Nonie Darwish has some excellent observations on the recent decision in Michigan to amend noise ordinances to allow the Muslim call to prayer over loudspeakers:
The Islamist movement in the United States has no intention of expressing sensitivity to the majority Judeo-Christian culture of America. Even 9/11 has not slowed them down, but might even have given more fuel to their cherished dream of seeing America and its government Moslem.The City Council of Hamtramck, Michigan, gave its preliminary approval to the Bangladeshi al-Islah mosque to carry the Arabic call to prayer five times a day through a loudspeaker. The Moslem call for prayer, in Arabic, says: “Allah is great. I confess that there is no God but Allah. I confess that Mohamed is his messenger. Call for prayer, call for prayer.” This is repeated for two minutes.
Devout Moslems already know when it is time to pray and in this day and age there are certainly other ways to call people for prayers that conforms to noise regulation and respects the wish of the general public not to hear loudspeakers 5 times a day praising a God that is different from theirs and in whose name the terrorists of 9/11 committed their atrocity. How far are we Arab/Moslem Americans going to keep pushing the envelope to test America’s patience? To whose benefit these loudspeakers are being installed? Could the loudspeakers be another sign of an audacious, in-your-face conquest of America to please those who finance these mosques?
Americans are the most tolerant people in the world and it seems that the more tolerant they become, the more they are taken advantage of. How far will our tolerant Judeo-Christian culture be pushed around? And how many times will Christians give the other cheek to prove they love those who despise them?
Arab/Moslem Americans should reciprocate the tolerance and sensitivity to the rest of America. They should not demand from America to tolerate unwelcome loudspeakers even if the politicians in the city council want to please the Arab population for their vote. Mosques in the US should know better because in most Moslem countries, Jewish synagogues and Christian churches are not even permitted to be built, much less promoted via public-address loudspeakers.
At a time when American youth are dying to stabilize Iraq and bring democracy to a Moslem country, the last thing I want to see as an Arab American is my fellow Americans upset at us for forcing Koran read to them through amplifiers.
Mosques all over the Middle East have used and abused loudspeakers to spread not only the call for prayers, but also Friday sermons. In many Arab capitals you can often hear a prayer to destroy the infidels (non-Moslems) and the Jews, the enemies of God, over loudspeakers that are often used as tools of incitement and indoctrination. People in congested and noisy Arab cities such as Cairo often hear 3 or 4 mosque loudspeakers simultaneously since there could be 4 or more mosques in one square mile. The dawn prayer can come as early as 5 am and many Moslems in the Middle East hate it, but are too afraid to say anything about it.
Why is America importing fear, oppression and insensitivity to the American general public? There is a fine line between tolerance and self destruction.
This is a serious question. I am not being tediously argumentative:
Would it be okay if the majority in the neighborhood were Muslims?
I way agree with the posters on an earlier report of this who said, "fine let's ring all the hours of the office, the angelus, etc."
I used to live near a Catholic college and I was surprised to hear the angelus at 6 am one morning. I only heard it because I was actually jogging across the campus and was next to the chapel. The early morning bells were practically murmured; the noon and 6 pm angelus were at full volume. Considerate Dominicans those were. Not like the mosques in Michigan.
Does anyone blow the shofar through a loudspeaker? I hope so. I suppose that is only a couple of times a year.
Noise nuisances are difficult to gauge but I would support a uniform decibel level and hope than non-Muslims will make exactly as much noise as Muslims. No special exceptions for the mosque. If the law can apply to everyone equally with no harmful societal effects, so be it.
To all the Muslim apologists who wish to debate with me:
Why do you not make your arguments to me in this public forum? Why are you afraid to make your arguments public? Is it because you are afraid that your arguments are weak and easily refuted? If your arguments are so strong, let the world see them on this public forum. Of course, I already know what your response will be. I will never see a single one of you Muslim apologists on this forum because you know your arguments are weak and undefendable. In fact, you Muslim apologists have observed what happens every time you try and defend your views in public – you end up looking like fools and more people are turned against Islam.
I have news for you Muslim apologists. Every day more and more people find out the truth about Islam. Every day more and more people come to view Islam with suspicion and fear. Every day more and more people come to realize that Islam is their enemy. We are like a snake coiling up to strike. When we strike, you will know the meaning of fear.
A toot, a bong, a whistle, a beep. Each can be considered a "noise."
Yet Nonie Darwish states...
"The Moslem call for prayer, in Arabic, says: “Allah is great. I confess that there is no God but Allah. I confess that Mohamed is his messenger. Call for prayer, call for prayer.” This is repeated for two minutes."
Whether muted or blaring, this is not a "noise." This not a call to prayer, this IS a prayer. While a spirit of good will suggests allowing this freedom, does the spirit of this prayer allow matching good will and freedom in its own "hometowns"? ...Cairo, Damascus, Riyadh?
The answer, I confess, is troubling. While we generously say "My house is your house," the response I hear is "My house is my house, and your house is my house, too."
Sound travels across property lines and therefore can be a nuisance like odors traveling across property lines. There exists plenty of legal precedent for property owners within hearing distance of the mosques to sue the mosques as legal entities that generate a nuisance. Just as a property owner could sue a pig farm that generated foul odors that floating across property lines.
That fact that the messages may have some religious significance does not make them any less the nuisance, rather the more. This law can be and should be challenged legally.
I have mixed feelings about this. If this is what the community wants, so be it. If there is one complaint about it from a local citizen, then shut it off.
What most Americans don't realize is that if one wishes to convert to Islam, it is a very simple process. All you have to do is recite these words in the presence of another Muslim: "Allah is great. I confess that there is no God but Allah. I confess that Mohamed is his messenger" -- the exact same words coming over the loudspeakers five times a day in neighborhoods filled with children.
That's it -- then you are officially considered a Muslim by the Muslim community, and thereafter treated as such.
The interesting thing here is that it doesn't matter whether or not you mean it when you say it, or whether or not you are coerced into saying it against your will, or whether or not you understand what you are saying (ie: you can even say it in Arabic - it's all the same).
The point here is that over the next months and years, you will have impressionable children imitating the Arabic sounds they hear each day. After awhile they will be speaking the exact phrase perfectly, much to the delight of the Muslim community. This in effect will make these children Muslim, and the parents will have absolutely no say in the matter whatsoever. And try getting a "Muslim" child to follow the Christian faith, or any other faith, and you know what the consequences from the Muslim community will be.
If we think that the Muslim call to prayer in
America is serious (and it is), we ain't seen nothing yet!
Quote: In many Arab capitals you can often hear a prayer to destroy the infidels (non-Moslems) and the Jews, the enemies of God, over loudspeakers that are often used as tools of incitement and indoctrination.
How many ways does it need to be said?
Twenty-Year Plan for USA:
Islam Targets America
Author: Dr. Anis Shorrosh
Publication: Koenig's International News
Date:
URL: http://www.watch.org/showart.php3?idx=38699&rtn=/index.html&showsubj=1&mcat=1
(Dr. Shorrosh's bio is after the commentary.)
When we immigrated from Jerusalem, Jordan in January, 1967, little did I imagine that Islam would become center-stage in world news. As my sincere interest in the growth of Islam in America intensified, I began to discuss, dialogue, and then debate Muslim leaders throughout the world from an Arab Christian’s view of Islam. So far, I have had the privilege of participating in over 20 debates and discussions on every continent plus T.V. and radio. Islam Revealed was released in 1988 and is now in its 8th printing. The True Furqan is now in its third printing in the three years it has been published. It is the only book which challenges the Quran in substance, style, language and contents. The True Furqan can be located on www.answers-to-islam.net or www.islam-exposed.org.
The following is my analysis of Islamic invasion of America, the agenda of Islamists and visible methods to take over America by the year 2020! Will Americans continue to sleep through this invasion as they did when we were attacked on 9/11?
1. Terminate America’s freedom of speech by replacing it with hate crime bills state-wide and nation-wide.
2. Wage a war of words using black leaders like Louis Farrakhan, Rev. Jesse Jackson and other visible religious personalities to promote Islam as the original African-American’s religion while Christianity is for the whites! Strange enough, no one tells the African-Americans that it was the Arab Muslims who captured them and sold them as slaves, neither the fact that in Arabic the word for black and slave is the same, “Abed.”
3. Engage the American public in dialogues, discussions, debates in colleges, universities, public libraries, radio, TV, churches and mosques on the virtues of Islam. Proclaim how it is historically another religion like Judaism and Christianity with the same monotheistic faith.
4. Nominate Muslim sympathizers to political office for favorable legislation to Islam and support potential sympathizers by block voting.
5. Take control of as much of Hollywood, the press, TV, radio and the internet by buying the corporations or a controlling stock.
6. Yield to the fear of imminent shut-off of the lifeblood of America – the black gold. America’s economy depends on oil, (1000 products are derived from oil), so does its personal and industrial transportation and manufacturing -41% comes from the Middle East.
7. Yell, “foul, out-of-context, personal interpretation, hate crime, Zionist, un- American, inaccurate interpretation of the Quran” anytime Islam is criticized or the Quran is analyzed in the public arena.
8. Encourage Muslims to penetrate the White House, specifically with Islamists who can articulate a marvelous and peaceful picture of Islam. Acquire government positions, get membership in local school boards. Train Muslims as medical doctors to dominate the medical field, research and pharmaceutical companies. Take over the computer industry. Establish Middle Eastern restaurants throughout the U.S. to connect planners of Islamization in a discreet way. Ever notice how numerous Muslim doctors in America are, when their countries need them more desperately than America?
9. Accelerate Islamic demographic growth via:
a. Massive immigration (100,000 annually since 1961)
b. No birth control whatsoever – every baby of Muslim parents is automatically a Muslim and cannot choose another religion later.
c. Muslim men must marry American women and Islamize them (10,000 annually). Then divorce them and remarry every five years – since one cannot have the Muslim legal permission to marry four at one time. This is a legal solution in America.
d. Convert angry, alienated black inmates and turn them into militants (so far 2000 released inmates have joined Al Qaida world-wide). Only a few have been captured in Afghanistan and on American soil. So far – sleeping cells!
10. Reading, writing, arithmetic and research through the American educational system, mosques and student centers (now 1500) should be sprinkled with dislike of Jews, evangelical Christians and democracy. There are 300 exclusively Muslim schools with loyalty to the Quran, not the U.S. Constitution.
11. Provide very sizeable monetary Muslim grants to colleges and universities in America to establish “Centers for Islamic studies” with Muslim directors to promote Islam in higher education institutions.
12. Let the entire world know through propaganda, speeches, seminars, local and national media that terrorists have hijacked Islam, not the truth, which is Islam hijacked the terrorists. Furthermore in January of 2002, Saudi Arabia’s Embassy in Washington mailed 4500 packets of the Quran, videos, promoting Islam to America’s high schools--free. They would never allow us to reciprocate.
13. Appeal to the historically compassionate and sensitive Americans for sympathy and tolerance towards the Muslims in America who are portrayed as mainly immigrants from oppressed countries.
14. Nullify America’s sense of security by manipulating the intelligence community with misinformation. Periodically terrorize Americans of impending attacks on bridges, tunnels, water supplies, airports, apartment buildings and malls. (We have experienced this too often since 9-11.)
15. Form riots and demonstrations in the prison system demanding Islamic Sharia as the way of life, not American’s justice system.
16. Open numerous charities throughout the U.S. but use the funds to support Islamic terrorism with American dollars.
17. Raise interest in Islam on America’s campuses by insisting that freshman take at least one course on Islam. Be sure that the writer is a bonafide American, Christian, scholarly and able to cover up the violence in the Quran and express the peaceful, spiritual and religious aspect only.
18. Unify the numerous Muslim lobbies in Washington, mosques, Islamic student centers, educational organizations, magazines and papers by internet and an annual convention to coordinate plans, propagate the faith and engender news in the media of their visibility.
19. Send intimidating messages and messengers to the outspoken individuals who are critical of Islam and seek to eliminate them by hook or crook.
20. Applaud Muslims as loyal citizens of the US by spotlighting their voting record as the highest percentage of all minority and ethic groups in America.
Dr. Anis Shorrosh, D.Min, D.Phil, a member of Oxford Society of Scholars, has traveled in 76 countries, is a Palestinian Arab Christian American who is an author, lecturer and producer of TV documentaries. Islam Revealed is a best seller which has been printed eight times already. His forthcoming tenth book will be available spring 2003 entitled Islam: A Threat or a Challenge. He is in great demand as a talk show guest on radio and television throughout the U.S.A. He has been on CNN, TBN as well as other networks. You can contact him at PO Box 949, Fairhope, AL 36533, FAX 1-251-621-0507 or phone 1-251-680-7770. Also, you may order his materials from his new website: www.focusing-on-islam.com. The True Furqan, our monumental new Quran, is also available for viewing on www.islam-exposed.org.
.
IN REGARD TO BEING FORCED TO CONVERT TO ISLAM, BRIAN SAYS...
>>All you have to do is recite these words in the presence of another Muslim: "Allah is great. I confess that there is no God but Allah. I confess that Mohamed is his messenger" .....The interesting thing here is that it doesn't matter whether or not you mean it when you say it, or whether or not you are coerced into saying it against your will, or whether or not you understand what you are saying (ie: you can even say it in Arabic - it's all the same).
Brian is right. I once repeated the phrase to a Moslem just to see if I had said it right, and he said, "Oh! You are a Muslim!" I said, "No I'm not." He insisted. "It doesn't matter if you didn't mean it. You said it."
Just saying a phrase doesn't mean anything. It's what you believe in your heart that matters.
Can Islam gain the heart of America?
No. That's absurd.
Can Islam gain the heart of Europe?
Only if muslims demographically dominate the population; i.e. become the majority, and if they take their teachings from Wahabi imans.
It's also conceivable that many muslim immigrants like the freedom of the West and will become the impetus to an islamic reformation.
Mike H
The residents of this community that oppose having to listen to this howling 5 times a day do have legal recourse, but it will most likely have to be taken up with a higher court that such as at the county or even state level.
This needs to be stopped, before every hellhole mosque in the country is asking for it.
Repetition is one of the most effective ways of learning. Many unlettered Muslims, Christians, and Jews have learned their faith's tenets through rote memory without ever learning what the tenets meant. They learned to obey through observation and repetition.
The Muslim prayer call is such a repetition. Eventually the call remains in the psyche such as a song that one can't forget. Can conversion begin in this way? Stranger things have happened, especially to the easily manipulated.
In any case, the prayer call is not synonymous with church bells because the ringing of the bells is just a noise, whereas the call is an affirmation of faith. Non-Muslims should not have to be subjected to this affirmation of faith five times a day or even once. This is intrusive and not neighborly.
This could be especially egregious in areas where there is more than one mosque in close proximity. The caucaphanous din would be unbreable. In the modern world we all have access to time pieces and other means of keeping time that Muslims should employ.
Unfortunately, I think that the only way to stop the Islamification of America is physical violence against these Muslonazis. The entire agenda of Nazislam is predicated on us playing nice. At some point, we are going to stop playing nice and many millions of innocent muslims will die. I don't approve or want that to happen. It is, though, what will happen if American Muslims do not become more tolerant. Soon.
To some extent, religion is like smoking. I don't care if you smoke, but I do care if I have to smell it, taste it, inhale it, choke on it, and in ways not yet mentioned, endure it. Only, Islam is much, more worse than smoking. These vermin are in our faces, on our televisions, in our universities, and now in our ears. I am not politically correct. I hate Islam and seek its destruction, and I do not give one damn who knows it. Let's stop calling Islam a religion--too many people hang up on "religion" as some metaphysically virtuous and untouchable source of beatific ALLGOOD. Islam is a death-cult philosophy honed over 1400 years to produce killbots, like the Borg of Star Trek, minus, however, any sophistication except that which they parasitize. Listening to that obscene crap pour out of some mosque tower multiple times a day would infuriate me beyond bearability. The first target of my anger, however, would be all of those city council officials whose minds need caustic lye soap douches three times a day until sanity returns. One of these days, we may have to marshall the pitchforks and hoes, a la the Frankenstein motion picture villagers, to drive these "keepers" we have actually elected into enough oblivion that they can have no influence on anything. Maybe they could join the fleeing Muslims.
Folks -
Where is the ACLU, those 'freedom from religion' individuals, all the many who are 'offended' by public displays of religion?
It makes me wonder.
In response to Brian, Joyce wrote ...
>>>GEE BRIAN, YOU SURE ARE A MAN OF REAL CONVICTION, I AM REALLY IMPRESSED!!! I FEEL OH SO MUCH MORE SECURE NOW WITH REAL "THINKERS" LIKE YOU AROUND TO HELP.....NOT.
Now, now, Joyce. Play nice in the sandbox or you'll have to go home. :-)
Your response to my post reminds me of the advice a seasoned lawyer gave to a novice ... "Young man, when the facts are on your side, argue the facts; when the law is on your side, argue the law; when you have neither, bang your fist on the table really loudly."
The equivilent in this case is using allcaps, with nothing of substance to say about my point, other than attempting to demean me. If that's how you normally express your disagreement with people, then I'll just learn to live with it. Otherwise, if you disagree with what I had written, say so, and then explain why.
The comments in the article seemed genuine, but it is to late. The snake referrence is perfect, because americans are just about ready to strick at all muslims and islam. we have been tollerant enough, it is time to take back our country and our rights; the aclu will never fight for the christian/jew it is a left wing communitst organization bent on destroying the values of america; what better way then to let the muslims do it for them.
It is time for the spineless journalists to start asking all political and judiciary candidates in the USA where they stand against Islam!
guess muslims and islamists are waiting for the coming of jesus christ, when jesus leading the muslims and creating once agian the muslim state all over the world, o disbelievers, have has much fun, and happy days you like, muslims are patient waiting for the coming then we see if your nukes work or cruise missles. without the will of allah(god) fighter planes will not be able to fly, ships won't be able to sail, do you not realise that with the will of allah we are nothing so live a life of luxury, because once you die as a disbeliever the fire of hell is all that you will abode.
In the name of Allah ,Most Gracious, Most Merciful
Say : O disbelievers!
I worship not that which ye worship ;
Nor worship ye that which I worship .
And I shall not worship that which ye worship .
Nor will ye worship that which I worship .
Unto you your religion , and unto me my religion .
if you had any sense you learn the true religion the religion of one allah and the religion of the messenger of allah mohammed(pbuh).
In the name of Allah ,Most Gracious, Most Merciful
Say : He is Allah , the One!
Allah , the eternally Besought of all!
He begetteth not nor was begotten .
And there is none comparable unto Him .
so disbelievers you still have time before you die follow islam and recieve your bounties in the next world, the eternal life
In the name of Allah ,Most Gracious, Most Merciful
When Allah's succor and the triumph cometh
And thou seest mankind entering the religion of Allah in troops
Then hymn the praises of thy Lord , and seek forgiveness of Him . Lo! He is ever ready to show mercy .
peace
Angry Infidel is right.
Look at the small countries in Europe and be surpriced. Holland, Sweden, Norway and Denmark are in great danger.
In som 30-35 years from now the majority in Denmark will be muslims. And do anyone think that they wan`t dhimmitice the Old-danes, that they will allowe the countys GRUNDLOV to exist ? No ! It will be the Sharia and Denmark will be the Khalifat of Denmark.
And what is the way out, Liberalism, humanism and democracy ?
Sorry to tell You it will be civil war. And I promise You we will go to war against this satanic religion and its people.
As Churchill said : we will never surrender. Never.
Jahnum Kufar;
Thanx for your permission to have fun and happy
days. I think Ill have a six-pack right now.
Oh, and by the way; when when we get tired of
all the muslim crap that the immigrants force on us we aint gonna be usin cruise missles. Its
gonna be a good ole fashioned Louisvill slugger.
"The ruling to kill the Americans and their allies -- civilians and military -- is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any country in which it is possible to do it"
This ruling is from bin Laden's Jihad Against Jews and Crusaders World Islamic Front Statement
23 February 1998.
In bin Laden's letter "to the People of America" printed in the Obsedrver on November 24, 2002, bin Laden answers his own chilling question:
"What are we calling you to, and what do we want from you?
(1) the first thing that we are caling you to is Islam"
By which he means his twisted and maniacal version of Islam.
And he and his fellow fanatic Islamists will try to accomplish their objectives directly by force and indirectly by assimilating into their free Western host societies and poisioning them from within.
We must wake up to this mortal danager before it is too late. Lets not repeat the mistakes of the 1930's when the French and other Europeans ignored Hitler's Mein Kampf until it was too late.
All non muslims within earshot of the mosque should file complaints on disturbing the peace - and having religion come into their homes without their permission - where is the separation of church and state here ....oh yes, I remember is it only for CHURCH not mosque and state....now I get it. forgive me, I am just a stupid woman.
jihan
Chris,
This is an excellent post. The 20 points are already WELL underway here in America. What does the doctor advise?
It's amazing that muslims want freedom of speach in the USA but in Muslim countries Christians are killed daily because they wont conform to islam. Remember to pray for the persucuted around the world
the only true path is through jesus christ, how can ur prophet even come close to him
in the balkans they just burn them down
Jerry:
I sent comments to the ACLU in Michigan and asked them what they will do about this or are they only interested in subjects that allow them to fight conservatives. I am waiting for a reply.
"We are like a snake coiling up to strike. When we strike, you will know the meaning of fear."
"every hellhole mosque in the country"
"I think that the only way to stop the Islamification of America is physical violence against these Muslonazis."
"I hate Islam and seek its destruction"
"I promise You we will go to war"
"when when we get tired of all the muslim crap that the immigrants force on us we aint gonna be usin cruise missles. Its
gonna be a good ole fashioned Louisvill slugger."
All of these quotes are magnificent. I think Christ would be proud to hear these sentiments. These are right in line with His gentle and peaceful teachings.
(please note sarcasm)
Might I make a suggestion to the folks in this town who do not like the prayer calls on the loudspeaker?
The change in the noise law must apply to everybody, not just to the Islamists, or else it is unconstitutional. Therefore I suggest this: GET A VERY LOUD LOUDSPEAKER SYSTEM. PUT IT ON A TIMER TO PLAY AT THE SAME TIME THE PRAYER CALL COMES. THEN BLOT THEM OUT BY PLAYING "WHISKEY FOR MY MEN AND BEER FOR MY HORSES"
The loudspeakers should be allowed to ring on Sunday at about the same time churches ring their bells. THAT'S IT PERIOD.