US "eliminating Islamic scholars and intellectuals in the Muslim world"

TALK ABOUT THE POT CALLING THE KETTLE BLACK!

I pointed out several days ago that the fingerprints of the CIA and the Mossad were all over this murder.

Allahu akbar

Yes, I am sure you know all about it, Reza (rolls eyes).

These fruitcakes will believe anything.

THE SAD REALITY

In my past experiences with arab/moslems i have often heard these ridiculous conspiracy theories.
I have thought about it and discuused it with various people.
The conclusion we have come to is this.
The sad reality of the arab/islamic world is so appalling, the failure of islam so absolute that rather than face it they can only develop these daft theories.
They are backward not because they do not value "non islamic education" rather because it is a US/UK/Jewish/Indian/christian/jew/hindu (pick one)conspiracy.
The reason bangladesh drowns in floods everyfew years is not because their arab masters are indifferent to them but because "the indian/hindu government has allowed "secret jewish companies to flood the ganges and cause storms in the bay of bengal" (seriously I have heard it said)
Technological backwardness = western/jew/hindu conspiracy.
It goes on and on and on.
The PC papers & media lie and distort.
I am sure you have seen headlines to the effect "asians dicrimminated against in education/jobs/cultural life"
it's pure koran (shit)
what they mean is pakistani/bangladeshi/somali/arab/afghan.
Who are the high acheivers the Indians/chinese be they sikh/hindu/buddhist/christian or jew.
IT MUST BE A CONSPIRACY, WHAT OTHER EXPLANATION IS THERE !!!!

To see the full failure of Islam, politically, economically, and above all intellectually, is simply too much to bear for Muslims. Given that it is a complete system, a Total Organizing Grid of the Universe, if it were to be seen as, even in some small aspect, to be wrong, the edifice would crumble. Some, especially non-Arab Muslims, may find solace, and support, in the non-Islamic aspects of their own civilisation (Persians, Turks, Indonesians). For the Arabs it is impossible, for the very idea of "Arabness" is so tied up with Islam, its history, its putative greatness and achievements, that to see, for example, the real history of the barbarous treatment of non-Muslims is simply too much. Kanan Makiya cannot bring himself to read Bat Ye'or, simply putting it out of his head. Fouad Ajami, always discussing the "Arab nightmare" and still seemingly fixed on pan-Arabism and Nasser, does not touch, with a ten-foot or any other pole, the subject of Islam, and its effect on Arab minds, the Arab understanding of history and of the world, the Arab view of truth and lies (taqiyya, kitman being so internalized that it effects far more than the discussion of Islam -- which itself is such a major, even overwhelming part, of Arab life).

That is why the study of the historical origins of Islam, treating it as all other religions have been treated, is likely to prove so threatening to Believers. They simply will not accept any such investigation. Christoph Luxenberg, Patricia Crone, Gerd Puin, Ibn Warraq, Nevo, and many others are those they fear the most -- for it is they who bring to bear philological, archeological, and other kinds of evidence to the problem of when, where, and how the belief-system we call Islam first got started.

Islam is a brittle religion; it will not bend, but break, for Believers if the burden of real history is placed on it. That is the likely outcome. Scholarship, real scholarship, threatens Islam as it threatens no other religion. There will still be hundreds of millions of true believers. But among the most thoughtful and intelligent, the ability, and therefore the will, to believe will be shaken, perhaps forever. And that will have consquences.

You are totally right Hugh
I am sure you have heard of the arab development report
follow this link:
http://uk.search.yahoo.com/search/ukie?p=arab+development+report&ei=UTF-8&fr=fp-tab-web-t&x=wrt&y=i

This is one of the reasons intelligent people do not become/or stay moslems, we do not want to be in such a sad state.

Hugh gets 11/10 for that essay. I am of that school and will start contributing soon to them. I have all of Ibn Warraq's books, the last one of Yehuda Nevo, and an extensive book review of Luxembourg (also a pseudonymn). They are all excellent.

Reza(d'oh):

We sense that behind your thin protective shell of pious arrogance, patronizing platitudes, and gargantuan grandiosity that you unconsciously wish to join us and become a true freethinker; leaving the oppressive and smothering confines of your totalitarian Islamic prison. We can see clearly that your reason for posting here is to test your false and hateful ideas.

Open your heart and and drop you hateful spirit. We await to embrace you in the innocent and nurturing love of acceptance.

The Jewish/hindu conspiracy

Honest!!!!
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=339437&contrassID=2&subContrassID=15&sbSubContrassID=0&listSrc=Y

Thomas Carlyle in 'Heroes and Hero Worship and the Heroic in History,' 1840
"The lies (Western slander) which well-meaning zeal has heaped round this man (Muhammad) are disgraceful to ourselves only."

"A silent great soul, one of that who cannot but be earnest. He was to kindle the world, the world’s Maker had ordered so."

A. S. Tritton in 'Islam,' 1951
The picture of the Muslim soldier advancing with a sword in one hand and the Qur'an in the other is quite false.

De Lacy O'Leary in 'Islam at the Crossroads,' London, 1923.
History makes it clear, however, that the legend of fanatical Muslims sweeping through the world and forcing Islam at the point of sword upon conquered races is one of the most fantastically absurd myths that historians have ever repeated.

Gibbon in 'The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire' 1823
The good sense of Muhammad despised the pomp of royalty. The Apostle of God submitted to the menial offices of the family; he kindled the fire; swept the floor; milked the ewes; and mended with his own hands his shoes and garments. Disdaining the penance and merit of a hermit, he observed without effort of vanity the abstemious diet of an Arab.

Edward Gibbon and Simon Oakley in ‘History of the Saracen Empire,’ London, 1870
"The greatest success of Mohammad’s life was effected by sheer moral force."

“It is not the propagation but the permanency of his religion that deserves our wonder, the same pure and perfect impression which he engraved at Mecca and Medina is preserved after the revolutions of twelve centuries by the Indian, the African and the Turkish proselytes of the Koran....The Mahometans have uniformly withstood the temptation of reducing the object of their faith and devotion to a level with the senses and imagination of man. ‘I believe in One God and Mahomet the Apostle of God’ is the simple and invariable profession of Islam. The intellectual image of the Deity has never been degraded by any visible idol; the honors of the prophet have never transgressed the measure of human virtue, and his living precepts have restrained the gratitude of his disciples within the bounds of reason and religion.”

Lane-Poole in 'Speeches and Table Talk of the Prophet Muhammad'
He was the most faithful protector of those he protected, the sweetest and most agreeable in conversation. Those who saw him were suddenly filled with reverence; those who came near him loved him; they who described him would say, "I have never seen his like either before or after." He was of great taciturnity, but when he spoke it was with emphasis and deliberation, and no one could forget what he said...

Annie Besant in 'The Life and Teachings of Mohammad,' Madras, 1932.
It is impossible for anyone who studies the life and character of the great Prophet of Arabia, who knew how he taught and how he lived, to feel anything but reverence for that mighty Prophet, one of the great messengers of the Supreme. And although in what I put to you I shall say many things which may be familiar to many, yet I myself feel, whenever I reread them, a new way of admiration, a new sense of reverence for that mighty Arabian teacher.

W.C. Taylor in 'The History of Muhammadanism and its Sects'
So great was his liberality to the poor that he often left his household unprovided, nor did he content himself with relieving their wants, he entered into conversation with them, and expressed a warm sympathy for their sufferings. He was a firm friend and a faithful ally.

Reverend Bosworth Smith in 'Muhammad and Muhammadanism,' London, 1874.
"Head of the State as well as the Church, he was Caesar and Pope in one; but he was Pope without the Pope's pretensions, and Caesar without the legions of Caesar, without a standing army, without a bodyguard, without a police force, without a fixed revenue. If ever a man ruled by a right divine, it was Muhammad, for he had all the powers without their supports. He cared not for the dressings of power. The simplicity of his private life was in keeping with his public life."

"In Mohammadanism every thing is different here. Instead of the shadowy and the mysterious, we have history....We know of the external history of Muhammad....while for his internal history after his mission had been proclaimed, we have a book absolutely unique in its origin, in its preservation....on the Substantial authority of which no one has ever been able to cast a serious doubt."

Edward Montet, 'La Propagande Chretienne et ses Adversaries Musulmans,' Paris 1890. (Also in T.W. Arnold in 'The Preaching of Islam,' London 1913.)
"Islam is a religion that is essentially rationalistic in the widest sense of this term considered etymologically and historically....the teachings of the Prophet, the Qur'an has invariably kept its place as the fundamental starting point, and the dogma of unity of God has always been proclaimed therein with a grandeur a majesty, an invariable purity and with a note of sure conviction, which it is hard to find surpassed outside the pale of Islam....A creed so precise, so stripped of all theological complexities and consequently so accessible to the ordinary understanding might be expected to possess and does indeed possess a marvelous power of winning its way into the consciences of men."

Dr. Gustav Weil in 'History of the Islamic Peoples'
Muhammad was a shining example to his people. His character was pure and stainless. His house, his dress, his food - they were characterized by a rare simplicity. So unpretentious was he that he would receive from his companions no special mark of reverence, nor would he accept any service from his slave which he could do for himself. He was accessible to all and at all times. He visited the sick and was full of sympathy for all. Unlimited was his benevolence and generosity as also was his anxious care for the welfare of the community.

Alphonse de LaMartaine in 'Historie de la Turquie,' Paris, 1854.
"Never has a man set for himself, voluntarily or involuntarily, a more sublime aim, since this aim was superhuman; to subvert superstitions which had been imposed between man and his Creator, to render God unto man and man unto God; to restore the rational and sacred idea of divinity amidst the chaos of the material and disfigured gods of idolatry, then existing. Never has a man undertaken a work so far beyond human power with so feeble means, for he (Muhammad) had in the conception as well as in the execution of such a great design, no other instrument than himself and no other aid except a handful of men living in a corner of the desert. Finally, never has a man accomplished such a huge and lasting revolution in the world, because in less than two centuries after its appearance, Islam, in faith and in arms, reigned over the whole of Arabia, and conquered, in God's name, Persia Khorasan, Transoxania, Western India, Syria, Egypt, Abyssinia, all the known continent of Northern Africa, numerous islands of the Mediterranean Sea, Spain, and part of Gaul.

"If greatness of purpose, smallness of means, and astonishing results are the three criteria of a human genius, who could dare compare any great man in history with Muhammad? The most famous men created arms, laws, and empires only. They founded, if anything at all, no more than material powers which often crumbled away before their eyes. This man moved not only armies, legislations, empires, peoples, dynasties, but millions of men in one-third of the then inhabited world; and more than that, he moved the altars, the gods, the religions, the ideas, the beliefs and the souls.

"On the basis of a Book, every letter which has become law, he created a spiritual nationality which blend together peoples of every tongue and race. He has left the indelible characteristic of this Muslim nationality the hatred of false gods and the passion for the One and Immaterial God. This avenging patriotism against the profanation of Heaven formed the virtue of the followers of Muhammad; the conquest of one-third the earth to the dogma was his miracle; or rather it was not the miracle of man but that of reason.

"The idea of the unity of God, proclaimed amidst the exhaustion of the fabulous theogonies, was in itself such a miracle that upon it's utterance from his lips it destroyed all the ancient temples of idols and set on fire one-third of the world. His life, his meditations, his heroic revelings against the superstitions of his country, and his boldness in defying the furies of idolatry, his firmness in enduring them for fifteen years in Mecca, his acceptance of the role of public scorn and almost of being a victim of his fellow countrymen: all these and finally, his flight his incessant preaching, his wars against odds, his faith in his success and his superhuman security in misfortune, his forbearance in victory, his ambition, which was entirely devoted to one idea and in no manner striving for an empire; his endless prayers, his mystic conversations with God, his death and his triumph after death; all these attest not to an imposture but to a firm conviction which gave him the power to restore a dogma. This dogma was twofold the unity of God and the immateriality of God: the former telling what God is, the latter telling what God is not; the one overthrowing false gods with the sword, the other starting an idea with words.

"Philosopher, Orator, Apostle, Legislator, Conqueror of Ideas, Restorer of Rational beliefs.... The founder of twenty terrestrial empires and of one spiritual empire that is Muhammad. As regards all standards by which human greatness may be measured, we may well ask, is there any man greater than he?"

Mahatma Gandhi, statement published in 'Young India,'1924.
I wanted to know the best of the life of one who holds today an undisputed sway over the hearts of millions of mankind.... I became more than ever convinced that it was not the sword that won a place for Islam in those days in the scheme of life. It was the rigid simplicity, the utter self-effacement of the Prophet the scrupulous regard for pledges, his intense devotion to his friends and followers, his intrepidity, his fearlessness, his absolute trust in God and in his own mission. These and not the sword carried everything before them and surmounted every obstacle. When I closed the second volume (of the Prophet's biography), I was sorry there was not more for me to read of that great life.

Sir George Bernard Shaw in 'The Genuine Islam,' Vol. 1, No. 8, 1936.
"If any religion had the chance of ruling over England, nay Europe within the next hundred years, it could be Islam."

“I have always held the religion of Muhammad in high estimation because of its wonderful vitality. It is the only religion which appears to me to possess that assimilating capacity to the changing phase of existence which can make itself appeal to every age. I have studied him - the wonderful man and in my opinion for from being an anti-Christ, he must be called the Savior of Humanity."

"I believe that if a man like him were to assume the dictatorship of the modern world he would succeed in solving its problems in a way that would bring it the much needed peace and happiness: I have prophesied about the faith of Muhammad that it would be acceptable to the Europe of tomorrow as it is beginning to be acceptable to the Europe of today.”

Michael Hart in 'The 100, A Ranking of the Most Influential Persons In History,' New York, 1978.
My choice of Muhammad to lead the list of the world’s most influential persons may surprise some readers and may be questioned by others, but he was the only man in history who was supremely successful on both the secular and religious level. ...It is probable that the relative influence of Muhammad on Islam has been larger than the combined influence of Jesus Christ and St. Paul on Christianity. ...It is this unparalleled combination of secular and religious influence which I feel entitles Muhammad to be considered the most influential single figure in human history.

Dr. William Draper in 'History of Intellectual Development of Europe'
Four years after the death of Justinian, A.D. 569, was born in Mecca, in Arabia, the man who, of all men, has exercised the greatest influence upon the human race... To be the religious head of many empires, to guide the daily life of one-third of the human race, may perhaps justify the title of a Messenger of God.

J.W.H. Stab in 'Islam and its Founder'
Judged by the smallness of the means at his disposal, and the extent and permanence of the work that he accomplished, his name in world's history shines with a more specious lustre than that of the Prophet of Makkah. To the impulse which he gave numberless dynasties have owed their existence, fair cities and stately palaces and temples have arisen, and wide provinces became obedient to the Faith. And beyond all this, his words have governed the belief of generations, been accepted as their rule of life, and their certain guide to the world to come. At a thousand shrines the voices of the faithful invoke blessings on him, whom they esteem the very Prophet of God, the seal of the Apostles.... Judged by the standards to human renown, the glory of what mortal can compare with his?

Washington Irving in 'Life of Muhammad,' New York, 1920.
His military triumphs awakened no pride nor vain glory as they would have done had they been effected by selfish purposes. In the time of his greatest power he maintained the same simplicity of manner and appearance as in the days of his adversity. So far from affecting regal state, he was displeased if, on entering a room, any unusual testimonial of respect was shown to him.

Arthur Glyn Leonard in 'Islam, Her Moral and Spiritual Values'
It was the genius of Muhammad, the spirit that he breathed into the Arabs through the soul of Islam that exalted them. That raised them out of the lethargy and low level of tribal stagnation up to the high watermark of national unity and empire. It was in the sublimity of Muhammad's deism, the simplicity, the sobriety and purity it inculcated the fidelity of its founder to his own tenets, that acted on their moral and intellectual fiber with all the magnetism of true inspiration.

Charles Stuart Mills in 'History of Mohammadanism'
Deeply read in the volume of nature, though extremely ignorant of letters, his mind could expand into controversy with the wisest of his enemies or contract itself to the apprehension of meanest of his disciples. His simple eloquence was rendered impressive by a manner of mixed dignity and elegance, by the expression of a countenance where the awfulness of his majesty was so well tempered by an amiable sweetness, that it exerted emotions of veneration and love. He was gifted with that authoritative air or genius which alike influences the learned and commands the illiterate.

Philip K. Hitti in 'History of the Arabs'
Within a brief span of mortal life, Muhammad called forth of unpromising material, a nation, never welded before; in a country that was hitherto but a geographical expression he established a religion which in vast areas suppressed Christianity and Judaism, and laid the basis of an empire that was soon to embrace within its far flung boundaries the fairest provinces the then civilized world.

Stanley Lane-Poole in 'Studies in a Mosque'
He was one of those happy few who have attained the supreme joy of making one great truth their very life spring. He was the messenger of One God, and never to his life's end did he forget who he was or the message which was the marrow of his being. He brought his tidings to his people with a grand dignity sprung from the consciousness of his high office, together with a most sweet humility.

Rodwell in the Preface to his translation of the Holy Qur'an
Mohammad's career is a wonderful instance of the force and life that resides in him who possesses an intense faith in God and in the unseen world. He will always be regarded as one of those who have had that influence over the faith, morals and whole earthly life of their fellow men, which none but a really great man ever did, or can exercise; and whose efforts to propagate a great verity will prosper.

W. Montgomery Watt in 'Muhammad at Mecca,' Oxford, 1953.
His readiness to undergo persecution for his beliefs, the high moral character of the men who believed in him and looked up to him as a leader, and the greatness of his ultimate achievement - all argue his fundamental integrity. To suppose Muhammad an impostor raises more problems that it solves. Moreover, none of the great figures of history is so poorly appreciated in the West as Muhammad.... Thus, not merely must we credit Muhammad with essential honesty and integrity of purpose, if we are to understand him at all; if we are to correct the errors we have inherited from the past, we must not forget the conclusive proof is a much stricter requirement than a show of plausibility, and in a matter such as this only to be attained with difficulty.

D. G. Hogarth in 'Arabia'
Serious or trivial, his daily behavior has instituted a canon which millions observe this day with conscious memory. No one regarded by any section of the human race as Perfect Man has ever been imitated so minutely. The conduct of the founder of Christianity has not governed the ordinary life of his followers. Moreover, no founder of a religion has left on so solitary an eminence as the Muslim apostle.

Washington Irving 'Mahomet and His Successors'
He was sober and abstemious in his diet and a rigorous observer of fasts. He indulged in no magnificence of apparel, the ostentation of a petty mind; neither was his simplicity in dress affected but a result of real disregard for distinction from so trivial a source.

In his private dealings he was just. He treated friends and strangers, the rich and poor, the powerful and weak, with equity, and was beloved by the common people for the affability with which he received them, and listened to their complaints.

His military triumphs awakened no pride nor vain glory, as they would have done had they been effected for selfish purposes. In the time of his greatest power he maintained the same simplicity of manners and appearance as in the days of his adversity. So far from affecting a regal state, he was displeased if, on entering a room, any unusual testimonials of respect were shown to him. If he aimed at a universal dominion, it was the dominion of faith; as to the temporal rule which grew up in his hands, as he used it without ostentation, so he took no step to perpetuate it in his family.

James Michener in ‘Islam: The Misunderstood Religion,’ Reader’s Digest, May 1955, pp. 68-70.
"No other religion in history spread so rapidly as Islam. The West has widely believed that this surge of religion was made possible by the sword. But no modern scholar accepts this idea, and the Qur’an is explicit in the support of the freedom of conscience."

"Muhammad, the inspired man who founded Islam, was born about A.D. 570 into an Arabian tribe that worshiped idols. Orphaned at birth, he was always particularly solicitous of the poor and needy, the widow and the orphan, the slave and the downtrodden. At twenty he was already a successful businessman, and soon became director of camel caravans for a wealthy widow. When he reached twenty-five his employer recognizing his merit, proposed marriage. Even though she was fifteen years older, he married her and as long as she lived remained a devoted husband."

“Like almost every major prophet before him, Muhammad fought shy of serving as the transmitter of God’s word sensing his own inadequacy. But the Angel commanded ‘Read’. So far as we know, Muhammad was unable to read or write, but he began to dictate those inspired words which would soon revolutionize a large segment of the earth: "There is one God"."

“In all things Muhammad was profoundly practical. When his beloved son Ibrahim died, an eclipse occurred and rumors of God 's personal condolence quickly arose. Whereupon Muhammad is said to have announced, ‘An eclipse is a phenomenon of nature. It is foolish to attribute such things to the death or birth of a human being'."

“At Muhammad's own death an attempt was made to deify him, but the man who was to become his administrative successor killed the hysteria with one of the noblest speeches in religious history: ‘If there are any among you who worshiped Muhammad, he is dead. But if it is God you Worshiped, He lives for ever'.”

Lawrence E. Browne in ‘The Prospects of Islam,’ 1944
Incidentally these well-established facts dispose of the idea so widely fostered in Christian writings that the Muslims, wherever they went, forced people to accept Islam at the point of the sword.

K. S. Ramakrishna Rao in 'Mohammed: The Prophet of Islam,' 1989
My problem to write this monograph is easier, because we are not generally fed now on that (distorted) kind of history and much time need not be spent on pointing out our misrepresentations of Islam. The theory of Islam and sword, for instance, is not heard now in any quarter worth the name. The principle of Islam that “there is no compulsion in religion” is well known.

Jules Masserman in 'Who Were Histories Great Leaders?' in TIME Magazine, July 15, 1974
Perhaps the greatest leader of all times was Mohammad, who combined all the three functions. To a lesser degree Moses did the same.

Well if this story is true it is going to prove to be futile anyways........finding an intellectual in the Islamic world is akin to finding a property owner in Stalin's Russia....

An Arab Muslim that I knew read on an Arab "news" website [a few years ago, prior to 9/11] that the Israelis were setting off nuclear bombs in the Dead Sea to gauge their effect on causing earthquakes in Turkey. This and other blatant fabrications were always accepted as absolute ... truth, kind of in the same vein as the recent poster.

On Muhammad's sheer wonderfulness, along with "Truth" (who would not stay for an answer) one might add Tor Andraes, Noldeke, the unanswerable William Muir, Henri Lammens, and to bring it right up to today, Ibn Warraq's anthology, "In Quest of the Historical Muhammad." Of course, we may be dealing with a complte fabrication(that is, there may have been no "historical Muhammad"), but even in dealing with the figure, concocted or not, as described in, or rather teased out of, the Qu'ran (and the hadith and sira, it seems, are essentially woven out of Qur'anic cloth), the picture is not pretty.

As for the notion of Arabs emerging, Qur'an in hnad, on horseback -- yes, it is implausible. What is more likely is that among the Arab tribesmen already in Mesopotamia and southern Syria (and what is present-day Jordan), there were various efforts made either to Christianize or Judaize them, for there is evidence of Ur-Qur'ans in Aramaic that might be taken to be attempts by Christians to convert the pagan Arabs, and something similar in Judaism. Or, the theory that some will find more compelling, that Abdel Malik, he of that Byzantine martyrium, the Dome of the Rock (which has Arabic, but non-Qur'anic, inscriptions), helped create the whole thing in order to justify his own power and rule. It is fun to consider all of these ideas.

Of course, if you believe that Muhammad was taking intermittent dictation, though described as illiterate, over 23 years, and in Arabic, which was not a written language at the time -- well, go ahead. Believe it. Any port in a storm.

I pointed out several days ago that the fingerprints of the CIA and the Mossad were all over this murder.
Allahu akbar
Posted by Reza at June 4, 2004 06:48 AM

**So Reza, you think some looney theory, by people who don't even know what the CIA really is or does, denotes "proof"? Get real. It's the paranoid ramblings of a third world rim-shot nutcase trying to boost his readership.
I can look out from my office, and see the same caliber of paper declaring Osama and Saddam were secret lovers and has computer generated graphics of them both in tutus doing an Arabesque! (I'm serious, BTW)

This just came out by Memri,

Saudi's Agree: "Zionists" Attacked them.
www.frontpagemagazine.com?Articles?ReadArticle.asp?ID=13660

Crown Prince Abdallah-"This is seduction. You all know who is behind this. Zionist are to blame".

Now, this was AFTER the Saudi head of Al-Qaeda, admitted they were behind the attacks.

They just are uncapable of looking their self-made monster in the face.

REZA

Looks like you caught us red-handed,lucky for
you the tinfoil on your head stopped the Zionist
messages transmitted from the moon ever
since the "Great-Satan" landed there to install
the global transmitters.

Oh wait,the moon landing was faked and the
"Jewish" controlled media was in on it,aliens
are in a warehouse held by the military along
with the real passenger from the planes that
faked the attack on the Pentagon and the
WTC towers.
The massad was behind the 911 attack because
a video shows that right after the planes hit
the WTC there was an explosion,this had to be
bombs planted to explode when the planes hit.

Damn,they really nailed us now,Muslims are
sooooo smart.

*ROFL* Roger. You should keep that and repost it every time these Islamists come up with another conspiracy "theory"....

~NMJ

Let me tell you that islam is a
disease and needs to be eradicated.

1st- Only by looking at islamic websites does it show that islam is a fascist
war spreading corrupt copy of Judaism and Christianity. Islamicconquerors.
In the Koran (which I have read, most arabs can not read 55%) it stipulates it is the duty
of every Moslem to promote jihad.
2nd- as to what the world owes islam, NOTHING. Islam has stolen, and destroyed
more than any and all other societies combined (north Africa was just like
southern Europe environmentally until pig muslim arabs invaded and genocided
the population, animals, and vegetation.
3rd- Greece in 2000 translated more books into Greek than were printed in
the whole muslim world. In 2000 (before Harry Potter) Spain published more
books than were published in WHOLE muslim WORLD IN THE LAST 1000 YEARS. (unesco
facts)

Muslims, please do us and the whole world a favor and have a mass suicide party and
exterminate yourselves.

Because of limited synapse activity in the muslim brain, I will prepare a
detailed and very simple accurate account of the dysfunctional attributes
of islam. More to follow.

reza said "I pointed out several days ago that the fingerprints of the CIA and the Mossad were all over this murder."

I have noticed on several occasions that muslims need very little prompting to kill each other with as much or more glee than they kill the infidels. I suspect this is just another conspiracy theory.

“Your grandchildren will be burning mosques.”

THe real question here is "Does the House of Saud " actually believe their own nefarious propaganda ?
NO
But are they are preaching to lobtomised Muslims.
yes
they have learnt from the success of the European vilification of Jews that this is the answer that Muslims and some Europeans want to hear.
BLaming Jews for everythimg exonerates them from their own evil deeds.
It is also the answer that many left wing marxists in the european world want to hear too. (I;ve left out the KKKs)
MAD Conspiracy theories are nowhere as abundant as they are in the Arab world.
Mossad planned 911
Prince charles is a Muslim
Diana was killed by MI5
etcetcetc.
Only the severely lobotomised or blinkered are attracted to this kind of hateful disinformation.

THe Saudis heve been waging Jihad on the west ever since the Saudi princes started collecting thier oil revenues.And no one noticed!
Only this was not a visible violent jihad .
It was a jihad of stealth and indoctrination to appease their own jihadists who saw tham as corrupt and unworthy.
EVEN They, the richest men in the world can take no action that is unsanctioned by their top clerics.
The stealth Jihad of appeasement was the financing of maddrassa, mosques and university departments throughout the dar al harb.
Under the guise of "religious education" they have infiltrated every western country and fulfilled their jihadist duties in a non violent manner.
They have well played on the corruption of some westerners to achieve these goals.
By doing this they have paid their dues over the last thirty years and have avoided losing control of Saidi Arabia.

Yep, it really is a CIA-Zionist conspiracy. BTW, did everyone know that the Waziris and other Pushtuns up on the NW Frontier of Pakistan are really Jews in disguise? They're only pretending to fight the Americans. In October, they're planning to hand over OBL to the American army in front of cameras while singing "Havah Negilah".

Interesting that everyone with a grudge against Christianity (Carlisle, Shaw, Gibbon, Besant--does Islam believe in trying to communicate with the dead?-- etc.) says such wonderful things about Muhammad. As for Shaw, that great intellect believed that the millennium had arrived in Stalin's Russia as well-when he was an old geezer who should've known better.

In fact, I understand that for a long time, the Muslims were rather wary about encouraging dhimmi to convert, since the Muslim rulers feared erosion of their tax base should that happen. Yet this gives a sense that perhaps, for the early Muslims, wealth was loot rather than product.

Those great thinkers and writers of the past DID NOT have Islam breathing down their necks and stirring the pot of hatred in their own home countries. These gentlemen might have visited Islamic lands, but then the returned home to sit in their comfortably arm chairs and wrote about events that were happening "over there" to "other people." Had they been our contemporaries, would they have written about Islam in such glowing terms? I think not.

I have never publicly responded to anything I have read on all the threads from Robert Spencer's websites, but I have learned so much from ALL of you. I just read Hugh's post above and was so moved by it I sent it to my friends and family, crediting Hugh, of course, and referencing this website I love so much! Thank you for helping me understand the threat our world is under and how to educate others. It starts with one person and soon enough becomes many. Let's hope it's not too little or too late!

What does one expect from a degenerate religion that extols the virtues of a 52 year old pedophile named muhammed marrying a 6 year old girl. Never in history has this occurred. Even in certain eastern religions, a girl may be promised at 9 years old, but never married nor sexually abused. Only in islam. What a disease.

Now let's be fair. Yes, Muhammad did marry Aisha when she was 6 years old. But he demurely waited until she was 9 before he did -- what is the demotic, again? -- the wild thing with her. And while, in his dotage, he saw a toddler (perhaps in her playpen, as he first saw Aisha on the swings) and "threw her a stray glance yearningly" as Hardy would have put it, he never acted on the impulse, and was still waiting for the tiny tot to grow up so that they -- he and she -- could hook up when, alas, he died.