Maybe he really does understand what is at stake, or is beginning to. Or maybe he is beginning to understand that a growing number of Americans do not buy, if they ever did, his "religion of peace" line. From the Washington Times, :
KUTZTOWN, Pa. -- President Bush yesterday called the war on terror "a mighty ideological struggle" between an American society of religious tolerance and Islamist militants who kill those with different beliefs."The better way to describe what's happening is, this is a war against an ideology which stands exactly opposite of what we believe," said Mr. Bush, using more direct and religious language to describe the war than ever before.
At an appearance later in the day in Lancaster, Pa., Mr. Bush said terrorists' "hearts are filled with evil," he said. "There is no peace treaty you can sign with these people."
Shortly after the September 11 attacks, Mr. Bush characterized the war on terror as a "crusade," an off-hand comment that was widely criticized as being insensitive to Islamic culture. He has avoided couching the war in religious terms since.
But campaigning for re-election as a war president at a time when support for his performance as commander-in-chief is waning, Mr. Bush has sharpened his rhetoric.
Admitting that his "greatest fear is we're going to get attacked again," Mr. Bush told 2,500 supporters at a basketball gym at Kutztown University that he is "working hard to stop it from happening" by showing strength to the terrorists.
"Listen, we want to whip them in Iraq before we have to face them here at home," Mr. Bush said.
One of the most important values of the United States, the president said, is the nation's tradition of religious tolerance -- a value not shared by the enemy.
"You see, we believe that you're as big a patriot if you worship the Almighty as if you don't. And if you choose to worship, whether it be as a Christian, Jew or Muslim, you're equally as patriotic as your neighbor," Mr. Bush said. "That's what we believe. You have the freedom to worship as you see fit in America.
"That's the exact opposite of the dim view of the people who are trying to cause us harm. So this is really a ideological struggle where the enemy is willing to use terror as a tool."
I was shocked to hear snippets of radio getting in and out of the car last week in which both Michael Medved and Rush Limbaugh said flat out on their shows that this is a religious war declared on us by Muslims. Rush really shocked me by saying that the problem is Islamic but that you would never know it from US Muslim groups; Medved who went further and said it is much more deeply embedded in Islam than anyone is willing to admit.
In both cases, conswervatives who have been much more interested in other issues are slowly (oh so slowly, grasshopper) beginning to admit the scope of the problem.
Do you not recognize the desperation in the ravings of your evil leader George Bush? Perhaps he has come to realize that the enemies of Allah (swt) have neither the courage nor the will to defend their rotten "culture" of immorality, disbelief, pornography, sexual perversion, greed, and selfishness. Perhaps he realizes that Europeans and Americans have murdered their future generations through abortion rather than suffering the "inconvenience" of raising children.
Perhaps he has noticed that Europeans have already come to terms with the Islamic future of their continent. Perhaps he has noticed that at least half of the American people reject their own "culture" and will accept the imposition of Islam.
Surely most of you people are not so blinded by your hatred that you cannot see that the outcome of the present struggle is inevitable. The world belongs to Almighty Allah (swt) alone and he has guaranteed the triumph of Islam.
I implore you - stop warring against Almighty Allah (swt). Stop oppressing Muslims. Embrace Islam now and look to the glorious future under the new world-wide Islamic Caliphate. Rejoice that all corrupt and unjust man-made laws and governments will be swept aside and replaced by Allah's (swt) divine Sharia.
The light of Islam is shinning brighter every day. The rotten edifice that is Western "civilization" is moribund and crumbling before your eyes. Look to the future, not to the dying past that will fade away, never to rise again.
Your grandchildren will be Muslim.
Allahu akbar
That part of Bush's speech, in which it is claimed that if one "chooses to worship, whether it be as a Christian, Jew, or Moslem" you "are equally patriotic as your neighbor" should not pass unremarked. One, it appears to link, and to favor, the three religions deemed monotheisms. It leaves out Hindus and Buddhists, among others -- do most Americans have less, or more, in common, with Hindus and Buddhists, then they do with their "fellow monotheists" the Muslims? I suggest that "monotheism" at this point is an essentially hollow and deceptive point of common ground, given that under Islam, fellow monotheists could, at best, expect not immediate death, nor forced conversion, but the slow asphyxiation that leads to conversion, through the imposition of dhimmitude, that institution, one should not ever tire of repeating, that imposes a status of humiliation (see Quran 9:29), degradation, and permanent insecurity on those fellow monotheists, Christians and Jews.
Secondly, and even more disturbing, is the dreamy insistence that Muslims are "equally patriotic as their neighbor." From whence this assumption? From the numbers of Muslims eagerly enlisting (there aren't any)? From the memorable and heroic performance of Muslim-Americans in Iraq, that makes us think of how that celebrated and much-decorated regiment of Japanese-Americans, the 442nd, performed during World War II? There hasn't been anything like this. From the way that Muslim-Americans have come out in force to protest against Muslim decapitations of Americans, Islamic threats against Americans? There hasn't been any coming out in force. From the way Muslim organizations have at every step publicly supported the need to report suspicious individiuals, to under no conditions leave any stone unturned, to self-monitor the mosques, to watch for those who echo the malevolent sentiments on Al-Jazeera? They haven't; in fact, a number have behaved in a fashion that can only be regarded as what, during World War II, would have been regarded as grounds for stripping people of their citizenship.
Islam itself is a manichaen belief-system. It teaches that there is Islam, and nothing else. It teaches that Islam "is to dominate, and not to be dominated." It teaches that the essential division of humanity is between the Believers and Infidels, and the Believers must triumph, and the Infidels, if left alive and unconverted (and some should remain unconverted so that, as in the past, their financial contributions may support the Muslim state), must be reduced to a condition that the phrase "second-class citizen" hardly does justice to. There can be, in Islam, no loyalty to an Infidel nation-state; it simply contradicts the clear teachings of the religion, of everything that is expressed in Qur'an and hadith. This belief-system is instinct with loyalty solely, only, to Islam itself.
Perhaps the President still does not understand this. Or perhaps he does, and thinks it better to pretend otherwise. Both possibilities are unacceptable. There is no need for him to dwell, or even to mention, the problem of the kind of single loyalty that Islam demands (save, of course, for feigned loyalty in order to protect, in Infidel lands, the position of Islam and of Muslims -- that is a different matter). But he need not, either, express a view which is flatly contradicted by the tenets of Islam.
Even though you can't access it anymore, I'll still point out that Reza identifies herself in her email address as "rezareza666". Puts her comments in perspective, doesn't it?
Mr. Imm:
You state that I attacked Robert Spencer in my comment above. Kindly provide the relevant quotation(s) from that comment or provide a retraction and appology.
Allahu akbar
This war will not end untill we end Islam!
Mr. Imm:
The sentence from my coment that contains the term "ravings" is:
"Do you not recognize the desperation in the ravings of your evil leader George Bush?"
Do you seriously claim that that sentence constitutes an attack on Robert Spencer, as you alleged above?
Mr. Imm, you have been caught out in a lie and have slandered me because you clearly lack the intellectual capacity to respond to those who dare to challenge your unreasoning hatred of Islam. This is yet another example of what is meant when I implore the readers of these comments to stop oppressing and abusing Muslims.
Mr. Imm, an honorable man would admit to his falsehood and issue an appology to those whom he has offended. Your response to my request does you no credit.
Allahu akbar
Tens of millions of Muslims march in protest of points that "further Islam." furthering Islam is not the same as ending terrorism which is a tactic used to "further islam." The headscarf is only one "small triumph" in the march toward imposing Islam on the rest of us.
Our "romantic views" are only an expression of self-defense against a predatory ideological movement that would enslave us all. Rez and olkonmakis are just some of those that would do so. We all recognize that.
Maybe most Muslim dont have time to speak out, they are to busy shaving there hind parts!
This is Islam!
Mohammed, a Jewish pseudo-Messiah.
Islam is built on subtle lies which have been concocted by evil men. Islam is the only religion that says that Jesus did not die on the cross. It denies this historical fact about Jesus which therefore negates the salvation given us by His painful death and resurrection from the dead
Most Muslims do not realize that Islam allows no freedom, and this alone should make them realize that it is Satan behind Islam who wishes to enslave Muslims to turn them away from the truth. Islamic law encourages Muslims to proselytize. Islam, however, clearly forbids others to proselytize to Muslims - because hearing the truth as revealed in the Christian Bible would weaken this false path to God; which Islam surely is.
Dear President George Bush,
So far our tactic has been to overpower regimes like those of the Taliban and Saddam in a conventional combat. The enemy stands no chance of prevailing against us in such combat. But once we prevail over the enemy, then starts the second phase of covert guerilla warfare where the enemy snipers and mortar gunners and shoulder fired stinger missile operators can pick up our marines one at a time at their convenience in an endless sniper war. No army howsoever powerful with conventional weapons using conventional war tactics can win such a sniper war. At this juncture when are about to repeat (after the 2004 Presidential elections) the same war strategy in Syria, Iran and then maybe elsewhere, it is high time for us to consider the other option – the Hiroshima option Had we not used this option by bombing Hiroshima and then after a few days bombed Nagasaki, the Japs may never have surrendered that fast and would have taken many more American lives. In today’s War on Terror, instead of sending our marines into Syria and then Iran, Sudan, Somalia, Libya, etc to win a conventional war, only to be bled day by day in a sniper war as is happening in Iraq, we should use the Hiroshima tactic of picking off some cities in the target countries and then setting out terms of surrender to the target Muslim country:
The terms should include (among other terms) the following:
- Lay down your arms, by disbanding your army and police.
- Hand over all weapons to the allied forces at the borders.
- Give up Islam as your religion, and the Quran as your religious book and the Shariah as your lawbook; or else face more Hiroshimas.
- Demolish all your Mosques and Madrasas.
- Ban the use of Hijab, Chador, Burkha by females.
- Ban the wearing of religious caps and growing of beards (a la Ataturk) by males.
- Accept any one of the non-Muslim religions.
- Agree to establish parliamentary democracy and secularism.
- Any non-compliance will lead to more Hiroshimas.
newonterror.com
A religion is at the root of the terrorism that we witness across the world today. All Religions originate from a psychiatric paranoia, based on a misunderstanding of the unknown universe as a god. This paranoia becomes a threat to civilization when a religion insists that everyone should accept that, the way in which this religion misunderstands the unknown universe as a god, is the ONLY right way (to misunderstand the universe!).
Missionary religions are an infectious psychiatric paranoia and Violent Missionary religions are a criminally infectious psychiatric paranoia that threaten human civilization. While all religions are psychiatric paranoias, only Islam is a criminally infectious psychiatric paranoia.
With the Quran setting the principles for forcible conversion of all non-Muslims to Islam and using coercion of treating non-Muslims like 2nd class beings, the base is prepared for the Madaressahs (Islamic theological-terrorism schools) to inculcate these Quranic principles into the minds of every growing generation of Muslims to have this attitude of paranoid coercion. Further at every prayer (Ibadat/Namaz), the Muslim priest (Maulavi) preaches the practice of terror to his audience. This is how a terrorist is born. So the Quran, and what is preached in the Madaressahs and the Mosques are the real roots of terror. And until the world over, we do not eradicate these, the problem of terrorism will not end.
There will come a point when widespread Muslim terror attacks against the U.S. will no longer allow military actions as we have taken in Iraq and Afghanistan and will call for a re-appraisal of our military strategy. A re-appraisal as happened during World War 2 when the allies in 1939 began by bombarding Germany with pamphlets asking the Germans to make peace, to the bombing of Dresden to rubble in 1945. It took six years during the last World War to bring about this change. How long will it take now? And in what circumstances now do we reach that point? Here's the dilemma: to have any hope of victory over the Jihadis, we must use a terrible, overwhelming, and insidious force; yet, in using that force we risk losing popular support for the war effort.
Victory requires a devastation so complete as to disabuse the enemy of any and all notions of pride (in this case Arab and Muslim pride) and the futility of resisting us. This kind of psychological change is forced in the enemy only by visiting a defeat on him that is so horrendous and complete that his very existence is dependent upon your will. Think of the bombing of Tokyo, and the fire-storms that followed in 1945. Think of Dresden. It is said that bombs fell in Dresden until the only effect was to bounce the rubble. Think of Hiroshima (horrendous as it seems, but can we prevent it from coming to that sometime in this war?).
If you are familiar with U.S. history, consider the way we completely drove out the last Britisher (colonialist) from the newly independent United States in 1776, consider the sacking of Atlanta during our Civil War, and the psychological impact on Southerners of Sherman's March to the Sea. Unfortunately, these are the necessary atrocities of a successful military campaign. This is what the history of war teaches: Without a complete and total annihilation of the enemy, he will never come to realize the folly of his ways... and he will rise to fight us again. The point is when and under what circumstances will we be provoked to carry this war to a decisively successful conclusion. Last time it was Pearl Harbor, this time if it has not been 9/11, then will it be a nuke or dirty nuke attack on the West or the US mainland?
newsonterror.com
Jeffrey, excellent post. I visit this site several times a day, it affirms my belief that the biggest threat that is faced by western civiliztion is militant islamism.
jeffreyimm:
You are obviously not a regular reader of Reza's posts. She advocates the establishment of the worldwide islamic caliphate and the establishment of sharia law by whatever means possible. Her concept of "peace" is of the "convert or die" variety.
I saw the speech and he still said,and I quote,"They have hijacked a great religion".But he has to,because their is still hope for the "bad" muslims, who've not yet been turned into murderous beasts like their pitchman.
Mr. Imm:
1. As I am unable quickly to locate many comments that you have authored, I am unable at present to document any "unreasoning hatred of Islam". I shall therefore appologize for accusing you of such attitudes. I will pay close attention to your comments henceforth and reserve the right to point out any such statements that I may encounter therein.
2. My statement about "abusing Muslims" specifically used your unfounded accusations against me as an example.
3. I am not an Islamic scholar and so will not enter into theological debate with you or with any other unbeliever. I have in the past provided links to fatwas issued by respected authorities and will continue to do so in the future.
4. I will not permit you to bait me into making any uncomplimentary references to other Muslims. This would constitute Gheebat (backbiting) which is a serious sin.
Thank you for your appology. I accept it and hope that you will graciously accept mine.
Allahu akbar
Hey, check this out. Its a site which posts various jibes, digs, insults and off-color words in Arabic.
http://www.insults.net/html/swear/arabic.html
Forgot to add... Here's a pretty funny 'insult' generator. Check all the boxes for the best insults.
http://www.insults.net/html/odd/random.html
To Reza
You said:
"Do you not recognize the desperation in the ravings of your evil leader George Bush? Perhaps he has come to realize that the enemies of Allah (swt) have neither the courage nor the will to defend their rotten "culture" of immorality, disbelief, pornography, sexual perversion, greed, and selfishness. Perhaps he realizes that Europeans and Americans have murdered their future generations through abortion rather than suffering the "inconvenience" of raising children."
Let me ask you this....
Which religion encourages/demands of its followers to murder men, women and children?
Which religion offers sex as a reward for killing innocent people?
Which religion says its ok to rape women?
Which religion treats women as inferiors with limited rights compared to men?
The answer clearly is one religion only, its called ISLAM!!!!
The western world is light years ahead of the arabian deserts, which is why muslims are invading Europe and America in their millions, there are very few people going the other way.
I know the truth hurts, but the sooner you wake up and realize it, the better.
Mohammed was a delusional man, he thought he was a prophet, he doesnt even begin to fit the definition of a prophet of God, maybe he was a prophet, a prophet of satan as only satan would be encouraging murder and rape in his name.
After reading Reza`s rants and threats against all that are not of the Islamic faith.
I could never give him/her an apology for any comments for his/her hypocrisy and display of hate towards the Zionists and Christians has known no bounds at all.
It is Reza that should be apologizing ,but then he/she has never responded to my comments regarding his/her rants.
reza Borg Master said, “Surely most of you people are not so blinded by your hatred that you cannot see that the outcome of the present struggle is inevitable. The world belongs to Almighty Allah (sob) alone and he has guaranteed the triumph of Islam.”
Hey reza! Good to see you again, how are you, you silly bugger? Still working on that Borg thing eh? “Resistance is futile! The Borg (swt) will absorb you!” hehehe… you just crack me up… I almost piss myself laughing whenever I read your stuff…
Listen, go directly to your nearest Buddhist Temple, talk to the resident monk and learn some relaxation meditations. It will do you a world of good.
“Your grandchildren will be Borg slayers and the world belongs to The West.”
Reza
Wish you would vary your rhetoric from Al Muhajiroun to make your comments more interesting.
Might I suggest www.Khilafah.com or www.qoqaz.com
where you can contact Al Qaeda in Chechnya?Find out how the brothers are doing.Since a tiny country like Israel can ably defend itself from all its big murderous Muslim neighbours, don't think we in the West are going to lose much sleep over terrorist threats. Or yours.Greetings.
SonofMoses asked:
Which religion encourages/demands of its followers to murder men, women and children?
Deuteronomy 20:16-17
"But of the cities of these people, which the LORD thy God doth give thee for an inheritance, thou shalt save alive nothing that breatheth:
But thou shalt utterly destroy them; namely, the Hittites, and the Amorites, the Canaanites, and the Perizzites, the Hivites, and the Jebusites; as the LORD thy God hath commanded thee.."
[Kill the men, the women, the children, even the farm animals.]
Which religion offers sex as a reward for killing innocent people?
Numbers 31:17-18
"Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him.
But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves."
[Islam makes you die to have virgins, Moses' commanders didn't have to wait, they got their virgins in this world, not the next.]
Which religion says its ok to rape women?
See above
Which religion treats women as inferiors with limited rights compared to men?
Exodus 20:17
"Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any thing that is thy neighbour's."
[Women are grouped with oxen and asses as property. Manservants and maidservants were slaves, not paid domestics.]
The point is not that there is an equivalence between modern Islam and modern Christianity. Anyone who follows the news knows that it isn't Christians who are doing the killing today. The point is that faith in scriptural revelations leads to murder of the innocent.
Christians, from the time of Constantine up to the Renaissance, were as brutal and sadistic as anyone else in that era. They justified their barbarism with scripture. Only modern Islam has exceeded the Christian Dark Ages in raw suicidal madness.
The most dangerous people are those who study ancient barbaric texts and spend their time justifying it. As you read this there are people on this site saying to themselves "Non Believer doesn't understand Christianity and Judaism" or "He is relying on a faulty translation" or "The Hittites deserved it" or "Women were property, but highly regarded property" or "Kill the infidel" or whatever. Anyone who cannot condemn brutality and injustice because it was practiced by co-religionists is dangerous.
On the bright side, Bush's comments were good news to me. For the first time he acknowledged that non believers could be patriotic. For a fundamentalist like Bush it is nothing short of amazing. This is a great advance over his father who said that atheists should not even be thought of as citizens.
Perhaps Bush is starting to understand the enemy, I hope so but his actions have been enormously frustrating for me. His refusal to attack Fallujah or destroy mosques protecting terrorists and his willingness to deal with Muqtada al-Sadr were not encouraging.
Non Believer,
I agree with your last paragraph that certain of Bush's actions were not encouraging. I suspect that is some of the wimp-factor he inherited from this father showing through.
Don't get me wrong! I support Bush and he's a world of difference from John F-ing Kerry.. And I respect his resolve and determination to win the war against Islam.
But I must say that he's 'gone wobbly' on us a few times when he should've stepped forward and thrown the punch..
reza,
'Perhaps he has noticed that at least half of the American people reject their own "culture" and will accept the imposition of Islam.'
If Islam were so great, it wouldn't need imposition.
"4. I will not permit you to bait me into making any uncomplimentary references to other Muslims. This would constitute Gheebat (backbiting) which is a serious sin."
So, condemning other Muslims, such as those doing ride-by killings of Christians and Buddhists in Thailand (notice that I chose an example that has NOTHING to do with US foreign policy - is a serious sin.
jay
nonbeliever,
faith in scriptural revelations does NOT lead to murder of the innocent. the quran does not tell muslims to kill the innocent. muslims are, in fact, very peaceful people. i know youve heard it so many times before but you dont believe it, well, youre going to have to. just because the only way islam is portrayed on the media is as a violent religion, it is not. if a person drives a brand new excellent car badly, does anyone blame the car? no, they blame the driver. so why do people blame the religion when only a small fraction of it is bad?
alll people do is go around, calling the Holy Prophet Muhammed (SAW) a pedophile, murdurer, etc. which is totally ludicrious, as it is not true. mahdi- Bush is a world of difference from John Kerry. thank god. i dont know how we would live with two George Bushs.
Mahdi Al-Dajjal:
I don't think it is the wimp factor with Bush, I think that he actually believes that Islam is a religion of peace. He has a fundamentalist worldview that makes religious texts the basis of all morality. If he attacks Koranic verses supporting murder and terror how will he explain the Biblical verses that I posted?
Iran is another issue. July 8 was the fifth anniversary of the first uprising against the mullahs. Not a peep from Bush about this. He said that he supported the students in their desire to be free but no mention that what they wanted to be free of was theocracy!
I believe that the reason for this is that the rebels in Iran are not merely secular, they make the ACLU look like a monastery. They demand absolute separation of mosque and state. Bush could never support that.
Bush believes that the new governments in Afghanistan and Iraq must be based on "good Islam" which will provide the moral basis for government. The new name of Afghanistan is "The Islamic Republic of Afghanistan" and that is taken seriously. No law may violate the sacred tenets of Islam. The same will probably be true in Iraq.
The laws of these countries must pass the test of "Are they consistent with Islam?" Under those circumstances who do you think will be making that determination? Answer - the interpreters of ancient texts, the mullahs.
That will put us back to square one.
muslim:
You asked "if a person drives a brand new excellent car badly, does anyone blame the car?" If the only people having accidents were driving Mercedes then what conclusion can you draw? I would say that Islam seems extraordinarily accident prone.
As for the charges of Mohammed being a pedophile: There is a word to describe a man who has sex with a nine year old girl that he call his wife and that word isn't "husband"!
RezaAhriman666 is a friftar (deceiver).
Bush is restricted by his position from saying what he believes. He is a President at war.
Obviously, in war good strategy dictates that you maximize friends and limit your enemies. Napoleon and Hitler demonstrated this fulsomely.
Once the most radical and dangerous islamic states are liberated the conditions should permit more openess.
The astonishing rigidity and tenure of Islam -- its thought control -- is incompatible with a shrinking world.
muslim said, ” faith in scriptural revelations does NOT lead to murder of the innocent. the quran does not tell muslims to kill the innocent.”
It is how the koran defines “innocent” that has me worried…..
I would also like to know how you define Peace. In The West, peace can mean many things, not all of them positive. In Rome, Carthaginian Peace meant total destruction of the enemy, the peace of the grave. Roman Pax meant peace at the point of a sword. The same as Pax Britannica.
And tell me your definition of pedophile. A 53 year old man boinking a nine year old girl fits mine.
“Your grandchildren will bring peace to islam.”
Hugh,
Your comments questioning the patriotism of at least some Muslim Americans is reflected in this statement just issued by the family of Cpl Hassoun.I don't recall a family issuing a statement making excuses for their sons service in the US military.This statement was issued after Cpl Hassoun was discovered safe in Lebanon.
Marine's Family Appeals to Arabs
Saturday, July 10, 2004
BEIRUT, Lebanon — Relatives of a U.S. Marine who surfaced in Beirut nearly three weeks after an apparent kidnapping in Iraq appealed for understanding from fellow Arabs on Saturday, saying the Lebanese-born man emigrated and joined the Marines for financial reasons.
Cpl. Wassef Ali Hassoun (search) was doing well and recovering at a U.S. military hospital in Germany after being flown out of Lebanon on Friday, a Marine spokesman said. He is expected to return to his home unit in Camp Lejeune, N.C., next week.
In Hassoun's native city of Tripoli, his family issued a statement saying he was forced to go to the United States and join the Marines because of the deteriorating economic situation caused by Lebanon's 1975-90 civil war.
The statement appeared aimed at countering criticism by some fundamentalist Sunni Muslims in Tripoli who accused Hassoun's family of being "American agents and collaborators." It stressed the family's Arab and Islamic ties, and its loyalty to Lebanon.
"We are a family of Lebanese Arab Muslims. We are not seeking to defend ourselves," the Hassoun family's statement said. "But we would like to thank the Lebanese for sympathizing with one of their sons (Hassoun) who was pushed by the difficult living conditions in their home country to emigrate and forced to work in a position that they may not like."
The statement said Hassoun, 24, was "driven by the lure of a good life to emigrate, (but he) might have made a mistake by choosing to sign a four-year contract with the U.S. Navy, which expires by the end of 2005."
The Marines are technically part of the Navy.
On Thursday, two people were killed and three others wounded in a Tripoli gunbattle between members of the Hassoun clan and business rivals who taunted them as being American collaborators.
The Hassoun clan, estimated at about 4,000 people, lives mostly in Tripoli and Dinniyah, northern areas where anti-American fundamentalist Sunni Muslim (search) groups are dominant.
Hassoun, who joined the Marines in 2001, vanished June 20 from his base near the troubled Iraqi city of Fallujah where he had been working as an Arabic translator.
A week later, he appeared in a videotape aired on Arab television that showed him being held hostage by militants. His eyes were blindfolded with a white cloth, and a sword was hanging over his head.
Days later, there were conflicting reports about his fate — first that he was beheaded, then that he was alive. He showed up Thursday at the U.S. Embassy in Beirut (search), but it was unclear how he reached Lebanon and contacted American officials.
The Navy is investigating whether the entire kidnapping might have been a hoax.
Frankly, I think Bush's stopping short of declaring a war on Islam is not a matter of his fear that his own religion is just as bad; but recognition that people like Amos and Adam (who posted either on Jihad Watch or Dhimmi Watch), that Doc out in Arizona and his 25 friends, and other such Muslims exist; and that they deserve avery benefit of the doubt--including a frank acknowledgment of their patriotism (that Arizona MD and one of the two posters I mentioned are Americans). Three cheers for Dubya!
I read the comments by Mr. Imm and non-believer with a fair amount of interest. Also, I see Reza promises us the same sort of peace known by the folks in Darfur even as I write, the Kurds under Saddam Hussein, and his own Iranian countrymen after they provoked Timur-e-lang (i.e., no peace).
Nonbeliever fails to note that Deuteronomy warns the Israelites that if they committed the same abominations as the Canaanites, they'd be spewed from the land as well (also, he fails to note that Genesis teaches us that Abraham was not allowed to inherit the land because the sins of the Amorite were not yet full--Gn. 15). He also fails to note that the rest of the Old Testament history and prophets show that the Israelites did indeed follow the Canaanite way (burning their firstborn, idolatry, etc.), and hence the Mesopotamians destroyed Israel and Judah.
The point of this history and the frightening warrant for the genocide of the seven nations of Canaan isn't "Aren't we so great and wonderful! See how God lets us murder whole nations!"
No, the WE to whom Deuteronomy is addressed (Christians, who retain the OT as Scripture, as well as Jews) are a stiff-necked people, and the sins of those nations is greater than ours (it's there, in the early chapters, too, Nonbeliever).
Our Jewish neighbors (pity they don't know M'shiach has come)have a day to mourn the failure of their ancient commonwealths--Tisha B'Ov (the 9th of the month of Ov). Nor is this a matter of whining about how mean non-Jews are; but a recognition of how the sins of the community--with a deisre to do better.
I pray that the Christian West never grows so callous to the Word of God that it requires a similar chastisement--although maybe God has answered me "NO" in the rise of Islam in the West(including the terror that many of its spokesmen now openly admit they are willing to unleash). This may be God's answer to a society that has received much from His hand, yet told him, ever so politely, to pack up and go; that could care less about the wholesale massacre of its next generation (something like the Canaanites and heathenized Israelites burning their firstborn?); and is oh so understanding about every sexual perversion known to man. I hope I'm wrong here, but I am one for whom the line "I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just" is more than a rhetorical flourish.
The point is that not even status as the chosen people and peculiar treasure of God expempts us from at least temporal chastisement if God seeks justice among us, but hears the cry of the oppressed (Isaiah 5).
And, before you gloat, friend Reza (my religion, unlike yours, does not forbid treating someone outside the faith as a friend--after all, YOU may end up with us rather than against us because of it), the lack of chastisement experienced by Mecca and Medina is because such is the mark of the illegitimate child rather than the true son of the household (Hebrews 12:8).
By the way, non-believer, for someone who is so sure of the moral superiority and mental health your unbelief entails, you seem pretty callous about how Sherman's march through Georgia, the fire-bombing of Dresden (and, shall we add, the way the Mongols sacked Herat and Baghdad?), etc. are necessary to win a war. Perhaps you are right, but I tremble with a great deal of fear and trepidation to consider that such things ever have to be done. Maybe it is better for us that a stupid fundamentalist like Dubya Bush is the one who has to make such decisions about whether bombing is to as surgical as possible or wholesale rather than someone like you.
Mr. Imm, who claims to be a Christian and a liberal (welcome, brother)condemns the KKK and Identity movement. As a Christian reactionary, I guess I have to say Amen to that, too, brother.
Mr. Imm can probably lay his finger on dozens of Biblical texts in the Old and New Testaments about loving one's neighbor, and Paul's admonition that there is neither Jew nor Greek, barbarian nor Scythian, slave nor free, etc., in Jesus Christ. Hence, he rightly concludes that people like the KKK and Identity people are hypocrites in terms of what all Christians see as divine revelation.
The problem that many people have raised is that it seems that the machete cultists and suicide bombers may indeed represent the most conscientious Islam in terms of what the Qu'ran and al-Hadith say. Now, if the Adams, Amoses, and similar folk end up spewing forth lots of Qu'ran and Hadith verses to prove OBL and Co. have hijacked their religion, I'll defer to their inside knowledge. But, until that happens, I will have serious reservations about Islam.
Excuse me, Non-believer: it looks as if I imputed Waronterror's views to you. My apologies.
"There is a word to describe a man who has sex with a nine year old girl that he call his wife and that word isn't "husband"!"
well.
-sex between father and his two daughters. night after night, both the daughters of prophet lot seduce their drunken father and concieve children from him. genesis 19:30-36
-judah commits incest with his daughter in law- she concieves immediately and delievers bastard teins who become the grandfathers of jesus christ. thus god rewards judah and his progeny. genesis 38:15-30
Reuben the eldest son of jacob, in the absence of his father, had sex with his fathers wife and israel, another name for jacob, heard it. but he did not do anything to his son, nor did God have a word of reproach for him.
-absalomsets up a tent on the flat palace roof and lays ten of his father's wives and rapes them all one by one, in the "sight of the whole israel." 2 samuel 16:21-23
you think it is necessary in ISLAM to be circumsised?
"He that is born in thy house, and he that is bought with thy money, MUST needs be circumsised: and my covenant shall be in your flesh for an EVERLASTING covenant." genesis 17:13
NONE of those Biblical personages' behavior is set up for us as an example to follow; in modern times, we condemn their behavior. We call none of them prophets. Not so with muhammad. His pedophilia is glorified and praised.
The mullahs in Iran lowered the marriageable age of girls to nine based entirely on the "prophet's" example. How sick is that?
Hello:
I share the view common on this board that Islam needs to be opposed and the West must be willing to fight back and or contain Islam.
Insofar as Bush executes the war I support him.
Yet I CANNOT VOTE FOR BUSH DUE TO DOMESTIC POLICIES: Pandering to Hispanics, Amnesties, Defense of Affirmative Action, Out of Control Spending, AIDS in Africa spending....
(Though, I am not voting for Kerry)
Those who guide the thinking in opposing Islamic radicalism ought to consider how they can influence the Kerry Administration, should it appear.
The poster 'muslim' doesn't want to look closely at the pedophilia inherent to Islamic scripture because he not only wnn't justify it but CAN'T else he's liable to have his head lopped off.
Rather, he falls back to the old argument which says that as long as you can point to someone (anyone - doesn't matter who) somewhere (anywhere - doesn't matter where) sometime (anytime) having done the same thing then you don't have to explain your own situation.
Since just about every conceivable atrocity has been committed by someone somewhere sometime against somebody else then nothing ever has to be explained.
So no explanation is owed to anybody for their prophet having murdered people, personally raped women and children (probably men too), pillaged and plundered everything from caravans to homes to Cathedrals and Synagogues, desecrated graves, tortured millions, and sold young children and babies into slavery for profit because ... well, others did it too..
Islam is the antithesis of what the civilized world commonly understands as good. For example:
In the west, if you are good and righteous then you are considered 'more holy' and you are elevated as a holy person. In Islam, you rise up in the cleric ranks by murdering your rivals (the more vicious the attack the better)...
In the west, if you cross paths with people who are hurt and in need of you help, you help them. In Islam, you first ask if they are muslim. If not then you rape them, steal all their stuff, and then kill them. If they are muslim, then you tell them that you'll be back with help for them but you lied so you don't ever return.
Just about every norm of behaviour in the west that you can think of is handled by Islam the exact opposite way! Islam really is the anti-thesis of civilized normative behaviour.
The MORE WORSE of a person you are the MORE YOU ARE VENERATED in Islam. If you are really an evil vindictive person with absolutely no concience whatsoever then you actually obtain sainthood in Islam.
Some of the Most Venerated Saints of Islam who sit at the right had of mohammed are:
Saint Pol (Pol Pot ruthlessly starved, tortured, and murdered over 2 million people),
Saint Josef (Stalin same thing as Pol Pot but did it to 20 million people that we know of and most likely twice that amount unaccounted for),
Saint Adolf (systematically murdered 11 million that have been accounted for and systematically executed untold millions more who were murdered behind buildings, in fields, up against walls, etc)
muslim said, "sex between father and his two daughters. night after night, both the daughters of prophet lot seduce their drunken father and concieve children from him. genesis 19:30-36"
When did Lot become a prophet? And what were his prophesies?
Canuck
Kutztown!
I went to college there. Got out just in time, too: they were going for University status and had Lowered requirements in order to get the required population numbers.
Probably too late to add my two cents, but I have thing Bush stopped short of declaring war Because of the election. Once he is in 'lame duck' position, he can take the gloves off. Why give Kerry the ammunition he needs to get Bush out?
A note on Muslim's attacks on the Bible, for the benefit of Sheikh Canuck and others:
Lot was the nephew of Abraham, and the sole righteous man God found in Sodom and Gomorrah, cities which God would have spared for the sake of ten righteous.
Lot's witness as a rightous man in Sodom and Gomorrah has a "prophetic" element, for the Biblical prophets spoke God's case against the people as well as foretold things (read the book yourself--don't just take my word for it).
His daughters did indeed get him drunk to copulate with him after the angels led them out of Sodom and Gomorrah. The sons conceived became the fathers of the nations of Ammon and Moab, of whom the Old Testament says little that is good, even if they were kinfolk to Israel.
Also, it is true that Judah (from whom all Muslims with the name Jawdad take their names) was deceived into having sex with his daughter-in-law Tamar. The harlot Rachab and her house were the only people saved from Jericho when Joshua, whose name means "YHWH saves" and for whom the Messiah is named, destroyed it. These figures are important because they are part of the Genealogy of Jesus Christ.
Muslim doesn't understand that the Bible nowhere shrinks from declaring the sins of the saints--or from calling on all the rest of us to repent.
Islam declares the perfection of Muhammad as a foil to the Christian doctrine of Jesus' sinlessness--then extends it to the rest of the prophets.
Nor does she appreciate the Gospel being the message of God's grace rather than a set of rules which, if followed, earn us salvation. So great are our sins that it requires nothing less than the sacrifice of the Son of God. Yet God has raised him up, leaving our sins--including Lot's incest, Judah's immorality, the pride and other pettinesses on the part of the rest of us--buried.
Christians are not called to wrap themselves up in a "holier than thou" mantle. God himself identifies with weak and sinful people (while we're on Genesis, let's not forget that Abraham lied to the Pharaoh of Egypt and Abimelech of the Philistines--a failure in his mission to be a blessing to the nations of the earth). They are the objects of His saving love. This is why Christ said he came to save rather than destroy men's lives (Luke 9:56).
This is not to have us sin that grace may abound, but to show us the shadows that the light of grace casts; and call us to repentence and faith rather than despair.
By the way, Muslim, in the Psalms, David confesses that his bones "waxed old" when he tried to cover his sin; and that he was restored only when he confessed. Could it be that one reason why the world of Islam is sunk in ecological dessication and brutal regimes is because the religion encourages people to think themselves better than they are?
In fairness to Bush, I think he and his advisors are perfectlyaware of islams true nature.
However before he can be more open he has to secure the wests energy supplies.
Unfortunatly the beasties in mecca have us by the gonads to a certain extent.
Until we are no longer dependent upon them Bush will have to be cautious in his statements about islam.
We need complete energy independence.
If you do a search on Bio fuels you will see there are alternatives.
I am having my car converted to run on vegetable oil.
The world has changed so much since 911, I do genuinly beleive that islam is finished.
The iranians are fed up with it and it is only a matter of time before the mullahs are overthrown.
Then we will have a reliable energy source from a secular anti islamic source.
military alliances are forming with nations that have a "debt to settle" with islam
see this link:
http://www.outlookindia.com/full.asp?fodname=20040712&fname=Indo+Us&sid=1
Regards
AI
They are apparently building a bio-diesle-fuel plant just a few miles east of where I am now in Canada. Should be interesting to see how this works out.