Annie Jacobsen's now-famous experience was not isolated. According to this Washington Times piece (thanks to Jjp Mackie), those kinds of dry runs are going on with disturbing frequency.
Flight crews and air marshals say Middle Eastern men are staking out airports, probing security measures and conducting test runs aboard airplanes for a terrorist attack.At least two midflight incidents have involved numerous men of Middle Eastern descent behaving in what one pilot called "stereotypical" behavior of an organized attempt to attack a plane.
"No doubt these are dry runs for a terrorist attack," an air marshal said.Pilots and air marshals who asked to remain anonymous told The Washington Times that surveillance by terrorists is rampant, using different probing methods....
A January FBI memo says suicide terrorists are plotting to hijack trans-Atlantic planes by smuggling "ready-to-build" bomb kits past airport security, and later assembling the explosives in aircraft bathrooms....
The article then recounts the details of Ms. Jacobsen's experience, adding:
The pilot confirmed Mrs. Jacobsen's experience was "terribly alike" what flight attendants reported on the San Juan flight.He said there is "widespread knowledge" among crew members these probes are taking place.
A Middle Eastern passenger attempted to videotape out the window as the plane taxied on takeoff and, when told by a flight attendant it was not permitted, "gave her a mean look and stopped taping," said a written report of the San Juan incident by a flight attendant.
The group of six men sat near one another, pretended to be strangers, but after careful observation from flight attendants, it was apparent "all six knew each other," the report said.
"They were very careful when we were in their area to seem separate and pretended to be sleeping, but when we were out of the twilight area, they were watching and communicating," the report said.
The men made several trips to the bathroom and congregated in that area, and were told at least twice by a flight attendant to return to their seats. The suspicious behavior was relayed to airline officials in midflight and additional background checks were conducted.
A second pilot said that, on one of his recent flights, an air marshal forced his way into the lavatory at the front of his plane after a man of Middle Eastern descent locked himself in for a long period.
The marshal found the mirror had been removed and the man was attempting to break through the wall. The cockpit was on the other side....
... [A] flight attendant reported that a passenger was using a telephoto lens to take sequential photos of the cockpit door.
The passenger was stopped, and the incident, which happened two months ago, was reported to officials. But when the attendant checked back last week on the outcome, she was told her report had been lost.
Recent incidents at the Minneapolis-St. Paul international airport have also alarmed flight crews. Earlier this month, a passenger from Syria was taken into custody while carrying anti-American materials and a note suggesting he intended to commit a public suicide.
A third pilot reported watching a man of Middle Eastern descent at the same airport using binoculars to get airplane tail numbers and writing the numbers in a notebook to correspond with flight numbers.
"It's a probe. They are probing us," said a second air marshal, who confirmed that Middle Eastern men try to flush out marshals by rushing the cockpit and stopping suddenly.
UPDATE: Clinton Taylor has shed a great deal of light on Annie Jacobsen's experience. It seems that the Syrians on her flight were indeed musicians, but that she had reason to be suspicious.
Osama really did screw up your country.
While this has been undoubtedly the case, this one apparently was not:
NATIONAL REVIEW ONLINE
[url]http://www.nationalreview.com/comment/taylor200407211921.asp[/url]
Moderator's Note: Answer to nagging question on Northwest flight enroute to LAX that has been lingering on the net all week. Thanks to LGF blogger Furious J.
Clue: Terrorists cells normally operate in groups of 3 to 5 males. but a least people are now sensitive to this stuff which is what we need.
*****
July 21, 2004, 7:21 p.m.
The Syrian Wayne Newton
The man inadvertently behind a scare in the skies.
By Clinton W. Taylor
Annie Jacobsen's recent piece for WomensWallStreet.Com made waves. Her account of flying with her family while 14 Middle Eastern passengers acted in a threatening and apparently coordinated manner makes for a terrifying read. Her article captures her sickening sense of both uncertainty and inevitability as what might possibly have been the next 9/11 unfolded around her. . .
Full text also on HSPIG [url=http://hspig.org/ipw-web/bulletin/bb/viewtopic.php?t=1123]site[/url]
Ron Wright, Moderator
HSPIG Forums Site
www.hspig.org
What is wrong with this administration?
#1. any foreigner without a green card needs to be escorted out of the country
2. any foreigner with a green card needs to go through extensive investigations
3. any holder of a green card with discrepencies needs to be in custody and either cleared or thrown out.
4. any new immigrant needs to go through extensive background checks.
Eneri,
Part of the problem is that the Republican Party has devolved from the the party of Conservatives into a party of Corporate Capitalism. Open borders, and the free movement of people, goods, and capital across those borders is in Corporate Capitalism's interests. Those interests are in conflict with our national security. A second Bush administration, or a Kerry administration is not likely to enact policies that are not favorable to Corporate Capitalism.
I think we need to be careful here. This is beginning to look like racial profiling and we certainly don`t want the ACLU coming down on airline pilots and passengers for being suspicious of middle eastern type looking men.
The guidlines set up by homeland security only allows us to be suspicious of 2 middle eastern looking men boarding per flight. Maybe we could pretend that we thought 2 or 3 of them where french or German? Yeah; that might work.#&**
The existential question Americans have to ask themselves is: Why is George Bush still allowing Bill Clinton to run the government? Nearly all of your critical institutions are being overseen by Clinton appointees, who are ardently dedicated to the liberal 9/10/01 world vision. When the islamic fanatics strike - probably within the next 6-8 weeks, what will be Norman Mineta's fate? Your standard government pension and summers in the Pokono's of course. I'm amazed at the media's demonstrative power to cast the spell of intellectual paralysis around holding the people who were entrusted (and well paid) to defend the country yet were never held to any legal or moral accounting. The next attacks will be the catalyst for a profoundly different response, its unlikely that the citizens of the United States will tolerate the government's impalitable demand that they be spectators in their own fate. The call for the removal of all muslims from the continental US will provoke a constituional crisis, this time the state will not enjoy the immunity it was granted after the first attacks. This fact has never been lost on the jihadis, which is why they have not attacked America since 9/11. Unfortunately the next attacks, whatever form they come in will bring a loss of live that is avoidable, only if those in responsible positions would grow up and face reality, most are still hiding under the sheets. When two hundred million of your citizens are heavily armed, do you think the national guard is really going to point the tank barrels outward when they're ordered to surround muslim enclaves?
Is there no public vote in the US to have this Corporate Capitalism dropped or significantly decreased in the name of national security?
Especially on the border which is more of a threat. If enough people are worried about the hugh threat open borders pose, not just from islamic terrorist, and vote against it, they have do something about it don't they. It may sound like I'm niave , but I always thought the US had stronger public voting system then the shambles excuse for one we have in the UK.
"#1. any foreigner without a green card needs to be escorted out of the country
2. any foreigner with a green card needs to go through extensive investigations
3. any holder of a green card with discrepencies needs to be in custody and either cleared or thrown out.
4. any new immigrant needs to go through extensive background checks."
Don't forget the fifth:
5. if an immigrant professes "faith" in Islam, they must undergo cult deprogramming. If they refuse to comply and denounce their Satan - DO NOT allow them admission to the free ride.
Alright, Mr. Spencer... assuming this is true, why isn't anyone reporting on it besides "WomensWallStreet.com"? I mean, we can count on FOX to tell us the facts, can't we? I don't read the papers much, but I do read the headlines every day. And the only place I have read anything about the dozen-or-so "musicians" that had free reign of a plane for the entire flight while Air Marshalls presumably stood anonymously by is here and at WWS.com. It just doesn't make sense.
Even if we assume (as many of your fans do) that CNN, ABC, etc. are firmly dhimmi-tized and won't say squat, where are FOX news and MSGOP, and the like?
fifthcolumnist: you are right. Money talks and patriotism walks.
newtopia: please sit down and take a deep breathe. Bill Clinton has been out of office for 4 years. Have faith, you are not alone, there are numerous 12 step programs to help you get over your Clintonphobia. Help is available. Good Luck
Oh wait, now I see that it is also in the Moonie Times. Okay, that's more like it. I never fully doubted the story, but it just seemed to absurd to be true. Maybe the Air Marshalls missed their flight that day?
The fact that not all bags are screened for bombs is reason enough for me not to fly anytime soon. I'll drive, take the train, the bus, or stay home.
This just solidifies it for me. Maybe after the "next 9-11" the airlines will sit up and take notice.
The passenger was stopped, and the incident, which happened two months ago, was reported to officials. But when the attendant checked back last week on the outcome, she was told her report had been lost.
...just like the photos of the Kennedy assassination, just like the Sami Al-Aryan evidence. OJ, MLK, Jon Benet.... when was the last time the police actually solved a major crime?
Recent incidents at the Minneapolis-St. Paul international airport have also alarmed flight crews. Earlier this month, a passenger from Syria was taken into custody while carrying anti-American materials and a note suggesting he intended to commit a public suicide.
Send him to Rikers Island. Maybe a someone who lost a loved one on 9-11 can help him on his way.
A third pilot reported watching a man of Middle Eastern descent at the same airport using binoculars to get airplane tail numbers and writing the numbers in a notebook to correspond with flight numbers.
People.... the "Middle Eastern descent" focus is going to come back to haunt us. I have seen MANY men from the Middle East that speak flawless Arabic, worship Allah, etc. that look just like any plain white man. They are probably descended from Christians that were forced to convert during the Muslim Crusades.
"It's a probe. They are probing us," said a second air marshal, who confirmed that Middle Eastern men try to flush out marshals by rushing the cockpit and stopping suddenly.
Man... if I had been there they would have thought I was an Air Marshall. The Air Marshall would have had to pull me off his lifeless corpse. Airlines need to put all men passengers in the front of the plane, and all women and bathrooms in the back. (Hey, it would be just like a flying Mosque!) There should be a line between the cockpit and the passenger area, and if a passenger crosses that line, they are fair game. If they can charge a fat person for two tickets, they can do anything.
And get rid of those ultra-dainty, feminine stewardess. Hire only rough, tough, ex-cons, failed professional wrestlers, and former military men. Make them all like bouncers. Have a little brig on every plane, like the Navy has on every boat.
I fear that the airline industry still doesn't "get it." I hope that they wake up soon before another tragedy befalls us.
Aaah, there it is. A comments area must have at least one partisan attack:
The existential question Americans have to ask themselves is: Why is George Bush still allowing Bill Clinton to run the government?
Silly! So that if there is another attack, you can get your orders from the RNC and the GOP to use THAT as a way to keep blaming everything on Clinton! Duh.
I was wondering why George Bush is STILL letting the Saudis get away with spreading jihad all over the world, by sponsoring preachers and madrassas in far-flung places like Pakistan, Bangladesh, "palestine", Morocco, Egypt, Sudan, and ... suburban Washington D.C.
Is it beyond the wit of the American government to 1) publicize this problem, as described in the article above, possibly by holding Congressional hearings and 2)simply banning travel on any airline by more than a prescribed number of Muslims -- 2-3 at most. If it is objected that this is outrageous, that this would require Muslim families and parties of friends to fly on different planes -- well, tough. One may reply: the first duty is to public safety. This state interest is so compelling, indeed is the first duty of government, that it outweights, in any sane balancing test, the possible inconvenience to innocent Muslims.
Unfortunately, we have not been treated to heartwarming displays of loyalty to this country by its resident Muslims. We have had nothing equivalent to the Japanese-American regiment, the 442nd, fighting to prove itself -- instead, we have had examples of Muslim soldiers, at least one killing his fellow soldiers in a sneak attack, and another who appears to have deserted his fellows, and there are other cases, of Muslims working for various security services, whose reported behavior does not -- shall we say -- inspire confidence.
Furthermore, those familiar with Qur'an, hadith, and sira understand that any Muslim who in fact subscribes to Muslim tenets, as set out repeatedly in those texts, and as confirmed or elabortaed upon by classical writings from all four schools of Sunni Islamic jurisprudence (and not only moderns such as Khomeini, Qutb, Maudoodi, Al-Farooqi, Qaradawi), Jihad is a central duty of all Muslims -- to spread Islam, to fight and kill and subjugate the Infidel. The notion that this is a tangential requirement is nonsense. Every single authoritative commentator confirms this; even those regarded in the West as far from being fire-breathers -- the histoiran Ibn Khaldun (a kind of Giambattitsta Vico of Ifriqiyya, or Tunisia), even the celebrated theologian Al-Ghazali (whom some in the West seem to regard as a kind of Muslim St. Augustine, ignoring -- or being ignorant of, more likely -- Ghazali's clear call for Jihad, and even, as the French Orientalist Laoust pointed out long ago, his insistence that Muslims make it an annual practice to participate in an expedition of Jihad-conquest.
So what should we do? Allow these trial runs? Acquiesce in our own demiste, or that of our fellows, whom we may not now? If these reports by pilots and crew are truthful -- and hearings, even secret hearings before Congress, could bring out the extent of the problem -- is the government perhaps calculating that its hand are tied "until there is a another big catastrophe" at which point, it will then feel, it can do what the farseeing thought should be done all along? Is this the idea -- that a still unknown planeload, or planeloads, of innocent Infidels, and perhaps the intended target on the ground, will have to be sacrificed, because the American public, and other Western publics, will only see the need for certain measures restricting the use by Muslims of airplanes AFTER another catastrophe?
It may be difficult for innocent Muslims -- "innocent" here is a word that needs to be in quotes, because any true Believer, any full Believer, in Islam must endorse Jihad and dhimmitude -- and these institutions mean the rquirement that all Infidels be killed, or converted, or subjugated and forced into a status of permanent humiliation, degradation, and insecurity. It seems fantastic. But look everywhere that Islam conquered -- and look, as well, at the situation wherever Islam has not yet conquered but even 5% or 10% of the population is Muslim, as in France today. Can anyone say, with a straight face, that this has not had enormous consequences, in expense (the cost of security, even now threatening to bankrupt the Olympics in Greece), in insecurity (try walking around Paris with a cross or a kippah, particularly along the Champs-Elysees), or in many of the banlieues and cities that have become, for non-Muslims, dangerous no-go zones, where even the police seldom enter. This is not necessary; this is not inevitable.
We have a duty to learn the tenets of Islam, and no wishful thinking or attempts to deflect steady attention from what those tenets are, should be permitted. Such deflection, such shutting-up, is perhaps the greatest security threat, because it keeps everyone from understanding what must be done. Had Europeans understood Islam (as they do not yet), they would never have permitted the kind of mass migration that, over the past decades, they have permitted. Whether or not they will come to their senses in time, so as to prevent further moves by the Saudis and others to pay for mosques and madrasas and the other instrument of Jihad that may precede, or accompany, or come after Combat (Qital), or indeed be an entirely independent and an alternative method for spreading Islam - which is to say Da'wa, the Call To Islam, spread through conversion, which in turn requires an established Muslim presence, along with all that such a presence depends upon, including mosques, madrasas, the ability to enforce sharia within its ouw community. And these, of course, are already well under way in much of Europe, thanks to money supplied by Muslim oil states, with Saudi Arabia footing much of the bill. Why is this demographic conquest any less of a threat than outright Combat, which cannot take place as long as the Infidel countries possess a technological superiority (Muslim states can steal weaponry and weapons plans, as A. Q. Khan did for Pakistan, or get aid from non-Muslim states and rogue Infidels, as Iraq did from France, as Iran does from a variety of sources)? In fact, it is not, for the result is the same.
There are those, with an imperfect understanding that the Jihad does not require any act by Infidels except that they insist on remaining Infidels. The "Anonymous" C.I.A.author of a recent supposedly "brave" and "daring" book on American policy and the Islamic threat, while he correctly identifies the need to understand that Bin Laden is wildly popular, that Jihadis are part of the mainstream, nonetheless shows a surprising lack of familiarity with Islamic tenets and Islamic history, for he contiunues dreamily to believe that the United States is the perceived enemy becuase of particular and limited "policies," and not because, in the end, as the most powerful Infidel power, and the one least likely to bend, it represents the main obstacle to the spread of Islam, to the world-wide Jihad, everywhere.
We have metal detectors, imperfect as they are. We have, however, no mental detectors at our airports, no way to determine if those five Muslim men over there, who have distributed themselves in seats between rows 10 and 13 and, though they were quite friendly while waiting to board, seem to not know each other (hmmmm....) on the plane, are innocent ("innocent" in the sense that they are not planning to engage in terrorism -- not "innocent" in the larger sense that they harbor no deep feelings of inculcated hostlity or hatred toward Infidels, for that would be impossible, if they are full-fledged Believers). And even among those who call themelves Muslims, but who are lukewarm in their attendance at mosques, are to found the attitudes, the atmospherics of Islam, that is -- a suspicion, a hatred, a singular lack of fellow-feeling and loyalty to Infidels, and a great urge to defend the Faith, including engaging in apologetics to prevent Infidels from understanding its true nature. Obviously, thsoe born into Islam who thoroughly understand, and reject it, are no longer Muslims at all, but apostates. Those, however, who continue to call themselves Muslims, whether out of filial piety, out of residual sense of loyalty, are in a mental or intellectual world which we, the Infidels, cannot quite fathom, and if we err, we must err, for our own safety, on the side of caution. Why must we, or our children, or our fiends, be put at risk? Why must we wait for another event, why must there be human sacrifices made, of innocent Infidels, before some sensible policies -- not only about who is searched, but who is even allowed onto planes even if they pass the most rigourous El-Al-style of searches?
Plane travel is not some god-given right. The duty of the government is to protect us -- and to fully inform us, or at the very least to do everything to stop misinforming us, about the nature of the belief-system called Islam, and which, out of a hatred of "cowboy Bush" or of "Sharon" or of "those who are bent on creating a police-state" (the hysteria here is beyond comprehension), or out of denial (who really wants to know about Islam, wants to know what this neverending Jihad will mean, not now, not for the next decade, but forever?), or out of laziness (you mean, I really have to read not just the Qur'an, but a few hundred or a few thousand of the most important hadith? I have to find out something about the major commentators? I have to learn how, under Islam, Christians and Jews and Zoroastrians and Hindus fared -- I can't just read a nice book about how wonderful everything was in Spain under that nice, tolerant Muslim rule where everyone got along so beautifully?).
Others may embrace these expressions of idiocy. They are comfort food for the minds of those who do not want to think, who cannot think, who abhor thinking.
Count me out.
I think we need to be careful here. This is beginning to look like racial profiling and we certainly don`t want the ACLU coming down on airline pilots and passengers for being suspicious of middle eastern type looking men.
Boy, sarcasm is SOOOO effective.
As I said above, the "Middle Eastern descent" focus is going to come back to haunt us. I have seen MANY men from the Middle East that speak flawless Arabic, worship Allah, etc. that look just like any plain white man. They are probably descended from Christians that were forced to convert during the Muslim Crusades.
Have you ever heard of Zacharias Moussaoui? Does he look "Middle Eastern"? How about Richard Reid? Or that Australian, Jack Roche? Did he look Middle Eastern? How about John Zogby, Louis FarraKlan, and Grover Norquist... do they look Middle Eastern?
Man, Islam has many "white man" converts. So we let them slip right on through at the airports?
Instead of whining about the ACLU (which is currently trying to help Rush Limbaugh avoid prison time, by the way) why not try to understand that the point is to carefully screen EVERY passenger, not just the ones that you think "look like" terrorists.
A similar phenomenon exists in medicine... you don't just put on gloves and carefully dispose of needles used on men that "look like" (talk like, smell like, dress like, etc.) they might have HIV/AIDS or Hepatitis. You do that with EVERY patient, because lots of people look "safe" but aren't... like Pamela Anderson.
Don't let your judegement be so clouded... think more carefully.
"This is beginning to look like racial profiling. . ."
(Banging head on computer desk)
ISLAM IS NOT A RACE!!!
and while I'm at it, and for those of you who still don't get it. . .
ISLAM IS NOT, IN NO WAY, NEVER HAS BEEN, AND NEVER WILL, NOR SHOULD IT EVER BE EVEN CONSIDERED, TO BE A "RELIGION"!!!
Quite simply and succinctly put:
ISLAM IS A SATANIC DEATH CULT ENGAGED IN A TACTICAL AND STRATEGIC CAMPAIGN FOR WORLD DOMINATION.
I.t's
S.atan
L.iving
A.mong
M.ankind
Pre-emptive first strike:
REZA, keeping in mind that you are a brainwashed member of the death cult and that you will likely be here sooner or later to spout off (wanting us to convert to islam, or die - sheesh!!), I dare you or any of your cult brethren to provide ANY REAL EVIDENCE to refute this fact!!!
And when you can't come up with even one example of a "good" thing your cult has done for humanity, stand by to discover just how EVIL your cult has been in the name of the Anti-Christ, the foretold in the Bible, the false prophet, violating many - if not all - of the Ten Commandments of God, the devil incarnate, Mohammed.
Its all laid out in the devil's diary, the Qu'ran.
Have you read the Gospel?
Still want to know. . . DOES IT SNOW IN ARABIA?
Yes or no, if you don't know, say so!!
Although the apparent need to constantly defend Bill Clinton is getting boring and stale, Keith is absolutely correct about screening everyone the same way. There are plenty of stupid white boys that have joined the machete cult, and they are as, or even more dangerous than the ones that were born into it because like the new guys in the mob, they feel the need to prove themselves.
Screening everyone the same way will also keep the civil rights huggers away. What happened on 9/11/01 can be blamed on both Clinton and Bush, or it can be blamed on neither. At this point it doesn't matter. What does matter is the fact that Muslims want us dead, and they're in our yard.
I would urge everyone to use no further restraint with regard to Islam or Muslims. We've been patient enough, and we've been run through the political correctness ringer for far too long.
Our ancestors built this country, all of us continue to build this country. This wasn't done, and isn't being continued for the benefit of Muslims that want to take it over. They've given little to nothing but have taken plenty and I'm sick of it.
They contribute nothing to our society, yet they're treated like some kind of royalty. I've never heard of royalty driving taxis, pumping gas, or bagging pop and candy at the mini-marts.
These illiterate foot soldiers are here for the purpose of taking over. Dems and Reps must band together to stop it. This in-fighting has to stop. Immigration is the problem. There is no necessity whatsoever for Muslims to be coming to this nation. The borders should be shut down, except for the exits.
these are the only one way to solve this...
everyone flies in their birthday suit....
everyone has a complete body cavity search...
no carry on....
no checked bags....
just your fat butt hanging out
how many of us would go for that?
kj:
You can leave Louis farrakhan out of that mix, surprisingly a lot of people dont know this but THE NATION OF ISLAM is not recognized as any part of the islamic movement and has not subscribed to the tenets of Islam .
The partizan comments are amusing. As usual, liberal bigots can never defend their positions so they attack motives. What's the modern definition of a conservative? A liberal saying stop? History is instructive, let me pose a question to all those convinced of history's end. During the second world war, which side fought from the premise that the outcome wasn't certain. It wasn't Hitler's crew, they were convinced of their superiority and no amount of evidence could penetrate that view. Roll forward to 2004, and ask the question: In the latest war of ideology, how can you tell if your winning? A good measure is what side people are more likely to identify themselves with. So what's more likely to get you killed from Morocco to Malaysia? Being vocally pro American or signing up at the local mosque for jihad duty?
Which of the five private news companies has the truth? Have you been hypnotized by them in believing your destiny is permanent lock on future? Destinies have always been determined by those willing to take risks, who cleary see the beyond comfortable predjudices.
What is most disturbing is that they're plugged into a nuclear bomb assembly line; aka Pakistan. What's your estimate of the impact on the West if Washington, London and Moscow go up in flames on the same day? They don't need to invade, they're already here. I watched freddy vs jason last night, it's as disturbing as we witness managerial liberalism battle islamic jihad. Honestly, its hard to determine which side is more arrogant.
Keithjoy,
Wow!!! I agree with you on something, some arabs do look western/european, but it's got to be a minute percentage. It would be impossible to screen every single person that goes through customs, so the most likely to be terrorists should be screened and searched. Failing that maybe everyone should have their religion printed on their passports so we know whose who. How many muslims would deny their faith? Mind you the q'ran says they're allowed to lie as part of jihad ,right? So whats the solution then? Total recall style X-ray scanners?
"Osama really did screw up your country."
Posted by: yobbo [TypeKey Profile Page] at July 22, 2004 07:39 AM
Nay, rather:
"Islam really did screw up your Osama."
You just don't get it, do you?
One other point: what happened to the man who was found trying to rip out the mirror in the bathroom so as to get to the cockpit? Arrested? Deported so that he could try again? What? What happened to the man who was videotaping and told to stop -- was the videocamera impounded, and the tape viewed? What about that "lost" report made by a stewardess about the passenger using a telephoto lens to make sequential pictures of the cockpit door? In other words -- what happened in all of these cases?
Is there no way, for example, to have a databank of fingerprints, and to quickly scan in the fingerprints of all passengers when they check in, to be quickly checked against country of origin, or how frequently that person has been flying, and even, whether any other passenger on that flight, about whom one has suspicions, may have previously been on the same flight with passenger number one.
All of this costs money, not least in the extra man-hours for every passenger on every flight, who must arriv still earlier, for the dead time of waiting. And all of this will only increase, until measures are employed that will simply prevent people who, because of their belief-system, Islam, are the ones we have every right to be worried about - not their race, not their national origin, but their belief-system, however tepid or fervent the outward and visible signs of that belief -- from travelling with other Muslims. Inconvenient for them, but not a question either of potential murder, or of the infliction of indescribable worry on both Infidel passengers, and on their families who may come to regard every plane trip by relatives and friends as an ordeal, worry lifted only at the news of safe arrival. It does not have to be this way. We do not have to make ourselves sick, or behave suicidally, in order to not offend those who, after all, adhere to a belief-system that enourages them, insists that they not only "not take Christians or Jews for friends" but that they work to subjugate the adherents of all other faiths. Whether or not a particular Muslim believes fully in that requirement is irrelevant. If he is a good Muslim, or calls himself a Muslim, we have every right to assume that he believes in the tenets -- the non-abrogated verses of Qur'an, the accepted hadith as collected in the recensions of Bukhari and al-Muslim, and in the example of Muhammad's own life and attitudes, reflected in the accepted biographies such as that of Ibn Ishaq.
There is a failure of intelligence here, a failure that is country-wide, world-wide. Not intelligence in the sense of "gathering intelligence" through spy satellites, and stolen briefcases, and James-Bond like feats of derring-do. No. I mean the other kind.
It has actually become painful to read of the sniviling cowardice of the mighty West. In Iraq, Afghanistan, Palestine, Chechnya, and elsewhere, brave Muslim men, women, and even children fight to their last breaths against the brutal hordes of unbelievers. Every day one reads of ordinary Muslims engaging in glorious acts of martyrdom in the cause of Allah (swt), giving their lives to destroy the Western invaders.
Compare these courageous acts to those of the cowardly Americans who, when they see a man of "Middle Eastern descent" on an airplane, hold hands and cry! How can you people live with your shame?
A commentator on another thread accurately likened Americans to old, sick, dying dinosaurs, lumbering slowly about with no hope in their eyes, awaiting Allah's (swt) command for their extinction. The dying beasts are still capable of killing innocent people in their dying spasms, but the end is in sight and unavoidable.
Surely there are those among you who can foresee the inevitable conclusion of the current struggle. Show compassion and help your benighted countrymen to accept the truth. Embrace Islam now and be part of the bright, shining future of Allah's (swt) world. Do not thrash futilely about until you are part of the dark, forgotten past.
Your grandchildren will be Muslim.
Allahu akbar
*reads Reza's comments, yawns*
Reza said,
In Iraq, Afghanistan, Palestine, Chechnya, and elsewhere, brave Muslim men, women, and even children fight to their last breaths against the brutal hordes of unbelievers. Every day one reads of ordinary Muslims engaging in glorious acts of martyrdom in the cause of Allah (swt), giving their lives to destroy the Western invaders.
Reza, tell us how can your kind win a war if your kind are dying like rats. In all of these place you mentioned and in others that do not involve the west (Iran even) muslims are dying, so please Einstein (he was jewish not muslim) how can this demonic cult called islam win???
Please idiot, come up with somthing original, just like a muslim to steal and copy everything.
reza,
has it ever occured to you that the reason all these muslims choose martyrdom is because it is the easiest way to leave islam. HHMM, that is a very good theory.
Reza,
That commentator on the other thread who came up with that crap about dinosaurs was none other than your twin freak brother, youknow the one who you sodomise every night against the will of Allah.I bet you came up with that comment together in bed last night didn't you ? Come on Reza admit it you're gay aren't you?
Good one, Rikki, though I'll try really hard not to visualize that one..
I live in the southwestern U.S. and we are
being invaded every single day. I know you
probably have some grasp of the problem
but just this past week two 18 wheelers full
of illegals were stopped in our area. How many more get through? And what happens to the "coyotes"? They get released on their on recognizance. (You just know he'll be back for the court date) And you can't tell some of these people from middle eastern types until they speak. The Mexican border should be closed NOW.
Even though you can't access it anymore, I'll still point out that Reza identifies herself in her email address as "rezareza666". Puts her comments in perspective, doesn't it?
Reza,
Does (swt) stand for Some Wanker Talking or Sodomized Womans Trauma? You got abused as a child didn't you?And now Allah (hawk!!!Spit!!!)is angry with you.You enjoyed it didn't you Reza?You're a hermaphrodite aren't you Reza?And Mahmoud abuses you like the muslim he-bitch that you are ( when it's his/her turn).
Going back to the tale of the Syrian Musicians...
The National Review Online article refered to in a post above by Ron Wright , explains in detail how those musicians do seem to have a legitimate "cover" story. However, things STILL may not be exactly as we perceive...
Another amazing story immediately came to my mind: CIA Goes Hollywood--A Classic Case of Deception. Antonio J. Mendez, a former agent for the CIA, masterminded a brilliant scheme to get 6 American diplomats out of Iran in the midst of the Iranian hostage crisis. How did he do it? He concocted an elaborate plot where the US agents attempting to infiltrate Iran posed as... movie scouts! You can read about this in brief in the Washington Post archives:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/style/feed/a52015-2000feb15.htm
Sadly, it appears that the Middle Eastern men "testing out" our aviation procedures don't even need an elaborate scheme or imaginative cover story in order to be basically left to their own "devices." Nevertheless, it would be foolish of us to underestimate the scheming and planning capabilities of those al-Qaeda folks.
Fox News showed the dry runs that are occurring every day here. Finally! Get your bullets and weapons ready, if they attack again, I'm going hunting!!! Where do you live reza? I really would like to meet you.
Don't mind Raisin, he's just been hittin' the jug again, he'll sober up in a few hours. Even "sniveling cowards" like all of us should be able to tell when a mentally defective alcoholic jumps on here and blast out the diahrrea he spews from his lips.
Remember, Raisin is our heckler. Somewhere over in the Arabian Ghetto, a village is missing their idiot.......They're sayin' "Oh where, oh where has our little tard Raisin gone?
Reza, ISLAM is , oh I'll spell it out for you:
Islam is a devil cult
Some muslims have very big noses, like pigs
Losers of 21st century wars and their minds
Allah is Satan
Mohammed is a child molester
(Or for M you could have Mecca is Hell)
Perhaps the passengers should have been allowed to beat that muslim coward that was removing the mirror to a bloody pulp, break his arms and legs and any other appendage that they felt like...I mean of course the marshall couldnt do that...but if the passengers rushed this moron well it was just chaos and "the marshall did what he could to stop the passengers"..and of course when questioned no one saw anything....like I said before the college football players on my flight all moved to sit near the mid east guys and let them know in no uncertain terms that they wouldnt put up with any crap from them...passengers need to be alert and ready to defend themselves...and if the cowardly muslims are rushing the cabin...passengers should be allowed to grab them on the way by and knock their head in.
Im with you Jewish Girl...and of course you would whip reza....the Jewish people have kicked muslim ass each and every time the muslims were dumb enough to start with them.
Stocked, loaded and ready to roll.
Sirs,
The next public statement of the President of the United States of America must include the next sentence:
"If a new terrorist attack on American soil is perpetrated, we will reduce Mecca to dust."
Marines score big in the last 2 days!!!
Just heard that we got 100 mulsum terrorist in Afgan. and lets not forget the mulsum terrorist 25 dead 17 wonded and 25 cap. Love the Marines!!!
Oh Yea it was not kill j it is keithjoy?
Now does any one know why Sandy Berger would stuff papers in his pants and scocks maybe he had holes in his shoes? But his pants???
Part of the American Tribe
God Bless the USA and her Fighting Forces and All who Fight with her give them Strength and Courage to stay the course to Victory Amen
PS the American people are strong!!!
Catherine,
Do you mean the 100 terrorists in Afghanistan were killed or caught? They should just shoot them all on sight if you ask me.
The vast majority of comments on this page are extremely illinformed with special reference too the "All Knowing Hugh" and only serve to promote the blaze of paranoia sweeping yoyr once sweet nation.
oh and Rikki, dont embarrass yourself further by placing comments on this page again.
What is wrong with this administration?
#1. any foreigner without a green card needs to be escorted out of the country
2. any foreigner with a green card needs to go through extensive investigations
3. any holder of a green card with discrepencies needs to be in custody and either cleared or thrown out.
4. any new immigrant needs to go through extensive background checks.
Posted by: eneri at July 22, 2004 08:11 AM
Will you side with the dems who get their money from the mulsum when they sue?? [ACLU]
Yes you libs cry when you see the real threat but fight aginst the people who try to fix the problem?
You make me LOL You have been fighting the NRA and the good people of the USA for along time and now when you get a little pick you scream??
Part of the American Tribe
God Bless the USA and her Fighting Forces and All who Fight with her give them Strength and Courage to stay the course to Victory Amen
The vast majority of comments on this page are extremely illinformed with special reference too the "All Knowing Hugh" and only serve to promote the blaze of paranoia sweeping yoyr once sweet nation.
oh and Rikki, dont embarrass yourself further by placing comments on this page again.
Posted by: Abraham MALEBushtoucher at July 22, 2004 12:23 PM
Illinformed in what way? Abe.....
Alright, Mr. Spencer... assuming this is true, why isn't anyone reporting on it besides "WomensWallStreet.com"? I mean, we can count on FOX to tell us the facts, can't we? I don't read the papers much, but I do read the headlines every day. And the only place I have read anything about the dozen-or-so "musicians" that had free reign of a plane for the entire flight while Air Marshalls presumably stood anonymously by is here and at WWS.com. It just doesn't make sense.
Even if we assume (as many of your fans do) that CNN, ABC, etc. are firmly dhimmi-tized and won't say squat, where are FOX news and MSGOP, and the like?
Posted by: kj at July 22, 2004 08:44 AM
keithjoy once again you are not keeping up on current events ?
Was reported on MSNBC and this moring on Fox & Friends??
Why was Berger stuffing his pants and why are all the millina papers missing? Why did the FBI find some of the papers in his house??
Part of the American Tribe
God Bless the USA and her Fighting Forces and All who Fight with her give them Strength and Courage to stay the course to Victory Amen
Some Facts To Correct the Ilinformed Hugh
CC:Hugh,DC WATSON
1. Islam is a world religion which has approximately 1.2 billion followers. That means that one in every five people on the planet is a Muslim. In short, Islam is not a minority phenomenon.
2. The word Islam is best translated into English as 'commitment'. Followers of Islam, called Muslims, commit their lives to peace, harmony, truthfulness, good works, charity, neighborliness, almsgiving, acceptance of religious pluralism, and diversity.
3. The religion of Islam does not support, preach, or advocate violence, discrimination, or terrorism in any way, shape, or form.
4. Extremist groups who claim to follow Islam are no more representative of Islam than David Koresh is of Christianity.
5. The religion rests on five pillars. These are:
a. Declaration: Since Islam is a monotheistic religion, i.e. Muslims believe in only one God, each Muslim declares that there is no god but Allah and that Muhammad is his final prophet. Islam recognizes the prophethood of Jesus, Moses, Abraham, Noah, etc.
b. Prayer: Muslims perform ritual prayer five times per day.
c. Fasting: During the ninth month of the lunar Islamic calendar, Ramadan, Muslims who are old enough and healthy enough fast for 29 or 30 days from sun-up to sun-down.
d. Giving to the Poor: It is incumbent upon every Muslim to donate a certain portion of his or her earnings to the less fortunate.
e. Pilgrimage: Each Muslim should make a pilgrimage to Mecca once in his or her lifetime if he or she has the means to do so.
6. Contrary to popular belief in the West, jihad is not one of the five pillars of Islam.
7. In the West, the concept of jihad has been improperly translated as 'holy war.' Instead, jihad means 'struggle' and refers, in particular, to the personal struggle that every Muslim engages in to live a peaceful and good life.
8. One of the basic precepts of Islam is the equality of all people regardless of race, ability, or gender.
9. Muslims believe that there is no compulsion in religion and that individuals are free to choose their own religion and beliefs.
10. The Qu'ran (a.k.a. Koran) accepts religious pluralism as a fact of life and sees strength in diversity.
11. Centuries before the women's movement in the West, Islam granted women the right to own property, to be educated, the right to inherit. In the West, in many instances, women did not receive these rights until centuries later.
Watson i hope this justifies my allegations against Hugh.
Re: Reza the Resident Jihadist
After spending much time reading the commentary on this site and Dhimmi Watch, I have ascertained that “Reza” is the lone Islamo-fascist taking part in this particular type of discourse.
The following are possible reasons for the absence of other Muslim commentary:
High rate of illiteracy in the Muslim community. Muzzie can’t read, ergo, he can’t type.
Female Muzzies not allowed near computer.
Computers require electrical current.
Even if there was an electrical current, learning to turn on a computer would require a higher level of intelligence than exists.
Other time consuming activities such as:
Praying to Allah, the “Moon Rock” god, five times a day.
Too busy complying with the Islamic requirement of shaving the rear hind quarters, which incidentally is a featured event at the Gay Olympics.
Practicing Jihad: Playing with explosives, decapitating infidels, raping women and children, male/female, (the false prophet Mohammed was an avowed pedophile and child molester), etc…
Fantasizing about the “alleged” 72 virgins waiting for them in paradise, when in reality they wind up in Hell where 72 naked and stinky Michael Moore look-alikes are eagerly waiting to penetrate their anal cavity with a rusty bike fork.
One other point: what happened to the man who was found trying to rip out the mirror in the bathroom so as to get to the cockpit? Arrested? Deported so that he could try again? What? What happened to the man who was videotaping and told to stop -- was the videocamera impounded, and the tape viewed? What about that "lost" report made by a stewardess about the passenger using a telephoto lens to make sequential pictures of the cockpit door? In other words -- what happened in all of these cases?
Posted by: Hugh at July 22, 2004 10:44 AM
Maybe it like other important stuff was in Sandy Bergers pants??
Yes the police do not give up all they know!!
Yes people stay strong remember a gun in hand is better than 2 cops on the phone and remember we are all part of the Fighting Forces!!
Part of the American Tribe
God bless the USA and her Fighting Forces and All who Fight with her give them Srength and Courage to stay the course to Victory Amen
DC,
Abe the "MALEbushtoucher" is possibly suffering from the affliction of homosexuality, and is clearly plagued by the "disease" of left wing liberalisim.
I live in the southwestern U.S. and we are
being invaded every single day. I know you
probably have some grasp of the problem
but just this past week two 18 wheelers full
of illegals were stopped in our area. How many more get through? And what happens to the "coyotes"? They get released on their on recognizance. (You just know he'll be back for the court date) And you can't tell some of these people from middle eastern types until they speak. The Mexican border should be closed NOW.
Posted by: Carolyn2 at July 22, 2004 11:42 AM
Yes and some were from malisa and brizil?
Hope you are armed and can shoot streight?
Part of the American Tribe
God Bless the USA and her Fighting Forces and All who Fight with her give them strength and Courage to stay the course to Victory Amen
PS raza you sound more like some one from Iran have you heard of the Samson plan?
I'm not sure why this is a negative story. Isn't the government asking all citizens to remain vigilent and report anything suspicious?In the pre 9/11 days the odd behavior of these "middle eastern men" would have gone unnoticed and they would have been able to go ahead with their probes. In the post 9/11 world Arabs and Muslims are watched and reported. When I travel I immediately note if there are Arabs or Pakistanis boarding my flight and I watch them. I'm sure I'm not the only one.Since Muslims are also known for cowardly attacks on civilians I also observe Arabs and Muslims when I'm out shopping. The reality is that Arabs and Muslims can no longer lower their profile in the US.Prior to 9/11 all they had to do was shave their beards and put on western clothing to blend in, now that does not work anymore. Perhaps that's why Al Qaeda is trying to recruit non-Arabs and US citizens for attacks in the US.
1. Islam is a world religion which has approximately 1.2 billion followers. That means that one in every five people on the planet is a Muslim. In short, Islam is not a minority phenomenon.
This must be the new math, where one in five makes you a majority. Using that same logic, are the majority of people on Earth Chinese?
2. The word Islam is best translated into English as 'commitment'. Followers of Islam, called Muslims, commit their lives to peace, harmony, truthfulness, good works, charity, neighborliness, almsgiving, acceptance of religious pluralism, and diversity.
Of course you are right, just EVERY OTHER RESOURCE is wrong.
3. The religion of Islam does not support, preach, or advocate violence, discrimination, or terrorism in any way, shape, or form.
4. Extremist groups who claim to follow Islam are no more representative of Islam than David Koresh is of Christianity. .
The Davidians are all dead cultists, thanks to the US government. Maybe you should take that as a lesson…
5. The religion rests on five pillars. These are: .
a. Declaration: Since Islam is a monotheistic religion, i.e. Muslims believe in only one God, each Muslim declares that there is no god but Allah and that Muhammad is his final prophet. Islam recognizes the prophethood of Jesus, Moses, Abraham, Noah, etc.
You probably think Tinky-Winky is a prophet. What of it?
b. Prayer: Muslims perform ritual prayer five times per day.
An important part of brainwashing is repetition.
c. Fasting: During the ninth month of the lunar Islamic calendar, Ramadan, Muslims who are old enough and healthy enough fast for 29 or 30 days from sun-up to sun-down.
Which is good, as non-productive Muslim nations cannot feed themselves for a full calendar year.
d. Giving to the Poor: It is incumbent upon every Muslim to donate a certain portion of his or her earnings to the less fortunate.
And how many RPGs do you donate each year, Abu?
e. Pilgrimage: Each Muslim should make a pilgrimage to Mecca once in his or her lifetime if he or she has the means to do so.
Of course, if you could arrange to do it all at once, it would sure make targeting easier…
6. Contrary to popular belief in the West, jihad is not one of the five pillars of Islam. .
You sure have a funny way of showing it.
7. In the West, the concept of jihad has been improperly translated as 'holy war.' Instead, jihad means 'struggle' and refers, in particular, to the personal struggle that every Muslim engages in to live a peaceful and good life.
Really? I thought “Jihad” translated to “Let’s get our asses kicked by the Jews!”
Or something similar...
8. One of the basic precepts of Islam is the equality of all people regardless of race, ability, or gender.
I’m sure the Black Muslims being murdered by Arab Muslims in Sudan are VERY comforted by that knowledge.
9. Muslims believe that there is no compulsion in religion and that individuals are free to choose their own religion and beliefs.
As long as that religion is Islam, Infidel!
10. The Qu'ran (a.k.a. Koran) accepts religious pluralism as a fact of life and sees strength in diversity.
As in, “diverse” ways to plant IEDs, “diverse” ways to abuse our women, etc.
11. Centuries before the women's movement in the West, Islam granted women the right to own property, to be educated, the right to inherit. In the West, in many instances, women did not receive these rights until centuries later. .
And they were so proud of those centuries, they just keep trying to go back there…
Watson i hope this justifies my allegations against Hugh. .
No. But it sure enlightened the rest of us about you and your motivations.
Catherine,
Do you mean the 100 terrorists in Afghanistan were killed or caught? They should just shoot them all on sight if you ask me.
Posted by: Rikki at July 22, 2004 12:21 PM
Dead!!!!
Part of the American Tribe
God Bless the USA and her Fighting Forces and All who Fight with her give them Strength and Courage to stay the course to Victory Amen
Rebuttal to Mr. Bushtoucher's Islamotrash update:
1. 1. Islam is a world religion which has approximately 1.2 billion followers
Over estimated by 3 to 4 hundred million.
2. The word Islam is best translated into English as 'commitment'. Followers of Islam, called Muslims, commit their lives to peace, harmony, truthfulness, good works, charity, neighborliness, almsgiving, acceptance of religious pluralism, and diversity.
Bullshit! Give a few examples of Muslims helping anyone else but Muslims.
3. The religion of Islam does not support, preach, or advocate violence, discrimination, or terrorism in any way, shape, or form.
Read the Koran-quickest example- 4:34 admonish them, leave them alone in their beds, and beat them-Islamic wife beating 101
4. Extremist groups who claim to follow Islam are no more representative of Islam than David Koresh is of Christianity.
More bullshit, the Koran/Qur'an tells them in many different verses to commit these acts.
5. The five pipecleaners of Islam are well documented, and........who cares?
6. Contrary to popular belief in the West, jihad is not one of the five pillars of Islam.
Not sure why this was brought up, because it's minimally relevent. Jihad exists, the format in which it rears its ugly fachia is not important.
7. In the West, the concept of jihad has been improperly translated as 'holy war.' Instead, jihad means 'struggle' and refers, in particular, to the personal struggle that every Muslim engages in to live a peaceful and good life.
The term "Jihad" has been used by one-eyed, hook handed, peg legged, gap toothed Imams when they preach hate for the West in their demonic sermons inside the urine ridden mosques.
8. One of the basic precepts of Islam is the equality of all people regardless of race, ability, or gender.
ahh, I just stopped laughing at this one. Is this why Iran has declared that it is their agenda to eradicate all Anglo-Saxons from this planet? Islam is the elite of the elite when it comes to bigotry, and this is proven nearly by the hour.
9. Muslims believe that there is no compulsion in religion and that individuals are free to choose their own religion and beliefs.
As long as it's ISLAM.
10. The Qu'ran (a.k.a. Koran) accepts religious pluralism as a fact of life and sees strength in diversity.
This statement is certainly not on par with the command for Muslims to not take Jews and Christians as friends.
11. Centuries before the women's movement in the West, Islam granted women the right to own property, to be educated, the right to inherit. In the West, in many instances, women did not receive these rights until centuries later.
Then Islam should hire some better educators, because the worldwide illiteracy rate for Muslim women is 97%. With regard to Islam granting women the right to own peoperty, and the right to inherit, I must say, that's mighty American of them.....
These obvious 'trial runs' prove a couple things:
1) Jihadists can take down an American airliner anytime.
2) For some reason, they have not done it yet.
It seems to me both these claims are true to an extremely high level of certain, at least 90%.
So, why hasn't the Jihad on American airlines resumed?
Organization, planning, a 'bigger attack' than 9/11 is in the works. They want something 'glorious', a 'death blow' to the infidels and the enemies of Allah, inflicted using some of the deceptive strategies outlined by the prophet himself.
The Jihad is organized, exploring means and methods that are new. New people. People they know will get by. And they must have a strong base of support in the US or they would not bother with plannning. They would simply take down a plane, something they can do at will.
The headline on the BBC this morning was all about the 'BLAME' for 9/11 going to US security lapses. The subtext of this kind of talk, especially in Europe, is devastating: just a couple of 'extremists' from a religion of peaceful people perpetrated 9/11. If US security did their jobs we would not even be in this mess. No 9/11. No Iraq. The war-monger Bush is to blame for the growth of these 'little groups' and all our problems."
THAT is the thinking that will lead (and probably already has) to the next catastrophe. And the irony of ironies: this thinking has enormous force in Europe and Europe will be the worst battlefield of all, before all is said and done.
For America this thinking, or should I call it slumber, will mean more horror. But take heart, strategically, economically, democraphically, and culturally, we are more prepared for the new levels of the Jihad to come. America has one eye open. Europe is sleep walking to its death like a lamb to slaughter.
4. Extremist groups who claim to follow Islam are no more representative of Islam than David Koresh is of Christianity.
Watson i hope this justifies my allegations against Hugh.
Posted by: Abraham Bushtoucher at July 22, 2004 12:56 PM
Well Abe we love ilinformed people like you because we get to do stuff like this?
And by the way how many Christians are going around the world and cutting peoples heads off in the name of Christ??
The truth about what Mulsums believe??
Read and learn about the peace they bring to your door??
Tabari VII:148 “Amr said, ‘Let’s wait here until the cry has died down. They are sure to hunt for us tonight and tomorrow. I was still in the cave when Uthman bin Malik came riding proudly on his horse. He reached the entrance to our cave and I said to my Ansar companion, ‘If he sees us, he will tell everyone in Mecca.’ So I went out and stabbed him with my dagger. He gave a shout and the Meccans came to him while I went back to my hiding place. Finding him at the point of death, they said, ‘By Allah we knew that Amr came for no good purpose.’ The death of their companion impeded their search for us, for they carried him away.”
Tabari VII:149 “I went into a cave with my bow and arrows. While I was in it, a one-eyed man from the Banu Bakr came in driving some sheep. He said, ‘Who’s there?’ I said [lied], ‘I’m a Banu Bakr.’ ‘So am I.’ Then he laid down next to me, and raised his voice in song: ‘I will not believe in the faith of the Muslims.’ I said, ‘You will soon see!’ Before long the Bedouin went to sleep and started snoring. So I killed him in the most dreadful way that anybody has ever killed. I leant over him, struck the end of my bow into his good eye, and thrust it down until it came out the back of his neck. After that I rushed out like a wild beast and took flight. I came to the village of Naqi and recognized two Meccan spies. I called for them to surrender. They said no so I shot and arrow and killed one, and then I tied the other up and took him to Muhammad.” Tabari VII:150 “I had tied my prisoner’s thumbs together with my bowstring. The Messenger of Allah looked at him and laughed so that his back teeth could be seen. Then he questioned me and I told him what had happened. ‘Well done!’ he said, and prayed for me to be blessed.”
Ishaq:434 “Amr and an Ansari waited until they were asleep. Then Amr killed them, thinking that he had taken vengeance for the Muslims who had been slain. When he came to the Messenger, he told him what had happened. The Prophet said, ‘You have killed men for whom I shall have to pay blood-money.’”
Tabari VIII:22 “Hassan was with the women and children. A Jew passed by and began to walk around his settlement. There was no one to protect them while the Apostle and his Companions were at the Meccans’ throats. So I said: ‘Hassan, this Jew is walking around. I fear he will point out our weakness while the Muslims are too busy to attend to us. So go down to him and kill him.”
Tabari VIII:22/Ishaq:458 “‘Allah forgive you, daughter of Abd al-Muttalib,’ Hassan said. ‘You know that I am not the man to do it.’ When he said that to me I saw that nothing could be expected from him. I girded myself, took a club, and, having gone down from the fortress to the man, I struck him with the club until I killed him. When I had finished with him, I returned to the fortress and said, ‘Hassan, go down to him and strip him—only his being a man kept me from taking his clothes.’ Hassan replied, ‘I have no need for his spoils.’”
Ishaq:464 “The Jews were made to come down, and Allah’s Messenger imprisoned them. Then the Prophet went out into the marketplace of Medina, and he had trenches dug in it. He sent for the Jewish men and had them beheaded in those trenches. They were brought out to him in batches. They numbered 800 to 900 boys and men.” Tabari VIII:40 “The Messenger commanded that furrows should be dug in the ground for the Qurayza. Then he sat down. Ali and Zubayr began cutting off their heads in his presence.”
Tabari VIII:38 “The Messenger of Allah commanded that all of the Jewish men and boys who had reached puberty should be beheaded. Then the Prophet divided the wealth, wives, and children of the Banu Qurayza Jews among the Muslims.”
Tabari VIII:90 “Abu Basir went out with his companions. When they stopped to rest he asked one of them, ‘Is this sword of yours sharp?’ ‘Yes,’ he replied. ‘May I look at it?’ Basir asked. ‘If you wish.’ Basir unsheathed the sword, attacked the man, and killed him. The other Muslim ran back to the Messenger, saying, ‘Your Companion has killed my friend.’ While the man was still there, Abu Basir appeared girded with the sword. He halted before Muhammad and said, ‘Messenger, your obligation has been discharged.’” [top] [toc] [quotes main]
TORTURE:
Qur’an 5:33 “The punishment for those who wage war against Allah and His Prophet and make mischief in the land, is to murder them, crucify them, or cut off a hand and foot on opposite sides...their doom is dreadful. They will not escape the fire, suffering constantly.”
Tabari VIII:122/Ishaq:515 “The Prophet gave orders concerning Kinanah to Zubayr, saying, ‘Torture him until you root out and extract what he has. So Zubayr kindled a fire on Kinanah’s chest, twirling it with his firestick until Kinanah was near death. Then the Messenger gave him to Maslamah, who beheaded him.”
Bukhari:V4B54N487 “The Prophet said, ‘The Hell Fire is 69 times hotter than ordinary worldly fires.’ So someone said, ‘Allah’s Apostle, wouldn’t this ordinary fire have been sufficient to torture the unbelievers?’”
Bukhari:V4B52N260 “Ali burnt some [former Muslims alive] and this news reached Ibn Abbas, who said, ‘Had I been in his place I would not have burnt them, as the Prophet said, “Don’t punish with Allah’s Punishment.” No doubt, I would have killed them, for the Prophet said, “If a Muslim discards his Islamic religion, kill him.”’”
Qur’an 48:27 “If the Muslims had not been there, We would have punished the unbelievers with a grievous torture.”
Qur’an 9:5 “When the sacred forbidden months for fighting are past, fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, torture them, and lie in wait and ambush them using every stratagem of war.”
Ishaq:550 “The Muslims met them with their swords. They cut through many arms and skulls. Only confused cries and groans could be heard over our battle roars and snarling.”
Qur’an 5:37 “The [Christian] disbelievers will long to get out of the Fire, but never will they get out there from; and theirs will be an enduring torture.”
Tabari IX:6 “The chief sheep tender sent out spies to obtain intelligence. But they came back with their joints dislocated. When he asked what had happened, they said, ‘We saw white men on black horses. Before we could resist, we were struck as you see us now.”
Ishaq:595 “The Apostle said, ‘Get him away from me and cut off his tongue.””
Ishaq:312 “Umar said to the Apostle, ‘Let me pull out Suhayl’s two front teeth. That way his tongue will stick out and he will never be able to speak against you again.’”
Ishaq:316 “Following Badr, Muhammad sent a number of raiders with orders to capture some of the Meccans and burn them alive.”
Qur’an 8:12 “Your Lord inspired the angels with the message: ‘I will terrorize the unbelievers. Therefore smite them on their necks and every joint and incapacitate them. Strike off their heads and cut off each of their fingers and toes.”
Tabari VII:133/Ishaq:387 “When Muhammad saw Hamzah he said, ‘If Allah gives me victory over the Quraysh at any time, I shall mutilate thirty of their men!’ When the Muslims saw the rage of the Prophet they said, ‘By Allah, if we are victorious over them, we shall mutilate them in a way which no Arab has ever mutilated anybody.”
Tabari VIII:96 “A raiding party led by Zayd set out against Umm in Ramadan. During it, Umm suffered a cruel death. Zyad tied her legs with rope and then tied her between two camels until they split her in two. She was a very old woman. Then they brought Umm’s daughter and Abdallah to the Messenger. Umm’s daughter belonged to Salamah who had captured her. Muhammad asked Salamah for her, and Salamah gave her to him.” [top] [toc] [quotes main]
THIEVERY & SLAVERY:
Qur’an 8:1 “They ask you about the benefits of capturing the spoils of war. Tell them: ‘The benefits belong to Allah and to His Messenger.’”
Ishaq:510 “We ask Thee for the booty of this town and its people. Forward in the name of Allah.’ He used to say this of every town he raided.”
Ishaq:327 “Allah said, ‘A prophet must slaughter before collecting captives. A slaughtered enemy is driven from the land. Muhammad, you craved the desires of this world, its goods and the ransom captives would bring. But Allah desires killing them to manifest the religion.’”
Tabari VII:64/Ishaq:307 “The Messenger of Allah gave orders concerning the contents of the camp which the people had collected, and it was all brought together. Among the Muslims, however, there was a difference of opinion concerning it. Those who had collected it said, ‘It is ours. Muhammad promised every man that he could keep the booty he took.’ Those who were fighting said, ‘If it had not been for us, you would not have taken it. We distracted the enemy from you so that you could take what you took.’ Those who were guarding the Prophet for fear the enemy would attack him said, ‘By Allah, you have no better right to it than we have. We wanted to kill the enemy when Allah gave us the opportunity and made them turn their backs, and we wanted to take property when there was no one to protect it; but we were afraid that the Meccans might attack the Prophet. We protected him so you have no better right to it than we have.’ When we quarreled about the booty we became very bad tempered. So Allah removed it from us and handed it over to His Messenger.”
Bukhari:V5B59N360 “The total number of Muslim fighters from Mecca who fought at Badr and were given a share of the booty, were 81. When their shares were distributed, their number was 101. But Allah knows it better.”
Ishaq:307 “The ‘Spoils of War’ Surah came down from Allah to His Prophet concerning the distribution of the booty when the Muslims showed their evil nature. Allah took it out of their hands and gave it to the Apostle.”
Tabari VII:65 “Allah’s Messenger came back to Medina, bringing with him the booty which had been taken from the polytheists.... There were forty-four captives in the Messenger of Allah’s possession. There was a similar number of dead.”
Bukhari:V5B59N512 “The captives of Khaybar were divided among the Muslims. Then the Messenger began taking the homes and property that were closest to him.”
Tabari VIII:116/Ishaq:511 “So Muhammad began seizing their herds and their property bit by bit. He conquered home by home. The Messenger took some of its people captive, including Safiyah and her two cousins. The Prophet chose Safiyah for himself.”
Ishaq:511 “When Dihyah protested, wanting to keep Safiyah for himself, the Apostle traded for Safiyah by giving Dihyah her two cousins. The women of Khaybar were distributed among the Muslims.”
Tabari VIII:130 “The Prophet conquered Khaybar by force after fighting. Khaybar was something that Allah gave as booty to His Messenger. He took one-fifth of it and divided the remainder among the Muslims.”
Bukhari V4B52N46 “I heard Allah’s Apostle saying, ‘Allah guarantees that He will admit the Muslim fighter into Paradise if he is killed, otherwise He will return him to his home safely with rewards and booty.’”
Tabari VIII:117 “The Banu Sahm of Aslam [newly recruited Muslim militants] came to the Messenger and complained, ‘Muhammad, we have been hurt by drought and possess nothing.’ Although they had fought for the Prophet they found he had nothing [he was willing] to give them. The Apostle said, ‘O Allah, You know their condition—I have no strength and nothing [I want] to give them [from the booty I have stolen]. So conquer for them the wealthiest of the Khaybar homes, the ones with the most food and fat meat.’”
Ishaq:515 “Allah’s Apostle besieged the final [Jewish] community of Khaybar until they could hold out no longer. Finally, when they were certain that they would perish, they asked Muhammad to banish them and spare their lives, which he did. The Prophet took possession of all their property.”
Tabari VIII:128 “Khaybar was divided among the people who had been at Hudaybiyah.”
Ishaq:521 “Khaybar was apportioned among the men of Hudaybiyah without regard to whether they were present at Khaybar or not. The spoil was divided into 1,800 shares.”
Ishaq:521 “When the spoil of Khaybar was apportioned, the settlements of Shaqq and Nata were given to the Muslims while Katiba was divided into five sections: Allah’s fifth [which Muhammad was custodian]; the Prophet’s fifth; the share to the kindred [Muhammad’s kin]; maintenance of the Prophet’s wives [now there’s an honest report]; and payment to the men who acted as intermediaries in the peace negotiation with Fadak [which enabled the prophet to steal the entire spoil].”
Ishaq:522 “Then the Apostle distributed the booty between his relatives, his wives, and to other men and women. He gave his daughter Fatima 200 shares, Ali 100, Usama 250, Aisha 200, Bakr 100…. In the name of Allah—this is a memorandum of what Muhammad the Apostle gave his wives from the dates and wheat: 180 loads.”
Bukhari:V5B59N537 “Allah’s Apostle divided the war booty with the ratio of two shares for the horse and one-share for the foot soldier.”
Bukhari:V5B59N541 “When we conquered, we gained neither gold nor silver as booty, but we gained cows, camels, goods and gardens.”
Tabari VIII:12 “When cities were conquered Muslims used to say, ‘Conquer for yourselves whatever seems good to you because all treasures were given to Muhammad.’”
Qur’an 48:19 “He rewarded them with abundant spoils that they will capture. Allah has promised you much booty that you shall take, and He has made this easy for you.”
Qur’an 9:103 “Take alms out of their property in order to cleanse and purify them, and invoke Allah for them; surely this is a relief for them.”
Tabari IX:3 “Since the Hawazin and Thaqif had marched with their women, children, and flocks, Allah granted them as booty to His Messenger, who divided the spoils among those Quraysh who had recently embraced Islam.”
Tabari IX:13 “Abu Talhah alone took the spoils of twenty men whom he had killed.”
Ishaq:571 “I went up to a man and struck off his hand. He fell and I killed him while he was down. But I was too occupied with fighting to pay any more attention to him. So one of the Meccan Muslims passed by and stripped him. Then when the fighting was over and we had finished with the enemy, the Apostle said that anyone who had killed a foe could have his spoil. I told the Apostle that I had killed a man who was worth stripping but had been too busy killing others at the time to notice who had spoiled him. Abu Bakr said, “To Allah’s lions who fight for His religion go the spoils that come from their prey. Return the booty to the man who killed him.’ The Apostle confirmed Abu Bakr’s words. So I was given the property of the man whom I had killed. I sold it and bought a small palm grove with the money. It was the first property I ever owned.”
Ishaq:592 “The Apostle held a large number of captives. There were 6,000 women and children prisoners. He had captured so many sheep and camels they could not be counted.”
Tabari IX:31/Ishaq:594 “‘Muhammad, divide the spoil and booty of camels and cattle among us.’ They forced the Prophet up against a tree, and his robe was torn from him. Muhammad cried, ‘Give me back my robe. If there had been more sheep I would have given you some. You have not found me to be niggardly, cowardly or false.”
Tabari IX:31/Ishaq:594 “‘You have not found me miserly, cowardly, or a liar.’ Then he walked over to his camel and took a hair from its hump. Holding it aloft in his fingers he said, ‘Men, I do not have anything of your booty, not even as much as this hair. Just filth. And that filth is what is being given to you. So, bring back my cloak.’”
Ishaq:594 “The Apostle gave gifts to those whose hearts were to be won over, notably the chiefs of the army, to win them and through them the people.”
Bukhari:V4B53N373 “Allah’s Apostle got property and war prisoners and gave them to some people to the exclusion of others. The latter seemed to be displeased by that. The Prophet said, ‘I give to some people, lest they should deviate from Islam or lose patience.’”
Bukhari:V4B53N374 “The Prophet said, ‘I give to the Quraysh so that they will desire Islam, for they are nearer to their life of Ignorance and it is not strong in their hearts.’”
Tabari IX:36/Ishaq:596 “‘Prophet, this group of Ansar have a grudge against you for what you did with the booty and how you divided it among you own people.’ ‘Ansar, what is this talk I hear from you? What is the grudge you harbor against me? Do you think ill of me? Did I not come to you when you were erring and needy, and then made rich by Allah?”
Tabari IX:37/Ishaq:596 “Do you hold a grudge against me and are you mentally disturbed because of the worldly things by which I conciliate a people and win them over so that they will embrace Islam and become Muslims?”
Tabari IX:38 “In this year, the Messenger sent Amr to collect the zakat tax from Jayfar and Amr, the clans of Julanda and Azd.... He collected the jizyah from the Zoroastrians.”
Tabari IX:74 “Indeed, Allah has guided you with His guidance. If you wish to do well [capture booty], obey Allah and His Messenger. You must perform the prayers, pay the zakat tax, and give a fifth share of Allah’s booty to His Messenger. The required zakat is: from the land one tenth of that watered by springs and rain, and one twentieth of that watered by the leathern bucket. From camels, a milch camel for every forty camels, and a young male camel for every thirty camels. From sheep, one for every five camels; and from cows, one from every fourth… If anyone pays more, it is to his credit. He who professes this, bears witness to his Islam and helps the faithful [fight] against the polytheists, he has the protection of Allah and His Messenger.”
Tabari IX:75 “He who holds fast to his religion, Judaism or Christianity, is not to be tempted from it. It is incumbent on them to pay the jizyah protection tax. For every adult, male or female, free or slave, one full denarius, or its value in al-ma’afir [fine cloth]. He who pays that to the Messenger has the protection of Allah and His Messenger, and he who holds back from it is the enemy of Allah and His Messenger.”
Tabari IX:76 “The Messenger has sent Zur’ah and his Companions to you. ‘I commend them to your care. Collect the zakat and jizyah from your districts and hand the money over to my messengers.’ The Prophet is the master of your rich and your poor.”
Ishaq:564 “The Muslims stole our goods and divided them. Their spears pierced us not once but twice. Their squadrons came at us like a swarm of locusts. Were it not for the religion of Muhammad’s people, their cavalry would never have attacked us.”
Bukhari:V9B84N59 “When the Prophet died, Arabs reverted to disbelief. Umar said, ‘Should we fight these people?’ Bakr said, ‘By Allah! I will fight whoever differentiates between prayers and Zakat, as Zakat is to be taken from property according to Allah’s Orders. If they refuse to pay me even so little as a kid they used to pay, I will fight with them for withholding it.’”
Qur’an 59:6 “What Allah gave as booty to His Messenger He has taken away from them [the Jews]. For this you made no raid. Allah gives His Messenger Lordship over whomsoever He wills. Whatever booty Allah has given to His Messenger and taken away from the [Jewish] people of the townships, belongs to Allah and to His Messenger.... So take what the Messenger assigns to you, and deny yourselves that which he withholds from you.”
Tabari VII:26 “In this year Muhammad ordered people to pay the zakat tax. It is said that the Prophet commanded them to do this.”
Ishaq:309 “‘Bind Abu Aziz tight for his mother is rich and she may ransom him for a great deal of money.’”
Tabari VII:71 “Among the captives was Abu Wada. Muhammad said, ‘He has a son who is a shrewd merchant with much money.” [The son] “slipped away at night, went to Medina, ransomed his father for 4,000 dirhams.”
Ishaq:312 “The Prophet said, ‘Abbas, you must ransom yourself, your two nephews, Aqil and Nawfal, and your confederate, Utbah, for you are a wealthy man.’ ‘Muhammad,’ Abbas said, ‘I was a Muslim, but the people compelled me to fight against my will.’ Allah knows best concerning your Islam,’ Muhammad said. ‘As for your outward appearance, you have been against us, so pay to ransom yourself.’ The Messenger had previously taken twenty ounces of gold from him following the battle. So Abbas said, ‘Credit me with this amount towards my ransom.’ ‘No,’ Muhammad replied. ‘That money Allah has already taken from you and given to us.’”
Ishaq:313 “The Muslims told Abu Sufyan to pay them a ransom to free his son, Amr. He replied, ‘Am I to suffer the double loss of my blood and my money? After you have killed my son Hanzala, you want me to pay you a ransom to save Amr?’”
Bukhari:V5B59N357 “The Badr warriors were given five thousand dirhams each, yearly. Umar [the future Caliph] said, ‘I will always give them more than what I will give to others.’”
Tabari VII:80 “When the events of Badr were over, Allah revealed the 8th surah, ‘The Spoils of War,’ in its entirety. The two armies met [there were no armies—just merchants and militants] and Allah defeated the Meccans [with Muslim swords]. Seventy of them were killed, and seventy were taken captive. Abu Bakr said, ‘O Prophet of Allah, these are your people, your family; they are your cousins, fellow clansmen, and nephews. I think that you should accept ransoms for them so that what we take from them will strengthen us.’” Tabari VII:81 “‘What do you think Khattab?’ Muhammad asked. ‘I say you should hand them over to me so that I can cut off their heads. Thus Allah will know that there is no leniency in our hearts toward the unbelievers.’ The Messenger liked what Bakr said and did not like what I said, and accepted ransoms for the captives.”
Ishaq:316 “On the Badr expedition, the Messenger took the sword of Dhu al-Faqar as booty. It had belonged to Munabbih. On that day he also took Abu Jahl’s camel as booty. It was a Mahri dromedary on which he used to go on raids. It is said that he wrote ‘Ma’aqil’ [Blood-Money] on his sword.”
Qur’an 8:1 “They question you about (windfalls taken as) spoils of war. Say: ‘Booty is at the disposal of Allah and the Messenger; they belong to Us and are for Our benefit. So fear Allah, and adjust your way of thinking in this matter. Obey Allah and His Messenger.’”
Ishaq:321 “The Spoils of War surah was handed down because we quarreled about the booty. So Allah took it away from us and gave it to His Apostle. When He did, we learned to fear Allah and obey his Messenger.... For in truth, our army had gone out with the Prophet seeking the caravan because we wanted its booty.”
Ishaq:324 “Allah taught them how to divide the spoil. He made it lawful and said, ‘A fifth of the booty belongs to the Apostle.’
Qur’an 8:40 “If people are obstinate, and refuse to surrender, know that Allah is your Supporter. And know that one fifth of all the booty you take belongs to Allah, and to the Messenger, and for the near relatives (of the Messenger).”
Qur’an 8:68 “Had it not been for a previous agreement from Allah, a severe penalty would have reached you for the (ransom) that you took as booty.”
Qur’an 8:69 “So enjoy what you took as booty; the spoils are lawful and good.”
Ishaq:327 “Allah made booty lawful and good. He used it to incite the Muslims to unity of purpose. So enjoy what you have captured.”
Bukhari:V4B52N276 “By Allah, we saw the Meccan women running, revealing their leg-bangles. So, we cried out, ‘The booty! O Muslims, the booty! Our Companions have become victorious. What are we waiting for? By Allah! We will go to the pagans and collect our share of the war booty.’”
Tabari VIII:38 “The Messenger divided the wealth, wives, and children of the Banu Qurayza Jews among the Muslims.” Ishaq:465 “When their wrists were bound with cords, the Apostle was a sea of generosity to us. Allah’s Messenger took his fifth of the booty. He made known on that day the extra shares for horses and their riders —giving the horse two shares and the rider one. A Muslim without a horse got one share of the spoil. It was the first booty in which lots were cast.”
Tabari VIII:39 “Then the Messenger of Allah sent Sa’d bin Zayd with some of the Qurayza captives to Najd, and in exchange for them he purchased horses and arms.”
Ishaq:503 “Allah saw what was in their hearts [what they coveted] so he rewarded them with victory and with as much spoil as they could take. Allah promised that they would soon capture a great deal of booty.”
Ishaq:508/Tabari VIII:91 “Abu Jandal, Suhayl’s son, escaped and joined Abu Basir. Nearly seventy Muslim men gathered around them and they harassed the Quraysh. Whenever they heard of a Meccan caravan setting out for Syria, they intercepted it, and killed everyone they could get a hold of. They tore every caravan to pieces and took the goods.”
Tabari VIII:93 “According to Waqidi, in this month, the Messenger sent out Ukkashah with forty men to raid Ghamr. He traveled quickly, but the enemy became aware and fled. He sent out scouts and they captured a spy who guided them to some of their cattle. They took two hundred head back to Medina.”
Tabari IX:28 “The Muslims were concerned. They did not want to give up their share. So Muhammad said, ‘He who holds a share of these captives shall get six camels for every slave from the next booty we take.’ So the Muslims returned the women and children captives.”
Qur’an 4:94 “Believers, when you go abroad to fight wars in Allah’s Cause, investigate carefully, and say not to anyone who greets you: ‘You are not a believer!’ Coveting the chance profits of this life (so that you may despoil him). With Allah are plenteous spoils and booty.” [top] [toc] [quotes main]
PEACE, ISLAM STYLE:
Bukhari:V9B84N59 “Allah’s Apostle said, ‘I have been ordered to fight the people till they say: “None has the right to be worshipped but Allah.” Whoever says this will save his property and his life from me.’”
Qur’an 8:58 “If you apprehend treachery from any group on the part of a people (with whom you have a treaty), retaliate by breaking off (relations) with them. The infidels should not think they can bypass (Islamic law or the punishment of Allah). Surely they cannot escape.”
Tabari VII:86 “Gabriel brought down the following verse to the Messenger: ‘If you apprehend treachery from any people (with whom you have a treaty), retaliate by breaking off (relations).’ When Gabriel had finished delivering this verse, the Prophet said, ‘I fear the Banu Qaynuqa.’ It was on the basis of this verse that Muhammad advanced upon them.”
Tabari VII:158 “Judayy went to Abd Allah Ibn Ubayy to ask for support. He said, ‘I found him sitting among a number of his companions while the Prophet’s crier was calling men to arms. He said, ‘This is a clever trick of Muhammad’s.’ The Messenger of Allah besieged the Nadir Jews for fifteen days. In the end they made peace with him on the condition that the Prophet would not kill them and that their property and their coats of mail would be his.”
Tabari VII:159 “The Messenger of Allah besieged the Nadir for fifteen days until he had reduced them to a state of utter exhaustion, so that they would give him what he wanted. The terms in which the Prophet made peace with the Jews were: he would not shed their blood, he would expel them from their lands and settlements, providing for every three of them a camel and a water-skin.”
Tabari VII:159 “The Prophet fought them until he made peace with them on condition that they evacuated Yathrib. He expelled them to Syria but allowed them to keep what their camels could carry, except for their coats of mail and weapons.”
Qur’an 47:33 “Believers, obey Allah, and obey the Messenger. Do not falter; become faint-hearted, or weak-kneed, crying for peace.”
Qur’an 9:3 “Allah is not bound by any contract or treaty with non-Muslims, nor is His Apostle.”
Qur’an 97:5 “There is peace until the dawning of the day!”
Ishaq:515 “When the people of Fadak heard what had happened, they sent word to the Messenger, asking him to banish them and spare their lives, saying they too would leave him their property. When the people of Khaybar surrendered on these conditions, the survivors asked Muhammad to employ them on their farms for a half share of whatever they produced. They said, ‘We know more about farming [seeing that you are terrorists and all].’ So Muhammad made peace with them for a half share, provided that: ‘If we want to expel you, we may.’ He made a similar arrangement with Fadak. So Khaybar became the prey of the Muslims, while Fadak belonged exclusively to the Messenger of Allah, becoming his personal property, because the Muslims had not attacked its people with cavalry.”
Qur’an 9:3 “And an announcement from Allah and His Messenger to the people on the day of the Pilgrimage is that Allah and His Messenger dissolve treaty obligations with the Pagans.”
Tabari VIII:104 “Peace to whoever follows the right guidance! To proceed; Submit yourself, and you shall be safe.’”
Qur’an 49:9 “If two parties among the Believers fall into fighting, make peace: but if one becomes aggressive, then fight against the one that transgresses until it complies.”
Tabari VIII:142 “The Messenger made peace with them on condition that the Zoroastrians should be required to pay the jizyah tax [so onerous, it’s akin to economic suicide] that one should not marry their women.”
Qur’an 9:7 “How can there be a covenant between Allah and His Messenger and the disbelievers with whom you made a treaty near the sacred Mosque?” Qur’an 9:8 “How (can there be such a treaty), seeing that they get an advantage, the upper hand over you? They do not pay you respect, or honor you or the ties of kinship or covenant. With (good words from) their mouths they entice you [out negotiate you], but their hearts are averse to you.”
Qur’an 9:12 “If they violate their oaths and break treaties, taunting you for your Religion, then fight these specimens of faithlessness.”
Tabari VIII:163 “The Prophet said, ‘I think you will see Abu Sufyan [the leading Meccan merchant] come to strengthen the pact and extend the term.’” Ishaq:543 “Abu Sufyan went to Muhammad in Medina to affirm the peace treaty, but Muhammad refused to speak to him.” Tabari VIII:164 “Sufyan went to Abu Bakr and asked him to intercede, but he refused. When Sufyan asked Umar to help [avert war], he replied, ‘No way. By Allah, if I had only ant grubs, I would fight you with them! Ali said, ‘Woe to you, Sufyan. When the Messenger has determined a thing it is useless for anyone to talk to him.’”
Tabari VIII:165 “There is nothing that you can do to make peace with him.”
Tabari VIII:165 “When Abu Sufyan reported back to the Quraysh that Muhammad had given him no reply, they said, ‘Woe to you! By Allah, he did no more than play with you.’”
Ishaq:544 “Muhammad commanded the people to prepare for the foray [raid, incursion, sortie, attack, or assault]. The Messenger informed his troops that he was going to Mecca. He ordered them to prepare themselves and ready their equipment quickly. He said, ‘O Allah, keep spies and news from the Quraysh until we take them by surprise in their land.’”
Tabari VIII:182 “Allah had enabled Muhammad to take the persons of the Quraysh by force, giving him power over them so they were his booty. Their lives were now his spoil.”
Ishaq:552 “When the populace settled down, Muhammad went to the Ka’aba and compassed it seven times on his camel, touching the Black Stone with a stick. Then he went inside the Temple. There he found a dove made of wood. He broke it in his hands and threw it away.” [The first idol Muhammad broke was the international symbol of peace.]
Tabari IX:58 “When the Messenger reached Tabuk the governor of Aylah [a seaport at the north end of the Gulf of Aqabah] came to him, made a treaty, and agreed to pay the jizyah tax. The people of Jarba and Adhruh also offered to pay him the tax.”
Ishaq:607 “The Byzantines encountered the Messenger’s cavalry which was led by Khalid. Ukaydir was seized and his brother Hassan was killed. Muhammad spared his life and made peace with him on the condition that he pay the zakat tax.”
Tabari IX:79 “In this year the zakat was made obligatory, and the Messenger dispatched his agents to collect it. The verse was revealed: ‘Take the zakat from their wealth to purify them.’”
Ishaq:316 “In peace you are wild asses—rough and coarse. And in war you are like women wearing corsets. But I care not so long as my hand can grasp my trusty blade.”
Qur’an 8:61 “But if the enemy inclines toward peace, do you (also) incline to peace, and trust in Allah. Should they intend to deceive or cheat you, verily Allah suffices: He strengthened you with His aid and with Believers.” [The small print is real important. “Should they intend to deceive or cheat” is an open invitation to invoke 8:57 to 60. The first to interpret this surah said:]
Ishaq:326 “If they ask you for peace on the basis of Islam (submission), make peace on that basis. Be of one mind by His religion.”
Tabari VIII:17 “The Muslims and polytheists stayed in their positions for twenty nights with no fighting except for the shooting of arrows and the siege. When the trial became great for the people, the Messenger sent for the leaders of the Ghatafan [Meccan comrades]. He offered them a third of the date harvest of Medina on condition that they leave. The truce between the sides progressed to the point of drawing up a written document, but there was no witnessing or firm determination to make peace; it was only a matter of maneuvering.”
Ishaq:454 “Now that Allah has conferred Islam on us, and made us famous, shall we give them our property? By Allah, we will offer them only the sword until Allah judges between us.’ ‘As you wish,’ said Allah’s Messenger.”
Tabari VIII:100 “Abu Sufyan said, ‘We were merchants but the fighting between us and Muhammad has prevented us from journeying, so our wealth is depleted. [This is the purpose of terrorism.] Even after the truce with the Muslims, we fear that we still are not safe. [Muslims, continuing to plunder Meccan caravans, violated the treaty twenty times.]’”
Qur’an 4:90 “For those who join a group between you and whom there is a treaty, or (those who become) weary of fighting you, had Allah had willed, He could have given them power over you, and they would have fought you. Therefore if they withdraw and wage not war, and send you (guarantees of) peace, then Allah has not given you a way (to war) against them.” [The purpose of terror is to cause people to become so “weary of fighting” they surrender.]
Qur’an 4:91 “You will find others who, while wishing to live in peace and being safe from you to gain the confidence of their people; thrown back to mischief headlong; therefore if they do not withdraw from you, and offer you peace besides restraining their hands, then seize them and kill them wherever you find them; and against these We have given you a clear sanction and authority.” [So if you wish to live in peace, but are perceived as being mischievous (i.e., non-Muslim), Allah has given his Jihad warriors “a clear sanction and authority to seize and kill” you.]
[top] [toc] [quotes main]
Tabari VII:7 “The Prophet married Aisha in Mecca three years before the Hijrah, after the death of Khadija. At the time she was six.”
Mahammad forced himself on her. This is how it happened:
Tabari IX:131 “My mother came to me while I was being swung on a swing between two branches and got me down. My nurse took over and wiped my face with some water and started leading me. When I was at the door she stopped so I could catch my breath. I was brought in while Muhammad was sitting on a bed in our house. My mother made me sit on his lap. The other men and women got up and left. The Prophet consummated his marriage with me in my house when I was nine years old.”
Sorry don't hate me because I'm Beautiful
Part of the American Tribe
God Bless the USA and her Fighting Forces and All who Fight with her give them Strength and Courage to stay the course to Victory Amen
Jihadists can take down an American airliner anytime.
And just how do these trial runs prove jihadist can take down an airplane anytime they want?
There's no hope for Bob Owens and his Ilk. You know brainwashing has been a success when the subject in question has no memory of it ever occurring .
Dont some of u guys stand up at 9 am in the morning mon to fri for allmost 18 yrs of your lives facing the star spangeld banner pledging your alegence to it. So yes Bob Owens repition in your particular case has indeed caused yuorself and possibly others to brainwashed.
Oh and dear Bob less of the homo jokes it's and it ain't clever xxx Abe
Tushtoucher,
Please don't give Bob creidt for the homosexual jokes.
If you could read properly, I posted them, and take full credit.
Fondly,
Son of Infidel
Catherine:
And by the way how many Christians are going around the world and cutting peoples heads off in the name of Christ??
Well let's see theres about 200,000 thousand of them in Iraq at the moment, of the 200,000 us troops sent 900 hundred of those hve died. Since the comencement of the war 23,000 Iraqi CITIZENS have died. As a direct result of the war.
And ok Catherine u know and i know trhat this war was not waged in the name of of Christianity. Thats no the way it looks to the rest of the human race.
Mr Bushtugger-
I can hear the knives being sharppened to cut you into little bits. Please stay with us to witness your execution!
And ok Catherine u know and i know trhat this war was not waged in the name of of Christianity. Thats no the way it looks to the rest of the human race.
Posted by: Abraham Bushtoucher at July 22, 2004 02:09 PM
What no comment on youR book the qu-ran??
and you have the numbers wrong again?
Are you realy an American or just another mulsum who can't spell?
when confrounted with your lies by a woman?
Part of the American Tribe
God Bless the USA and her Fighting Forces and All who Fight with her give them Strength and Courage to stay the course to Victory Amen [FREEDOM FROM DIMMI TAX]
Great Joke!
How does an Iraqi Insurgent Bomb 20 British Coalition Forces.
Easy calls the americans. Doh!
What did the Hot Dog Sell say When he got pulled out of the Twin Towers Rubble
Fuck who ordered Two Jumbos
Catherine where did I called myself Muslum, i'm intrigued. i just started of by placing some common fact based truths down for discusion down and all i get is insult after insult.
So obviously St Catherine I've had to bring myself down to your level of understanding. Hence thos shite jokes posted above.
Well let's see theres about 200,000 thousand of them in Iraq at the moment, of the 200,000 us troops sent 900 hundred of those hve died. Since the comencement of the war 23,000 Iraqi CITIZENS have died. As a direct result of the war.
Posted by: Abraham Bushtoucher at July 22, 2004 02:09 PM
What about the 300,000 Iraqi People that saddam killed do you only care about mulsums when they die in the process to obtain FREEDOM?
abe you ar a confussing sort you say that mulsums want peace and FREEDOM but when people come to their aid to help feed them and save them from the death monsters like saddam you don't want the help
what about in the qu-ran 5:32 where it says if you kill a Jew it will be as if you killed all MANKIND and if you save a life it will be as if you SAVED ALL MANKIND
Now last time I checked the USA and others saved a hell of a lot of Mulsums lifes and there were no mulsums who fought to help FREE the Iraqi People???
We are only letting your book do the talking!!
Part of the American Tribe
God Bless the USA and her Fighting Forces and All who Fight with her give them Strength and Courage to stay the course to Victory Amen
My dear Abraham,
You cannot refute the surgical accuracy of the quotes that I culled from your own religious texts that specifically contradict you, so you try to dodge the issues by throwing up a smokescreen alleging comments that I never made regarding homosexuality.
Interesting.
Ignoring your attempt to raise false issues of sexuality in this commentary, I refer you to your assertion that Islam is best translated to English as “commitment.” Every valid, serious and objective source, including all prominent Islamic scholars, agree unanimously that Islam properly translates into English as “submission.”
This raises two distinct possibilities.
The first possibility is that you do not know enough about Islam to comment intelligently on it, as your assertion does not concur with accepted truths. If this possibility is true, then we must discount your basic understanding of all things pertaining to the Islamic religion, and therefore discard the credibility of any comment you make upon the subject.
The second possibility is that you are willfully misrepresenting Islam, and therefore, by most common standards, committing libel and blasphemy against Islam. In this case as well, you cannot be considered to be a reliable, credible commentator.
Catherine goes on to provide a painfully exhaustive list of direct quotations from the Holy Qur’an. As these quotes are in direct disagreement with your own assertions Abraham, that leaves us with the same two options as well.
Either you are lying, Abraham, or the Holy Qur’an is wrong, in which case the religion of Islam is false.
So which is it, Abraham?
Are you a liar, or is Islam a lie?
I await your response.
Well let's see theres about 200,000 thousand of them in Iraq at the moment, of the 200,000 us troops sent 900 hundred of those hve died. Since the comencement of the war 23,000 Iraqi CITIZENS have died. As a direct result of the war.
Posted by: Abraham Bushtoucher at July 22, 2004 02:09 PM
You know, Bushleague, you've come into the site bashing everyone, calling Hugh illinformed. Yet, you make comments such as the one I've pasted above. Why don't you get off of your knees, pull your panties up, and give the squirrel hole in that tree another big french kiss.
You're beginning to sound like some of the other full blown dunces that come in here to argue on behalf of the machete swinging death cult called Islam, and try to make a point, only to realize that the point is situated and fixed directly on top of their head.
War is Hell, and War was necessary. Stop bashing American soldiers, tu molto estupido petito felita cagna.
Catherine where did I called myself Muslum, i'm intrigued. i just started of by placing some common fact based truths down for discusion down and all i get is insult after insult.
So obviously St Catherine I've had to bring myself down to your level of understanding. Hence thos shite jokes posted above.
Posted by: Abraham Bushtoucher at July 22, 2004 02:25 PM
What are you saying that you are not a mulsum?
Part of the American Tribe
God Bless the USA and her Fighting Forces and All who Fight with her give them Strength and Courage to stay course to Victory Amen
PS. SUV kills his mulsum passanger in TN. another preejacklation??
As far as the jihadists doing dry runs on flights...we won't be able to count on the FBI doing a thing about it. Dhimmitude strikes again.
An excerpt from this mornings article of Daniel Pipes.
George Soros Teaches the FBI Tolerance
by Daniel Pipes and Sharon Chadha
FrontPageMagazine.com
July 22, 2004
The special agent in charge of FBI's Washington Field Office has participated in a new initiative called the Promising Practices Guide: Developing Partnerships Between Law Enforcement and American Muslim, Arab, and Sikh Communities. This is a worrisome development because that guide's adoption could significantly impede the war on terror.
Funded by the Soros and Whiting foundations and created at Northeastern University, the guide presents its goal as shaping "a basic curriculum for future law enforcement and community training activities." At first glance, this sounds promising, as it offers ways to take advantage of Arab, Muslim and Sikh unique "linguistic skills, information, and cultural insights" to develop new counterterrorism initiatives.
But the guide's authors, Deborah A. Ramirez, Sasha Cohen O'Connell and Rabia Zafar, quickly alert the reader as to their true agenda. "The most dangerous threats in this war" they write, "are rooted in the successful propagation of anger and fear directed at unfamiliar cultures and people." The most dangerous threat, they say, is not the very real violence of Islamist terror but the alleged bias of American authorities against some minority populations. The guide might present itself as an aide to counterterrorism but its real purpose is to deflect attention from national security to the privileging of select communities.
The full article can be found at:
http://www.danielpipes.org/article/1971
Reza,
Your grandchildren will eat pork.
"I think we need to be careful here. This is beginning to look like racial profiling and we certainly don`t want the ACLU coming down on airline pilots and passengers for being suspicious of middle eastern type looking men."
Mackie, the ACLU can kiss my nice, white butt! I have a right to speak up on a flight if someone is making me feel uncomfortable, and I'm not going to apologize. People need to have the courage to order these 'people' to sit their sorry asses down, and not to make a move until the flight ends. I mean, if the behavior is so bazaare that other passengers are crying, and clinging to their spouses, thinking death is imminent, then someone needs to speak up. They want us to stay in our seats and to remain quiet. Remember Attas instructions? Fark that! If I see a group of 'people' acting strange on a flight, you can bet that I'm gonna go off on them. Hello, Mr/Mrs Muslim extremist, I'm a former Steele Chick with a bad attitude, and a wicked vocabulary that can intimidate a truck driver. Oh, and if that doesn't work, i will beat the living crap out of you with my 100lb Coach purse. Plus, I'm sure my fellow passengers will have my back. *sigh* It's a ,littel late to speak up after they have assembled and detonated a bomb in the bathroom.
On that note, I just want to make it known that I didn't hate muslims prior to 911. Despite having a Syrian/Lebonese college roomate, who warned me about muslim men. Hell, all I had to do was observe the way her father and brothers treated her and other woman in her family. (don't get me started) No, I never hated muslims. I never gave them much thought. Now, thanks to 911, I loathe them. I want to see them exterminated. Congratulations! And, BTW, a lot of Americans fell just like me. We're not all anti war, tree hugging hippies, adn we don't give a piss about thier woman and children. On 911, these nut balls stirred up a hornets nest. If it happens again, do you really think anyone will be able to control the American citizen? Hell. I'd vote to exterminate them, simply based on my tax that have to go to fund all the antiterrorism measures.
/bad mood
Pink Power: Will you marry me?
Just a joke.
Abraham Bushtoucher:
You appear to be reading from that flowery public relations pamphlet that organizations like C.A,I,R, put out to government agencies right after 9-11. And your comments are right in line with the copy that was given to me as well.
And after reading it, I said wait a minute, this is just to sweet based on what we are seeing going on in the Islamic world today and has actually been going on for centuries .
So I began to do research and found that what Islam is telling us in english is far different then what they are preaching in mosques and madrassis in Arabic.
And to be honest, I was quite shocked to see the hypocrisy that was there. But then we learn that it is okay to tell lies in the Islamic world to infidels if it helps to proliferate there desire for world domination and a caliphate with sharia law in every country which by the way, they are working hard to achieve by the use of terrorism in numerous countries around the world and millions of christians are being killed because of it.
Hugh Fitsgerald and Robert Spencer are well versed in the teachings of the Quran . Mr Spencer has studied the Quran for over 25 years and gives speeches,interviews on tv,radio, and writes columns on the subject of Islam everyday. Take a little deeper look into what is really going on here before you reach a full conclusion.
You should take some time and read the discussions that Robert Spencer has had with some Christian clergy that don`t have a clue of what is really going on here my friend.
My friends,
Wonderful refutations of Abe's post,
most excellent.
Perhaps Abe gets his info or most
of it from CAIR,
as he doesn't seem to care
about the mohammedan source documents
or what the good muslims say.
Have a good day all, knowing you are Free.
I've said it before, but I'll say it again, the most dangerous Americans that the Islamists will stir up will be American Soccer Moms.
Threaten the cubs and the ladies will start ordering their men to take action, similar to when Jack Ryan's doctor/wife says about the terrorists in PATRIOT GAMES:
"I don't care what you have to do, Jack. Just get them."
Fear the American female, oh wielders of the chauvanistic manual called the Qu'ran.
Pinkpower:
I`m with you, I hope that you read my little jab at the political correct BS as a facetious remark back there a ways ?
DCWATSON:
Sorry, I'm happily tagged! And no, I'm not a soccer mom. Haven't spawned yet!
You know what...Beat them at their own game.
Let retired military pilots fly our commercial planes. And seal the cabins shut. Only way into the cockpit is through the canopy similiar to the fighter jets we will use to spray their pig infested souls over their own soil.
I could go on with more ways to protect ourselves but I think the armed forces are preparing for that with the new MOAB. Cool huh?
What did the Hot Dog Sell say When he got pulled out of the Twin Towers Rubble
Fuck who ordered Two Jumbos
Posted by: Abraham Bushtoucher at July 22, 2004 02:20 PM
Mr. Bushbrusher, can you please tell me your location? I'm a bit dissapointed with your 9/11 jokes and would like to address this issue with you in person if feasible.
Catherine, yep, everybody in my household
is a skilled hunter/marksman. My house looks
like a taxidermy shop. If our feds will leave
the 2nd amendment alone, we'll take care of
our perimeter.
Tushtoucher,
Your ignorant comments reflect the typical anti-American hating rhetoric espoused by the likes of Michael Moore(evidently your idol and mentor)the fat American hating slob.
In addition, it is you and your ilk who are brain washed and whose brains have been irreperably damaged by the fatal "disease" of left wing liberalisim.
Clearly, you are an apologist for and sympathizer with the Islamo-fascists.
The "alleged" jokes you posted concerning the destruction of the World Trade Center and slaughter of three thousand plus people,only confirms my above remarks.
You would be well suited as a "Human Shield", somewhere near the next US air strike in Fallujah
DC,
I would be more than glad to join you in visiting Mr.Tushtoucher, as I reside in New York.
Also, I could bring along some of the other residents here and we could have a nice time "talking" with him.
Not likely this would happen, as his kind are a bunch of yellow cowards.
I'm just guessing, but of the claim there are 1.2 billion muslims, I would say 1.19 billion had no other choice. Just ask those who have left the cult.
Who woud embrace Islam unless you were one of it's beneficiaries, Right? Sexually twisted, meglamaniac, lying, oppressing, tribalpathic, suicidal, corrupt, hemipigeonous, death-dancing, rock sucking, black hearted, souless, sand worms?
..for starters!
Fear the American female, oh wielders of the chauvanistic manual called the Qu'ran.
Posted by: Foehammer at July 22, 2004 03:28 PM
Now ladys does not this make your day makes mine! Here is a man who knows the American woman!!!
Part of the American Tribe
God Bless the USA and her Fighting Forces and All who Fight with her give them Strength and Courage to stay the course to Victory Amen
Prester John,
Sand worms, very original!
I have often used the term "sand monkeys"(no disrespect to primates)
I am certian that the late General, George S. Patton would have had the appropriate solution in dealing with these mutants.
One of his more memorable quotes is:
"no poor bastard ever won a war by dying for his country".
"He won won it by making the other bastards die for their country"
In this case it is not their country that the Islamo-fascists wish to die for, they wish to die for"Islam".
Therefore, lets accommodate all the "bastards" and
send them to "Allah"
and Reza-
Please tell me more about how great it will be under the rule of the psyco-delite, shade stealing, throat cutting, machete-faced, abu-hooded, blood soaked, stone throwing, civili-castrated, camel-porned, amputation fixation, mobotic, rug sniffing, evil-doing (don't want to forget that one), poppy snaking, ear and nose hacking, make'n-me-gagging, world Caliphate?
I just thought of a scenario in airliner Jihad. I have a good imagination...but then so do they:
The simultaneous detonations of aircraft flying directly over major American cities with bio/radiological material smuggled onboard.
That would give them something bigger than 9/11 and would not require taking the cockpit.
Note all the activity on the plane with Annie Jackobsen as they approached LA...they would be over populated areas.
And all the attention with the bags...
Tushtoucher,
From your ignorant and vile commentary, I highly suspect that you are a "Muzzie".
Would you please confirm this ,or are you ashamed yo do so.
We are all waiting.....
Sorry about the typo, it should read,"to do so"
Check out this site for perfect examples of the religion of peace at its finest.
ogrish.com
Q: When does a Muslim boy become a man?
A: When they take the diaper off his ass and put it on his head.
He started it.............
I'll be here all week.
REZA My little Iranian Lemming
You certainly pop up between the pages. Now I would have thought ISLAM was better equated to be
a Dinosaur ; a huge ferocious Tyranasaurus Rex demanding a constant supply of 'fragrant blood' and beheaded corpses for its delectation. ISLAM is certainly on its last legs.We just have to press a few buttons.Take care...
Wow muslims really get uppity when you quote directly from their unholy koran...hard to refute what evil drivel comes directly from those pages...any idiot that would joke about 9-11 deserves to be beaten to a bloody pulp...just what is so f-ing funny about 4000 innocent people being fried alive, what is so f-ing funny about wives who lost husbands, husbands who lost wives, children who lost both parents....yes only a muslim would find humor in that...sickos....and I always have to laugh at non muslims who apologize or sympathize with muslims...dont they realize that their heads will be chopped off just the same..do they think that kissing muzzie ass gives them a "get out of beheading free" card...lol...think again, your are an infidel just like the rest of us, unless you either pay your dhimmi tax or convert you are fair game for them, simply being sensitive to their phony plight gets you nothing.
Tushtoucher,
Still waiting to hear from you......
I guess like all left wing liberals,you fold like a cheap camera.
ABRAHAM BUSHTOUCHER [Gee, just love the name]
You are obviously very touchy[no, this is not a pun] about your beliefs.There is a saying :'If you
don't like the heat, stay out of the Kitchen.'If you BELIEVE the Iraq war is a CHRISTIAN CRUSADE
against ISLAM, you follow drivel spouted at your
local mosque by some ignorant self dubbed SHEIK/IMAM recently arrived from Pakistan.You ought to know, according to Muslim propaganda that the wicked West are not that much interested in religion,certainly not enough to kill others
in the attempt to force our Faith on them.We leave this to Islam, who at this moment are slitting the throats or burning Christians,Hindus,
Buddhists in many countries around the world.
Anyway despite your protests, Muslims are going to
be dragged kicking and screaming, into the 21st Century. Either that or they will be left to stagnate in ignorance,superstion,backwardness and
poverty. The rest of the world is going ahead.
Richard The Lionheart
Hulequ Khan:
Kind of backing up into history a little bit there aren`t you (1150 A.D.)
Mr.Khan . No one ever denies that the Crusades where a violent period in history. Both sides where extremely viscious. Will have to give credit due, but it was the French that stopped the rampant muslim moorish armies from going any farther into Europe at the end of the 500 year war.
Since bushmaster likes jokes...here are a couple he will love....
Q) What did the Muslim boy say about his dad?
A) "I wanna be just like Daddy when I blowup"
Q) Why do Muslms carry sandpaper?
A) To be prepared, you should always carry a map
Q) Why are Muslims unwelcome in hotels?
A) Because they always steal the towels.
Q) What did sadaam and his father have in common?
A) Neither knew when to pull out.
Hope you enjoy bushmaster!
Ok I can hear bushmaster laughing..so here is one more especially for him....
Three strangers awaiting their flights strike up a conversation in the airport passenger lounge in Bozeman, Montana. One is an American Indian passing through from Lame Deer. Another is a Cowboy on his way to Billings for a livestock show. And the third is a fundamentalist Arab student, newly arrived at Montana State University from the Middle East who is headed to a training conference in Detroit.
Their discussion drifts to their diverse cultures. Soon, the two Westerners learn that the Arab is a devout, radical Muslim who supports Osama Bin Laden's Jihad, so the conversation falls into an uneasy lull. The cowboy leans back in his chair, crosses his boots on a magazine table and tips his big sweat-stained hat forward over his face. The wind outside is blowing tumbleweeds around, and the old windsock is flapping; but still . . . no plane comes.
Finally, ! the American Indian clears his throat and softly, he speaks, "At one time here, my people were many, but sadly, now we are few."
The Muslim student raises an eyebrow and leans forward, "Once my people were few," he sneers, "and now we are many. Why do you suppose that is?"
The Montana cowboy shifts his toothpick to one side of his mouth and from the darkness beneath his Stetson says in a drawl, "That's 'cause we ain't played Cowboys and Muslims yet, . . . but I do believe it's a-comin'."
Abraham Bushmuncher,
1. Who the hell are you and what leftist rock have you scurried from under?
2. How dare you call my comments embaresing , when the first comment you make on this page is filled with more crap than the combined latrines of every single third world country, and more lies and misinformation and lies than every single leftist media channel/newspaper and Faren-shite 9/11 put together.
3. Where the hell did you dig up all that bullshit about islam, it's too far-fetched and laughably inaccurate to even be given the rock bottom tagging of "liberal".You've created a new wing in political leaning : Far Side of the Universe left.
4. How supremely arrogant of you to call Hugh illinformed. I have never in my entire existence respected anyone, or learned so much from two people as I have from Hugh and Robert Spencer. Every single article and comment by them both on here are full of facts , observations and anecdotes that I assume are from years of personal experience and extensive research, which is infinitely more than I can say for your pathetic excuse for a PC statement. Go and do some serious research and then come back here and have a go , but until then I'd go looking for info in slightly better sources than "1001 Totally Ludicrous Lies About Muslims.Com".
Finally , I'll be the first to admit that I have my off days , and that there are some subjects that I'm not quite as 'in the know' with, but there are many areas of the world of war/religion/media/politics/geography where I have it down to a fine art, much of it from first hand experiences. So go back and read every single comment I've ever made on this and like-minded websites and remind me again exactly what I've said that I have to be embarrassed about.Yes I say offensive stuff about muslims , THEY OFFEND ME BY BEING MUSLIM!!! Yes ,sometimes I comment without thinking or even reading the article/previous comments properly, but I'm sure I'll be backed up in saying that I can sometimes be pretty perceptive, not that it takes a genius to work out what muslims worldwide are up to , which puts you firmly min the category of "blind Joe public" or more bluntly put ignorant prick. If I've ever said something that offends or annoys a self-righteous PC doormat such as yourself then I'd say I've done a fine job of it, and that; sir; is no embarassment to me.
Rikki,
Mr. Tushdoucher and all his ilk are a bunch of yellow cowards.
When confronted with the facts they fold like a cheap camera.
Please, offend these pc wankers as often as possible.
Finally , I'll be the first to admit that I have my off days , and that there are some subjects that I'm not quite as 'in the know' with, but there are many areas of the world of war/religion/media/politics/geography where I have it down to a fine art,
Posted by: Rikki at July 23, 2004 11:09 AM
Never say your sorry!!
We love you!! Don't turn PC on us now!
I need my short skirts!
Part of the American Tribe
God Bless the USA and her Fighting Forces and All who Fight with her give them Strength and Courage to stay the course to Victory Amen
PS Abe is working for Al-Jizzi and his freind jtf is on duty today?
I don't know why they keep talking about me as St.Catherine other than to think Italy and I believe the day is sometime in March Heard them talking on arab news about St.Catherine?
May have something to do with sity bu saide? & Carthage and the mosiacs?
Bob Owens,DCWatson,Son of Infidel and Catherine:
Well done for shutting that sick, twisted, maggot the hell up, he's the scum of society along with the muslims whose assholes he's stuck in .I wish I'd seen his comments yesterday.GRRRRR!!!!
Abraham"little girls"Bushtoucher:
I'm trying to find out were you are... You've been warned freak!!!
PS- If you love muslims so much (thats if you're not one) , why not join them , preferably as a suicide bomber or one of the walking sanitry towels getting annihilated in Iraq every day.
Rikki:
Excellent post.
Abraham Bushtoucher is a muslim, and as such is unworthy of ANY response from you. Nice of you to try and explain things to it, though . . . much more than I'd be willing to do.
Bob Owens and DCWatson,
Have you noticed Bushface hasn't replied once to any of your posts, that buried his trash? You both left him without a leg to stand on, how pathetic , the chicken-shit pussy has been proven completely wrong and his mommy won't let him comment again, or maybe association time at Arkham Asylum is over and he's back in his padded cell on the peadophiles wing.
The muslims here always "spew and run", they never have the brains nor the balls to duke it out in a real discussion. Typical - try ineffectually to lob a verbal hand grenade, then run and hide.
Rikki,
I am not unfamiliar with the "spew and run" (thanks for the phrase, CGW) tactics of people such as Abraham. The same tactics are common to those that hold to extremist views, whether those views are held on the far right of Islam or on the far left of American and European liberalism.
They both make pointed, emotional outbursts that back a feeling or emotion. With little variation, those feeling generally revolve around anger, betrayal and jealousy, though there is always a emotional appeal in their message. They must rely on emotion, as they cannot hold their worldviews when exposed to facts. Once you expose the illogic of their position, what else can they really say? At that point all they have left is name-calling, or silence.
I do find it interesting that when a Muslim is confronted with an argument that he cannot win, he at least has the discipline to cut his losses and wait for another opportunity to attack. Abraham Bushtoucher seems to be following that strategy here, and you will notice it is common to Reza, Mahmoud, deathpasser, and other Muslim posters.
Liberals do not often have that measure of self control, and turn quickly to name-calling and personal attacks, before finally withdrawing. This was painfully obvious about a month back with a neophyte liberal Muslim sympathizer named Jen, whose arguments underwent a systematic breakdown when exposed to logic over the course of three days on two threads.
An interesting thing I’ve noticed when verbally sparring with American liberals is that those who use logic to defuse the liberal arguments are quickly and derisively referred to as neo-Con Republican Bush supporters. Obviously, logic has no place in the Democratic Party, at least in their minds.
I find that quite interesting.
You know what really makes muslims upset if you used pages of their Quran as toilet paper.
I know.. I know.. It comes off as being some sort of juvenile stunt. I initially thought so too. But I did it and then came the overwhelming satisfication of having insulted them, their allah, their mohammad, and their holybook so much so that it became not juvenile event but actually an uplifting and.. uhmm. cleansing experience.
And the only thing I care about is that you're absolutely insulted and that you lay awake at night so totally pissed off at me and that your lust for vengence forces you to come and get me.. Cause I'm here waiting for you cowards...
Pretty soon there'll be millions of your precious Qurans sitting along side toilet bowls everywhere with pages torn out of it cause that's what we think of your deathcult's book of war.