Al-Sadr wanted concession after concession, including money for the families of those killed by Americans. Instead of granting this, which would amount to an admission that the entire Iraqi operation was illegal and unwarranted, the Iraqis and the US government have allowed the talks to break down. From AP:
NAJAF, Iraq - Truce talks between Shiite militants and Iraqi officials broke down Saturday, raising the prospect of a return to the fierce fighting between militiamen and U.S-Iraqi forces that has shaken the holy city of Najaf for more than a week.The government's chief negotiator, Mouwaffaq al-Rubaie, said talks were making no progress and that he was leaving Najaf. Aides to radical Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr blamed the United States and the Iraqi government on the breakdown....
Al-Sadr had demanded a U.S. withdrawal from Najaf, the freeing of all Mahdi Army fighters in detention and amnesty for all the fighters, in exchange for disarming his followers and pulling them out of the revered Imam Ali shrine and Najaf's old city, where they have taken refuge, aides said.
However, al-Sadr himself did not participate in the talks and al-Rubaie said he felt some "elements" were hindering his efforts to hold a face-to-face meeting with the firebrand cleric.
Al-Rubaie said he had proposed that al-Sadr's militia be disbanded and become a political movement.
"We have been talking and discussing these matters for three days but reached no positive conclusion," he said. "After three days, my government thought there was no use in continuing."
Al-Sadr aide Sheik Ali Smeisim said both sides had agreed on all points, but interim Prime Minister Ayad Allawi suddenly told the government officials to break off talks and return to Baghdad.
"It is a conspiracy to commit a big massacre," he told the pan-Arab Al-Jazeera television station.
Ahmed al-Shaibany, another al-Sadr spokesman, blamed the talks' failure on the Americans, who also were not participating.
"There are particular points and demands we had that we specifically wanted the Americans to sign on, but they refused," he said.
Among those demands, he said, was U.S. compensation for the families of those killed in confrontations with the Americans.
Is anyone surprised! This thug's demands and offers of truce go up and down like a frigging yoyo.Don't even believe he was wounded:just a political ploy to generate sympathy and try to make Fatboy look like a hero. Shed his last drop of blood and make it SOON...
Why are we even listening to fat boy? We know he is full of sh*t and will lie through is rotten teeth. Lets just take care of him like we should have months ago
I agree this is a cheap ploy to buy time,this happened before and the trick was to fake a truce to bring in weapons and new replacements,once re-armed innocent civilians are shot and then blamed on the US troops.
That little fat F**ker reminds me of Gering
hiding behind soldiers that die for his cause,are Muslims that stupid they don't see the pattern of young Muslims doing the dying while slobs like Sadr or even Arafat get to grow old and pass down the lies to new mindless Muslims.
I say we pound the prick into the stone age,oops,they are already there,Ok send him to Allah on a silver platter. Lets not wait for more Churches to be bombed buy these thugs or hear another lame excuse from CAIR about Islam is peace and Iraqis are just defending themselves from the invaders. CAIR USA has made it clear they support the terrorists and CAIR will pay for that stupid stance,they act like a body unto themselves to control the U.S. Army and foreign Policy.
If Muslims hate Americans so much then all they have to do is leave,the endless demands for 250 million people to accomadate their religious costumes and rules is dangerous and will get worse if Kerry becomes their leader in the Whitehouse.
Can you not see that the current events in Najaf are a small reflection of the larger struggle? Most of the Iraqi Police and National Guard in Najaf have joined with the resistance fighters. Sayyed Mutada As-Sadr and the Mehdi Army are fighting in the cause of Allah (swt). They have the courage and the will to win. The cowardly Americans and their remaining Iraqi apostate stooges have neither the courage nor the will. They are doomed.
Sayyed As-Sadr has already asked for United Nations troops to preserve the holy Shrine of Imam Ali. Soon he will request help from his Islamic brothers in Iran. What will you do when hundreds of thousands of Iranian troops, supported by armor and air power, pour across the border. What will you do when Iran closes the Persian Gulf and cuts off the American line of retreat?
Here, with a few minor changes, are a few lines of a poem by the British imperialist Rudyard Kipling. I believe them appropriate to the current condition of America:
Hard pressed, your navies melt away.
On headland sinks the fire.
And all your pomp of yesterday
Is one with Nineva and Tyre.
Allahu akbar
Reza
I'm still waiting for your answers from a earlier post,I will honor my claim to convert to Islam if you answer the question I had on the 9/11 attack being done the Jews and the passport being palnted at the scene to fram Mohammed Atta.
The only outcome to your avoidance to use the Quran to prove me wrong is that you aren't a Muslim,nor do you know the Quran or give a F**k about Allah. So whatever game your playing it's very dangerous to mock Allah and refuse to help a person willing to accept Islam.
I'm a trusted NorthAmerican and would be an excellent Jihadist for Islam,once brainwashed
to murder for the peaceful teaching of Muhammed
I'll even bomb a Mosque to rid the West of the Muslim infidels that befriend the Jewish and Christian pigs.
Please please please let me join Islam,all I need is the answers to those previous requests,if
not then F**K off and die,it's nothing personal
so don't take it the wrong way.
NO ISLAM - KNOW PEACE
Reza:
What will you do when hundreds of thousands of Iranian troops, supported by armor and air power, pour across the border. What will you do when Iran closes the Persian Gulf and cuts off the American line of retreat?
The technical term for the situation you describe is a "target-rich environment."
Trust me, our forces would enjoy nothing more than to see hundreds of thousands of Iraqi troops equipped with antiquated armor and aircraft pour across the border.
Or are you actually stupid enough to believe that a fourth-rate power like Iran is a match for the US in a stand-up fight?
Reza whined:
Sayyed As-Sadr has already asked for United Nations troops to preserve the holy Shrine of Imam Ali.
Who cares about your stupid shrines (spit) Do you muslims show ANY respect for other religion's cultures and shrines? NO!!!
The taliban destroyed ancient religious statues. In Pakistan and India they destroy churches. In Saudi Arabia they wont even allow a church to be built. In Jerusalem they destroy important ancient Jewish temple sites under the cover of darkness. In France they desecrate Jewish graves.
But wait... if anyone comes near their holy sites they cry like little babies to the UN and then threaten the world.
Your savagery and animal-like behavior will never be matched by any other nation or religion, so you dont have to keep reminding us. If we had the same mindset as your people we would have nuked and exterminated every one of your people a long time ago, just like you try to do to us.
Those of you who don't believe that Iran can easily close the Persian Gulf and trap the Crusader armies in Iraq might read this. You might also look up Stalingrad and Tannenberg.
Allahu akbar
Those of you who don't believe that Iran can easily close the Persian Gulf and trap the Crusader armies in Iraq might read this. You might also look up Stalingrad and Tannenberg.
Allahu akbar
Posted by: Reza at August 14, 2004 04:38 PM
Excuse us, fake Muslim Raisin, one thing you forget, Americans don't retreat. It's just a matter of time before Islam is finished. The laughing stock of the planet.
Iran is next.......Their sabre rattling does them no good. They might as well throw their hands up and waive their little white flags now, before we destroy what's left of their foul smelling, earthquake riddled land.
Let the Iranians come and join the party. I welcome that. Islam's on the way out, Raisin.....You'll make a good Jew someday, but you should start on some medications as soon as possible, you're a meshugana.
Reza must be on our side. He/she is telling us what the enemy is doing.
Keep it up Reza.
Reza must be on our side. He/she is telling us what the enemy is doing.
Keep it up Reza.
I read that the DCWatson Supreme Court Of American Justice was in session this afternoon for a special ruling.
The results are as follows-
Issue 1: The court rules that the beloved Islamic Shitite Shrine has been utilized by the terrorist/coward/militant/insurgent/liar members of al Porker's rag-tag militia to shoot at Coalition troops and store weapons.
With this information allowed into the case as evidence, it is hereby decided that terrorist/coward/militant/insurgent/liar members of al Porker's rag-tag militia are to be lock inside, while Coalition Gun-Ships fire at the Shrine until it, and its occupants are demolished into splinters, and bone fragments.
This decision is not open to appeal. In other words, it has come time to say goodbye to Spanky, Alfalfa, and the rest of the "He Man Woman Haters Club".
Court is now adjourned.
Reza,
You know the majority of the Iraqi people including the Shia do not side with Al Sadr and his criminal gang. Sure some of the IP and National Guard has joined him; would that be because he and his gang have ordered over 200 deaths with their court rulings. The people are scared and rightfully so with these guys taking over the town and terrorizing the people.
Is this YOUR God, Reza? Is it?
The Iranians are there, and they will hopefully die with Sadr. Send more please cause then the Mullahs are going to have their hands full at home watching their backside. The world is watching Iran and their interference; they have no credibility left. Bring it on anytime.
The Borg Master said, “Here, with a few minor changes, are a few lines of a poem by the British imperialist Rudyard Kipling. I believe them appropriate to the current condition of America:
Hard pressed, your navies melt away.
On headland sinks the fire.
And all your pomp of yesterday
Is one with Nineva and Tyre.”
Strange that you of all people would quote Kipling, a famous Freemason, and a man after my own heart. I would point out that the only reason that Najuf is still standing (or Mecca for that matter) is because the Americans are being polite. That will probably change in the future. The islamo countries of the Middle East will come to resemble Chechnya, the Russians don’t worry about small matters such as collateral damage or “holy” islamo shrines. We could take a page from their book.
“Your grandchildren will be readers and admirers of Kipling, the Freemason.”
Hmmmmmmmmm...the Iranians are going to attack? I'd like to see that...to quote General George S. Patton:
"No bastard ever won a war by dying for his country.
He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country." (or religion in this case)
I don't think the US soldiers in Iraq would have a problem with this...so come on lets go here...the more muslims that run to die for their religion the sooner we will win. The US military is specifically trained and equiped to take on a large military force (the Soviet Union...although this is changing now) so lets go! We will destroy your tanks and air craft before they have a chance to even shoot at us!
REZA ME OLE MATE![And I thought you'd gone on jihad to help your bros in Najaf.]
You ain't 'alf crazy,luv. Looked at that bit of
shit and none of it makes sense... All will happen if Iran makes a move is THAT LOTS MORE MORE
MUSLIMS WILL BE KILLED which should reduce overall
population some.By the way if Merry Mullahs are going to war, it would give the rest of the Iranians a chance to threw off their shackles.They'll probably kill off those bastards
before we have a chance to get to them. Sad really, would have liked to see a few fat Mullahs
beaten up, pleading to American soldiers to take them to a safe Infidel Prison...
The "Imam Ali Shrine:"
Is it better to lose one more American Marine or one soldier to save this domed mosque? No!
This mosque would be a good place to start reversing the trend of being sensitive to the jihadists (I am using the word to include those that carry guns and rocket launchers and those that support them--whether by dancing in delight when Americans die or silently being satisfied by seeing the images on Al Jazeera).
One mosque being blown to rubble would show the illegitimates that any edifice sheltering armed contingents--whether Iraqi Shi'ites or Iranian Shi'ites--isn't holy to us.
Of course, it will not happen. We want Iraqis to storm the shrine. Fat chance. And we are so so concerned with the sensitivity of the jihadist world. I mean, what would the jihadist world do? Rise up, a howling mob shouting their rage at the infidel? What a frightening spectacle! How would we ever deal with that?
The Threat of Iran:
This mighty power spent some--what was it, eight or ten years--fighting a war with Saddam's Iraq. How long did it take us to take that illegitimate out?
I wrote here once before that one part of the population of Iran would be happy to see their black-turbaned oppressors gone, the other part is itching to attack the infidel. As a matter of fact, many of these have already joined the "Mahdi army."
So, by taking out the Imam Ali shrine and the "Mahdi army," it would accomplish two things:
1. Show the jihadist world "no more Mr. Nice Guy"
2. Deplete some of the Iranian manpower eager to die for their ideology.
Reza asked: What will you do when hundreds of thousands of Iranian troops, supported by armor and air power, pour across the border.
I'd like to see Iran amass a million man army along the Iraqi border then have them all storm into Iraq all at once. Kindof like the start of the Boston Marathon..
Within minutes there'd be so much firepower raining down on them from above that every last one of those Jihadiots will be dead before any of them crossed within a few miles inside the border..
The real question becomes... How does one go about burying that many dead guys? I say... skip the burial altogether and just import a few thousand vultures from Kenya..
Reza tried to logically make a point but of course failed miserably per usual "Those of you who don't believe that Iran can easily close the Persian Gulf and trap the Crusader armies in Iraq might read this. You might also look up Stalingrad and Tannenberg."
Two words, Reza.
War College.
Poor Reza,14 centuries of the great Islamic scholars and knowledge and they still can build a radio and I know they can't make a TV(black and White no VHF)or model T clunker.
And her rag-tag wimps will have victory over
the infidels. Ha,they'll surrender for asylum
like the Gulf war girly-men.
Allah is fake,wake up ,pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.
Gee, here's a hard question..."
"What will you do when hundreds of thousands of Iranian troops, supported by armor and air power, pour across the border. What will you do when Iran closes the Persian Gulf and cuts off the American line of retreat?"
Hmmm.... Let's see...
Take out Iran's experimental nuclear facilities??
Muslim-Puke,
I see you are stirring up trouble again.
"The cowardly Americans and their remaining Iraqi apostate stooges have neither the courage nor the will. They are doomed".
"We shall neither fail nor falter, we shall not weaken or tire...give us the tools and we will finish the job."
SIR WINSTON CHURCHILL, (1874-1965)
WE have the tools !!!
"History will be written by the victors"
My vote is to finish the JOB.
Yahweh reighns
In Najaf, in Shi’a southern Iraq, the route to any compromise - if it ever existed - has been fully closed by now, with the young Ayatollah Muqtada el-Sadr’s bold speech yesterday that, at this stage, for him and his thugs, it’s "either victory over the Americans or Death".
If Najaf’s to be a battleground due to his repeated recalcitrance, then so be it - let ‘er rip: Grand Mosque, Sacred Shrine, Hallowed Cemetery, "Holy City" and all. Najaf’s Shi’ite sanctity was broken in the first place by el-Sadr’s own barricading of the Mosque and the fortification of its precincts, many months ago - hauling munitions and gunmen into there, making it an armed base for his "Mahdi Army", using it as a haven for Terrorism as much as for prayer.
US Special Forces could raid the Grand Mosque and capture or kill el-Sadr, but if that doesn't work, things could get bad in Iraq.
If not held back (as previously), the USMC ought to be able to take Najaf by storm within weeks, without big trouble, though potentially with heavy US casualties and much collateral damage. It’s not impossible that Najaf could end up resembling the smoking devastation of GROZNY.
Indeed, the bloodier and longer-protracted the prospective, bitter combat in Najaf, the more the fanatical Sadrists - despite their eventual defeat - stand to gain (via their "noble, heroic" multi-"martyrdom") a palpable, posthumous "moral triumph" for the Jihad, among millions of maniacs across the Umma. (But at least all the Sadrists’d be GONE forever, and good riddance.)
Alternately, the problem can be addressed throught the establishment of a tight siege-ring around Najaf, patiently subjecting it to shelling, ærial strafing, thirst, hunger, madness, disease, et al, till it falls. - Will el-Jazeera and its ilk entitle such a blockade there, "a new Leningrad"?
Another feasible approach would be, after a stern and stringently time-limited, public ultimatum (strenuously pressing everybody in Najaf to come out with their hands up, in the scant hours left), have the USAF expend tons of iron-bombs on it. The Arabs, Arabists, their apologists and pet media would definitely glom onto this approach as "a new Dresden"!
There’s NO avoiding an immense barrage of adverse propaganda for the US from its antagonists and their running-dogs, whichever conventional means it applies to Imam el-Sadr. However, his rebellion CANNOT go unquelled; the results of that course could be even worse - manifesting Weakness, at once a red rag and a green light to Islamo-fascism.
Here’s a further option: unambiguous Force Majeure. Proceed (in maximum-persuasion mode) with the strongest warnings to the town’s inhabitants to evacuate promptly, as above, then drop not dumb-bombs, nor "smart" ones, but an Atomic Warhead.
Destruction of the Grand Mosque and its environs in CONVENTIONAL fighting would communicate the message (inter alia) that Moslem religious sites immediately LOSE their protected status as soon as any weapons, etc, are introduced into them.
Flattening Najaf with a nuke conveys this concept equally well, but contains an additional, vital, message: this blast’s an Example, a Demonstration, an Object Lesson, for Jihadis everywhere to urgently meditate upon - things’ve shifted up to the next level in the "War on Terror"; the USA has seized the intiative and the gloves are finally off, no more "Mr Niceguy", it’s Hardball now. Faluja, Ramadi or Sadr City in Bagdad (and targets beyond Iraq) are square in the sights, from this minute on - America’s enemies won’t even see what hit them; RESISTANCE IS FUTILE.
Ohhh, How I miss the good old day of Dresden, Hamburg, Berlin & Tokyo. In 1945 the allied air forces almost levelled those cities and there was no protest from anyone.
Allthough the lost of innocent lives was regrettable but the outcome of that action was clear, the allied won the war!
Nowadays we have to fight with one arm tied and the enemy take full advantage of it. When we gonna realize that the enemy will never fight with the same rules?
"There's no honorable way to kill, no gentle way to destroy. There is nothing
good in war. Except its ending."
- Abraham Lincoln
HGII,
Very well said.
I especially like the term "unambiguous Force Majeure" with the caveat "in maximum-persuasion mode". Thanks for the laugh..
BTW.. I agree with everything you said with the proviso that Bush get re-elected first. Then he's a lame-duck and he can proceed forthwith and not give a damn about the political fallout.
'BTW.. I agree with everything you said with the proviso that Bush get re-elected first. Then he's a lame-duck and he can proceed forthwith and not give a damn about the political fallout.'
Exactly what I have been saying for weeks, Mahdi. Let him get back in and then to Hell with the 'peace at any cost to the future of the planet' crowd.
Reza,
You must be watching a different war to the rest of us. To me it looks as though al saddos goons are getting absolutely slaughtered by the yanks and brits, while all those muslim muppets seem to do is stand there firing into thin air, or at nothing, making themselves look rather silly and completely useless in the process.
Lets see how many of al saddos freaks have become corpses in the last few days, ooooo it's got to be at least 500, maybe even 600 and rising, and how many US troops SIX.
I'm sure you don't need me to tell you Reza , but as I've said before, you muslims suck at war.