UK: Fundraisers for new mosque in old church condemn BNP leaflet

I don't blame the Moslems. They legally purchased the defunct church and are going to build a large Mosque complex from it. I don't like it. It signals the slow process of Islamification in merry ole England and thw church owners who sold it to them are despicable in my view. But legally, to discriminate against a buyer is against the law in the US so it probably is in the UK as well. But the Moslems had to have bags of cash which in all likelyhood came from America via Saudi Arabia. We are paying for our own conversion to a new religion (for us that is). What a deal, using a huge UK church to instill the maximum psychological effect on the target dhimmi population. After those two beautiful spires are equiped with mezzuins, the hapless population will eventually become accustomed to a huge Islamic Mosque, a former dead Christian church, calling to prayer in Arabiac and slowly aclimate to their new Islamic overlords.

I want to know if anyone has a link showing the flyer which we can read. It was said to be from the BNP and is racist. I think there were people creating false flyers to further discredit them. I will admit however that I do not know if they are racist, intolerant nazi's that they are accused of being because I never paid any attemntion to the BNP. Does anyone know what they are really all about?

I don's know much about them either, surely the community has a right to protest a mosque in their town. Is there some respectable org who could support their stand.

UK is like other places in Europe falling in the battle, we have to fight.

OT

I just want to make a point. Lately several readers have objected to being referred to as "infidels". This is my take on it, anyhow.

Being an "infidel" does NOT mean that you do not believe in the One True God (who is NOT "allah"). It means that you are an "unbeliever" in the demonic moon-"god" "allah" of the satanic blood cult of islam. Therefore, you can wear your "Infidel" label with pride.

I do!

CGW

The solution for this kind of irritating application of the law is to change the law by introducing the reciprocity clause. It is indignant to hear that the diplomatic missions of the West in Saudi Arabia have to resort to all sorts of humillating tricks to reunite for religious services in places that cannot be called a church while the Saudi money innundates our soil and mosques grow in it like mushrooms. Lets admit it: we are a bunch of dhimmidiots!

Do not underestimate the British National Party simply because of their repulsive ideology and the tactics they use to create social tensions. they are sophisticated and well-financed, experienced and well-organized. The BNP is the vanguard of the struggle against dhimmitude in Briatain at this time. they appear to be stupid, brutal, and thuggish. Many of them are, but many othedrs are smart and eneergetic, genuine intellectuals who've gone right off the rails. And they are leading our force. We, as contributors to the discussion and propaganda movement at Jihadwatch, are in the dark. The BNP is the light leading our anti-dhimmitude movement. Too bad for us.

It's not the fault of contributors at JW that the BNP is leading the charge. BNP members are not in any way better than we are at what they do: they are only different in that they are organized and willing to act in public; and the truth is that though Spencer provides a public-access forum here, we are really a private group: we do the hand-wringing and knuckle-chewing. The BNP is not a better able group than we are. But until we organize in public we are doomed to remain spectators watching jihad aqnd the BNP acting in our stead.

If any of you wish to take some initiative in your community, you may contact susan_b, and through her, me, so I can forward you at least a beginning of a public campaign process. A couple of our contributors have privately taken stepsw to recruit large numbers of sympathetic people to our cause. At this time we're still embryonic, and it is only time that seperates us from growth into a movement that will over-take all of our opposition.

Skin-head thugs have a definite advantage over many of our writers here in that they know that if there is opposition to them on the streets they have fellow skin-heads with placards taped to 2x2s. They know that one must carry vaseline to smear on their faces to counter-act c-4 gas in case of a riot. They know enough to bring football helmets for the game afterward. They know things we might not know at this time, but they arfe not smarter or better able than us in any real way. They do have organization and high motivation.

If you care to do some foot work in your area, safe stuff that shouldn't bring you into contact with anyone scarey, contact susan_b. From there I will do whatever I am able to provide you with the first of what I hope will be a set of ready-made flyers you can use to leaflet your neighborhoods.

If we do not take some steps toward defending our positons in the social mix, then the BNP will attract those who would otherwise come here for their marching orders. We have something better to offer the public. The fact is that if we don't offer it to them they'll accept whatever alternative there is in their hands.

If you let this appeal pass, I'll come back at you again. If you simply cannot rouse yourself to do anything ever, then I'll be forced to join the BNP myself, God help us.

I want to know if anyone has a link showing the flyer which we can read. It was said to be from the BNP and is racist. I think there were people creating false flyers to further discredit them.

Posted by: Andrew at December 27, 2004 11:38 AM

Gold Star for You today!!

Part of the American Tribe
Squirrel Hunter
Spider Killer
God Bless the USA and her Fighting Forces and ALL who Fight with her give them Strength,Wisdom,Sight, and Courage to Crush ALL Islamic Terrorist and ALL who Support them Amen

"Gold Star for You today!!"

Well thank you very much Catherine.

I'm with sonofwalker you have to fight them like in WW2 we didn't trust the Russians but they were willing to fight the same foe??

Like the mussis today are useing all to fight us we have to stop fighting each other to take on this enemy!!

Stop Fighting yourselfs and don't fall for the kitman shit??

they are not the Vitims they[mulsums] are the enemy!!!

We have been waiting for any to come forward and say what the terrorist do is wrong and we are still waiting??

here is what they tell each other to say to Us what they think are all stupid??

THEY ARE ALL PART OF IT!!

http://www.ci-ce-ct.com/Feature%20articles/02-12-2002.asp
Taqiyya and kitman: The role of Deception in Islamic terrorism
Tradecraft. Persona. Deception. Disinformation. Cover: Western operational terms and techniques. But, Islamic terrorists have their own terms: taqiyya (pronounced tark-e-ya) : precautionary dissimulation or deception and keeping one’s convictions secret and a synonymous term, kitman: mental reservation and dissimulation or concealment of malevolent intentions...
Taqiyya and kitman or ‘holy hypocrisy’ has been diffused throughout Arabic culture for over fourteen hundred years since it was developed by Shiites as a means of defence and concealment of beliefs against Sunni unbelievers. As the Prophet said: 'he who keeps secrets shall soon attain his objectives.’
The skilful use of taqiyya and kitman was often a matter of life and death against enemies; it is also a matter of life and death to many contemporary Islamic terrorists. As so often in the history of Islam, a theological doctrine became operational.
During the Spanish inquisition, Sunni Moriscos attended mass and returned home to wash their hands of the ‘holy water’. In operational terms, taqiyya and kitman allowed the ‘mujahadeen ’ to assume whatever identity was necessary to fulfill their mission; they had doctrinal and theological and later jurisprudential sanction to pretend to be Jews or Christians to gain access to Christian and Jewish targets: ‘the mujahadeen can take the shape of the enemy’.
Taqiyya is common to both Shiite and Sunni Muslim discourse and has significant implications for understanding Islamic fundamentalism and terrorist operations. The theory and practice of counter terrorism would be counter productive, indeed pointless, and even harmful, without reference to taqiyya and kitman and the crucial role of deception ranging from Islamic jurisprudence to Al Qaeda training manuals, which carry detailed instructions on the use of deception by terrorists in Western target countries.
According to Christian ethics lying is a sin; In Islamic jurisprudence and theology, the use of taqiyya against the unbelievers is regarded as a virtue and a religious duty

"Verily the most honourable of you in the sight of God is the most pious among you; verily, God is knowing, aware!" 49:13
Shi'a interpret the phrase above as "he among you "
Like many Islamic concepts taqiyya and kitman were formed within the context of the Arab-Islamic matrix of tribalism, expansionary warfare and conflict. Taqiyya has been used by Muslims since the 7th century to confuse and split 'the enemy’. A favored tactic was ‘deceptive triangulation’; to persuade the enemy that jihad was not aimed at them but at another enemy. Another tactic was to deny that there was jihad at all. The fate for such faulty assessments by the target was death.
Sydney NSW Australia: 2 November 2002Sheik

Sheik Taj el-Din al Hilaly, the controversial Grand Mufti of Australia, is enjoying lunch with his trusted assistant Keysar Trad. The journalist writing of the meeting with the Sheik noted:
'Several times, when direct responses to questions about passages in the Koran begged a simple yes or no, both men preferred to avoid the issues by talking about the difficulties of translating passages from Arabic to English.’
Referring to the Sheikhs blithe dismissal of his virulent anti-Semitic remarks in 1998, the journalist reflected:
'I can only muse at the facility of my guest, who has also praised suicide bombers in more recent times, to dismiss his notorious and abominable remarks with such ease and without actual apology. It seems clear that he is considering the way his remarks will be construed by the Sunday Telegraph’s huge and influential audience when they are translated into Arabic for Muslims to debate. He’s walking a tightrope.'
The skilled journalist should not be puzzled as the Sheik's target audiences were Australians and not Arab readers. Taqiyya, or dissimulation, is a key feature in Islamic public discourse and confuses Western audiences. It is meant to, according to the Koran:
'Let not the believers take for friends or helpers unbelievers rather than believers; if any do that; they shall have no relation left with Allah except by way of precaution….that ye may guard yourselves’. 3:28
Al Taqiyya is with tongue only; not the heart. A believer can make any statement as long as the ‘heart is comfortable'. The 9/11 terrorists lived and visited in the United States for two years before the 9/11 attacks. How did they acculturate? By the use of taqiyya. Meaning: I hate you but I smile at you-in public.
Taqiyya and ‘Outwitting’ in contemporary political discourse and debates
Outwitting: Islamic spokesmen commonly use taqiyya as a form of ‘outwitting’. The matter under discussion is not to be debated or discussed; rather the opponent is to ‘outwitted’ through taqiyya, by diversion of the subject and obfuscation aided at times with a mystical reference to God or Allah.
The claim that difficulties in translating from Arabic to English make communication with non-Arab speakers difficult or impossible, is another form of outwitting. The tactical use of a translator offers considerable advantage
Role playing as victim: Claiming to be 'the victim’ of religious discrimination and intolerance during debate or discussion is another form of distraction and ‘outwitting’.
Manipulating ambiguity: Sheik Hilaly of Sydney, Australia is on public record as (a) ’condemning’ the 9/11 attacks in ambiguous terms and (b) praising suicide and martyr operations However, Islamic spokesmen will rarely condemn a specific act of terrorism and direct questions will be skillfully evaded.
Diversion: For example, questions relating to the 9/11 terrorists attacks will be diverted by a causally irrelevant counter reference to the plight of the Palestinians, the nefarious role of Israel and US foreign policy and support for Israel as ‘causes’ of terrorism.
Anti-Semitism, a core belief of Islamic fundamentalism is also skillfully diverted by misleading and exaggerated historical references to the alleged status enjoyed by Jews and non-believers under Islamic rule, thereby deflecting critical examination of the virulent contemporary Islamic anti-Semitism.
Demanding ’evidence’: Islamic spokesmen practice a form of taqiyya defined in psychology as ‘cognitive denial’ by repetitive and extreme requests for ‘evidence’ and ‘proof’ of alleged terrorist acts, which they know cannot be disclosed.
Tactical denial: Rather than admitting that a proposition concerning a state of affairs can be partly true, an Islamic spokesman will deny a claim or proposition in absolute terms. For example, “It is impossible to be a Muslim and a terrorist’ , which is false and ‘Islam forbids suicide’, which is true, but irrelevant as suicide or martyrdom attacks are not forbidden in the Koran.
Exploiting cognitive dissonance: Islamic spokesman tend to be baffle television interviewers and puzzle viewers as they resort to double talk ‘clichés and platitudes’ concerning Islam. A state of cognitive dissonance-holding two contradictory beliefs and attempting to resolve them- is induced in viewers as they attempt to process the claim that Islam is a peaceful religion with the dissonant facts of Islamic terrorist acts and operations.
The Islamic ’defence’ script: Islamic spokesmen repeat the same predictable platitudes concerning Islam in London as do Islamic spokesmen in Seattle and often appear to follow a prepared script from “Islam is tolerant and peace loving’ to the claim by Islamic spokeswomen invariably claiming that wearing the veil offers them more freedom (women in Muslim countries are therefore ‘freer’ than women in western countries), thereby precluding further examination into the real status of women under Islamic rule
Islamic platitudes are also echoed uncritically by Western politicians, for example ”A small group of fundamentalists have hijacked a great religion’. The timely, skilful, misleading and diversionary theme of the ‘hijacking’ of Islam was introduced into public, political and media discourse by an Islamic ‘spokesmen’ in the United States shortly after the 9/11 terrorist attacks.
The “Islam has been hijacked’ diversionary theme is now a conventional media and political reference deflecting attention from empirical and historical examination of the doctrinal, political and religious continuity of Islamic terrorism. A related theme that a small minority of Muslims are engaged in terrorism is utterly irrelevant as Islamic terrorism is always perpetrated by ‘small minorities’ or more accurately’ small groups’.
Taqiyya as impressions and perceptions management
The tactical use of children: Australia television viewers noted that interviews with terrorist suspects raided by security authorities invariably featured veiled women holding small children or a baby as they protested their husband’s innocence and attested to his innate goodness. Trembling fingers pointed to ‘damage’ to the family residence. In some interviews the suspect / father holds the child, whilst denying involvement or knowledge of terrorism in any sense of the word: an example of taqiyya in the age of impressions and perception management.
Taqiyya and the Deceptive use of Jihad: The contemporary political meaning of jihad is clear: it is Jihad of the sword. Egyptian-based Islamic fundamentalists, from whom Bin Laden recruited his key operatives, believe jihad is the fourth pillar of Islam and is a binding belief and integral to the faith. Claiming that Jihad is a subjective and psychological state of personal struggle is taqiyya. In contemporary terms, Jihad means - holy war - against unbelievers and it in this context that Al Qaeda training manuals refer to Jihad as ‘Holy War’.
The study of taqiyya and kitman is crucial to an understanding of Islamic fundamentalism and terrorism ranging from the issuing of false terrorist threats, operational and strategic disinformation issued by Al Qaeda in the form of ‘intelligence chatter’ to the use of taqiyya and kitman by terrorists during interrogation and the use of systematically misleading expressions concerning Islam and terrorism by Muslim ‘spokesmen’

JUST THREW THIS IN TO SHOW WE ARE WINNING!!
http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2004/12/27/94800.shtml
Reprinted from NewsMax.com
Monday, Dec. 27, 2004 9:46 a.m. EST
Troops Blame Congress for Armor Shortage
The majority of U.S. soldiers do not blame President Bush or Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld for a shortage of body armor in Iraq, but instead say Congress should be held responsible - according to a new poll by the Military Times.

Sixty percent blame Congress for the shortage of body armor in the combat zone, reports USA Today in its coverage of the Times survey. In more bad news for congressional Iraq war critics, 63 percent of active duty personnel said they approve of the way President Bush is handling the war.
Further confounding media attempts to demoralize the troops, 66 percent of soldiers surveyed say the war is worth fighting.
In addition, 87 percent of soldiers say they're satisfied with their jobs and, if given the choice today, only a quarter of troops surveyed say they'd leave the service. The latter number is particularly impressive, considering that nearly half say they expect to be there more than five years.
The Military Times Poll surveyed 1,423 active-duty subscribers to Air Force Times, Army Times, Navy Times and Marine Corps Times in late November and early December. The poll has a margin of error of +/—2.6%

Part of the American Tribe
Squirrel Hunter
Spider Killer
God Bless the USA and her Fighting Forces and ALL who Fight with her give them Strength,Wisdom,Sight and Courage to Crush ALL Islamic Terrorist and ALL who Support them Amen

From the BNP Website:

On current demographic trends, we, the native British people, will be an ethnic minority in our own country within sixty years.

On issue after issue, the views of the majority of British people have been ignored and overridden by a Politically Correct 'élite' which thinks it knows best. On immigration, on Capital Punishment, on the surrender of British sovereignty to the EU and in numerous other areas, democracy has been absent as Labour, Tories and Lib-Dems conspire in election after election to offer the British people no real choice on such vital issues.

Their website seems OK enough. I am still researching what it is exactly that makes them "skinheads". From what I can see there may be some substance to the claim that they are radical, but I can't effectively judge from the media sources so far because I am suspicious at the overusage and misapplication of the following putrid propaganda terms:

1) Racist
2) Intolerant
3) The Community
4) Assylum Seekers
5) Multicultural
6) Diversity
7) Islamophobe
8) Offended
9) Asian
10) Islam is a Religion of Peace

http://www.bnp.org.uk/policies/policies.htm

Maybe some people from Britain can give me the local impression of thre British National Party and tell me how they are perceived in the UK. Are they genuinely deplorable or is their position attacked because of the genuinely intolerant ideology, multiculturalism?

Any info would be appreciated.

This seemed somewhat objective:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_National_Party

Posted by: Andrew at December 27, 2004 07:01 PM

I liked the Bedding they were selling?

From What I raed they seam to be going through what a lot of Americans Are going theroug if you Stand up you are called names??

Here is a story in their Paper??

http://www.bnp.org.uk/freedom/3dec04.html
What a fuss over a racist gesture
TELEVISION news bulletins can find plenty of time to report on racist gestures and noises made at one of our football grounds and the police can find extra resources for tracking down the culprits.
All this effort and media coverage to just protect the feelings of a few highly-paid black footballers.
There's no such fuss over the death of Lee Martin, a young soldier from the 1st King's Regiment, savagely beaten outside a take-away in Chorlton-cum-Hardy in an actual racist attack.
The 21 year-old had just graduated with honours at his army training camp in Catterick, North Yorkshire, and had received a Best Endeavour award for a solo mission into 'enemy' territory. His bravery earned him an extra week's leave from commanding officers but within days of returning home to Chorlton he was beaten savagely by two men outside a take-away on Wilbraham Road.
One witness described how the two thugs repeatedly kicked Lee's head like a football, "as if they were running up to take a spot-kick".
Lee never regained consciousness and after eight days in a coma, he died of a brain haemorrhage at Salford's Hope Hospital on Tuesday, April 13th.
His killers still haven't been found.
Why is there no media outcry over a racist murder, when they make such a palaver over a racist gesture?
Could it be something to do with the fact that Lee Martin was white and Manchester Police have described his killers as "of Asian appearance

WE HAVE SEEN MANY STORYS HERE AT JW/DW IN THE SAME MIND SO I KNOW I AINT NO RASIST??

Part of the American Tribe
Squirrel Hunter
Spider Killer
God Bless the USA and her Fighting Forces and ALL who Fight with her Amen

PS
Nothing wrong with putting the Christ back in Christmas!!

"crèche facilities, mother and toddler groups, social activities and English classes for women... He said people from all ethnic backgrounds or religious beliefs would be welcome."

What a load of crap that is! I lived in England for 26 years; if this place gives such services to the wider community, it would be the first in Great Britain to do so (or Europe? or the world?)
These Muslims spit so many lies that I don't know if they even understand what the truth is any more.

The problem with the BNP is that they are National Socialist. 10 Years ago, their main enemies were Jews, the IRA and Communists. Typical KKK stuff.

Since 9/11, verbally attacking Israel would make them sound too much like the hated Pakistanis, and the IRA and Communists are not an issue these days. So the Muslims are a great new populist target. I doubt the BNP's sincerity. Back in the 1980's and 1990's I never read about them specifically attacking Islam any more than Hinduism, Sikhism or whatever. Their vilification extends to all non whites.

Strangely enough, half (or maybe two thirds) of what they say about Muslims is true, but I still think that most of their leadership think that Mein Kampf was the best book ever written. I think that their anti-Islamic stance is a bit of a political Trojan Horse for a lot of real fascism. However, the way they are getting censored I think is very questionable.

The BNP are the re-packaged National Front, who were the re-packaged British Nazi Party. Historically they were against Jews and any non English/British immigrant, especially non white. They backed off the Jews once we had large scale black immigration, then backed off the black and other Asian communities to concentrate on Moslems.
As I said in a post (the first on the subject of this new mosque) last week I weep that I should find myself in agreement with so much that they say on the subject of Moslem attempts at world domination. Recently, I believe, they have had talks with Sikh groups of angry young men to explore common ground.
I would be reluctant to get too close to them personally because I have a good memory. I think Hugh's response to my post pointing me towards UKIP was a good suggestion.

The BNP are filth, they are a totally cranky bunch.
Nick griffin their leader has a memorable line when he opens his speeches "I smoke more than a chimney at aushwitz"
I am sure that many of you have seen his speech in a pub when he quotes the sura in the koran that justifies rape of female prisoners.
Did any of you see the nutter jon tyndals speech afterwards ?
For any non uk memberes, Jon Tyndall is a nazi, he dresses up in all the black leather/storm trooper gear.
Please give them a wide berth.
I think a far better stategy would be to contact sikh/hindu/buddhist/parsi/christian groups who cannot be accused of racism when criticising islam, for the very simple reason We know the nature of the beast and have no understanding of political correctness.

I have posted a few links below:

http://www.hinduhumanrights.org/

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/000783.php

http://www.infoisrael.net/cgi-local/text.pl?source=4/b/viii/archives/150220041
http://www.indianexpress.com/full_story.php?content_id=40236

There are enough allies out there without us having to resort to the BNP