Here is a piece about General John Abizaid, who seems in many ways to have a clearer idea of the nature and intentions of the jihadists than do many of his peers. And he may be right that "if ordinary Arabs could see the cruelty and repression of these Taliban-style jihadists, they would reject them." But I hope he is also reckoning with the power of their ideology, based so firmly on the Qur'an and Sunnah. If he doesn't combat that, "ordinary Muslims" are likely to continue to be sympathetic to the jihadists. From the Quad City Times, with thanks to Nicolei:
America’s enemies in this Long War, he argues, are what he calls “Salafist jihadists.“ That’s his term for the Muslim fundamentalists who use violent tactics to try to re-create what they imagine was the pure and perfect Islamic government of the era of the prophet Muhammad, who is sometimes called the “Salaf.” Osama bin Laden is the best known of the Salafist extremists, but Abizaid argues that the movement is much broader and more diffuse than al-Qaida. It’s a loose network of like-minded individuals who use 21st-century technology to spread their vision of a 7th-century paradise.Salafist preachers see themselves as part of a vanguard whose mission is to radicalize other Muslims to overthrow their leaders. Abizaid likens them to Lenin, Trotsky and the other Bolshevik leaders. He urges us to think of today’s Islamic world, wracked by waves of violence, as akin to Europe in the revolutionary year of 1848. The Arab world’s spasms of anarchy and terror, like those in Europe 150 years ago, are part of a process of social change — in which an old order is crumbling, and a new one is struggling to be born.
Abizaid’s historical analogies are helpful because they stretch our thinking. The wealthy Saudi jihadist bin Laden begins to seem a bit like 19th-century anarchist Prince Peter Kropotkin, who similarly wanted to use revolutionary violence to purge what he viewed as a corrupt order. On this broad canvas of historical change, the time horizon isn’t years, but decades.
If the United States is fighting an ideological vanguard similar to the Bolsheviks — whose leaders will never surrender or negotiate — then it will have to capture or kill them. That suggests a dirty, drawn-out conflict in which each side tests the other’s will and staying power. It’s not the sort of war that democracies are usually good at fighting, but among Abizaid’s team of advisers, you hear the same phrase over and over: “A lot of bad guys are going to have to die.”
Yet because the battlefield is society itself, the United States cannot think of the struggle in purely military terms. Centcom’s 1,000 troops who are digging wells and performing other reconstruction tasks in the Horn of Africa may be a better model for success than the 150,000 soldiers hunkered down in Iraq. And because it is a war of transformation, comparable to Europe’s hundred-year process of modernization in the 19th century, the United States must above all be patient.
Abizaid is frustrated that Arab journalists haven’t provided a more critical picture of life in places where Islamic insurgents have gained control, such as Fallujah. He’s convinced that if ordinary Arabs could see the cruelty and repression of these Taliban-style jihadists, they would reject them. “They are the most despicable enemy I’ve ever seen,” he told European and Arab leaders who gathered in Bahrain to talk about Persian Gulf security. “They operate from mosques, they behead people, they have killed far more Muslims than non-Muslims.“
Abizaid believes the winning strategy, in Iraq and across the Islamic world, is to isolate the Salafist vanguard from ordinary Muslims who want the better, freer life that prosperity and connectedness can bring. That means breaching the gaps between rich nations and poor ones, and preventing terrorists from establishing bases of operations, in the way bin Laden did in Afghanistan. “The clear military lesson of Afghanistan is that we cannot allow the enemy to establish a safe haven anywhere,” he says.
OT
Sorry to go OT so early, but this was buried on an old thread ("Algerian . . .") and I didn't want it to go unanswered, as it is part of a continuing pattern.
"Timbo" posted:
"Many of you get very angry when other countries say "no" to the USA, don't you?
Let me explain...
If you view other peoples with contempt ("Axis of Envy" - "home of Hitler", blah blah) and if you want the world to dance to your tune ("France's grandiose plans to make the European Union into a global rival of the United States" -how dare they take your power!) then you're no better than Muslims.
I saw on Fox News that over 50% of young Canadians think that America is a bad country. I would not worry about the Saudis hating you, but Canada? Canada! It was their parents who probably educated them in this. When the Canadians start hating you, I think its time to ask serious questions. The root of Anti-Americanism (me thinks) is your nation's moronic foreign policy over the last 50 years.
For example, check this out from the BBC (that infamous "egregiously inaccurate" organization, from that crappy little island that gave you programmable computers, TV’s, trains, trial by jury, the internal combustion engine, penicillin, the theory of gravity, the theory of evolution, and Shakespeare) on how the USA helped create al Qaeda:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/programmes/assignment.shtml
But hey, what the hell do the British know about anything!
Posted by: Timbo at January 1, 2005 08:35 PM"
My response:
Timbo:
"Your flagrant, blatant anti-Americanism is out of place here. This is an anti-jihad forum, but the majority of your posts denigrate the U.S. and are detrimental to the Common Cause that we have established here. If your goal is to just relentlessly bash America, as it seems to be, there are plenty of other fora where you will be welcomed with open arms, but such off-topic ranting in unwelcome here. Your focus is consistently against those whom you should see as your allies against the islamic Threat. As it is, you are of no worth to us with your present mindset. Your posts are more reminiscent of many islamist posters we've had as visitors than of anyone truly committed to the Triumph of Reason and Western Civilization.
I personally don't care how you feel about America. But if you can't put differences aside and join with us to fight the islamic Threat, you really don't belong here. I'm certain that another forum will be better suited to your worldview.
Posted by: CGW at January 2, 2005 06:45 AM"
And Franze aptly added:
"America is hated because many countries wanted to be the boss and being the boss is unpopular
Posted by: Franze at January 2, 2005 07:03 AM"
I am Canadian, and Timbo's claims are not accurate. I understand that America has made mistakes, as has every other country.
I would only want the most powerful country on the planet to also be the country that provides the most personal freedoms than any other country on the planet. For this Canadian, I feel blessed to be America's neighbor.
Moose
Thanks, Moose. That means a lot.
Double thanks!, Moose. Hey Timbo, get a life. You're living in the dark ages pal. Let me tell you something -- I'm over here in Afghanistan with 1000's of Americans because we appreciate and value LIBERTY! -- you listening, Timbo -- and we would like to share LIBERTY with the folks here that have been oppressed for far too long. And now in Indonesia, well those "stingy" Americans are at it again -- LEADING the relief effort in a predominantly Muslim/ Hindu corner of the world. Timbo, Americans do what we do because we "Believe in doing the RIGHT Thing!" and we are a Nation Blessed by the One True God -- this IS the reason we are the GREATEST COUNTRY on this Planet. You can come out of the dark ages or continue to wallow in your current delusional state of being.
Bringing Freedom to a Dark Corner of the World --
The whole of the West and any muslim free agendas are in this together, if one country goes its the beggining of the end for all of us.
Cheers
Timbo looks like a typical Marxist, communist, socialist, ect. I suggest for everyone to read the new David Horowitz book called "Unholy Alliance" about the connections between the jihadists and the american left. I think it goes beyond that and explains communists like Timbo and others in Europe as well. It also shows how these people (Timbo and the jihadists) think the same when it comes to the West and the desire and need for it to be destroyed to create a utopian fantasy society. Its amazing how much the delusional marxists views of reality have become so well entrenched in the west. Here is one of them that I think is part of what is behind communists like Timbo:
"Everything that exists deserves to perish" Karl Marx
meredith:
I beg to differ.
Some Western nations will fight on to the last breath for freedom, even if they stand alone and last.
I believe that the USA is one.
If it weren't for the United States of America this world would be a much sadder place.
Yes. it has made mistakes and it will make more but it is, unlike any former so called world leaders, including England, France, Spain, Portugal, Rome, Greece and Islam, a benign and peace seeking country without any aspirations of conquest and colonization.
It has done a great deal to aid those countries in need, including its former enemies who, true to form have turned against their saviour and benefactor.
As a Canadian I am grateful to have the USA as our neighbour. Sure we have our arguments and disagreements but unlike almost all other countries in the world, we have not resorted to arms.
As for the Fox survey, the young are always anti --- anything. When they mature and learn to think and analyze they almost certainly will change their thinking.
I would like to see the questions on that survey.
The USA is one of the very few truly free, democratic countries and it is willing to use its wealth and energies and its great people to preserve and advance the freedoms it enjoys.
Timbo is Anti Jihad as well,give him a chance.
CGW,
Im Aussie with German, Dutch and Scottish Ancestors, and yeh Australia has toughness to it's culture and attitude as well and I expect we will stick the war out.
To me it looks like the fight against dhimminisation is only just beginning as we see how it snuck up on Europe and we comprehend its insidious nature and then try to alert our friends and fellow citizens.
meredith:
To my mind, Australia is our #1 ally and I for one am grateful for it.
CGW
I suggest that we ignore the trolls and the morons and go to work on rolling back the jihad surrounding us. We just got a letter from a man living and working in Afghanistan. I think his insights are somewhat more important to us than the idiot rants we get from other quarters.
I've written frequently on the conflation of the Left and the Right into the new Red Fascism. to the best of my knowledge, I'm the only one here who regularly quotes Hegel, Feuerbach, Marx, Bakunin, and Lenin. If you want a serious discussion of this topic, write to susan_b and I'll get back to you. Otherwise, forget the trolls and let's work on the serious issues at hand.
I direct your attention to the post I made on organizing a conference for this coming July. If you'll turn your attention to that rather than to juvenilia here, we might do better in the long term.
The thing is that the above topic is extremely interesting, and if we discuss it with some depth we might find some good insights arising from the readership here.
General Abizaid’s poignant analysis of the Salafist movement is right on. The General’s understanding of the overall problem in the Middle East far surpasses the ignorance and indolence that seems to prevail at Foggy Bottom (good luck to Ms. Rice in cleaning up that mess!).
The General’s frustration with Arab journalists for not telling it like it is in places like Fallujah is understandable, however, we seem to have the same problem with graduates of the American schools of journalism here in the US. They tell the public the story from their own political perspective - probably also colored in the Middle East by a religious perspective, and as well by propagated lies that the journalists themselves have bought into.
But the newspapers are only part of the problem. Television gets a much wider audience in the Middle East, and Arab TV seems to have a plethora of Dan Rathers feeding the public with lies about Iraq, messages of hate from the Koran and the Hadith, and even collaboration with the terrorists in broadcasting their propaganda tapes. And they give free reign to hate-filled Imans propagating their messages of death to the Infidels - there is certainly no Fox News ethic of “fair and balanced” reporting. Tens of millions in the Middle East who may not be able to read, hear this daily propaganda pumped at them again and again. Finally, like the Germans of the 1930s, they begin to believe it.
The American Defense Forces need to counterattack in the area of Psy-ops with powerful TV stations of their own, broadcasting in both Arabic and Persian to the entire Middle East, hammering 24/7 with our side of the story.
The Psy-ops effort cannot be left to the morons in the State Department who are sending be-bop music to Iran. This is a wartime need, just like iintelligence, nfantry, armored cavalry, and air and sea attack forces, and requires military dedication to the mission; not only to assure success of the endeavor, but to tell the true story of the United States and US Defense Forces, and to project a powerful image of those arms as forces for peace as well as war.
Bolshevik revolution offers analogies for 21st-century Islamic jihad
This is a very good analogy for Jihadists and Islam in general. The economist Ludwig von Mises spent a great deal of time studying why socialism does not work. He concluded that economic calculation under a socialist system was impossible. He believed that you needed a market that was free to set prices according to supply and demand and with no coercion in the setting of these prices. A “free” market. He was speaking about socialism but the same thinking can be applied to Islam and an Islamic dictatorship. Instead of consulting books containing the flawed thoughts of Marx or Lenin these Islamists will be consulting the ravings of Mohamed to guide the productive output of the economy. Instead of entrepreneurs borrowing money at interest and then investing it to get a rate of return higher than the rate of interest demanded by the lender, you will have corrupt mullahs and their favored cronies printing money and investing it in dubious ventures which will usually result in a destruction of wealth, not the creation of more wealth. How will they know which goods to produce, which means of production is the most efficient at producing the needed goods? How will they choose which materials to purchase and at what price? What kind of training will the workers need? Who will invest the time and capital needed to discover new technologies? How much labour should be used for which line of production? I doubt that the mullahs know how important capital accumulation is, or how to go about achieving it. These are all the same problems the socialists could not overcome in Soviet Russia, and they are still problems for places such as Zimbabwe and even Canada to a lesser extent.
That’s my rant for the day.
General Abizaid should be replaced. He is an Arab being asked to fight his own ancestors. It was unfair to put him in that position. Also his actions of not requesting more troops from the git go was a monumental error.
His inability to recognoze ISLAM IDEOLOGY in General is another monumental travesty. He is blaming but a few. EVERYONE it seems are saying ISLAM has been hi-jacked by a few.
ITS WRONG. Islam in of itself is one of the worst CULTS ever created. It is the DEVIL HIMSELF.
General Patton:
Completing your words:
"It also shows how these people (Timbo and the jihadists) think the same when it comes to the West and the desire and need for it to be destroyed to create a utopian fantasy society. Its amazing how much the delusional marxists views of reality have become so well entrenched in the west."
I wish to add: The problem with our Left is what killed the dinosaurs: a desire to plod on to oblivion in a rapidly evolving world.
M.O.T.: Your words referred to USA:
"...a benign and peace seeking country without any aspirations of conquest and colonization.
It has done a great deal to aid those countries in need, including its former enemies who, true to form have turned against their saviour and benefactor."
If I had to make a judgement about a country to discern whether it has a 'clean soul' or not, I would just analyse its behaviour in victory. When it comes to the United States of America, all I can say is find in it a magnanimous nation that lets and even helps their former enemies to reconstruct their economies and start a new, orderly, civilized and prosperous life.
When or where in History anyone can find such an egregious example? The answer is: nowhere.
Based on that alone I am and always shall be an American admirer...and defender.
Affectionately, from Spain.
Jimmie Bones:
You say: "Television gets a much wider audience in the Middle East, and Arab TV seems to have a plethora of Dan Rathers feeding the public with lies about Iraq, messages of hate from the Koran and the Hadith,..."
I say: Isn't it awkard that the followers of a religion that expressely forbids the recreation of figures corresponding to animated beings, love television so much? Isn't it one more example that demostrates the moronic nature of the automated souls all muzzies are?
Have always admired American 'Get up and Go', they have a dynamism and readiness to try new things which make 'em Superpower they are. Of course they have made mistakes in Foreign
Policy, which country hasn't - Britain's mistakes in Middle East are monumental like France in Africa and Dutch in Indonesia...
Would say that Timbo is the sort of chap who isn't happy anywhere - no country can live up to his idea of Utopia because a perfect country exists only in the imagination. My suggestion is he should try Iran for his next move....
Support listening to General Abizaid and what he says makes a lot of sense to me.Merely hunting down and catching Terrorists is not enough ; we must also win Propaganda war.