Jihad set to resume in Gaza

It amazes me how this is merely accepted as the routine. Israel must expect to be attacked, damn the peace to hell, and Egyptian and the so-called "Palestinian Authority" must collaborate with them.

Amazing.

Geoff

Jihad is eternal, never be deceived by it's false truces, pauses and treaties. Jihad is an eternal blight and pestilence. It ends only when Muhammad's cult ends.

This "hudna" was always an opportunity for Hamas, and other Palestinian groups to build up their terrorist forces and equipment for more effective future jihads against Israel. They live by the 36 articles of the Hamas charter which they say cannot be changed.

Oh yeah, the Jihad will escalate in Gaza... until the IDF buries it until a hail of Pittsburg steel. I hope Israel doesn't sit idly by while the "palestinians" are putting their rocket launchers in place.

Of course, when the shit hits the fan, and Israel does respond, look for "witnesses" to claim that Israel fired first, over-reacted, etc. etc.

KJ:

you may be correct about events in the Gaza, but omitted the part about the hoked-up source of righteous indignation that has to presage the violence so the usual suspects can say that they are only acting out of frustration over Israel's provocation (a la the famous Mohammed Al-Durrah case or Sharon's visit to the Temple Mount)

Palestinians want to attack Israel without Israel answering the attack. If Israel answers an attack IT IS AN OUTRAGE!!!

How dare Israel defend itself! How dare Israel target the architects of the slaughter of their children! Why, the checkpoints are an abomination. Palestinians want the freedom to murder Jews with impunity.

WTF!!

Palestinians suckle their children on Jew hatred, indoctrinate them with vile, murderous intention when other children their age are learning their ABC's. The schools they attend don't have maps of Israel and the festering hatred and wanton destruction of Jews and Israel is institutionally supported throughout the educational system -- pre-school through university level.

Palestinians are vicious, murdering liars. Their history is invented. They don't want to admit that they're in this swirling bloody sewage hole thanks to their rich Arab brethern.

If a Palestinian tells you they want to make peace it's time to stockpile weapons and watch your back!!

One more thing ...

I am completely dumbfounded by the behavior of not only the former biggest defender of the settlements, Ariel Sharon but the behavior, hypocrisy and duplicity of our President GWB.

GWB stated he would fight terrorism wherever he found it. Is that everywhere but Israel?

Why isn't GWB pushing the Iraqis to make peace with the nitwits blowing them up?

Why didn't he tell the Lebanese that they had to make nice with their occupiers? Why doesn't GWB offer the Taliban a peace treaty and some Afghan real estate?

Why the big push to transfer Jews off their land? And yes, it is their land! If it is not their land then Texas belongs to Mexico.

Weren't enough Jews killed in Oslo?

Has everyone gone insane? I thought it was pretty evident that you don't give into terrorism? The more you give the more you are viewied like a punk in prison.

I'm afraid we're headed back to the 1930's if we aren't already there yet.

Amen, Kemaste. Amen.

Watch the hand of G-d at work, and not necessarilly to the immediate benefit of the Jewish people.

Regards from Jerusalem.

Hamas says it all the time: the violence will end when the occupation ends. And that means the occupation of all land "from the river to the sea". Only Western Human Rights groups, pseudo-intellectuals, and those brainwashed by the BBC actually believe the narrative about a displaced people struggling in earnest for a national homeland living in peace beside a secure Israel.

Even Sue Blackwell in the UK readily acknowledges that she seeks the destruction of the "illegitimate" state of Israel, presumably by any means possible.

Why? Why are muslims forbidden to read the Bible? Think about that, please.

http://harakahdaily.net/article.php?sid=12851

Didn't the U.S. just authorize the sale of 100 bunker buster bombs to Israel?

I hope they arrive soon.

Use them wisely Israel.

Carolyn2...some Muslims cheat. If you go Yahoo's Islam chat, you would be surprised how many muslim "bible experts" there are. They are not in love with the bible...they do that in order to "try" and prove that Jesus is not God nor the son of God. Muslims must prove that Jesus was not God, because if he is, Allah isn't. It's almost funny, muslims who dont even know their own religion are experts at the Bible and Christianity. Of course their expertise is "slightly", flawed as they dont have the slightest idea what they are reading...

Well Hamas says they cannot have peace at any price.

The Israelis choice is then - what? The same one they were given in 1948 and earlier when the first Arab attacks started? To die, convert or become their own second-class citizens?

This is islamic tolerance.

Geoff

Muslim Group in France Is Fertile Soil for Militancy

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/04/28/international/europe/28tablighi.html

T.-DENIS, France - Raouf Ben Halima, 39, sleeps on his side, never on his stomach. He enters the bathroom leading with his left foot but puts his pants on leading with his right. Instead of using a fork when he eats, he uses his index finger, middle finger and thumb.

Mr. Halima is a member of the Tablighi Jamaat, or Preaching Party, a global army of Muslim missionaries helping to expand their religion and reinforce their faith. They believe that emulating the habits of the Prophet Muhammad is the surest way to restore Islam to its intended path.

So Mr. Halima and his associates shave their upper lips but let their beards grow. They wear their pants or robes above the ankle because the prophet said letting clothes drag on the ground is a sign of arrogance.

"Halfway between the knee and the ankle is best," Mr. Halima explains, sitting amid stacks of religious tracts in his small home.

His comments, made recently to a reporter during conversations about the growth of militant Islam, offered a rare window on the beliefs of a group that is unsettling to many here. The Tablighi are one of the primary forces spreading Islamic fundamentalism in Europe today, and many young Muslim men pass through the group on the way toward an extreme, militant interpretation of the religion.

Beyond that, little about the group is known.

The window Mr. Halima offered was open only briefly: he spoke only about his own experience and refused to accompany a reporter to France's main Tablighi mosque for fear of being seen breaching the sect's strict rules of secrecy.

European terrorism officials who follow Tablighi closely say they know many cases in which terrorists have emerged from the movement, but they say they have never been able to penetrate the group sufficiently to prove that it plays any direct role. "It is definitely fertile ground for breeding terrorism," said a French intelligence official who has traced many militants' religious awakening to their membership in the movement.

Zacarias Moussaoui, the only person to be charged in the United States in connection with the Sept. 11 attacks, was once a Tablighi adherent in France. Hervé Djamel Loiseau, a young Frenchman who died fleeing the 2001 American bombardment of Tora Bora in Afghanistan was, too. Djamel Beghal, an Algerian-born Frenchman and confessed Qaeda member recently convicted in Paris for plotting to blow up the American Embassy, was a Tablighi follower in the French town of Corbeil a decade ago.

The movement got its start in the mid-1920's when a man named Mawlana Muhammad Ilyas, disturbed by distortions of Islam in the face of India's predominant Hinduism, began preaching in the poor neighborhoods of Delhi. It is now considered the largest Muslim missionary movement in the world. Its yearly November gathering in Raiwind, Pakistan, may be second only to the hajj in drawing Muslims.

On the Continent, the group's main base is in France, where most of its adherents are North Africans, according to experts watching it. Introduced here in the early 1960's, it grew quickly during the 70's and 80's, one the country's few Islamic organizations at a time when Europe's economic slump had left many Muslim immigrants unemployed.

"They were the first Islamic movement in France and the rest of Europe to target young people who were destabilized," said Gilles Kepel, author of "The War for Muslim Minds." "They targeted young people who were lost in their identity, were involved in delinquency, drinking, petty crime, and proposed reorganizing their life."

Mr. Halima, a senior Tablighi activist who once spent a week with the movement's governing council in Pakistan, estimated that 50,000 to 100,000 people had passed through the Tablighi movement in France and that there were about 5,000 active members. But there is no way to confirm these figures.

Shortly after Islam's twilight prayer here, bearded and robed men stream out of the Tablighi's central mosque in France, a small two-story house freshly painted eggshell white not far from Mr. Halima's home.

Their approach to idle young men in this working-class town on the northern outskirts of Paris is usually the same: they offer a handshake, touch their hand to their heart, and ask, "Do you go to the mosque?"

Only occasionally do the missionaries return to the mosque with someone in tow.

Mr. Halima was once such a person. Now a cheerful proselytizer who publishes pamphlets promoting the Tablighi Jamaat and other aspects of fundamentalist Islam, he took a path to the Tablighi that may well be typical of European recruits. He said he was born to a Tunisian father and an American mother who divorced and moved to Britain when he was a child and brought up with no particular religious training. He began to seek spiritual sustenance by the time he left adolescence.

At 16, he met a Tablighi member in southwest London and soon attended a three-day mosque retreat. Before long, he was joining outings to visit other mosques across Britain as a missionary.

The Tablighi's obligation includes proselytizing 3 days every month and 40 days once a year. Every devoted Tablighi is also expected to make one four-month trip to Pakistan to study at the organization's central mosque.

"The Tablighi only care about bringing people back to Islam," Mr. Halima insisted. "We are not political." But he said Tablighi-sponsored trips to Pakistan put young men in contact with fundamentalists of many stripes, including adherents of Salafism, a fundamentalist school of Islam whose radical fringe advocates war against non-Muslims.

Abandoning the Tablighi during such trips is discouraged, he said, but there is no stigma for those who wished to leave for more radical groups later.

He acknowledged that young men wishing to migrate from the Tablighi to more militant forms of Islam had no trouble finding their way. "Everyone knows which mosques attract Salafists, and if you go and ask, it's easy to get into the jihadi network," he said.

He said most people touched by the Tablighi eventually moved on to practice a more moderate form of Islam, but of the hundreds that remain engaged in fundamentalism, he estimated, half are recruited by Salafists.

"The Salafists are very aggressive," Mr. Halima said, adding that they are growing faster than the Tablighi.

In the Tablighi's central mosque here, across a park from the 12th-century basilica where many of France's kings are interred, a young man with a long beard and a long stick watches over the tiled front room where visitors remove their shoes and those coming for prayer perform ablutions in communal sinks. In the small, carpeted worship room, the only decoration is a lone shelf of religious books and a row of clock faces showing the times of Islam's five daily prayers.

A group of bearded men sit on the floor, talking quietly beside a low wooden box that serves as a desk. Seeing a visitor, one of them gets up and introduces himself, whispering so as not to disturb another man praying in a corner. "Happiness is inside us all, you only need the right glasses to find it," he begins. "Those glasses are faith."

I sometimes wonder how committed muslims such as Shukri, can live in the US or other Western nations.

Muslims, particularly those who can be identified as muslims, are now viewed with a mixture of suspicion and contempt. If I or my family were made to feel this way, I would be out of the country and be back in my homeland or any muslim country, where I and family, would feel at home and at peace.

OT:
FRIENDS OF ISRAEL:

StandWithUs Denounces Britain Association of University Teacher's vote to Boycott Israeli Academics

LOS ANGELES (April 22 2005) The international education organization StandWithUs (SWU) denounced Britain's Association of University Teachers' (AUT) decision today to boycott Israeli academics. "We are deeply disturbed by this one-sided, politically inflammatory decision. The vote was the result of a combination of propaganda campaign and racism," stated StandWithUs National Director Roz Rothstein.

Britain's AUT voted to boycott academics from Israel's Bar Ilan University and Haifa University and is continuing to review Hebrew University's status. These measures fall neatly in line with demands by Palestinian academics for what they call a comprehensive boycott of "all Israeli academic and cultural institutions."

"This boycott movement is simply part of the war against Israel and its legitimacy. It is reminiscent of Nazi Germany when that regime banned Jewish academics and even denounced Jewish science and art," said Rothstein. " Now the AUT has voted to ban academics simply because they are Israeli citizens. They justify their decision by twisting the truth about Israel and its university system which in fact promotes freedom of ideas and encourages Arab-Israeli cooperation."

More at www.standwithus.com, including e-mail addresses to voice your condemnation of this despicable act of dhimmitude.

Found this link at LGF- thanks American Infidel.

http://www2.iiu.edu.my/deed/index_ie.html

Lots of useful information, the glossary is helpful.

Two more boy bombers nabbed in West Bank.

http://www.standwithus.com/news_post.asp?NPI=309

In case you're wondering, this is a violation of international law concerning the use of child soldiers.

Mike

International law applies only to the IDF and US armed services.

Muslims hold a perpetual "get out of jail free" card.

Phillistines, why don't you just go to work, and take care of your families? Wouldn't it be nice to not be raving, crazy mad for a day or two? I've always wondered why the "paleos" were worked up all the time, just go to http://www.memri.org/index.html
and watch the Friday sermons. That will explain why they never calm down, constant incitement. 5 times a day they hear that they must hate, they must kill. What a "religion".

Don't these pali-Pigs think before they (act) intifada? They'll get blown to smitherenes and rightfully so. Send 'em back to Jordan where they came from and still belong. Oh wait, Jordan doesn't want them. Neither does Syria, Egypt, Iran, Iraq, or any other muslim country. Ever wonder... why?

Palis = Animals

This is why Israel is building the fence... most zoo's I've been to have fences to keep the Humans safe from the Animals (in this case, Humans safe from pali's).

I say israel finishes the fence then places remote sentry guns on top of it , you walk within 15 feet of the fence, bam auto targeting machine gun.

Why? Why are muslims forbidden to read the Bible? Think about that, please.

http://harakahdaily.net/article.php?sid=12851

Posted by: Carolyn2 at April 28, 2005 04:09 PM

Because if a muslim DID read the Bible, they'd become enlightened to the Way, the Truth and the Life. And islam doesn't want to lose too many of its cult members (many of whom are unwillingly enslaved by the cult). The 'messenger' a/k/a Satan knows what he's doing. All we can do is pray for the souls that are unwilling participants in the cult of death, which is islam.

Another good islamic link:

http://www.islamic-state.org/

THEY SAY islam is not a religion

I sometimes wonder how committed muslims such as Shukri, can live in the US or other Western nations.

Muslims, particularly those who can be identified as muslims, are now viewed with a mixture of suspicion and contempt. If I or my family were made to feel this way, I would be out of the country and be back in my homeland or any muslim country, where I and family, would feel at home and at peace.

Posted by: DP111 at April 28, 2005 05:19 PM

I wonder why they come here at all.... to live in the belly of the "Great Satan". They're here to usurp and to purge, pillage, rape, sue, force their beliefs, open businesses tax free, live on the dole, pump out puppies at our expense, and ridicule their Host nation.

For the next millenium, all muslims will be viewed with suspicion and contempt, and it is a pipe dream to think that they'll leave here willingly. Unfortunately for them, their ENDING experience here in the West may well be worse than anything they could hope for in an islamic hell hole society.

1- Irrefutable samples where GOD Almighty Changed His Mind in the Bible:

Christians often object to Allah Almighty's Divine Command in the Noble Quran for substituting His previous Divine Revelations with the Noble Quran, and for substituting some of the Divine temporary Commands that He Revealed in the Noble Quran for specific situations with newer ones:

"None of Our revelations do We abrogate or cause to be forgotten, but We substitute something better or similar: Knowest thou not that God Hath power over all things? (The Noble Quran, 2:106)"

"We ordained therein for them: "Life for life, eye for eye, nose or nose, ear for ear, tooth for tooth, and wounds equal for equal." But if any one remits the retaliation by way of charity, it is an act of atonement for himself. And if any fail to judge by (the light of) what God hath revealed, they are (No better than) wrong-doers. (The Noble Quran, 5:45)"

An Example of the Noble Quran Abrogating the Bible: Noble Verse 24:33 "Let those who find not the wherewithal for marriage keep themselves chaste, until God gives them means out of His grace. And if any of your slaves ask for a deed in writing (to enable them to earn their freedom for a certain sum), give them such a deed if ye know any good in them: yea, give them something yourselves out of the means which God has given to you. But force not your maids to prostitution when they desire chastity, in order that ye may make a gain in the goods of this life. But if anyone compels them, yet, after such compulsion, is God, Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful (to them),"
ABROGATED:

Leviticus 25:44-46 "Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves. You may also buy some of the temporary residents living among you and members of their clans born in your country, and they will become your property. You can will them to your children as inherited property and can make them slaves for life, but you must not rule over your fellow Israelites ruthlessly."

Allah Almighty in the Noble Quran Commands the Muslims to free their slaves if the slaves want to be free, and to pay them money too so they can have a good jump start in life. In the Bible on the other hand, we see slaves not being allowed to be freed at all. Not only that, but they and their children must be inherited as slaves forever.

Please visit: Human equality and freedom in Islam Vs the Bible.

Let us look at some of GOD Almighty's serious and unexplainable abrogations in the Bible:

1- What saves the Bible followers?

Perhaps one of the worst and most serious contradictions that exist in the Bible is this one, because it is about Salvation!

What saves the Bible followers?

Righteousness alone?

" "But if you do warn the wicked man and he does not turn from his wickedness or from his evil ways, he will die for his sin; but you will have saved yourself. "Again, when a righteous man turns from his righteousness and does evil, and I put a stumbling block before him, he will die. Since you did not warn him, he will die for his sin. The righteous things he did will not be remembered, and I will hold you accountable for his blood. But if you do warn the righteous man not to sin and he does not sin, HE WILL SURELY LIVE because he took warning, and you will have saved yourself." (From the NIV Bible, Ezekiel 3:19-21)"

Jesus?

"that everyone who believes in him may have eternal life. "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. (From the NIV Bible, John 3:15-17)"

"I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. (From the NIV Bible, John 14:5-7)"

Please visit: Jesus GUARANTEED Paradise to all non-trinitarians.

2- "Thou Shalt not kill" -- OR-- "Kill all the children and non-virgin women!"

One of the Bible's 10 basic Pillars, the ten commandments, says: "Thou shalt not kill. (Exodus 20:13)." Yet, we see GOD Almighty Commanding His servants to not only kill the enemy's men, but also the innocent children and non-virgin women who have not done anything to anyone:

"Now kill all the boys [innocent kids]. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man. (Numbers 31:17-18)"

If Exodus 20:13 was supposed to be the basic pillar that prevents the Bible followers from committing murders against innocent people, then how is Numbers 31:17-18 justified then when GOD Almighty Himself nullified His own Commands and decided to kill innocent children and virgin girls perhaps by the thousands?

It is most ironic that GOD Almighty prohibited ordinary murders but supposedly allowed massacres to be done by the mass!!

Did you Know:

Extreme fundamentalists and racists from among the Christians such as Pat Robertson and George W. Bush who could careless about who dies and who doesn't in wars from innocent people are WELL KNOWN FOR THEIR CARELESSNESS about the deaths of innocent civilians? The 100s of thousands of innocent Iraqis that died in the previous Persian Gulf wars [1] [2] [3], and the deformed Iraqi children from the US' Deplete Uranium bombs clearly and irrefutably prove this.

Also, we must not forget that the biggest blood sheds and terrorism that took place throughout the world happened by Christians. World Wars I and II prove this. The white Christian race would literally wipe out nations out of the face of the earth if their interests are threatened.

We also must not forget about the African slaves who were forcefully brought to the US by the Europeans and were forced to embrace the polytheist trinitarian pagan christianity to at least earn their freedom.

Last and most definitely not least, we must not forget about the Native Americans (Red Indians) and how the white Christian man literally killed more than 90% of their population throughout the lands.

The white Christian man is the biggest terrorist this world ever known!!

3- GOD prohibiting brothers from marrying their biological sisters after He initially allowed it for Abraham and Sarah:

"And yet indeed she is my sister; she is the daughter of my father, but not the daughter of my mother; and she became my wife. (Genesis 20:12)"

"Cursed be he that lieth with his sister, the daughter of his father, or the daughter of his mother. And all the people shall say, Amen. (Deuteronomy 27:22)"

It is important to know that in the same book of Genesis, GOD Almighty did Speak directly with Abraham. For instance:

Genesis 12:1-3
1 The LORD had said to Abram, "Leave your country, your people and your father's household and go to the land I will show you.
2 "I will make you into a great nation and I will bless you; I will make your name great, and you will be a blessing.
3 I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you I will curse; and all peoples on earth will be blessed through you."

Yet, GOD never prohibited Abraham from marrying his own biological sister, Sarah!

So, Deuteronomy 27:22 is indeed an abrogation to the previous Law!

Please visit: The Bible claims that Sarah (Isaac's mother) was Abraham's biological sister.

4- Can the Bible followers work on Saturday or not?

No:

"Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people. (Exodus 31:14)"

"Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death. (Exodus 31:15)"

"Six days shall work be done, but on the seventh day there shall be to you an holy day, a sabbath of rest to the LORD: whosoever doeth work therein shall be put to death. (Exodus 35:2)"

Yes:

"And it was the sabbath day when Jesus made the clay, and opened his eyes. (John 9:14)"

John 7:22-24
22 Moses therefore gave unto you circumcision; (not because it is of Moses, but of the fathers;) and ye on the sabbath day circumcise a man.
23 If a man on the sabbath day receive circumcision, that the law of Moses should not be broken; are ye angry at me, because I have made a man every whit whole on the sabbath day?
24 Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.

Mark 6:1-3
1 And he went out from thence, and came into his own country; and his disciples follow him.
2 And when the sabbath day was come, he began to teach in the synagogue: and many hearing him were astonished, saying, From whence hath this man these things? and what wisdom is this which is given unto him, that even such mighty works are wrought by his hands?
3 Is not this the carpenter, the son of Mary, the brother of James, and Joses, and of Juda, and Simon? and are not his sisters here with us? And they were offended at him.

5- Jesus compromised his own teachings regarding Prayers. He commanded his followers to Pray in a certain way and he then compromised it by bowing down to GOD Almighty. He only prostrated to GOD Almighty once during his most desperate times with his face down to the ground, while we Muslims do it everyday in our 5-daily set of Prayers. He also did the "vain repetitions" ENDLESSLY all night long while he prohibited his followers from doing it.

The article is too long to post here. Therefore, please visit:

Jesus is a hypocrite for bowing down to GOD only during his desperate times.

Islam is the only solution and salvation! It's funny that even the Jesus of the corrupt bible prayed to GOD Almighty as we Muslims do by prostrating his face down to the ground before GOD Almighty. The difference between the Jesus of the bible and the Muslims, however, is that we Muslims Glorify and Honor GOD Almighty through prostrating to Him at least in 5-daily sets of Prayers everyday. The Jesus of the corrupt bible on the other hand was a hypocrite who only bowed down to GOD Almighty once during his most desperate times. Jesus' previous teachings of "prayers" to his followers obviously did not Glorify and Honor GOD Almighty to the fullest, nor did they mean much to Jesus when he desperately needed GOD Almighty. They were the first to be compromised by him. Quite ludicrous indeed!

6- Abrogation in Adultery punishment in the Bible!

According to the Mosaic Law, the punishment for adultery and coveting your neighbor's wife is death:

"If a man is found sleeping with another man's wife, both the man who slept with her and the woman MUST DIE. (From the NIV Bible, Deuteronomy 22:22)"

"If a man commits adultery with another man's wife--with the wife of his neighbor--both the adulterer and the adulteress must be put to death. (From the NIV Bible, Leviticus 20:10)"

"You shall not covet your neighbor's house. You shall not covet your neighbor's wife, or his manservant or maidservant, his ox or donkey, or anything that belongs to your neighbor. (From the NIV Bible, Exodus 20:17)"

Let us now look at what David did with his neighbor's wife in the Bible:

"One evening David got up from his bed and walked around on the roof of the palace. From the roof he saw a woman bathing. The woman was very beautiful, and David sent someone to find out about her. The man said, 'Isn't this Bathsheba, the daughter of Eliam and the WIFE of Uriah the Hittite?' Then David sent messengers to get her. She came to him, and he slept with her. (She had purified herself from her uncleanness.) Then she went back home. (From the NIV Bible, 2 Samuel 11:2-4)"

Here is how David was punished!

2 Samuel 12:7-8
7 Then Nathan said to David, "You are the man! This is what the LORD , the God of Israel, says: 'I anointed you king over Israel, and I delivered you from the hand of Saul.
8 I gave your master's house to you, and your master's wives into your arms. I gave you the house of Israel and Judah. And if all this had been too little, I would have given you even more.
.............

2 Samuel 12:12-14
12 You did it in secret, but I will do this thing in broad daylight before all Israel.' "
13 Then David said to Nathan, "I have sinned against the LORD ." Nathan replied, "The LORD has taken away your sin. You are not going to die.
14 But because by doing this you have made the enemies of the LORD show utter contempt, the son born to you will die."

How come David wasn't Commanded to be put to death by GOD Almighty? Instead, the child died instead of David. I wonder how the missionaries would've barked about this story if it were in the Noble Quran instead of their X-Rated Pornographic Bible, the book of women's vaginas and breasts taste like "wine", and brothers can "suck" their sisters' and lovers' privates.

The Noble Quran WOULD'VE been "wrong" if Prophet Muhammad INSTEAD was forgiven from such sin!

By the way, our beloved and blessed Prophet NEVER EVER committed any such or similar sin!

7- Are non-Jews dogs or not?

I'd like to start this section by presenting this Noble Verse from the Noble Quran:

"Do they not ponder on the Qur'an? Had it been from other than Allah, they would surely have found therein much discrepancy. (The Noble Quran, 4:82)"

Below we will see the overwhelming amount of corruption that exists in the New Testament.

Jesus was defeated by the woman's wisdom:

"A Canaanite woman from that vicinity came to him, crying out, 'Lord, Son of David, have mercy on me! My daughter is suffering terribly from demon-possession. Jesus did not answer a word. So his disciples came to him and urged him, 'Send her away, for she keeps crying out after us.' He [Jesus] answered, 'I was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel.' The woman came and knelt before him. 'Lord, help me!' she said. He [Jesus] replied 'It is not right to take the children's [Jews] bread [blessings and miracles reserved for them] and toss it to their dogs [the Gentiles].' 'Yes, Lord' she said, 'but even the dogs eat the crumbs that fall from their masters' table.' Then Jesus answered, 'Woman, you have great faith! Your request is granted.' And her daughter was healed from that very hour. (From the NIV Bible, Matthew 15:22-28)"

It's funny how Jesus supposedly in the book of man-made alterations and corruption, the New Testament, instantaneously ABROGATED his views and decision about the non-Jewish woman and people in general being equivalent to dogs when compared to the Jews. It is important to note that the woman, in this corrupted book, from the very start showed that she is a "believer" (what ever that meant back then). So it wasn't a matter of a "disbeliever" or pagan seeking Jesus' help.

The woman's wisdom defeated Jesus, the so-called "Creator of the Universe"! Jesus, within a second, changed his racist and trash-mouthed views against her from being a "dog" to a human being who deserves to be helped.

"I was sent ONLY to..." clearly and irrefutably means that Jesus initially claimed that he wasn't sent to none other than the Jews!

So what if the woman failed with Jesus??

It seems that Jesus in the corrupted book of the new testament changed his racist and filthy views only because the woman begged him. I wonder if the woman never did this and instead answered him inappropriately after he called her and all gentiles as "dogs", would the gentiles today still be considered as the Jews' dogs? Most probably yes. It doesn't take much for a racist to go back to his old habits and generalizing evil beliefs.

Again, don't forget that the woman initially showed that she was a believer! Jesus rejected her only because she was a Gentile!

The contradiction and man-made corruption in the text are clear!

The "Jesus" of the corrupted book of new testament is clearly not the Creator of the Universe as the lie of trinity claims. Allow me to quote Jesus himself, or what's put on his mouth, regarding those so-called masters:

"O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone those sent to you, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, but you were not willing. (From the NIV Bible, Matthew 23:37)"

No Prophets killers can ever be better than any human being that GOD Almighty Created! Those so-called masters can not be better than anyone or any race that exists on earth. In fact, the dung that I personally or anyone for this matter flush in the toilet is better than them and those worthless words that were uttered on the tongue of Jesus in the book of racism and lies, the New Testament. Let alone, them being the masters. So much for them being better than me, a non-Jew, and me being their "dog".

Because the bible is not Divine and is filled with man's lies, it is easy to find unanswerable contradictions in it. Jesus' views were clearly absurd and allow me to say, stupid. At one point, the Jews were the masters, and because he was satisfied with them, he ignored the fact that they were the Prophets' killers. But after they disappointed him, the balance changed and they became bad, and it was now ok to go and preach to the Gentiles (the non-Jews).

So in other words:

1- Have the Jews been ok with Jesus, the Gentiles would not have received any preaching.

2- The face of christianity today would be totally different. "Christianity" today would be limited to "only the lost sheep of Israel," i.e., the Jews.

3- Like I mentioned above, have the woman failed with Jesus, the Gentiles today would still be considered as the "Jews' dogs".

Of course me as a Muslim, I don't believe that the foul dirt that was put on Jesus' mouth or anything that exists in the NT is Divine. Again, as Allah Almighty Said:

"Do they not ponder on the Qur'an? Had it been from other than Allah, they would surely have found therein much discrepancy. (The Noble Quran, 4:82)"

Only the verses in the Bible and Hadiths (collection of Prophet Muhammad's, peace be upon him, words) that directly agree with the Noble Quran are considered close to the Truth, but not quite the Truth. The Jesus of Islam is not the Jesus of the bible. The book of lies, the New Testament, is filled with man's alteration and corruption. I have provided ample quotes from bible theologians and a long list of contradictions that clearly and irrefutably prove this!

Also visit: What is the place of Jesus, Jews and Christians in Islam? See the type of Jews and Christians that GOD Almighty is Satisfied with in Islam.

So now the question to you is:

Do you honestly call this absurdity about Jesus being a trash-mouthed racist and then changing instantaneously in the book of lies as Divine Revelations from GOD Almighty?

Where is the Divine Wisdom and Perfection in that?

I only see double-standard hypocrisy and CLEAR-CUT stupidity!

Let's just briefly compare the above lies with the Divine Justice and Revelations in the Noble Quran:

"O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a female, and made you into nations and tribes, that ye may know each other. Verily the most honoured of you in the sight of Allah is the most righteous of you. And Allah has full knowledge and is well-acquainted. (The Noble Quran, 49:13)"

For more details, please visit: Human Equality and Liberation of Slaves in Islam VS racism in the bible.

8- Is divorce allowed or not?

Matthew 5
31 "You have heard that the law of Moses says, `A man can divorce his wife by merely giving her a letter of divorce.'
32 But I say that a man who divorces his wife, unless she has been unfaithful, causes her to commit adultery. And anyone who marries a divorced woman commits adultery.

While GOD Almighty in the Old Testament allowed for divorce if the two spouses could no longer get along with each others, the New Testament claims that Jesus said that divorce is not allowed, unless the wife is unfaithful to him, i.e., she is either a loose woman or an adulterous.

2- Christians abrogating the Bible:

1- Eating swine while it is prohibited in the Bible.

"And the pig, though it has a split hoof completely divided, does not chew the cud; it is unclean for you. You must not eat their meat or touch their carcasses; they are unclean for you. (Leviticus 11:7-8)"

There goes your Christmas and Easter ham and pork.

It amazes me how the polytheist trinitarian pagan christians are the world's biggest consumers of pork meat!

Talk about respecting GOD Almighty and obeying His Divine Will!

2- Not following the Social Laws of the Old Testament. If you believe that you don't have to follow the OT's Social Laws, then I must ask you:

1- Can you marry your father's former wife?

2- Can you marry your own sister?

3- If you're a Hindu (male Hindus are allowed to marry their sisters' daughters) and you just recently embraced Christianity, then are you allowed to marry your sister's daughter whom you probably fell in love with before or at least had strong feelings toward, or was probably spoken for, when she was young while you were a Hindu?

4- Can you marry your son's former wife, or daughter's former husband, if you're a dad or mom?

5- CAN YOU MARRY YOUR OWN MOTHER????

The New Testament hardly contains any social law. It certainly doesn't address any of the questions I raised! Only the Old Testament is thorough and contains all of the Social Laws that define the limits of marriage and relationships and other social issues.

For points #1&2 above, if the polytheist trinitarian pagans EAT PORK because it is not prohibited in the NT, then SHOULDN'T that also allow for them to start marrying their own siblings (brothers and sisters) or their nieces and nephews, OR EVEN THEIR OWN PARENTS??

I mean, who's really to say no if the NT doesn't prohibit it!!

HECK, they're now allowing for men to marry men and women to marry women!

What's next? Marry your own dog because the New Testament doesn't say no?!

You think some christians wouldn't do it?

So if you now agree with me that you must follow the Old Testament's Social Laws, then shouldn't you also follow the following:

"And he that curseth his father, or his mother, shall surely be put to death. (Exodus 21:17)"

"For every one that curseth his father or his mother shall be surely put to death: he hath cursed his father or his mother; his blood shall be upon him. (Leviticus 20:9)"

"And he that blasphemeth the name of the LORD, he shall surely be put to death, and all the congregation shall certainly stone him: as well the stranger, as he that is born in the land, when he blasphemeth the name of the Lord, shall be put to death. (Leviticus 24:16)"

Renegades/Apostates: Must they be killed?

"If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying: Let us go and worship other gods (gods that neither you nor your fathers have known, gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other, or gods of other religions), do not yield to him or listen to him. Show him no pity. Do not spare him or shield him. You must certainly put him to death. Your hand must be the first in putting him to death, and then the hands of all the people. (Deuteronomy 13:6-9)"

"And he should go and worship other gods and bow down to them or to the sun or the moon or all the army of the heavens, .....and you must stone such one with stones and such one must die. (Deuteronomy 17:3-5)"

Very confusing, isn't it?

Please visit: Christians are Commanded to follow the Old Testament.

3- Christians prohibiting polygamy, while Jesus and the Old Testament clearly allowed it!

The article is too long to post here. All of Jesus' and the Old Testament's quotes, along with Christian sects and web sites that support polygamy are located at:

Polygamy is allowed in the Bible's Old and New Testaments.

3- Conclusion:

It is quite clear and beyond question that the Bible contains many abrogations. There Christians' bogus claim about Islam being false because Allah Almighty substituted some of His Holy and Divine Laws in the Noble Quran with Others is soundly debunked in this article! All Praise due to Allah Almighty.

Also, it is important to know that the reason why the christian societies today are blasphemous ones (they worship porn, sex and money) is because they live in total darkness and confusion. As we've seen above from the small samples that I provided, it is very easy for a christian to get confused and lost and end up in sin while thinking it is ok. This is what you get out of satan's religions on earth!

Islam is the only solution and salvation! Even the Jesus of the bible prayed to GOD Almighty as we Muslims do by prostrating his face down to the ground before GOD Almighty. The difference between the Jesus of the bible and the Muslims, however, is that we Muslims Glorify and Honor GOD Almighty through prostrating to Him at least in 5-daily sets of Prayers everyday. The Jesus of the corrupt bible on the other hand was a hypocrite who only bowed down to GOD Almighty once during his most desperate times. Jesus' previous teachings of "prayers" to his followers obviously did not Glorify and Honor GOD Almighty to the fullest, nor did they mean much to Jesus when he desperately needed GOD Almighty. They were the first to be compromised by him. Quite ludicrous indeed!

As I mentioned in section 1 point 7, the Jesus of the corrupt bible is not the Jesus of Islam. Christianity today is the real cause of the corruption and blasphemy that the christian world is living in today. Therefore, embrace Islam, the one and only true Monotheistic Religion today and the only Divine Religion that teaches real discipline in life, and you will be saved.

Sheik Ibrahim Mudeiris in A PA Friday Sermon: Muslim Prisoners Are Forced to Convert to Christianity in Iraq, Afghanistan, and Palestine

http://memritv.org/Transcript.asp?P1=647

The following are excerpts from the Friday sermon in Gaze by Sheik Ibrahim Mudeiris that aired on Palestinian Authority TV on April 15, 2005

Mudeiris: Muslims prisoners are subject to force conversion to Christianity. They are forced to abandon their faith today, as in the past. Muslim prisoners are forced to curse Muhammad. They are forced to curse the religion of Allah. They are forced to curse God. Haven't you heard about our prisoners in Palestine, Iraq, Afghanistan, and throughout the world… They are oppressed and incarcerated, and then they are offered conversion to Christianity. This is an old-new policy of heresy. Abdallah bin Huzafa Al-Sahmi, categorically refused. The emperor said to him: "We will put you in boiling oil." He said: "I don't care." He was shown two Muslims who had been placed him in boiling oil until their flesh came off their bones. But the emperor's deeds were not as bad as those of his successors, who preach freedom and democracy in this era. By Allah, what this emperor did, when he put the Muslims in boiling oil, is a thousand times better than what their soldiers are doing today to our wives and daughters in Iraq, Palestine, Guantanamo, and Abu Ghureib.

I know you are, but what am I? No seriously, Jesus of the Bible is love and forgiveness. islam is death, that is all I need to know.
BTW, not everyone who is not a muslim or a Jew is a Christian. To become a Christian takes a statement of faith and living the life of Christ. AND we don't have a murderer who monitors who is leaving the faith. We can study any religion we want to, without being flogged or killed. The G-D of the Torah and the Bible is not so afraid of losing believers that he must murder those who are apostate.

Here are some examples of Shariah law (complete legal texts and sources are excepted at the web address below):

http://boston.indymedia.org/newswire/display_any/21475

1. Offensive, military jihad against non-Muslims is a communal, religious obligation;
2. A person who is ignorant about Islamic legal opinion must follow the legal opinion of a scholar;
3. The penalty for a Muslim apostate (someone who no longer believes in or no longer follows the tenets of Islam) is death;
4. When slaughtering animals for food, a knife must be used to cut the windpipe and gullet;
5. A woman is only eligible to receive half the inheritance of a man;
6. Marriage may be forced on virgins by their father or father’s father;
7. A non-Arab man may not marry an Arab woman;
8. A woman must seek permission from her husband to leave the house;
9. A Muslim man cannot marry a woman who is a Zoroastrian, an idol worshipper, an apostate from Islam or a woman with one parent who is Jewish or Christian, with the other being Zoroastrian; a Muslim woman cannot marry anyone but a Muslim;
10. A free Muslim man may marry up to four women;
11. Retaliation is obligatory in most cases when someone is deliberately murdered except when a Muslim kills a non-Muslim, a Jew or a Christian kills a Muslim apostate or a father or mother kill their offspring;
12. Non-Muslim subjects (Ahl al-Dhimma) of a Muslim state are subject to a series of discriminatory laws – “dhimmitude”;
13. The penalty for fornication or sodomy is being stoned to death;
14. The penalty for an initial theft is amputation of the right hand. Subsequent thefts are penalized by further amputations of feet and hand;
15. A non-Muslim cannot testify against a Muslim in court; a person who is “without respectability” cannot give legal testimony; a woman’s legal testimony is only given half the legal weight of a man’s (and is only acceptable in cases involving property); to legally prove fornication or sodomy requires 4 male witnesses who actually saw the act;
16. The establishment and continuation of the Islamic Caliphate (by force, if necessary) is a communal obligation;
17. Sodomites and Lesbians must be killed;
18. Laughing too much is forbidden;
19. Musical instruments are unlawful;
20. Creating pictures of animate life is forbidden;
21. Female circumcision, which includes the excision of the clitoris, is obligatory;
22. Slavery is permitted;
23. People may be bribed to convert to Islam;
24. Beating a rebellious wife is permissible; and,
25. Lying is permissible in a time of war (or jihad).

Carolyn,
There is only 1 God, the creator of the heavens, the creator of all Mankind. How can there be more than one God. I worship the God of Noah, Moses, Abraham, Jesus and Mohammad, peace be upon them all.

ia786:

Do you honestly think anyone cares what you think?

Here read this below and learn some true wisdom!

Everybody's looking for the answers
To everything they just can't understand
Some praise God and some sing Hare Krishna
Some go door to door to say the world will end

Well, it's all quite a sight
Everybody thinks they're right
And everybody else is just insane
Otherwise, their lives are down the drain
All the years they just spent selling their songs
Just to find it out it's all wrong

Trying to find solutions to give life some meaning
Seems to be the way some people spend their time
All the time that's lost in fruitless thinking
Surrounded by so many gifts of every kind

Well, it's all such a shame
So many years gone down the drain
While life passes like a big parade
All the laughter, all the music's played
All the friends you know you could have made
Then the big parade is gone

Life's a big parade

Ian Thomas
"Big Parade"
from the album, Calabash, 1976 (GRT)

ia786:

Sources for your contention that the bible is corrupted please? I wait with bated breath..

(And please don't use the noble quran as one.)

"Because if a muslim DID read the Bible, they'd become enlightened to the Way, the Truth and the Life."

Really!!

What was the church trying to hide? IN 1415,THE CHURCH OF ROME TOOK AN EXTRAORDINARY STEP TO destroy all knowledge of two Second Century Jewish books that it said contained ‘the true name of Jesus Christ.’ The Antipope Benedict XIII firstly singled out for condemnation a secret Latin treatise called ‘Mar Yesu ’ and then issued instructions to destroy all copies of the Book of Elxai.No editions of these writings now publicly exist,but church archives recorded that they were once in popular circulation and known to the early presbyters.Knowledge of these writings survived from quotations made by Bishop Hippolytus of Rome (176 –236)and St Epiphanius of Salamis (315 – 403)along with references in some early editions of the Talmud of Palestine and Babylonia.The Rabbinic fraternity once held the destroyed manuscripts with great reverence for they were comprehensive original records reporting the ‘Life of Rabbi Jesus ’.

Later,in a similar manner,Pope Alexander VI (1492 –1503)ordered all copies of the Talmud destroyed.The Council of the Inquisition required as many Jewish writings as possible to burn with the Spanish Grand Inquisitor, Tomas de Torquemada (1420 –98),responsible for the elimination of 6000 volumes at Salamanca.In 1550,Cardinal Caraffa,the Inquisitor-General procured a Bull from the Pope repealing all previous permission for priests to read the Talmud which he said contained ‘hostile stories about Jesus Christ ’. Bursting forth with fury at the head of his minions,he seized every copy he could find in Rome and burnt them.Solomon Romano (1554)also burnt many thousands of Hebrew scrolls and in 1559 every Hebrew book in the city of Prague was confiscated.The mass destruction of Jewish books included hundreds of copies of the Old Testament and caused the irretrievable loss of many original hand-written documents.The oldest text of the Old Testament that survived,before the discovery of the Dead

Sea Scrolls was said to be the Bodleian Codex (Oxford),which was dated to circa 1100AD.In an attempt by the church to remove damaging Rabbinic information about Jesus Christ from the face of the earth,the Inquisition burnt 12,000 volumes of the Talmud However,many copies survived and today provide opposing traditions about the person called Jesus Christ.

In the mass destruction of Jewish writings,the church overlooked two particular British documents that also recorded ‘the true name of Jesus Christ ’. They survive to this day in the British Museum and are called the Chronicles and the Myvyean Manuscript treasured ancient documents with a very early origin.Supporting evidence was also found on early First Century gold, silver and bronze coins discovered at the site of an ancient mint at Camulodunum (Colchester)in Britain.‘Thus the testimony of the Briton coins establishes clearly and positively the historicity of the traditional ancient ‘Chronicles ’ as authentic historical records.’1

The evidence is compelling,and additional supporting clues are found on a mysterious headstone in Germany,in Vatican art treasures,and in a series of coded sentences in the Shakespearean Plays.Further concealed information was left in the form of specially created statues commissioned by a Catholic priest and positioned in a small hilltop church in Southern France.Coded ciphers were also secreted into the first English-language printings of the Bible and a combination of all clues provides interlocking information and presents a new insight into the origin of Christianity.

Secret ciphers in the New Testament It was the ‘wisest fool in Christendom ’,2 who ‘authorised ’ the translation and publication of the first Protestant version of the Bible into English.He came to the English throne in 1603 and quickly became unpopular because of ‘his disgusting personal habits and his unsavoury character ’.3 He pretended to be a scholar in theology and philosophy,but his learning was shallow and superficial.He wallowed in filth,moral and physical,but was endowed with a share of cunning that his associates called,‘a kind of crooked wisdom ’.4

For his new edition of the Bible he issued a set of personal ‘Rules ’ the translators were to follow and ordered revisions to proceed,although he never contributed a farthing to its cost.Work began early in 1607 and took a committee of forty-seven men (some records say fifty-four,others say fifty)two years and nine months to rewrite the Bible and make ready for the press.Each man received thirty shillings per week for his contribution. Upon its completion in 1609,a remarkable event occurred —the translators handed over the reviser ’s manuscripts of what is now called the King James Bible to King James for his final personal approval.‘It was self-evident that James was not competent to check their work and edit it,so he passed the manuscripts on to the greatest genius of all time ...Sir Francis Bacon.’5

Sir Francis Bacon (1561 –1626)was a man of many talents,a lawyer,linguist and composer.He mastered every subject he undertook;mathematics, geometry,music,poetry,painting,astronomy,classical drama and poetry, philosophy,history,theology and architecture.He was a man of many aims and purposes,the father of modern science,remodeler of modern law,patron of modern democracy,and possibly the reviver of Freemasonry.His life and works are extensively documented,and his intellectual accomplishments widely recognized,particularly in academic circles.At the age of sixteen,he was sent to Paris ‘direct from the Queens Hand ’ and there studied Egyptian, Arabian,Indian and Greek philosophy with particular attention given to the Ancient Mysteries and their Ritual Rites.He personally recorded that, while in Paris,he created a secret cipher system that could be inserted into a document without arousing suspicion.While living in Europe,Francis Bacon was initiated into the mysterious Order of the Knights Templar and learnt a very special secret.Before he returned to London,he travelled to France,Italy,Germany and Spain and at the age of twenty completely devoted himself to the study of law.From his understanding of the secret information he had learned during his initiation into the Knights Templar,he conceived the idea of reactivating various Secret Societies and in 1580 founded the secret Rosicrosse Literary Society in Gray ’s Inn.Later in the same year,he founded the Lodge of Free and Accepted or Speculative Masons,also at Gray ’s Inn.

On 25 June 1607 Sir Francis Bacon was appointed Solicitor-General and Chief Advisor to the Crown.He had presented new ideas to the Government for the Reformation of the church and was officially instructed to commence restructuring the Bible.Research in the Records Office of the British Museum revealed that original documents still exist which refer to important proceedings associated with Sir Francis Bacon ’s involvement with the editing of both the Old and New Testaments They revealed that he personally selected and paid the revisers of the New Testament who completed their task under the instructions of Bacon ’s long-time friend,Dr Andrews. Statue of the editor of the Bible, Sir Francis Bacon. © Photography:Thomas L.Lithgow,Esq.

The first English language manuscripts of the Bible remained in Bacon ’s possession for nearly a year.During that time:

...he hammered the various styles of the translators into the unity,rhythm, and music of Shakespearean prose,wrote the Prefaces and created the whole scheme of the Authorized Version.6

He also encoded secret information into both the Old and New Testament An ancient document recorded that the true history of early Christianity was known to the initiates of the Order of the Knights Templar,having originally been:

...imparted to Hugh de Payens by the Grand-Pontiff of the Order of the Temple (of the Nazarene sect),one named Theocletes,after which it was learned by some Knights in Palestine.7

Regarding the months of editing work applied to the Bible by Bacon,his biographer,William T.Smedley, confirmed the extent of the editing:

It will eventually be proved that the whole structure of the Authorised Bible was Francis Bacon ’s.He was an ardent student not only of the Bible, but also of early manuscripts.St Augustine,St Jerome,and writers of theological works,were studied by him with industry.8

At the completion of the editing,Sir Francis Bacon and King James I had a series of meetings to finalise editorial matters associated with the new Bible. It was at this time that King James ordered a ‘Dedication to the King ’ to be drawn up and included in the opening pages.He also wanted the phrase ‘Appointed to be read in the Churches ’ to appear on the title page.This was an announcement clarifying that King James had personally given the church ‘Special Command ’ for this particular version of the Bible to be used in preference to the vast array of Greek and Latin Vulgate Bibles current at the time.His reason was personal,as King James had previously instructed the revisers to ‘defend the position of the king ’ in their restructuring of the texts.This was seen as an attempt to distance the Protestant Bible from the Catholic version.The Protestant versions of the Bible are thinner by seven books than the Catholic version and the variant churches have never agreed on a uniform Bible.In their translation of 1 Peter 2:13 the revisors changed the phrase ‘the emperor,as supreme ’ to ‘the king,as supreme ’.Because King James ’ Bible was written to support the authority of a king,the later church often referred to it as the one from ‘authority ’,and it later came to be presented as if officially ‘authorised ’.In subsequent revisions,the word ‘authorised ’ found its way onto the title page and later still came to be printed on the cover,giving King James ’ new Bible a false sense of authenticity.

The King James Bible is considered by many today to be the ‘original ’ Bible and therefore ‘genuine ’ and all later revisions simply counterfeits forged by ‘higher critics ’.Others think the King James Bible is ‘authentic ’ and ‘authorised ’ and presents the original words of the authors as translated into English from the ‘original ’ Greek text.However,the ‘original ’ Greek text was not written until around the mid-Fourth Century and was a revised edition of writings compiled decades earlier in Aramaic and Hebrew.Those earlier documents no longer exist 9 and the Bibles we have today are five linguistic removes from the first Bibles written.What was written in the ‘original originals ’ is quite unknown.It is important to remember that the words ‘authorised ’ and ‘original ’,as applied to the Bible,do not mean ‘genuine ’,‘authentic ’ or ‘true ’.

There IS just one G-D. And his name is not allah.

Remember, ia786, everything is pre-destined by Allah. If you resent what Allah has destined, you are an apostate. You will burn in hell.

If you do not accept fate, if you complain about what Allah most high has destined, you are committing an enormity. You must accept what Allah has done for all Muslims. And, guess what ia786, Allah hates you!

Allah hates you ia786. He has been hating you for a long time now. Allah demonstrated that he hated you in Spain in 1492. Allah showed that he hated you at Lepanto in 1571. Allah said, "I hate you" at Vienna in 1683. Allah showed that he hated you in 1699 when the Habsburgs recovered Hungary. Allah demonstrated he hated you again in 1770 when the Russians destroyed the Ottoman fleet at Cesme. 1771 - Allah gives Crimea to the Russians. Allah gives Serbia and Greece back to the Serbs and Greeks in 1829. Allah gives Crete away - 1908. Allah gives Bulgaria back to the Bulgarians - 1909. Allah gives Bosnia-Herzegovina away - 1909. Allah gives Montenegro away - 1910. ALLAH DISBANDS THE MUSLIM CALIPHATE - 1924. Why would he do that, pray tell? 1948 - Allah creates Israel. 2001 - invasion and occupation of Afghanistan. 2004 - invasion and occupation of Iraq. Do you understand yet,ia786? ALLAH HATES YOU. Allah loves Western civilization!

Your civilization will fade and die. All you can offer people is death in the name of Allah.

{Tapping my foot, waiting for ia786's head to explode} Do you really think we read all your screed? We have seen it all before.

" I worship the God of Noah, Moses, Abraham, Jesus and Mohammad, peace be upon them all."

Gggggacckkk!

Islam is a cult... read the cult characteristics below and prove me wrong.

The group is focused on a leader to whom members seem to display excessively zealous, unquestioning commitment.

The group is preoccupied with bringing in new members.

The group is preoccupied with making money.

Questioning, doubt, and dissent are discouraged or even punished.

Mind-numbing techniques (such as meditation, chanting, speaking in tongues, denunciation sessions, debilitating work routines) are used to suppress doubts about the group and its leader(s).

The leadership dictates sometimes in great detail how members should think, act, and feel (for example: members must get permission from leaders to date, change jobs, get married; leaders may prescribe what types of clothes to wear, where to live, how to discipline children, and so forth).

The group is elitist, claiming a special, exalted status for itself, its leader(s), and members (for example: the leader is considered the Messiah or an avatar; the group and/or the leader has a special mission to save humanity).

The group has a polarized us- versus-them mentality, which causes conflict with the wider society.

The group's leader is not accountable to any authorities.

The group teaches or implies that its supposedly exalted ends justify means that members would have considered unethical before joining the group (for example: collecting money for bogus charities, committing suicide, etc).

The leadership induces guilt feelings in members in order to control them.

Members' subservience to the group causes them to cut ties with family and friends, and to give up personal goals and activities that were of interest before joining the group.

Members are expected to devote inordinate amounts of time to the group.

Members are encouraged or required to live and/or socialize only with other group members.

Yup... this is islam.

http://answering-islam.org/Authors/Arlandson/ten_reasons.htm

Top ten reasons why Islam is NOT the religion of peace
Violence in Muhammad's life and the Quran

James M. Arlandson

Ever since 9/11, Muslim leaders who have access to the national media have told us that Islam is the religion of peace and that violence does not represent the essence of Muhammad’s religion.

Even President Bush and Britain’s Prime Minister Blair have repeated this assertion, saying that Islam has been "hijacked" by a few violent fanatics. Is this true?

Sadly it is not, for empirical, observable facts demonstrate beyond doubt that Islam at its founding is filled with violence—in the life of Muhammad himself and in the Quran itself.

Hence, these Muslim apologists must stop misleading unsuspecting Westerners, and they must be honest about the heart of their religion, for once and for all.

Here are ten clear, verifiable reasons that explain why Islam is not the religion of peace.

Clear? In order to prevent the standard, reflexive "out of context" defense from Muslim apologists, the context of each verse in the Quran is explained either in this article or in the links provided within each of the ten reasons. No verse is taken out of context, and Muslim translations are used.

Verifiable? The readers are invited to look up each verse in the Quran in multiple translations, by visiting the website www.quranbrowser.com and typing in references, like so: 61:10-12. (61 is the chapter or sura, and 10-12 are the verses).

10. Muhammad nicknames his weapons.

Tabari (AD 839-923) is an early Muslim historian who is considered largely reliable by scholars today. In fact, the State University of New York Press selected his history to be translated into 38 volumes. (We use The Last Years of the Prophet, trans. Ismail K. Poonawala, 9:153-55.)

In the context of the list of Muhammad’s assets at the end of his life (horses, camels, milch sheep, and so on), Tabari records the nicknames of Muhammad weapons.

Muhammad nicknames three swords that he took from the Jewish tribe Qaynuqa after he banished them from Medina in April 624: "Pluck Out," "Very Sharp," and "Death." Two other swords from elsewhere are named: "Sharp" and "That is wont to sink" (presumably into human flesh). After his Hijrah or Emigration from Mecca to Medina in 622, he owned two swords called "Sharp" and "Having the vertebrae of the back." This last sword he collected as booty after his victory at the Battle of Badr in March 624.

Next, Muhammad took three bows from the Qaynuqa tribe and named them as follows: "Most conducive to ease, or wide," "white," and "of nab wood" (species of tree from which bows are made).

The name of a coat of mail implies "ampleness" or "redundant portions," probably because Muhammad was portly (cf. Ibn Ishaq, Life of Muhammad, trans. Guillaume, p. 383).

Finally, even Muhammad himself has a nickname. After Tabari lists the positive ones, he matter-of-factly provides one that is not so positive: "The obliterator."

Muslim apologists may object that Tabari is not authoritative (except when he shows Muhammad as heroic or victorious) and that he is not on the same level as the Quran and some hadiths (words and deeds of Muhammad outside of the Quran). This is true. But Muslim apologists still must answer why such a tradition of naming weapons developed about Muhammad. After all, later, unauthoritative traditions about Christ developed, but they do not show him even owning weapons, let alone naming them. The answer to this question about Muhammad is found in the next nine reasons.

Thus, violence sits at the heart of early Islam—in the life of Muhammad. Islam is therefore not the religion of peace.

9. Muhammad commands in his Quran that adulterers and adulteresses should receive a hundred lashes.

24:2 Strike the adulteress and the adulterer one hundred times. Do not let compassion for them keep you from carrying out God’s law—if you believe in God and the Last Day—and ensure that a group of believers witnesses the punishment. (MAS Abdel Haleem, The Quran, New York: Oxford UP, 2004)

The supposed historical context of this sura occurs during a raid of a tribe in December 627 or January 628, on which Muhammad brought his favorite and youngest wife, Aisha, also the daughter of Abu Bakr, his right-hand lieutenant. After the Muslims’ victory, they journeyed back to Medina, one hundred and fifty miles to the north. On their last halt, Aisha answered the call of nature, but lost her necklace in the dark, just as the army was setting out from their encampment early in the morning. She left her litter, returned to look for the necklace, and found it. Meanwhile, the man leading her camel assumed she was in her curtained litter and led the animal away by the halter. Returning, Aisha saw that she was left behind.

However, a handsome young Muslim named Safwan saw her and accompanied her back to Medina, though both the Muslims and Muhammad’s opposition wagged their tongues at seeing the two youngsters entering the city together. Eventually, revelation came that Aisha was not guilty of any immorality.

Sura 24 thus establishes some ground rules against adultery, of which flogging one hundred times is one of the rules. Amazingly, 24:2 exhorts the accusers and judges not to let compassion keep them from carrying out God’s law.

Moreover, early and reliable traditions depict Muhammad and his Muslims stoning adulterers and adulteresses, as recorded by the two most reliable collectors and editors of the hadith, Bukhari (AD 810-870) and Muslim (c. AD 817-875):

Umar said: God sent Muhammad with the truth and sent down the Book [Quran] to him, and the verse of stoning was included in what God most high sent down. God’s messenger [Muhammad] had people stoned to death, and we have done it also since his death. Stoning is a duty laid down in God’s Book for married men and women who commit fornication when proof is established, or if there is pregnancy, or a confession.

Umar was Muhammad’s right-hand lieutenant (along with Abu Bakr), and even shortly after Muhammad’s death he tried very hard to get a verse allowing stoning into the Quran, but he did not succeed (Ibn Ishaq, Life of Muhammad, trans. Guillaume, p. 684). Be that as it may, this and the next hadith are sufficient for many Muslims today to endorse stoning, as seen here: [1], [2], [3], [4].

Perhaps the most gruesome hadith is the following. A woman came to the prophet and asked for purification (by being punished for her sin). He told her to go away and seek God’s forgiveness. She persisted four times and admitted that she was pregnant as a result of fornication. He told her to wait until she had given birth. Then he said that the Muslim community should wait until she had weaned her child. When the day arrived for the child to take solid food, Muhammad handed the child over to the community and ordered the woman’s death by stoning.

And when he had given command over her and she was put in a hole up to her breast, he ordered the people to stone her. Khalid b. al-Walid came forward with a stone which he threw at her head, and when the blood spurted on his face he cursed her ... (Muslim, No. 4206)

It is true that Muhammad told Khalid to be gentler, but how gentle does one have to be when one throws a rock at a woman buried up to her breasts? Is the rock required to go only 30 miles per hour or 40? Perhaps Muhammad was ordering Khalid not to curse her. In any case, the prophet prayed over her dead body and then buried her. Truthfully, how effective was the prayer when Muhammad and his community murdered her in cold blood? They should have forgiven her and let her go to raise her child.

Even if some Muslim apologists today do not accept these hadiths, then they still have to answer why the true God would send down the harsh punishment of lashing in the Quran (Sura 24:2), when the New Testament says nothing about this. Christians should therefore rightly reject this verse, for Christ forgave the woman caught in adultery and told her to go and sin no more (John 8:1-11). He showed us the better way and taught the will of the true God.

For more information on this early punishment and how it is applied today, refer to this article, which also answers Muslim apologists and explains John 8:1-11 more thoroughly.

Thus, cruel violence sits at the heart of early Islam—in Muhammad’s life and in his Quran. Islam is therefore not the religion of peace.

8. Muhammad in his Quran permits husbands to beat their wives.

4:34 Husbands should take full care of their wives, with [the bounties] God has given to some more than others and with what they spend out of their own money. Righteous wives are devout and guard what God would have them guard in the husbands’ absence. If you fear high-handedness from your wives, remind them [of the teaching of God], then ignore them when you go to bed, then hit them. If they obey you, you have no right to act against them. God is most high and great. (Haleem)

Written in the historical context of the Battle of Uhud (March 625), in which Islam lost 70 holy warriors, this verse belongs to a larger collection of verses that outlines laws for the family, such as how to divide the inheritance and to how to oversee the assets of orphans (vv. 1-35).

Plainly said, Sura 4:34 specifies that husbands may beat their unruly wives if the husbands "fear" highhandedness, quite apart from whether the wives are actually being highhanded. This puts the interpretation of the wives’ behavior squarely in the husbands’ judgment, and this swings the door to abuse wide open. This verse embodies a gigantic cultural and social step backwards and should be rejected by all fair-minded and reasonable people.

For a more thorough analysis of this hurtful practice, refer to this article.

Thus, domestic violence sits at the heart of early Islam—in the life of Muhammad and his Quran. Islam is therefore not the religion of peace.

7. Muhammad in his Quran commands that the hands of male or female thieves should be cut off.

5:38 Cut off the hands of thieves, whether they are male or female, as punishment for what they have done—a deterrent from God: God is almighty and wise. 39 But if anyone repents after his wrongdoing and makes amends, God will accept his repentance: God is most forgiving and merciful. (Haleem)

Three passages in the hadith interpret Muhammad’s policy and provide its context. This is a quick compilation taken from Bukhari and Muslim:

Aisha [favorite wife of Muhammad] reported the Prophet saying, "A thief’s hand should be cut off for only a quarter of a dinar and upwards."

A dinar, a word taken from the Roman denarius, was not a small sum, but not exorbitant either, yet one-fourth of a dinar merits the loss of a hand in Muhammad’s view.

Ibn Umar said the Prophet had a thief’s hand cut off for a shield worth three dirhams.

The shield was fairly expensive. The poor in Muhammad’s armies could not afford one. But is a shield equal to a hand?

Abu Huraira reported the Prophet as saying, "God curse a thief who steals an egg and has his hand cut off, and steals a rope and has his hand cut off!"

Some commentators are quick to say that an "egg" is really a helmet, and the rope is a ship’s rope, which is sizable and costly. However, the translation above is usually accepted, and this means that the penalty could be imposed for trivial thefts. But even if the more expensive items are in view here, they still do not measure up to a hand.

For more information on this gruesome practice and its historical context, consult this article, which also answers Muslim apologists who seek to defend this practice and which also contrasts Christ with Muhammad. Suffice it to say here, Christ never endorsed this. And Paul the Apostle says that thieves should work with their hands in order to share with those in need, not get their hand cut off (Ephesians 4:28). So Paul excels Muhammad.

Thus, harsh and excessive punitive violence sits at the heart of early Islam—in Muhammad’s life and in the Quran. Islam is therefore not the religion of peace.

6. Muhammad assassinates poets and poetesses.

These two poets represent others in early Islam.

March 624: Uqba bin Abu Muayt

Uqba mocked Muhammad in Mecca and wrote derogatory verses about him. He was captured during the Battle of Badr, and Muhammad ordered him to be executed. "But who will look after my children, O Muhammad?" Uqba cried with anguish. "Hell," retorted the prophet coldly. Then the sword of one of his followers cut through Uqba’s neck.

March 624: Amsa bint Marwan

Amsa was a poetess who belonged to a tribe of Medinan pagans, and whose husband was named Yazid b. Zayd. She composed a poem blaming the Medinan pagans for obeying a stranger (Muhammad) and for not taking the initiative to attack him by surprise. When the prophet heard what she had said, he asked, "Who will rid me of Marwan’s daughter?" A member of her husband’s tribe volunteered and crept into her house that night. She had five children, and the youngest was sleeping at her breast. The assassin gently removed the child, drew his sword, and plunged it into her, killing her in her sleep.

The following morning, the assassin defied anyone to take revenge. No one took him up on his challenge, not even her husband. In fact, Islam became powerful among his tribe. Previously, some members who had kept their conversion secret now became Muslims openly, "because they saw the power of Islam," so conjectures an early Muslim source that reports the assassination.

In addition to the sources that recount these and other assassinations, the Quran also supports harsh punishments for mockers and insulters (Suras 3:186; 33:57; 33:59-61; and 9:61-63).

However, even if Muslims reject the early non-Quranic sources where these assassinations are found, they still must answer these questions: Why would such a tradition grow up around Muhammad in friendly Islamic sources? What was it about Muhammad that produced such reports? Why are these friendly sources eager to present their prophet in a "positive" way?

For an in-depth analysis of Muhammad’s assassinations of poets and how they justify assassinations of artists today, like the one of Theo van Gogh, the Dutch filmmaker, refer to this article, which also answers the Muslim apologists who try to justify Muhammad’s deadly policy, and which contrasts early Christianity with early Islam—Jesus assassinated no one, neither did he order this in the Gospels.

Thus, bullying and murderous violence sits at the heart of early Islam—in Muhammad’s life and in the Quran. Islam is therefore not the religion of peace.

5. Muhammad in his Quran commands death or the cutting off of hands and feet for fighting and corrupting the land.

5:33 Indeed, the punishment of those who fight Allah and His Messenger and who go around corrupting the land is to be killed, crucified, have their hands and feet cut off on opposite sides, or to be banished from the land. That is a disgrace for them in this life, and in the life to come theirs will be a terrible punishment. 34 Except for those who repent before you overpower them. Know, then, that Allah is All-Forgiving, Merciful. (Majid Fakhry, An Interpretation of the Quran, New York: NYUP, 2000, 2004)

According to the hadith, the historical context of these verses runs as follows and clarifies "fighting" and "corrupting" the land.

Some Arab tribesmen visited the prophet, but fell sick in the uncongenial climate of Medina, so he recommended an old folk belief: drinking the milk and urine of a camel. Subsequently, they are reported to have felt better. However, for some reason, after departing from Medina, they killed some of Muhammad’s shepherds, turned apostate, and drove off the prophet’s camels.

This news reached him, and he ordered them to be hunted down and brought before him. He decreed that their hands and feet should be cut off, their eyes gouged out, and their bodies thrown upon stony ground until they died.

For more information on this policy that punishes people today based on Sura 5:33, even on ambiguous charges like colonialism, racism, and the disintegration of family relationships see here, and for a reply to Muslim apologists, refer to this article, which also contrasts Christ with Muhammad.

Thus, gruesome violence sits at the heart of early Islam—in Muhammad’s life and in the Quran. Islam is therefore not the religion of peace.

4. Muhammad aggressively attacks Meccan caravans.

A year or so after Muhammad’s Hijrah from Mecca to Medina in 622, he attacks Meccan caravans six times, and sent out a punitive expedition three-days away against an Arab tribe that stole some Medinan grazing camels (or cattle), totaling seven raids.

W. Montgomery Watt, a highly reputable Western Islamologist who writes in favor of Muhammad and whose two-volume history of early Islam (Muhammad at Mecca (1953) and Muhammad at Medina (1956)) has won wide acceptance, tells us why geography matters:

The chief point to notice is that the Muslims took the offensive. With one exception the seven expeditions were directed against Meccan caravans. The geographical situation lent itself to this. Caravans from Mecca to Syria had to pass between Medina and the coast. Even if they kept as close to the Red Sea as possible, they had to pass within about eighty miles of Medina, and, while at this distance from the enemy base, would be twice as far from their own base. (Muhammad at Medina, emphasis added, p. 2)

It must be emphatically stated that the Meccans never sent a force up to the doorstep of Medina at this time—they did later on when they were fed up with Muhammad’s aggressions. It is true that the Meccans gathered forces to protect their caravans, but when Muhammad confronted them, they were many days’ journeys away from Medina, often more than eighty miles. (Medina and Mecca are around 200-250 miles from each other, taking seven to eleven days of travel by foot, horse, or camel.)

Hence, two Muslim scholar-apologists are misleading when they assert that the caravans "passed through" Medina, adding that the Muslims haphazardly sought for whatever spoils they could get, whereas the Meccans mobilized for war (Isma’il R. al-Faruqi and Lois Lamya’al Faruqi, The Cultural Atlas of Islam, New York: Macmillan, 1986, 134). Rather, it is more accurate to say that the Muslims were aggressively harassing the Meccans.

To complete the picture of expeditions, raids and wars in Muhammad’s life from 622 to 632, Watt totals up the number that Muhammad either sent out or went out on: seventy-four (Muhammad at Medina, pp. 2; 339-43). They range from negotiations (only a few compared to the violent expeditions), to small assassination hit squads, to the conquest of Mecca with 10,000 jihadists, and to the confrontation of Byzantine Christians (who never showed up), with 30,000 holy warriors to Tabuk (see below).

For a fuller account of these six early aggressive attacks against Meccan caravans, go to this article, which explains more thoroughly why these attacks are not defensive.

Thus, aggressive military violence sits at the heart of early Islam—in Muhammad’s life and in the Quran. Islam is therefore not the religion of peace.

3. Muhammad in his Quran promises sensuous Gardens for martyrs dying in a military holy war.

Throughout the Quran, Muhammad promises the men in his fledgling Muslim community that if they die fighting for Allah and for him, Allah will reward them with a "virgin-rich" Garden (Suras 44:51-56; 52:17-29; 55:46-78).

In the following Quranic passage, representing others (Suras 4:74, 9:111; 3:140-143), the Arabic word "jihad" (root is j-h-d) is the means or currency to trade in this life for the life to come in an economic bargain.

61:10 You who believe, shall I show you a bargain that will save you from painful punishment? 11 Have faith in God and His Messenger and struggle [j-h-d] for His cause with your possessions and your persons—that is better for you, if only you knew—12 and He will forgive your sins, admit you into Gardens graced with flowing streams, into pleasant dwellings in the Gardens of Eternity. That is the supreme triumph. (Haleem)

These verses are found in the historical context of the Battle of Uhud (625), in which Muhammad lost 70 of his fighters. Thus, he must make the loss of life appear worth the sacrifice, so he frames their deaths in an economic bargain (note the word in bold print). If his jihadists trade in or sell their lives down here, they will be granted Islamic heaven—it is a done deal.

For an in-depth analysis of Islamic martyrdom and how Biblical martyrdom opposes it, consult this article. Christ’s "Martyrdom" on the cross opens the way to heaven so that Christians do not have to die in a holy war to reach heaven.

Thus, deadly, ‘heavenly violence’ sits at the heart of early Islam—in Muhammad’s life and in the Quran. Islam is therefore not the religion of peace.

2. Muhammad unjustly executes around 600 male Jews and enslaves the women and children.

After the Battle of the Trench in March 627 (named after a trench that the Muslims dug around parts of Medina) against a large coalition of Meccans and their allies, Muhammad imposed the ultimate penalty on the men in the Jewish clan, Qurayzah, his third and final Jewish rivals (he banished the Qaynuqa tribe in April 624 and the Nadir tribe in August 625). The Qurayzah tribe was supposed to remain neutral in the Battle, but they seem to have intrigued with the Meccans and to have been on the verge of attacking Muhammad from the rear. They were judged guilty by one of their Medinan Muslim allies, though Muhammad could have shown mercy, exiled them (as indeed they requested), or executed only a few.

The sentence: Death by decapitation for around 600 men (some Islamic sources say 900), and enslavement for the women and children (he took a beautiful Jewess as his own prize). Muhammad was wise enough to have six clans execute two Jews each in order to stop any blood-feuds. The rest of the executions were probably carried out by his fellow Emigrants from Mecca and lasted the whole night.

The prophet says the following in Sura 33:25-26 about the Battle of the Trench and his treatment of Qurayzah:

33:25 God sent back the disbelievers along with their rage—they gained no benefit—and spared the believers from fighting. He is strong and mighty. 26 He brought those People of the Book [Qurayza] who supported them down from their strongholds and put terror into their hearts. Some of them you [believers] killed and some you took captive. 27 He passed on to you their land, their homes, their possessions, and a land where you had not set foot. God has power over everything. (Haleem)

Now this atrocity has been enshrined in the eternal word of Allah—and the Quran seems to celebrate it. But these questions must be answered: Is intriguing with the enemy equal to slaughtering 600 men and enslaving the women and children? Who decides? The Arab tribal chief with the most powerful army? Muhammad said around the time of his Hijrah in 622 the following:

16:126 If you [people] have to respond to an attack, make your response proportionate, but it is better to be steadfast. (Haleem)

Any reasonable and fair-minded person would judge that Muhammad was not making his response (execution) proportionate to the breach of the agreement. The Qurayzah tribe never attacked the Muslims, and even if a few were to have done so, the punishment does not fit the crime. Therefore, Muhammad was being excessive and disproportionate because he used an irreversible penalty to express his human wrath.

For a fuller account of this atrocity, refer to this article.

Thus, anti-Semitic violence sits at the heart of early Islam—in Muhammad’s life and in his Quran. Islam is therefore not the religion of peace.

1. Muhammad launches his own Crusades.

In the following verse, Muhammad uses the Arabic word qital (root is q-t-l), which means warring, fighting, or killing:

9:29 Fight [q-t-l] those among the people of the Book [Christians] who do not believe in Allah and the Last Day, do not forbid what Allah and His Messenger have forbidden and do not profess the true religion, till they pay the poll-tax out of hand and submissively. (Fakhry)

The two most interesting clauses in this violent verse are (1) People of the Book (Christians in this verse late in Muhammad’s life) are to be attacked if they do not profess the true religion: Islam. This leaves the door wide open for terrorists today to attack and fight Christians because they do not adhere to Islam; (2) Christians must pay a tax for the "privilege" of living under the "protection" of Islam—submissively or in humiliation.

The historical context of Sura 9:29 finds Muhammad preparing for a military expedition against the Byzantine Empire in 630, two years before his ordinary death of a fever in 632. Indeed, some scholars regard Sura 9 as the last sura to be revealed from on high. Therefore, it sets many policies for Muslims today, and is often interpreted as abrogating or canceling previous verses, even peaceful ones.

Muhammad heard a rumor that the Byzantines amassed an army some 700 miles to the north in Tabuk (northern Arabia today) in order to attack Islam, so he led an army of 30,000 holy warriors to counter-strike preemptively. However, the Byzantines failed to materialize, so Muhammad’s belief in the false rumor was misguided and his expedition was fruitless, except he managed to extract (extort) agreements from northern Christian Arab tribes that they would not attack him and his community. An army of 30,000 soldiers from the south must have deeply impressed the northern tribes, so they posed no real threat to Islam. They are the ones who paid the "protection" tax mentioned in Sura 9:29 (and so do tribes and cities after Muhammad’s death). Therefore, Muhammad’s forced tax was aggressive and hence unjust, not defensive and hence just.

Muhammad’s military expedition qualifies as an Islamic Crusade long before the European ones. After all, in 638, only six years after Muhammad’s death, Muslim armies conquer Jerusalem. Today, Muslims should never again complain about European Crusades, unless they first come to grips with their own.

For more information on the Muslim Crusades after Muhammad’s death and their atrocities and motives, refer to this article.

Thus, crusading violence sits at the heart of early Islam—in Muhammad’s life and in his Quran—and beyond, even reaching to today’s western world. Islam is therefore not the religion peace.

What the ten reasons mean for us today

These ten aspects of violence that have burrowed into the hemorrhaging heart of early Islam have eight implications for us today. The first three are theological; the rest are practical.

The theological implications are as follows:

First, as each reason in this article has hinted at and the links explain more thoroughly, Christ never, ever engaged in such violence. For example, he never assassinated opponents, whipped adulterers, cut off the hands of thieves, or launched his own Crusades (what the Medieval Europeans did is not foundational to Christianity). Christ expresses the love of God. Therefore, Christians and all fair-minded persons have the right to question whether the true God would reveal the Quran when it contains such violent verses that conveniently support Muhammad’s violence, whereas the New Testament does not have such violence.

Second, Muslims believe that the New Testament is corrupted, whereas the Quran is inerrant. Even if we assume only for the sake of argument that these claims are true (but they actually are not), then why would reasonable seekers of the truth prefer the "pure" but violence-filled Quran over the "corrupted" but peaceful New Testament?

Before Muhammad is allowed to throw around unsubstantiated charges about alleged New Testament corruption, he and his Quran must pass a down-to-earth test regarding his dubious, violent practices. But he and it fail the test badly, as this article demonstrates, whereas Christ and the New Testament pass with a perfect score. Therefore, if Muhammad is so wrong about down-to-earth matters like whipping adulterers and cutting off the hands of thieves and beating wives, then he is likely wrong about unresearched accusations of New Testament corruption—and factually he is wrong.

Please refer to the articles listed on these pages for more information: [1], [2].

Third, since Muhammad who claims divine guidance is so wrong about practical matters, why should we believe him about theoretical matters like the deity of Christ and the Trinity, both of which he denies? Clearly, he was not divinely guided in practical matters because the true God would not degrade religion by endorsing such gruesome violence six hundred years after Christ came—the historical span is critical. Christ and the New Testament do not have even one example of such violence. Again, if Muhammad first fails the down-to-earth test, then he likely fails the theological or theoretical test—we have no reason to believe him in such high doctrines, especially since he was no theologian and his revelations are now empirically suspect.

The practical implications of the top ten reasons are as follows:

Fourth, nominal Christians who no longer take their faith seriously, but who are tempted to convert to Islam, must stop to think a second time. Christ the Son of God demonstrates the love of God (Matt. 3:16-17), not the wrath of an ordinary, self-described human messenger (Sura 3:144). Why would they trade in the religion of God’s peace and love for Allah’s human religion of violence?

Fifth, fanatical Muslims today are simply carrying on their prophet’s mission. Why should we be surprised if they want to conquer the West, in order to impose Allah’s will on non-Islamic societies? They are still working out Muhammad’s Crusades and trying to put a halt to the reality embodied in this simple logic:

(1) If A, then B. If Allah endorses Islam, then it should expand endlessly.
(2) Not-B. But it is not expanding endlessly.
(3) Therefore, not-A. Therefore, Allah does not endorse Islam.

This logic eats away at the heart of fanatics, especially premise two, even if they are not conscious of it in this logical form. What is stopping the endless expansion of Islam, according to the fanatics? Their answer: the US and even the very existence of the Jewish State of Israel in the heart of the Middle East. The fanatics have yet to uproot the Jews, despite three wars, which the Arabs lost. This tiny non-Islamic, Jewish State in their neighborhood slaps them in the face every day. How could Allah let this happen? Hence, premise two is the deepest reason that they have been launching attacks on the US and the West and Israel for the last two decades and why Osama bin Laden ignited 9/11. For more information on three Quranic verses that predict the worldwide dominance of Islam and that provide the motives for fanatics, refer to this article. And for more information on bin Laden’s motives specifically, go here.

Sixth, as noted in the introduction to this article, Muslim apologists who have access to the national media and who constantly assert that Islam is the religion of peace must stop misleading unsuspecting Westerners. Factually, Islam is not the religion of peace. True, it had peaceful moments, but not for very long. Muhammad sent out or went out on seventy-four expeditions, raids, and wars in only ten years (622-632), most of which were violent.

Seventh, western civilization must never accept the lie that Muhammad’s life, the Quran, and sharia (the law derived from the hadith and the Quran) are benefits to society. Rather, Islam represents many gigantic steps backwards, culturally and socially. One of the most tragic events in the western world in recent years—and one of the most underreported—is the existence of an Islamic court in Canada. The Canadian government should promptly shut it down. And such a court must never be allowed to exist here in the US. Sharia does not benefit society, bluntly stated.

Eighth and finally, Islam should never be taught in our public schools, K through 11. Perhaps grade 12 is acceptable, but only on one condition. If school administrators insist on teaching it, Islamic violence must be included in the lesson plans because it is part and parcel of early Islam and Muhammad’s life.

Of course, Muslim apologists assert that Christianity is filled with violence, citing the Roman Emperor Constantine and the Medieval Crusaders. However, to repeat, they are not foundational for Christianity—only Christ and the New Testament are. And he and the New Testament authors never practiced or endorsed such violence.

On the other hand, Muhammad and his Quran are foundational for Islam, and violence fills his life and its pages.

Therefore, for ten clear and verifiable reasons, Islam is not the religion of peace.

[ Note: This article has a companion piece: Does Islam improve on Christianity? — Muhammad fails Jesus’ simple fruit inspection. ]

Further reading:

Islam & Terrorism

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Copyright by James Malcolm Arlandson. Originally published at americanthinker.com, this article was slightly edited for Answering Islam.
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Articles by James Arlandson
Answering Islam Home Page

"Remember, ia786, everything is pre-destined by Allah. If you resent what Allah has destined, you are an apostate. You will burn in hell.

If you do not accept fate, if you complain about what Allah most high has destined, you are committing an enormity. You must accept what Allah has done for all Muslims. And, guess what ia786, Allah hates you!"

I'm sorry if I upset you Mentat, the truth can be very painful.

Did you know that more Muslims go to Mosque than Christians go to Church in the whole of the UK!! 2 million Muslims and there are 60+ Million Christians think about that!!

"Your civilization will fade and die."

They said that 1400 years ago!!! HA HA HA

ia786:

You are a loser who follows a loser religion.

The whole world laughs at Muslims and Islam. Whenever I see a Muslim, it's all I can do to stop from rolling on the floor laughing, you are so ridiculous. What's the difference between a robot and a Muslim? Just the name. One's a robot, the others a MOBOT!

Shukri/Shirk: You cannot compare and contrast the Old Testament with the New Testament. Read the WHOLE thing (both Books) and enlighten your sludge ridden mind. Oh, and Jesus loves you even though you worship the devil and his messenger.

You loser, ia786:

(1) If A, then B. If Allah endorses Islam, then it should expand endlessly.
(2) Not-B. But it is not expanding endlessly.
(3) Therefore, not-A. Therefore, Allah does not endorse Islam

"You are a loser who follows a loser religion."

I seem to have upset you old chap, I'm sorry ^_^
Islam is the fastest growing religion in the World. All Praise belongs to God, you can't do anything about it.
Many people in the West are accepting Islam, especially educated women, I know of many in the UK.

You may use this site to escape the real world, old chap, the truth is you can't do anything to Islam and you know it.

Islam is the fastest growing faith in the World

The Will of God be Done.

"Oh, and Jesus loves you even though you worship the devil and his messenger."

You think I am wrong and I think you are wrong. So be it. Jesus' return is imminent, we will both follow him, we will both honour him. We will be like brother and sister in faith.

How I long to be with Jesus son of the Blessed Mary.

God bring that day closer.

ia786:

What a joke! You are a joke and Islam is a joke.

"Many people in the West are accepting Islam, especially educated women, I know of many in the UK."

Those women may be educated, but they certainly are not smart. If ever there was a woman-hating religion, it is islam.

http://www.prophetofdoom.us/quotes5.html#women

"What a joke! You are a joke and Islam is a joke."

You seem very upset old chap, I'm sorry if I hurt your feelings.

However Islam is still the fastest growing faith in the World and there is nothing that you can do about it old chap.

The question you need to ask, Shukri... Is it okay to f*** a 9 year old.

Do you long to be with Jesus that said this?

13When Jesus came to the region of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, "Who do people say the Son of Man is?"
14They replied, "Some say John the Baptist; others say Elijah; and still others, Jeremiah or one of the prophets."

15"But what about you?" he asked. "Who do you say I am?"

16Simon Peter answered, "You are the Christ,[b] the Son of the living God."

17Jesus replied, "Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah, for this was not revealed to you by man, but by my Father in heaven. 18And I tell you that you are Peter,[c] and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades[d] will not overcome it.[e] 19I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; whatever you bind on earth will be[f] bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be[g] loosed in heaven." 20Then he warned his disciples not to tell anyone that he was the Christ.

ia786:

Allah is all-powerful. Allah is alive. He is moving. Allah is in the world. He reaches in, out and around us. He has told us he is closer to us than our jugular vein.

Allah has come to me. He came to me on 9/11. He caused me to turn on the television. He made me see his children jumping to their deaths, writhing in agony. He made me see his childrens’ pain. Allah forced me ask myself what has caused his children to kill his other children. Allah forced me to read the Qur’an. Not once. Not twice. But many times. And now, I read the Qur’an every day. Allah caused me to study the Sunnah. Allah brought the Sharia to me. Allah forced me to look upon these works. I protested. Allah, I said, why must I read these terrible, dark, hateful revelations? But Allah prevailed. I studied Islam. I sucked up this knowledge like a dry sponge.

And then Allah came to me again. He showed me my path. Allah put me on the straight path. Allah made me see that he has brought a flawed revelation to the Muslims. Allah showed me that day that my destiny is to help him destroy his flawed revelation. Allah is moving through me. He is guiding my hand. Allah is writing these words. Every day when I wake up I am filled with his spirit as he guides me to write journalists, politicians, academics and ordinary people to bring to them the truth of his flawed revelation. Allah has called me to help him destroy Islam.

Allah has called Robert Spencer. He has called Hugh Fitzgerald. He has called Ali Sina. He has called Ibn Warraq. He has called Taslima Nasrin. He pulled them out of darkness and into his light. He has called them to his struggle to destroy his flawed revelation. Allah is moving through me and through them.

And he is moving in you ia786. Every time he calls you to fight us, to destroy us, he is working in you to cause your destruction. For if you will not abandon Islam, he is forcing you to destroy yourselves and Islam with you. That is why he is calling you to death. That is why he is calling you out of the light and into the darkness. That is why he is calling you back. Allah is telling you to abandon Islam or face certain death at the hands of his helpers.

You think that if you bring death to us that Allah will smile on you. That he will give you power over us. That he will make us your slaves. You are wrong. When you bring us death, Allah will not smile. He will bring you destruction. He will burn and vaporize you. He will take you back to him – all of you. Allah knows he has made a mistake. Allah knows he has brought a flawed revelation. Allah is working to destroy that flawed revelation. You can see him moving everywhere. Allah has brought us a mighty victory in 1948 in Israel. Allah helped us to triumph again in Kuwait. Allah brought us victory in Afghanistan and Iraq. And Allah will bring us further victories until Muslims abandon Islam or they return to Allah.

Allah is alive. Allah is moving. Allah is working in the world. Look upon his handiwork, ia786. LOOK. Look upon his actions in this world.

From Million Dollar Baby, great movie:

Frankie: Father, that was a great sermon… made me weep.

Father Horvak: What’s confusing you this week?

Frankie: Oh, it’s the same old, “one God-three God” thing.

Father Horvak: Frankie, most people figure out by kindergarten that it’s about faith.

Frankie: Is it sort of like snap, crackle, and pop, all rolled into one big box?

Alphonse de LaMartaine in 'Historie de la Turquie,' Paris, 1854.

"Never has a man set for himself, voluntarily or involuntarily, a more sublime aim, since this aim was superhuman; to subvert superstitions which had been imposed between man and his Creator, to render God unto man and man unto God; to restore the rational and sacred idea of divinity amidst the chaos of the material and disfigured gods of idolatry, then existing. Never has a man undertaken a work so far beyond human power with so feeble means, for he (Muhammad) had in the conception as well as in the execution of such a great design, no other instrument than himself and no other aid except a handful of men living in a corner of the desert. Finally, never has a man accomplished such a huge and lasting revolution in the world, because in less than two centuries after its appearance, Islam, in faith and in arms, reigned over the whole of Arabia, and conquered, in God's name, Persia Khorasan, Transoxania, Western India, Syria, Egypt, Abyssinia, all the known continent of Northern Africa, numerous islands of the Mediterranean Sea, Spain, and part of Gaul.
"If greatness of purpose, smallness of means, and astonishing results are the three criteria of a human genius, who could dare compare any great man in history with Muhammad? The most famous men created arms, laws, and empires only. They founded, if anything at all, no more than material powers which often crumbled away before their eyes. This man moved not only armies, legislations, empires, peoples, dynasties, but millions of men in one-third of the then inhabited world; and more than that, he moved the altars, the gods, the religions, the ideas, the beliefs and the souls.

"On the basis of a Book, every letter which has become law, he created a spiritual nationality which blend together peoples of every tongue and race. He has left the indelible characteristic of this Muslim nationality the hatred of false gods and the passion for the One and Immaterial God. This avenging patriotism against the profanation of Heaven formed the virtue of the followers of Muhammad; the conquest of one-third the earth to the dogma was his miracle; or rather it was not the miracle of man but that of reason.

"The idea of the unity of God, proclaimed amidst the exhaustion of the fabulous theogonies, was in itself such a miracle that upon it's utterance from his lips it destroyed all the ancient temples of idols and set on fire one-third of the world. His life, his meditations, his heroic revelings against the superstitions of his country, and his boldness in defying the furies of idolatry, his firmness in enduring them for fifteen years in Mecca, his acceptance of the role of public scorn and almost of being a victim of his fellow countrymen... This dogma was twofold the unity of God and the immateriality of God: the former telling what God is, the latter telling what God is not; the one overthrowing false gods with the sword, the other starting an idea with words.

"Philosopher, Orator, Apostle, Legislator, Conqueror of Ideas, Restorer of Rational beliefs.... The founder of twenty terrestrial empires and of one spiritual empire that is Muhammad. As regards all standards by which human greatness may be measured, we may well ask, is there any man greater than he?"

30"He who is not with me is against me, and he who does not gather with me scatters. 31And so I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. 32Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.

Oh yeah... and Shukri/Shirk: JESUS never killed.

(*- Early Christians rejected Trinity -*)

They also had major problems and disagreements about who truly Jesus was and whether or not he got crucified or not:

The sections of this article are:

1- Early Christians rejected Trinity.
2- Questions to Trinitarian Christians.

3- Early Christians, especially during the 2nd century, had major disagreements and problems with each others about the identity of Jesus and whether or not he got crucified.

4- The quotes of Peter's Apocalypse that confirm Islam's claims. See link of Web site that contains the quotes. JESUS NEVER GOT CRUCIFIED!

1- Early Christians rejected Trinity:

The following was sent to me by brother Fikirman; may Allah Almighty always be pleased with him.

We, Muslims are not the only ones who believe that Jesus (peace be upon him) is mortal and not a god so that means we deny the trinity.

The Jews also reject the trinity, in addition to the very first groups of Christianity such as the Ebonites, the Corinthians, the Basilidians, the Capocratians, and the Hypisistarians never know about trinity doctrine at all. The Arians, Paulicians and Goths also accepted Jesus (peace be upon him) as a prophet of God and against the trinity.

Even in the modern age there are churches in Asia, in Africa, the Unitarian church, the Jehovah's witnesses, and even the majority of today's Anglican Bishops do not worship Jesus (peace be upon him) as one in three, as what been report by the "Daily News" 25/6/84 under the heading "Shock survey of Anglican Bishops."

Moreover, the 'Socinianism', the 17th-century Christian also rejects such traditional doctrines as the Trinity and original sin, the founder is Socinus, and his Latinized name of Lelio Francesco Maria Sozzini (1525-1562), the Italian Protestant theologian.

Johannes Greber (1874) a former of Catholic priest in his book 'The Communication with the Spirit World of God' in page 371 was written, "As you see, the doctrine of a triune Godhead is not only contrary to common sense, but is entirely unsupported by the Scriptures". So another priest who was deny the trinity.

A theologians, Edouard Schillebeeckx of the Netherlands in 1979 was writings some article that rejects the doctrine of the Trinity. This caused concern to the Vatican.

2- Question to Trinitarian Christians:

Why, for thousands of years, did none of God's prophets teach his people about the Trinity? At the least, would Jesus not use his ability as the Great Teacher to make the Trinity clear to his followers? Would God inspire hundreds of pages of Scripture and yet not use any of this instruction to teach the Trinity if it were the "central doctrine" of faith?

3- Early Christians, especially during the 2nd century, had major disagreements and problems with each others about the identity of Jesus and whether or not he got crucified:

Introductory Note:

Hebrews 5:7-8 confirm Islam's claim about Jesus never got crucified and contradicts the Bible! According to the documentary film, "Banned from the Bible", which I watched on the History Channel, some of Saint Peter's apocalypse were banned from the current Bible, and these Epistles contain what Islam claims - that Jesus didn't get crucified on the cross and it only appeared that he was. This banned part also says that Jesus was standing next to the cross laughing. These are the parts of the Bible that only few people in the world know about.

According to the documentary film, the apocalypse was very popular among Christians during the 2nd century. They believed "it was spiritually inspired" by GOD Almighty to Saint Peter. They actually had doubts about "John's apocalypse", which is known today as "the Book of Revelation". Interestingly also, this apocalypse says that after GOD Almighty fills both Heaven and Hell with inhabitants from Mankind, and the people of Hell get tortured for a long period of time, the People of Heaven will ask and Pray to GOD Almighty to Forgive the people of Hell. GOD Almighty will then eventually listen to their Prayers, and will order the "Gates and the Steel Bars of Hell" to be opened and allow the people of Hell to enter Heaven for Good. This apocalypse of Peter seems to also perfectly fit Noble Verse 7:40 in the Noble Quran where Allah Almighty Promised that He will eventually open the Gates of Heaven to all disbelievers and empty Hell. Please visit: Hell will eventually be empty according to Islam.

The following three posts from my message board contain the proofs and references about early apocalypses and epistles conflicting with trinity, Jesus' identity about being GOD, and the crucifixion story. During the 2nd century, it was widely believed among many Christians that Jesus never got crucified. This belief perfectly agrees with Islam.

First Post:

From http://www.answering-christianity.com/cgi-bin/message_board_islam/read_post.cgi?file_name=162/main.txt

From:
Subject:
Date: Osama Abdallah
The apocalypse of Peter confirms ISLAM'S Jesus never got crucified AND Hell will eventually be empty!
4/09/2004

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Peace be upon you everyone,

I just finished watching the documentary film, "Banned from the Bible" on the History Channel.

Please visit: Hebrews 5:7-8 confirm Islam's claim about Jesus never got crucified and contradicts the Bible! (http://www.answering-christianity.com/hebrews5_7.htm) According to the documentary film, some of Saint Peter's apocalypse were banned from the current Bible, and these Epistles contain what Islam claims - that Jesus didn't get crucified on the cross and it only appeared that he was. This banned part also says that Jesus was standing next to the cross laughing. These are the parts of the Bible that only few people in the world know about.

According to the documentary film, the apocalypse was very popular among Christians during the 2nd century. They believed "it was spiritually inspired" by GOD Almighty to Saint Peter. They actually had doubts about "John's apocalypse", which is known today as "the Book of Revelation". Interestingly also, this apocalypse says that after GOD Almighty fills both Heaven and Hell with inhabitants from Mankind, and the people of Hell get tortured for a long period of time, the People of Heaven will ask and Pray to GOD Almighty to Forgive the people of Hell. GOD Almighty will then eventually listen to their Prayers, and will order the "Gates and the Steel Bars of Hell" to be opened and allow the people of Hell to enter Heaven for Good. This apocalypse of Peter seems to also perfectly fit Noble Verse 7:40 in the Noble Quran where Allah Almighty Promised that He will eventually open the Gates of Heaven to all disbelievers and empty Hell. Please visit: Hell will eventually be empty according to Islam (www.answering-christianity.com/hell.htm).

Best regards,

Osama Abdallah

Second Post:

From http://www.answering-christianity.com/cgi-bin/message_board_islam/read_post.cgi?file_name=162/4.txt

From:
Subject:
Date: Osama Abdallah
RE:RE:The apocalypse of Peter confirms ISLAM'S Jesus never got crucified AND Hell will eventually be empty!
4/10/2004

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As'salamu Alaikum brother,

In regards to obtaining a copy of the banned apocalypse, I am not aware of any place that you can buy it from. But you can go to any major university and ask any theology professor and he should be able to assist you better.

You can purchase the documentary film, "Banned from the Bible", at www.historychannel.com and watch it for yourself.

In regards to the New Testament, there are 24,000 epistles (letters) found so far that were written about Jesus. Constantine, which came around year 300 decided to chose the current 30+ books and gospels of the "Cannon" or New Testament. But before that, many books or epistles were believed to be inspired, including this banned apocalypse. In fact, this apocalypse was "very popular" and was widely believed that it was "SPIRITUALLY INSPIRED TO SAINT PETER".

The point is, Contantine's decision along with his church is irrelevant here. The 30+ current books of the Bible are corrupted and were written by men. They were chosen from 24,000 epistles, and the 30+ books do contain contradictions in them regarding Jesus' divinity and identity. In www.answering-christianity.com/contra.htm, I have provided ample proof for this.

I personally don't have any proof about the divinity of the banned apocalypse, other than that it was widely believed in during the 2nd century and it perfectly agrees with Islam. To me, Islam's Truth proves the apocalypse's Truthfulness. It is an indirect proof, but it is the only proof anyone can give to any of the 24,000 epistles. Early Christians had major problems and disagreements about who truly Jesus was and whether or not he got crucified or not. Constantine's *easy way out* did not solve the problem, because his books and gospels do contain errors and contradictions in them as well, and some of them even suggest that Jesus never got crucified, as I explained in www.answering-christianity.com/hebrews5_7.htm.

Best regards,

Osama Abdallah

Third Post:

From http://www.answering-christianity.com/cgi-bin/message_board_islam/read_post.cgi?file_name=162/5.txt

From:
Subject:
Date: Osama Abdallah
The documentary film can be purchased at this link.....
4/10/2004

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://store.aetv.com/html/search/index.jhtml?search=banned+from+the+bible&x=0&y=0

Best regards,

Osama Abdallah

4- The quotes of Peter's Apocalypse that confirm Islam's claims:

The following quotes, proofs and references of the quotes were posted by brother Haytham on my message board, may Allah Almighty always be pleased with him. I have colored and bolded important points below to make easier to read.

From http://www.answering-christianity.com/cgi-bin/message_board_islam/read_post.cgi?file_name=162/7.txt

From:
Subject:
Date: Haytham
I GOT IT QUOTED HERE
4/11/2004

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The Savior said to me, "He whom you saw on the tree, glad and laughing, this is the living Jesus. But this one into whose hands and feet they drive the nails is his fleshly part, which is the substitute being put to shame, the one who came into being in his likeness. But look at him and me."

But I, when I had looked, said "Lord, no one is looking at you. Let us flee this place."

But he said to me, "I have told you, "Leave the blind alone!". And you, see how they do not know what they are saying. For the son of their glory instead of my servant, they have put to shame."

And I saw someone about to approach us resembling him, even him who was laughing on the tree. And he was filled with a Holy Spirit, and he is the Savior. And there was a great, ineffable light around them,and the multitude of ineffable and invisible angels blessing them. And when I looked at him, the one who gives praise was revealed.

And he said to me, "Be strong, for you are the one to whom these mysteries have been given, to know them through revelation, that he whom they crucified is the first-born, and the home of demons, and the stony vessel, in which they dwell, of Elohim, of the cross, which is under the Law. But he who stands near him is the living Savior, the first in him, whom they seized and released, who stands joyfully looking those who did him violence,while they are divided among themselves. Therefore he laughs at their lack of perception, knowing that they are born blind. So then the one susceptible to suffering shall come, since the body is the substitute.But what they released was my incorporeal body. But I am the intellectual Spirit filled with radiant light.He whom you saw coming to me is our intellectual Palermo , which unites the perfect light with my Holy Spirit."

Read on :

"But many others, who oppose the truth and are the messengers of error, will set up their error and their law against these pure thoughts of mine, as looking out from one perspective, thinking that good and evil are from one source. They do business in my word. And they will propagate harsh fate. The race of immortal souls will go in it in vain, until my Parousia. For they shall come out of them, and my forgiveness of their transgressions into which they fell through the adversaries, whose ransom I got from the slavery in which they were, to give them freedom that they may create an imitation remnant in the name of a dead man, who is Hermas, of the first-born of unrighteousness, in order that the light which exists may not believed by the little ones. But those of this sort are the worker who will be cast into the outer darkness, away from the sons of light. For neither will they enter, nor do they permit those who are going up to their approval for their release."

Taken from :

http://wesley.nnu.edu/noncanon/apoc/fgapcpt.htm

Note from me, Osama Abdallah: The article has moved to: http://wesley.nnu.edu/biblical_studies/noncanon/apoc/fgapcpt.htm

It is noteworthy that many other gospels contain similar messages. You guys need to understand and know that in the first century,

1) EVERY CHURCH HAD ITS OWN DOCTRINE

2) EVERY CHURCH HAD ITS OWN SCRIPTURES.

Not until the first council did the people in Rome set what we see today as the standard christian theology. All those other early churches have been persecuted and killed for their different views.

Salam Alaikum.

Somebody open a window and call maintenance!

ia786:

What is the Koran?

. . I must say, it [the Koran] is as toilsome reading as I ever undertook. A wearisome confused jumble, crude, incondite; endless iterations, long-windedness, entanglement; most crude, incondite; -- insupportable stupidity, in short! Nothing but a sense of duty could carry any European through the Koran . . . It is the confused ferment of a great rude human soul; rude, untutored, that cannot even read; but fervent, earnest, struggling vehemently to utter itself in words . . . We said "stupid:" yet natural stupidity is by no means the character of Mahomet's Book; it is natural uncultivation rather. The man has not studied speaking; in the haste and pressure of continual fighting, has not time to mature himself into fit speech . . . The man was an uncultured semi-barbarous Son of Nature, much of the Bedouin still clinging to him: we must take him for that. But for a wretched Simulacrum, a hungry Impostor without eyes or heart . . . we will not and cannot take him. Sincerity, in all senses, seems to me the merit of the Koran; what had rendered it precious to the wild Arab men . . . Curiously, through these incondite masses of tradition, vituperation, complaint, ejaculation in the Koran, a vein of true direct insight, of what we might almost call poetry, is found straggling.

Thomas Carlyle

http://www.victorianweb.org/authors/carlyle/heroes/lewkowicz10.html

Edward Montet, 'La Propagande Chretienne et ses Adversaries Musulmans,' Paris 1890. (Also in T.W. Arnold in 'The Preaching of Islam,' London 1913.)

"Islam is a religion that is essentially rationalistic in the widest sense of this term considered etymologically and historically....the teachings of the Prophet, the Qur'an has invariably kept its place as the fundamental starting point, and the dogma of unity of God has always been proclaimed therein with a grandeur a majesty, an invariable purity and with a note of sure conviction, which it is hard to find surpassed outside the pale of Islam....A creed so precise, so stripped of all theological complexities and consequently so accessible to the ordinary understanding might be expected to possess and does indeed possess a marvelous power of winning its way into the consciences of men."

is786
Save your breath, Christians and Jewish people do not live the Old Testament to the letter, because we use Intelligence and apply it in our daily lives, not like some people, who are stuck with a 7th century text and are totally either afraid to move on from it, or who agree with it. If the latter, what does it say about you?

The Bible is divinely inspired, not divinely written, not like your pile of rubbish.

Ever wonder why everybody finds your 'religion' repugnant? And you know its not just the hated
Christians and Jews that find it so, you know its every right-thinking people on earth. Are we all wrong, are you so superior, yet claiming victimhood for your ideology of hate, Well, I suppose, whatever gets you out of bed in the morning. Are you so evolved, as your Mo says, that you still revel in blood, rivers of it, that flow not just through your history but also through your present, do you find it insulting that everybody is now questioning your worship of blood sacrifice due to western translation over the last 100 years or so, and the internet, where before infidels were not allowed to own/read your koran, and we now know why, and your warriors were not allowed to take it into battle, and we now know why, because you DID NOT WANT THE INFIDEL TO KNOW HOW EVIL YOUR SO-CALLED RELIGION IS.

You know deep down how evil it is. All your learned people do. This is not a competition.
You know it's evil, you know it turns wrong into right. That's why you defend it to the death. You know it's a religion of death.

Do you ask yourself why women and children in your religion are expendable. All civilisations, no matter how barbaric, have cherished their women and children, yours alone doesn't. You slaughter your own women when they disagree in any way with your male-mandated ways. NO OTHER CULTURE DESTROYS SO WANTONLY ITS FOUNT OF LIFE, its own MOTHERS, SISTERS,DAUGHTERS.

No other culture on earth throws acid in the faces of their women. No other culture on earth refuses its women fresh air on their faces and through their hair. No other culture on earth locks women into the prison of their houses. No other culture butchers the bodies of their women.What are you doing to yourselves, you so-called men who only define yourselves by the prowess of your penises. You are truly pathetic. No other culture slaughters their women because male pride is in some, stupid, way offended.

You muslim men are consumed with the concept of dignity. Don't you realise that you have no dignity when you deny the personhood of your women. Don't you realise why non-muslims disrespect you because you insist on treating women as pieces of property, while at the same time insisting you respect them, which we know is a travesty.

You can't have it both ways. You want your sexual licence which islam gives you, you want your 4 revolving wives, which islam gives you, and your easy divorce, and your child brides, but you can't expect respect in return for this.

You want your sexual licence and your dignity. Well you can't have both. The sexual licence which your religion so kindly gives you invokes no respect from the rest of the world. You cannot have it both ways, although that is what you are obviously demanding.

I have no respect for any male muslim. To me, animals have more dignity, this virtue which is so important to muslims.

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead." -- Thomas Paine

The origin of the "Black" flag of Islam:

The "Black banner" is Muhammads raiding war banner. It was a white banner soaked in blood, and like dried blood, it looks black. there are many references to the "banner" in Islam's "holy books"
Tabari VII:11 “In this year the Messenger entrusted to Sa’d a white war banner for the expedition to Kharrar. Sa’d said, ‘I set out on foot at the head of twenty men. We used to lie hidden by day and march at night, until we reached Kharrar on the fifth morning. The caravan had arrived in town a day before. There were sixty men with it.”
Ishaq:578 “Crushing the heads of the infidels and splitting their skulls with sharp swords, we continually thrust and cut at the enemy. Blood gushed from their deep wounds as the battle wore them down. We conquered bearing the Prophet’s fluttering war banner. Our cavalry was submerged in rising dust, and our spears quivered, but by us the Prophet gained victory.”
Tabari VII:38 “I have been informed by authorities that Muhammad set out on 3 Ramadhan at the head of 310 of his companions. The war banner of the Messenger was carried by Ali. The banner of the Ansar was carried by Sa’d.”
Ishaq:580 “We helped Allah’s Apostle, angry on his account, with a thousand warriors. We carried his flag on the end of our lances. We were his helpers, protecting his banner in deadly combat. We dyed it with blood, for that was its color. We were the Prophet’s right arm in Islam. We were his bodyguards before other troops served him. We helped him against his opponents. Allah richly rewarded that fine Prophet Muhammad.”
Ishaq:470 “We attacked them fully armed, swords in hand, cutting through heads and skulls.”
Qur’an 61:4 “Surely Allah loves those who fight in His Cause.”
Ishaq:580 “Our strong warriors obey his orders to the letter. By us Allah’s religion is undeniably strong. You would think when our horses gallop with bits in their mouths that the sounds of demons are among them. The day we trod down the unbelievers there was no deviation or turning from the Apostle’s order. During the battle the people heard our exhortations to fight and the smashing of skulls by swords that sent heads flying. We severed necks with a warrior’s blow. Often we have left the slain cut to pieces and a widow crying alas over her mutilated husband. ’Tis Allah, not man we seek to please.”

Allah is all-powerful; Allah is all-knowing. And, if there is only one God, then why do Muslims believe in Genies?

Why must Muslims believe in Genies? Ali Dashti explains why all Muslims must believe in Genies:

“Genies resemble humans but are normally invisible. There are male genies (jenni) and female genies (jenniya), malevolent genies, and benevolent genies or fairies. On rare occasions a genie is seen by a human, and it is even possible for a fairy princess to fall in love with a man or for a male genie to love a woman. …

No commentator or theologian, however, has denied the existence of genies, because they are mentioned in more than ten Qur’anic passages and are explicitly stated, in verse 14 of sura 55 (or-Rahman), to have been created by God out of smokeless fire. Moreover sura 72, which is known as the Surat ol-Jenn, states in its first two verses that a company of genies listened (to the Qur’an being recited) and said, “We have heard a wonderful Qur’an. It guides to righteousness, so we have believed in it and will never ascribe any partner to our Lord.”

The ancient Arabs, like other primitive peoples, believed in the existence of good and evil spirits, and the more readily because of the harshness and solitude of their desert environment. There is a report that when an Arab dismounted to spend the night in an uninhabited waste, he would be so frightened that he would utter supplications to the king of the fairies to shelter him and to the king of the genies to prevent impudent genies from molesting him. Verse 6 of sura 72 warns that taking shelter with genies only makes them more impudent.

While it is easy to understand why illusions and irrational ideas are so common among primitive peoples and lower classes of advanced nations, it is surprising to find them in a book deemed to be God’s word and in the preaching of a man who challenged his own people’s superstitions and sought to reform their customs and morals.”

pp. 159-160, 23 Years: A Study of the Prophetic Career of Mohammad, by Ali Dashti, (Mazda Publishers, 1994)

"Save your breath, Christians and Jewish people do not live the Old Testament to the letter, because we use Intelligence and apply it in our daily lives"

That’s a great relief to me as the Talmud the Jewish Good book promotes paedophilia.

The Talmud is Judaism’s holiest book. Its authority takes precedence over the Old Testament in Judaism. Evidence of this may be found in the Talmud itself, Erubin 21b (Soncino edition p. 149): "My Son, be more careful in the observance of the words of the Scribes than in the words of the Torah (Old Testament).

"A maiden aged three years and a day may be acquired in marriage by coition, and if her deceased husband's brother cohabits with her, she becomes his. — Sanhedrin 55b"

"MISHNAH A girl of the age of three years and one day may be betrothed by intercourse … (Niddah 44b)"

"MISHNAH. A GIRL OF THE AGE OF THREE YEARS AND ONE DAY MAY BE BETROTHED BY INTERCOURSE; … IF ONE WAS YOUNGER THAN THIS AGE INTERCOURSE WITH HER IS LIKE PUTTING A FINGER IN THE EYE.
— Babylonian Talmud, Tractate Niddah 44b
Soncino 1961 Edition, page 309"

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead." -- Thomas Paine

I'm bored guys. You play with this troll for a while. Like all these Muslim fanatics he has lost the power of rational thought, which, of course, is why they are such looooooooooooooosers!

http://www.lampholderpub.com/Imam%20Mahdi,%20new_page_25.html

How about this Shukri and ia786

In the Islamic Hadith, the hour for the end-of-the-world, and the prophets who awake at the Last Judgment [salawatullahi ta'ala 'alaihim ajmain], cannot occur until the al-Mahdi comes forth, "the Guided one," the descendant of Fatima from the family of Muhammad. Mahdi is a man, not a prophet. In Islamic eschatology, Mahdi will lead the people for seven years just prior to the return of the [Islamic] Jesus [Isa]. Mahdi will lead Muslims in victory over an anti-christ (the Dajjal), Europeans, Americans, Jews, and the white race in general. A great war known as al-Malhamah al-Kubrah (also known to the Christian as Armageddon) will occur upon the face of the Earth. According to Islamic prophecy, this war will be carried out because Al-Hajj.39 permits Muslims to fight [against disbelievers; qitl fee sibil-Allah; Infidels] who fight against Muslim believers' victory [the al-Mumrin]. NOTE: All Infidels are nonMuslims, and the hypocrites [and apostates] are Muslims who align with the Infidels. Apostate Muslims and the mushrik [polytheist] are considered counterfeit and not considered to be true, authentic Muslims. They, along with the Infidels, are to be eliminated

More from that site:

Again, the purpose is to conquer and dominate the world for Islam and to encompass the Islamic Khilafah as one great state. This one-world domination may be reflected in the two-fold representation of the Islamic standard [flag, banner containing the Shari`ah Islamic Law or Creed] - one flag is for jihad [war] and one for state/government [Ibn Majah; Islamic ruled

Religion of peace?

ia786
Well you've made my point for me. Go away and keep your dignity with a 9 year old.

We can all quote from scriptures that we don't live by today.

Yours is the only 'religion' that insists on living forever according to disgusting 7th century rantings. Ask your ayatollah khomeini, he 'married'a ten-year-old who died having a miscarriage at eleven. He also waxed lyrical on the assault of female babies. Wonderful role model, though only following in the footsteps of the 'seal', the laughing killer. Lots to be proud of here.

Rest assured that thousands of well-respected sheiks in the arab world have child-slave-sex-object-brides.

No doubt you're proud of this.

I’ve seen and read the ultra venomous speeches from the islamic leaders that can be seen and read at memri.org. Contrast that with George W. Bush’s speech tonight.

If I were a muslim I would be embarrassed and ashamed.

Okay... allah/simon says: Everyone spin around four times, and tap their shoes three times while spinning, and shout out loud ten times (still spinning) "Allah Akbar". Then put your ass in the air a minimum of 12 times in synch (stop spinning at this juncture, because allah says it is hard to watch you spin with your ass in the air and this could be misconstrued as "break dancing" which is something practiced by infidels). And allah/tallah knows best.

Now, allah/simon says, "don't you fart during this exercise, or the entire spin/spell/prayer will be broken" and your prayer will not be heard, and all that physical exercise will be for naught. Got that? And if a woman is menstruating or even if she's a woman, she can't enter the holy mosque, ... or join your spinning/chanting class. allah Says beat her. If she farts during the beating, beat her again until there is no more farting, and tell her that allah says "biotch, you can't break dance, much less break wind".

Even in the midst of fartaing, mujahadeen... keep shouting and chanting and praying and spinning (no farting, by allah) and work to follow the instructions above and you will not die in allah's hell fire which he has prepared for you before the earth was even the earth:

And for allah's sake you have to scream "this",

"Islam is the fastest growing faith in the World"

Any takers for allah's suicide spinning class?

Posted by at April 28, 2005 08:58 PM

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead." -- Thomas Paine

Agreed. Time for Ia to go. How can one argue with a wall? And when have his arguments ever made sense (like that misquote from Hebrews, long recognized as tripe when used in the manner he means)? I'm glad he agrees though by inference that the Quran is an evil book, and that Mohammed was indeed a paedophile. That being done, I suppose his complaints are at an end. That was a pretty fast pwnage for me to impose, even by the low standards of argument one expects from Ia.

By the by, the nonsense about each Church having its "own gospels" and "own traditions" is not exactly news, although the malicious spin you put on it is...not exactly news either. I suppose you've never heard of the Council of Nicaea. Ah well. And what exactly is the "Apocalypse of Peter" meant to prove, per se? =D That he didn't get crucified. OMG. Go back and re-read it, Ia. You're reaching for other people's straws now.

Good post from 1913 though. Very up-to-date by your standards. You've gained almost 1200 years on the rest of your co-religionists; unfortunately that places you in the same era as that other work you're so fond of: The Protocols of Zion.

Good post Carolyn2.

And as for islam being the fastest-growing faith in the world, and there being "nothing one can do about it"; that's kind of like saying "well Naziism is the fastest-growing religion in Germany in 1937, old chap, and there is absolutely nothing you can do about it".

Wrong, I'm afraid. More and more muslims are waking up and fleeing their religion - perhaps 20% or more of the total in the UK, despite threats and harassment. Do you have five muslim friends, Ia? Statistically speaking, one of them is already an apostate. And there's a world of things we can do to open the eyes of the rest, and we're doing it - right here, right now, despite your anti-Semitism.

And there's absolutely nothing you can do about it, old chap.

Geoff

OT, Hasan Akbar gets death

http://www.littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/

Also, it ill behoves a muslim to accuse others of pedophilia. You are walking on very shaky ground here.

To preempt you, IT IS NOT CONDONED IN THE NON-MUSLIM WORLD but it is certainly in the muslim world. You like your little boys, don't you?

Allah demonstrated that he hated you in Spain in 1492. Allah showed that he hated you at Lepanto in 1571. Allah said, "I hate you" at Vienna in 1683. Allah showed that he hated you in 1699 when the Habsburgs recovered Hungary. Allah demonstrated he hated you again in 1770 when the Russians destroyed the Ottoman fleet at Cesme. 1771 - Allah gives Crimea to the Russians. Allah gives Serbia and Greece back to the Serbs and Greeks in 1829. Allah gives Crete away - 1908. Allah gives Bulgaria back to the Bulgarians - 1909. Allah gives Bosnia-Herzegovina away - 1909. Allah gives Montenegro away - 1910. ALLAH DISBANDS THE MUSLIM CALIPHATE - 1924. Why would he do that, pray tell? 1948 - Allah creates Israel. 2001 - invasion and occupation of Afghanistan. 2004 - invasion and occupation of Iraq. Do you understand yet,ia786? ALLAH HATES YOU. Allah loves Western civilization!

Thanks for keeping records, Mentat. You forgot to mention East Timor, which was utterly destroyed by Indo's Muslims before they were forced out by Australian peacekeepers.

Anyway, seems that you are all, left and right, very much into the religion. Perhaps I should add this:

Belief is just belief, books are just books, all of them are written by man/men, God never wrote a book, and neither did Mohammed. The wisdom from thousands of years ago is obsolete in todays world, at least for the most part. But to kill, murder, cheat, lie and steal in the name of a marauding desert bedouin who was illiterate, cruel and primitive, that definitely is not the way to build a civilization and to call that 'culture' or 'religion' is an insult to anyone's intelligence.

Islam probably wouldn't be an issue today if we had not lost the
'Will to Rule': If we had occupied the oilfields without showering the camel-riding and goat molesting desert Arabs with billions and billions of undeserved wealth for which they have no other use than to build mosques and madrassahs to propagate hatred of 'unbelievers', then Islam wouldn't be an issue today and would just naturally fade away. But again, that is not science, just 'my belief'...

Terminator, we use all the weapons at hand.

From an online article:

"Muslim fundamentalists launched their suicide attacks against Israel and the U.S. with a firm belief that they will immediately go to a paradise populated by 72 black-eyed virgins. 

The "Catch-22" to a Muslim fundamentalist is that they firmly believe that if they touch anything from a pig at death, they are doomed forever. 

Imagine what would go through the thoughts of a suicide terrorist onboard a bus in Israel as he or she pushes the button on the bomb taped to his body, and then their gaze sees a bag of pig lard glued to the bus, just above the heads of  the innocent Jewish and Arab passengers.  I wonder how soon signs will begin appearing outside stores and clubs in the Mideast saying; "protected against swine with swine"?

Before World War I, U.S. General "Blackjack" Pershing put down an Islamic insurgent movement in the Philippines by having 50 captured Islamic fundamentalist terrorist tied to posts for execution by firing squad.  In full view of all 50, Pershing had his men slaughter two pigs.  Pershing's men next dipped their bullets in the pigs blood, making sure the horrified terrorists watched.  Blackjack's men shot 49 of these terrorists, dumped their bodies in a common grave and covered them with pig parts.  The 50th terrorist was let go.

After this, it took 42 more years before there was another serious Islamic terrorist incident in the Philippines. "

Mentat:
The creator of Islam was nothing but an unscrupulous con-man. He knew that Arab primitives, who were illiterate and unaware of the Biblical tradition, could not be sold any pseudo-religios system that didn't include demons (jinn), thus he included the fiction into his murder cult.

A whole bunch of total BS on what "true" islam is :

http://www.malaysia-today.net/Blog-e/2005/01/what-non-muslims-should-know-about.htm

Friday, January 28, 2005
What non-Muslims should know about Islam
SPECIAL REPORT

Prime Minister Abdullah Ahmad Badawi has just addressed the OIC. You could summarise Abdullah’s address as a call to all Muslims worldwide for a redefinition of the concept of JIHAD. Jihad is probably the most misunderstood word in Islam basically because of the 911 incident.

Malaysia Today has attempted, but failed miserably, to start an intellectual Islamic discourse in this site. Unfortunately, Malaysians are just not capable of engaging in a matured and intellectual discourse so we were forced to close down the Islamic Debate blog. And Malay-Muslims as well as the non-Muslims are equally guilty of this.

In the early days, pre-1960s, anyone converting to Islam were said to be ‘masuk Melayu’ (literal translation meaning ‘entering Malay’ -- or more accurately ‘becoming a Malay’ because ‘entering Malay’ could have sexual connotations).

This is how Malays of that era thought and to a certain extent they still think this today because when non-Muslims convert to Islam they expect them to wear a songkok if not then they are not true Muslims. Well, in Indonesia, Christians too wear songkoks.

When you speak to Malay-automatic-born-Muslims you get a very narrow understanding of Islam as the Malay bloggers in Malaysia Today have proven. But when you speak to ex-Christians now Muslims, in particular from the West, who converted to Islam because they discovered that it is a beautiful religion, you begin to ask yourself, “Are they really Muslims?” This perplexed reaction is primarily because their version of what Islam is and stands for seems to be a great departure from that expounded by the Malays in Malaysia.

I regard myself as a ‘born again Muslim’ if there is such a thing. The purpose of this Special Report is not to convert non-Muslims to Islam (but it would be a bonus if they did) but to call upon the Malay-Muslims to explain properly ‘real Islam’ to the non-Muslims and not shout that they will enter Hell if they do not.

You will see that many Malays have posted comments in this site saying that we should practice ‘the true teachings of Islam’. Non-Muslims, in turn, have challenged these Malays to explain ‘WHAT is the true teaching of Islam’.

The Malays who made this call for us to revert to the true teachings of Islam have so far not responded. Either they feel it is no use trying to convince non-Muslims about the beauty of Islam, since they have very fixed ideas anyway and would still not be convinced, or they themselves do not really know what the true teaching of Islam is.

Before you all jump on me, let me assure you this Special Report is not aimed at Malay-bashing. It is an attempt, and a feeble one at that maybe, to correct the misconception regarding Islam that has resulted in Islam becoming the new bogeyman due to the actions of the likes of Osama bin Ladin, if he really does exist.

So here goes:

My name is Yusuf Estes and I am the National Muslim Chaplain for American Muslims, sponsored by a number of organisations here in Washington, DC. As such, I travel around the entire world lecturing and sharing the message of the Christ of the Quran in Islam. We hold dialogs and discussion groups with all faiths and enjoy the opportunity to work alongside of rabbis, ministers, preachers and priests everywhere. Most of our work is in the institutional area, military, universities and prisons. Primarily our goal is to educate and communicate the correct message of Islam and who the Muslims really are. Although Islam has grown now to tie Christianity as the largest of religions on earth, we see many of those who claim Islam as Muslims, that do not correctly understand nor properly represent the message of "Peace, Surrender and Obedience to God" (Arabic = 'Islam').

I was born into a very strong Christian family in the Midwest. Our family and their ancestors not only built the churches and schools across this land, but actually were the same ones who came here in the first place. While I was still in elementary we relocated in Houston, Texas in 1949 (I'm old). We attended church regularly and I was baptized at the age of 12 in Pasadena, Texas. As a teenager, I wanted to visit other churches to learn more of their teachings and beliefs. The Baptists, Methodists, Episcopalians, Charismatic movements, Nazarene, Church of Christ, Church of God, Church of God in Christ, Full Gospel, Agape, Catholic, Presbyterian and many more. I developed quite a thirst for the "Gospel" or as we say; "Good News". My research into religion did not stop with Christianity. Not at all! Hinduism, Judaism, Buddhism, Metaphysics, native American beliefs were all a part of my studies. Just about the only one that I did not look into seriously was "Islam".

ALLAH: does it mean God?

In fact "Allah" is the perfect word to describe the "One God" of monotheism.

Where Does It Come From?

"Allah" comes from the Arabic word "elah" - (Arabic) means 'a god' or something that is worshipped.

Allah = Has no gender (not male and not female)
Allah = Always singular - Never plural
Allah =Means "The Only One to be Worshipped"

Is "Allah" only for Islam and Muslims?

"Allah" is the same word used by Christian and Jewish Arabs in the Bible, before Islam came.

On page one [1] of Genesis in the Old Testament, we find the word "Allah" seventeen [17] times.

- Chaplain Yusuf Estes

Six Beliefs (Muslims must believe in the six articles of faith):

Allah
Angels
Books
Prophets
Judgment Day
Predestination

Allah - Believe God Almighty is One, Unique, Unlike His Creation, Perfect in every way; Not like or in His Creation

Angels - Made from light, follow Allah's orders perfectly, never make mistakes and are never disobedient (devil is not a fallen angel in Islam).

Books - Torah (Old Testament), Suhoof (Scriptures of prophets), Zabur (Psalms), Enjil (Evangel or New Testament), Quran (Recitation to Muhammad)

Prophets - Adam, Noah, Abraham, Jacob, Moses, David, Solomon, Jesus, Muhammad, and others mentioned in Books, peace be upon them all.

Resurrection - All people, believers and disbelievers will be resurrected for Judgment Day in real flesh and blood bodies to be judged.

Divine Destiny - Allah has complete control of all that happens, both good and evil and He has full knowledge of it all.

Five Actions (The Muslim must practice the five things):

Shahadah
Salat
Fasting
Charity
Pilgrimmage

Declare The Belief That Allah is ONE and Muhammad, peace be upon him, Is His Last Messenger

5 Daily "salat" - The special form of worship of standing, bowing, prostrating to Allah while facing Mecca.

Fast Ramadhan - Not eating or drinking during the daylight hours for the month of Ramadhan (Lunar calander).

Pay Alms Tax - 2 1/2% of Exess wealth distributed annually to the poor and needy.

Hajj - Pilgrimmage to Mecca once in the life when Allah provides a way, and it is safe to do so.

PEACE

"Salam" (peace) is the most common word on a Muslim's tongue.

"Whenever two people meet, they exchange greetings, wishing each other peace: "Peace be upon you." But peace cannot prevail except through justice. Since the concept of justice may differ from one man to another, or from one society to another, Muslims believe that real justice is that which is specified by Allah (God).

Islam permits fighting in self-defense, in defense of the religion, or by those who have been expelled forcibly from their homes. At the same time, Islam requires one to treat one's enemy mercifully. It lays down strict rules of combat which include prohibitions against harming civilians and against destroying crops, trees, and livestock. Islam also requires that if an enemy declares his desire to end hostilities and seek peace, the Muslims must do the same.

"Peace" is mentioned 58 times in the Holy Quran and it is certainly the most sought after condition for the life of every human on earth.

"Peace" is also one of the attributes which Allah has named Himself by in the Holy Quran: "He is Allah beside Whom there is none worthy of worship, The King, The Holy, The Peace, The Watcher, The All Mighty, The Compeller, The Supreme. Glory be to Allah! He is above all that they try to associate with Him as partners." [Holy Quran 59:23]

We are all striving to achieve some sort of peace and tranquillity in our lives. And providing that the other four conditions have been met, then this is the inevitable result of the one who is truly seeking Allah.

So as soon as he or she has totally surrendered and submitted and obeyed Allah, in complete sincerity and as a result has achieved total and complete peace in this life and in the next.

It does not imply that they will not be tested however. And this must be quickly understood. The one whom Allah loves, He tests. The person who will be successful in this life and the Next Life will be tested as Allah has said: "Do they think that they will be left alone on saying, 'We believe and that they will not be tested'? For sure we will test them as we have tested those who came before them, to show (them) the truthful of the honest and the liars in their falsehood." [Quran 29:2-3]

Once we humble ourselves, rid ourselves of our egoism and submit totally to Allah, and to Him exclusively, in faith and in action, we will surely feel peace in our hearts. Establishing peace in our hearts will bring about peace in our external conduct as well.

JIHAD

The concept of Jihad ("Holy War" or struggling in the cause of Allah) is stated in the Qur'an. Allah said: "Fight in the cause of God those who fight you, but do not transgress limits. God does not love transgressors." [2:19]

Jihad is never to be waged to force anybody to choose a particular religion. On the contrary, it is waged to protect his right to choose freely. Therefore, if there is a force in the world that tries to prevent a person from practicing this right, Jihad may lead to fighting the force that is trying to prevent him from exercising free will.

FUNDAMENTAL RIGHTS IN ISLAM

Islam has been from its inception very concerned about the importance of rights. Usually we speak in terms of human rights, women's rights or even animal rights. However, Islam goes into far more detail and in categorical order as to what rights are really all about.

There is a famous hadeeth (teaching of Muhammad, peace be upon him) wherein he said, "Ihdeenah naseehah." Many people, even Muslims have mistranslated this to mean, "Islam is about giving advise". However, this is most incorrect as can quickly be established by simple considering the context of how the prophet, peace be upon him, used the term "naseehah," by simply reading the rest of what he said. Let us consider the hadeeth in its entirety.

Privacy, freedom, dignity and equality are guaranteed in Islam. The holy Qur'an states clearly: "Let there be no compulsion in religion." [Holy Quran 2:256]

The lives, property and privacy of all citizens in an Islamic state are considered sacred, whether or not the person is Muslim. Non-Muslims have freedom of worship and the practice of their religions, including their own family law and religious courts. They are obliged to pay a different tax (Jizyah) instead of the Zakah, and the state is obligated to provide both protection and government services. Before the modern era it was extremely rare to find a state or government anywhere in the world that was as solicitous of its minorities and their civil rights as the Islamic states.

In no other religion did women receive such a degree of legal and moral equality and personal respect. Moreover, racism and tribalism are incompatible with Islam, for the Qur'an speaks of human equality in the following terms: "Mankind! We created you from a single soul, male and female, and made you into nations and tribes, that you may come to know one another. Truly, the most honored of you in God's sight is the greatest of you in piety." [Holy Quran 49:13]

THE POSITION OF JESUS IN ISLAM

Islam honours all the prophets who were sent to mankind. Muslims respect all prophets in general, but Jesus in particular, because he was one of the prophets who foretold the coming of Muhammad. Muslims, too, await the second coming of Jesus. They consider him one of the greatest of Allah's prophets to mankind. A Muslim does not refer to him simply as "Jesus," but normally adds the phrase "peace be upon him" as a sign of respect.

"Behold!' the Angel said, God has chosen you, and purified you, and chosen you above the women of all nations. Mary, God gives you good news of a word from Him, whose name shall be the Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, honored in this world and in the Hereafter, and one of those brought near to God. He shall speak to the people from his cradle and in maturity, and he shall be of the righteous. She said: "My Lord! How shall I have a son when no man has touched me?'

He said: "Even so; God creates what He will. When He decrees a thing,

He says to it, 'Be!' and it is." [3:42-47]

Muslims believe that Jesus was born immaculately, and through the same power which had brought Eve to life and Adam into being without a father or a mother.

Prophet Muhammad emphasized the importance of Jesus by saying: "Whoever believes there is no god but Allah, alone without partner, that Muhammad is His messenger, that Jesus is a servant and messenger of God, His word breathed into Mary and a spirit emanating from Him, and that Paradise and Hell are true, shall be received by God into Heaven. [Bukhari]

posted 10:54 AM

97 Comments:
Anonymous said...
We can even learn more about Islam from http://harunyahya.com

11:51 AM
Pintu Gate said...
Here is another spin on Islam to make it palatable. It realty make me sick when they claim they “knows” the correct interpretation of Islam. Every Muslim “knows” the problem. Every fool is a Muslim. Hence every damn Muslim is a known fool.

He says

“Prophet Muhammad emphasized the importance of Jesus by saying: "Whoever believes there is no god but Allah, alone without partner, that Muhammad is His messenger, that Jesus is a servant and messenger of God, His word breathed into Mary and a spirit emanating from Him,”

Ask this moron if Jesus died on the cross and rose from the death. Do I have to tell you what kind of answer you will get? Raja will you step up to the plate? In case you don’t get it. Islam came 600 years after Christianity but Islam know better about Jesus than Christians? The Koran knows better about Jesus than the New Testament? Give me a brake you damn fool!

He says:

The lives, property and privacy of all citizens in an Islamic state are considered sacred, whether or not the person is Muslim. Non-Muslims have freedom of worship and the practice of their religions, including their own family law and religious courts.”

Can you built a temple or a church next to a mosque? Do you know how many temples and churches are listed for demolition by the state of Selangor? Too many my friends. In Malacca the State build a mosques first while the state hospital was going to the dogs. It took them 20 years to up grade the hospitals. What kind of Islamic bullshit is it ?
And read what this fools is writing. Doesn’t that make you sick to your stomach?? This is absolutely bullshit. Lies after lies. Islam is evil.

He says”

The concept of Jihad ("Holy War" or struggling in the cause of Allah) is stated in the Qur'an. Allah said: "Fight in the cause of God those who fight you, but do not transgress limits. God does not love transgressors." [2:19]

Go tell it to the likes of Osama Bin Ladin and they will quote verses after verses of the Koran as I can to point out where it tell them to kill the infidels.

2:191 And slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. And fight not with them at the Inviolable Place of Worship until they first attack you there, but if they attack you (there) then slay them. Such is the reward of disbelievers.

3:12 Say (O Muhammad) unto those who disbelieve: Ye shall be overcome and gathered unto Hell, an evil resting-place.

3:10 (On that Day) neither the riches nor the progeny of those who disbelieve will aught avail them with Allah. They will be fuel for Fire.

I really cannot find any verses in Koran to support what this fool is perching. If any of you know something better please enlighten me.

He says:
“"Salam" (peace) is the most common word on a Muslim's tongue.”

Who is this guy fooling? I am sure kill is mention more than times than peace! If I have the time I will count but it will make me ill!

He says”
“Islam permits fighting in self-defense, in defense of the religion, or by those who have been expelled forcibly from their homes. At the same time, Islam requires one to treat one's enemy mercifully. It lays down strict rules of combat which include prohibitions against harming civilians and against destroying crops, trees, and livestock. Islam also requires that if an enemy declares his desire to end hostilities and seek peace, the Muslims must do the same.”

Can any of you Muslim in Malaysia give me a an example of such behavior among you ? For godsake…do you know how many million muslim were killed during the Iran Iraq war? Millions!!!! And look at Iran now. What do you see? God or Satan?

12:36 PM
zam said...
WOW.! WTF is wrong with this 'pintu'?, it seems that u are a really disturbed person. What is it that u hate about Islam so much that u put it this low..? Are you an Atheist ? free thinker ? explain..? I noticed you have a tendency of being very anti-islamic.

Now,if u can get away with this, than why can't i dedicate my life in being the total opposite of what you are.. because i for one cannot stomach whatever crap that u spew from your mind in the name of righteousness.

Explain to me your religion, your belief, your ideal lifestyle and I sure as hell hope that you are leading a better way of living and thinking than what you have professed so far in this blog.Can i have your full name,address,neighbourhood so i can check with your family, neighbours,father and mother on what kind of person you are..You must be a higher benevolent omniscient,omnipotent,ever-present being
than the rest of us humans.Flawless right?

3:12 PM
Pintu Gate said...
Zam:
Just answer my questions unless you are a retard or a reject.
I can’t seem to get even one decent “Iblis” to answer my questions!What the hell is going on there?

3:41 PM
Anonymous said...
This 'pintu gate' is actually a pintu gate to Hell. Dunno how to help this guy. Pls God, have mercy on his soul & give him 'Hidayah'. Amin.

3:44 PM
Pintu Gate said...
This post has been removed by a blog administrator.

3:59 PM
Anonymous said...
Something are really wrong with u...
Are you ISLAM?
Are your really ISLAM?
If not?
Stop talking about Islam...

4:04 PM
Pintu Gate said...
3:44
How the hell you want to help others when you morons can’t even help yourselves!

4:05 PM
Pintu Gate said...
4:04

Make me you moron!

4:06 PM
zam said...
Hey Pintu..take a step back and take a reality check.
Just because Islam is being targeted and being the "menu of the day" for these mofo doesnt mean that its the biblical truth you know. Dont tell me no other religion hasnt fought wars in the ground of their gods.My point is blood has been shed in the name of religion for centuries..Too bad that now Islam is being highlighted just because of religious fanatics like OBL and GW,and its happening primarily in our time.Its the cycle of every religion to have its glory days and down time.Dont tell me about being hollier than thou,about satan and God.

If i wanted to smash your face today,its because u are acting as a complete arsehole and not because of your religious background or race. Tell me now that Zionism is way better than every other religion and you accept the fact that in their eyes you are also Gohyim and your blood can be spilled for the glory of their people,nation and god. Why do you want to do this ? why do you put my God in the same level as the iblis ? Doing this gives you pleasure and satisfaction? or is there an ulterior motive that i sense..Of course in order to be fair, i will try to reason on why do you keep pursuing this issue.Yes, there are unfairness going on in this country and the world for that matter, but to pick Islam and dump all the crap there is just not fair.Its like your mother cannot be blamed for bringing you in this world if you turned out like this..!

4:38 PM
Anonymous said...
I tend to agree with Pintu Gate, but his "anger" are sometimes over the top. With all the "peaceful" sayings in the Koran - you can find another 10 that preaches violence. Further to that, a lot of the more peaceful sayings are abrogated (replaced) by harsher and violent ones. So tell me which teachings of the Koran should one follow? I see Pintu Gate has been asking this question numerous times, but sadly no one has step up to the plate to refute his "allegations". Just ask yourself; if this is a true religion - why would God preach so much hate and violence. Why in the first place would God preach hate and violence.

4:42 PM
Anonymous said...
well some have shed blood in the name of religion while US shed blood in the name of democracy and of course OIL.....

4:48 PM
Pintu Gate said...
Seriouly 4:42:

I am actually laughing so hard reading all the response to my comment. I am just waiting for one person to be straight with me. No one has except Raja of course who is just dancing around the issue. I am highly technical person. At work I have to analyses thousand of lines of computer codes. There is no room for bullshit. No room for error. If someone made a mistake I prefer him or her to admit so that I can go on with my job. Mistake is just normal part of life. If a person tries to deny it, to hide it, and to pussy foot around it, problem solving becomes extremely difficult and nerve wrecking. It makes my life miserable. I really get pissed. If these Muslim Malays admits they are retard , reject and absolutely useless then I am gone. Until then I have insult them shame. But the question is, how to shame a shameless race?

Anon 4:42
You are a well-informed person. You seem to know the issues concerning "abrogated (replaced) by harsher and violent ones" in the Islamic scriptures. Islamic polemic and apologetic is very screwed up! The Muslim malay have no clue WTF they belief

5:11 PM
Anonymous said...
Pet and bloggers all, Good night.

I Me Me Mine is the attitude of the day then why continue?

5:39 PM
Raja Petra Kamarudin said...
I have only one question for all the above posters, never mind who they are: do you wish for this blog to continue or do you wish for me to close it down? I can, if you REALLY wish, close it down, plus ALL the others as well if that makes everyone happy. I just aim to please. And if SOME of you decide not to come back after that because there is no longer a blog for you to vent your anger to release you frustrations due to whatever your hang-ups may be; whether it be a dead end career or a boring sex life; I can live with that. My life will remain the same and I will lose no sleep.

It is your call. I will come back in an hour or two and see how we develop. And if clearly that is what you want I will certainly oblige you.

I know for a fact that some officers from Bukit Aman have been sent to Cyberjaya for training plus a couple more to the US for 6 months training and that Pemuda Umno has set up a special cyber unit to 'bomb' websites like Malaysia Today with a prime objective of putting them out of business. I will close down the entire blog before I allow Malaysia Today to be closed down.

Yes, I am aware that EVERY page in Malaysia Today is being printed and filed into various 'evidence' files to be used against me when the long arm of the Malaysian law finally closes in on me. I am aware that a few people have already been called in for interrogation and their testimony recorded in the case that is being built up against me.

Well, as Malaysia Today bites the dust, which will happen in time, and as they again take me away in handcuffs and blindfold like they did on 11 April 2001, I will certainly remember Pintu Gate, Perakman and the dozens of other anonymous posters who made all that possible.

And may we one day meet in another world where I will claim redemption for the injustice done to Malaysia Today. And may you remember to send Raya cakes to Kamunting, the one day in the year when outside parcels all allowed in.

Well, guys, it was nice knowing you. And in the event we never speak again after an hour or two from now....bye, bye.

Editor, Malaysia Today

5:59 PM
Anonymous said...
Site moderator- it is yr obligation, responsibility and duty that only intellectual comments, positive criticms are posted. No 4letter words, personal attacks, and stick to the issue.

If Pintu Gate feels so much hatred towards the Malay Muslims (Malays first) then he is free to leave Malaysia and go back to wherever he came from. We dont need people like him here.

Hitler (my son's idols) lughtered millions of Jews, US bombed Japan- millions dead, Iraq, Bosnia, Afghan - millions dead, Jews are killing Muslims everyday in Palestine, General Custer scalped thousands of Indians, and so on. Why focus only on Iran-Iraq war. If you Pintu Gate- are as educated as you claim you are, you would know that this war was planned and provoked by the US satans. Divide and rule.

6:15 PM
Anonymous said...
salam,

PintuGate, Mala and various other anonymous - rather than asking these questions publicly in this blog and u think u can't get a good answer, why not you directed them personally in person to ppl who u know can answer them? or is it just ur intention to have some fun?

i believe that u'll find ur answer soon..

ALlah itu Maha Pengampun, Maha Pengasih lagi Maha Mengetahui.. u'll get ur answer.. it is just a matter of time.

i'll answer some of ur questions later.

6:46 PM
Anonymous said...
Hi pintu gate, please tone down your rectoric,I know you are in upper hand but we need a proper debate plateform.

anyway can someone enlighten me on why all the islamic religeous wear head gear? and who are the biggest abuser of women right and women cannot get the same right as men? and also so far no one has answer pintu gate questions convincingly. Islam is total submission my dear raja petra, even I know it and you cannot pick and choose what ever suites you and discard the rest.

my own view after reading all the postings are that pintu gate could be correct that osama teaching is the real islam, judging from the versus, with JAWI officer run amok in KL enforcing islamic values, and 8 months remand of chinese(non-muslim )girls, what can non-muslim/malay do in this circumstances?

Malaysia is likened to be a train heading towards a tunner which has a dead end. all non muslim must be prepared to abondon to train in due time, (i am not starting a debate on migration) but migration is the only option just like the caucasians in zimbabwe, the future is getting dimmer with majority of muslims that gone through the religous system have the same narrow minded view of perakman, which is intorelate of non-muslims and justifying his action in the name of koran. Naturally NEP is a must because it applies to non-muslim. It is about time non-muslims starting to plant roots in foreign country before the train stops in the tuner and this so called paradise become Iran.

tell me if malay/muslim are suprior as it claims, why you guys need protection for everything?

6:53 PM
Anonymous said...
C'est La Vie! Dont question the constitution your fore fathers agreed upon when they came landing on our shores.

If you dont like it here in Malaysia, then you can go back to the country where your ancestors came from - that if if they still want you back. If not you can try Australia, UK or US.

7:22 PM
Anonymous said...
assalamualaikum wrt

It is very unislamic to allow and encourage situations where uncalled for remarks and comments like racist and bigotary remarks, religion and race bashing, be allowed. This includes the site Raja has put up where often than not used by certain ignorant bigots like Pintu Gate to Hell to vent his anger and frustrations.

Get real, while your intentions are good, this is (still) Malaysia and despite having our twin towrrs and MSC we are still hypersensitive Asians. Get real, this is not the UK where a decent level of decency and civility is maintained even in situations like this.

Take this topic for example, if you really want to know the real and accurate of teachings of Islam or any other religion, this definitely is not the site. Go to a site with certain authority to view your comments. This post is only viewed by layman people like you and me who can not answer or not in the position to make any comments on a topic not within our scope.

I am sure simple peace loving Malaysian folks like the ahmads, Ah chongs and the Maniams would see this posting be out to prevent bigots like Hell's Gate.

What say you Raja? Or do you like to see disharmony? Get real (2nd time) this is Malaysia not the UK. Kata dah belajar tinggi2 dah pass University, but Malaysians on the whole are still not open to criticisms or how to react as we have been brought up by our parents and parents before them no matter what country they originated from, not to offend your neighbor.

Take the post off for articles like race, religion, NEP. Nak bash the Govt ok but do in a professional way.

For Hell gate, whoever you are, be man enough to identify yourself if you want to make remarks against another race or religion. If you have no balls, then shut up!

Ahmad Izzuddin Hariz

8:08 PM
Anonymous said...
Pintu Gate sudah mula panik. Sebab itu dia dah jadi macam orang tak siuman. Rencana terbaru Petra ni, kalau orang bukan Islam boleh terima, akan menyebabkan rancangan agen Bukit Aman ini untuk pecah belahkan pembangkang gagal. Pintu Gate ialah SB. Kerja dia ialah untuk menentukan yang PAS, DAP dan Keadilan tidak bersatu. Rencana Petra membuktikan yang orang Islam/bukan Islam boleh bersatu dan tidak salah dari segi Islam.

Syabas Petra. Pintu Gate sudah mula tunjuk belangnya yang sebenar.

8:11 PM
Anonymous said...
apa kata Pintu Neraka bukan SB tapi memang racist dan bigot? Apa kata kamu di atas yang SB mengalakkan site seperti ini untuk kaum Malaysia pecah belah dan create disharmony?

8:34 PM
Anonymous said...
Yo Knock Knock Knockin on Hell's Gate... Your balls shrunk? With your dangerous bigotory and racist remarks against other religions, you'd better watch your back, bro! You might just 'trip and fall' and 'hurt' yourself real bad. Think before you say something unpleasant about one's faith or god.

10:57 PM
Anonymous said...
it was really a sad case for you
'pintu gate'.

you claimed to be highly technical and educated but the way i see it you are really 'lost' in life at least for now.

technical people usually look and analyse things in its whole context and not partially as what you did.

Yusuf Estes quote:
""I was born into a very strong Christian family in the Midwest. Our family and their ancestors not only built the churches and schools across this land, but actually were the same ones who came here in the first place. While I was still in elementary we relocated in Houston, Texas in 1949 (I'm old). We attended church regularly and I was baptized at the age of 12 in Pasadena, Texas. As a teenager, I wanted to visit other churches to learn more of their teachings and beliefs. The Baptists, Methodists, Episcopalians, Charismatic movements, Nazarene, Church of Christ, Church of God, Church of God in Christ, Full Gospel, Agape, Catholic, Presbyterian and many more. I developed quite a thirst for the "Gospel" or as we say; "Good News". My research into religion did not stop with Christianity. Not at all! Hinduism, Judaism, Buddhism, Metaphysics, native American beliefs were all a part of my studies. Just about the only one that I did not look into seriously was "Islam"." unquote.

you see, he researched most of the major religions in the world before he got to see the true light.

i wonder if you claimed to be highly technical did the similar approach to your existing religion/belief (if any)

my sincere advise to you is please try to learn other peoples' religion too.

the only difference between ANIMALS against HUMANbeing is the BRAINS (ability to think).

and where and from whom does it comes from? THINK !.

11:03 PM
Anonymous said...
We really cannot have a good debate here with people like Pintu Gate who constantly write with his aim of insulting Islam and the Malay. If we are really going to have peace and harmony in our multi-racial society now, if we are really going to create an open and a class-less society and promoting racial and religious tolerance then we really need to remove evil like Pintu Gate from the equation. He is full of hatred towards Malay and l am sure most of you here will not think twice to put your boot into his f**king skull for all the deragotary comments and insult he made.

This piece of shit is a menace to a civil society and this is the one that SB should be targetting, bang him up in prison cell and let him eat his own shit.

There are Chinese who l call friends but not this one..if he is Chinese.
There are Indians who l also call friends but not this one..if he is an Indian

But if he is a Malay murtad......l will shoot his f*cking brains off, not because he is an apostate but for his insult to the Koran, Islam and Allah.

This m*therf**ker need to learn some lessons.

11:29 PM
Raja Petra Kamarudin said...
Dear Ahmad Izzuddin Hariz. I am certainly revolted by the bigotry that goes on in Malaysia Today's blogs. But this only goes to prove that racial polarisation and religious intolerance in Malaysia is at alarming proportions. And this, sad to say, is because our politicians wish for this to be so. Race and religion are the platforms for most of the political parties in Malaysia. This, we cannot deny. And this is why we are in this sorry state of affairs.

Race and religion CANNOT be separated from politics. This is the reality. So, to talk politics, these two subjects have to be broached as well.

The day racial and religious differences are set aside will be the day Malaysia sees the emergence of a non-race based party. Take Parti Keadilan Rakyat (PKR) as an example. It is not a multi-racial party. It is a non-race based party. But can PKR see success in its aspirations if Malaysians are not ready to put race and religion aside? People like Pintu Gate are not the only culprits. Malays like Perakman too are guilty of the same thing. It takes two hands to clap.

Malaysia Today must keep hammering away at this stumbling block until such a time that Malaysians can say, “Enough!” and are prepared to look at each other as equal citizens, not divided by race and religion.

And if this never happens, then PKR and parties like it might as well wind up and we just let Barisan Nasional and its race-based coalition partners continue to rule this country till doomsday.

But I am not prepared to roll over and play dead just yet. I will still like to continue with my attempt to introduce to Malaysians a culture of intellectual discourse with the intention of bridging the gap that divides us.

I just hope people like Pintu Gate and Perakman and all the rest are sincere and share my view that this country sucks and we need to do something about it. But what they are doing now is widening the gap further instead of helping me reduce it.

Can I call upon all of you to declare a truce and join me in this attempt at nation building? I really need your help here as I cannot do it all alone.

Editor, Malaysia Today

11:53 PM
Anonymous said...
Hey guys...when are we going to grow up? We can't even discuss man to man without hitting at each other. Next we will be like the 'road bullies' who take everyone else as s**t. If we can't stand the likes of Pintu Gate, Perakman or whoever you consider do not deserve your attention, IGNORE THEM. Let them be or 'smoke cigars'. Why do you think we are discussing so many problems that we are facing now. It's people like these that make things (understanding) so difficult. They just want you to see their point of view. They will never move until you do, failing which, they resort to extreme intimidation.

Why allow them to piss you off! There are others who can share intellectual debates without resorting to superlative name calling and making disgusting comments. Let's move on. Unless we are all DEFEATIST !!!

1:16 AM
anonymous said...
Please have some decorum, don't insult religion, any religion as a matter of fact, try to debate maturely and not degenerate into calling name and please refrain from using vulgarity.Most debates are going out of point and context after a while.

As i said before,ban them or delete their postings.U guys are either contributing reason for closing down the blog or he will,- to avoid problem.

I got a suggestion,maybe charge them a fee for posting and penalise them more (charges )if repeated.Some people are abusing free blog.

1:28 AM
Pintu Gate said...
Dear Honorable Raja Petra:

A truce you shall have for a period of 7 days provided if you can coax you muslim malay reader to answer my questions. All I want is to hear reasonable answers. You can help them if you like. I will rephrase my question here for your readers benefit. For a start let me stick to just one issue and then I will move on to the rest.

Yusuf Estes says

“Prophet Muhammad emphasized the importance of Jesus by saying: "Whoever believes there is no god but Allah, alone without partner, that Muhammad is His messenger, that Jesus is a servant and messenger of God, His word breathed into Mary and a spirit emanating from Him,”

The new testament in book of Luke says in

23:33 And when they were come to the place, which is called Calvary, there they crucified him, and the malefactors, one on the right hand, and the other on the left.
23:34Then said Jesus, Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do. And they parted his raiment, and cast lots.
23:35 And the people stood beholding. And the rulers also with them derided him, saying, He saved others; let him save himself, if he be Christ, the chosen of God.
23:36 And the soldiers also mocked him, coming to him, and offering him vinegar,
23:37 And saying, If thou be the king of the Jews, save thyself.
23:39 And one of the malefactors which were hanged railed on him, saying, If thou be Christ, save thyself and us.
23:40 But the other answering rebuked him, saying, Dost not thou fear God, seeing thou art in the same condemnation?
23:41 And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss.

23:42 And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom.
23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

Did Jesus died on the cross and rose from the death in the account of the Koran ?. In case you don’t get it. Islam came 600 years after Christianity but it appears Islam is rewriting the account of the New Testaments and thus insisting that they know better about Jesus than Christians? is the Koran’s account is truer about Jesus than the New Testament?

Please clarify in a clear and intelligent way by proving supporting accounts.

4:03 AM
Raja Petra Kamarudin said...
1) Okay Pintu Gate. You have yourself a deal.
2) A truce should be indefinite. There should be no timeframe, as you have done it; 7 days. Only when the other party violates the truce do you call an end to it.
3) Let this Battle Royale be between you and me only. ALL others stay out. And I mean ALL. I shall delete the postings of ANYONE who masuk campur.
4) There shall be no free-for-all or cowboy-like bar room brall. We shall conduct ourself with decorum and as educated gentlemen.
5) We shall take the issues one by one, settle them, then set them aside once settled, not to be resurrected in future as a never ending quarrel.
6) We shall respect each other's views and beliefs and not say the other is stupid, etc., just because he does not share our same view or belief. We shall agree to disagree.

Is this agreeable to you? If so, then we can start. But if I sometimes seem late in replying, please bear with me, as some other pressing matters may be keeping me away from my computer (like today where I have a family gathering at a recently deceased uncle's house).

Those other non-Muslims who wish to get their five cents worth in, you can e-mail your points to Pintu Gate to bring up. Those Muslims who feel I have wrongly replied or have not replied properly enough can also e-mail their views to me. I am NOT a religious scholar so my knowledge on Islam may not be up to scratch.

I am Raja Petra Kamarudin. My e-mail address is editor@malaysia-today.net. And I live in Jalan BRP5/5, Bukit Rahman Putra, Sungai Buloh (just ask guard at the guardhouse which is my house).

Now, your turn to introduce yourself Pintu Gate.

Editor, Malaysia Today

7:51 AM
zam said...
"I am a highly technical person..bla..bla..bla..i have to analyze thousand of codes..yada.yada.yada..THERE IS NO ROOM FOR BULLSHIT ?(coming from this guy?) ..HEHEHEH..Quote Quran here.. quote Bible there..and PRESTO : Pintu is born!! ( repeat process if you want to have some pazazz in your life ) HEHEHE.. You know pintu for someone who as highly technical as you are, you must lead a very sad life...no literally..You stare at computers all day,probably grew up as a geek,been bullied a lot in school,no power and authority in life ,too much of a free time to study Quran and Bible (those seems to be the only thing you refer to when you bitch! ) And your arguements seems to be of cut and paste quality..Where's your own thought man! Every idiot can turn something to serve their purpose.You prove this well.! If you argue, then let us know whats your take on the angle.

Fact of the matter is you do not compute well for 'this' equation..You refer to something that is abstract as religion and belief, never want to show your true thoughts,ideas,and ways.You just bitch and moan and complain (something you must get a lot in your life ).Life is what you want it to be,no one forced you to have a sad life.These mofo who says Islam this,Islam that.. are just a bunch of scared p*****s who is probably hiding when things start to heat up.

Petra after some fact finding, i found that what you said is true..This joker is one of the setup to take you down.Too bad for the blog site though..you have seen this coming rite.?

8:04 AM
Raja Petra Kamarudin said...
Well Pintu Gate, here goes. We start our debate on the first issue; Jesus.

But before I start, first of all, let me say this:

"The Quran repeatedly counsels Muslims NOT to dispute with other monotheists over matters of doctrine. People, the Quran says, believe differently for good reasons. In fact, that is a part of Allah's will. Therefore, Muslims should not quarrel with Jews or Christians about whether your doctrine is right or mine is right."

- Muslim convert Michael Wolfe (author of books of poetry, fiction, travel, and history. His most recent works are a pair of books from Grove Press on the pilgrimage to Mecca: "The Hajj" (1993), a first-person travel account, and "One Thousand Roads to Mecca" (1997), an anthology of 10 centuries of travelers writing about the Muslim pilgrimage. In April 1997, he hosted a televised account of the Hajj from Mecca for Ted Koppel's "Nightline" on ABC. He is currently at work on a four-hour television documentary on the life and times of the Prophet Muhammad).

8:13 AM
Raja Petra Kamarudin said...
JESUS IN ISLAM

In the Muslim view, Jesus' essential work was not to replicate magic bread or to test our credulity, but to complement the legalism of the Torah with a leavening compassion rarely expressed in the older testament. His actions and words introduce something new to monotheism: They develop the merciful spirit of God's nature. Jesus confirmed the Torah, stressing the continuity of his lineage, but he also developed the importance of compassion and self-purification as crucial links between learning the words of God's message and possessing the wisdom to carry it out.

Even today, when a Muslim mentions Jesus' name, you will hear it followed by the phrase "peace and blessings be upon him," because Muslims still revere him as a prophet.

We believe in God And in what has been sent down to us, What has been revealed to Abraham and Ishmael And Isaac and Jacob and their offspring, And what was given to Moses and to Jesus And all the other prophets of the Lord. We make no distinction among them.

As these lines from the Qur'an make clear, Muslims regard Jesus as one of the world's great teachers. He and his mentor John the Baptist stand in a lineage stretching back to the founder of ethical monotheism. Moreover, among Muslims, Jesus is a special type of prophet, a messenger empowered to communicate divinity not only in words but by miracles as well.

Muslims, it must be said, part company with some Christians over the portrait of Jesus developed in the fourth and fifth centuries. Certain fictions, Muslims think, were added then. Three of these come in for special mention: First, Muslims consider monastic asceticism a latter-day innovation, not an original part of Jesus' way. Second, the New Testament suffers from deletions and embellishments added after Jesus' death by men who did not know him. Third, the description of Jesus as God's son is considered by Muslims a later, blasphemous suggestion.

Muslims venerate Jesus as a divinely inspired human but never, ever as "the son of God." In the same vein, we treat the concept of the Trinity as a late footnote to Jesus' teachings, an unnecessary "mystery" introduced by the North African theologian Tertullian two centuries after Jesus' death. Nor do Muslims view his death as an act of atonement for mankind's sins. Rather, along with the early Christian theologian Pelagius, Islam rejects the doctrine of original sin, a notion argued into church doctrine by St. Augustine around the year 400.

It can be said that Islam holds a view of Jesus similar to some of the early apostolic versions condemned by the fourth-century Byzantine Church. Once Constantine installed Christianity as the Roman Empire's state religion, a rage for orthodoxy followed. The Councils of Nicaea (325), Tyre (335), Constantinople (381), Ephesus (431), and Chalcedon (451) were official, often brutal attempts to stamp out heterodox views of Jesus held by "heretical" theologians.

Rulings by these councils led to the persecution and deaths of tens of thousands of early Christians at the hands of more "orthodox" Christians who condemned them. Most disputes centered on divergent interpretations of the Trinity. For this reason, historians of religion sometimes see in these bloody divisions one of the root causes for early Islam's firmly unitarian outlook.

8:23 AM
Raja Petra Kamarudin said...
"The Muslim Jesus is not divine, but a humble servant of God. He was not crucified - Islam insists that the story of the killing of Jesus is false. He is, as it were, Jesus as he might have been without St Paul or St Augustine or the Council of Nicaea." - By John Casey, Daliy Telegraph (London) 19 December 2001

Jesus is referred to quite often in the Koran, six times under the title "Messiah".

Muslims deny the Crucifixion, their emphasis has been on the wonders surrounding the birth of "Jesus Son of Mary", born as his mother sat under a palm tree, and miraculously speaking from within the womb.

Many of the sayings of the Muslim Jesus are clearly derived from Biblical sources - "Place your treasures in heaven, for the heart of man is where his treasure is"; "Look at the birds coming and going! They neither reap nor plough, and God provides for them." Sometimes there is a sort of gloss on words of Jesus from the Gospel: "Oh disciples, do not cast pearls before swine, for the swine can do nothing with them . . . wisdom is more precious than pearls and whoever rejects wisdom is worse than a swine."

The Muslim Jesus is an ascetic, a man of voluntary poverty, humility and long-suffering. He literally turns the other cheek, allowing his face to be slapped twice in order to protect two of his disciples. He teaches the return of good for evil: "Jesus used to say, 'Charity does not mean doing good to him who does good to you . . . Charity means that you should do good to him who does you harm.' " He loves the poor and embraces poverty: "The day Jesus was raised to heaven, he left behind nothing but a woollen garment, a slingshot and two sandals." He preaches against attachment to worldly things: "Jesus said, `He who seeks worldly things is like the man who drinks sea water: the more he drinks, the more thirsty he becomes, until it kills him.' "

8:38 AM
Raja Petra Kamarudin said...
CONCLUSION

No, Islam says Jesus DID NOT die on the cross.

Yes, Islam has 'rewritten' the story of Jesus.

So, Pintu Gate, can we agree to disagree on this one?

Editor, Malaysia Today

8:45 AM
Pintu Gate said...
No Petra, we cannot agree to disagree on this one. If we were to disagree about a recipe to sambal belachan than I can accept your proposition but this in not sambal belacan isn’t it?

Why this misleading appeal to the reader that Islam somehow respects Christianity? It is like saying that the Mohammad you worship is son of Satan. How offensive is that to you now? ? In the same way what you are saying is offensive to Christian. If you feel I am unfair then find Christians that will agree to your Jesus. So absurdity on your part does not equal validity. And so how can we agree to disagree?

The author misled the reader to think that Islam and Christianity have something in common when it has none. Misleading is unethical in any religion.

10:42 AM
Raja Petra Kamarudin said...
Pintu Gate, I just gave you Islam's view of Jesus. I am NOT asking you to accept this view or agree with me that it is right. I am telling you Islam's side of the Jesus story, crucifiction on the cross and all that (which was the question you posed to me).

As you pointed out before the debate even started, Christianity and Islam disagree on the crucifiction theory. Muslims and Christians BOTH accept this doctrine of faith difference. And BOTH Muslims and Christians agree that we will never agree.

You said, "No Petra, we cannot agree to disagree on this one." Either you agree with Islam's view of Jesus' crucifiction, or you agree to the Christianity verion. If you agree to the Muslim version, then we agree. If you disagree with the Muslim version and instead agree with the Christian version, then we disagree.

And if we disagree, then I agree we disagree!

This, my dear man, is plain English. It is a language issue. Not a religious issue. We agree, or we disagree. And if we disagree, then I agree we disagree.

Editor, Malaysia Today

10:55 AM
Pintu Gate said...
Raja, if you cannot speak for the Muslim as aMuslim scholar then why debate me now? If you are not a schlor then get off this debate! The reader of this blog want to make a determination on who is valid and who is not on the facts presented. If we are not debating about the truth then we need to debate on the fact so that the readers can make their own conclusion. This topic calls for a conclusion
I don’t want to waste my time on some hald-baked representative of Islam and Muslim in this forum. I need to know if you agree to a conclusion about the article that is posted in this block presents fact if not the truth. (I concede truth is almost impossible to establish) It is your integrity and my integrity on the line here. You have a chance to silence me for good.

10:56 AM
Raja Petra Kamarudin said...
Pintu Gate, before we continue this debate, we must first get a clear understanding that we will NEVER agree on Islam. This is apparent. I am NOT asking you to agree with my arguments or with Islam. I am asking you to accept the fact we are never going to agree. If you cannot agree to disagree, then going on with this debate is pointless.

You refuse to accept what I say. Yet you also refuse NOT to accept what I say. What is there left? Your logic just defies all logic. Do you realise you are telling me you refuse to allow anyone to have any other opinions other than your own? How does this make you look?

On your sambal belacan example. I like laksa asam. You like fried mee. Does this mean one of us is, as you say, taking the other for ride?

Anyway, I am off for the rest of the day so catch you later.

Editor, Malaysia Today

11:07 AM
zam said...
Pintu has integrity? really? we're still waiting for your introduction ? where's your integrity? tell us who you are? why joust as anon., when you can have a face.?Since religion is the face you seem to put down don't you think integrity dictates you tell us wee bit about urself.
And whats the deal in telling him to get off the debate.Where are your b*lls man.Just because he don't agree with you you want to kick him out ..come on!! show integrity laa.Its getting interesting here.

11:09 AM
Pintu Gate said...
You miss the point my dear friend. What I am saying is you are making the historical account of Jesus from the Christian perspective trivial. If your account of Jesus is not what historical Christianity upholds then you cannot use that as a fact in your thesis that Islam is a tolerant religion because Islam has something in common with Christianity. Do you get the finer point logic my honorable foe?

Will you agree that Christianity has nothing in common with Islam? If you do then Yusuf Estes has misrepresented the fact. He is a liar. Do we agree?

11:38 AM
Anonymous said...
Everyone here seems to miss the point. The point is that Jesus(pbh) was always a Muslim. So were Adam, Abraham, Moses, etc and all the prophets of the One GOD the One whom all Muslims refer to as Allah. The word "Christianity" never came from the mouth of Jesus. He has never claimed in any scriptures to have discovered "Christianity". Neither did Prophet Mohamad(pbh) ever claimed that he discovered Islam.
Islam started with the creation.
"Islam" means "to surrender to Allah". To surrender is to be absolutely sincere and this is the essence of worship.
All things are created by Allah. As such all things come into being and can so exists only by submission to The Creator.
The whole Universe is Muslim. Man also and a recent one at that. Man is granted a (limited) power of will. He can choose to or not to surrender to his Creator.He can choose to or not to worship Allah. He can choose to or not to be Muslim . This is The test and this is the purpose of his short life on this planet.
All prophets are Muslims. The first being Adam the last being Mohammad. Their message is one.Their purpose is one. Their religion is one. Their God is one. Their message is very clear. That is to worship The One and Only One God. Only people would want to have it otherwise - through selfish contumasy and to wrong one another.
To wrong one another is none other than the way of Satan.
This understanding of Islam is what jolted me to revert to Islam 20years ago after been in search of the True religion.

1:07 PM
Anonymous said...
previous writer must have read harry porter last night!!

Dear raja, I am not to discredit anyone here, but what pintu trying to say is that( I hope I am right) let say if someone manage to "discover" a book written in the 10th century but with reference to the prophet in the 5th century but with detailing and incidents that all are different and saying that they are related and something in common and asking the people that follow the 5th century book to debate on the 10th century book, what do you think what you can agree on? what is there to debate?
Hope I dont offence anyone, I am only refering to the debate issue.
thank you

1:50 PM
Anonymous said...
Just curious, we have the fossil to prove the existence of dinosaurs few thousand years ago, my question is who was the first living creature, Adam or dinosaurs? Forgive me if my question offended you.

3:14 PM
Raja Petra Kamarudin said...
To posters 1.07pm and 1.50pm above: Maybe you did not read my earlier posting above. This debate is between Pintu Gate and me; at least for the meantime until we officially end the joust. So I humbly urge you both NOT to turn this into a cowboy bar room brawl. This debate is between two gentlemen of opposing views. If Pintu Gate or I need anyone’s help we will holler for you to jump in. This is a one-on-one and not a WWF tag team wrestling match. I KNOW what Pintu Gate is saying. I do not require any help in understanding him.

Editor, Malaysia Today

3:23 PM
Raja Petra Kamarudin said...
Now, back to Pintu Gate. I have, as you may have noticed above, properly introduced myself complete with e-mail address and home address. If you also require my identity card number please let me know. You may, at any time of the day or night, come to my house to verify that I DO live at that address shown above.

I did this because I stand by what I am doing and saying. And I dare do this because I am a gentleman and will be open, sincere and truthful in this debate. Therefore, if I do or say anything that can be considered a misrepresentation of facts or a distortion of the truth or downright lie, then I run the risk of retribution and I dare face the consequences of my actions.

As they say, “Berani kerana benar.”

I urge you, Pintu Gate, to do the same. Considering you too are equally a gentleman and will be open, sincere and truthful in this debate, you should not fear anything. Only those with evil and devious intentions or mala fide need hide behind a computer screen and post comments as anonymous and I take it you are not this at all.

You too should be berani kerana benar.

I await your confirmations.

Editor, Malaysia Today

3:37 PM
Pintu Gate said...
I cannot comply to your request. Let us stick to the issues not background.

Pintu Gate.

3:53 PM
Pintu Gate said...
Sorry Raja, I cannot participate in this debate anymore. I have to resolve technical issues in Eastern Siberia. Work comes first!

Pintu Gate.

4:07 PM
Raja Petra Kamarudin said...
Pintu Gate said: If your account of Jesus is not what historical Christianity upholds then you cannot use that as a fact in your thesis that Islam is a tolerant religion because Islam has something in common with Christianity.

My reply: I did not say Islam and Christianity agree on the issue of whether Jesus was crucified or not; which was a point YOU raised when you launched this debate. Your specific question was: “Did Jesus die on the cross and rose from the death in the account of the Koran?”

In fact, I agreed with you. And I have satisfactorily replied by saying that Islam’s belief is he DID NOT. So Islam and Christianity DOES NOT agree on this as you have said so.

Which part of ‘NO’ do you not understand?

You ask. And I replied. Is this not settled?

It is entirely up to me to believe what I want to believe. If you believe the world is round, and I believe the world is flat, that is entirely within my right to believe so. We are entitled to our own beliefs. Just because I believe the world is flat, which is not what you believe, does not make me, other Muslims, or Islam a liar.

Pintu Gate said: Will you agree that Christianity has nothing in common with Islam? If you do then Yusuf Estes has misrepresented the fact. He is a liar. Do we agree?

My reply: No, I do not agree. And, again, I am entitled to believe so and this in no way makes me, Yusuf Estes, or Islam a liar.

If I believe in drinking Coke, and you believe in drinking Chinese tea because you think Coke is poison and Chinese tea is healthy, and I don’t believe it is poison so I continue drinking it, how does that make me a liar? It just means we have different views on what is healthy and what is not.

On your point that Islam has NOTHING in common with Christianity, this is not true. NOTHING is the wrong word to use. ‘Nothing’ means ‘zero’! So you are wrong. Islam believes in Adam and Eve. Islam believes in Doomsday. Islam believes in the Afterlife. Islam believes in Gabriel. Islam believes that there is only One God. Islam believes in Abraham. Islam believes in Noah. Islam believes in Ishmael. And Christianity too believes in all this. And I have listed just a few examples, the tip of the iceberg. So, Islam and Christianity DOES NOT have nothing in common with Christianity. It DOES have some things in common.

And your point that therefore Islam cannot be considered tolerant just because it DOES have some things in common with Christianity is again NOT TRUE. I ride a bike and you drive a car. I drink Coke and you drink Chinese tea. But we both listen to the same music so we do have ONE thing in common. That does not mean I am intolerant with you because I share one thing in common with you but do not share the same views with you on many other things like choice of food or choice of transportation. Opposite choices does not reflect lack of tolerance at all.

Editor, Malaysia Today

4:13 PM
Raja Petra Kamarudin said...
Since Pintu Gate has requested the debate be ended I comply to his request. And since it is clear that Islam and Christianity do not agree on all issues -- differ on some issues and agree on some issues -- let us accept that. Let us also accept that disagreement on issues does not reflect lack of tolerance. Let us also accept that just because one does not agree with us on certain issues does not make that person stupid, neither does it make us stupid. And let us accept that there is no reason we should despise and not respect the other person who does share our view on all things.

Editor, Malaysia Today

4:34 PM
Anonymous said...
apo pasal kau nak tahu nama, alamat Pintu uhh? awak ni nak suroh JAWI hambat dia ko ?

4:58 PM
Anonymous said...
Raja, well done.. I'm impressed with your debating skills and I'm sure others are as well.

But please spare a thought .. have pity on our kids, the Deprived Ones who do not get the benefits of First Class Education under the present Sekolah Kebangsaan system.

For over 20 years, the Mamak Regime had wasted our economic wealth developing megalomanic physical symbols yet neglect Nation Building; worse when Sekolah Kebangsaan promote the kind of spoon feeding that are churning kids into pak turuts where even IPTA graduates are rejected by the job market.

But don't keep blaming Malays for not measuring up for they know not the benchmark.. Pity too the hard working though poorly underpaid teachers who could do no better themselves because of the rigid system and also remember that the new ones are themselves the product of Mamak's gross failure.

Put the burner on Hishamuddin and wake him up if you care for the future.

In the face of globalisation, our kids lost the command of languages, worse, can't form own opinions or articulate as your pal puts it...they don't study World History anymore not knowing the likes of Genghis Khan, Napolean, Drake even Hitler of old days.. so how would they react on seeing such similar characters of the future..

Play your role as an effective Opposition; you may not be an elected representative yet but that should not stop this Public Service, nay amal jariaah..

Seek only Allah's reward for the good deeds, for indeed He is our Provider.

10:33 PM
Anonymous said...
Raja:

What a pity the debate stopped. I wish it would continue and address all the issues Pintu Gate brought up during his reign. What we need is someone who can push the entire taboo structure to the limit and summon the wake up call. Unfortunately we cannot pick and choose how we like this person to be. You are an intelligent man, you can write well, but Pintu Gate is a formidable intellectual. I have a feeling he is a philosopher and an aggressive one at that. I am hard press to believe that Malaysia is capable of growing one like that. At least the climate will not nurture such a stature. I have done a search on your website and read all the article he wrote in a short time and it cer

This news from Malaysia's main English newspaper (The Star), dated 28 April 2005:

http://thestar.com.my/news/archives/story.asp?ppath=\2005\4\28&file=/2005/4/28/nation/10809096&sec=nation

US men held for proselytising

PUTRAJAYA: Two Americans have been arrested for allegedly distributing religious books, pamphlets and compact disc outside the Masjid Putra here on Monday.

City acting CID chief Asst Comm Ramli Din confirmed the arrest of the two men, aged 28 and 36.

The two men, who had visited the country previously, were caught distributing religious materials about 9.40pm after mosque officials called the police.

Police seized at least 60 electronic and printed religious materials, which were published in English and Malay.

The American Embassy has been informed about the arrests.

I am not a fan of Pipelinenews - especially since they once posted as "pipebombnews" - but their Wahabi Watch segment has some interesting background on that pestilence.

http://www.pipelinenews.org/index.cfm?page=ctusix%2Ehtm

The only good Wahabi is a dead one.

Wow! IA786 has managed to condense the entire Internet onto a single page!

Learn Torah and Talmud properly and you'll find the answers to the classic anti-semitic rhetoric (available from many popular white supermist websites) he's copied and pasted here.

Lo Am Ha'Aretz Hassid.

Mentat, nice try, and I salute you. But we who believe in divine providence also note that God can put his people to the test, and subject them to chastisement. I'm sure that is how Shukri and IA regard Mr. Spencer.

I notice that all those 19th century French scholars whom IA enlists on the side of Islam only praised Islam because they were destructive men who denied the existence of God and chiefly wished to find any convenient stick with which to beat the Christian dog. These were men viewing Islam from a very great distance. They knew nothing of the pirs in whom Pathans and Hazaras put so much faith; or the tombs of Sufis to which Muslims in China resort when they wish their prayers to be especially efficacious. Nor did they even bother with the veneration Shi'ah pay to Ali, Hassan, and Hussein. Indeed, it seems to me that IA's peculair vehemence against the atonement of Jesus Christ may be because deep down inside, he shares Islam's clear hunger for a mediator.

Further, IA's post reflects shopworn 19th century "village atheist" polemics such as the superstition that Constantine decided what would go into the Bible (he didn't: the OT canon was there long before him, and where NT lists differed, it was in which later, apocryphal works to include, for all agreed on the 4 Gospels, Acts, Letters of Paul, Peter, James, and John long before Constantine was born). The origins of the 27 traditional canon of the New testament is obscure only because it lies rooted in the very beginnings of the apostles' ministry--a work begun among obscure people whose survival indicates far more power than a cult whose leader could threaten people with the choices of conversion or death. Even Napoleon recognized as much,since we're quoting 19th century Frenchmen.

The Apocalypse of Peter, of which IA makes such liberal use, is a 2d century apocryphon, written long after the actual Peter.

And I see IA owes a very big debt to Dan Brown's _Da Vinci Code_; the latest marvel now viewed by all half-educated athesit television producers and burger flippers as unassailable.

IA, if Hebrews 5:6-8 denies Jesus was crucified, what do you make of the same book's affirmation of his death (2:14-18), and that his death was the final offering for sin (7:27;9:14,27-28); and that it took place on the cross (12:2). And, if Jesus prayed, how does this conflict with his later dying on the cross?

True, he prayed for God to deliver him from that death, as recorded in the Gospels (to which the letter to the Hebrews doubtlessly alludes). Yet this deliverence did not come until the third day, when "This Jesus hath God raised up" (Acts 2:32).

And, since you so admire the Mew Testament Letter to the Hebrews, what of the fact that it quotes the Psalms in the first chapter? Psalm 102:256-28, addressed to God Almighty, Hebrews applies to Jesus Christ, the Son (Hebrews 1:8-12). It seems that the book affirms

(a) the deity of Jesus the Messiah as well as his humanity,

(b) his death on the cross, and

(c) that his death is atonement for our sins.

So, IA, Shukri, I take your word for it that you wish to be with Jesus the Messiah after death. But, suppose he were to say something like this:

"You say you honor me, then why do you dishonor the death I died, the only atonement that can cleanse your sin? And was it not my death that showed the continuity of all blood sacrifices following the fall of Adam, from those given by righteous Abel, including those given on the altar in Jerusalem, down to mine? Is it not the very thing that gave Muhammad the idea of a chain of revelation? And, do you youself not recognize the need for blood sacrifice to connect man to God in your slaughter of sheep at Eid? So, why do you claim to honor me, while dishonoring the greatest gift I have to offer you?"

Indeed, dear Muslim friend, the death and resurrection of the Messiah Jesus are what set the seal on all former revelation. See Psalms 16 and 22, and Isaiah 53 for starters. See Psalm 2 of God speaking of his son in his former Testament. And, BTW, no Jew, save some in Muhammad's misinformed imagination, ever called Ezra the son of God. Indeed, it is clear that wherever the Old Testament speaks of the son of God, it speaks of the King of the Jews--the very title hung over Jesus' head when he bore our sins on the cross (John 19:19).

Further, since I mention the Son of God, let me introduce you to his wife as well, since I hear that sarcastic jape in the depths of your mind.
Many a Sunday, you may walk into one of our churches (I'm Presbyterian Church in America myself) and see the people partaking of bread and wine. It is God's wife actually sitting down to supper with him--for the whole body of faithful people is the spouse of God.

And, this supper we eat, proclaims the death of Jesus Christ till he comes (First Corinthians 11:26).

BTW, IA, I gather that there are folks saying that the Mahdi has come. He was a guy name Ahmed, from the Panjab. I'm sure Naseem would be glad to discuss him with you.

Or, was he the guy from late 19th century Sudan who disapproved of the Egyptian government's kowtowing to perfidious Albion and suppressing the slave trade? Then again, he may have been Baha'ullah.

Or, could it be that the final Word and mediator of God you desire is the one whom even Muhammad recognized as the Messiah of Israel?

The Spirit and the Bride say "Come" (Rev. 22:17).

Mentat, nice try, and I salute you. But we who believe in divine providence also note that God can put his people to the test, and subject them to chastisement. I'm sure that is how Shukri and IA regard Mr. Spencer.

I notice that all those 19th century French scholars whom IA enlists on the side of Islam only praised Islam because they were destructive men who denied the existence of God and chiefly wished to find any convenient stick with which to beat the Christian dog. These were men viewing Islam from a very great distance. They knew nothing of the pirs in whom Pathans and Hazaras put so much faith; or the tombs of Sufis to which Muslims in China resort when they wish their prayers to be especially efficacious. Nor did they even bother with the veneration Shi'ah pay to Ali, Hassan, and Hussein. Indeed, it seems to me that IA's peculair vehemence against the atonement of Jesus Christ may be because deep down inside, he shares Islam's clear hunger for a mediator.

Further, IA's post reflects shopworn 19th century "village atheist" polemics such as the superstition that Constantine decided what would go into the Bible (he didn't: the OT canon was there long before him, and where NT lists differed, it was in which later, apocryphal works to include, for all agreed on the 4 Gospels, Acts, Letters of Paul, Peter, James, and John long before Constantine was born). The origins of the 27 traditional canon of the New testament is obscure only because it lies rooted in the very beginnings of the apostles' ministry--a work begun among obscure people whose survival indicates far more power than a cult whose leader could threaten people with the choices of conversion or death. Even Napoleon recognized as much,since we're quoting 19th century Frenchmen.

The Apocalypse of Peter, of which IA makes such liberal use, is a 2d century apocryphon, written long after the actual Peter.

And I see IA owes a very big debt to Dan Brown's _Da Vinci Code_; the latest marvel now viewed by all half-educated athesit television producers and burger flippers as unassailable.

IA, if Hebrews 5:6-8 denies Jesus was crucified, what do you make of the same book's affirmation of his death (2:14-18), and that his death was the final offering for sin (7:27;9:14,27-28); and that it took place on the cross (12:2). And, if Jesus prayed, how does this conflict with his later dying on the cross?

True, he prayed for God to deliver him from that death, as recorded in the Gospels (to which the letter to the Hebrews doubtlessly alludes). Yet this deliverence did not come until the third day, when "This Jesus hath God raised up" (Acts 2:32).

And, since you so admire the Mew Testament Letter to the Hebrews, what of the fact that it quotes the Psalms in the first chapter? Psalm 102:256-28, addressed to God Almighty, Hebrews applies to Jesus Christ, the Son (Hebrews 1:8-12). It seems that the book affirms

(a) the deity of Jesus the Messiah as well as his humanity,

(b) his death on the cross, and

(c) that his death is atonement for our sins.

So, IA, Shukri, I take your word for it that you wish to be with Jesus the Messiah after death. But, suppose he were to say something like this:

"You say you honor me, then why do you dishonor the death I died, the only atonement that can cleanse your sin? And was it not my death that showed the continuity of all blood sacrifices following the fall of Adam, from those given by righteous Abel, including those given on the altar in Jerusalem, down to mine? Is it not the very thing that gave Muhammad the idea of a chain of revelation? And, do you youself not recognize the need for blood sacrifice to connect man to God in your slaughter of sheep at Eid? So, why do you claim to honor me, while dishonoring the greatest gift I have to offer you?"

Indeed, dear Muslim friend, the death and resurrection of the Messiah Jesus are what set the seal on all former revelation. See Psalms 16 and 22, and Isaiah 53 for starters. See Psalm 2 of God speaking of his son in his former Testament. And, BTW, no Jew, save some in Muhammad's misinformed imagination, ever called Ezra the son of God. Indeed, it is clear that wherever the Old Testament speaks of the son of God, it speaks of the King of the Jews--the very title hung over Jesus' head when he bore our sins on the cross (John 19:19).

Further, since I mention the Son of God, let me introduce you to his wife as well, since I hear that sarcastic jape in the depths of your mind.
Many a Sunday, you may walk into one of our churches (I'm Presbyterian Church in America myself) and see the people partaking of bread and wine. It is God's wife actually sitting down to supper with him--for the whole body of faithful people is the spouse of God.

And, this supper we eat, proclaims the death of Jesus Christ till he comes (First Corinthians 11:26).

BTW, IA, I gather that there are folks saying that the Mahdi has come. He was a guy name Ahmed, from the Panjab. I'm sure Naseem would be glad to discuss him with you.

Or, was he the guy from late 19th century Sudan who disapproved of the Egyptian government's kowtowing to perfidious Albion and suppressing the slave trade? Then again, he may have been Baha'ullah.

Or, could it be that the final Word and mediator of God you desire is the one whom even Muhammad recognized as the Messiah of Israel?

The Spirit and the Bride say "Come" (Rev. 22:17).

Mentat, nice try, and I salute you. But we who believe in divine providence also note that God can put his people to the test, and subject them to chastisement. I'm sure that is how Shukri and IA regard Mr. Spencer.

I notice that all those 19th century French scholars whom IA enlists on the side of Islam only praised Islam because they were destructive men who denied the existence of God and chiefly wished to find any convenient stick with which to beat the Christian dog. These were men viewing Islam from a very great distance. They knew nothing of the pirs in whom Pathans and Hazaras put so much faith; or the tombs of Sufis to which Muslims in China resort when they wish their prayers to be especially efficacious. Nor did they even bother with the veneration Shi'ah pay to Ali, Hassan, and Hussein. Indeed, it seems to me that IA's peculair vehemence against the atonement of Jesus Christ may be because deep down inside, he shares Islam's clear hunger for a mediator.

Further, IA's post reflects shopworn 19th century "village atheist" polemics such as the superstition that Constantine decided what would go into the Bible (he didn't: the OT canon was there long before him, and where NT lists differed, it was in which later, apocryphal works to include, for all agreed on the 4 Gospels, Acts, Letters of Paul, Peter, James, and John long before Constantine was born). The origins of the 27 traditional canon of the New testament is obscure only because it lies rooted in the very beginnings of the apostles' ministry--a work begun among obscure people whose survival indicates far more power than a cult whose leader could threaten people with the choices of conversion or death. Even Napoleon recognized as much,since we're quoting 19th century Frenchmen.

The Apocalypse of Peter, of which IA makes such liberal use, is a 2d century apocryphon, written long after the actual Peter.

And I see IA owes a very big debt to Dan Brown's _Da Vinci Code_; the latest marvel now viewed by all half-educated athesit television producers and burger flippers as unassailable.

IA, if Hebrews 5:6-8 denies Jesus was crucified, what do you make of the same book's affirmation of his death (2:14-18), and that his death was the final offering for sin (7:27;9:14,27-28); and that it took place on the cross (12:2). And, if Jesus prayed, how does this conflict with his later dying on the cross?

True, he prayed for God to deliver him from that death, as recorded in the Gospels (to which the letter to the Hebrews doubtlessly alludes). Yet this deliverence did not come until the third day, when "This Jesus hath God raised up" (Acts 2:32).

And, since you so admire the Mew Testament Letter to the Hebrews, what of the fact that it quotes the Psalms in the first chapter? Psalm 102:256-28, addressed to God Almighty, Hebrews applies to Jesus Christ, the Son (Hebrews 1:8-12). It seems that the book affirms

(a) the deity of Jesus the Messiah as well as his humanity,

(b) his death on the cross, and

(c) that his death is atonement for our sins.

So, IA, Shukri, I take your word for it that you wish to be with Jesus the Messiah after death. But, suppose he were to say something like this:

"You say you honor me, then why do you dishonor the death I died, the only atonement that can cleanse your sin? And was it not my death that showed the continuity of all blood sacrifices following the fall of Adam, from those given by righteous Abel, including those given on the altar in Jerusalem, down to mine? Is it not the very thing that gave Muhammad the idea of a chain of revelation? And, do you youself not recognize the need for blood sacrifice to connect man to God in your slaughter of sheep at Eid? So, why do you claim to honor me, while dishonoring the greatest gift I have to offer you?"

Indeed, dear Muslim friend, the death and resurrection of the Messiah Jesus are what set the seal on all former revelation. See Psalms 16 and 22, and Isaiah 53 for starters. See Psalm 2 of God speaking of his son in his former Testament. And, BTW, no Jew, save some in Muhammad's misinformed imagination, ever called Ezra the son of God. Indeed, it is clear that wherever the Old Testament speaks of the son of God, it speaks of the King of the Jews--the very title hung over Jesus' head when he bore our sins on the cross (John 19:19).

Further, since I mention the Son of God, let me introduce you to his wife as well, since I hear that sarcastic jape in the depths of your mind.
Many a Sunday, you may walk into one of our churches (I'm Presbyterian Church in America myself) and see the people partaking of bread and wine. It is God's wife actually sitting down to supper with him--for the whole body of faithful people is the spouse of God.

And, this supper we eat, proclaims the death of Jesus Christ till he comes (First Corinthians 11:26).

BTW, IA, I gather that there are folks saying that the Mahdi has come. He was a guy name Ahmed, from the Panjab. I'm sure Naseem would be glad to discuss him with you.

Or, was he the guy from late 19th century Sudan who disapproved of the Egyptian government's kowtowing to perfidious Albion and suppressing the slave trade? Then again, he may have been Baha'ullah.

Or, could it be that the final Word and mediator of God you desire is the one whom even Muhammad recognized as the Messiah of Israel?

The Spirit and the Bride say "Come" (Rev. 22:17).

sorry for the multiples

The reason why Islam is the fastest growing religion in the UK is because of the high birth rates of Pakistanis. This is due to the arranged marriage system and the fact that women are used as breeding cattle.

The high birth rate is matched by the fact that Muslims are the fastest growing religion in prisons in the UK. They now account for the biggest single ethnic or religious group incaracerated in the UK in proportionate terms.

This means that Muslims are the fastest growing criminal race in Britain.

Muslim women also have the fastest growing suicide rate in the UK too, Muslim women are three times as likely as the national average to kill themselves.

Muslims also have the fastest growing rate of honour killings in the UK too, in which, opposite to other eastern immigrant groups in which this phenomena is decreasing as they improve their economic status and education, the rate of slaughter of daughters and sisters for daring to want a boyfriend or education is rapidly increasing.

Muslims also have the fastest growing rate of diseases in the UK associated with consanguinity, that is, genetic in-breeding caused by first-cousin marriage.

Muslims also have the fastest growing rate of drug abuse out of all religions in Britain too; in some areas of the country, for example Tower Hamlets and Bradford, Muslims make up the largest groups of heroin addicts in the country.

Muslims are also the fastest growing group of terrorists in the UK too, for example, the Gloucester man Sajid Badat being the latest in a long line of British Muslims who have been involved in terrorism and plots to kill as many innocent infidels as possible in the name of Islam.

Islam also has one of the highest rates of apostasy of any religion in the UK too, as a recent article by Anthony Browne in The Times shows, that despite death threats and persecution, Muslims are leaving their religion in droves, although it is not reported by the media that much, for fear of enraging more Muslims, and worsening their inferiority complex, and making them turn to criminality, of which they are already the fastest growing religion of criminals, or terrorists, of which they are the fastest growing religion.

They are also the fastest growing religion of illiterates, as study after study shows that Muslims have the highest rate of educational idiocy and exam failure in the UK, in contrast to Hindus, Jews, Sikhs and Chinese, who out perform native white people, and contribute to the health and happiness of the UK.

Yes indeed, Islam is the fastest growing religion in many areas of the UK.

Dear Shukri and IA

The following passages from the book of Corinthians may give us some understanding to why the Bible makes no sense to you.

these things God has revealed to us through the Spirit. For the Spirit searches everything, even the depths of God. (1 Corinthians 2:10)

For who knows a person's thoughts except the spirit of that person, which is in him? So also no one comprehends the thoughts of God except the Spirit of God. (1 Corinthians 2:11)

Now we have received not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might understand the things freely given us by God. (1 Corinthians 2:12)

And we impart this in words not taught by human wisdom but taught by the Spirit, interpreting spiritual truths to those who are spiritual. (1 Corinthians 2:13)

The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned. (1 Corinthians 2:14)

The spiritual person judges all things, but is himself to be judged by no one. (1 Corinthians 2:15)

"For who has understood the mind of the Lord so as to instruct him?" But we have the mind of Christ. (1 Corinthians 2:16)

Compare the following passages with what Mohammad says!

For when one says, "I follow Paul," and another, "I follow Apollos," are you not being merely human? (1 Corinthians 3:4)

What then is Apollos? What is Paul? Servants through whom you believed, as the Lord assigned to each. (1 Corinthians 3:5)

I planted, Apollos watered, but God gave the growth. (1 Corinthians 3:6)

So neither he who plants nor he who waters is anything, but only God who gives the growth. (1 Corinthians 3:7)

Sahih Bukhari
Volume 1, Book 3, Number 106:
The Prophet said, "Do not tell a lie against me for whoever tells a lie against me (intentionally) then he will surely enter the Hell-fire."

You can plainly see that Mohammad is his own god, completely equal with Allah, the penalty is the same for speaking bad about both.

The Bible on the other hand clearly shows that only God matters, not his messengers.