They "would turn right around and try to slit our throats, slit our children's throats"

Straight talk and refreshing honesty from General Myers. "Myers Defends Treatment of Guantanamo Prisoners," from AP, with thanks to DC Watson:

WASHINGTON (May 29) - The Pentagon's top general on Sunday defended the treatment of prisoners at the U.S. Navy prison camp at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba and said the U.S. believes al-Qaida leader Abu Musab al-Zarqawi is wounded, though it's not known how badly.

Gen. Richard Myers, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said the U.S. has done a good job of humanely treating detainees. Muslims in several countries have protested in recent weeks about allegations that a Quran was flushed down a toilet at Guantanamo as part of an interrogation of a prisoner.

The human rights group Amnesty International released a report last week calling the prison camp "the gulag of our time."

Myers said that report was "absolutely irresponsible." He said the U.S. was doing its best to detain fighters who, if released, "would turn right around and try to slit our throats, slit our children's throats."

In accord with Qur'an 47:4: "Therefore, when ye meet the Unbelievers (in fight), smite at their necks..."

"This is a different kind of struggle, a different kind of war," Myers said on "Fox News Sunday."

"We struggle with how to handle them, but we've always handled them humanely and with the dignity that they should be accorded."

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32 Comments

Bon mot, Gen Myers.
Spoken like a straight-talking soldier.

The US military has nothing really to apologise for.

Now if only you could quote a few koranic verses to support your assertions, things would look up.

Defiling an enemy's religious icons is a time-honored technique used to draw him into the open, to provoke him into revealing himself ... the better to destroy him. So it is with the quran and islam ... we desecrate the quran and islam shows us its true face. It is a primitive taking of sides.

To me, it looks like islam on the one side, America and her allies on the other. (W's rambling twaddle to the contrary notwithstanding, islam is not among America's allies.)

No muslims. No mosques.

Gen Myers:We struggle with how to handle them, but we've always handled them humanely and with the dignity that they should be accorded"

but do not deserve

i ask anyone who is interested in finding out alot of info on Islam, i suggest a really good website with lots of good and true facts and info on the "Religion of Peace" www.islamundressed.com i read t from start to end and all of the info there matched what i have already know from other sources i have read myself....islam has been waging its agressive war on the rest of humanity since its very beginning...1400+ years of war, rape, murder, deciet and lies...Islam is not a Religion of Peace...never was, never will...Islam's so called "prophet" Muhammed, was and is nothing but a lunatic,murdering,egomaniac who worshiped satan and the Muslims of the world still do to this day....there is no way to change islam, as it would no longer be Islam...the only way is to destroy the teachings of Muhammed and his followers who worship this satanic man and his cult....read it, go to the website and learn for youreselves what the "religion of Peace" is truly about....Knowledge is Power

`American lives would be saved if we out terrorized the enemy, NOT by handling them "humanely"'.

The reasoning behind the humane treatment of prisoners is to protect American soldiers.

Firstly, by treating the enemy humanely, we make him more likely to surrender and less likely to fight to the death. I know the jihadists like to say that they will all fight to the death, however the hundreds of prisoners in US custody are evidence that they can be convinced to surrender.

Secondly, by treating the enemy humanely, we can expect humane treatment of American prisoners, and punish those who fail to give it. True, this isn't likely to help much with terrorist groups. But private terrorist armies aren't the only people we may end up fighting.

Thirdly, and by no means least, we can avoid alienating the world and thereby undermining our war effort.

Then there's a whole lot of moral arguments that you may or may not be interested in.

The high standard of treatment of prisoners was allowed to slip in Vietnam and the war was still lost. It's doubtful that the benefits of the Guantanamo regime will outweigh the damage to America's international reputation. Flouting the Geneva Convention* was a political mistake. They could have been held as POWs of the invasion of Afghanistan (the war on the Taliban is ongoing to this day). Instead the Bush Administration handed a propaganda goldmine to the enemy, and for what? We still haven't captured Bin Laden.

* At this point you may wish to respond that the Guantanamo prisoners are not POWs because they don't carry arms openly, etc etc. That may be so, however article 5 of the Third Geneva Convention states: "Should any doubt arise as to whether persons, having committed a belligerent act and having fallen into the hands of the enemy, belong to any of the categories enumerated in Article 4 [that is, people protected as POWs], such persons shall enjoy the protection of the present Convention until such time as their status has been determined by a competent tribunal."

"To me, it looks like islam on the one side, America and her allies on the other."

To me, it looks like you are deluded.
What about American Muslims? what side are they on? America really doesn't have much allies, America has isolated many Europeans and other people across the World. Russia has pledged to support the Palestinians, China has invested heavily in Iran, Russia has helped Iran with its nuclear program. Russia has sold missiles to Syria.
Are these the ‘allies’ you were talking about?

"We need to capture them, question them, and then execute them!

...Amnesty International are a bunch of anti American Pinko's, who I wouldn't mind see being put in Guantanamo too. Perhaps then they would be able to give the terrorists the one on one love, and attention they feel they deserve."

"Let me guess, we are going to rehabilitate these terrorists at tax payers expense ( if Amnesty International had their way), instead of putting a bullet in their brain....or better yet, by gassing them."

I am no longer surprised as to why many Europeans are anti-American.

Thanos35 is right. Islamundressed.com is an excellent site. Everyone should read it and Mr. Spencer should link to it.

"What about American Muslims? what side are they on?"

You tell us, ia. Can a muslim be a patriot in an infidel land?

IA - Eurarabia is no longer Christian. It is Atheist/Socialist/Pagan/Islamic. Practicing Christians are very small number (excluding the liberal chruches that don't follow the Bible).

The USA is very different, around 30% are practicing Christians, who follow the Bible. Which is probably why there is much more freedom, warts and all, in the USA, compared to the socialist doctrine running through Eurarabia.

So of course the Gay Loving, Islamic Pagan loving, Europeans are against the US and Australia, and to a lesser degree, England. It was the same in WW2. Europeans loved Hitler, right up until it was to late.

Funny though, how they all want to live here! (in the Oz case)

Oh and as for the People of The North (Russia, China) supporting Iran etc (the very countries who want to invade Israel), maybe you should read the Bible where it talks about the Magog invasion of Israel - its all falling into place for the event (NOTE TO SELF - NO PROPHECY IN KORAN - ONLY YHWH OUTSIDE OF TIME DIMENSION- NOT ALLAH)

IA - hows the hunt going for a little nine year old for sex? Just so you can be like Mohammmed (may pigs piss be upon him)

Viking5,

The notion that treating Jihadists "humanely" makes them more likely to surrender rather then fight to the death is not reality. Jihadists are usually killed in most conflicts rather then being taken prisoner because they have a habit of behaving treacherously while surrendering. Jihadists will pretend to surrender then take out hidden weapons and fire on the soldiers while pretending to surrender. So soldiers in other coutries just kill Islamists rather then take them captive thus eliminating the need for POW camps. If places like Gitmo close it will mean that Jihadists will be killed on the battlefield rather then being taken captive and treated "humanely".As our military leaders have said, this is a different kind of conflict. Muslim terrorists have no honor, obey no rules of engagement and violate the laws of war. They are lucky to be alive and living at Gitmo since most other countries just kill them.

As for the Geneva convention that is a treaty among nations, Al Qaeda and other Muslim terrorists groups have not signed the treaty and therefore are not entitled to its protections. Only "lawful" combatants are entitled to protection under Geneva. Lawful combatants wear uniforms, carry their weapons openly and do not attack civilians. Even if Al Qaeda had signed the treaty they would forfeit any protection because they have executed prisoners and deliberately attacked civilians.As for Gitmo the US has always maintained POW camps during time of war and Gitmo is a POW camp where unlawful combatants are being held. Combatants can be freed when the conflicts ends whether that's 5, 10 or 50 years from now.

Roxane:

Spot on!

As far as I'm concerned they should have been executed long ago. To keep them alive makes us look foolish in the eyes of the Jihadi's.
This war is a war against Islam, nothing else. Islam is terror, either we wipe out the disease or we will go down with it.
This is not like fighting a country or fighting communism, this is about our freedom and everything we believe in.

There is nothing Mohammedans can possibly do to make our world a better place. Either they adjust, assimilate, integrate (which they won't do) or ship out.

Why should we be forced to live in fear? It's not worth it and we can not afford it. They infiltrate us to destroy us, nothing else.

The U.S. needs to grasp a few basics in this unconventional conflict:

Let the Europeans hate us.

Let Russia sell its own destruction by arming its many Muslim enemies.

Let China shows its true face by aiding Iran.

All three combined are weaker than the U.S. and can sell their own souls to their future slavemasters in the "Restored Caliphate" if they like.

We, on the other hand, need to crush the terrorist bastards wherever they arise. Execute the illegal combatants in the field, after "debriefing", and defend the Bill of Rights against the global theocratic despotism of Imperialistic Islam.

It is not our job to be "loved" but to survive.

Nothing we do will convince those predisposed to hate any power greater than their own to "trust" us. They can always find a rationale to fit their resentment, envy, jealousy, inferiority complex and arrogance.

"World opinion" and $2 will get your a cup of coffee.

These muslims don't respect decency.

Show them kindness, decency. Will this soften them, will they appreciate it? No. They read it as weakness. They only respect brute force. These guys are programmed to kill, main, destroy till they make the whole planet Islamic.

The General, who handles these people, said, if released they "would turn right around and try to slit our throats, slit our children's throats."

You don't pussyfoot with people like that.

I say,desecration of the koran is the way to go.
First of all it is legal,free speech,granted to us by the first amendment.
A flood of koran desecration on home videos distributed www,would bring out the muslim rage that would ultimately lead to their demise.

"There is nothing Mohammedans can possibly do to make our world a better place. Either they adjust, assimilate, integrate (which they won't do) or ship out."

Terminator,

Yes. Islam offers nothing more than misery, terror, death.

We hope they will adjust, assimilate, integrate. But it does not look likely.

Islam can't change. It is a doctrine set in concrete. It says it is the perfect religion, every word directly from their moon-god himself. And anyone who tries to change any bit of it should be killed. And if you try to leave Islam (having realized what a death cult it is) you get a death warrant from your mullah (exactly like a death cult). And if you try to adopt the ways of your host country, like some muslim girls did in Europe who just want to experience life like their non-muslim friends, you get killed, by your own keeper-of-the-faith muslims. You can't reform Islam, like you can other religions.

Islam's rigid dogmatism, and its use of terminal violence to keep itself intact and expand to make itself the only religion on the planet, makes it a virulent cancer in the body of mankind. If not removed, it will kill the body. Like a cancer.

There are 3 ways to kill a cancer - chemo, radio, surgery. Chemo and radio are not an option. Surgery may be, when the cancer is still small and localised and can be easily removed and sent back to wherever they came from. But if the cancer has metastasized and spread through too much of the body... then each region have to fend them off, reject them as foreign tissue, and hopefully, they will feel unwelcome enough to leave on their own, self deportation. The best hope. Otherwise... weep for your children?

Bill In Virginia-

I thought you were sending some secret message to 3rdtimelucky!

(Just be glad you aren't charged per posting!)

Some historian once said that: "Hitler always told the truth, but no one believed him."

(Until it was to late.)

"Mein Kampf" is nakedly honest in its intent.

As is the Koran.

All people need to do is read the damned thing.

How many in the MSM ever have? Or Congress? Or the CIA or FBI?

It's maddening. And ludicrous.

Derelection of duty is what I consider it.

And, meanwhile, they are closing military bases -during a war...

I feel like I'm watching a really bad production of "Waiting For Godot".

"its best to detain fighters who, if released, "would turn right around and try to slit our throats, slit our children's throats."

The general is right.

"Humane treatment"...Just exactly what is that?
Is it possible to give "equal" humane treatment to every detainee/prisoner. How much humane treatment do you give someone who is hanging off your arm by their teeth? Is it possible to give the same level of humane treatment to a detainee who attacks guards at every opportunity, is hostile or beligerant, as another detainee who is non threatening, compliant or even helpful?
Is humane treatment an attitude possessed by most but not by some? What governs our ideas about that? Conscience? Ego?
Is it inhumane to keep someone strapped to a bed for days, if that person is murderously assaultive. Is it inhumane to handcuff a cooperative prisoner? Is it inhumane to enforce idelness? What about denial of priviledges, such as no television? No checkers for two years.
Enforced idelness is torture. Happens in American prisons/institutions daily. Is that humane treatment? The list goes on...
It's hard to defend abuse...some things really are abusive, but there is every shade of gray.
Simply being confind is inhumane. Thats against the human desire for freedom. It directly opposes liberty. In spite of all that, confinement is sometimes called for.
Who decides what's humane treatment and what is not? Laws are sterile, they talk a lot but do nothing. So in reality the final deciders
are the guard(s) on site. They are dealing with dangerous people real time, close-up. This is not easy work and most people, could not, would not do it. It takes an exceptional person to have life and death authority over hostiles, and not abuse it. Because of mans long love affair with confinement and abuse of confinee's,
and because torture of any kind is an affront to our humanity, guards should be carefully selected and specially trained. Supervision should be a high priority,
And security paramount. And even THAT will not guarantee humane treatment, but it would help...

Amnesty International's priority seems not be to human rights but whom they can look bad, the main country they seek to vilify being the US.

They almost never report cases of abuses being done in the name of Islam, that is why they will go on about Guantanamo Bay but ignore the huge number of cases of people put in prison or mental asylums in the Dar-al-Islam for apostasy despite the fact that they have been known to be tortured and in Saudi, routinely beheaded in public.

AIUK recently had some event where the father of one of the Guantanamo detainees. Why didn't they choose the father of someone in jail in say Libya for renouncing Islam?

It's ironic that so many people cling desperately to the belief that jihadists will never surrender, in a thread about how we should treat jihadists who surrender.

If you think there is no surrender then you are believing the jihadist propaganda. Even Imperial Japan surrendered. The Germans had to be convinced to fight to the bitter end by blood-curdling propaganda about what the victorious Americans were going to do to a defeated Germany. The jihadists talk tough, but we're never going to win the war on terror by killing everyone with pro-jihad views. It's just not possible. We have to kill those who are determined to fight and deter the rest from taking up arms.

If you think that pious notions of jihad are the only thing that motivates terrorists, then I think you read too much JihadWatch! Check out the pro-jihad websites like jihadunspun. The terrorists dedicate plenty of airtime to non-Qur'anic reasons to fight America. Jihad is part of the picture, an important part, and JihadWatch does valuable work in exposing that. But it's not the only piece to the puzzle.

Treating prisoners properly isn't about being "nice", it's about winning the war by undermining the enemy's will to fight. America didn't sign the treaties to be nice, it signed them to protect its own humanity and its own soldiers. If we want other countries to obey their treaty obligations then we have to be seen to do likewise.

Amnesia Int'l is bought and sold on commie ideals and willing suckers for arabs money...

Viking: Keep dreaming! Watch some Zarqawi-snuff movies and lets talk again after.

The Gitmo scumbags have the right to watch each other being executed. That's the 'right' they have. All other rights they have left behind in the Jihad world world of terror. This is not about 'winning'- it's not a ball game.

Its about eliminating the enemy. We can never 'win' this. We can do something to protect ourselves. That means: Internment, mass-deportations and mass executions. The US in its humanitarian mania is unable to move in this direction. We have to be 'nice', we are told to 'respect' the filth of the 7th century.
Unfortunately, the US is far from identifying the enemy. Once we get there, things will change. What does it take to save ourselves?

Viking: How can you compare 'imperial Japan' to Mohammedan madness? How can you compare Germans to Mohammedan lunacy? For Japanese and Germans it was a period of collective madness, they went through it and left it behind, they are still civilized nations after all. How can you compare that with 1350 years of brainwashed, frenzied fanaticism, illiteracy, superstition and bloodlust which is inbred and impossible to cure?

Go and live in a Mohammedan country and learn something, dear friend!

Amnesia finds it easy to piss on the US or the EU:

No harm done, apart from a bit of treason, sedition and incitement.

Freedom, no?


Strangely the reports from Zimbabwe, Bangladesh, Pakistan,Burma Kongo and Saudi Arabia are somehow strangely muted.

Perhaps I should say 'not forthcoming'- where are the heroes of AI?

Piss elsewhere Miss Khan!

i have been a supporter of amnesty international but now based on some of the posters here i am reconsidering it, not sure what I’ll do about my support for them, but I have to admit that its true; amnesty very rarely talks about the main demon of this world: Islam.
America’s report card is lily white compared to the islmaists report card when it comes to treating prisoners, muslim nations not only don’t dispute that they torture their prisoners they arrogantly boast that they do!!. and I believe that although Americans are no angels and do make a lot of mistakes and sometimes messy ones and have committed war crimes as many nations have,. they are NOT fundamentally evil.

Islam however, IS fundamentally evil in my belief.
and its a cult of total hate. Fundamental hatred towards anyone who is not a Muslim until they convert. that is Islam in a nut shell.
For those who are not totally pleased with USA I have to say that you need to remember right now.. USA is really the only nation that is standing up to Islam and because of this all enemies of Islam should unite with America. I consider myself a friend to America.
I just hope that America comes out and formally calls Islam for the cult that it is and disallow sharia (Islam is not a religion and therefore should not be allowed under the freedom of religion) and tax Muslims who openly stay Muslims because of all the pain Islam costs everyone and help and understand the apostates of Islam and their risk.

the biggest threat to human rights for the last 1700 years has been Islam. the reason Islam is growing is because of the same reasons bullies rule in poorer desperate nations. Islam is the evil bully wherever its gone through out time.

I have recently read a very good essay that clarifies what dishonorable jihads have given up. And why gitmo detainees should NOT be afforded POW status, >>>>>>>>>>Sanctuary.....


http://www.ejectejecteject.com/


Viking5...and look what it took to get Japanese Imperialists to surrender.

Non Quranic reasons for jihad are periferal to the central Quranic reasons. They are elaborated for propaganda purposes. Anything to make Allahs cause look just. The more valid they appear the better. The quest for world domination by Islam,(no secret), would out of necessity include non Quranic issues, but they are never "the" reason for jihad. Beware, muslim scapegoating and mental distractions. They are designed to trap you into seeing things "their way". If you see things "their way", they have converted you.
Jihad by definition is holy war, no non Quranic reasons will take precident over over "Allahs cause... ever. It is always dominate.

When we set up Gitmo and gave these thugs the full raft of Islamic paraphernalia – Qorans, prayer rugs, arrows pointing to Mecca, and chaplin imans, we were naively not attempting to de-Islamize them; instead we were trying to demonstrate to the world how humane we are taking care of their “religious needs”. Actually, we were giving them the tools to refresh and reinforce their Islamist terrorist hate mentality.

It would have been like giving German POWs in WWII copies of Mein Kempf and Nazi SS propaganda officers to hold classes every day on taking over the world.

We have in effect, been retraining these jihadists for more jihad by allowing them access to the paraphernalia of Islam, in particular the Qoran, which seethes with hate for all non-Muslims and orders Muslims to commit murder, mayhem and rape.

These thugs need to be de-Islamisized before allowing them back into the general population (in the Middle East, not here!). No Qorans, no chaplins, no imans, no prayer rugs, no communications with each other. This should be accompanied by reprogramming, emphasizing civilized behavior, respect for others, respect for women, etc.

More interesting might even be reprogramming some as “Manchurian Candidates” to return and undermine Al Queda from within.

A guy who goes through Gitmo comes out re-charged and will lead the battle against the US: With enough time to 'study' the Koran, with enough hatred to wipe out a major city in the West (or 2 or 3) they will do what they are programmed for:

'Strike terror in the hearts of the enemy...'

(don't remember which number that is in the Koran..)

The Japanese surrendered after two atoms bombs were dropped and they faced the prospect of total annihilation. In WW2 the Japanese had the same religious fanaticism and master race mentality as our current enemy. Here's an excerpt from Victor Davis Hanson's essay on America's defeat of the Japanese at Okinawa.The Japanese strategy was to use "suicide attacks" against American forces. One lesson that was learned at Okinawa is the high cost in American lives in taking Japan using conventional forces against suicidal Japanese soldiers. The US decided to save American lives by dropping two atomic bombs. It should also be noted that the Japanese killed more Chinese during their brutal occupation of Nanking then the number who died in Japan when two atomic bombs were dropped.

More Okinawa The a Vietnam?

From April 1 to mid-June, 1945, we fought die-hard enemies well entrenched in vast caves stocked with telephone switchboards, tanks, artillery, and mortars. The enemy, while adopting European arms and military organization, had completely rejected Western pluralism, freedom, and tolerance as "weak" and "corrupt," and instead fortified its military with the fanatical religion of "Bushido," a crackpot and deviant Buddhist fundamentalism that sought to marry Emperor-worship with a medieval warrior code to produce a purportedly unstoppable new type of high-tech samurai warrior. The fantatics' goal was to rid the Pacific of Occidentals, and let China, Korea, southeast Asia, and the Pacific Islands "join" an "Oriental" alliance, orchestrated from Tokyo as an exploitive empire passed off as the "Greater Co-Prosperity Sphere." Sound familiar?

American soldiers were thousands of miles distant from our shores, closer to the enemy mainland than to friendly bases. As an ally, we had only Britain — who did her best, but could not offer much in our hour of crisis. The enemy shanghaied local civilians into their army, filled them full of lies about Americans, and turned them loose against us either to charge as suicide bombers, or often to commit mass suicide themselves. Soldiers hid in civilian houses, hospitals, even tombs of the dead to avoid our bombers — which were never successful in finding the Japanese high command, but hit a lot of civilians trying. Fanatics like General Isamu Cho and Mitsuru Ushijima boasted of no surrender, rejected all efforts at armistice, and vowed to take as many Americans as possible with them. Crude propaganda leaflets and radio broadcasts promised horrific deaths to Americans and portrayed them as cowardly killers who would rape and murder innocent civilians — over 100,000 natives of the island would eventually be casualties. The Japanese leadership itself, in the manner of ancient warlords, believed Americans were decadent and soft. Indeed, without the overwhelming firepower of the United States — purportedly to be neutralized on Okinawa by offensive suicide attacks on ships, and the defense of caves and concrete bunkers — the generals swore that few of the stinking Americans could ever stand up to Japanese soldiers in battle.

Suicide bombers were everywhere. Kamikazes ("The Divine Wind") dove unexpectedly from cloud cover; eventually they would fly almost 2,000 sorties and sink 34 American ships. They hit another 368 craft. The Japanese unleashed previously unknown and quite bizarre new weapons to terrify Americans, such as the human guided rocket (ohka), the crash boat (Shinto), the suicide midget submarines (koryu and kairyu), and the fukuryu or human mines.

The wounded and dead were wired with explosives; holes in the ground opened up to pour forth small squads of charging Japanese suicide machine-gunners at the rear of American troops. Despite days of preliminary bombing, it was soon discovered, to the Marines' dismay, that few defenders on Okinawa were killed in their fortified and hidden bunkers. Meanwhile, Japanese suicide gliders attacked Marine airfields while Kamikazes from Japan dove onto carriers at sea. Americans met every challenge, but victory proved costly — and far more deadly — than planners had anticipated.

As for the Geneva convention that is a treaty among nations, Al Qaeda and other Muslim terrorists groups have not signed the treaty and therefore are not entitled to its protections. Only "lawful" combatants are entitled to protection under Geneva. Lawful combatants wear uniforms, carry their weapons openly and do not attack civilians. Even if Al Qaeda had signed the treaty they would forfeit any protection because they have executed prisoners and deliberately attacked civilians.As for Gitmo the US has always maintained POW camps during time of war and Gitmo is a POW camp where unlawful combatants are being held. Combatants can be freed when the conflicts ends whether that's 5, 10 or 50 years from now.

Most excellent from you Roxanne. You get one of Catherine's gold stars!!

Roxanne. WOW.

Everything that has been posted about the Japanese makes interesting reading, but the fact remains that they were eventually convinced to surrender, and nobody has provided evidence that the end of the war would have been hastened if we had adopted a policy of torturing or executing prisoners.


"As for the Geneva convention that is a treaty among nations, Al Qaeda and other Muslim terrorists groups have not signed the treaty and therefore are not entitled to its protections."

Afghanistan signed up. The Taliban never denounced the treaty. Therefore anyone fighting the US-led invasion would be a POW. Al Qaeda operatives may well not qualify as POWs under article 4, but that's not a decision that Bush can make en-masse about hundreds of prisoners, on a whim! As I said before, article 5 of the treaty states that "Should any doubt arise as to whether persons, having committed a belligerent act and having fallen into the hands of the enemy, belong to any of the categories enumerated in Article 4 [people protected as POWs], such persons shall enjoy the protection of the present Convention until such time as their status has been determined by a competent tribunal." A competent tribunal should establish whether any prisoner has done anything that puts him outside the Geneva protections.

I once saw an American soldier in Iraq running a military prison, soon after the invasion. An Iraqi came to the prison asking about his son, no doubt fearing the worst. The soldier told him: "Sir, we are a nation of laws, your son will be dealt with in accordance with the law". America needs to live up to his promise. A clear gulf must exist between America as a nation of law and the arbitrary powers of tyrants like Saddam and the Taliban, clear enought not just to be appreciated by us, but also by the people around the world that we seek to ally, pacify, and most of all by those we feel the need to occupy.

To all those who have attacked Amnesty, your points are well taken (they are insufferable hysterics), but they are not alone. The Red Cross has also voiced concerns about Guantanamo. And what of Colin Powell? Is he also an "anti-American Pinko" for opposing the current policy? What is really being achieved in Gitmo that could not be achieved if the prisoners were accorded POW status?

Even if Afghanistan signed the Geneva convention they would forfeit protection under the treaty by violating the treaty. For example, when an American soldier fell off a helicopter Taliban members swarmed over him and killed him rather then taking him prisoner and treating him "humanely". The execution was witnessed by American soldiers who were returning to rescue the soldier and violates the Geneva convention.The Taliban has a history of executing POWs (eg Northern Alliance) so they are in no position to demand protection under Geneva.

The Geneva convention applies only to "lawful" combatants. Lawful combatants are defined as wearing uniforms and carrying their weapons openly.Taliban soldiers do not wear uniforms to distinguish themselves from the civilian population. The Taliban also allied with Al Qaeda a group that committed an act of war by killing 3000 civilians in the US. Deliberately targeting civilians is a war crime.Taliban and Al Qaeda members are "unlawful" combatants who are not entitled to POW status.