It looks as if it may have been four British-born Muslim suicide bombers. Welcome to the future of Western Europe and the U.S. From "What we know so far: police statement on London bombs" in the Times Online, with thanks to Peter:
Deputy Assistant Commissioner. Peter Clarke, Head of the MPS Anti-Terrorist Branch and National Co-ordinator of Terrorist Investigations...."The investigation led us to have concerns about the movements and activities of four men, three of whom came from the West Yorkshire area.
"We are trying to establish their movements in the run up to last week's attacks, and specifically to establish if they all died in the explosions.
"Today we executed six search warrants issued under the Terrorism Act at premises in the West Yorkshire area.
"These included the home addresses of three of the four men to whom I have referred. A detailed forensic examination will now follow. This is likely to take some time to complete.
"We have identified CCTV footage showing the four men at King's Cross station shortly before 8.30am on that morning of July 7.
"One of the men who set out from West Yorkshire was reported missing by his family to the Central Casualty Bureau shortly after 10pm on Thursday, July 7. We have now established that he was joined on his journey to London by three other men.
"We have since found personal documents bearing the names of three of those four men close to the seats of three of the explosions.
"As regards the man who was reported missing, some of his property was found on the Route 30 bus in Tavistock Square.
"Property in the name of a second man was found at the scene of the Aldgate bomb. And in relation to a third man property in his name was found at the scene of both the Aldgate and the Edgware Road bombs.
"We also have very strong forensic and other evidence, that it is very likely one of the men from West Yorkshire died in the explosion at Aldgate. This, of course, is subject to formal confirmation by the Coroner....
"At one of the searches in West Yorkshire, some material has been found which has caused the West Yorkshire police to take measures to ensure that there is no risk to the public. The investigation of what has been found will be a detailed and lengthy exercise.
"At Luton a vehicle has been found in the station car park which we suspect is connected to this investigation. Again, steps are being taken to ensure that there is no risk to the public.
"One man has been arrested in West Yorkshire and will be brought to London to be questioned...."
That squawking sound comes from a large flock of vicious ugly Moslem chickens, coming home to roost. Basically, the English are totally fucked; rather, they totally fucked themselves. If there were an Olympic competition in this, the English would be the odds-on favorites. From readings here and elsewhere, none of this should be a surprise. We should take bets on when, if ever, the British will wake up. (I doubt ever.) Perhaps some groups can set up a Jewish rescue organization because, of course, the Jews will be blamed, perhaps by just existing.
Western civilization has got themselves in a pickle. All those Muslims they welcomed and even subsidized their immigration, they thought they would assimilate. They were dead wrong. What will they do? Surrender, call a halt to inbound Muslim immigration, crack down hard on any hate preachers and their followers? Darn, that 'religious freedom' right so cherished in Western Civilization keeps getting in the way, not to mention the Muslim and non=Muslim apologists.
It is just a matter of time until one of these idiothadis blows themself up among Americans. If I see anyone that resembles a muslim, I'm going the other way.
http://frum.nationalreview.com/print/
WHAT WE SHOULD EXPECT FROM MUSLIMS
National Post, July 12, 2005.
Western Muslims feel badly misunderstood. The vast majority of them utterly abhor terrorism against the countries in which they live. And yet they sense suspicion from their fellow citizens.
Meanwhile, those fellow citizens are feeling increasing frustration with their Muslim neighbours. Since 9/11, security forces have foiled some 40 major plots against Western nations. Many if not most of those plots have been the work of local Muslims. Hundreds of European Muslims have journeyed to join the insurgents in Iraq. Extremist preachers exploit the freedom of Western societies to incite terrorism against them.
Moderate Western Muslims -- and careful politicians -- prefer not to acknowledge this reality. But euphemism is breeding resentment on all sides. We'd all benefit from speaking clearly. Let us be explicit about what we expect from Muslim communities:
- Acknowledge Reality; accept Responsibility. Obviously it would be unjust to blame the religion of Islam for terrorism. But equally obviously, terrorism is a problem within Islam, and Islamic communities bear a special obligation to uproot it.
Yet how many times have you heard an Islamic leader in a Western country urge Muslims to take action against the extremists in their midst? Or unequivocally repudiate violent jihad? Or condemn by name those who lead young Western Muslims astray?
- Isolate and Exclude Extremists. Too often, even the most moderate Western imams excuse and condone extremism.
GOOD READ!!!
- Co-operate actively with police and security services. After the 9/11 attacks, one U.S. Islamic organization distributed a pamphlet called Know Your Rights, explaining to American Muslims that they had no obligation to answer questions from the police. From a legal point of view, that is of course correct. But one would have imagined that patriotic Muslims would want to tell the police anything that might help protect the country against future attack and bring the guilty to justice.
READ THE WHOLE THING LOOKS LIKE HE HAS BEEN PAYING ATT.??
Part of the American Tribe
Squirrel Hunter
Spider Killer
GOD BLESS THE USA AND HER FIGHTING FORCES AND ALL WHO FIGHT WITH HER GIVE THEM STRENGTH, WISDOM, SIGHT, AND COURAGE TO DESTROY ALL ISLAMIC TERRORIST AND ALL WHO SUPPORT THEM AMEN
These guys are the ones who carry out the bombings.My question is where is the bombmaker he is to important to be a homicide bomber.I'm surprise they didn't use a female or disguise male dress in a burqa.By wearing a burqa it would be impossible to identify them by the CCTV recordings.
Since we haven't seen Havoc for a while, here is a link to an article he posted at LGF.
There are no moderate muslims behind closed doors.
http://www.ropma.net/no_moderate_muslims.htm
Now that the UK has been a victim of sucide-bomb attacks not very different from the ones that have taken place and continue taking place in Israel - will the UK press and population mave a more friendly and comprehensive attitude towards Israel's plight, or will it take still a few more bombs?
For too long the world didn't pay attention to what was going on in Israel, excusing everything on the "Palestinian cause". Now the whole world is becoming an immense Israel, with human bombs everywhere...
Head of MPS Specialist Operations says, “I want to conclude by making it absolutely clear that no-one should be in any doubt the work last Thursday is that of extremists and criminals. So, that being the case no-one should smear or stigmatise any community with these acts."
Why not? Why not stigmatize those “communities”? They’re accessories to murder until they start helping. Stigmatize the hell out of them. It could be a little kick in the ass for said “communities” to do the right thing.
butterfly, I heard Steven Emerson on FNC today talking about just that. He said something to the effect of "that was a barb to be PC".
We can't let PC kill us. Truth please!
Skynews is reporting that 3 of the bombers are possibly British born Pakistanis.
Suicide bombers? Maybe. But suicide bombers don't need timers. I still suspect the bombers were recruited as couriers, then sacrificed. Like the muscle guys on board the 9/11 flights.
texan,
Why can't suicide bombers carry timers on them? It would be easier and more effective than depending upon human judgement linked to synchronized watches. Just have four guys with explosive-timers strapped onto their person or in the bags they are carrying.
The suicide bomber would be the living vehicle of the timer.
We (sane rational people) need to use logic to convince the majority of PC idiots in our society of a certain crucial point:
1) Yes, we know that the majority of Muslims are peaceful, law-abiding people (wink, wink, play along, we need to placate the PC idiots first), and that only a tiny minority of Muslims are dangerous.
2) However: there are various features of this situation that make it too difficult to tell the safe Muslims apart from the dangerous Muslims:
a) the dangerous Muslim "soldiers" wear no uniforms
b) the dangerous Muslims often have nothing superficially distinguishing them from safe Muslims: both groups may be
i) poor or middle class,
ii) uneducated or college-educated,
iii) wearing traditional garb & beards or wearing Western clothes,
iv) disgruntled in behavior or outwardly friendly,
v) blatantly spouting hostile rhetoric or using harmless moderate language
vi) clearly following extremist Islam or seeming to follow non-extremist Islam
c) the dangerous Muslims mingle freely among the larger populations of safe Muslims
d) the larger populations of safe Muslims include a significant number of Muslims who, though not actively & directly dangerous, nevertheless countenance the philosophy and activity of the dangerous Muslims -- this can have the practical effect of making it easier for the dangerous Muslims to hide & plan in their Muslim communities.
SUMMARY: In this situation, a rational response of law enforcement & self-defense requires us to use a net that is broad enough to encompass both groups (but not so broad that it impinges unduly on non-Muslim groups).
Folks, I just read this on the "http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200507/s1413217.htm" website...
"The British press has identified three of the four men suspected of launching suicide bomb attacks in London last week, saying that all of them were Britons of Pakistani origin who had never previously been suspected of terror links.
Several newspapers named two of the dead suspected bombers as 19-year-old Hasib Hussein and 22-year-old Shehzad Tanweer, who lived in Leeds."
hmmm...IRA members you think?
Islam is the problem, starring, as the 'perfect person' mohommed aka the prophet, the islamic Christ if you wish, a cross between Charles Manson and Attila the Hun, in whose footsteps the uber faithful follow, generating blood, gore and carnage.
Islam is THE problem, with its odious central character.
The refusal of any political figure of note, to admit the truth, islam is the problem, leaves our societies to suffer further defeats, more carnage, ad nauseum.
Only the truth can save us.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200507/s1413217.htm
Things that muslims should be careful of:
Things that we should be careful of are:
-Bury your hair and nails
-Don’t go under the tree after magrib
-Women should keep their hair covered especially if they go out at night
-Keep ourselves clean
-Refrain from going to a place which has been closed for over 40 days
and Allah Ta'ala Knows Best
SEAMS THE IRANI STUDENTS WERE OUT IN FORCE TODAY DEMANDING FREEDOM??
SEAMS ALSO THE CAR BOMBER IN ISRAEL WAS TIED TO THE CAR WITH A ROCK JAMED ON THE GAS PETAL??
Part of the American Tribe
Squirrel Hunter
Spider Killer
GOD BLESS THE USA AND HER FIGHTING FORCES AND ALL WHO FIGHT WITH HER GIVE THEM STRENGTH, WISDOM, SIGHT, AND COURAGE TO STAY THE COURSE T DESTROY ALL ISLAMIC TERRORIST AND ALL WHO SUPPORT THEM AMEN
PS
http://www.co-jet.org/
http://www.homelandsecurityus.com/pc.asp
Escalation in Terrorism
by Randy Taylor
When planes go down killing passengers and flight
crews, it brings terrorism dead center into the public
eye. It brings a more graphic and enlarged violent
picture to our minds because it is a painful reminder
of events past that occurred right here in our
country, a place we never imagined would be violated
in such a manner. Many of us stared in horror and
disbelief as we watched the tragic events unfold right
before our eyes on that frightful day in 2001.
This is the reason that the Chechen rebels or
affiliates of the same chose to hijack the Russian
jetliners on August 24, 2004. Suddenly the world is
aware that there is a steadily escalating conflict
between the Russian government and the Chechen Rebels,
although this conflict has been going on for many,
many years. It was imperative that they raise the ante
and perform acts that draw world attention, because as
with any terrorist action, the act itself bears
carnage and death but the larger and more valuable
prize to the terrorists is the attention, anxiety and
fear the act itself generates worldwide.
I would expect that the acts will become larger and
more grandiose in nature, as is indicated by the 150
plus hostages taken today by gunmen in Russia. It
almost appears that this type of action on the part of
the rebels almost seems to run in cycles as indicated
by the timeline below. But although the cycles seem
consistent, there seems to be an indication that the
stakes will rise and the terrorist attacks will become
more grandiose in nature, almost deserving more
attention from the world. Since 1995 the rebels have
been seizing buildings, taking hostages, detonating
bombs in suicide missions and killing people. Now they
appear, according to Russian Intelligence and media
reports, to have hijacked airplanes. The pattern over
the years has also indicated that in the beginning of
the rebellion in the 1990?s, the attacks were usually
in outlying provinces, towns or cities, when as of
late the attacks are moving into the capital itself,
Moscow. This is the alarming trend that brings it
closer to home, even as an observer living in America.
The terrorists are growing bolder in operations
everyday.
So one would question who the new motivated players
are in the rebellion in Russia? Who brought the
hijacking idea to the table in Chechen rebel terrorist
planning? Did they learn in a ?Monkey see, Monkey do?
fashion from Al Qaeda, or are the numbers of Al Qaeda
soldiers within the Chechen rebel ranks increasing?
How much of the information coming out of Russia is
accurate? Where is the actual funding coming from and
who are the real masterminds behind this escalating
violence? I?ve heard just about every speculative
theory I can stomach at this point and I sit back in
reserve, quietly, patiently waiting for factual
information that may never come in an accurate
delivery.
But, be rest assured in these simple facts. That
Global Terrorism is only getting started, that there
is no geographical safety zone on this planet to avoid
it and many, many lives will be lost during the
commission of terrorist attacks. In addition, many
lives will be lost fighting terrorists and terrorist
attacks.
We will never be able to accurately deduce who the
perpetrators were, simply by the weapons they used as
it has been proven time and time again, that any
weapon is available to you if your bank account can
bear it. We cannot deduce who the perpetrators were by
the methods used, as we do not know where all the
alliances lie within the terrorist ranks worldwide and
which group is influencing, financing or training
another group. We cannot assume that simply because a
statement is made claiming responsibility for the
terrorist act, that it is an accurate confession. We
cannot assume that because someone denies the
responsibility for the attack, that it is an accurate
denial. We do not know when, where or how the
terrorists will strike within this country with any
degree of accuracy. No one except the terrorist
planners themselves can answer that question. It isn?t
a matter of ?if?, it is a matter of ?when?.
Stay vigilant. Be safe.
--Randy Taylor
NOTE: As you read this timeline, amazingly enough CNN
omitted the attack on May 9, 2004 in Grozny that
killed Kadyrov, Baranov among other Chechen officials
at a stadium there. The bomb (as asserted by the New
York Times) was built into the concrete columns near
the viewing stand during recent repairs.
Timeline- Russia Terrorism Attacks
(http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/europe/09/01/russia.timeline/index.html)
August 31, 2004 - A female suicide bomber kills nine
people and herself, and wounds 51 others when she
detonates a bomb outside a subway station in
northeastern Moscow.
August 24, 2004 - Two Russian passenger planes are
blown up almost simultaneously, killing 89. Federal
Security Service focusing on whether acts of terrorism
brought down the jets after traces of explosives found
in wreckage of planes.
June 22, 2004 - Rebels seize an interior ministry
building in Ingushetia, near Chechnya, killing at
least 92 people, including the acting head of the
Ingush Interior.
February 6, 2004 - A rush-hour blast kills at least 30
people and injures 70 on a metro train in Moscow.
December 9, 2003 - A suicide bomber in central Moscow
kills at least five people.
December 5, 2003 - An explosion on a commuter train in
the Stavropol region north of Chechnya kills at least
36 people and injures more than 150.
September 3, 2003 - Six people are killed in an
explosion on board a commuter train near the Northern
Caucasus spa town of Pyatigorsk, but police say it is
not the work of Chechen rebels.
August 1, 2003 - A suicide bomber kills at least 50
people at a military hospital in the town of Mozdok in
North Ossetia bordering Chechnya.
July 5, 2003 - Two women suicide bombers kill 15 other
people when they blow themselves apart at an open-air
rock festival at Moscow's Tushino airfield. 60 are
injured.
June 5, 2003 - A woman bomber ambushes a bus carrying
Russian air force pilots near Chechnya, blowing it up
and killing herself and 18 other people.
May 14, 2003 - At least 16 people are killed in a
suicide bomb attack during a religious festival in the
town of Iliskhan-Yurt, east of Grozny. 145 are
wounded.
May 12, 2003 - Two suicide bombers drive a truck full
of explosives into a government administration and
security complex in Znamenskoye, in northern Chechnya.
Fifty-nine people are killed, and scores hurt.
December 27, 2002 - Chechen suicide bombers ram
vehicles into the local government headquarters in
Grozny, bringing down the roof and floors of the
four-story building. Chechen officials say about 80
people killed.
October 23, 2002 - About 50 Chechen rebels seize a
Moscow theater and take about 800 hostages. After a
three-day siege Russian forces storm the building
using gas, killing most of the rebels and 115
hostages.
August 8, 2000 - A bomb in a busy Moscow underpass
kills eight people.
July 2-3, 2000 - Chechen guerrillas launch five
suicide bomb attacks on bases of Russian forces within
24 hours. In the deadliest, at least 54 people are
killed at a police base near Grozny.
June 7, 2000 - In the first attack of its kind in the
breakaway republic of Chechnya, two Russian special
police are killed in a suicide car-bombing near the
regional capital Grozny.
September 1999 - Bombs destroy apartment blocks in
Moscow, Buynaksk and Volgodonsk, killing 200. The
government blames Chechen rebels, who in turn accuse
Russia's secret services. Then-Prime Minister Vladimir
Putin responds by sending troops into Chechnya for the
first time since 1997.
August 31, 1999 - A bomb explodes in an underground
shopping center near the Kremlin, injuring 20 people.
January 1996 - 350 Chechen militants seized a hospital
in Kizlyar, eastern Chechnya, and took more than 3,000
people hostage. In military operation to free them, 65
civilians and soldiers were killed.
June 1995 - Chechen rebels seize hundreds of hostages
in a hospital in southern Russian town of Budennovsk.
More than 100 die as Russian commandos launch botched
raid. Rebels allowed to leave for Chechnya after five
days in return for freeing captives.
PC Will Get Us Killed!
by Randy Taylor
REMEMER THIS IS ALL ISLAMIC TERRORIST!!!
http://www.solomonia.com/blog/archives/006107.shtml
Wednesday, June 29, 2005
EU Parliament President: EU is not an altruistic player in the Middle East
The EU, which provides the Palestinian Authority with half of the $1 billion in European aid, is not an altruistic player in the Middle East, said Borrell.
With its growing Muslim population, Europe is finding that violence in the Middle East leads to unrest within its own borders, he said.
"The conflict in the Middle East is dangerous for us. We are not just here, as the good guy who says, please do not fight between you. We need this conflict to be finished because of its impact on life in Europe.
ISRAEL HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH IT THEY WANT YOUR LANDS AND THE WORLD YOU BOUGHT THEIR LIE AND MADE THE USA SIDE WITH THE WRONG SIDE IN BOSINA AND KOSOVO WAKE UP EUROPE!!!
YOU BOUGHT THE WRONG TICKET!!!! AGAIN JUST LIKE YOU BOUGHT THE THOUGHT THAT HITLER WOULD LEAVE YOU ALONE!!!!
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/07/10/international/europe/10qaeda.html?hp&ex=1120968000&en=b50d65cef3786c79&ei=5094&partner=homepage&oref=login
July 10, 2005
For a Decade, London Thrived as a Busy Crossroads of Terror
By ELAINE SCIOLINO
and DON VAN NATTA Jr.
LONDON, July 9 - Long before bombings ripped through London on Thursday, Britain had become a breeding ground for hate, fed by a militant version of Islam.
For two years, extremists like Sheik Omar Bakri Mohammed, a 47-year-old Syrian-born cleric, have played to ever-larger crowds, calling for holy war against Britain and exhorting young Muslim men to join the insurgency in Iraq. In a newspaper interview in April 2004, he warned that "a very well-organized" London-based group, Al Qaeda Europe, was "on the verge of launching a big operation" here.
WAKE UP OR IT WILL BE THE END OF YOU!!!
http://www.chiesa.espressonline.it/dettaglio.jsp?id=6985&eng=y
The Church and Islam. "La Civiltà Cattolica" Breaks the Ceasefire
Through the prestigious magazine, the Vatican denounces with unusual harshness the oppression of Christians in Muslim countries. A testimony from Egypt
by Sandro Magister
ROMA - There is a conspicuous absence among the new cardinals created on October 21 by John Paul II: Archbishop Michael Louis Fitzgerald, president of the Pontifical Council for Interreligious Dialogue.
The current explanation is that Fitzgerald was not made cardinal because of his excessively placid approach to Islam.
And it is true that, together with this exclusion, an article was printed in "La Civiltà Cattolica" that contrasts markedly with the matter of Fitzgerald´s rebuke.
"La Civiltà Cattolica," edited by a group of Jesuits in Rome, is a very special magazine. Every one of its articles is reviewed by the Vatican secretary of state before publication. So the magazine reflects his thought faithfully.
In its October 18 edition, "La Civiltà Cattolica" published a strikingly severe article on the condition of Christians in Muslim countries. The central thesis of the article is that "in all of its history, Islam has shown a warlike and conquering face"; that "for almost a thousand years, Europe lived under its constant threat"; and that what remains of the Christian population in Islamic countries is still subjected to "perpetual discrimination," with episodes of bloody persecution.
What follows is an ample extract from the article printed in "La Civiltà Cattolica" no. 3680, October 18, 2003, and used here with the kind permission of the magazine:
NOT THE JEWS HERE WAR LIKE FOR 1000YRS BUT GUESS WHO??
WAKE UP PEOPLE READ THE WHOLE THING!!!
http://www.hindubooks.org/sudheer_birodkar/hindu_history/islam.html
Islam
- Came first Seemingly as a Message of Universal Brotherhood and Later as an Aggressor to Blanket India in a Dark Age for 700 years
by Sudheer Birodkar
At one of the searches in West Yorkshire, some material has been found which has caused the West Yorkshire police to take measures to ensure that there is no risk to the public. The investigation of what has been found will be a detailed and lengthy exercise.
I wonder what this means? Did they find evidence of some type of biological or chemical substance? The muslim demons are unconscionable. I think 99% of them are born with an incurable psychosis which appears to be hereditary. These monsters will haunt the world for decades to come, maybe centuries, unless we stop them now.
Posted by: Susanp at July 12, 2005 11:45 PM
SEAMS THAT THE BOMB PARTS AND MATERAL WAS CONNECTED TO BOSNIA???
OH MY WE WERE ON THE WRONG SIDE??
Part of the American Tribe
Squirrel Hunter
Spider Killer
GOD BLESS THE USA AND HER FIGHTING FORCES AND ALL WHO FIGHT WITH HER GIVE THEM STRENGTH, WISDOM, SIGHT, AND COURAGE TO STAY THE COURSE TO DESTROY ALL ISLAMIC TERRORIST AND ALL WHO SUPPORT THEM AMEN
PS
THIS LINKS SYIAR IRAQ BOSINA IRAN??
metaxy,
I agree. There's no reason why suicide bombers can't also have timers, as a failsafe to a lapse of resolve or otherwise. Near-simultaneous detonations are probably not the result of four independent time-keepers. From a captain's perspective, if you're going to rely on the timers, why bother to recruit, vet, select, train, watch, secure and dispatch suicides, when it is simpler and easier (for recruiting AND operational security) to find couriers, then kill them. You can claim later, if you want, that they sacrificed themselves in the name of Allah or whatever, and advertise and attract others to your cause, by claiming the dear departed were willing martyrs.
What I would want to find, of course, would be some notes to family or friends, some tapes, wills, etc., that said "goodbye," death to kafir, make ready the virgins, etc, here I come.
I remember seeing some video taken in one of the houses in Iraq where our soldiers uncovered a weapons cashe. On the floor, seemingly out of place and unmentioned in the narrative, was a box of toy cars, each about a foot long. There must have been twenty or thirty of them, all piled up, no packaging, just loose. These were radio-controlled cars like you'd find at Radio Shack, etc. It was clear to me that the radio control devices for these toys had served a military purpose. I think they would work in a tunnel.
When I was growing up we used to make bombs (and cannons and zip-guns) for fun. We could produce some pretty good gunpowder (blasting powder) out of materials we got at the drugstore. Our most sophisticated detonation system was using a Lionel train transformer and doorbell wire. Radio control was too expensive to even think about. We didn't have cellphones either, and those are often used now. The favorite terrorist timer used to be a Casio watch, but I understand these British guys had some washing-machine timers. I'm still trying to figure that one out.
If you have any ideas on that, I'd like to hear them.
texan,
I'm afraid you know more than I do about the technical aspects of this. I was just guessing based on logic -- but also based on the fact that Muslim terrorists have a far more frequent and psychologically based propensity to willingly engage in suicide bombings than any other military or terrorist group in history, including the WWII Japanese.
Just look at the hundreds of suicide bombers in Iraq over the last few years -- hundreds not coming out of one academy somewhere, but rather streaming in from many different countries (including Western countries where they live as immigrants or visitors). Then there's Israel and India/Pakistan.
Anyway, one of your comments seemed to imply that the Muslim terrorists use unwitting dupes as suicide couriers, but I don't think they have to dupe them: they have an ever-renewing supply of religious zealots quite lucidly prepared to sacrifice their lives in order to kill us in the Dar-al-Harb (or to kill those who have had the audacity to take back a part of the Dar-al-Islam: Israel, India, Philippines...).
texan,
I'm afraid you know more than I do about the technical aspects of this. I was just guessing based on logic -- but also based on the fact that Muslim terrorists have a far more frequent and psychologically based propensity to willingly engage in suicide bombings than any other military or terrorist group in history, including the WWII Japanese.
Just look at the hundreds of suicide bombers in Iraq over the last few years -- hundreds not coming out of one academy somewhere, but rather streaming in from many different countries (including Western countries where they live as immigrants or visitors). Then there's Israel and India/Pakistan.
Anyway, one of your comments seemed to imply that the Muslim terrorists use unwitting dupes as suicide couriers, but I don't think they have to dupe them: they have an ever-renewing supply of religious zealots quite lucidly prepared to sacrifice their lives in order to kill us in the Dar-al-Harb (or to kill those who have had the audacity to take back a part of the Dar-al-Islam: Israel, India, Philippines...).
Theres no distinction btwn British born, British or non-citizen muzzies they're all the same. Look at me... i'm a foriegn born British citizen... but i'm as British as any British born...
Theres no distinction btwn British born, British or non-citizen muzzies they're all the same. Look at me... i'm a foriegn born British citizen... but i'm as British as any British born...
Here it comes... the "nice guy, good muslim" terrorist:
The Liverpool Street bomber is believed to have been Shehzad Tanweer, 22, the son of Mohammed Mumtaz Tanweer, a fish and chip shop owner in Beeston, Leeds.
Friends said Shehzad Tanweer was a keen cricketer and "a good Muslim" and expressed disbelief that he could have been involved in England's worst terrorist attack.
link
But shocked friends and neighbours said the suspects were ordinary youths, more interested in sport than politics.
"He was a sweet guy who gets on with everyone," "sound as a pound" were some of the descriptions of one of the suspects, a 22-year-old sports science graduate who occasionally helped out in his father's fast food shop in the northern city of Leeds.
Police seized explosives after searching houses in Leeds and arrested a relative of one of the suspects.
link
Britain is not "fucked", as someone claims. Not even close. Actually, I was impressed by the speed and success of the police operation; to be able to identify the suicide killers and the way they operated, starting from no evidence at all, in less than a week, is remarkable. Ask any police officers how long they would expect such an investigation to last, in the circumstances, and when they could even begin to hope for results. Apparently, the police were pointed to these specific individuals by phone calls from locals, which means someone - in spite of the universal statements of astonishment from neighbours - had reason to suspect.
No, what is really astonishing is the disparity between the swift, efficient, clear-sighted and obviously successful action of the police, and the insisting and unhelpful clinging of the media to PC nostrums of the dreariest kind, when one would think that they would be, at least now, "mugged by reality". In fact, you cannot possibly imagine that politicians and journalists - except possibly for stooges such as Robert Fisk - can take their own PC chatter about the peaceful nature of Islam seriously.
That being the case, you have to realize that what we have here is something that frequently happens in British history - the leadership trying to manipulate the public. Tony Blair cannot possibly have believed what he said about "tiny minorities" when, as we know, he had been presented with a report claiming that 16,000 British Muslims had been to suspect places in Pakistan and Afghanistan. No, he knew exactly what the situation was; he merely lied to the people.
And why did he lie? Ah, there is the interesting thing. Part of it has to do with facts: the white British working class has, over the last few decades, proved extraordinarily productive of thugs (ask anyone who knows anything about football), and, with few exceptions, they outnumber immigrants virtually everywhere. For every Bethnal Green where Muslims are in or near the majority, there are dozens of working-class districts where they are outnumbered by the old white working class. That is a fact, so please do not throw misunderstood numbers at me. (I worked as a census taker a few years ago, and I know for a fact that British census figures are unreliable.)
The other part has, in my judgment, to do with the cultural background of our governing classes. Remember, these guys were young in the Sixties and Seventies. We are now governed by a generation of overage hippies; Tony Blair himself is absolutely typical of the breed, from his obsession with African poverty (a standard Sixties cause) to his love for Fender Stratocasters. And when these men and women were young, racial struggle was a real threat, not only in South Africa, but in the US - where the FBI was carrying out a near-civil war against a still powerful and entrenched Ku Klux Klan - and even in Britain, where an irresponsible Tory maverick, Enoch Powell, seemed for a second able to raise the flag of racial war.
Most of these men and women still have their Joan Baez and Peter Paul and Mary LPs in their closet - mentally or physically. They have grown with the fear of racial struggle, and they cannot now bring themselves to realize that there is no reality to their in-built visions of white British workers running amok in Asian neighbourhoods, torching Asian houses and beating Asians up. They cannot see the difference between the few, isolated and masked cowards who do perform such acts - and they exist - and the mass movement that was the KKK in the days of its power. Therefore their first reaction in such a crisis is - above all, do nothing that might encourage racial hatred.
And that has another feature. That they regard the Muslim community, in spite of its boasts and its inflated claims for numbers, as a small part of the body politic (as it is), constantly under threat from the white majority. Just because the white majority has no intention of acting as the elite's fevered sixties dreams imagine them -and just because the only mobs seen recently in British streets, except for Northern Ireland, have been Muslim - it does not mean that they are wrong, or that they underrate the numerical significance of Muslims. As chasers of votes, they have plenty of opportunity to evaluate it correctly.
Muslims are not going to take over. They are not going to become even a large minority, let alone a majority. What they are going to do is continue to produce a violent large minority (or even majority) from their numbers, with which the government has to deal; and to blackmail society by their very presence. This is the reality we have to deal with. It is threatening enough. But all these notions of "Britain is fucked" and "Europe is committing suicide" are based on extrapolations from nubmers which are sufficiently unreliable in themselves, and which at any rate never work. Remember the extrapolations from the sixties, which said that the LA area would be uninhabitable, on account of pollution, by 1975?
Paolo,
I think it's a grave mistake to think that only "leaders" and media intelligentsia are afflicted with the PC disease.
The PC disease is DOMINANT. It holds an overwhelming hegemony over all our sociopolitical discourse, rhetoric and public policy.
Our leaders are not swimming against a tide. They are thinking and speaking in PC terms because it is the safest thing to do politically. And why is it the safest? Because it is DOMINANT.
Reset, is so right, and he is dead on.
The fact is the Muslim pigs will and are using western civilization to kill all non muslims, see people where you are born mean's nothing but what culture you are from mean's all.
If europe keeps walking down the path its on, someday the evil muslim with help from other's will kill not 6 million or 12 million in death camps but will kill 500,000,000 million, remember evil is evil and the mad-dogs of the muslim world are coming for you.
how can you stop this new world evil? start with your governments and start to see it for what it is.
its all about death or life, what do you want for your kids?
Metaxy: I would not say that PC is necessarily dominant, at least in the sense that a majority of the public accept all its claims and viewpoints. Certainly, the public in general shares in some of its assumptions to some extent - I would not rule myself out of this kind of thing myself - but I think that it is only a minority that really takes the whole set of assumptions seriously. Look at all recent elections: from the catastrophe of the French Socialists in the last presidential election - when the run-off ended up being between a Gaullist and a Fascist - to the Bush triumph last year, and the Church's stunning victory in the assisted-birth referendum in Italy, to Angela Merkel's coming victory in Germany, it never pays to be PC. Canada seems to be the only country where PC rules. Yes, Tony Blair does win elections with a supposedly left-wing party, but only at the price of taking it so far to the right that Chirac is to the left of him.
More specifically, I feel sure that the area of ingrained suspicion about Islam and its members, in both Europe and America, is vast and growing. Why would the media and politicians sound off in such a shrilly unanimous chor, "Islam is not responsible for this", repeatedly, continuously, monotously, if they thought everyone agreed with them? Would it be the first thing they always say? This is the use of language as advertisement, as incantation: trying to make it sound as though everyone agreed with one point of view, so as to make the holders of the opposite one feel small, isolated and inconsequential. It is still working in Britain so far as I can see, but less so every day; and I think that in Italy, except for the lunatic left, it has failed altogether. I just recently had a peek at the blog of the secularized Arab Magdi Allam, a columnist for the Corriere della Sera (Italy's best-selling and most respected newspaper), and it was simply amazing how unanimous the reaction to the London bombings was: there was not a single posting that did not express the deepest suspicion of Islam, that did not demand not only disassociation from the murderers but prompt and immediate naming names, that could not, in short, have come straight from any thread in JihadWatch.
It's now time to lock in the location of Mecca and Medina,feed them into nuclear missiles and let Muslims know that enough is enough and
if Allah continues to oder Muslims to murder Gods children then they can kiss their ASS and Mecca good-bye.
The home grown suicide bombers prove that the Mosques in London are run by Islamists and the
moderate muslims that screamed "Islamophobia" for the unfair attacks on Islam were out right liars and have been harbouring the terrorists in their Mosques by their silence and lack of effort to stop the spread of the "Toxic" Islam.
I hope people now see why the crusades happened,Islam was spread by the sword and the Christian Middle east was reduced to pockets of Christians that lived under oppressive Islamic leaders like the Saudis. The horror in London was just a modern version of the murderous teachings by Muhammed and the Quran he created to control the ignorant and poor.
It's now time to lock in the location of Mecca and Medina,feed them into nuclear missiles and let Muslims know that enough is enough and
if Allah continues to oder Muslims to murder Gods children then they can kiss their ASS and Mecca good-bye.
The home grown suicide bombers prove that the Mosques in London are run by Islamists and the
moderate muslims that screamed "Islamophobia" for the unfair attacks on Islam were out right liars and have been harbouring the terrorists in their Mosques by their silence and lack of effort to stop the spread of the "Toxic" Islam.
I hope people now see why the crusades happened,Islam was spread by the sword and the Christian Middle east was reduced to pockets of Christians that lived under oppressive Islamic leaders like the Saudis. The horror in London was just a modern version of the murderous teachings by Muhammed and the Quran he created to control the ignorant and poor.
Paolo,
Your degree of optimism may be closer to reality than my dismal pessimism. However, I'd suggest one answer to your question -- "Why would the media and politicians sound off in such a shrilly unanimous chor, "Islam is not responsible for this", repeatedly, continuously, monotously, if they thought everyone agreed with them?" -- stems more from a typical irrational fear that PC Leftists hold that any rational adjustment of civil rights (with pragmatic reference to degrees of crisis & threats) will inexorably plummet us on a Hitlerian trajectory. PC Leftists -- particularly when oppressed victim minorities happen to be guilty of crimes -- constantly worry that redneck lynch mobs will be unleashed followed by the totalitarian dictatorship that all Western whites secretly hunger for and are ever waiting for the right opportunity to implement.
So these warnings by media and politicians may just be the reflexive expression of the constant fear they have that Western Civilization is on a precipice of an evil fascistic abyss (if it is not already in it, according to many Leftists) and must always, anxiously, be kept -- through elaborate PC legislation and education -- from falling in.
This PC Leftist loss of faith in the West is drastic and psychotic, and represents, as I've said before, a sea change in our Zeigeist over the last 50 years (with roots going back further).
I sometimes dispair at the lack of common sense displayed by our politico's in the UK.
A homocide bomber kills civilians on a bus in Israel and we must "understand the context"
he is a "militant"
All the other bull shit excuses.
Bombs go off in the UK and they are "terrorists"
Now the BIG PENNY is dropping.
I think we need political leadership with big hairy gonads and hairy armpits.
If UK moslems are in anyway connected to terrorism they should be stripped of citizenship and deported
all of their property and money are forfeit to the state.
No doubt when the plotters are discovered their families will feign innocence, sue for police protection under that
silly "human rights act" which will mean more expense to the UK tax payer.
I am trying to encourage more Brits of Indian origin onto this site and the reason is because we know who these
wankers are and can name them, I am sure that this site is monitored by some memebers of the police/security forces and hopefully they can pick
up info from here.
There are alot of rich paki moslems in the UK who finance mosques, bookshops and islamic propergation in general.
They are our historical enemies since circa 8-9th century and I see no reason why we cannot help the "Boys in Blue".
Why are the security services not activly recruiting arab christians or Indian translators who speak urdu ?
why even take the risk of employing a moslem ?
apostate_islam speaks sense as usual.
I have just been having a look at the BBC "Have your say" Less relevant for what people are actually saying (I prefer to listen to what I hear around me for that) than that ocassionally public opinion is such that the Bleedin' Biased Corporation can no longer ignore the comments they find non PC and unpalatable. Either that or they have a new comment sifter this week who has not let learned that she is not there to be balanced.
I write regularly, more for the benefit of the staff than with any hope of being published, but they did publish one of my comments yesterday. These are a sample from today.
In my eyes if these are British citizens then they have performed an act of treason against this country and its people and should be dealt with accordingly.
Alec, York, UK
Let's get away from any idea that it's 'our fault' for not treating certain sectors of the population fluffily enough. Lots of people feel they might have been short-changed in life: their response may be to get a bit angry, lobby to get things changed, work to make up for circumstances. They don't go round blowing things up. Instead, the message must be: know which side your bread's buttered. This country gives you a healthcare, education, employment opportunities, free speech. The least you can do is not try to destroy it.
Liz, London, UK
But of course there is the usual claptrap as well, miracles don't happen overnight.
About Brutish Biased Creeperation bias and lies: I am currently watching a "report" on BBC24 about the new, severe Danish immigration and nationalization laws. Made by a clearly Middle Eastern reporter, it is an extended whine on behalf of a Danish citizen who has to commute from Sweden because her husband, an Egyptian, has not been allowed residence in Denmark. No reference to the Muslim disaster area that is Malmoe, where they live; instead, romantic picture of bride and handsome groom walking hand in hand together on the shore, and of a neat, hygienic, very Scandinavian kitchen. Lots of blonde Viking heads delivering bits of uninformed opinion, artfully cut to make them sound stupid and racist. And a general sense that Denmark has suddenly become a Ku Klux Klan member organization. And millions of people are going to take this for journalism.
Very plainly, very simply, Europe is heading for a bloody show-down with these murderers. We will have a cvil war that will make the Wars of Religion back in the 16th century look like a football ruck.
apostate_islam speaks sense as usual.
I have just been having a look at the BBC "Have your say" Less relevant for what people are actually saying (I prefer to listen to what I hear around me for that) than that ocassionally public opinion is such that the Bleedin' Biased Corporation can no longer ignore the comments they find non PC and unpalatable. Either that or they have a new comment sifter this week who has not let learned that she is not there to be balanced.
I write regularly, more for the benefit of the staff than with any hope of being published, but they did publish one of my comments yesterday. These are a sample from today.
In my eyes if these are British citizens then they have performed an act of treason against this country and its people and should be dealt with accordingly.
Alec, York, UK
Let's get away from any idea that it's 'our fault' for not treating certain sectors of the population fluffily enough. Lots of people feel they might have been short-changed in life: their response may be to get a bit angry, lobby to get things changed, work to make up for circumstances. They don't go round blowing things up. Instead, the message must be: know which side your bread's buttered. This country gives you a healthcare, education, employment opportunities, free speech. The least you can do is not try to destroy it.
Liz, London, UK
But of course there is the usual claptrap as well, miracles don't happen overnight.
I would like to echo (much of) what Paolo said re the poster who described the English as 'totally fucked'.
With regard to indigenous Muslims, I think it is important to differentiate between the UK, on the one hand, and continental European countries like France, the Netherlands and Sweden, on the other. My impression (and limited knowledge) of the latter is that there is a genuine feeling of intimidation on the part of the 'native' population. The youth in those countries is predominantly well-educated and relatively disinclined towards criminal activity. This contrasts sharply with huge swathes of the (largely Maghrebian) Muslim youth population, which, as JW readers will know, has rendered many urban districts effectively 'no-go' areas for police and non-locals alike.
In Britain, no such state of affairs exists. Here there is a long-standing tradition of youth culture, binge-drinking, football hooliganism, hedonistic holidays and a teenage pregnancy rate unmatched anywhere else in Europe. Currently, anti-social behaviour orders (Asbos) are being thrown around like confetti. The youth - both in the countryside and cities - is regularly described as 'feral'. In London, particularly, there is a large African and West Indian presence.
All of which means that there is no sense of being cowed or intimidated by the Muslim population. Quite the opposite, in fact.
Finally - at the risk of stating the obvious - there is more news and focus on events in the UK than on other European countries because JW readers are mainly English speakers, reading English language articles sourced from the Internet's Anglosphere.
Oh, yes, the Brutish Biased Creeperation. I just watched a "report" on the Danish immigration laws on BBC24. Hosted by a reporter of Middle Eastern appearance, whose face is new to me and whose name I did not catch, it started with an extended whine on behalf of a Danish woman who has to commute from Sweden because her Egytpian husband is not allowed to live in Denmark. No notion that Malmoe, where they live, is a city wrecked by Muslim immigration and violence; instead, romantic pictures of bride and handsome groom walking hand in hand on the beach, and comforting domestic images of a neat, highly hygienic, very Scandinavian kitchen. Come back in five years, when the groom has made a dash for Egypt with the kids and the bride cannot even enter the country for fear of a beating or worse. The whole story is engineered to make it seem that opposition to excessive (and especially Muslim) immigration is a direct inspiration of the Devil and that Denmark has suddenly been seized by collective insanity. And millions of people are going to take this sort of thing for journalism.
Whooops... I thought the first post had not gone through, so I rewrote it... sorreeee!
My dial-up computor is so slow I copy every post in case it disconnects half way. Which is what it did this time. Just after, not just before hte first post. At least Paolo developed his point in the second post. I just sent the original typos.
reset,
You asked if the UK government will call for a halt to Muslim immigration.
In the leaked correspondence between the Cabinet Office and the Home Office in May-June 2004, Sir Andrew Turnbull put the rise of potential terrorism down to two things, disaffection and alientation in the Islamic community.
He asked about the possible responses that the government should take and wondered what different migration controls might make.
It seems that they concluded that clamping down on Muslim migration might make the Muslim community more alientated and disaffected in their view but at the same time felt that the rest of the public would be annoyed if nothing was done in this field.
It appears that Blair's government which is obsessed with opinion polls and not offending people rather than leading the country decided to solve this dilemma by washing their hands of it and delegating the responsibility to Brussels.
That is why in the autumn of last year Blunkett signed away our rights to set our own asylum and immigration figures.
Hooligans should to be busy going forward, perhaps God will not have to save the Queen.
I wonder how long it will take the authorities to realise that the source of all these terrorist atrocities is the ideology - Islam.
It's the programming.
Humans beings are general-purpose computers.If you stick an accounting program into a computer it will do accounting, stick a malicious virus program into it, and the same computer will murder your harddisk.
In humans the same thing happens as well: put accounting programming into a human and you get an accountant, medical programming you get a doctor, terrorist programming and you get someone who blows civilians in our cities into "thousands of body parts".
Every muslim terrorist tells us that they did what they did because of their programming - the ideology, Islam. The last case was Bouyeri, Theo Van Gogh's personal terrorist, he said, “I did what I did purely out of my beliefs.”
The moderates may claim they are different, but they are all running off the same program - one program, not several. One set of instructions, called Islam - it is contained in their 'holy' books: the Qur'an, the Hadiths, and the Suras. This is the source code. You may read it yourself and find the terrorist programming by book and verse.
Bouyeri said and showed that the programming is there, and it works, it made him a terrorist, him and hundreds of others blowing people up left and right all over the planet now. The moderates may not have acted on the terrorist parts, but the instructions are there, the program is already resident in the hosts. Notice how the terrorists' neighbours always say they are such nice people, including the neighbours of the London terrorists. Nice people carrying a programming that has terrorist instructions that, in the case of the terrorists, were acted upon.
Our horde of politicians, media, and academics have created a blizzard of words on why this is happening "anger with Iraq... we must have done something to provoke... gitmo... foreign policy, poverty... give $9 billion to the Palestinians... the moderates, the islamists, the jihadis... Islam is a religion of peace... "
Within the blizzard there is only one substance - a terrorist is made by the programming running inside him. It's the programming. The root cause for Islamic Terrorism is the ideology of Islam itself. Simple as that.
All the rest is obfuscation.
Until we realise that, our war on terrorism would be like trying to cure cancer by popping aspirins.
I never thought that drunken football holigans would save us from Islam, but maybe they will.
Apostate Islam, you've really hit the nail on the head. What happened in London, happens in Israel all the time, and yet the Palestinian bombers are always "understood", not least by Cherie Blair.
In another life, I too used to by sympathetic to Palestinian bombers until one Palestinian killed a little girl who was hiding under her bed. That sickened even me, and was my own personal road to Damascus.
I hope that the world will start to become more aware of what Israeli's go through every day from now on.
"if a muslim kills someone it would be as though he;d killed all of mankind"
A "someone" is a person. For the purposes of this quote, muslims get to decide who, and what, a person is...For a muslim, I would suspect, that a "person", in their view is another muslim. Infidels, non-believers ect, are not persons, but enemies of Allah. Apes, pigs, idolitors, pagans, polytheists, Christians, Hindu's, Jews (especially Jews), ect are not entitled to personhood. What we are entitled to is convert, pay that everlovin tax, or become a dhimmi, and pay that everlovin tax, or die.
Those were the three choices given by the prophet and are in force today.
Mankind:Mankind is made up of "persons". Only muslims are persons.
Good point, duh_swami. From what I've learned about Islam, we are not anybody to them. We are not people, we are not someone or somebody. We are the same as excrement, urine, sweat, pigs, etc. They've categorised us as filthy, dehumanised us. Hence, we are so easy to slaughter.
Even being born in our countries, living amongst us, seeing us, talking to us, working with us, interacting us, it doesn't sway their programming. This is proof positive that Islam will never, ever, ever, assimilate or get along. It will never 'live and let live'. They loathe us and have no qualms about murdering us. Islam is a cancer on our world.
duh_swami, feralee, that's right.
I've always thought when they said, "Islam teaches that to kill an innocent person is like killing all of mankind", they were quoting an abrogated verse, superceded by a later "smite the infidel on the neck" verse.
Now I understand it better. The 'innocent person' refers to their own muslim. And they don't regard a non-muslim as innocent, since we are infidels.
And the muslim quoting this with a straight face must be doing taqiyya, deceiving us to our faces.
Skidd,
Yes, you are right that the innocent person referred to is not an infidel.
'That is why we laid it down for the Israelites that whoever killed a human being except as punishment for murder or other villainy in the land shall be regarded as having killed all mankind and whoever saved a human life, shall be regarded as having saved all mankind' (5:32)
Christians and Jews who say that God has a son, whether he has come or not are viewed as villainous because claiming God has a son is regarded as a montrous falsehood and that there is nothing more villainous as spreading falsehoods about God, according to Islam.
The next but one verse in this 5th surah says 'Those that make war on Allah and His apostle (Mohammed) and spread disorder in the land shall be slain or crucified or have their hands and feet cut off on alternate sides, or be banished from the land'.
Skidd, as you say the later surahs abrogate the earlier ones reflecting the growing might of Mohammeds followers who no longer needed to be nice to non-Muslims. The fifth surah is one of the last to be supposedly revealed.
I think 99% of them are born with an incurable psychosis which appears to be hereditary.
Inbreeding will do that you know.
skidd
I've always thought when they said, "Islam teaches that to kill an innocent person is like killing all of mankind", they were quoting an abrogated verse, superceded by a later "smite the infidel on the neck" verse.
That Koranic verse is stolen from Hebrew scripture:
"Whoever saves one life, it is as if he has saved an entire world." (Talmud -
Sanhedrin 37a).
And in relation to a third man property in his name was found at the scene of both the Aldgate and the Edgware Road bombs.
Robert July 12 7.31 pm
How did the third person happen to be in two places? This is clear proof that the so called evidences are fabricated and planted. There is a witch hunt. Find out dead Muslims and blame them!
Blair has declared it in what he thinks are ringing tones (il fait son petit Churchill, but really, by inviting the comparison, he suffers from it): it is an "ideology of hate," an "extremist and perverted" ideology that has "nothing to do" with the real ZIslam. This word "Ideology" just two weeks ago started to be used, notably, by George Bush (or did it start at the G-8 meeting? Anyway, its sudden appearance was noticeable), as Americans try to think up some word that will not be "religion" and not be "Islam" but will somehow hint at the problem -- the word "ideology" simply will not do; "Jihad" will, for the moment, but they so far refuse, quite incorrectly, to take their marching orders on matters of language from Jihad Watch) will be the flavor-of-the-month but "extremist" Islam, or a "perversion of Islam" will take its place --and who knows when "Islam" tout court will finally be used.
If this "ideology" is a "perverted" version of Islam, could Blair, could Bush, could others who suggest this tell us exactly what are the passages in Qur'an, stories in Hadith, details of Muhammad's life in the Sira, are being "perverted" and so grossly misunderstood?
Because, you see, we Infidels can now read those texts. We'd rather not; we'd rather read Shakespeare, or the TLS, or perhaps eventhe Gazzetta dello Sport, or something starring Huey, Dewey, and Louie, but if we must read this horrible stuff, to find out what it is in it, we will. And if, Bush and Blair and Company, you keep lying to us about what has become the most important, life-threatening, civilization-threatning menace in our little lives, it will go hard with you. And all who support you, all who parrot falsehoods and nonsense.
Read the goddam Qur'an, Hadith, and Sira. Go ahead. Read and re-read them. Get instruction, take tuition, hire a "scholemaster" -- that is why, in the old days, from Ascham on, there was such interest in the right education of princes. Well, our princes are not educated. And after the long un-fairy-tale-like sleep of reason that the Western world has been in for so many decades, a sleep of reason where words like "everyone wants the same thing" and "all cultures are equal" and "the white Western world is the baddest thing that ever came along" and "colonialism is the worstest thing ever ever ever" -- well, we are waking up from that sleep of reason, retrieving and reason, looking over next to us, and disvoring that our ruling "princes" turn out to be croaking frogs, after all.
The bad thing is that terrorism works. The UK
will learn nothing about this. The obvious fact
is now that islam has its foot at the british
throat it will soon in a decade or two with
home grown islamists destroy this once proud nation
Blair will give islamists even more protection
and contimue to spread the lie that islam is a
religion of peace. These fine young educated boys
were only following the commands of Islam. Which
has a goal to enslave the rest of mankind. Blair
is to stupid and greedy to see or understand that.
dennisw,
That's right, it was stolen from the story of the raven scratching at the ground when Cain killed Abel.
In fact Mohammed paid the Jews in Yahtrib (Medina) to sell him stories from the Talmud and the Bible because he wanted to make Islam seem more authentic. When he got them all jumbled up, the Jews laughed at him, so he got angry and eventually slaughtered them.
Mohideen,
Why isn't it possible for two different possessions of someone to be in two different places at once?
One thing to ask Muslims to see what they really think of all this is this:
Do you think that the people who did this are in heaven or hell?
Paolo, like your posts and also I think that the point about British yobs is an interesting one, our youth is pretty mean and won't take crap, they dish it out.
Also the BBC is bending over backwards to be PC correct with its articles, I saw one that stated that Islam does not allow suicide bombings, gotta be kidding. 10 minutes later that stupid paragraph had been removed. Maybe they assumed that people will soon stop listening to them if they keep lying.
I am about to stop using the BBC completely soon, tough, but I have had it with them.
I am amazed that those two points of view put foward by GW were posted, but rest assured that the BBC will make sure the balance is 80% supportive of our Muslims protectors and 20% against the Muslim terrorists and I bet that the real split was 20/80. I gave up posting to the BBC a long time ago.
Do you think that the people who did this are in heaven or hell?
Heaven? Hell? Or have they have simply cast themselves into "the outer darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth." and doomed themselves to be "wandering stars, for whom the gloom of eternal darkness has been reserved forever." Thereby effectively "cut[ting themselves] off from the earth" if they have not already procreated.
They have simply chosen to no longer exist. The people London still do. Long live the people of London!
Killing oneself in the name of a god or ideology is extremely stupid and indicates a lack of intelligence due to natural causes or clinical stupidity induced by brainwashing. Normal healthy people don’t feel compelled to end their life. This is criminally insane behavior introduced by the morally bankrupt ideology that can be found in the Koran and which is promoted today in Mosques around the world.
The debate over whose side God is on is utterly pointless. It doesn’t matter one iota. People are dieing because of this nonsense. It has to be brought under control and the first step is for world governments to acknowledge the true source of the problem (the ideology of Islam) without entering into the “whose side is God on” debate.
The bastards “other worldly” destinations are of little concern to me, I live in this one.
f.g.
Speaking as a Catholic, I cannot imagine a more certain way to sink straight to the bottom of the Pit. These men - these creatures that once were men - went to their deaths in an orgy of destructive hatred, committing at once the sins of suicide and of murder, showing in one action that they did indeed love their neighbours as themselves - that is, not at all. If God is love, if God is purity, if God is author of existence and the opposite of death and destruction, can anyone imagine a deed that would remove a soul further away from him? We are taught in Catholic schools that it is bad theology to say that anyone is in Hell, since the mercy of God is infinite, but really, it seems difficult to know how even God could reach out to men who have placed themselves so far from Him. God can do the miraculous, but not the absurd. And as C.S.Lewis once said, there are, in the end, only two kinds of human beings - those who say to God, Thy will be done, and those to whom God says, Thy will be done.
Think about this, Mohideen, while you try to get through what you have of brains the idea that the property of one man may have been in the pockets of another (especially if it was not very important for them to look after every little bit and bob, since they knew they were going to die); and that you should not think that our cops are so stupid as to make mistakes in planted evidence that the likes of you could detect. There are such things as murderous Muslims. It is a fact. Get over it.
Daffersd, you are quite right, every single comment (15, I counted. I do have a life but sometimes the little details are worth it) published since my first post has been on the lines of "cannot call themselves 'Muslims' as Islam is a religion of peace"
Plus the BBC is focusing on the pain of the uncle of one of the murders, who says his nephew must have been lead astray. Although it is better at the moment that they leave the families of the innocent victims to mourn in peace. Not every body is recovered, only a few are named, none are buried yet.
Meanwhile in Iraq another mighty warrior of the Religion of Deceit has killed over 20 children who were collecting sweets.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/4678207.stm
Delenda est islamia.
think 99% of them are born with an incurable psychosis which appears to be hereditary.
Inbreeding will do that you know.
Posted by: f.g. at July 13, 2005 09:10 AM
ROTFL!!!
Gold Star for you today!!!!
http://www.beecy.net/frank/
Part of the American Tribe
Squirrel Hunter
Spider Killer
GOD BLESS THE USA AND HER FIGHTING FORCES AND ALL WHO FIGHT WITH HER GIVE THEM STRENGTH, WISDOM, SIGHT, AND COURAGE TO STAY THE COURSE TO DESTROY ALL ISLAMIC TERRORIST AND ALL WHO SUPPORT THEM OPEN THE WORLDS EYES TO THEIR THREAT LET NOT THE WORLD BE DECEVEIVED BY THEM AMEN
Mohideen is drowning in denile...dats a river in Egypt...
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/latest/tm_objectid=15732618%26method=full%26siteid=94762%26headline=eu%2dtakes%2dup%2dclarke%2ds%2dchallenge%2don%2danti%2dterror%2dmoves-name_page.html
Sarkozy called for member states to exchange intelligence on "radical Muslim preachers and imams whose actions disrupt public order by their support for violence, hatred and discrimination", according to his speaking notes.
He also called for intelligence cooperation on young European Muslims who have joined Iraqi insurgents to fight U.S.-led troops, and better surveillance of places of worship, prisons, charities and associations, including sports clubs, that were fronts for radical or terrorist ideologies.
EU Justice and Security Commissioner Franco Frattini said the time had come to "blame and shame" member states that were not implementing anti-terrorism measures agreed after the September 11, 2001 attacks on the United States and the March 2004 Madrid train bombings
WELL GOOD ON HIM!!!
READ THE WHOLE THING AND PEOPLE OF BRITIA BETTER GET READY FOR A FIGHT WITH THE APPESSERS IN YOUR OWN COUNTRY!!!!
BLAME AND SHAME!!!!!
http://www.beecy.net/frank/
Part of the American Tribe
Squirrel Hunter
Spider Killer
GOD BLESS THE USA AND HER FIGHTING FORCES AND ALL WHO FIGHT WITH HER GIVE THEM STRENGTH, WISDOM, SIGHT, AND COURAGE TO STAY THE COURSE TO DESTROY ALL ISLAMIC TERRORIST AND ALL WHO SUPPORT THEM AMEN
PS
Seams that the packi mulsums have attacked the Indian side of Kashmer??
WOW?? not a suprize part of the partten N. Korea, Iran, Pakistan?? Around and Around we Go?????
Cry me a river. Islam has been making holy war on the world for centuries. So, now that the West and the Rest are waking up, there are sure to be plenty of Muslims crying and whining that they actually got our attention enough that we are firing bullets at THEM for a change.
Seriously. Islam needs to grow up in so many ways. I'm sick of the infantile nature of it all, the bloody, vicious bully mentality of their leadership and their terrorist arms. The cowardly way they wage war without a face, hoping to slink in the shadow and murder innocents with bombs because they can't take the field of battle and hope to win against their military betters.
Now Muslims are starting to realize that when the Rest are fully awake, Allah will not save them. He is, afterall, a phigment of some madman's imagination.
Become Apostates or reap your reward for your Theocratic, anti-Modernist, Fascist cult's adherance to ignorance and death-worship.
No more patty-cake from me. I want Islam destroyed.
Granny Weatherwax- I've also been monitoring the BBC boards since this started and have been positively appalled at some of the posts. A few of the more stellar examples:
"Let's pray for the Muslim victims of this tragedy" (of course omitting to mention the fact that Muslims are forbidden to pray for non-Muslims)
and
"This is another set-up just like 9/11, probably done by the Mossad. No muslim would do such a thing!"
and
"How are you all holding up over there?" (This was from a Muslim in Dubai, who was expressing concern over reports of anti-Islamic backlash. No mention of sympathy whatsoever for the victims. Thank goodness another, non-Muslim poster, expressed disgust at this show of sympathy.
fg,
I'm not saying that otherworldly definitions should be of interested to you or others, but what I was saying was that if Muslims are condemning these acts and they hold that Islam is a peaceful religion it would be worth putting to them the question: Do you think that the four men who blew themselves up killing lots of innocent people will be with Allah in paradise or in the other place?
Kafira
It's all me, me, me with Muslims unfortunatly.
All the interviews with the neighbours are
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/west_yorkshire/4679483.stm "We're scared the finger of blame will be pointed at all of us," said 24-year-old Nusrat Hussain.
"We have to live here, we are going to suffer."
I'm scared to walk out on the street now. We're all worried, you just ask anyone and they'll tell you they're worried."
No sorrow for 70 families, none of whom have yet had their loved one's body released so that they can have a funeral. No hopes for the swift recovery of 700 injured people many of whom lost limbs or were blinded.
They are frightened to walk the streets in case someone points at them. I and 8 million other Londoners have to go to work knowing that there are still Muslims plotting to murder more of us.
Granny Weatherwax, it's the PC mindset, care more for the perpetrators than the victims.
Londoners need to flush PC down the tube.
And say "Enough!".
Just on ITV news. Videos praising the murders and glorifying the carnage have apparently been posted on line.
And one of the Islamic murderers was a primary school teacher, another a care worker who boasted to his friends of his al-quaida training.
It's becoming obvious from what I heard today that the media is brodacasting denial.
A pastor spoke of the situation and the fact that Islam and these bombers are working in unison, and he was ridiculed by the talk show host, who said "You speak of the Koran but what about the Bible, how about the extremism in that" the pastor replied "I beg your pardon we are talking of the brutal murder of 50 odd innocent people, where do you draw a distinction like that in the Bible" The host said " Yes but there are passages inthe Bible which can also be taken out of context" "name one" replied the pastor, the host replied "Women in there menstrual period mustn't be seen in public" "WHAT'S THAT TO DO WITH THE MURDER OF 52 PEOPLE" replied the pastor.
Then he launched into the radio station for being apologists for Islam, he was shouted down by the Host yet he did speak sensibly, he also stated the he has Muslims who have left Islam in his congregation, who told the pastor their lives were on the line shouls other Muslims find out that they are apostates , this Radio host ridiculed that as well.
It's all very well having freedom of speech it's the dopes you have to convince that makes it so difficult, obviously this is the line the government want the stations to follow
breadwinner, Thanks for sharing that.
Looks like there is a positive glimmer in this: people, like the pastor here, are waking up to what Islam is, and speaking up. I am so glad he held his ground, kept his focus, and spoke the truth. No BS can stand up to that.
I think this will spread. When people see others are not afraid to stand up to the PC obfuscators they will speak up as well. Ours may be the generation that drives Islam back to the deserts.
metaxy,
I agree. I didn't mean to imply that all bombers are dupes as to their missions. It's just that some of them have been, and it's a possibility that should be considered from time to time, such as here. I still haven't heard about any notes, wills, or video tapes describing the bombers' forthcoming suicide missions.
On the other hand, it really amazes me how many suicide bombers have been recruited, in Palestine, Iraq, Russia, etc. Like you said, there are many more dedicated fanatics than the Japanese ever produced. Their brainwashing is really thorough and complete. It's astonishing.
I want to pick up on something Paolo said. He drew a distinction between the PC mindset of the politicians, and the practical understanding of the police. I had the opportunity to serve three terms as a councilman in a small suburban city in Texas, and near the end of my third term the mayor appointed me as police commissoner to investigate some allegations against the chief of police. I was the swing vote on a three man commission. I hired a lawyer and conducted investigatory meetings and hearings. In my spare time (ha ha), I rode with some of the officers. I particularly liked riding shotgun on Saturday nights. I developed a kinship with the officers, and on occassion was given a weapon during a tight situation so I could act as back-up. The guys on the street develop an attitude. Everything and everyone damn well better look and act exactly as expected or it or they are immediately suspect. Policemen eventually acquire a sixth sense, and they use it. They have to make judgments quickly and correctly all the time. They are driven by the life and death necessity of understanding reality RIGHT NOW, and cannot be distracted by theoretical bullshit, political correctness (although they are aware of it and keep quiet), or whether someone not at the scene will be offended. A police department is a paramilitary organization. The personnel give their loyalty up the chain of command and expect loyalty down the chain of command. They will drop everything to come to the aid of a fellow officer, and don't stand in their way. The detectives LOVE to solve problems and catch crooks. That is what they live for. They want to stay alive, make some money, and retire to fish, hunt, go boating (not sailing), raise cattle or dogs or goats. They understand that politicians run the city, but dammit, they run the department because nobody else knows how. They appreciate and admire courage, especially (as I saw at the time) political courage, probably because they see it so infrequently. They trust each other, and their equipment, but not much else. The man I rode with most often carried three guns and two knives. Only his main sidearm was ever visible.
texan, great post! Thanks.
From http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,1280,-5130462,00.html we find:
===
Transit officials originally said Thursday's blasts occurred over a 26-minute span, but computer software that tracked train locations and electric circuits subsequently determined the first blast shattered the rush-hour commute at 8:50 a.m in Aldgate station, east London, with the next two erupting within 50 seconds.
===
How come? Transit officials would have used their watches to decide the time of the explosions, and the individual uncorrelated reports had put the three explosions spread over 26 minutes. It is possible that this spread of 26 minutes does not support the conspiracy theory that “four dead Muslims carried out the attacks.”
Computer experts know that any data stored in rewritable media could be altered. Banks alone might have Write-once Read-many times memory. Obviously, we do not expect the underground train control system to have such memory banks. Thus, it is not beyond comprehension that the computer data was manipulated by the authorities to fit the latest theory to blame it on the dead Muslims. How convenient! The dead do not protest.
In the same news report, we also find:
===
Mustafa Setmarian Nasar, the alleged mastermind of last year's Madrid railway bombings, who also goes by the name Abu Musab al-Suri, has emerged as a suspect in the London attacks, according to unidentified investigators cited in The Sunday Times, The Sunday Telegraph and the Mail on Sunday.
Nasar, a Syrian fugitive, allegedly played a key role in setting up an al-Qaida structure in Spain and was indicted there in connection with the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks in the United States. Last year, the U.S. offered $5 million for information leading to his arrest.
===
The first patsy was Osama bin Laden. The Afghan war was launched exploiting the patsy Osama. The next patsy was Zarqawi, who was used to destroy the Iraqi cities and kill civilians inside Iraq wholesale. May be he is also useless now. So, the corporate media is suggesting the next patsy, Nasar. Why? Are the war mongers planning to use him to launch the next war on Syria or Iran?
The troops fighting the war on Iraq do not support the war.
From http://www.workers.org/2005/world/iraq-0721/ we find:
===
On July 7, as "a small group of peace activists conducted a candlelit vigil at the main gates of the naval base through which all service personnel coming or going passed and in full view of the bridge of the Kitty Hawk, we laid out candles in the shape of the peace symbol," writes James Courtney of Greenpeace in Australia.
"The response was moving and inspiring. We had naval personnel helping to light candles and taking photos. Many words of thanks from ships crew, some with tears welling in their eyes. We had nothing but positive feelings from the ships crew that spoke with us. We managed to hand out around 200 copies of Traveling Soldier," a U.S.-based anti-war GI newspaper.
===
Let all peace lovers unite in stopping the war mongers. Then, Islam would not be maligned.
Mohideen, you are a troll, a self-deceived patsy, a brainless lunatic with the logic and sense of a pinball, and a fucking waste of time and space. I answered you once as if you were worth answering; never again. As far as this site is concerned, your only value is documentary - to see what Islam does to the mind of a human being.
Texan, about the police - I think there are a few differences. First, the current head of the Metropolitan Police, Sir Ian Blair, is the biggest PC stooge in decades. His predecessor Lord Stevens was a copper's copper, come up through the ranks, credited with restoring morale to the Force and - in collaboration with Ken Livingstone - increasing its numbers; Sir Ian seems more concerned with getting nice headlines in the Press than being loyal to his men (who, as you say, expect loyalty from up the chain of command). He also seems to make differences between officers: he has hung out threee ordinary beat cops to dry for some supposed insults against a Muslim colleague, but he has supported to the hilt members of the elite armed service (our version of SWAT) guilty of killing a wholly innocent citizen.
The atmosphere is apt to be perhaps a bit less tense in Britain. Most cops, like most Britons, do not carry weapon, and many of them go through their whole careers without being shot at once. Knives are apt to be a more immediate danger: the British police are pretty uptight about knives, and regularly institute drives to turn them in. All the same, I suspect that most of what you say could be replicated this side of the Pond, or indeed in Italy (one of my cousins is about to join the Carabinieri, like several members of his family). Cops have their fault, but we need them as they are, not as propagandists for some utopia.
Get instruction, take tuition, hire a "scholemaster" -- that is why, in the old days, from Ascham on, there was such interest in the right education of princes. Well, our princes are not educated.
Hugh
Hugh thanks for the above gem of a statement. Under the system of “Royalty” the princes were hereditary. Under the “Democratic System” any adult citizen could be a Prince / Princess. So, it simply boils down to every child getting the right education. I support you whole heartedly.
Paolo
Your post to Mohideen was as succinct a truth ever spoken. I enjoyed it immensely. Unfortunately, Mohideen will only have a vague notion that he has been insulted. He won't actually understand how. No matter, he is beyond help.
Paolo, we're not as far apart as you might imagine. The chief's position is usually a political one. If it doesn't start that way, it often becomes that way. I mentioned that I was appointed to investigate the chief. He had done so many favors over the years (Oh, your boy got caught vandalizing/drinking/smoking marijuana. I'll just give him a lecture and maybe we can avoid booking him, and you can take him home) that he could call in lots of favors in return. He also favored some officers over others, and he wasn't loyal to a few who followed his orders and then got into trouble as a result. He made some really bad management decisions, in an effort to gain favors or otherwise. When he started calling in his favors, I began getting the threats. I started carrying a 45 automatic and varying my routes to work (I worked in the private sector). I was afraid I would be stopped by his police friends in another jurisdiction, and have contraband tossed in my car. I changed cars. I had to have a bodyguard at the last public hearing. When I suspended him, I hired a locksmith to break into his office, and sent in a photographer to take pictures of every square inch, including the contents of drawers. I mindlessly picked up a paper sack that looked out of place on a bookshelf. I opened it up and found about 18 or 19 injectible ampules of morphine. There were 25 or 30 tabs of what one detective said were LSD. The top drawer of the desk had a telephone wire-tap device. The weapons locker was not secure. etc. etc. This was a very popular man. Except with the officers.
The City of Houston had a chief that I have described as a turtle. If you see a turtle on top of a fence-post you know he didn't get there by himself. Several civilians were shot and killed by police and off-duty police while he was "in charge" but he was rescued by an appointment in (I think) New York. He then served as "Drug Czar" under Bill Clinton. Totally incompetent, but (I'll risk saying it) he was the right color for the guys that own the fence-posts. He went back to Houston after being groomed, and successfully ran for Mayor. Still incompetent, and his chief was just as bad. He pretty much screwed up the fire department, too, as I understand. He arranged to sell the city's only downtown fire station to a restaurant kingpin who put in a restaurant and small theme-park.
So, yeah, I agree with you about the politics. As one of my fellow councilmen said: When a fish starts to go bad, it's the head that smells.
Paolo, when I was in London in 1987, I stayed around the Aldwych and sometimes talked to the police that guarded Bush House, home of the BBC, I believe. We talked guns. Most of the officers, like you said, were not armed, but this one was. He had a small pistol in his pants pocket. He showed me its outline one night. He was with Special Branch, I think.
I remember a news broadcast while I was there, because it was so bizarre. Someone tried to assassinate a London policeman with a crossbow. The bolt hit his radio microphone on his shoulder, which prevented a really serious injury. I don't know if they ever arrested the archer.
That's interesting about the knives. Are there any particular groups that favor knives? Or is that simply a response to the gun laws?
I always felt the London police were so much more reserved than our own, as if they had some secret knowledge or ability that set them apart. I really don't know what that is all about.
Unfortunately, Mohideen will only have a vague notion that he has been insulted.
pismopal
This site is trying to do a very important social service. Let us not misuse this site by personal insults and the like.
The London attacks are a repeat of 9/11; a coordinated inside job meant to shore up the support for the unjust Iraq war by blaming innocent Muslims.
Ladies and gentlemen...I rest my case.