From AFP, with thanks to J.K.
LONDON - The British government is planning to set up special intelligence units to monitor Muslims nationwide to better detect extremists and thwart eventual attacks, a newspaper reported.The Muslim Contact Units, staffed by London's Metropolitan Police Special Branch officers, will be established in areas including Yorkshire, northwest England and parts of the Midlands, the Guardian reported.
"Deep knowledge of Muslim communities is rare in the service," a senior police officer with knowledge of the scheme told the Guardian.
"If you are going to understand who is extreme and who is dangerous, which are different (ideas), you have to understand the community," the officer was quoted as saying
"Unless you know the subject well and what they are saying, often in Arabic or Urdu, and what the context is, you are not going to get a feel for it," the source said.
He stressed that the squads would be open about their work. "It is not about spying."
The police and Home Office said a Muslim Contact Unit operating in London has already helped thwart extremist attempts to recruit young British Muslims to violent jihad, by working with Islamic communities, the Guardian said...
I didn't have to go 'inside' to figure it all out, why can't they figure out Islam without going 'inside.'
Reset
Unless you know the subject well and what they are saying, often in Arabic or Urdu, and what the context is, you are not going to get a feel for it,"
Which takes us back to the often discussed problem of getting people on board who know the languages but are also trustworthy (ie not Muslim).
How long must we maintain this farce? Who did it? Duh, MUSLIMS! They always commit acts of terror, murder, rape, etc. The “good” Muslims never turn in the “bad” Muslims. The “good” Muslims never confront the “bad” Muslims in the mosques. Why is this? Because the “good” ones believe the “bad” ones are actually carrying out Allah’s will. At the end of the day, there is no such thing as a “good” Muslim. All Muslims are complicit. They no longer merit the benefit of the doubt; they are all guilty until the Islamic reformation takes place and the core beliefs of Islam are dramatically altered or extinguished. DETAIN, DEPORT & DESTROY
Is Britain’s islamophobia ever going to stop? This profiling of muslims is barbaric. How can you hold your heads up high and show the world how tolerant and multicultural you are if you have to resort to such extreme measures. I’m ashamed for Britain to have stooped so low as to risk being perceived by the rest of the world as bigots and racists. Surely Livingstone and Galloway see the injustice of it all.
What is needed now is to show the Islamic world how really tolerant you are and increase immigration and give more money to them. Also, increase the aid to Palestine to 50 billion to match what the US will give to Africa. Can’t let them say you think that they aren’t as important as Africa. Stop being so stingy and selfish and help them more. You don’t want to be terrorized anymore do you? England should pull out of Iraq now and attack Israel. Come on Blair show your muslim masters what a good boy you are. Be the first Western country to go 100% sharia. Either do this or finally get ****ing serious and crack down on this ****!
It's pretty pathetic isn't it, that the British government has to monitor the entire muslim community just so that they can be prevented from killing more people.
Next time that some-one tells you about all the wonderful contributions that muslims have made, just remind them about all the huge expense, as well as police man hours, and inconvenience that they have caused to our society.
If a cost benefit analysis was done, then I'm sure that it could be shown that muslims have cost us a huge amount of money, just monitoring them.
There you all go again...you sound like a bunch of racist bigots. It seems everyone is so quick to blame a Muslim...maybe you all need to look in the mirror...you are the terrorists!!
When A Muslim country screws up they are the first to admit they are wrong...we never blame anyone else...you Americans and British always blame Islam.
Islam is the key to peace and a united world.
When are people going to wake up to the problem of importing large numbers of Muslims into Western countries? No one has to monitor Buddists, Christians or Sikhs. Even Satanists are less trouble.How long do you think it will take for Britian and other countries to see it's a lot less costly if you have fewer Muslims around?
A cost-benefit analysis of Islam—God that is hilarious. The costs are infinite. The benefits are nonexistent. There has to be PhD dissertation is this concept somewhere. Seriously, what would the world miss if Islam were no more? What if we took out every contribution ever made from Muslim civilizations? How far back would humanity regress? What does Islam and Muslim societies contribute to man? I think we all know the answer—NOTHING!
"The police and Home Office said a Muslim Contact Unit operating in London has already helped thwart extremist attempts to recruit young British Muslims to violent jihad, by working with Islamic communities, the Guardian said..."
What’s wrong with that, I am sure that the overwhelming majority of Muslims in the UK would support these operations.
"Which takes us back to the often discussed problem of getting people on board who know the languages but are also trustworthy (ie not Muslim)."
Do you honestly believe that all Muslims support terrorist attacks???
Not all muslims but about 80 to 90 percent!
No, not all Muslims support terrorist attacks. My Buddy Jabir is Muslim and he doesnt, but he has yet to prove the terrorists wrong in their interpritation of the Koran.
He excuse is that they are more knowledgable....well doesnt that show you something....
It seems being a knowledable Muslim means being a more dangerous one. You cant say you are Muslim and not expect suspicion from the world...you have earned it. When you can defend your own religion against "hijackers" then you can whine about it. Back up all of your arguments with texts and the world will start to believe you. By doing that you would definetly injure the Jihad movement, but not until then will we stop being suspicious.
"Do you honestly believe that all Muslims support terrorist attacks???"
"Not all muslims but about 80 to 90 percent!"
_________________________________________________
I knew it, I knew it.
Ha ha ha ha
Voltaire posted: If a cost benefit analysis was done, then I'm sure that it could be shown that muslims have cost us a huge amount of money, just monitoring them.
There is the cost of benefits. In wont surprise me if the bombers and their families were on benefit.
Then there is damage to the economy. The cost of 9/11 to the economy of the world, was in the trillions. Muslim nations OTH produce nothing, so that they were unaffected in that sense. The Saudis though are making a killing as oil prices rocket. The Palis and the rest of the Arabs have also enacted huge anmounts of Jizya. This is getting so expensive -I'm not sure we can afford it. A bunch of young muslim men, are causing huge damnage to the economy, security and well being of the nation. This has to be made to stop or we will be destroyed by our own profligacy in this war.
Posted by: ThirdWorldHeaven at July 21, 2005 04:37 PM
THATS WHAT ubl[yellow coward who runs away] SAID IN 1996??
GO AHAED AND READ THE WHOLE THING WILL REALLY PISS YOU OFF!!!!
http://www.islamistwatch.org/main.html
Declaration of War on America
August 23, 1996 Hindukush Mountains, Khurasan, Afghanistan
By Usama Bin Laden
That is the killing of the pharaoh of this Ummah Aba Jahl, the leader of the unbelievers (Mushrikeen) at the battle of Badr. The role of Abdul Rahman Ibn Awf, may Allah be pleased with him, was to direct the two youths toward AbaJahl. That was the perseverance and the enthusiasm of the youths of that time and that was the perseverance and the enthusiasm of their fathers. It is this role that is now required from the people who have the expertise and knowledge in fighting the enemy. They should guide their brothers and sons in this matter; once that has been done, then our youths will repeat what their forefathers had said before: "I swear by Allah if I see him I'll not let my shadow to departs from his shadow till one of us is dead".
And the story of Abdur Rahman Ibn Awf about Ummayyah Ibn Khalaf shows the extent of Bilal's (may Allah be pleased with him) persistence in killing the head of the Kufr: "the head of Kufr is Ummayyah Ibn Khalaf.... I shall live not if he survives," said Bilal.
A few days ago the news agencies had reported that the Defense Secretary of the Crusading Americans had said, "the explosion at Riyadh and AlKhobar had taught him one lesson - not to withdraw when attacked by coward terrorists". We say to the Defence Secretary that his talk can induce a grieving mother to laughter and shows the fears that had enshrined you all with. Where was this false courage of yours when the explosion in Beirut took place on 1983? You were turned into scattered pits and pieces at that time; 241 mainly marines solders were killed. And where was this courage of yours when two explosions made you to leave Aden in less than twenty-four hours!
But your most disgraceful case was in Somalia; where after vigorous propaganda about the power of the USA and its post cold war leadership of the New World Order you moved tens of thousands of international force, including twenty eight thousands American solders into Somalia. However, when tens of your solders were killed in minor battles and one American Pilot was dragged in the streets of Mogadishu you left the area carrying disappointment, humiliation, defeat and your dead with you. Clinton appeared in front of the whole world threatening and promising revenge, but these threats were merely a preparation for withdrawal. You have been disgraced by Allah and you withdrew; the extent of your impotence and weaknesses became very clear. It was a pleasure for the "heart" of every Muslim and a remedy to the "chests" of believing nations to see you defeated in the three Islamic cities of Beirut, Aden and Mogadishu.
I say to Secretary of Defence: The sons of the land of the two Holy Places had come out to fight against the Russian in Afghanistan, the Serb in Bosnia Herzegovina and today they are fighting in Chechenia and by the Permission of Allah they have been made victorious over your partner, the Russians. By the command of Allah, they are also fighting in Tajakistan.
I say since the sons of the land of the two Holy Places feel and strongly believe that fighting (Jihad) against the Kuffar in every part of the world, is absolutely essential, then they would be even more enthusiastic, more powerful and larger in number upon fighting on their own land the place of their births defending the greatest of their sanctities, the noble Ka'ba (the Qiblah of all Muslims). They know that the Muslims of the world will assist and help them to victory. To liberate their sanctities is the greatest of issues concerning all Muslims; It is the duty of every Muslims in this world. I say to you William (Defence Secretary) that: these youths love death as you love life. They inherit dignity, pride, courage, generosity, truthfulness and sacrifice from father to father. They are most delivering and steadfast at war. They inherit these values from their ancestors (even from the time of the Jaheliyyah, before Islam). These values were approved and completed by the arriving Islam as stated by the messenger of Allah (Allah's Blessings and Salutations may be on him) "I have been send to perfecting the good values". (Saheeh AlJame' AsSagheer). When the pagan King Amroo Ibn Hind tried to humiliate the pagan Amroo Ibn Kulthoom, the latter cut the head of the King with his sword rejecting aggression, humiliation and indignation.
Part of the Aerican Tribe
Squirrel Hunter
Spider Killer
GOD BLESS THE USA AND HER FIGHTING FORCES AND ALL WHO FIGHT WITH HER GIVE THEM STRENGTH, WISDOM, SIGHT, AND COURAGE TO STAY THE COURSE TO DESTROY ALL ISLAMIC TERRORIST AND ALL WHO SUPPORT THEM AMEN
Catherine:
Thanks for the link.
Disillusioned German: Not all muslims but about 80 to 90 percent!
From the above link
"Whoever says that Islam is free from terrorism or wants to differentiate between Islam and terrorism is committing Al Juhoud and that is Kufr Akbar – and will take them out of the fold of Islam.
We call it terrorism they call it Jihad. From which follows that any muslim who does not support Jihad, is not a muslim. Therefore all muslims, 100%, are terrorists or support terrorism.
Hang in their ia786. About 80 to 90 percent of statistics are completely baseless.
""Whoever says that Islam is free from terrorism or wants to differentiate between Islam and terrorism is committing Al Juhoud and that is Kufr Akbar – and will take them out of the fold of Islam.
We call it terrorism they call it Jihad. From which follows that any muslim who does not support Jihad, is not a muslim. Therefore all muslims, 100%, are terrorists or support terrorism."
I wish you people could see me, I have proven my case. I have exposed you.
So that is your final proof, you should actually think about the people that say those sort of things. Al-Muhajiroun etc.. You can use their material if you want but don't be surprised if no one takes you seriously.
By the way they have been refuted along with other Wahabi extremist organisations.
Good luck, you're gonna need it.
Spies, spies and more spies. The Muslims are destroying England and will bleed its coffers dry by every conceivable method, all discussed here, and terrorize its people for eternity. US is almost as bad.
Our leaders are not even looking at what is the long term solution which I guess is OK for now, but it is time to quit calling Islam a religion, it is an evil cult with all it's 'unveilings' and 'revealings' and secretive mosques and secret Arabic sermons and closed door discussions.
I think the idea that 1 billion people can be a part of it is the big mental block people have. But hey, wanna quit, watch your back. Women are chattel and their children indoctrinated with hate and that 'grievance' mentality and superiority. Just a cult but the most evil, and now it's woven it's evil web by pioneering and settling the Infidel Lands, waiting; if chosen for any task of jihad, they have no trouble finding eager volunteers. Disgusting.
Yeah monitor the mosques Blair and Bush. Lot of good it will do you.
By the way they have been refuted along with other Wahabi extremist organisations.
ia786, Robert has asked to see these refutations:
http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/006988.php
Wow!! ia786 has really shown you guys! He thinks he's got the logic there, all right.
Hey, ia: You're not really a muslim, are you? You're just some agnostic animal rights activist trying to stir things up over here, aren't you?
If you were really a muslim, you would have read at least a good portion of your koran by now. Do you not understand what it says? Do you disagree with it's commandments? Have you reported any rabble-rouser to the authorities? What are you contributing to the Religion of Peace? Where do you give your alms? Do you know how they are spent? Do you attend mosque? Regularly? Are YOU a good muslim?
Roxane, I'm ROFL. "Even satanists are less trouble." That's great!
ia786:
Dont leave in a huff. My post about 100% of muslims being Jihadis in one way or other, is based on definitions by leading muslim scholars. It is their definitions that support the logic, which at first glance, seems to be flawless.
ia786, I have another question to ask you. You seem to come to this site whenever there is a major terrorist outrage. I suppose you spend some of your time on islamic sites, arguing against the extremist views that are there for all to see. If I remember right, you yourself claimed that you try and convince your fellow muslims against extremism. Could you provide us links on any islamist site where we can all see, what you as ia786 have been writing.
Roxane: How long do you think it will take for Britian and other countries to see it's a lot less costly if you have fewer Muslims around?
In Britain's case, when the Chancellor runs out of ingenuous methods to tax us. Then will come the time of accounting. So far we are running this war on credit.
Separation is the answer for the good of everyone. It will restore peace and sanity here, and also allow muslims to come to their senses. As Islam is not reformable, hopefully they will reject it. If not, they shoud be in dar ul islam till such time as they do.
We cant go on like this forever. Definitely not. I do not think our societies, geared as they are to free and open thought, can continue while this assault on freedom continues unabated. If this assault is not brought to a halt soon, then free society will start to perish. It may not be evident immediately, but perish it will in the fullness of time.
ia786:
Could you post the link for those sites. Would be delighted to see them.
Yeah, yeah..hang in there o wise and mighty ia786!
Nothing like a troll around to galvanize JWers to the everpresent threat of Taqiyya and kitman....
Well, the Brits are going to set up special intelligence units to "track muslims nationwide" and detect extremists.
Ya' know, if they haven't already been doing that for at least three years, then they're playing "catch-up ball" in a bad way.
When I was a police commissioner in my community about twenty or twenty-five years ago, there was an incident that I still think about from time to time. I kept a copy of the report, but I have probably lost it in one-too-many moves.
Man and wife came home from the theatre one evening. Nice home, affluent people. The home had been burglarized. Entry was through a window. The sophisticated electronic alarm and closed circuit TV had been BYPASSED. Cash and jewelry were still on the bedroom dresser, untouched. Valuable art and antiques were left in place. The only evidence of burglary was an open filing cabinet. Our officers dusted for fingerprints, found none. Neighbors saw and heard nothing. A complete mystery. This was mentioned as a curiosity the next day or two in a routine call to the FBI on another matter. (Burglary of a private residence is not a federal crime, so FBI does not investigate) But, it seems that they had heard of something similar.
Yes, they said, on checking. Exactly similar burglaries had taken place ON THE SAME NIGHT in two other cities: Washington DC, and New York City. Now its major curiosity. Lots of calling around, piecing together. Seems that all three of the homeowners were hosting a west bank mayor on his travels in the US. Apparently, the subject of interest was the mayor's itinerary, but we never knew for sure.
The professionalism of the bag job brought quiet admiration from everyone who knew about it, and nothing else was ever said, as far as I know.
That's the kind of WATCHING that Blair needs to do. And if the boys haven't already been sneeking a few peeks, then woe is us!
So Brits are going to track Muslims across the country. Well, from a political class notorious for its Islamophillia, one sensible step.
Its still an open question if anything will be done with the intelligence obtained this way. As to need for Arabic / Urdu speakers, Brits would be well-advised to improve their relations with the Israeli and Indian intelligence agencies. Both have light years of experience in tracking down these Arab and Pakistani pigs and listening to their fiendish plots in their own native languages, and there is no point in re-inventing the wheel, or worse letting a bunch of Muslims infiltrate the domestic surveillance of their co-religionists.
Of course, for all we know, the British foreign office types will develop another strong case of Islamophillia and keep the two natural allies of Britain at a distance while continuing the decades long dance of death with the subhuman countries that these pigs come from.
How many more bombings does it take before we realise that Islam is not compatible with any civilized society. Islam incites and sanctions murder, mayhem and sedition.
MURDER AND MAYHEM:
Islam teaches that a non-muslim is "without sanctity", his "blood, possessions, and land" are free for the muslim to take. Muslims have no qualms about bombing civilizans, or gang-raping native girls or beating up non-muslims since Islam sanctions these acts.
Sheikh Abu Hamza, muslim cleric: “Murder, bank robbery and looting are legitimate weapons against the enemies of Islam.”
SEDITION:
Islam seeks to replace our free democratic society with a totalitarian Islamic mullahtocracy.
Sheik Omar Bakri, muslim cleric: "The ultimate goal is the imposition of Sharia on Great Britain...Someday the black flag of Islam will fly over 10 Downing Street"
Omar Ahmed, chairman CAIR: "Islam isn't in America to be equal to any other faiths, but to become dominant. The Koran, the Muslim book of scripture, should be the highest authority in America, and Islam the only accepted religion on Earth."
Islam should be criminalised and banned from any civilized society.
"Do you honestly believe that all Muslims support terrorist attacks???"
"Not all muslims but about 80 to 90 percent!"
Even if only 10 percent support terrorist attacks, and among that 10 percent 5 percent aid & abet the terrorists in a variety of ways ranging from merely looking the other way when suspicious groups hunker down in a neighborhood apartment and come and go at all hours of the night etc., the problem is this:
We cannot sufficiently tell the difference between the dangerous Muslims and the peaceful Muslims -- until after the explosions have happened and it is too late.
And one major reason why we cannot tell the difference is because of the massive passivity (at best) on the part of the Muslim communities with regard to the growing problem of their bad apples.
In this problematic situation, we must DEMAND (not ask) from the Muslim communities that they actively hunt down and root out their bad apples and turn them over to the secular authorities. The time for "dialogue" and "bridge-building" and "international conferences on terrorism" should be over and put on a back burner for ivory-tower university think tanks to do in their leisure as we pursue the serious necessary business of self-defense.
Omar Bakri is my favorite: He is 'the solution' he says, not the cause of the problem...
In other words, submit to Allah would stop the bombing....
Shuggi, Saladin, lying king of the desert, 1a687:
You are trying to tell us that Islam is not Islam? That terror is not terror?
And with your homoerotical depiction of Muhammed the peadophile, rapist, pilfering carawan raider you are not a submissive zombie of the cult?
Omar Bakri is honest about it. Why not you? Are you from the propaganda department like King Tollerschwantz?
Terminator
Its a tactic similar to the one used by Turkish armies in the middle ages.
They divided their armies into two parts (was it three ?) :
Bashi-bezouks who were poor soldiers but served as cannon fodder and confused the fighting formation of the opposing army.
Janisseries the shock soldiers, highly trained, who provided the killing power.
ia786 and others of his ilk (unless they are simply stupid Westerners who are still asleep, just repeating the latest Islamic propaganda) are simply bashi-bezouks. Their sole purpose is to sow confusion, and cause dissensions.
Omar Bakri is simply a true janissery. Higher up in the command chain, closer to Mohammed the pedophile.
Geez, what a bunch of crap to wade through "Is Britain’s islamophobia ever going to stop?" and the classic "It seems everyone is so quick to blame a Muslim...maybe you all need to look in the mirror...you are the terrorists!! When A Muslim country screws up they are the first to admit they are wrong...we never blame anyone else...you Americans and British always blame Islam. Islam is the key to peace and a united world."
Then why is it that the suicide bomberswere all Muslims? Why is it that the phone links with their Al-Queda connection are fact? Why is it that Islam decided to divide the world into the House of Submission, the House of Truce and the House of War (dar al Islam, dar al Suhl and dar al Harb)? Islam declared an eternal unholy war on all the non-Muslim world almost 1400 years ago. Mohammed started it by raiding caravans until he had stolen enough money to amass an army of robbers large enough to take over Mecca and then all of Arabia. Muslims are always trying to hide their ignorance and wrong doing. They never willingly come forth to admit their sins or their failures. It's all the West's fault after all they cry. They have done this to us! It's the Jews! Taqiyyah and lies, that's all these peoples comments are. Here is an easy way to tell when a Muslim is lying: if their lips move, then its safe to assume they're lying. Never trust a Muslim. Never.
Proudsikh, I wouldn't dignify Bakri by calling him a janisarry. Janisarries were taken from Christian families and given the choice of convert to Islam or die. Bakri has always been a Mussie dog, licking his master's heels to keep them happy. He wishes he could have been a janisarry.
I know as a soldier serving overseas I have lost numerous friends to so called *muslims* or holy warriors. Whatever they believe they are. All I can say is that no Christian country has ever caused the kind of trouble that non-christian, i.e. muslims countries have caused. I have never lost friends to a christian suicide bomber. I have only watched friends die at the hand of some disillusioned psycho who thinks that he is a martyr because he finds himself in a down trodden, pointless religion. I think it is inexcusable that we actually let these types of people into our country after what we have seen happen to ourselves and England. I know we can't stop all bad things from happening, but I doubt I would have watched some Wiccan's or Sikh's fly planes into the Twin Towers. America needs to wake up and recognize that this danger is relevant and real. No longer are we to believe that everyone is equal and deserves equal rights. To be a true Muslim, you must believe in the Jihad. And to do this means that you lie in the same group as you insurgent brothers in Mosul, your Taliban fighters in the Paktia Province, your warriors of Allah in the Kashmir frontier, and your dirty scum terrorist buddies that bombed London. Gone are the days of calling racial profiling wrong and in are the days ousting most of Dearborne, Michigain. I know I can't stand watching this country give my GOD given rights, that my ancestors fought and died for, to a bunch of Allah worshipping, shaheed wanna-be Muslims any longer.
Josh, well-said.
Indictment of Muslim: On or about such-and-such day, Mr. Muslim did then and there knowingly, intentionally, and unlawfully place and detonate explosives upon a public conveyance within the city limits and legal jurisdiction of Wherever, resulting in the death of Mr. and Mrs. Whomever, against the peace and dignity of the State.
Statement of Muslim in Defense: I didn't do it. You are racially profiling me, and discriminating against me. You are engaging in psychological projection because it's you that does these things, killing innocent people, and then blaming muslims, who are peace loving people except when defending themselves against the jew pigs swine and the great satan, and you always jump to conclusions, and I don't have any explosives, and those people on the underground deserved to die terrorist pigs hateful people, and probably the oil greedy uncle sam and jew occupier intelligence service did it along with British heathen devil dog-lovers, and the explosion was small and next time will be big you see to glory of Allah and the prophet (peace be upon him) and the blood of the tyrant Amerika and British people will run in the streets because we are peaceful people praying in our mosques and don't have F-16 jets and rockets only poor depressed young men and backpacks, and we don't know about explosves only about study of Allah and koran, not like filthy kafir infidels unworthy whores, and you owe us an apology and to make statement public that you are wrong because we are peaceful and if you don't stop all your infidel doings and change then I will put even bigger bomb in tube and kill more of you next time Allah be praised, Allah willing. I am innocent.
Bohemond:
No no no: It was M5, the Blair government that is behind it! They do that in order to blame the poor Muhammedans who are totally innocent!
Blair is only using this as a pretext to impose martial law, just like Bushitler!
And the Twin Towers 'imploded', didn't you know? This 'travesty' was engineered by the Mossad, the CIA and David Copperfield, it never really happened! You are all racist xenophobic Islam haters, but Allah will surely strike terror in your hearts and wipe you out...
gagaggoogoo and so on and so on....
There are those who believe that and there are those who want to make believe.
The poor infidel I am, I don't believe! I saw what I saw, I know what I know, I learned my history, and 1400 years of Mohammedan conquest and destruction dosn't look pretty.
Round them up, ship 'em out, and if the container goes down on the way make sure it doesn't float...
texan,
And that, is practicing Islam too.
Specifically the Islamic doctrines of Taqiyaa (deception) and Kitman (concealment of malevolent intentions).
Has anyone else noticed the bombing pattern in London resembles a crescent and star? The attacks have been planned along curved sections of the tube from the graphics I've seen, and the bus bomb, or the star, is epicentric... Just a crazy observation, but it's peculiar to place one of the bombs above ground on a bus... -- although this might simply be to provide a vivid graphic scene for public consumption -
OT but, Has anyone else noticed the bombing pattern in London resembles a crescent and star? The attacks have been planned along curved sections of the tube from the graphics I've seen, and the bus bomb, or the star, is epicentric... Just a crazy observation, but it's peculiar to place one of the bombs above ground on a bus... -- although this might simply be to provide a vivid graphic scene for public consumption -
sorry for the repeat ...
I think that one day a class action suit will be brought against muslims for all the suffering that they have caused us "infidels".
According to this Sky News poll,
http://www.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,30000-13391671,00.html
2% of Muslims agree with the July 7th attacks. So that means we have about 32,000* terrorist sympathisers running around Britain. Can you see how people find this scary, ia786? You can say that most Muslims oppose terror, you might not even see any of the 2% in your mosque or town. But they are out there in sizeable number, and they will do more damage to Britain (and possibly the USA) before they are defeated.
(*plus any that support terrorism but weren't dumb enough to say so)
"By the way they have been refuted along with other Wahabi extremist organisations.
ia786, Robert has asked to see these refutations:"
________________________________________________
Wahabism itself has been refuted by the Ahlus-Sunnah.
http://www.yanabi.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=27&threadid=913
http://www.yanabi.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=27&threadid=802
http://www.ummah.net/Al_adaab/suwahhab.html
_________________________________________________
I challenged the people here to show me how terrorist attacks like those in London could be justified in Islam, I'm still waiting.
While it may be a good idea to track Muslims, we should also keep an eye on their left-wing dhimmi allies. Ranting lefties are every bit as dangerous as the ranting jihadists. Taking down (figuratively speaking) the likes of Michael Moore, Ward Churchill, Galloway, or Red Ken is much more effective than attacking some Muslim on the street (unless of course he's actually doing something, like the guy in the train station.) The individuals I mentioned are worth ten ordinary Muslims. To not do so is the equivalent to alarimg the front door but leaving the back door open.
"ia786:
Dont leave in a huff. My post about 100% of muslims being Jihadis in one way or other, is based on definitions by leading muslim scholars. It is their definitions that support the logic, which at first glance, seems to be flawless."
Leading Muslim scholars.....??? ha ha
_________________________________________________
"ia786, I have another question to ask you. You seem to come to this site whenever there is a major terrorist outrage. I suppose you spend some of your time on islamic sites, arguing against the extremist views that are there for all to see. If I remember right, you yourself claimed that you try and convince your fellow muslims against extremism. Could you provide us links on any islamist site where we can all see, what you as ia786 have been writing."
Yes I do, It is only a handful of these nuts. You should know that alot of them are attention seekers, they are not even that significant. They have no power, no authority. You will find that alot of their leaders are foreigners.
I do talk to those that hold extreme views, I will admit that I love to humiliate them and expose their hypocrisy and stupidity, expose how extremism is weakness, how it is cowardice.
Hazrat Ali(ra) said "Extremism is a sign of Ignorance"
However I will not post any links here. You seem to be a reasonable person however there are many here that are not and I don’t trust them. I am a Muslim that opposes extremism, I feel don't need to prove myself to anyone here, you should all know where a Muslim stands in times like these.
DP111 you can email me at :ia786@hotmail.co.uk
I will write back to you and give you more details however please understand I will not give you links to debates between me and extremists.
I will tell how they are justified clown. These *islamikazis*, terrorists, or mislead children of Allah find that someone with years of experience in thier religion, i.e. imams, clerics, fake Muslims that just like killing are looking for a few good men to stand up for thier religion and show the West who is really in control. These filthy clerics go about the cities either inciting hatred, or playing off ideas already placed in the young minds of very impressionable teenagers. These teenagers, feeling led to become martyrs because the clerics tell them that if they do blow themselves up on a train, bus, small market in Jerusalem, crowd of U.S. Soldiers in Mosul, the Pentagon...that they are entitled to live in Paradise depending on what scale their all gracious Allah is grading on today. I can see their twisted justification, and I am only 20 years old. The only justification they need is that in order to please Allah, they need to the fight the dirty, oil loving, apple pie eating, throwing keggers in the corn field and degrading the great world that Allah created Kufirs, they need to either convert us, or kill us by way of the sword. I can tell you now, I will never be a Muslim, and I am dead sure that I will never be killed by a Muslim...cause I am going to watch my front site post!
I read this whole thread. All of it. With exception to IA786, the mindless drum beat of ignorance continues.
"We can't trust Muslims! Waaaaah!"
"We think Muslims suck! Waaaa!"
"Why can't we kick them all out? Waa Waaa!"
Calm down the hysterics and consider a few factoids:
1. 1.2 billion Muslims in the world. They're not changing their faith.
2. Over 100,000,000 Muslims live in India. Peacefully.
3. Muslims live in Singapore. Peacefully.
4. Muslims live on my block. Peacefully.
5. Muslims work in my office. Peacefully.
6. A Muslim drives the bus I ride to work in the
the morning. Peacefully.
Ignoring these facts and taking a hard line against the millions upon millions of people based on a "guilt by association" mentality is not only weak, but just as bad as the terrorists who do exactly the same thing.
Oh - thanks to Turdinator for the plug. Its nice to know that I am thought of even when I am not around.
Ia, Saladin, Shuggy, Lying King of the desert:
http://www.terrorists-suck.org/fight/the_shoe_bomber.mp3
Put a bomb in your shoe and blow away....
King Schwantz:
Hundred million Muzzies in India "peaceful?" What about Kashmir? What about the Bombay bombing? What about the parliament bombing? How about the Hindu temple on which the Muzzies build a mosque just like the atrocious "Al Axa" piece of s*#t they build on top of the temple -mount in Jerusalem?
You are such a phoney! Where do you live? You ride a bus? Not safe in London, little schwantz!
Change your religion, you might not end up dead or in handcuffs and you might be able to use chauffeur-drive to your office instead of using public transport!
All this talk of tolerance and being nice to everybody. Where has the put us in the world today? It wouldn't hurt my feelings to pull out of Iraq and watch this worthless peice of soil destroy itself. All I can really find in the *Land of Two Rivers* worth anything are the Chaldeans anyways. You may think KingTolerance that all these Muslims you hold so dear are simple, non-violent, Peaceniks. But the truth is, in order to be a true, real, geniune Muslim, you must hate all that the West stands for. You cannot simply watch your poor brothers in Iraq get mowed down by the brutal, mindless Army. You must fight them to the death and bring honor to Allah and his prophet. Well that doesn't fly with me. If you are a Muslim, you are guilty by association. No more grey area, just black and white from now on. You are either with us, or against us. And if against us, get out, or you will be kicked out soon enough.
DP111 ignore my earlier post. Please don't email me. I have read that comment in the other thread that was aimed at me.
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Has anyone noticed that this ia786 poster had said his goodbyes to JW/DW but immediately turned after the massacres of innocents in London. I have a feeling that he came here to gloat. It is a typical muslim thing. Note that muslims were passing around beheading videos on their mobiles.
There seems no limit to the evil that is islam.
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I don't need to prove anything to you. You can believe what you want. This movement of yours is not Anti-Terrorism, it is anti-Islam. It is anti-Muslim.
I don't want you to prove anything to any of us. You have showed your ignorance in your last statement pal. It seems to me that Anti-Islam and Anti-Muslim would indeed be Anti-Terrorism. Need I say more?
ia786 posted: I will write back to you and give you more details however please understand I will not give you links to debates between me and extremists.
Ok I will not email you as you dont wish it. However, what is the harm of looking at internet sites where you have engaged the extremists. It is after all quite public, unless there is a requirement for registration, and non-muslims are not eligible.
Look at this site that you come to. There is no requirement that you have to prove that you are a non-muslim. If there is to be free debate, then you should let us see that you do oppose the extremists on islamic sites - something that you have oft stated that you do.
ia786, I do want to believe that you are trying to stop the increase of hatred. What you need to show is that you are honest on both sides ie you do the same on islamic sites as well.
For ia786:
The sidewalks where terror breeds
http://www.csmonitor.com/2005/0722/p01s01-woeu.html
This is really quite terrifying. What is happening to your community? Can you explain?
Ignoring these facts and taking a hard line against the millions upon millions of people based on a "guilt by association" mentality is not only weak, but just as bad as the terrorists who do exactly the same thing.
The hard fact is that there are thousands of Muslims in the UK who, by their own admission, support terrorism. Yes, there are many, many more who don't. But that's not going to stop those who do from killing people. What's more, there's no easy way to distinguish the killers from the innocent.
I've never supported collective punishment (I'm not sure if that's what you mean by a "hard line"), but surveillance of Muslims by the intelligence services is inevitable. If and when 2% of the Christian population of Britain support outrages like 7/7, I expect MI5 will be looking closely at them too.
ia786:
Wahabism itself has been refuted by the Ahlus-Sunnah.
http://www.yanabi.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=27&threadid=913
http://www.yanabi.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=27&threadid=802
http://www.ummah.net/Al_adaab/suwahhab.html
Thanks for the links. They present some interesting detail on the history Wahabism and an argument against Wahabism.
But argument against Wahabism is not necessarily argument against the jihadist philosophy, unless you are saying that all jihadists are Wahabist?
I find it interesting that ia786's parries and thrusts are sufficient to keep many on this board engaged with him -- in that he is being very successful -- although I'm fairly certain he hasn't convinced anyone of his (what appears to me to be) mock sincerity... Periodically his acidic anti-semitism flashes through in posts, although he often appears to be quite sedate and, dare I say it 'moderate' sounding.
I don't wish to take this too far, but in a similar fashion Muslim acts of terror are similar in that the acts of one or two can completely engage an entire society -- hamper its free operation, damage its functionality, undermine the very essence of its existence. We will never fully know this poster's intent at this site, but his posts have become a metaphor for me.
Clearly there is something deeply troubling about Islam's disposition towards the rest of the world.
Clearly it is causing great suffering and strife in ALL the places where it exists.
Clearly many have the growing knowledge that Islam poses a grave challenge to our systems by its inimical beliefs, and the threat that it universally nurtures and creates human horrors which may harm us in unimaginable ways in pursuit of those beliefs.
This is part of my calculus that makes me conclude that they must be marginalized, ostracised, and ultimately run out of town. They can't fit in, they don't want to fit in, they never will fit in -- BY THEIR OWN CHOICE. There is nothing more we can do for them...
I have asked ia786 before if he wishes to see Islam dominate the world -- in a similar fashion to requests above for his 'anti-extremist' credentials, he has never responded. His peculiar posts and the attitudes expressed are very similar to the larger Islamic community which either leaves the impression that they support Islamic violence against the rest of the world, or that their attitude is ambivalent at best.
Sorry, dude -- in this post 9/11 world, and with the evidence mounting that your religion is getting out of control -- if the best you can do is dance around the fringes and reinforce the growing notion that Islam is ambivalent at best about its terroristic trajectory, it's going to get pretty bad for you and yours.
As I have said in the past, the pious ones had no idea who they were tangling with when they messed with the USA ... Lesson time for you is coming -- But being the noble and tolerant nation we are, we're giving you ample opportunity to reform while we orchestrate the field of battle. Your leaders are so craven and deluded that they think they're winning this thing.
Fair warning to you : BEWARE!
Nothing could be further from the truth. In the meantime Muslims will hurt us, they will steal from our treasuries, they will rob us of our loved ones. But at some point we will use the excuse Muslims have used so well, attacking us and then blaming us for the attack. You will force us to do EXTREMELY BAD THINGS TO YOU in retaliation. The shoot on site is just the beginning, and this from the UK! a beautiful culture and society that couldn't have done more to help you, encourage you, and welcome you into the west. And you Muslims have turned on her and bitten her with poisonous fangs.