CAIR goes after me

We have something CAIR and Islam can never have: An honest man.

I periodically check Islamicity.com, especially the IViews section, which has op-eds and articles. The articles are inevitably anti-American, anti-Semitic, anti-Christian. The U.S. is to blame for all the world's ills. The hatred and invective that spews forth from the comments section at Islamicity.com every day is something to behold. Pretty apalling, as bad if not worse than the idiotic comments one finds here. Does CAIR condemn Islamicity.com for "raw hatred" esposued there? Does CAIR hold Islamicity.com respponsible for these hateful comments?

Keep on keeping on ! -- if the fascists at CAIR are angr with this site, it must be revealing something about Islam which they wish to conceal -- Could it be their intolerance of opinions critical of Islam ? The things they quoted didn't really appear to me to be hateful at all -- It's a violent religion -- that can be seen the world over -- every where that Islam exists there is violence, hatred, intolerance, and the most staggering bigotry and ignorance.

If the rage filled Wahhabi sect at C.A.I.R hate the truth, then that says alot about Muslims and Islam too!

Robert Spencer, your objective views on Islam are accurate to the core. Keep up the good work and don't let any Muslim or anyone else stop you from telling the truth! You are doing something that most people do not have the talent, knowledge, insight or willingness to do, so carry on shedding light on the darkness of Islam!

I can hear the avalanche of fresh Internet traffic for Jihad Watch, generated free of charge by CAIR-LA.

Nice move, guys.

If CAIR is upset you can be sure you are doing something right.

Mr Spencer,
We stand behind you with every breath we have!!!
I hope that the California synagouge is educated to CAIR's affiliation with Hamas and Islamic Jihad.This s@#$ is truly unbelievable.
Jews of California- Don't fall for it !even "Nice" muslims hate Jews.
even "Nice" muslims want to see Israel wiped off the map.
CAIR is a terrorist organization.
Islam IS the NAZISM of our generation.
Defend freedom of though!!!
Defeat Jihad!

This is an ad hominem attack through and through. Not one argument, not one piece of evidence provided by Spencer in his books, articles, etc., has been addressed. Nothing.

CAIR demands that Spencer is alienated and silenced because he operates a Web Site that post articles and information related to worldwide jihadist activity, attacks on human rights, like freedom of speech, motivated by Islamic principles. Rather than address Spencer's arguments and the evidence CAIR appears to employ a 'slander-threat' strategy: first, slander Spencer and his work with the label of 'Islamophobe' and guilt by association with provocative, offensive comments on the site for which he is not responsible. But do things end there? What is CAIR prepared to do if Temple of the Arts and Jewish leaders to not respond in kind? Is there a tacit threat of some sort involved in this 'request' to alienate Spencer? What if members of the Temple of the Arts disagree and hold that Spencer is not promoting hate but awareness of jihadist ideology in Islamic scriptures and traditions? Will the Temple of the Arts be the next to be included in the category of 'hate-mongers'?

Ad hominem attacks, slander, and implied threats (at the very least CAIR makes clear in this press release that if Jewish leaders do not respond they are suspect and unworthy of further 'cooperation', whatever that entails.)

This is obviously an ideologically motivated attempt at censorship of criticism of Islam, an act quite at home in Islamic traditions, Islamic societies all over the globe, and now in any country where Muslims have acquired sufficient political and economic power.

The press release, of course, does not provide grounds to alienate Spencer. On the contrary, CAIR only makes it all the more obvious why we should tune in now even more carefully than we did before.

You won't be beaten by these people.

In the aftermath of 9/11, the fact that Muslims in America were so quick to turn their wrath upon America and slander this magnificent tolerant land was very telling to me...

I have never seen C.A.I.R. condemn the endless stream of bigotry, hatefulness, and sewage flowing like a torrent out of the Islamic world and directed against Jews, Christians, and America in particular. Ibrahim Hooper was one of the first red flags that alerted me about Islam's role in 9/11, though it wasn't yet clear to me what the link was.

Speak on C.A.I.R. With every bitter recrimination I am CERTAIN that more Americans are saying -- 'hey wait' these guys seem like the hatred spewing liars and bigots they're always accusing everyone else of being -- I wonder what's up with the 'religion' of Islam if they're always filled with such outrage and indignation...'

They're doing a great job of spreading the vile face of intolerant Islam to the masses... A BIG SHOUT OUT goes to C.A.I.R !

Thanks guys, we couldn't have done it without you!

Well, if the Muslims are going to see what I post...

HEY EVERYBODY!

I DON'T BEAT WOMEN!
I DRINK ALCOHOL!
PORK IS GOOD!
SEWN UP P***IES DOES NOT APPEAL TO ME!
I LOVE EARNING INTEREST IN MY BANK ACCOUNT!
I DON'T PRAY 5 TIMES A DAY!
I LIVE IN A CHRISTIAN COUNTRY AND COME FROM A CHRISTIAN FAMILY BUT I DON'T BELIEVE IN JESUS!
I BELIEVE THAT WOMEN ARE NOT PROPERTY.
I BELIEVE THAT IT IS WRONG TO KILL HOMOSEXUALS.

:)

NETANYA. BALI. THE COLE. LONDON SUBWAY. SPANISH TRAIN. 9/11. OSAMSA. ARAFAT. HAMAS. ISLAMIC JIHAD.THE AYATOLLAH. SADDAM.IDI AMIN. NASSER.THE PALESTINIANS CHEERING ON 9/11. AIRLINE HIJACKINGS. THE SHOE BOMBER. THE THREAT OF A DIRTY BOMB.REJECTION OF PEACE WITH ISRAEL. THE AsSASSINATION OF BOBBY KENNEDY.HEZBOLLAH. AMERICAN HOSTAGES IN IRAN.THE ASSASINATION OF SADAT. FEMALE CLITORAL MUTILATION. POLYGAMY.MYSOGYNY. WIFE BEATING. REJECTION OF RATIONAL THOUGHT.JIZYA.DHIMMI.SAMI AL ARYAN. THE BLIND SHEIK. THE Y2K BOMBINGS. SHARIA.BEHEADINGS. DANIEL PEARL. NICK BERG.THEODORE VAN GOGH.THE ASSASINS.ATTEMPT OF POPE JOHN PAUL'S LIFE.

You f@#$ing animals.
Anyone who doesn't it has their head in the sand.
Anyone who doesen't get it isn't paying attention.
Some things are worth fighting for.
the NAZIS were worth fighting.
the fascists were worth fighting.
and, ISLAM IS WORTH FIGHTING
DEFEND THE WEST!
DEFEAT JIHAD!

"Does CAIR condemn Islamicity.com for "raw hatred" esposued there? Does CAIR hold Islamicity.com respponsible for these hateful comments?" - kelley

"I have never seen C.A.I.R. condemn the endless stream of bigotry, hatefulness, and sewage flowing like a torrent out of the Islamic world and directed against Jews, Christians, and America in particular. "-- jsla

jsla, kelley,

even if you point out such Islamic bigotry & hate speech from muslim websites, you know what they will say right ?.....the usual ' you are looking at the wrong section of muslims, they are a minority, they dont represent real islam, real islam is peaceful, they are distorting the message of islam,' if that also doesnt work, they will start with the 'grievances' like how they are justifying riots in france with 'assimilation problems' 'french police brutality' 'youth=scum remark of politician' etc etc. muslims/islam is never at fault.

To whoever, on this site, whose quotes were used in the article I have this to say. Good job and I am a bit jelous none of my quotes made it.

With the way Robert sheds the truth about this Islamic organization, I think we should nickname Robert the "CAIR Bare".

(Note: Comments on articles are unmoderated, and do not necessarily reflect the views of Jihad Watch or Robert Spencer. Comments that are off-topic, offensive, slanderous, or otherwise annoying may be summarily deleted. However, the fact that particular comments remain on the site IN NO WAY constitutes an endorsement by Robert Spencer of the views expressed therein.)

The opinions I espouse are mine alone, I formed my opinions watching the events of the world unfold. islam can deny that it is the main cause of just about all terrorism in the world today, but I can see for myself who is responsible.
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/

LOL! You seem to have struck a nerve at CAIR. Good work JW/DW!

I don't think that the temple needs to take CAIR up on it's offer. Something tells me Jews have a rather accurate perspective on Islam already. As for the press releases, they remind me of the worst kind of ambulance-chaser or mob lawyer.

In all seriousness, who is CAIR's legal staff, how big is it? I can imagine how much prep-work goes into these attacks. Have they reached the point where they can have legal proceedings started against THEM? Dhimmitude emboldens them, stumbling and stuttering PC apologists validate their attacks, silence encourages them to push a little harder the next time. At what point do free infidels say "Enough!" and litigate back. At what point do the double standards become an offensive affront to any liberty-loving individual? What is needed for a cease-and-desist order?

I do object to animals being slandered though...

If you ever feel persecuted for what you say in truth, then ask for allegiance from individuals like myself. I have read the Quran and it is militant in nature. In Muslim society, it is not allowed that you question Islam. Much to my dismay, you can not even speak of it, nor question it as this is detrimentle to Islam. What voice does a religion have that oft inters.

Otterfisher ~

Very nice.

Sincerely,

Mad Jack

"We would be glad to suggest the names of credible Muslim scholars who can offer Temple Shalom's congregation a perspective on Islam that is not tainted by hatred and bigotry," said CAIR-LA Executive Director Hussam Ayloush."

Khomeini's speech on the day of celebration of the birth of Muhammad: 1981

"The real Day of God is the day that Amir al mo’menin  drew his sword and slaughtered all the khavarej and killed them from the first to the last.  
 
The Days of God are when Allah, the gracious, the almighty, causes an earthquake. It is when He slaps on the face. It is when he causes a hurricane. He whips this people to become humans. 
 
If the Amir al mo’menin  wanted to be tolerant, he would not have drawn his sword killing 700 people in one go in our prisons we have more of the same kind of people who are corrupt. If we do not kill them, each one of them that gets out, will become a murderer!
 
They don’t become humans. Why do you Mullahs only go after the ordinances of prayer and fasting?

Why do you only read the Quranic verses of mercy and do not read the verses of killing? 

Quran says; kill, imprison! Why are you only clinging to the part that talks about mercy?  Mercy is against God.  

Mehrab means the place of war, the place of fighting. Out of the mehrabs, wars should proceed, just as all the wars of Islam used to proceeded out of the mehrabs. 

The prophet has [had] sword to kill people..Our [Holy] Imams were quite military men. All of them were warriors. They used to wield swords; they used to kill people.  We need a Khalifa who would chop hands, cut throat, stone people in the same way that the messenger of God used to chop hands, cut throats, and stone people. In the same way that he massacred the Jews of Bani Qurayza because they were a bunch of discontent people.   
If the Prophet used to order to burn a house or exterminate a tribe that was justice. The lives of people must be secured through punishment. Because, the protection of the masses lies beneath these very punitive executions.  

With just a few years of imprisonment things don’t get fixed. You must put aside these childish sentimentalism.  We believe that the accused essentially does not have to be tried....he or she  must just be killed. 

Only their identity is to be established and then they should be killed."

I THINK IT IS VERY CLEAR SINCE THE ABOVE SPEECH CAME FROM A VERY CREDIBLE MUSLIM SCHOLAR......KHOMEINI......himself!

I look forward to the day when the law catches up with the fascists in CAIR. They aren't as clever as they think they are and I hope Homeland Security pounces on them the minute they slip up.

In the meantime Robert, wear their criticism of you like a badge of honor. It's almost as good as a Congressional Medal of Honor in my books. And counter their offer of free Korans with your PIG to Islam book.

CAIR can go straight to hell.

I resent that CAIR implies that we called muslims " animals and Nazis"
animals no
Nazis absolutely.

you have my full support, nothing you have said is neither deragatory nor hatefull. Criticism is not allowed in Islam. Lest you want decapitaition or second class citizenship, aka, buddist reference. It is funny, no social structure relagates individual ideas, yet they wonder why they are at the bottom rung. Feed me full of oil and I will show you how ideas are squashed. Let alone scientific activity. Capital in nature, yet we are on the forefront of technology. Repressive in nature, spoiled from birth, not much to gather from mind meetings.

Perhaps CAIR is unhappy with the true Islamic Scholars of our day. They much prefer the John Espositos and Karen Armstrong to give the confused infidels an enlightened opinion.

Let's go back in time and listen to the Islamic scholars of old. Andre Servier was a French scholar of Islam. He wrote a book Islam and the Mind of the Musulman, published in 1922 in French, translated to English in 1923. His target audience was the bureaucratic elite of France. You know, the France on fire.

Now, it is online in its entirety for you to read and its coming in French soon.

MusulmanBook

Why don't you google my name, or the name of a leader of long past, and long forgotten.

Jan Sobieski

If I were teaching a course in argumentation I could use that press release as a final exam essay question:

"Identify and briefly describe each formal and material fallacy committed in this press release. Focus on identifying different types of fallacies (rather than on listing multiple occurrences of the same fallacy type). For extra credit, list the types and scope of evidence the authors would need to make their case validly (i.e., without relying primarily on material and formal fallacies)."

-- Pilgrim

Look, folks, I'm sure most of us have at some time or another seen a post here that we felt uncomfortable with. The majority of them are just reasonable criticisms and frustration being vented by people everywhere who (rather than being "isolated" because their practice of Islam) feel isolated because they know the truth about Islam. It IS frustrating to run into the same ignorance time and time again.

It is useful for me, as a Christian, to have a Church that I can go to where I don't have to defend my views on Christianity the way that I so often do in my day to day life. In the same way JW/DW is useful because gives us somewhere to go where we can see that we are not alone in being vilified as "Islamophobes" because we care more about the truth and the people we would bring it to than the image we could cultivate by not doing so.

Robert Spencer, Hugh Fitzgerald, Jihad Watch - these are not the enemy. IGNORANCE IS THE ENEMY - ONCE THE IGNORANCE SURROUNDING ISLAM IS DEFEATED THE WAR IS ALL BUT ALREADY WON.

One side of this debate is following the pursuit of truth the other is practising deception.

. . . and I don't think I have to tell you folks which is which.

CAIR Bare!

Too freakin funny!

What was that line about ideologues not wanting free speech because they suspected it was the truth? Also the line about there being no wrong time for the truth?

kelley;

Islamicity was one of the first places I investigated when I started to realize there was a new "ism" out there trying to turn the world into a sh!thole, having missed being a victim of 9/11 because of a late delivery. Actually before I ever found DW/JW. Vile, vile place. Used to feel like I needed a shower after taking the troll tour. Actually engaged a few in "discussion", got the usual routine and my first experience of statements so bizarrely unrelated to what I had said.

It is critically important, a matter of life and death, that the truth be given a forum. The truth must be encouraged to live, grow, spread. It must be spread to infect new minds, to rampage through towns and cities, a reverse epidemic of reality, causing not sickness but health, that rolls across the land, a strain resistant to the fascist vaccines, unaffected by antibodies of self-loathing and guilt artificially introduced in response to fictitious antigens.

"We few, we happy few, we band of brothers(and sisters)
For he today who sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother, be he ne'er so vile,
This day shall gentle his condition;
And gentlemen in England(and all the West) now a-bed
Shall think themselves accursed they were not here
And hold their manhoods cheap whilest any speaks
That fought with us upon St. Crispins Day."

W.S. 1599

Notice that the first two goals of CAIR are clearly false, the third a buzzword for pushy.

encourage dialogue, protect civil liberties, empower American Muslims

How come I am American, yet I can not get into harvard, yet all immigrants of middle eastern decent get bonafided clearance? Best schooling to offer, and we give it to people that hate us.

CAIR does believe in its motto:

"encourage dialogue"---we talk, you listen

"protect civil liberties"---we have the right to say and do whatever we want, but you cannot do anything that may offend us.

"empower American Moslems"---we are the Master Religion, understand dhimmi?

fundamental structure of educating non americans has faultered, start with educating our own, I can not get a scholarship, but a minority can, what the f

Ibrahim Hooper of CAIR is such a liar. He was on MSNBC debating Dennis Prager about a year ago. The next day he is a guest on the Michael Medved show. Several callers tried to get Hooper to own up to his lies on the MSNBC show - Hooper then claims he never met and has never spoken to Prager.

This is how they operate - Infidels don't deserve the truth. Isn't it interesting that the biggest liars are found in leftist organizations?

How come we educate all that hate us, yet hang our own sons out to dry?

we should be teaching our own sons instead of sending them to war, while we teach their opposition how to conduct business

how many dead in Irag, how many enrolled in our collegges, lest the toll rain down on you send our sons to war, give the opposition scholarships

educate them, while we send our sons to war,

this needs to change

Dear Robert:

I know that you won't pay any attention to CAIR's blather but you should know that this regular JW/DW reader supports you in your efforts 100 percent.

This article by CAIR represents the classic Muslim way of arguing - if you can't dispute the message, then attack the messenger. I am constantly amazed how Islamists think that by simply making ad hominem attacks on people that they will convince anyone of the accuracy of their views. If anything, for thoughtful people, ad hominem attacks indicate that your arguments are so weak that the only way you can get at the person is to attack them personally. And, of course, you can see where this leads - if your insults don't work, then the next step is physical intimidation, threats of violence and the like. But, as all Jihad Watchers know, this type of behaviour is straight from the example of Mohammad who also, when he could not answer the arguments of his opponents, condoned their assassination.

Keep up the good work Robert. If CAIR is mad at you then your efforts to educate people about Islam must be making enough headway that CAIR has begun to find you alarming. I notice that CAIR's preferred modus operandi is at first to ignore people who criticize Islam in the hope that they will come to nothing. They only start attacking when they feel that the person is having some effect. So, guess what Robert, you are having some effect!

So, CAIR, if you are reading this, please feel free to move to Saudi Arabia, Algeria, etc. as soon as possible. If you don't like living in the West, please, move to "paradise" as soon as possible.

"We would be glad to suggest the names of credible Muslim scholars who can offer Temple Shalom's congregation a perspective on Islam that is not tainted by hatred and bigotry," said CAIR-LA Executive Director Hussam Ayloush.

Islam isn't tainted by anyone else than it's own deeds. If it can be 'tainted' by anything, then it is a weak brainwashing system indeed.

Ayloush also offered to give every member of Temple Shalom a complimentary copy of the Quran, Islam's revealed text, so they may learn more about what Muslims really believe.

Muslims need to learn what the rest of the country believes, not the other way-round.

The CAIR message sounds pretty "hateful."

CAIR doesn't get it that in AMERICA one can "hate" Islam as much as they please.

They would love to psychologically manipulate people into thinking this is the same as hating Muslims.

PSYCHO-logical manipulation that includes using abstract to describes details and the use of exaggerations.

Robert says it best:

This CAIR press release is yet another example of that organization's attempt to stifle free speech about Islam and terrorism in the United States,

Robert, go after them for defamation if you can.

Let's support Robert financially if need be.

CAIR is only doing their job, and that is to practice low-intensity Jihad war, on an informational level, by peddling taquiyya-filled obfuscation.

PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH

Winning individual skirmishes with CAIR will do nothing.

Islam has extremely bad facts. But somehow that story has not and perhaps can not be put out there in front of the general infidel public.

At a recent lunch with a highly educated and fairly influential fellow, he became visibly angry when I told him the Koran called for the murder of Jews and Christians. I told him these were plain facts and he shut down. The truth was unacceptable, prima facie.

Nowhere have I heard anybody articulate a coherent public argument based on the plain facts of Islam to take it on for what it is.

To date, all arguments against Islam have been apologetic, self-censored, needlessly academic in presentation, and therefore very easily discredited. Only Moslems may criticize other religions.

Job one is to win the war of underlying concepts and lexicon. Until these fundamental tasks are accomplished, recounting Islam's sordid history is perfectly useless.

PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH

So long as the concepts of "moderate moslems" and "Islamic fundamentalists" have currency, world freedom will continue its inexorable slide towards extinction.

CAIR on Hugh:

"He went on to recommend that western nations be "Islam-proofed the way a house is child-proofed," compared Muslims to Nazis and urged that they be boycotted..."

Dang! I knew there was a reason I like Hugh so much. Remind me to send him a birthday gift.
:D

Good going, Mr. Spencer. We're all proud of you.

CAIR-bear... love it Shy Guy. Can I use that?

Robert, Islam cannot stand to have the truth told about them or their false prophet. This is an attempt by CAIR to muzzle you and limit the free speech of every contributor to this board. God bless you for standing up to these heathen Mohammedans and not being cowed into submission.

One day CAIR will be exposed as the lying sack of cr@p it is, largely thanks to Mr. Spencer.

If the Temple of the Arts wishes to invite one of these nazi animals for an opposing point of view, I suggest they frisk the bastard before letting him in, and don't let him handle any religious books.

Todd -- maybe your heart is in the right place, maybe it isn't -- I can't quite tell... But if you could learn to form complete sentences, it would be a tremendous step in the right direction, and possibly even open up the possibility that you could eventually get a scholarship!

Author: Sebastian Vilar Rodrigues

I was walking peacefully on a street in Barcelona and sudenly i had a shaking wakening vision:EUROPE died in Auschwitz.
We killed 6 milion Jews and exchanged them with 20 milion Mulims.In Auschwitz we burned,culture,usefull thinking,talent,creativity.We exterminated a choosen nation,really choosen because that nation cultivated reall big things,that changed the world for good.The contribution of that nation is in every aspect of life,science,trade,and specialy they was the conscience of the world.Those were the people we burned in Auschwitz.And under the false coverage of humanism,because we wanted to prove to ourself and the world that we have been healed and recovered from that illness (mentaly)we opened our gates(Europe)to 20 milion muslims who entered claiming they want a better life.They bringed lazines,extremism,non tolerance to our and other religions,crime,powerty that comes from unwilingness to work,to integrate,and provide their families in pride and honor as we do.They turned our beautifull cities in Spain to a 3d world cities,ghetos drowning in dirth and crime.Locked in their apartments,compliment of the hosting country,they hide and plot murder and destruction of the innocent ppl of the hosting country.Thats how we in our everlasting shame we made a bad bargain,exchanging culture with fanatic heatred,inteligence withretardness and evil power.We exchanged a peacefull population of the European Jews and their contribution to a better future for their children,their will to life with all their migth because life is sacred,with those wo have a death wish,those wo seek death as a major achivment a goal they have to reach for themself andothers,to our children and theirs too.
What a dreadfull mistake you made poor miserable EUROPE???

PS My translation migth be poor so you will have to excuse me!!Thank you

CAIR? A muslim will never admit that he is wrong,thats why they are so powerfull.Always crying discrimination all over the world,how poor they are and helpless.1.3 bilion muslim with all the reaches in the world(oil)but only a few who really enjoy it,stealing from the poor,letting them live and die poor,iliterate,and stupid.Always in the name of the Quran,learning to destroy what others have build in hard work.Robert i salute you for your site.GBY

Congradulations Robert, you have CAIR and Islam on the run. Besides the energy they waste harassing you can't be used for terrorist actions. I look for the day that CAIR will be branded as an Islamic terrorist organization, their leaders arrested, tried and convicted, and the organization closed.

Spencer and company MUST be doing something right. Why else would the islamists ... cair?

With any luck, CAIR will publicize many, many more of Hugh's excellent pieces and this web site will reach many others who find themselves starved for a bit of sanity in the media.

From CAIR’s press release:

“Other anti-Muslim comments on the Jihad Watch website include:
"Islam strips its followers of all aspects of their identity and in short converts them into killer-Zombies."
* "Islam, the preferred religion of criminals."
* "If Mohammad were alive today and spouting his 'new' message from God in today's media he would be identified and branded as the lunatic that he was and be jailed or hospitalized."

From Rumoret’s post at 5:16:

“Khomeini's speech on the day of celebration of the birth of Muhammad: 1981…

The prophet has [had] sword to kill people..Our [Holy] Imams were quite military men. All of them were warriors. They used to wield swords; they used to kill people. We need a Khalifa who would chop hands, cut throat, stone people in the same way that the messenger of God used to chop hands, cut throats, and stone people. In the same way that he massacred the Jews of Bani Qurayza because they were a bunch of discontent people. If the Prophet used to order to burn a house or exterminate a tribe that was justice.”

Khomeini’s statement is utterly extraordinary! He told the truth about Islam. The presumably egregious “anti-Muslim” JW comments that CAIR objects to are simply acknowledging PRECISELY the truth that Khomeini spoke about, when he described the actions of Islam’s violent founder and prophet! Was Khomeini “anti-Muslim”?

CASE EFFING CLOSED!!

Islam has far more bad PR to worry about.

Muslims are up in arms about cartoons of Mohammed, and Robert Spencer's truth-telling, but can't be bothered to try to cut down on their body count.

Robert and Hugh,

You're taking some flack for being honest. The only way CAIR can get away with this mock-scolding is that the general public is still uneducated about what the Islamic doctrines say. Can you sue CAIR for slander? Islamophobia has to be an unreasonable disproportionate fear of Islam, and I don't believe that CAIR has established that either Robert or Hugh has been unreasonable or disproportionate in their concern.

Why didn't CAIR quote the Koran to show that they are not infidelophobes? Oh yeah, because it says...

disbelievers (infidels): are “worst of created beings” (98:6—refers specifically to disbelievers among Christians, Jews, and idolators), are “miscreants” (2:99, 24:55), are the worst beasts in Allah’s sight (8:55), are “a folk without intelligence”/ “most ignorant” (8:65, 6:111), “evil” is upon them (16:27), evil (2:91, 2:99), liars/they lie (2:10, 9:42, 16:39, 16:105, 59:11), the “wrong-doers” (2:254, 5:45), on the side of the devil (Satan) and are fighting for him (4:76-77); “enemy” and “perverted” (63:4); “wicked” (80:42, 9:125); hypocrites, i.e., those who only pretend to be religious (4:61); losers who are deceived by Allah (2:6), and deceived by Satan (4:60); have a “diseased heart” (2:10, 9:125); are ill (84:20); are “guilty” for disbelieving (45:31, 83:29); deaf, dumb, and blind, and have no sense (2:171); have no sense (5:103); their fathers were unintelligent and had no knowledge or guidance (2:170, 5:104); Allah assigns them devils for protecting friends (7:27); they choose devils for protecting friends (7:30); disgraced lives (22:9); “losers” (7:179); foolish and liars (7:66), liars and losers (58:18-19), false pride and schism (38:2); are partisan against Allah (25:55).

It seems to me CAIR has two options.
1. Accept the validity of the Koran and admit that they are infidelophobes.
2. Deny the validity of the Koran and say nice things about disbelievers, thereby losing the "infidelophobe" label, becoming apostates of Islam in the process.

The hate crime that wasn't.

CAIR's dishonesty continues. They're still running that bogus hate-crime story about the Sikh teen (the story is dated June 1st). The youth fabricated the story about being attacked. (Note: To use the link below. The CAIR page will come up, scroll down and click on "Go to the site". Then on the site page scroll down to "CIVIL RIGHTS" and "CAIR-CAN: CANADIAN MUSLIMS...")
http://www.cair-net.org/default.asp?Page=articleView&id=1601&theType=NR

Mr. Spencer,

There isn't an iota of hate in anything you have spoken or written.

CAIR, on the other hand, is a deceptive, Wahhabist, propaganda organization that has had some of its' members have been indicted and jailed for terrorism.

Let's see, who is the greater danger? Robert Spencer, the truth teller, or CAIR, the taqiyya masters?

Alas, the truth is dangerous for thinkers like those in CAIR.

America, and indeed the world, are slowly waking up to the reality of the world situation.

Keep talking CAIR...

I know this does not belong here, but I wanted to share this (quite funny) link :)

http://www.institut-integration.be/

In few years, hopefully few months, it will be an honor to be "whatever" they call. That's when their book is criminalized like dopes.

Keep up the fantastic work. I make this site a daily read and frequently seek out additional reference/source material as suggested.

Today I began reading my copy of Dr. Bostom's book, "The Legacy of Jihad". In Dr. Bostom's acknowledgment statement he thanks his family as he writes:

"May Esther and Yonah and their children thrive in world where the devasting institution of jihad has been acknowledged, renounced, dismantled, and relegated forever to the dustbin of history by Muslims themsleves."

May ALL the worlds children thrive in a jihad-free reality.

I got a really good chuckle out of CAIR's comments. The best part of course is (as mentioned above by (NonProphet16 and Mad_Jack) . . . free advertising via CAIR. . . poetic justice!

Hey! All Muslims out there who are visiting this site thanks to CAIR'S free publicity!

PLEASE DO be sure to stop by Ali Sina's wonderful and internationally acclaimed site, faithfreedom.org.

Take his challenge! He is offering $50,000 dollars to anyone who can disprove his claims about Muhammad:

Challenge to Muslims! $50,000 prize!

Be sure to check out his debates and articles while visiting. You won't regret it! And thank YOU CAIR for providing the the free publicity for both Jihadwatch and faithfreedom.org. Very much appreciated! Muchos gracias!

I know a lot of you do not support Le Pen, but the patriotism of this ad is inspiring. Maybe we can just enjoy the hope that France will wake up and resist the Paristinians. (I don't know anything about Le Pen, and am American...so I am not endorsing him, just the rousing music!)
http://www.frontnational.com/

DAMN! Free speech IS bad for Islam!

Hey CAIR, please show me one Islamic country that has equal rights for it's women?

Uhh..hello?

NO BURKAS FOR ME, THANK YOU!!!

(A free copy of the Quran may be ordered or sponsored at: www.ExplodeTheEarth.org )

COOL ! ! !

/scratchin' Charmin off the shoppin' list

- - -

- - - -

CAIR is the Enemy, to the core

deport them all, yesterday

I may sound like a broken record, if anyone listens to me anyway.

But this is important so I'm going to keep repeating it.

What CAIR does is file SLAPP (Google it) litigation against critics, to silence any free speech they don't agree with, and to limit public participation in democratic debate. Whether the issue is zoning, criticism, hiring, prayer accomodations, cartoons, or literature, the Islamic legal playbook has only one play.

SLAPP suits should be named as such in any responsive pleading. Show the history of similar SLAPP suits by CAIR (and similar groups), particularly their suit against anti-CAIR (cut down to one count, from several, which CAIR will lose if it goes to trial anyway).

Islamic harrassment litigation is becoming serious abuse of the legal process.

Oh - and for all Muslims stopping by, when you check out Ali Sina's well-known website faithfreedom.org, be sure to check out his FAQ's. Read every single one of them (70 in all):

Frequently Asked Questions, Objections and Comments

Again - CAIR - Merci Beaucoups!

Well Robert, your comments section is a lively part of this web-site and has spawned its own growing community.

The down side is you will continue to be held accountable for words that are not your own, unfair as that may be.

Someone on another site stated that fundamentalist christianity was a greater contemporary threat to global civilization than Islamofascism, quoting the 'mote and beam' scripture as a means to chastize me for what he mistakenly saw as an ideologically based oversight on my part (this view is common among many Americans who have - in most cases quite reasonably - rebelled against their fundamentalist upbringing, but who have no comparable personal experiences of Islamofascist intolerance and repression).

I answered him thusly:

I take issue with the 'mote and beam' characterization of my position because I view the contemporary Islamofascist memeset as currently more dangerous than the Fundamentalist Christian one, for a number of reasons.

1) Recent History
The lion's share of mass-killing terrorist attacks in the past quarter-century have been perpetrated by these people, and not Fundy Christians (although they, too, are on my "Danger, Will Robinson!" list). 9/11, London, Beslan, Bali, Madrid, the USS Cole, the Khobar Towers...the list could go on and on.

2) Fundamentalist Literalism
Christians believe that the Bible was written by human beings, under Holy inspiration, while the official position of Islam is that the Qu'ran (literally, the Recitation) was dictated to Muhammed by the Archangel Gabriel, and is word-for-word accurate and correct for all time. Thus, while there is a reasonable split between Fundamentalist Christians, who take the Bible literally, and the rest of Christians, who see parable, poetry metaphor, simile, era-linked prejudices, contradictions and inaccuracies in the Bible, no such split is officially possible within Islam. All Muslims are expected to submit to the literalist stance; in fact, Islam translates as Submission.

3) More Violent Character
While there are a half-dozen or so peace-and-tolerance passages contained within the Qu'ran, there are also more than a hundred vicious and violent passages to be found there. People say, well, the Old Testament is itself to a significant degree a 'testament' to divinely sanctioned brutality, and this is indeed true. However, most of that brutality was superseded by the more peaceful and tolerant New Testament, while the Qu'ran is divided into the Meccan and the Medinan sections. The Meccan section, which came first, when Muhammed was militarily weak and was forced to placate his enemies, contains all of the peace-and-tolerance passages, while the Medinan section, which contains many (although not all) of the brutal and violent passages, was written later, and supercedes the more moderate Meccan section. It is as if, in the Bible, the Old Testament came later and superceded the New; if this were so, Christianity would be (even) much more brutal and intolerant than it is now.

4) The Examples of the Respective Primary Protagonists
Jesus only got violent once in the Bible, when he whipped the money-changers. Mainly, he preached faith, love of one's neighbors, and nonviolence. When one of his disciples raised a sword against and cut the ear off of one of the people sent to arrest him, he supposedly put it back on. Muhammed, on the other hand, was historically a warrior and guerilla fighter. His life was circumscribed by military conquest. The hadiths, which are records of occurrences in and commentaries on the life of Muhammed, are nearly as important as the Qu'ran itself to them.

5) The Confrontation with Modernity
Christianity began to behaviorally moderate and domesticate itself around 500 years ago, due to the effects that the Reformation and the Enlightenment had upon it. Islam has yet to go through this confrontation; it is only now just beginning for them. However, in the present era, with the advent of global anonymous communications and travel, and with easy access available to both the materials needed to construct WMD's and the knowledge needed to properly employ these materials, this is a particularly dangerous time for fanatics to lash out from the growing pains. Giordano Bruno conceived of relativity 350 years before Einstein and was burned as a heretic for it, and rockets (fireworks) were already known to Europe by then, due to Marco Polo's sojourn in China; think of what it would have been like if the medieval world had had the option of ballistic thermonuclear conflagration (not to mention genetically engineered plagues and mass-produceable deadly chemical compounds). There is the added factor that one of the Muslim death-penalty heresies translates as 'innovation' (Islamists are quite willing to appropriate death-dealing technology while rejecting the science behind it - a Pakistani 'scientist' actually wrote a paper that advocated solving his country's energy problems by harnessing djinn (genie) power!); thus it can be dangerous for Muslims to publicly embrace novel concepts - and this will only make it more difficult for Muslim adaptation of include accommodation to other perspectives rather than to simply be comprised solely of the Borgian assimilation, subjugation or elimination of all of their vectors.

6) The Evolution of Universality and Intolerance in Totalizing Memeplexes
Mind viruses are unlike the viruses that plague our bodies. If a physically infectious disease kills its host too quickly, that host cannot serve as an infection vector (which is why AIDS is so much more of a global threat than the Ebola virus - the long, symptom-free yet contagious incubation period). This is also why deadly diseases demonstrate the historical propensity to become slower killers as time goes on. However, a different survival strategy presents itself for totalizing mind-viruses, which MUST be cognitively rather than physically communicated, and thus, if they are elaborate and/or involve significant behavioral changes, difficult to contract under the radar of one's attention: to kill and/or enslave all those who RECOGNIZE the attempted dissemination (proselytizing) and REFUSE to be infected (part of these memetic memesets is invariably the inculcation of the desire and/or duty to infect others - this is how they propagate). This eliminates competition for cognitive residence from alternative memeplexes (the dead cannot communicate their competing vectors). Unlike physical diseases, where people may be infected with multiple differing phages simultaneously (like measles AND the flu), a totalizing memeplex must have SOLE possession of its niche, or it cannot be said to possess it at all. And in fact, to reject concersion to Islam is considered by Islamofascists to be an insult and attack upon it, punishable by death.

Now, remembering that the historical function of tribal religion has been to enhance group cooperation and cohesion, thus giving religious tribes an advantage in warfare against tribes with less mutual committment and more individualism (and most likely the prehistorical function, too - thus setting up a group selection which would tend to reproductively favor those who were increasingly susceptible to infection by religious memeplexes), let's take a quick look at the evolution of universality and intolerance in Patriarchal Monotheism.

The memeplex of Judaism originally involved a divine gift of a particular parcel of land to a particular chosen people - Israel for the Jews (although, lately, converts to Judaism, although not sought, are accepted from evey racial and ethnic classification). Thus the parameters for the growth of the Jewish memeplex were set by the nature of the memeplex itself - only within ethinc jews, who were only promised dominion over historical Israel (most Zionists still think this way).

However, with the evolution of Christianity from Judaism, the ethnic imperative and the geographical rootedness were pruned off, and all one had to do was to accept the memeplex. This allowe Christianity to spread to all sorts of ethnicities, and for them to take control of previously non-Christian lands, as their demographics grew to majority within them. It also had the advantage of spreading the genetic sacrifice idea beyond a tribe, so that multiple tribes sharing the same memeplex could band together and both protect each other and cooperate in the confrontation of common enemies (a feature that the Roman Empire put to conscous use when they adopted Christianity as the state religion of the Roman Empire). However, Christianity was written so it could be disseminated via persuasion - the Great Charter, which comprises the Christian memeplex's infection module, reads "Go ye therefore and TEACH all nations". Of course, the construction of this module implies the conviction that the vector is offering a gift of knowledge to the ignorant, and for this reason many have been historically forced to adopt Christianity 'for their own good', even when they were too (willfully or otherwise) ignorant to recognize what their own good was, and sometimes at the cost of their mortal bodies, if in the process their immortal souls were saved.

Still the language of Christianity's proselytization module is persuasional rather than coercive, and this left room for the development of tolerance for other faiths, even while missionaries continue to be perpetually funded to 'spread the Good Word'.

This is a weakness that the evolution into Islam has exploited. The Muslim memeplex explicitly substitutes coercion for persuasion. It is quite precise in what may and may not be done: all 'People of the Book' - that is, Jews and Christians (and I suppose Zoroastrians - they have a single holy book called the Zend Avestra of Zarathustra)- have the option to a) convert to Islam, b) be put to death, or c) live in Dhimmitude, a serfic, subservient state somewhere between slavery and second-class citizenship, characterized by less civil rights, the fact that any Muslim's word will always be legally favored over theirs in courts of Shari'a law, and the payment of a perpetual monetary tribute known as the jizya. For all the rest - Buddhist, Taoists, Hindus, Pagans and Atheists - the options are only two: convert or die.

Islam officially divides the globe into two camps; Dar-el-Islam (the World of Islam) and Dar-el-Harb (the World of War). This stance entails the conviction that the only means by which final global peace may be attained is the total elimination of the Dar el Harb, and the establishment of a Global Muslim Caliphate ruled by Shari'a law. Those who choose to embark upon Jihad (actually, it is described in the Qu'ran as a duty rather than as a choice just like Christian witnessing is in the Bible) and are killed (martyred) while engaging in it, are Qu'ranically assured of a Paradise in which they may perpetually and guiltlessly enjoy practically all of the pleasures that are religiously forbidden to living Muslims; those who live are Qu'ranically permitted to take possession of the spoils of war, be they the property or the women of the conquered and/or slain infidels. This stance is, of course, patently hegemonistic and militantly imperialistic, and becomes even more appealing to poor male Muslim youth, when they see their chances of having their own (appealing) wife as negligible (since the more wealthy Muslims are religiously free to marry as many as four of them each - as long as they can financially support them all). When one takes a look at the historical spread of Islam, primarily by coercion and conflict, from its inception in the Arabian Peninsula some 1300 years ago to its reach from Spain to the Philippines today, and one discovers that, of the forty-five military conflicts extant in the world today, Muslims are fighting on one or both sides of them all, it would appear that this particular module possesses great expansionistic efficacy.

Supporting this memetic module are some others, such as the doctrine that all humans are naturally born as Muslims, and that those who profess other beliefs have fallen into apostasy (and thus must be rescued from their error or suffer the dire consequences), and the dictum that people are free to convert TO Islam - in fact, as we have seen, the 'inducements' are quite formidable - but that to convert FROM Islam to anything else (or, in the case of atheists and agnostics, to nothing) is a religious crime for which the punishment of death is prescribed. It is also better for one's assimilational purposes if one's infidel target is kept in the dark. Thus, Muslims are religiously free to both deceive infidels as to their intentions regarding them (taqiyya) and to misdirect their attention from those intentions(kitman), in the interests of the greater good - that is, in the interests of the expansion of the Ummah (the fellowship of the true believers).

Now, I'm not saying that all Muslims, or even a majority of them, are inexorably drawn from live-and-let-live tolerance to Mujaheddin Jihadism in the service of the annihilation of the Dar el Harb and the establishment of the Global Caliphate (Daniel Pipes estimates the number at around 15%), but the vast majority those who are not so drawn are very quiet, because the message contained in the memeplex of Islam supports not them, but the militants, and they are quite reasonably frightened of suffering the Righteous Retribution of the Violent Faithful should they dare to attempt to speak out in dissent (Some exceptions are Salman Rushdie, Ayaan Hirsi Ali, Irshad Manji, Taslima Naslim, and Ibn Warraq, these brave souls continue to suffer for their courage and integrity, and many of their outspoken brethren have been killed).

Now, briefly, let us look at the particular strain which is presently so globally troubling.

Imaam Muhammad Ibn Abdul Wahhab was born in and lived in eighteenth century Arabia (1703-1792), and promulgated the idea that Islam had fallen away from its seventh century roots, the Edenic era when Muhammed and the Four Great Caliphs (Abu Bakr, Umar, Uthman and Ali) succeeded each other, and needed to return to them. This involved a Puritanical purging of all non-Muslim nfluences, the return of draconian enforcement of religious edicts against infidels, and the toughening of restrictions upon women. Wahhabism subsequently spread throughout most of the Arabian Peninsula and gained significant footholds beyond, but concentrated itself primarily upon the peninsula itself, as the defender of the purity of the faith in Muhammed's birth land, the Land of the Two Mosques. In the early 20th century, the House of Saud brokered a deal with the Wahhabists, and Saudi Arabia was born.

Sayyid Qutb was a Wahhabist born in Egypt (1906-1966). He traveled to the US, and sojourned there between 1948 and 1950. This experience shocked and disgusted him. He was horrified by the presence of uppity and voting women, freeddom of religion and thought, widespread substance use and rampant sexual licentiousness. He then put forth the idea that the US was the fount of Jahiliyya (a word roughly translatable as pre-Musim Paganism), and, as such, was a danger to Islam and must be forcibly subjected to Shari'a rule. He did not view the US as a military threat, but rather contended that its various freedoms and vices were slatternly temptations that could seduce the faithful away from the true path. Thus, for the good of both the faith and of all humankind, the US as it was must be destroyed, and Mulim piousness enforced there. He later generalized this view to include, forst Europen, and later all non-Muslim societies.

Notice that, without Qutb, Wahhabism would have remained directed inwards, and without Wahhab, Qutb would not have had a pious and puritanical Islam with which to compare and contrast the US culture which he encountered. Together, their contributions combine to create the present Al Qaedan stance that the entire globe must be subjugated to a religious regimen that consciously holds itself in the seventh century. Interestingly enough, the head of Al Qaeda, Usama Bin Laden, came from Saudi Arabia (like Wahhab), while Al Qaeda's chief ideologue, Zawahiri, came from Egypt (like Qutb).

Considering all of these points taken together, I must respectfully disagree with your contention that, in the present age, Fundamentalist Christianity is more of a threat than Radical Islamism.

PS: Do not think that this is a racist stance which I am taking; I am expressing dismay at the propagation of a violent, virulent memeset that may cognitively infect any racial or ethnic classification, and trying to figure out what can be said and/or done to persuade Muslims to refuse to embrace it. In fact, there are quite a few non-Muslim Arabs, and the majority of Muslims are themselves not Arabs - the most populous Muslim nations are Malaysia and Indonesia, and their populations are East Asian, not Arab). Likewise, I am not criticizing Islam alone or in its entirety; the problem we face and the task set before us is to gain enough understanding of the workings of the Islamofascist memeplex to be able to memetically counter the propensity, a propensity particularly inherent in the Islamic memeplex but also present in the memeplexes of the other Patriarchal Monotheisms, to facilitate the spawning of intolerant and murderous mutational variants, such as, in the case of Islam, the Wahhab/Qutb Al Qaedan strain.

Islam is just playing Al-lah's favorite tune: "5 Billion People Screaming as the Planet Goes Dark."

Everyone KNOWS that CAIR is a front group for terrorist networks that slaughter innocent people, non-Muslim and otherwise, without provocation or concern. So why should we care what they think? I don't.

It's not necessary to CARE about CAIR.

Personally I think the 'mujahideen at CAIR' were among those responsible for 9-11.

p.s.-Thank you for this FANTASTIC website, Mr. Spencer. (I know we don't agree on much, however).

What a chuckle as many high placed personnel in CAIR have turned out to be TERRORISTS! There, I've mentioned the dread un PC word - Terrorists and MUSLIM TERRORISTS too.As for these Moon worshipping MO cretins who behave and want to remain in the 7th century, here is a message for you.HACK INTO OUR SITES LIKE YOU HACK OFF HEADS OF INFIDELS,WHINE,MOAN,LIE AS YOUR HOLY BOOK TELLS YOU TO DO IN THE SERVICE OF ALLAH, BUT WE WILL NEVER GIVE UP UNTIL THE LIKES OF CAIR AND THEIR MINIONS ARE EXPOSED FOR WHAT THEY ARE ...

So CAIR doesnt like it when the truth is exposed..

I am an Infidel (a christian one) and PROUD of it..

I noticed that Islam never CARES about human rights as the islamic fanatics are
Mass raping the women in the sudan.
Killing civilians with bus bombs
Blowing up Trains
Be-heading Civilians.
Butchering Jews who were there 1500 years before Mohammed was even BORN...

So i will tell you my rights..
I have
The RIGHT TO be FREE from Islamic Butchers.
The RIGHT TO be FREE from Islamic Genocide.
The RIGHT TO be FREE from Islamic Suicide bombs.
The RIGHT TO be FREE from Islamic Rapists.
The RIGHT TO be FREE from Islamic Be-Heading.
The RIGHT TO be FREE from Islamic Propaganda.
The RIGHT TO be FREE from Islamic Jizra TAX
The RIGHT TO be FREE from Islamic Intimidation
The RIGHT TO be FREE from Islamic RULES.

I will NOT Bown down to or in ANY other way
worship the FALSE god of ISLAM...
PERIOD...

Write that down on a Koran and SMOKE it...

"It is as if, in the Bible, the Old Testament came later and superceded the New; if this were so, Christianity would be (even) much more brutal and intolerant than it is now."

Posted by: Salamantis at November 8, 2005 09:33 PM

From this, we would assume that adherents to Judaism (who believe in the Old Testament) would be more brutal and intolerant than Christians (who believe in the New Testament).

The real difference is the interpretation of texts. Whereas the Old Testament records historical battles and gives religious edicts to battle certain groups - later leaders were able to understand the underlying morality and sought out morality internally. Thus, they were able to conveniently "lose all records" of who the word Amalack refers to and no longer seek out such battles.

The New Testament had never undergone the same inner sight, resulting in "undesirable elements" (, such as the fanatical desire to convert the Jews to believing in Jesus and the acts carried out towards such a goal,) that lingered within the Christian tradition.

Similarly, no such interprative tradition has taken place among readers of the Koran. That is the real issue. Islam has the POTENTIAL to be the religion of peace, if it is approached correctly (and properly edited).

"The New Testament had never undergone the same inner sight, resulting in "undesirable elements" (, such as the fanatical desire to convert the Jews to believing in Jesus and the acts carried out towards such a goal,) that lingered within the Christian tradition."

Posted by: Nqamah Ben Mavet at November 8, 2005 10:12 PM

I disagree with that statement, as the age of enlightenment has surely taught us the value of inquisitive approaches to texts. You can't be serious that a similar change has not taken place in many of the different forms of Christianity today. (As a former Christian) I find such a statement to be very upsetting.

My apologies to anyone I might have offended.

Hi
CAIR is spending the wahabi money on giving out free qurans right. Why dont all the kaafirs who are aware of lies and deciets of CAIR get all the Quran copies so that they dont end up with naive americans.
Please order your copy today!

Chutzpah is an understatement.

This analogous to the National Socialists in Germany or USA after WWII wanting to speak in a Synagogue after Wiesenthal presents the Nazi crimes in WWII.

If the Jews in CA do not see who are the true followers of Adolf Hitler today, they are totally morons and do not deserve to be Jewish.

Richard

Chair and other Muslim apppologists do not seem to grasp, is the concept of Western Thought.. that is our Freedoms, particulary "Freedom of Speech". If there any Muslims reading this.. for you who have fled your violent countries that are filled with poverty. you want to come and live in the Western world, then "You" must abide by our customs esp. our hard fought for Freedoms! They want to be able to practice their relgion in a tolerant West, then must also accept our culture! If they do not like it,,my advice is to go back home. For the liberal media who are the appologist for this cult, they want equate all religions as equal,and cultures. Do you see droves of Westerners moving to the Arab Muslim mid east? No!! Therefore l conclude our culture to be superior!

"This CAIR press release is yet another example of that organization's attempt to stifle free speech about Islam and terrorism in the United States, and to intimidate into silence those who dare to step out of line. Well, they got National Review. And they got Fox's 24. And they got ABC. But they're not going to get me."

Right-On Mr. Spencer--no Dhimmis here!

CAIR is fast becoming the Islamic ACLU in that:
1. It knows intimidation works
2. It attacks it opponents
3. It hides behind doublespeak

The ACLU is already the most anti-American, anti-G-d organization in this country, with deep pockets and influence on many benches.

G-d help us if CAIR ever rises to such power.
They learned intimidation works because we let it happen.

Here's an idea for a Muslim speaker at the synagogue: Walid Shoebat. He's already spoken at many synagogues across the country.

BTW- "Islamophobia": We're not afraid of Islam, we just can't STAND Islam!

I'm a big fan of this site and read it every day.

I don't think there should be any direct reaction to CAIR because they don't deserve serious consideration, but I do think that some comments on this site undermine what you are trying to do. There are some blogs with wild and outrageous commentary that seem to fit the overall freewheeling attitude of the site, but JIhadWatch is too serious, too important to be tainted by ill-thought, poorly stated and sometimes downright racists comments.

I'm sure it is impossible to monitor these threads but sometimes I think they damage your credibility with people who are not more familiar with the site.

Dear Mr. Spencer,

Have no anxiety at all, but in everything, through prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, make your requests known to God. Then the peace of God that surpasses all understanding will guard your hearts and minds in Christ Jesus.

Like St. Paul and St. Peter, you are doing important work in spreading the word. And like them, you will be protected until your work is done.

Everyone that believes in God, please, get down on your knees tonight and ask God to keep Robert Spencer safe. We need him now and we need the information he shares and the leadership he presents. This evil that we are facing is not an insurmountable obstacle. But we need to take a look at history and learn from it.

Did you know that in the battle of Lepanto Don Juan of Austria led the opposition to a Moslem force that was overwhelming in it's numbers and yet could not withstand the force of the Rosary that Don Juan and his forces prayed. The Moslems were soundly defeated and they can be again, but we have to know what we are up against and who the enemy is and only then will we know what weapon will be most effective in facing the most challenging foe that the world has ever had to deal with. We have met this foe before but with their access to technology, instant communication and seemingly neverending, fellow traveling, downright deceitful disinformation, we have our work cut out for us.

I pray for you, that God will keep you safe and that you will continue to impart your wisdom and courage to the rest of us.

Islam is incompatible with any Western nation.

No citizens should be allowed to be Muslims in any Western Nation because the foundation of our nation is based on values that are incompatible with Islam.

No Muslim can be trusted to cherish, defend and love nations like the USA, France, Denmark, Ireland or Italy. It is an absurd to think they could.

Since Muslims have their paramount allegiance in arabia and their holy places towards which they face in prayer 5 times a day in aeabia, that is away from estern countries, they cannot be citizens of integrity of any Western country.

Their hearts will be always divided.
And "No man can serve two masters..."

Despite its shrill cries CAIR has no 'locus standi' in the US. Its only purpose is to breed traitors. In the worst case CAIR should be prosecuted for having a criminal agenda and in the best case made redundant.

Islamic harrassment litigation is becoming serious abuse of the legal process.

A good explanation Beagle - but it's more like "disagreement litigation" if you ask me.

People say, well, the Old Testament is itself to a significant degree a 'testament' to divinely sanctioned brutality, and this is indeed true. However, most of that brutality was superseded by the more peaceful and tolerant New Testament,

I might add: Christians do not follow the Old Testament. The Old Testament exists to show us just how necessary the New Testament is.

The Quran instructs the current modern day follower to utilize violence.

The Old Testament instructed those in that day to utilize force to overcome immorality.

The New Testament instructs us that this world is a very temporary place.

The bottom line is, if someone is breaking into my house I'm going to do something about it.

BTW- "Islamophobia": We're not afraid of Islam, we just can't STAND Islam!

To borrow a phrase from Seinfeld: Islamocantstandya

Be safe, Mr. Spencer! Exercising your freedom of speech in this matter is a dangerous, fatal thing.
By speaking the truth about Islam, you have bit the bullet and joined the league of Salman Rushdie, Theo Van Gogh and Taslima Nasreen. So stay safe! And hope you're never muzzled.

Imo, not being rabid, but simply and calmly putting facts forth (and up for challenge) is the best way of convincing people who're unaware about the danger this ideology poses to humanity. Factual events, unadorned and unexaggerated are what finally convinced me, not speculation and innuendo like that earthquake item yesterday. Jihadwatch does get a bit too rabid at times which must drive the neutral ones away. http://www.faithfreedom.org is a good site to emulate, I think.

Time to hook up to the hivemind and reprogram for the 5th time in the day NOT.. Not yet anyway. And I hope I'm never forced to.

Mr Spencer you and many of the posters on this site are the exemplars of moderation, truth and balance.

We stand behind you 100%, perhaps CAIR's interest in Jihadwatch is a result of this site's and movement's great and growing success.

Every single person that has taken me up on my suggestion to visit this sight has become one more who understands the truth about Islam and the likes of CAIR.

As Jihadwatch and your success grows expect more comments from CAIR, that may be a good thing, by focusing attention to us they will help us grow.

While CAIR is busy trying to impose their brand of censorship on America, our State Department is busy promoting CAIR in the US and the world. Someone want to tell me why Condi Rice's State Department is in the business of promoting the good works of CAIR?
---------------------------------------- ------
From the link:
http://usinfo.state.gov/mena/Archive/2005/Oct/12-579520.html

Ibrahim Hooper, a spokesman for the Washington-based Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR), said this year’s Ramadan has become a month of charity and giving more than ever before because of natural disasters such as Hurricane Katrina and the massive earthquake in Pakistan and parts of India and Afghanistan.

“The benefits of Ramadan are being better understood because those who are fasting can appreciate the suffering of the victims of these natural disasters, many of whom are hungry and without shelter,” Hooper said.

In the wake of the September 11, 2001, terrorist attacks, American Muslims are also eager to explain Islam to other Americans and the holy month of Ramadan offers many opportunities to share.

CAIR, the largest Islamic civil liberties and advocacy group in the United States, is conducting a nationwide “Sharing Ramadan” outreach effort to invite non-Muslims to learn more about the values of Islam.

CAIR is also sponsoring a campaign called “Explore the Quran” by distributing free Qurans to non-Muslims who want to understand Islam better. Those who request a Quran receive a hardcover book with an English translation next to the Arabic on each page.

Must be this site is doing somthing right, the American way. Nothing wrong with free thought, even if a idea is way off it still can be balanced against others in a open forum, everyone can speak his mind.

This site is a breath of what is needed in the media, pure honest talk from many different points of view.

A very needed site, my thanks to JW for being there.

If CAIR is offended by what is voiced here, they can "turn the channel".

I wonder how many synagogues want to have a
CAIR spokesman speak there.

"Oh yeah, monkeys and swine is really a compliment in Arabic! No need to get offended.
No, that saying is that at the end of days the
rocks and trees will say "Here is a Jew, offer
friendship"".

Disgusting bunch of lying scum. I don't CAIR.

I wonder how many synagogues want to have a
CAIR spokesman speak there.

"Oh yeah, monkeys and swine is really a compliment in Arabic! No need to get offended.
No, that saying is that at the end of days the
rocks and trees will say "Here is a Jew, offer
friendship"".

Disgusting bunch of lying scum. I don't CAIR.

*click*

You hear that, Mr. Spencer?

That was the sound of me adding JihadWatch to my favorites list. Trust me, it's a very short list.

Keep up the good work.

>Click

Dude ~

I may not be much of a lawyer, but YOU HAVE GROUNDS TO SUE THEM. Remember - little guys almost always prevail against big gorillas. Defamation [you are NOT a "virulant anti-islam site"] and many other clauses fit right in.

You run a damned fine blog, and frankly, you should take these guys to the cleaners. SHOW THEM just exactly what it means to "play with the matches of libel".

GoatGuy

Mr. Spencer:
As an committed Jihadwatcher, I truly admire your intellectual contributions with your books and website. You have an important role in presenting the truth about Islam to our world today.

We all know that the liberal western press simply won't give us the truth about Islam. Your prophetic voice about Islam is sorely needed to compete with the trumpet blasts of the misinformed western media.

You are a respected intellectual whose own commitment to educating people in the truth about Islam has brought me closer to my love for country (U.S) and my religious faith, Roman Catholicism. Your book Inside Islam: A Guide for Catholics helped me to understand the misconceptions about Islam and educated me about the theological differences between the two faiths. It is my hope and prayer that Muslim societies will some day come to fully accept and know the truth of Jesus Christ as God, not as a prophet.

I read the articles on this website on a daily basis and use them to educate me about what is really happening in the world.

It is of no surprise that CAIR is out to stop the work that you are committed to for the greater good of society. To speak the truth about Islam makes you a target of Islam. This is not a surprise. Consider yourself a success if CAIR doesn't like the work that you are committed to as an intellectual.

I live in a country (U.S) that values freedom of religion and freedom of speech. The jihadwatch website operates because freedom of religion and freedom of speech laws allow it to operate here. There are many people like me who support the work that you do on this website. Although there are some who post vulgar and vicious comments about Islam on this website, I have never attributed them to you.

Keep up the great work with jihadwatch and all your intellectual endeavors.

This website is terrible and it's surprising that it hasn't provoked any attacks on innocent muslims yet. In Israel, this would fall under the Incitement Law and be illegal. You can write what you want within reason. Promoting this type of hate is on the periphery of the law, if not illegal. This is no different from Neo-Nazi webpages that call for death to Jews or some Islamic webpages that call for death to Christians and Jews.

The most disgusting post ever on this website:

"Muslims set fire to innocent woman in France"

Exactly where is the proof that the guilty parties were muslims?? There is none. It was just assumed for the sake of this website without one shread of evidence that this is the case. Now that is unethical.

This website is terrible and it's surprising that it hasn't provoked any attacks on innocent muslims yet. In Israel, this would fall under the Incitement Law and be illegal. You can write what you want within reason. Promoting this type of hate is on the periphery of the law, if not illegal. This is no different from Neo-Nazi webpages that call for death to Jews or some Islamic webpages that call for death to Christians and Jews.

The most disgusting post ever on this website:

"Muslims set fire to innocent woman in France"

Exactly where is the proof that the guilty parties were muslims?? There is none. It was just assumed for the sake of this website without one shread of evidence that this is the case. Now that is unethical.

Ryan,

If this site is so terrible, then go away.

Ryan,
Did you apologize for your previous lies?
It's hard to take liars seriously, so put up
your apology for charging in guns blazing and
accusing Spencer of calling mohammadans rats or
whatever it was your febrile imagination conjured up. Then maybe you can be treated as a non troll.

Ryan,

it's surprising that it hasn't provoked any attacks on innocent muslims yet

Making a film about Islam will get a religious manifesto stabbed in your chest and a partial decapitation. Dating the wrong person will get you stabbed 48 times. Children who want candy will be blown to pieces by suicide bombers in Iraq. Women who step out of line with their Muslim family get acid facials. Politicians who dare to critique Islam need 24 hour guard.

Hmmmm?

Try using more of your brain.

Some people were raised in peaceful, tolerant societies which can absorb as much intellectual banter, insults, even incitement (to use your stupid, inapposite example) as you can throw at them. Muslims get angry and make an international incident over cartoons.

"Ryan" said: This website is terrible and it's surprising that it hasn't provoked any attacks on innocent muslims yet.

This website is informing the world regarding the violent FACTS and ACTS of Islam.

Promoting this type of information is within the periphery of the law.

"Ryan" said: Exactly where is the proof that the guilty parties were muslims??

According to "Ryan" the question of one report now means that all of Islam is safe for the world.

Posting your post repeatedly, now that is unethical. (Of course 15-year-olds still need to brush-up on mouse control)

Hey "Ryan" here's an article for ya: 'Adherents of militant Islam account for some 15-20 percent of the Muslim world, according to Daniel Pipes, an expert on the subject. This means that more than 150 million people are part of the problem. To make matters worse, they hide among the moderates. They don't wear uniforms and rarely identify themselves.' http://www.meforum.org/article/168

Hey "Ryan" learn how to type "Islam" in a google search and take more than 2 minutes to actually study the problem.

P.S. America, Free Speech, Get A Clue.

Ryan's question about the woman set on fire: by all accounts, these riots are being perpetrated predominantly by young Muslim men of North African origin.

Also of interest, according to a French news website, the young men involved in the bus burning (in which the woman was intentionally burned) were wearing Palestinian-type masks, the proud badge of young Muslim rabblerousers the world over:

"les jeunes avaient le visage à moitié masqué par des écharpes, ce qui rendra difficile leur éventuelle identification."

http://news.tf1.fr/news/france/0,,3260144,00.html

That said, perhaps Robert should have titled that particular article with tongue in cheek: "It Must Have Been Non-Muslim Youths Who Set Handicapped Woman on Fire".

this is regarding spencers debate in the frontpage debate -abu khalil or the other guy wrongly mentions India as being 80% Hindu despite 700 years of Islamic rule-pre independence India included present day Islamic Pakistan and Bangladesh-regions that were populated by hindus who were forcibily converted to islam-these regions were then partitioned as lands belonging to muslims-so abu whatever's argument that islam did not harm India is misleading to say the least!

Peace to those who follow the Straight Path,
From my perspective, it's best to stick to the books, the Qur'an, the Torah and the Gospel. That way, any person or org. with a different perpective, can be debated according to the texts and we can leave all the personal comments aside.
Catherine, I'm not asking for help, I'm saying what needs to said.
sheik yer_mami, Allah means the One True God, not the moon god as you assert. The Kaba was built by Abraham and Ishmael, peace be upon them.
Contillion, We Muslims believe that the Torah and the Gospel did exist but presently they do not exist in a pur form. The Bible is not the Word of God, it has been corrupted by God Knows how many hands and the numerous lies and inconsistencies make it impossible for it to be the Word of God. For example, you mention the New Testament as the Word of God, in fact the majority of it was written by "Paul"! In the Old Testament, you have outrageous lies that pass for true stories of the Prophets and the Messengers, peace be upon them all. For example, there's the story that Abraham, peace be upon him, lent his wife to the king for some sheep, of Lot, peace be upon him, being made drunk by his daughters who then had sex with their father (After they'd been saved from the punishment!), of Isiah, peace be upon him, smearing dung all over his body and running around naked, of David, peace be upon him, having a man killed so he could have sex with that man's wife, of Solomon, peace be upon him, dying as an idolater and a disbeliever, every single one of these stories in the Bible, 100% lies, pure fraud. The question then emerges: why would someone lie about the prophets and the messengers, peace be upon them? Think about it. If someone did these things you would think them a criminal or at the very least insane! And yet this is the book of the Christians, (at least the New Testament they claim) and the Jews (the Old Testament). With so many inconsistencies, what can one believe in? The Qur'an mentions the stories of the prophets and the messengers, peace be upon them, and clears them of the falsehood they have been charged with. And the Qur'an is protected by God Himself, no one can change His words, and since the revelation was revealed to Muhammad, peace be upon him, the words have not been changed.
May Allah Guide you all and set your affairs in order,
Abdullah

If this is indeed a peaceful website, why are the comments of "death to islam" not being removed?

So you think the fact that the majority of rioters (not all) are muslim and the perpetrators were wearing ski masks (hmmm... do they only sell those in the middle east or something?) is enough evidence to say that a muslim is guilty of the crime? They are all wearing ski masks. It's not just a muslim thing to want your identiy not known.

"Ryan" said: If this is indeed a peaceful website, why are the comments of "death to islam" not being removed?

If you are indeed concerned about the future security of the country in which you live then why are you acting like there's nothing wrong with Islam?

"Ryan" said: If this is indeed a peaceful website, why are the comments of "death to islam" not being removed?

Since when is death-to-a-hateful-ideology the same as death to some person?

Are you old enough to even be up this late on your own?

"Abdullah" said: ____________ (insert a bunch of crap here.)

The text of the Quran is the most un-loving rigid man-made deceitful brainwashing manipulative violent, harsh, judgemental, biased, racist, hateful, lying false teaching that has ever existed.

Period.

Ryan - stop posting here unless you are going to read ALL OF THE TEXT OF ROBERT'S ARTICLES AND *ALL* OF THE POSTS IN THE FORUMS.

The French (echarpes) does not describe "ski masks" but more accurately "scarves", wrapped around to cover half the face. The only troublemakers who wear these are Muslim males brandishing guns in protest in various parts of the world -- and perhaps also banditos and guerillas in Central America. I doubt the bus-burners outside Paris were the latter.

But as I said, Robert would have been better off employing his sarcastic wit for that particular post.

Also, after reading Robert's posts for over a year now, I'm confident that he would respond in kind to the general evidence of Muslims taking a sincere stand (with no clever loopholes) against all the Islam-inspired violence metastasizing around the globe. So far, Muslims have been outrageously remiss in doing so -- instead spending 99% of their communication skills & energy making scrupulously sure to root out "Islamophobia" and "backlashes".

Non-Muslims around the world have shown astounding restraint so far -- Russians did not go on a rampage against Muslims after the suicide bombings of apartments, the suicide bombing of a rock concert, the mass-murder of children in Beslan; Australians did not go on a rampage against Muslims after two mass-murders of Australian tourists in Bali; Spanish did not go on a rampage against Muslims after the mass-murder in Madrid; Londoners did not go on a rampage against Muslims after 7/7; Dutch did not go on a rampage against Muslims after a Muslim (working as part of a group of Muslims in Holland) shot then tried to saw off the head of a well-known Dutch filmmaker and then at his trial brazenly said he did it for Islam and he is not sorry and he would do it again; Americans did not go on a rampage against Muslims after 911 or after the grotesquely hideous beheading of Nick Berg and others or after the atrociously jubilant and macabre defiling of burnt corpses of Americans in Iraq; Poles did not go on a rampage against Muslims after one of their women was found dismembered naked and gutted in the street in Iraq; Christians in Indonesia or elsewhere did not go on a rampage against Muslims after three Christian girls were beheaded and dumped in the dirt in Indonesia...

Wake up man. The non-Muslims of the world have shown superhuman restraint in the face of these disgusting acts of evil ferocity and hatred around the world.

THE FACTS

Even the dhimmi pewglobal surveys are startling:

Support for Islamic Terrorism

Support for suicide bombings against the U.S.:

Morocco 56% X 33 million = 18.5 million
Jordan 49% X 6 million = 2.9 million
Lebanon 49% X 4 million = 2 million
Pakistan 29% X 162 million = 47 million
Indonesia 26% X 242 million = 62.9 million
Turkey 24% X 70 million = 16.8 million

The total = 150.1 million.

This doesn't even include Iran, Syria, or Egypt, the number could easily DOUBLE.

Therefore the grand total is about 300 MILLION IN FAVOR OF, AND I REPEAT:

Support for suicide bombings against the U.S.

Support for Islamic Terrorism

Oh, and don't forget, it's all our fault. NOT.

- Read the Quran, then toss it off a cliff.

Ryan: "Promoting this type of hate is on the periphery of the law, if not illegal. This is no different from Neo-Nazi webpages that call for death to Jews or some Islamic webpages that call for death to Christians and Jews."

Where do you read Robert Spencer promoting hate on this website?

How ridiculous it is to associate "Muslims set fire to Women in France" with Neo- Nazis webpages. This is not not being intellectually honest Ryan.

It is a fact that the majority of rioters in France are Muslims from N. Africa. It is a moot point to argue anything different. Even the liberal press will acknowledge this as being true. But not Ryan. He knows better than we all do. Even if we show Ryan links with press reports about Muslims youths causing the burning incident, he still won't believe them because they were wearing ski masks.

Ryan would rather distort the truth than face up to the fact that Muslim youths can be murdeous and a threat to society. What a disgrace!

Abdullah sez:

"...sheik yer_mami, Allah means the One True God, not the moon god as you assert. The Kaba was built by Abraham and Ishmael, peace be upon them..."

Any evidence, Slave of Al-Ilha?

"Ryan" is upset that we exist. That Jihad Watch exists. We are like Pelayo's mustard seed, mate! We will turn the tide on the Islamic invasion, we'll turn this absurd spook on its head!

And "Ryan:" Where is your evidence that the thugs who set that poor woman alight were NOT Mohammedans? Have you seen anybody else arrested and sent to the slammer?

By the way: This morning on the news it was reported that the "Muslim World" (as if there was such a thing!) was upset with the infidels because it appears we are suffering from "donors fatigue"- meaning that WE are responsible for Allahs punishment on the bleeding 'believers' in Cashmere.

Nothing to apologize for, "Ryan"- Mohammedans OUT!

I'm not surprised you would take these views Ryan....Abdullah, you comical slave to Allah, get a better idea...those are old and worn out.
By the way...do you guys know each other?

CAIR comes off like that because CAIR is S-CAIR-ED. I can almost feel the leaderships anxiety. They have 31 offices and Saudi money...Robert and Hugh have one office and no(?)money. And CAIR is S-CAIR-ED. Whining like an injured dog.
Complaining like the old woman next door. Gee, I really feel sorry for them...they try so hard and all they get is the agony of defeat. If I was CAIR, I would fold up my tent and steal away in the night. If Allah really knows best he will provide them with a get away car...

"49% of Lebanon supports suicide bombings against the United States"

Odd statistic considering 40% of the country is Christian. Either nearly every muslim supports it or there are a significant number of Arab Christians that support it. Now why would Arab Christians ever support terrorism??

Ryan,

You made a false accusation against Mr. Spencer in your previous posts; that's already been established. Are you going to take responsibility for those reckless comments, and apologize to Spencer and those who post on this site?

In this thread, you said:

"This is no different from Neo-Nazi webpages that call for death to Jews or some Islamic webpages that call for death to Christians and Jews."

This is not true. The vast majority of the people who post here do not call for the extermination of anybody. It is the hard-core Islamists that want a war with non-Muslims, and the question is, Are we going to educate and defend ourselves, or not? (BTW, the hard-core Islamists are making life very miserable for moderate, or secular, or progressive, or nominal Muslims as well).

Rather, the core Islamic texts call for the killing, conversion, or subjugation of all non-Muslims. Have you actually read what the Koran has to say about Jews? Have you read the reports from the Hadith?

From the Hadith.

Mohammad's Final Policy Against the Jews.

A report narrated by a man named Muslim from Abu Hurayrah, the prophet said: “The hour (of the Day of Judgement) will not begin until the Muslims fight the Jews and kill them. A Jew will hide behind a rock or a tree, and the rock or tree will say ‘Oh Muslim, O slave of Allah! There is a Jew behind me, come and kill him!’ –except for the gharqad (bow thorn), for it is one of the trees of the Jews.” (Reported by Muslim, 2922). This passage was also quoted by Osama bin Laden, May 28, 1998, in an interview with John Bell of ABC News.

Hadith:Book 19, Number 4366: Narrated Umar ibn al-Khattab:"Umar heard the Messenger of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) say: 'I will expel the Jews and Christians from the Arabian Penninsula and will not leave any but Muslims.'"

The policy toward the Jews is expulsion from the Arabian Penninsula and, finally, extermination.

From the Koran.

Here's some of what the Koran has to say about
Christians and Jews and Other Religious People:
(They are viewed as unbelievers also, except if they publicly (and presumably privately) switch over to Allah exclusively (i.e., must deny “partners” such as priests, rabbis, monks, Jesus, Mary, Ezra?! (Mohammad claims Jews worship Ezra?!). Note: People of the Book are Christians and Jews.

They (people of the book) disbelieve in Allah and confound truth with falsehood (3:70-3:71). Christians lie when they talk about the son of God (18:4-5).

Jesus taught them compassion and mercy in the Gospels, but Christians turned to monasticism…many of them are evil-livers (57:27).

Fight against them, kill, convert, or subdue them and (only if it is beneficial to Islam) force them to pay a tax that Muslims do not have to pay (9:29-35). If they refuse, kill them.

Condemned to hell/cursed/doomed/bad/evil/turned into swine or apes, etc. (not in order) 2:61, 4:48, 4:50, 4:116, 4:47-52, 4:55, 4:157, 4:160, 5:12-5:13, 5:37, 5:51, 5:53, 5:59-60, 5:72-73, 5:79, 9:29-35, 18:52, 33:26, 59:14, 98:1).

Jews will face Allah’s wrath because they made friendships with those who disbelieve (5:80).

They must convert to believing in Allah only, or else be doomed (2:62-65, 3:85). Note that 3:85 refers explicitly to the Islamic religion as the “Surrender.” Jews are wrong-doers who will face a painful doom unless they believe in Allah (4:160-161).

He who ascribes partners to Allah is lost, as if a bird has snatched him out of the air and taken him away (22:31)

Mohammad says Jews look ugly and they are foolish (62:5). Jews are greedy (2:91), and are evil-livers (5:59).

Allah will mock Christians when they burn in Hell, asking them Where are your partners now? (40:73).

Priests and Rabbis do “evil work” (5:63). Many Jews guilty of evil conduct (5:81). Jews act like Christians when they are around Christians (5:82).

Some of them (people of the scripture) are believers, but most of them are evil-livers (3:110), wretchedness is upon them because they disbelieved, slew the prophets wrongfully, were rebellious and transgressed (3:112).

Muslims won’t get hurt fighting them (the people of the book), who will turn and flee and afterwards will not be helped (3:111)

The Jews and Christians flung the scripture behind their backs and gained evil (3:187)

Christians and Jews who disbelieve scripture are the worst creatures in Allah’s sight (98:6) and will receive hell-fire.

Idolaters are unclean (9:28). Turn away from idolaters (6:106). Don’t pray for idolaters (9:113). Let the idolaters kill their own children (6:137).

Ryan, I'm not sure if you've really been reading much posted on this site, but if you had, you would not be surprised by what I've just cited. If you don't believe me, I encourage you read an on-line Koran, and look at multiple translations. You can verify just how bad it really is. You can read Hadith reports on-line. And you can verify how the terrorists are following the Koran and Hadith.

Ryan...thats an easy one...if 40% are Christian, the other 60% are liars. Simple as that...

History is self-evident:

Wherever Mohammedans conquered, they wiped out all cultures and believers of other faith.

The Koran, Hadith, Sira are self-evident:

All of it reads like a horror story!

Rape, armed robbery, slavery, genocide, piracy, slaughter, slavery and arson, all of it is a crime against humanity. It is incompatible with our values, it is a clear attack on freedom and democracy, on equality of the sexes, Islam is a criminal cult invented by a pedophile warlord and caravan raider.

Any evidence to the contrary?

The mosques gotta go, the 'clerics' gotta go and the 'believers' have to ship out (before they are in a position to slaughter us!)

Self- defense is our duty. Treason is treason and those who are selling us out will pay dearly!

'Ryan' has a western name, but methinks he is a muslim. There is a good possability he is Al-Mahdi. He comes here to sharpen his writing and debating skills. Soon he will go public and convince many. He learned it here. As soon as Mahdi-Ryan gets smart enough, he will gather a large army in Afghanistan and from there conquor the world. We are all lucky that he is not yet that smart...maybe next week...

ALLAH = SATAN
MUHAMMED = FALSE PROPHET
ISLAM = DEADLY PARASITE

DiscipleofJesusChrist: ALLAH = SATAN MUHAMMED = FALSE PROPHET ISLAM = DEADLY PARASITE What a coincidence! I'm working on the same crossword puzzle.

:p

Where did the slave to Allah (Abdullah) go?

Abdullah dear boy...God works in strange and mysterious ways. But some of those ways can be decerned. God is the universes greatest employer.
Like any other employer, when he has a job to do, he hires someone skilled in that field. In human life, this is why the garbage collector does no brain surgury. God had a difficult time getting his people to march in a straight line, so he had to hire guys skilled in dirty work.
Davids sending Bathsheeba's hubby off to get killed, so he could play with the wife, is just David filling out his application. God hired Joshuah after moses died and look what a fine job he did. But that was then...After a while, God started hiring men who were more refined to do refined work...Paul was one, Peter was another. Then of course the Star of the show Jesus.
Allah follows a similar process in Islam, except that the dirty work guys he originally hires, never escalalate into refinement. Mohammad and his early companions, Umar, Uthman, Ali, Abu Bakr, all future Califes, started out despots and ended the same way. Murdered...their karma finally caught up with them as it did their boss der Mohammad. Well those guys are dead, but Mohammad is still alive. Like Dracula, there is only two things that will kill him. The light of truth or a wooden stake through the heart.
A wooden stake thru the Quran would do just as well, it cant stand the light of truth either...

If anyone is a "phobe" it's Muslims worldwide who have a phobia against Jews, Christians, Hindu's etc.

I DARE those humanity hater's at CAIR, to point out exactly what has been said on this site that is incorrect about Islam, What has been miss-interpreted in the koran, hadiths and traditions of Muhammad the butcher.

It would be very amusing if CAIR would be given their very own thread in which they can have a debate one-on-one with Robert Spencer, and let CAIR, if they can, correct what ever is being said wrong with what is revealed about Islam, the Koran, the hadith and traditions on this site.
What Imam's sermons are being misunderstood, and how anyone is misinterpreting the genocide occuring in areas around the world at the hands of Muslims who are, by their own admission, simply following the ways of Muhammad.

What is done on this site is mostly just exposing what goes on in the muslim world, what Imams say in their hate filled sermons, what Islam's faithfull do in the name of Muhammad and his alter ego, the Allah stone, what the Koran and other islamic "scripture" says.

I would welcome a CAIR thread so they can correct all the misunderstandings, musinterpretations so many very professional and studious people are accused of making.

That won't happen however, because CAIR knows that Islam is evil, a lie, that Muhammad is a false prophet, or at best a prophet of Satan;
That Islam is a CULT which has to keep it's faithful brainwashed and held captive with the threat of death, believing that their impoverished, pathetic lives are the fault of the west, when in fact the oil rich Islamic nations they live in are far wealthier per capita than any western nation is.

If anyone is a "phobic" and a hatefilled liar, it's CAIR, the proof is in the statement they published at the top of this thread.

Hate, lies, all all hallmarks of a 'devote' muslim, "approved by Moe" actions for use against the "infidel" and for the expansion of Islam.

Bukhari:V2B24N555 “I heard the Prophet say, ‘Allah hates for you for asking too many questions.’”

That's because anyone who takes a close look at Islam, it's "koran" which a 6 year old could write better, and is full of contradictions, hatred, lies, racism, and terrible grammar,
-it's so called "prophet" who's murderous theiving, raping and pedophilic ways prove beyond a doubt that he was anything but a prophet, and is exposed in the hadith and traditions, finds the truth ovout Islam, and the cult of hate it really is.

The protectors of this cult kill people for exposing Islam for what it is; not only the allah rock hates you for asking too many questions.

Islam is a pandemic.
If left unchecked,this virulent mind virus will wipe out most of humanity.

Since when did informed, educated fair comment on the daily events around us equate to "hate"?

Jihadwatch & Dhimmiwatch are quite frankly the most important Websites on the planet.

Keep on keeping on & don't stop.

CAIR are obviously rattled by this site, & probably have access to information with regards to the amount of hits it is achieving.

I see their flabby wittering as a very positive sign.

Congratulations to the whole team

Ryan is a very poor kt. He should go the same route.

The CAIR gang are really very smooth. Just dripping with honey, with sugar and spice and everything nice, with love, tolerance, and wet kisses. So how do we deal with them? We can say "people who live glass houses shouldn't throw stones." But that's not strong enough.
Yet it's a start. Before any discussions with them, ask them to unequivocally denounce and condemn the Judeophobic jihad propaganda in the mosques, the schools, the TV, radio, and print media in most Muslim states, not only in allegedly "radical" Muslim states [in the usual MSM usage] but states on Uncle Sam's payroll, like Jordan, Egypt, Saudi Arabia. Demand that they denounce the Hizbullah which regularly engages in crude Judeophobia, for instance, a Hizbullah paper back about 1987, stated: "The Jewish microbe is everywhere" [reported in LeFigaro at the time]. Then they can unequivocally condemn the mass murder of Blacks in southern Sudan over the last 49 years [little reported by Western media and political institutions, such as the State Dept and the UK Foreign Office]. Then there is the little matter of more than 1,000 years of the dhimmi experience in Muslim-ruled lands, still going on in moderate Egypt in the form of persecution of and discrimination against Copts, the purest descendants of the ancient Egyptians.

Of course, condemnation is negative, necessary perhaps but negative. So if they don't want to be negative, then ask them to be positive, to affirm Quranic passages such as those that assert that Allah assigned the Holy Land to the Jews and made a covenant with the Sons of Israel [5:12, 5:20-22]. And then the passages about the Jews returning to their land. If CAIR really is loyal to the Quran, then why not affirm those passages? Any self-respecting synagogue must demand these affirmations from CAIR before any discussion. After all, if CAIR is covering up for Islamic persecution and hate propaganda in Muslim countries while speaking in the name of equality and tolerance in Western lands, then why should they have a platform? Will CAIR give a platform to the Israeli Yigal Karmon or Robert Spencer, for instance, on their own premises?

In general, the burden should be on CAIR to prove its good faith, its bona fides, by the abovementioned condemnations and affirmations. However, some will say, Why not talk? Why not listen to what they have to say? The answer is: Little is to be gained from listening to proven liars, the smoothest of smoothies, who deny history, avoid answering real challenges and always turn the discussion in a direction convenient for them. But then some will still insist on "giving them a hearing." Then why not have a two-sided discussion. Have Yigal Karmon, for instance, who can supply all the quotes from Arab broadcasts and press which vilify Jews, call for jihad, justify persecution of Christians in Muslim lands, etc. Or have a CAIR mouthpiece confront someone who is knowledgeable, whether Robert Spencer, Daniel Pipes, etc.

"The English suffix -phobia is technically used to describe irrational, disabling fear as a mental disorder, and commonly misused to describe hatred of a particular thing or subject. Everyday language has misused the use of this suffix as a mild or irrational fear with no serious substance; however, its origin is from areas of psychiatry which study serious phobias which disable a person's life. ..."

Phobia: Phobic: An irrational fear.

There is nothing irrational with regards to Robert's, or our, well documented fears & concerns about Islam.

To be a true Islamophobe you would need to have been living in a box for the last 1400 years & still have fears about Islam that could be construed as "irrational" because you had not been exposed to Islam.

Maybe CAIR's statement has lost something in the translation from the original Arabic - they certainly abuse the English language & stretch a definition to the point of nonsense.

As I have now read quite alot of their literature & learnt alot (hence removing the term "Islamophobe" from any definition of myself) , I think it only fair if they study the Oxford English Dictionary & educate themselves.

The reliability of translations of the Quran is another problem. Can we rely on a translation that CAIR would give out? Can Robert Spencer or somebody provide a list of more reliable and less reliable translations of the Quran? And why they are such?

What about the Pickthall, Nissim Dawood [Penguin ed.], George Sale translations, for instance? In French, Denise Masson has drawn comparisons in parallel columns between Quranic passages, in order of Sura and verse, and Jewish and Christian texts. This might be helpful. Eliyahu Zawi did this on a more modest scale in Hebrew and I think there have been some attempts in English to do something similar.

Hey guys! Make sure you vote in this poll: in your opinion are western values fundamentally at odds with those of Islam?

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/

Welcome to the club, Robert. I had an somewhat brusque exchange of emails with the grand poobah of the Canadian Islamic Association, who began by condescending to me that I share his wife's first name (okay, we'll let that one pass as an attempt at playing 'nice') and then carried on to refute my points by not addressing them but mischaracterizing what I'd said and further, offering a 'straw man' argument which he proceeded to knock down as evidence that I was in error. They have no conception of 'playing by the rules' and so in verbal exchanges seek to redraw the argument by restating what you said with subtle alterations to their advantage. Only by addressing them on paper or in emails where there's a record of what you ACTUALLY SAID and can defend yourself, is it safe to debate them. What's remarkable is that supposedly highly intelligent people are continually bamboozled by this stuff. It's crazy-making!

If Mohammed were alive he wouldn't be jail for being a lunatic - he's be there for being a pedophile, a thief, and a murderer. Take your pick.

Ryan

If this is indeed a peaceful website, why are the comments of "death to islam" not being removed?

Again, Ryan, I'm trying to be patient here.

Someone could type detailed instructions which would allow me to commit the perfect crime against a dozen Muslims and never get caught. I'M NOT INTERESTED. Nothing in my background or makeup could cause me to commit violence unless it was a case of legal self-defense, my job in the military, or legal defense of another.

Islam is the religion where calls to violence are heeded by the ummah the same way I habitually lock the door even if I'm just stepping outside. In free societies we have armies, police, and security who do violence when there are no other options.

Example (again):

Free society: read something - no matter how offensive to me, tries to incite me - no reaction

Islamic society: read something - perceived as offensive to Islam - look for someone to blame / kill.

You keep confusing Islamic reactions to mere words to those of us who've been barraged by conflicting, persuasive, even offensive words since we were children. I wouldn't live any other way, but it does require some mental ability to understand your role in society is not determined by what you read each passing day.

Go ahead, tell me God wants me to murder. Try it a thousand times. I'm immune, vaccinated, rational, not-gonna-do-it. Comprende?

It's called independent, rational thought. Not easy to achieve, but something to aspire to. Compared to Muslims, I feel like Superman.

Mentat,

Thanks for that link to the poll. As of about 5 minutes ago, 65% say YES, western values are fundamentally at odds with Islam (35% say NO).
Total sample size was about 5200.

I'd say much of the 35% have not yet read the Koran.

Voted and now at 66%.

Ryan, the Mohammedan poster, fears that infidels could actually turn the table on the 'Ummah' and, if provoked, react with the same fanatic frenzy which is common where Mohammedans have achieved a majority.

This is a very characteristic trait of Mohammedans: Always accuse the accuser and deflect their evil intentions onto others.

We just have to wizen up to their tactics, their strategies, their lies and since these arguments are all similar, (Muslims always 'speak for 1.5 billion Allah-warriors) we should never see them as individuals: They are controlled by the community of 'believers', they are slaves of Allah and thats why the individual Muslims opinion is quite worthless.

What counts is their actions, the Koran, the Sira and the Hadith and the history of Islamic conquest.

49% of Lebanon supports suicide bombings against the United States"

Odd statistic considering 40% of the country is Christian. Either nearly every muslim supports it or there are a significant number of Arab Christians that support it. Now why would Arab Christians ever support terrorism??

Posted by: Ryan at November 9, 2005 03:26 AM

Nice ASSumption. How you came to the conclusion that Arab Christians are the ones who support suicide bombings is still anyone's guess.

How about 49% out of 60% of the Muslim community in Lebanon support it? Given Islam's record of this exercise, wouldn't that be more realistic?

11/08/2005

REMEMBER WHAT COURAGE IS!
Courage is not Strength without fear but, Courage is Strength in the face of fear!!!

McCain amendment stands with dicki Derbin yes the same dicki Derbin who call the US Military Polpot and or Nazis? REMEMBER WE HAVE ALREADY SAID we use the Geniva Convetion so is McCain saying the Geniva convetion allows torcher??
And this bulsh-t about what the Islamic Terrorist do is Just that HELLO YODAY FOUND IN IRAQ MEN WITH THEIR HANDS TIED BEHIND THEIR BACKS AND SHOT AND KILLED !!!

Were the Islamic terrorist using the Geniva Convention???????

So when you ask yourself if I could be a Hero? For women many may have done so before their first child but, I would think if not done so that the Birth of their first Child was not without fear but, it was something they did in the face of that fear! So when you think you have no Courage to do things that need to be done to be done think again about what and who a Hero is and what can be done in the face of fear!!!

Islamic terrorist still burning France down???
The old man who died in France who was beaten by Islamic terrorist who were burning France was a HERO!!! He went out to try to help save people around him to put out a fire yes in the face of fear!! BUT Shame on the French who sat back and did nothing to help him? You may say what could others have done WELL I bet every house apt. had a BROOM in their house it doesn’t take much to make bullies run away like the YELLOW COWARDS they are. JUST THE SHEAR NUMBERS OF A BUNCH OF PEOPLE SCREAMING AND SWING BROOMS COULD HAVE SAVED THE LIFE OF THIS GREAT MAN!!! BUT the French people show themselves to be cowards!!!

I have a deep discust for cowards who call others names[to make themselves feel better] for those bullies in life we all must not follow because in the end they will get you killed!!!

Are all lib’s cowards no BUT, doing the right thing is never easy yes they will have to stand against the PC Crap because this is now proven to be WRONG WRONG HELLO FRANCE HAS BEEN BURNING FOR 13 NIGHTS!!!!

Are all Conservites Heros NO some have no courage to stand for they are afraid to be called names yes they show fear in it’s face and run away like cowards!!

SO to not be PC IS TO BE A HERO in a way because you are standing in the water against the current!!

WE see Courage in the Iraqi People to do these things in the Face of Fear to come together to stand against the Bully’s!!!!
The Afghani People also are standing in that river and, are Faceing that fear to stand aginst the Bully’s!!!

And yet the MSM can’t see past their nose.....

HELLO FRANCE IS BURNING and the youth’s [Islamic terrorist] are burning and in the streets screaming mulsum chants and they do this in the name of islam.. So what the french said about the mulsums could never live in freedom at lest we see the French mulsums can’t???

I see a lot of excuses but the condemning is not there???

Saudis arrest a Islamic terrorist?
Iran tells the EU to change their bahavoir??
Russian Border is getting better at stopping the drug flow!!

Kj
Who was it who took the Islamic terrorist caught on the battlefield to the courts of the USA?? OH YEA IT IS THE LIB’S And of course this hurts the war effort and you know it.. Who is it today who stood on the floor of the the Senate to once again Bash the Troops OH YEA IT IS THE LIB’S DEMOCRATS LEVIN AND DERBIN!!

Why is the CIA hurting the war effort??
Hello more burning in france tonight only in 250 citys??

15 year spy case tracked down in the last year was selling stuff to China for the last 15 years was busted 10/28/2005 in L.A.??

I say take the trator out back and just shoot him or hang him from the tallest tree in the town sq.!!!
Repub. Finnaly call for a investagtion on who leaked about the prisions to the press!!

McCain want a new rule that goes beyond the Geniva Convetion and who is his co sponser BUT DICKI DERBIN THE REPUB. In the Senate had better stop this asalt on our military who are in the trenches in this war!!

I will honor the ALB Boccot!!

Remember terrorism is just a tactic so when the MSM says terrorist what are they saying?? It is like saying car we kind of know what that means but not really there are many kinds of cars??

NO IT IS ISLAMIC TERRORIST BURNING FRANCE!!

It was ISLAMIC TERRORIST WHO TIED MENS HANDS BEHIND THEIR BACK AND KILLED THEM what cowards TODAY IN IRAQ!! Found at the water treatment plant?

But the MSM is so worried like our polis they are showing to be cowards STOP THIS PC CRAP WE DO NOT TORCHER is standing a child in the corner torcher this is what McCain and Derbin are saying??

11/09/2005

France Denile aint a river in Egypt??

Granny’s on the borders with guns SWEET!!! Better to live in a place where Granny’s have guns then a place like France where they are living in fear in their houses while their streets burn!!!!

Saudi ambastor said yesterday it is all the Jews fault?? Because they only report the bad things when Islamic terrorist blow up their people HUH??

Islamic terrorist still burning France?? What was it France saying to the rest of the world ? Be more like us??
Who leaked the info about the where CIA was keeping Islamic terrorist??
Who ever did should be tried for TREASON! Remember this leak either came from the CIA itself or Polis and this was REAL CLASSIFIDED INFO and was done to hurt the War against Islamic Terrorism what do they want to have what is happening in France to happen in the USA?? Well I will tell you if it happened in the USA it will be much uglier!!!

Defence Contractor caught after 15 years of selling CLASSIFIDED info to China? Take him out back and shoot him!!!

Iraq huge weapon stash found on the border with Syira!!! Way to go guys!!

Another lawyer killed in Iraq? Saddam[YELLOW COWARD FOUND IN A HOLE DON’T SHOOT I’M A YELLOW COWARD] is having the lawyers killed to stall the trial! Maybe it is time to let the Iraqi people do what the Itialians did to Muslinni????

REMEMBER THIS IS WHAT IS HAPPENING IN FRANCE!!
http://www.netwerk.tv/templates/videoasx.jsp?f=198614

AND THIS IS WHAT IS HAPPENING IN THE USA??
http://www.foehammer.net/2005/06/thoughts.html

VIDEO IN NYC OF CRAZY MULSUMS!!!

AGAIN PEACEFUL MULSUMS AT PLAY!!!

UN=LON=AL says the USA is bad because of Cuba?? ROTFL!

Part of the American Tribe
Squirrel Hunter
Spider Killer
GOD BLESS THE USA AND HER FIGHTING FORCES AND ALL WHO FIGHT WITH HER GIVE THEM STRENGTH, WISDOM, SIGHT, AND COURAGE TO DESTROY ALL ISLAMIC TERRORIST AND ALL WHO SUPPORT THEM LET NOT THE WORLD BE DECEIVED BY THEM AMEN

PS
JUST means you are making a big impact on this problem and like all bullies they never admidt they need to look in the mirror that it they who need to change to get along with others!!!
And who are these bullies from CAIR who are trying to take FREEDOM away from the American people it is none of their bussiness who People have as seakers REMEMBER THE MULSUMS IN FLA. HAD NAZIS COME AND SPEAK TO THEM WHAT DID THEY DO OR SAY ABOUT THAT???

OH YEA I REMEMBER YOU CAN'T SAY ANYTHING ABOUT WHO WE HAVE AS SPEAKERS???

Ryan,

Last census in Lebanon was held in 1932. The lack of official statistics makes a demographic analysis of Lebanese society a difficult task. Because of the precarious and delicate sectarian arrangement in the body politic, the government has deliberately avoided conducting a comprehensive update of the 1932 census. Christian communities, primarily the Maronites, fear that the numerical preponderance of Muslims would eventually strip them of their privileges by changing the foundations of political representation.

The Moslem strike into the bastion of Christian power has roots that go back at least to the creation of independent Lebanon. As France was quitting the area in 1943, an unwritten but carefully wrought National Covenant was adopted by Lebanese leaders in an effort to accommodate the new country's's volatile religious mix of Christians and Moslems. With Christians in a slight majority according to a 1932 census, the Covenant provided that the country's President and the armed forces commander would always be from the dominant Maronite Christian sect, the Prime Minister always a Sunni Moslem and the legislative assembly always in a 6-5 balance favoring Christians. This slight but significant power edge reflected not only the population figures but also the fact that Christians controlled the professions and business. Despite simmering eruptions, notably in 1958 when the U.S. sent in troops to prevent a leftist takeover, Lebanon thrived for decades as a result of its compromise -- and of a Swiss-style neutrality that helped to make it the trading, banking and communications hub of the Arab world.

In the 70's, 80's, 90's and now a higher birth rate has pushed the Moslem portion of Lebanon's population to an estimated 75% of the 3.8-4.0 million total.

Richard

Hey Ryan...Where'd you go!?

Dear Salamantis,

That was one of the most insightful dissertations on comparative religions I have ever read. Knowledge such as this needs be disseminated widely, understood to the limits of each individual's ability, and utilized as the base of all future actions (I use that term w/malice aforethought).

Thank you.

"Ryan" said: "Odd statistic considering 40% of the country is Christian"

If 40% of Lebanon is Christian then where's the Lebanon CAIR group - surely they would be fighting against Christians.

Odd fellow, this "Ryan" who spouts off false statistics with no link, no reference, no study, no facts, no historical data, no research and no sense.

It's not true that 75% of Lebanon is muslim. It's 65% tops. CIA official statistics say 60% muslim and 40% Christian so that's what I relied on.

According to a Pew Center Poll:

For their part, people in predominantly Muslim countries have mixed views of Christians and strongly negative views of Jews. In Lebanon, which has a large Christian minority, 91% of the public thinks favorably of Christians

In Lebanon, all Muslims and 99% of Christians say they have a very unfavorable view of Jews.

Jew hating is not retricted to muslims, although one on this website would like you to believe that.

http://pewglobal.org/reports/display.php?ReportID=248

And the Qur'an is protected by God Himself, no one can change His words, and since the revelation was revealed to Muhammad, peace be upon him, the words have not been changed.
May Allah Guide you all and set your affairs in order,
Abdullah

Posted by: Abdullah at November 9, 2005 01:55 AM

And some believe that islam can be reformed?
Abdullah, you have chosen the false prophet.
You should set your affairs in order.
What god would think murder, mutilation and rape are a good thing? Who comes to steal, kill and destroy?

DC:

Math and demographics aside, Ryan overlooks the fact that a lot of Middle Eastern Christians are so warped by decades of anti-Israel, anti-Western propaganda, that they differ little from Islamists except they aren't given to suicide bombing or acts of violence. Instead, they've been known to form organizations like the notorious ISM or become toadies to the Islamists like Hanan Ashrawi or Ed Said.

and if that LA synagogue decides to host a Muslim authority, I hope they pick Sheik Palazzi of Italy, or, failing that, invite Walid Shoebat and/or Nonie Darwish (former Muslims who converted to Christianity) to speak as well as to the leaven of malice in the Middle East.

"Islam, the preferred religion of criminals." they used one of my quotes! I love it! LOL! :-)

How do we deal with this virulent memeplex? I believed that we're already on the path to doing so, and this is why:

The primordial form of government, one that long predated the advent of the written word, is monarchial, composed of royal masters, typically from a single family lineage that served as a similacrum of the genetic heritage of the tribe, and ruled slaves, who owed the masters familial bonds of fealty. However, this form of government often entailed power struggles and intrigues by the royal relatives to either lay claim to or to seize the reins of succession during the authority change when the king, czar, pharoah or emperor would die, and this was not conducive to smooth and orderly transition and the smooth continuation of order.

Spoken religious myths had most likely been invoked to legitimize royal rule for as long as humans spoke and gathered in tribes. However, with the creation of written language, it was possible to create a form of leadership that would not change or die like rulers did; blueprints - that is, sets of ideas - that could codify the regal rule as divinely sanctioned, serve as abstract monarchs with which to supplement the concrete yet generationally changing ones, provide a common glue which smoothed transitions and soothed the populace while transition happened, and, via the inclusion of explicit tribal history, the encoding of symbolic abstractions of critical tribal decisions within the religious myth, or divinely communicated rules, provide both guidance as to how such transitions should be effectuated, and within what parameters a particular king should circumscribe his decisional alternatives: the holy texts of written religion.

As time passed, certain written religions spread across several kingdoms each, and the kings themselves became in their turn ruled by their ecclesiastical authorities, who held sway over multiple kingdoms; as religion mattered more, royalty mattered less. In such a manner, genetic monarchies gradually evolved into, or were superseded and supplanted by, ideological monarchies, whose rulers were chosen from within the membership of the religion itself, the successor being decided, whenever a ruler died, via the consensus of the most influential members remaining.

Where religious government was itself supposedly superceded, in most cases, its supercession was apparent rather than real. Thus with communism and fascism, the god of matter and labor, and the god of the spirit of the people and its will to power, replaced the transcendent god of heaven, mind and prayer. Still, however, the master and the slave remained; the divinely granted set of ideas and rules was the acknowledged ruler, but the actual rulers were those who mandated to the general populace what those rules meant. Hegel was the philosopher who first explicitly described this structure.

The Hegelian master-slave dialectic was composed of masters (who were willing to risk death in order to rule) and slaves (who were not willing to risk death in order to not be ruled), and Hegel did not present any manner by which governmental form could evolve past this basic inequity. However, in the past couple of hundred years, a synthetic new level has emerged, that of Free and Independent Individuals, who refuse to rule others, but who are willing to kill and die in order not to be ruled by others - that is, they are willing to, in fact, even desirous of, letting others rule themselves, and will even take pains to free enslaved others, but in return they insist upon the right to rule themselves also, via representatives who are neither divinely chosen nor doctrinally imposed by exclusive vote from within an ideological apparatus, be they priests or commissars, but are instead popularly elected by the populace at large, in accordance with a costitution that, in addition to codifying the ethical precepts contained within the holy texts, mandates the existence, frequency, and structure of such a process. In a way, the principle of ecclesiastical or commissar vote was generalized to encompass the entire citizenry.

Competition between the governments and peoples of countries that embrace this principle, that is, competition between constitutional democracies, is removed from the politico-military sphere (democracies generally do not war with one another - it's counterproductive) and relocated in the economic sphere, comprised of international trade and the competition between producers for consumers via the manufacture of better and/or less expensive products. This competition of course financially and materially benefits the consuming citizenry, at the same time that it furnishes them with gainful productive employment by means of which they may self-support (self-support being a necessary corollary of freedom and self-rule). The hope for the future of civilization lies in this constitutional-democratic synthesis sweeping the populations and governments of the globe, and finally ridding us of the oppressive master-slave dialectic, and the totalitarianisms and theocracies which remain in its thrall.

CAIR complains that "one poster described Muslims as being like animals."

What about the Islamic concept of najis that equates kuffar -- i.e., us dear friends, to feces, urine, dead bodies, pigs, and dogs?

Read it here. Pixels do not lie.

Don't hold your breath waiting for the Muslim world to rush to forswear this delightful concept.

Mr. S., you dastardly man, you. Speaking at a synagogue of all places and on Yom Kippur yet!

I'll show you a thing or two, Mister! I'll just buy another copy of your new book and donate it to a public library and see just how much of your "hate" I can spread around. I can't believe you are so dastardly, both you and Mr. F. Shame, shame! I'll just buy 2 additional books to donate, that will teach you a right proper lesson. ;-)

Oh my, what the world needs now is more people like you, Mssrs. S. & F. Phooie on cair-less.

Aughhhhhh!!!! It must really hurt to be French.

Carolyn2, that rousing music in Le Pen's patriotic ad is the 1812 Overture which celebrates the DEFEAT of the French armies attempting to take Moscow. "La Marseillaise" which had been heard earlier gives way to the Russian National Anthem "God Save the Czar" which is what we heard in the ad.

Le Pen's eyes in imprisoned Europe should turn hopefully, or desperately, toward the freedom of the Americas, and Hal Wallis, and take a tip from Casablanca on how to film a patriotic bit.

bohemond:

Presumably, if they kept stats of prison conversions, they'd bear out what you have written, but I'm not sure if you have done Spencer any great favour or not by writing that here. But, then again, maybe CAIR is opening a can of worms for themselves by taking on organizations and individuals like Anti-CAIR and Robert Spencer.