Ten days after the riots started, Jacques "The Beast" Chirac is vowing to get tough and saying that law and order are top priority. Only ten days! Watch out, Jacques! Remember Shakespeare's warning: Be careful not to "outrun, by violent swiftness, that which we run at, and lose by over-running." Why, Jacques might not even give the rioters raises in their next round of welfare checks. From CNN:
PARIS, France (CNN) -- As arson and violence spreads into regional France and central Paris, French President Jacques Chirac has vowed to crack down on the perpetrators."The absolute priority is to reestablish security and public order," Chirac told the nation Sunday after emerging from an emergency meeting with top members of his Cabinet.
"The law should have the final say, and the republic is determined to be stronger than those who want spread violence and fear. Those people will be apprehended, judged and punished."
As he spoke, increased security efforts were already visible in the capital, where thousands more police were in the streets and helicopters hovered overhead.
But never fear! Large-scale concessions for the rioters are just around the corner:
Chirac also said he also wants to address what some observers have blamed as the cause -- unemployment as high as 50 percent among the nation's poor immigrant youth and discrimination against them.An official with the Interior Ministry listed Sunday's vandalism: in the western city of Nantes, a pre-school was set afire; in the eastern city of Colombe, rocks thrown at two buses hit a 13-month-old child, who was in serious condition; in the northern city of Rouen, a police barricade was set afire and a burning car was pushed into the police station; in Strasbourg, a school was torched near the German border; and a church were set ablaze in the southern fishing town of Sete and another in nearby Lens, Pas de Calais.
As of 11 p.m. (5 p.m. ET), 365 cars had been set ablaze Sunday, and 50 people detained, an Interior Ministry official said. Since October 27, 3,300 cars have been torched, he added.
YAY! Time to dance in the streets for the establishment of:*
THE ISLAMIC REPUBLIC OF FRANCE.
*Dancing in the streets is allowed only so long as all women are properly dressed from head to toe, with no skin showing, with the proper sewing up of the vaginal region to ensure virginity, and with at least one male relative present to ensure family honor.
Mr. Spencer is afraid that some social reform will prove his theory of the necessary genocide against muslims wrong and will actually help the situation in France
No person here is in favor of genocide. Except for the Muslims who occassionally post here and lament about Iran not being able to use Nuclear Weapons. I doubt even you, Ryan, are in favor of Genocide.
No, I'm not in favor of genocide against anybody. So if the point is "muslims are inherently evil" but "genocide is not encourage", then what is the remedy to the fact that muslims are rats?
My dear "Ryan,"
Why must you resort to falsehoods?
I have never advocated genocide of Muslims or anyone. If you think otherwise, bring your proof, if you be truthful.
Nor have I ever said or written that "muslims are inherently evil" or that they are "rats."
The fact that you must lie about me to mount any kind of attack indicates the weakness of your ground.
Cordially
Robert Spencer
Then what is your message here?
The purpose of this site, as broadly displayed on the home page is:
Because the West is facing a concerted effort by Islamic jihadists, the motives and goals of whom are largely ignored by the Western media, to destroy the West and bring it forcibly into the Islamic world -- and to commit violence to that end even while their overall goal remains out of reach. That effort goes under the general rubric of jihad.
Jihad (in Arabic, "struggle") is a central duty of every Muslim. Modern Muslim theologians have spoken of many things as jihads: the struggle within the soul, defending the faith from critics, supporting its growth and defense financially, even migrating to non-Muslim lands for the purpose of spreading Islam. But violent jihad is a constant of Islamic history. Many passages of the Qur'an and sayings of the Prophet Muhammad are used by jihad warriors today to justify their actions and gain new recruits. No major Muslim group has ever repudiated the doctrines of armed jihad. The theology of jihad, which denies unbelievers equality of human rights and dignity, is available today for anyone with the will and means to bring it to life.
Jihad Watch is dedicated to bringing public attention to the role that jihad theology and ideology plays in the modern world, and to correcting popular misconceptions about the role of jihad and religion in modern-day conflicts. We hope to alert people of good will to the true nature of the present global conflict.
And exactly what evidence is there that any jihadists (not just young men with muslim names) are involved in the rioting in France? One of your posts yesterday was "muslims burn woman". Exactly what evidence do you have that a muslim did that.
Once the world recognizes the true nature of Jihad mentality, we will finally be able to educate our young to VALUE human life rather than simply make excuses for the muslims. Once we do THAT, we can begin the process of establishing fundamental human rights for people all over the world, instead of complaining about "Bush lied" and making more excuses for Saddam the MASS MURDERER.
Once we realize the truth and get moving towards our true purpose, rather than bickering amongst ourself on who to blame, and we will be able to bring democracy and freedom to men and ESPECIALLY WOMEN everywhere.
Nqamah Ben Mavet:
Why is it that the same people who believe islam is evil are the ones who want to "liberate" muslims in Iraq?
Sigh...does anyone read the basis, history, or stated purpose of bogs before they "dive in"?
here:
http://jihadwatch.org/spencer/
And.....read it all ;)
JIHAD IS A CENTRAL DUTY of every Muslim. Modern Muslim theologians have spoken of many things as jihads: the struggle within the soul, defending the faith from critics, supporting its growth and defense financially, even migrating to non-Muslim lands for the purpose of spreading Islam. But in Islamic history and doctrine violent jihad is founded on numerous verses of the Qur'an — most notably, one known in Islamic theology as the "Verse of the Sword": "Then, when the sacred months have passed, slay the idolaters wherever ye find them, and take them (captive), and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor-due, then leave their way free. Lo! Allah is forgiving, merciful" (Sura 9:5). Establishing "regular worship" and paying the "poor-due" (zakat) means essentially that they will become Muslim, as these are two of the central responsibilities of every Muslim.
Sahih Bukhari, which Muslims regard as the most trustworthy of all the many collections of traditions of Muhammad, records this statement of the Prophet: "Allah assigns for a person who participates in (holy battles) in Allah's Cause and nothing causes him to do so except belief in Allah and in His Messengers, that he will be recompensed by Allah either with a reward, or booty (if he survives) or will be admitted to Paradise (if he is killed in the battle as a martyr)."
Ibn Khaldun (1332-1406), a pioneering historian and philosopher, was also a legal theorist. In his renowned Muqaddimah, the first work of historical theory, he notes that "in the Muslim community, the holy war is a religious duty, because of the universalism of the Muslim mission and (the obligation to) convert everybody to Islam either by persuasion or by force." In Islam, the person in charge of religious affairs is concerned with "power politics," because Islam is "under obligation to gain power over other nations."
Violent jihad is a constant of Islamic history. The passages quoted above and many others like them form a major element of the motivation of jihad warriors worldwide today. No major Muslim group has ever repudiated the doctrines of armed jihad. The theology of jihad, with all its assumptions about unbelievers‚ lack of human rights and dignity, is available today as a justification for anyone with the will and the means to bring it to life.
Jihad Watch is dedicated to bringing public attention to the role that jihad theology and ideology play in the modern world and to correcting popular misconceptions about the role of jihad and religion in modern-day conflicts. By shedding as much light as possible on these matters, we hope to alert people of good will to the true nature of the present global conflict.
The Czechs, for reasons that troubled no sensible person at the time, passed the Benes Decree in 1946. That did not constitute genocide; it was a rational attempt to deal with what was reasonably regarded as a permanent security threat. This and many other measures to contain and constrain Islam, which is a permanent threat to all non-Muslims (by its very tenets, and the attitudes to which those tenets naturally give rise in the minds of Believers), are part of what can legitimately be considered, by people in Western Europe, and North America, and indeed everywhere in the Bilad al-kufr. Would anyone deny Infidels the right of self-defense? And if that self-defense avoids major conflict, but can be accomplished without any, or very little, military action, so much the better.
Contrary to unpopular opinion, all muslims are NOT evil. My favorite example of all time:
The Druze.
Population 1.2 million.
Location: Israel, Syria, Lebanon.
Religion: Islam - dating back to 7th century.
Non-proselytizing. Non-Agressive. EQUALITY OF GENDER. Loyal. Friendly. I love Druze.
People like the Druze are heavily persecuted by other sects of Islam. I can't understand why. They kick mega-a$$. They are probably jealous.
Often people like these, although muslim, need to be liberated from their muslim brethren as they have been persecuted for centuries.
There are also a variety of groups horridly oppressed under Islam. Such as WOMEN.
Women.
Population: 3.2 Billion.
Location: Everywhere
Relgion: All religions, except certain forms of Buddhism.
Friendly. Neccessary for future of human race. Human beings. I love Women.
People like the Women are heavily persecuted by other sects of Islam. I can't understand why. They kick mega-a$$. They are probably jealous.
Our culture, through some very tough periods in history and tough decisions, has decided that bigotry is wrong.
It is not the time to return to dark periods of history when one race had to use a different bathroom or ride the back of the bus.
As for the same poster's comment about "liberating" Muslims in Iraq, the liberation, such as it is, is really of Shi'a Arabs and Kurds (mostly Sunni) from Sunni Arab despotism. But in one sense the poster is right: the American effort to help Muslims in Iraq is a misallocation of resources, naive and uncomprehending both of Islam and of Iraq. It would make far better sense for the Americans to leave Iraq quickly, so that the natural fissures -- sectarian and ethnic -- could be allowed to widen rather than narrow, and so that Iraq can become a place where the Sunni-Shi'a battle, a kind of Iran-Iraq War on a domestic scale, can play itself out, and one hopes, involve aid to both sides from co-religionists outside Iraq. Let the Muslims use up men, money, materiel, and the Americans cease to squander theirs. It makes sense.
Far more important than Iraq, in any case, is the islamization of Europe and the need to deal with Iran, not by bringing it "democracy" but by destroying, or damaging, in repeated raids, the nuclear weapons project that is underway. Those are the two tasks: keep major weapons out of Muslim hands, and reduce, through proper education of Infidels, the space afforded to Islam and to Muslims within the Lands of the Infidels. And that is about it. That will take care of things, if relentlessly pursued.
But first there has to be a widespread understanding of what Islam is all about. And that cannot happen as long as a sentimentalist about "religion" such as Bush, or the uncomprehending Rice, remain to prate about "staying the course" and not "cutting and running."
Yes, we all know that everything we ever needed to know we all learned in kindergarten, as that demode best-seller put it, but the rhetoric and the stubborn refusal to be the slightest bit calculating, or the slightest bit flexible, of the current Administration, is getting on every sensible person's nerves.
Getting out of Iraq will no doubt allow some temporary gloating by Muslims. Let them gloat. Then let the Kurds make their move, and let the Sunnis and the Shi'a go at it, without American troops in the middle. And wake up everyday to a news item about an attack in Iraq, and there were this number of casualties, and realize with first a pang, to be quickly replaced by indifference, or even a little pleasure, that whoever those casualties may have been, not a single one was an American. And if aid pours in from Saudi Arabia and Jordan and Syria to help the Sunnis, and the worst kind of Iranians flock across the border (weakening the regime at home, quite possibly) to help fight the Sunnis in Iraq -- well, let them go at it. For as long as they want. Do nothing to discourage them. If, here and there, a little equipment sent to one side or the other can keep the thing going, then that should be considered. But the only consideration should be: what does this do for us, how does this harm the Jihad, how does it work to divide and demoralize Muslims, to lessen the appeal of Islam among Infidels in the West, to use up money, men, materiel supplied by the Muslim world? That, and only that, should count.
It will be the time real soon. It's called Dhimmi Time.
SCORE.
Someone mentioned on another thread that property that is destoryed during riots will not be covered by insurance.If this is the case what will Chirac and the government of France do to compensate innocent infidel victims of Muslim violence? Is it the governments plan to compensate Muslim rioters before compensating infidel victims? If the infidels are not compensated by the government for their burned cars and businesses would it be alright for those infidels to riot and destory property in Muslim neighborhoods? Is rioting and violence the fastest way to get government help. If the French government moves to help Muslims for their grievances either real or imagined before the riot victims are compensated I can see the hard right winning big in next French elections.
Compensation will not end the Riots. I personally believe that once the food stocks in the rioting areas is eaten up, the Muslims will have to continue rioting and looting in order to feed themselves. This means either the end of France or some swift reprisals on part of the French. Judging from the way France has handled problems in the past, I would say this is the slow and painful end of France.
Ryan writes:
"It is not the time to return to dark periods of history when one race had to use a different bathroom or ride the back of the bus."
More trolling from you huh? Are you too thick to
understand that muslims are not a race? Or that
someone can be anti-Nazi and not harbor a racial hatred for Germans, or anti-Communist and not
anti-Russian? And that deportation and separation
are a far cry from genocide?
Your continued attempts to confuse the issues indicate that you're yet another in the long line
of trolls here. You can keep selling this BS, but
we're not buying! Go back to UC Berkeley, where they love this kind of thing. Anyone who can't see that the common thread to almost all of the
bloody borders of the world today is islam is
deluding himself.
American, in all fairness Ryan does not seem like a troll. He doesn't automaticaly reject this Jihad Watch it sounds like he simply is trying to understand.
The Barbarians are no longer at the Gates of Paris. They are already inside.
Last night 30 cars were burnt out by Muslims going around on scooters
lobbing Molotov cocktails inside cars near the Place de La Republique and
the 17th arrondissement.
Tonight 30 police have been injured by gunfire and, if you were to follow
the mainstream media in France, this is what you would hear. Anti Racism
groups accusing Sarcosy of inciting hatred by calling the Islamic hordes
'scum' and accusing the police of over reacting. (Because they fight back).
You would hear about community leaders 'reaching out', and sporting
associations helping 'youth' find their feet. That's not news, it's
propaganda: 'Tout va bien Mme la Marquise'
30 cars burnt out in Paris, is nothing compared to the 1200 or so burnt on
Saturday night by islamofascists. One could say that the over-reacting
police have done an excellent job so far of keeping these zombies away from
the Left Bank.
The reality is however, that the phrase, thin blue line has never been so
apt as now, in France, the centre of European Jihad. This is not a racial
issue, or an issue of poverty or unemployment. For years Islamic Arab and
African immigrants and their descendants have used anti racism as an excuse
for us not to examine too closely what they have been up to in their
neighbourhoods. The problem is not the blackness of their skin, but the
blackness of their hearts. Islam is a binary religion whose morality is not
based around the idea of 'treating your neighbour as you wish to be
treated'. Right and wrong is decided on whether you are Muslim or not. An
infidel is always wrong. Hence the overwhelming feeling of victimisation,
whenever you question anything about their religion.
This also explains the deafening silence which accompanies a billion Muslims
not marching with 'Not in my name' placards when their co-religionaries,
chop, dice, humiliate, rape, destroy, explode anything or anyone which gets
in the way of the advance of Islam.
All Muslims believe Mohamed is the final prophet of Allah. They all believe
that the Koran is divinely dictated. They all believe that the Koran is
perfect for all time. They all believe Mohamed is the perfect man who must
be emulated.
This perfect man had sex with a nine year old girl. FACT
This perfect man ordered the death of poets who criticised him. FACT
This perfect man ordered the death by decapitation of 800 innocent Jews at
Banu Quaraiza. FACT
This perfect man hated art. FACT
This perfect man took as slaves, the wives of executed prisoners. FACT
This perfect man robbed caravans, destroyed towns and kept 20 % of the
booty. FACT
This perfect man said women had half the value of men. FACT
This perfect man called for the death of infidels wherever they could be
found. FACT
This perfect man lied, to hide his ambitions. FACT
This perfect man arranged to have a revelation that suited him when he
wanted his son in law's wife. FACT
This perfect man said that he knew of no greater act for Allah than Jihad.
(Not the internal struggle bullshit) FACT
This perfect man ordered the killing of apostates. FACT
For years now, the media has covered Islamism in Europe as a minority sport
carried out by a tiny handful of fanatics. Not one jihadist has even been
handed over to the police by these mythical moderate Muslims. There is no
such thing as a moderate Muslim, just a Muslim who doesn't take his religion
to its logical conclusion, by behaving like its founder.
For those who don't believe that the intifada in France (and in Denmark) has
anything to do with Islam, I would like to suggest that you read the
Internet Blogs of those who take part. These links go down as soon as they
go up, but from www.france-echos.com you will find links to these
islamofascist zombies. These islamobarbarians are armed to the teeth with
AK47s, grenades and knives. They have been ready for far longer than we
have.
To those who still believe that Islam is a religion of peace and that
Turkey, Africa, Pakistan, India, Central Asia, the Balkans and Indonesia
were Islamised by peaceful methods, I would suggest you ask yourselves what
happened to their religious minorities. (And why are they minorities in the
first place, if Islam came from elesewhere?)
To those who believe that Moorish Spain was the height of civilization
because the Alhambra looks like a gothic cloister and they have heard of
Avicenna and Averoes and because Jewish scribes translated texts by
Aristotle into Arabic, I suggest you vist the Islamic art section of the
Louvre in Paris. And when you have finished gazing at the repetitive
calligraphy and a few earthenware pots, take a look at the pre Islamic art
in the Louvre. You will find Christian art from North Africa. You will find
Babylonian, Greek, Byzantine, Roman, Jewish, Persian, Greco-Egyptian all of
which make the glories of Islamic art look a child's school project.
To believe that this religion, which forces its subjects to take Arab names,
destroy all that went before, adopt 7th century nomadic tribal legal and
moral codes, treat women and infidels like slaves, deny all art and science
not created by themselves and yet, despite all this, think themselves as
superior beings, belongs to 21st century, is so completely and utterly
stupid that one has to question the common sense of humankind.
France has two choices today. Today means today, not next year or next
generation. Next week the Islamic hordes have agreed via the Internet to
meet on the Champs de Mars on Friday the 11th of November or, on the Champs
Elysees on Saturday the 12th. This has been announced on their Blogs. How
true this is, one can only guess, but as they announced that last night was
going to be the big one, and 1200 destroyed vehicles all over France was the
biggest so far, I would reckon that it is not beyond reason to take them
seriously.
France can choose, to reach an agreement and allow them to live in peace in
their neighbourhoods. They will get brand new mosques, they will continue to
receive state money for not working, and they can quietly continue the
demographic conquest. It will be a parallel world where the laws of the
republic no longer apply. This is the Balkan solution preferred by Giles
Kepel, Tariq Ramadan and to a certain degree, Nicolas Sarkosy. The state
will accommodate their ethnicity. In socialist speak, they will be permitted
"celebrate their diversity", even if it includes polygamy, wife beating or
gang raping of infidel girls. Robberies of infidels will not be examined too
closely. (This is actually pretty much the situation today anyway)
Choice two, is to apply the law of the land. However much it hurts.
If choice two is applied, Europe has a chance to save itself.
If choice one is applied, I invite anyone to point out when appeasement of
those who hate you, has ever brought long term peace.
If you are tired of the crap which passes for analysis on the mainstream
media here are some links for you. If you want to know the truth about Islam
you have several choices.
The best of course would be to ask a child. He or she will point out the
obvious:
Failing that you can of course read Jihadwatch for a few days and ask
questions in the comments section.
http://jihadwatch.org/
The latest news in France can be found here:
http://www.france-echos.com/index.php
And possibly here, although this site is very mocking in tone:
http://no-pasaran.blogspot.com/
And this Scandinavian Blog is also very well written:
http://fjordman.blogspot.com/
More Europe wide news can be found here:
http://gatesofvienna.blogspot.com/
The fate of christians in muslim lands can be seen here:
http://www.barnabasfund.org/home.htm
Just don't ask a muslim about his religion. He will bang on about 5 pillars
but will hide the nasty truth from you because his religion demands of him.
(Unless he is a fully fledged jihadist, in which case he will be quite
honest in his desire to kill infidels)
Don't ask a socialist. (To their joy, Islamism accelerates their program of
the destruction of capitalism). They also believe all religions are equally
bad. Socialists are the useful idiots of Bin Laden, and will be next in
line for the wall, once the islamofascists have finished with the jews and
infidels or transformed them into well behaved dhimmis.
You can read more about Islam from the following authors. Their books can be
found on www.amazon.co.uk
Robert Spencer, Bat Ye'or, Ibn Warraq, Ram Swarup, Serge Trifkovic, Andrew
Bostom, Ayaan Hirsi Ali and Oriana Fallaci
These books all condemn Islam as a religion which extinguishes light,
creativity, joy, lives and indeed, entire civilizations. Some are written
brave ex muslims who live under a death fatwa. The facts are backed up by
quotes, historical examples and anecdotes. People only wish to kill writers
who tell the truth
Writers on Islam who have no death sentence hanging on them are Karen
Armstrong, Gilles Kepel and Bernard Lewis. Edward Said, whilst alive also
never risked a Theo Van Gogh type killing.
I will let you make your own conclusions as to who is telling the truth
about about Islam. Those who risk death, or those who enjoy their Saudi
funded university chair?
Raising the issue of genocide is so childish and extreme. That is not the issue, except for mental midgets spouting off. The issue is that adequate self-defense against a general insurrection might entail killing a great many people. Especially if they have a suicidal mentality. Very chilling.
Excellent article by Paul Belian in the Brussels Journal
---
What is happening in France has been brewing in Old Europe for years. The BBC speaks of “youths” venting their “anger.” The BBC is wrong. It is not anger that is driving the insurgents to take it out on the secularised welfare states of Old Europe. It is hatred. Hatred caused not by injustice suffered, but stemming from a sense of superiority. The “youths” do not blame the French, they despise them.
-snip-
Dyab Abou Jahjah, the young and charismatic Brussels-based leader of the Arab European League, rejects assimilation and demands segregated schools and self-governing, Arab-speaking ghettos. “We reject integration when it leads to assimilation,” Jahjah says: “I don’t believe in a host country. We are at home here and whatever we consider our culture to be also belongs to our chosen country. I’m in my country, not the country of the [Westerners].”
The Western authorities quietly accepted this when they abandoned the suburbs to the immigrants a decade ago. The attempt by the French Interior Minister Nicolas Sarkozy, a second-generation immigrant himself (though not from a Muslim country), to assert the authority of the French Republic over its lost territory has triggered the current civil warfare in France. For the “youths” this is a declaration of war. They are not in Sarkozy’s country but in their own country, where the West promised they could retain their own cultural values and spread them.
Those media that tell us that the rioting
“youths” want to be a part of our society and feel left out of it, are misrepresenting the facts. As the insurgents see it, they are not a part of our society and they want us to keep out of theirs.
---
http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/444
It's Paul Belien, not Belian as spelt above.
I think since most of the West has been taught to despise racism any Muslim punk-ass loser can scream "racism!" and stop most people like a deer in a headlight. This infidel ain't buying it though.
"and a church were set ablaze in the southern fishing town of Sete"
I wonder how many Mosque's have been burned??? Or is to ask this question being "RACIST!!??"
After all, most of the rioting has occured near or around Mosques.
Mr. Ryan is afraid that explanations of just how agressive Islam is will prove his theory of falsly accusing others wrong and will actually help the situation of informing future victims of Islam.
Gee, could you take more than 10 seconds to answer your own psychologically crafty hidden-agenda questions?
Exactly what evidence do you have that disproves HUNDREDS of independent daily reliable news sources.
Malaise erupting into violence in French suburbs - Islamic radicals
What are you, some 15 year old? I supposed you think Saddam Hussein was a good guy.
Islam has nothing to do with race. It has everything to do with deception, aggression, psychological maniuplation. Interesting that 'Ryan' exhibits these very traits.
Nothing wrong with Islam? Ever take more than 30 seconds to study it?
So where's 'Ryan' now? Can't stand by your posts? Have to post-and-run?
Sebastien, bravo! bravo! bravo!
You have said it all, eloquent and truthful a clear analysis of what must be done.
From many in America who stand in solidarity with Europe's fight to stop the Islamic menace, your words ring true.
Thank you Sebastien for saying what must be said.
This is a call to arms, for the French as well as the West to save our culture for future generations.
After France has burned nothing will be the same.
Thank you Robert and Hugh and Jihadwatch for bring us the truth.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Chirac is all talk and no action. The French people are lacking backbone to put an end to the riots. It's no longer international news, it's iternational embarassment!
Great post, Sebastien
Jade wrote that Ryan "simply is trying to understand."
That may be the case, but Ryan seems to be the type who comes seriously hobbled by PC Leftist givens. As such, it would be a miracle if he ever can walk, and understand, again.
Robert,
The comments section is gathering quite a momentum of its own impetus...(or perhaps fueled by events in France). Pretty soon the posts will be too numerous to read...a sure sign of success.
Congratulations on your decision to retain it.
Sebastien, bravo! bravo! bravo...
Very Good.
Thank you Robert and Hugh...Indeed.
JadeDragoness writes:
"American, in all fairness Ryan does not seem like a troll. He doesn't automaticaly reject this Jihad Watch it sounds like he simply is trying to understand."
Huh? He begins by accusing Robert of advocating genocide (false for several reasons!), then insinuates that Robert called muslims "rats" and
finally after being called on it says "well then
what is your message". What would you call him?
First, liar. Second provocateur. Ignoramus also
fits, as does cretin. But "troll" is the hip new Usenet inspired way to say all at once.
The trolls are rather cliche's in their approach. First, the "racist" cry. Well, islam isn't a race, and while there are undoubtedly racists
in the comment section, I for one will say that
I'd be happy to trade every white european mohammadan in my country for black African Christians (I am white) and would far rather that my children marry the latter than the former.
Then there's the variant, that JWers are like Nazis, which, coming from the mohammadans, is
just projection. Most suggestions are more along the lines of deport, and make life psychologically uncomfortable for mohammadans here, by exercising our God given (Constitutional, for my atheist friends ;-) right
of free speech. Ridicule the pervert they worship, in ways they don't like.
Hugh has suggested the Benes decree as a model, and while I think he has something there, I also
think most people aren't ready for that yet. But
we'll see how they react to the ridicule. Anyways, still a far cry from the Nazis.
As far as the blather about Islam being peaceful,
small minority, who do I believe, the apologists or my lying eyes? It's always something, opression in France, or Israel, or Indonesia (those young Christian girls are vicious!) or
India or Sudan. Always someone else's fault.
Ryan, it's not society that's telling the Muslims to keep separate, on the contrary, society is seeking mixing and interaction as part of the necessary process of assimilation. It is Muslims who are demanding to be kept separate, and insist on keeping out the polluting, contaminating influences of the infidel culture. If you look at the developed world, it has consistently thrived through intermixing and free-market choice. Hey, I'm Asian, and I love pizza and peach schnopps!
The Islamic separatism is a brazen attempt to thwart exposure to free-market choice. Well, you cannot arrest cultural evolution, since culture is by its very nature dynamic and can't be held static.
This constant inward-looking amongst Islamists is fostering ghetto-ization and parochialism. Sorry, but those instincts need to be overcome in order to support coexistence, and not stubbornly clung to or justified.
Sebastien: "I enjoyed your last thread. Well done!"
Ryan wrote: "Our culture, through some very tough periods in history and tough decisions, has decided that bigotry is wrong."
"It is not the time to return to dark periods of history when one race had to use a different bathroom or ride the back of the bus."
Please do not confuse the civil rights movement and Rosa Parks with what is happening in France at the present time. Muslims in France aren't being forced to the back of the bus as a result of their dark skin color. I bet, though, that some Frenchmen may be nervous to sit next to a Muslim youth who carries a large back pack on a bus.
As was explained earlier, Muslims aren't one race of people. It is well known that the Muslims in France come from all kinds of backgrounds around the world, but the majority are from Algeria and Morocco. It is also a known fact that the North African Muslims aren't integrating well into French society. There are many reasons for this occurrence.
First, the French Muslims demand to have their own schools, culture, and all encompassing religion at the front and center of French society. Essesntially, they view themselves as a superior group of religious people who deserve to have their way all of the time becasue Allah told them to. If Muslims don't get their way, then they will complain about discrimination (victimization) and will riot until they achieve whatever they want.
Second, many North African Muslims don't put out any effort to become western educated and yet demand to have the best of jobs in French society. They have a rather high level of expectation for success in French society and don't posses the skills to make it happen. Consequently, many Muslim youths are in gangs and make their money through drugs and crime. This is hardly the way to become the darlings of French society.
Let us not forget here that Muslims around the world have been and still are the very worst violators of human rights. The slave trade that operated in Muslim societies by Muslims were undisputably the largest in the world. Some forms of slavery still exist today in parts of the world (Somalia). I can go on and on in describing all of this to you, but won't for the sake of time.
Ryan, please don't play the race card and make victims out of the French Muslims ( as the media is already doing right now ). The rioting French Muslims don't respect French society, they don't like to work, and they have their allegiances in the Middle East, not in France.
Well put, sanman:
"it's not society that's telling the Muslims to keep separate, on the contrary, society is seeking mixing and interaction as part of the necessary process of assimilation. It is Muslims who are demanding to be kept separate, and insist on keeping out the polluting, contaminating influences of the infidel culture."
Of course, many groups, religious and non-religious, have a tendency to keep their identity relatively pure and distinct -- but Islam takes this tendency to a pathological extreme, and it's causing problems, annoyances, inconveniences, mayhem, murder and misery in various parts of the globe now.
After 911: I swear by all that is scared to me, I was ready to sacrifice my life in a heart beat for the country that saved me from the clutches of Islam and gave me my human dignity. I tried desperately to join the effort… Agencies were hiring Muslims left and right: near illiterates, underemployed riffraff with deep seated hatred of the US. I was not discouraged and I took my first chance to join the war on terror with a private military contractor: instead of fighting the global menace, I participated in the biggest American fiasco since Vietnam nay the Civil war. I saw the incredible levels of Dhimmitude and stupidity and it sickened me. However, what sickened me to the core was my sorrow for the optimistic idealist soldiers who sought that they were doing something descent for both America and the Iraqis, and expected that they will turn a corner, change the world for the better, and protect their way of life… I came back heart broken for their tragic fate, dying more by the stupidity of the politicians who send them, the Generals who consider Aljazera in designing their rules of engagement rather than the life of their own.
I lived every failure in conception, planning, and command… I have seen the Muslim citizens of America acting with treason, arrogance, and malice and being rewarded for it, and dedicated infidels from the M.E. punished for their zeal. It got to the point of me saying what a waste? What is the point? Is Iraq worth dying for so the Shiites would have their theocratic state? The answer being no, I left that Hell whole.
Somebody jumps in freezing water to kill themselves and you jump after them… The person is heavy and he is fighting you trying to prevent you from rescuing him, you can not hold on any longer, do you let this person go now, and may be, just many be you have enough strength to swim to shore before hypothermia claims you or he pulls you down with him, you can not bear the guilt though, at this second you have to make the most difficult choice, what do you choose?
The common sense of this microcosmic scenario does not translate well to overall suicidal tendency of the West… I do not want to die for those not welling to save themselves and in the same time are fighting me, pulling me down with them… I do not see the sense or the morality of it… I just can not.
Sebastein,
Great post. A veritable educational kit for the uninformed. Send it to any media outlet that runs quotes to the effect that Islam is a religion of peace.
View from Korea is that France is weak. Western countries should know that it isn't only Islamic countries that see the West as decaying and decadent.
Sebastien,
(sorry for my spelling error above)
Truly we need a brief summary that we can distribute to people, along the lines of your FACT list.
Burning churches on a Sunday?
Shirky, is this still about discrimination and unemployment?
What I have never understood is why western society has this self destructive urge to import this incompatible ideology.
Honestly, what the heck would we loose by not allowing Muslims to settle in the West.
Do we have a death wish? Maybe someone can enlighten me.
Sebastien, bravo! bravo! bravo!
Very fine post Sebastian
I have posted your brilliance here:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1517146/posts
It's not a good thing that none of the rioters have been shot. There should have been several hundred rioters killed already. Heck, at least in New Orleans, for all that Bush and Blanco screwed up, they at least gave a shoot to kill order. This is just sick. Chirac doesn't even have the guts to defend his own country. Totally pathetic!!
'....trolls are rather cliche's in their approach. First, the "racist" cry...'
From a poster above. Indeed, they are. Whether it is "Ryan" or "Shirki" or "Kingky the Schwanz", the approach is identical, the arguments circumvent the issues and accuse the accuser, to somehow whitewash Islam from being a vile and evil cult.
One could suspect that all these identities are the same. Another thing they all have in common is that they all deny about being Mohammedans, which they obviously are since they are unable to apply logical reasoning or arguments that would hold up under scrutiny. So all they are trying to do is to deflect anger and possible damage away from the "ummah"- which can also be their own personal jihad. In other words, all of them play their role:
The storm-troopers burn the cars and shoot at the police, the Imams say they cannot "restrain their youth since they are too angry" and the PR brigades excel in PC and PR to tell the world "No, look everywhere, but it is not Islam that causes it..."
So far it worked.
Just how stupid do they think we are? People will wake up, people have to wake up and chase the silly, corrupt and idiotic polit-propellers like Chirac and DdV out of office. I suspect Szarkozy would have done the right thing, but the grand-master of grimaces, Chirac, probably stopped him.
Oh, by the way: I am writing from Strassbourg today. And yes: They do yell "Allhu Akhbar" when they throw stones, smash windows or burn cars. I was there on New Years eve 2 years ago and I was there last night. I saw it.
What have you got to say about it, "Ryan?"
Will you tell us that it is a "tiny, tiny minority who give Islam a bad name?"
We are also a tiny minority who are growing in numbers, and we will eventually make sure that those "tiny minority" numbers are reduced, radically.
Thanks to Dennisw for reposting my midnight rant. One of your commentators pointed out a possible error in the list of facts.
The source for the planned islamozombie jamboree on the 11th of November is purely rumour picked up on by those who study their blogs. I reported this indirectly from www.france-echos.com
Thanks again for the kind compliments by you and others.
"Muslims in France are not being forced to the back of the bus"
No, but they're not allowed in most nice shops, restaurants and nightclubs in downtown Paris. A shop on the Champs-Elysees that sees an Arab or Black person will suddenly be "closed". Imagine blacks were not allowed in nice American malls. Would that be discrimination? There is also employment discrimination where they are not hired unless no Frenchmen has applied for the job and there is a glass ceiling in corporations which muslims cannot pass. The only French-Algerian CEO says people under him are constantly trying to tie him to terrorist organizations to force him out.
Muslims are 10% of the French population and yet there is not one muslim member of parliament. This may be due to the fact that they do not want to participate in the democracy but it is problematic because nobody is in the government to speak up for their issues.
If this turns out into a pure intifada with guns, rocket launchers, terrorism, etc. and an attempt to overthrow the government, then all of you will be right.
But if it remains as street riots and tones down the in the next week or so, it is probably just for attention and recognition of their issues.
Ryan,
You said:
"But if it remains as street riots and tones down the in the next week or so, it is probably just for attention and recognition of their issues."
Do you think these punks give a damn about human life? Do you think they check the buildings and cars for people inside before they burn them? Do you think they throw their rocks gently? Do you think they shoot their guns just to wound? It is pure luck that no one has been killed yet. Police officers have been shot. A thirteen-month-old infant is in critical condition after being hit with rocks. A disabled woman was set on fire. A pre-school was burned down. A church was burned down. How much more do you need see to arrive at a moral condemnation of these actions?
If Muslims in France "want attention," violence and destruction of property is the best way to turn the other 90% of the population against them.
Now that the French, and other Europeans, are going through the "Whose ox is being gored process," perhaps they will remember the deprecations of their ancestors cause by Islam in an earlier period and they might empathize with those that are now being victimzed in the developing world.
Perhaps as many as 20% of the world is Muslim? That leaves 80% that aren't and are not interested in either becoming Muslims or putting up with "Islam's bloody borders," Sha'ria and all the other accommodations and crap that comes as cultural and religious baggage.
Ryan,
I dont know if it is a fact that Arab or Black people are not allowed in 'most nice shops or restaurants',but I honestly doubt it.
What I do know is that there are huge no go areas for whites and they dont put up polite 'closed signs' to let you know either.
The muslims there dont seem to be an underclass either. They dress in the best gear, drive decent cars and have money in their pockets.
I think they do alright out of the French social security system. More fool the French.
Touche! Sebastian.
Douche! Ryan.
Okay, I'll admit it Ryan, I'm a radical. But, you have to understand that it was Islam that radicalized me. It has made me suspicious of any Muslim with whom I have dealings. No longer can I assume that most Muslims are decent people. Just like the Jews had to view the Germans, I have to assume some level of danger from Muslims. Will the "he was an average American" suddenly decide it is time to throw off the sheep's clothing? I am radicalized because I hate Islam with a passion. Buddhism, Hinduism, Judaism, etc. have my respect even though I disagree with them as a Christian. The more I learn about Islam though, the more I hate it. I don't hate the people stuck in the darkenss that is Islam. However, as long as they are in that darkness, I can't trust them. Too much about Islam is about deceiving the unbelievers and subjugating them.
As a little side story, I knew an engineer who immigrated from India and attended my original church. He was one of the nicest people you would ever meet. He would give you the shirt off his back in a snowstorm. However, when it came to Islam, he became pretty excitable and always ranted about never trusting Muslims. This was before 9/11 and I always took it as more of a result of the Pakistan/India conflict. I was one of those "religions have the same core values" drones. Now, reality has force me to see what the Indian gentleman saw. Islam is incompatible with any other religion in the world. We need to stop immigration and contain it's expansion.
l have my doubts about Chirac, he and his minions have no backbone, and back stabbers, you have to look what they did to the Bush. administrations. they are in bed with the rest of islamicfacists! it will take the regualar working French to find and elect a true leader with some backbone. you will find apologists about why these poor down trodden are rioting... and pretty soon the slick politicians will come out with their people's check book (tax dollars) to buy them some more time! l think it will take a lot more to wake them all up! Hopefully the French can read enough English to read Jihad Watch!
"If this turns out into a pure intifada with guns, rocket launchers, terrorism, etc. and an attempt to overthrow the government, then all of you will be right."
Well, as muslim rioters are shooting at cops, and as a petrol-bomb making site has been discovered, then, yes, it seems we are right. And as the muslim rioters seem to be targetting non-muslim property specifically, yes, we are indeed right.
"But if it remains as street riots and tones down the in the next week or so, it is probably just for attention and recognition of their issues."
Ah. Issues like the unwanted presence of the filthy churches of the filthy kufr too near the ulema. Gotcha. Their issues, sure sure.
Prophet Geoff [beer be upon me]
"This perfect man had sex with a nine year old girl. FACT This perfect man ordered the death of poets who criticised him. FACT This perfect man ordered the death by decapitation of 800 innocent Jews at Banu Quaraiza. FACT [and so on ad nauseum]..."
-- posted by Sebastien
So long as you're giving poor Ryan an object lesson in Islam, Sebastien, do not forget to tell him that Moslems are to emulate Mohammed's sayings and deeds:
PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH
"You have indeed in Allah’s Messenger an excellent pattern of conduct for anyone whose hope is in Allah and the Last Day and who engages much in the praise of Allah."
-- posted by God in Koran 33:21
PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH PBUH
Rape. Theft. Murder. Lying. Pedophilia. Misogyny. Terrorism. Genocide. And Moslems CELEBRATE such behavior! And then, dear Ryan, an explicit order to emulate Mohammed's squalid life.
Is it any wonder that Moslems are the worst people on earth?
How could Mohammed's acolytes morally reconcile what he did, what they helped him do? The didn't. The Moslems were, and are, morally bankrupt.
Moslems, and their awful puke-puddle religion, comprise the world's single biggest problem.
It's just a damned shame that liberals like Ryan and Hugh Hewitt are too god-dammed lazy to crack a book like the Koran or Hadith or Sira and see it for what it is...
"...What I do know is that there are huge no go areas for whites and they dont put up polite 'closed signs' to let you know either..."
From a poster above. How true!
Ryan is a very typical, lying Muhammedan apologist. There is nothing 'liberal' about him.
Mohammedans are not allowed to enter the fancy shops on the Champs Elysees ?
Now why would that be?
Isn't it likely that these shopkeepers already had some rather awful experiences with Mohammedans, who came to steal,(for what else?) to wreck havoc and to intimidate both staff and customers...
I could tell you some rather awful stuff, 'Ryan'- but why bother? As a follower of Mo you are stooped in the seventh century, with a Koran in one hand and a knife in the other, and the coffee-filter you are wearing on your head doesn't allow for anything "un-islamic" to enter what's left of functional brains thereunder...
"No, but they're not allowed in most nice shops, restaurants and nightclubs in downtown Paris. A shop on the Champs-Elysees that sees an Arab or Black person will suddenly be "closed"."
This is just uninformed empty rhetoric... Ryan, why don't you back up your hollow statements? Have you been to Paris and seen something like this ? PROVE to me that such shops close when the owner "sees an Arab or a Black person" -- Your post is fiction, made up to support your supposition that this is purely a racist and "poverty" based issue -- Your arguments are nothing more than PINKO SWILL!
No one here denies that there may be an economic or "racial" aspect to the separatism witnessed in France or elsewhere in Europe -- But the left's mendacity, and their relentless attempts to piggy back their favorite pet projects onto fascist Islam's Jihad is a sickening betrayal of the truth, deserving of contempt, and excoriation...
I rue the fact that so many citizens are still duped by this distortion, by this concealment being peddled by the leftist shills and their friends, the Muslim deceivers.....
Ryan sure, Buddhists, Baptists and Atheists run around burning churches and synogogues while sparing mosques, throwing rocks, shooting at firemen and ploice and shouting "Allhu Akbar" all the time. Absolutely no proof whatsoever these are Muslims. DUMBASS.
RE: Why is it that the same people who believe islam is evil are the ones who want to "liberate" muslims in Iraq?
Because the evil parts come from the "top" down to the "bottom"
Case in point, look at what the "Mad Mullahs" are
trying to do in Iran whom are Persians and have
had their country hijacked by the evil portion of Islam.
PS: Iran is next on the list!
"All that evil needs for to triumph is for good to do nothing"
Evil manifests in many ways, Nazi Germany is just one example and the World lost millions of people to eradicate it.
learjet0450:
You really put the finger on the argument raised against the invasion of Iraq, didn't you? It is precisely the understanding of the malignant and inhumane nature of Islamofascism that motivated Blair and Bush, even if neither of them are willing to call a spade a spade.