The "experts" are right. If Osama and Zawahiri were proven to be dead, it would be a great victory, but it would not end jihad violence. The jihad ideology doesn't depend the presence of a charismatic figure; it is based on deeply rooted religious beliefs. From AP, with thanks to the Constantinopolitan Irredentist:
The Israeli assassins caught Abu Jihad in his study. They left the chief strategist of the Palestinian uprising with 170 bullets in his body. Over the next two decades, however, the movement only grew stronger, and Israel bled even more.It's called "decapitation," and a missile strike in Pakistan has raised the question anew: Would eliminating Osama bin Laden and deputy Ayman al-Zawahri deal a mortal blow to the al-Qaida terror network?
"Decapitation just fuels the movement itself," says Jenna Jordan, a University of Chicago scholar who has closely studied the historical record of such antiterrorist tactics.
"I think that is the lesson of the Israeli efforts over the years," says Brian Jenkins, veteran terrorism analyst with the RAND Corp. research firm.
But, he quickly adds, "that doesn't mean you don't do it."
The Jan. 13 missile strike on a remote Pakistani border village showed again that the U.S. government is still trying to do it.
The early-morning attack, reportedly aimed at al-Zawahri, killed 13 villagers and possibly a few second-rank al-Qaida operatives - but not the bin Laden lieutenant. Its immediate impact could be seen in the streets of Pakistani cities, where thousands rallied, chanting "Death to America," in support of al-Qaida's "jihad," or holy war.
By Thursday, bin Laden's voice was being broadcast throughout the Muslim world, threatening a new terror strike against America.
"The Pakistan case, where you have all those people killed, that's the kind of `bad press' that keeps a movement going," said Jordan, whose 2004 study reviewed 72 international cases, stretching back almost a century, in which militant movements' leaders were targeted and killed.
In most cases, she found, the movements carried on - particularly if they were religion-based, like al-Qaida. Only one in five violent religious groups collapsed when their leaders were eliminated, she determined.
The Israeli Method involves identifying - and then capturing or killing - between 12% and 25% of the key components of the terrorist organization.
See:
Fighting New Terror - Theory and Israeli Experience
By Isaac Ben-Israel
very good point. the war needs to be on multiple fronts.
so , could someone please tell the christian evangelical's in the U.S. that they should wake up to the persecution of Assyrian and Coptic Christians in the middle east - rather than banging on about Israel and "rapture" all the time.
The Evangelical's have their heart in the right place (support of Israel). But they could be turned into an extremely effective propaganda brigade waking people up to the death cult of Islam.
Their inordinate focus on Israel and "rapture" stuff, means that they are currently ineffective in the war against the death cultists.
Bin Laden and Al-Qaeda are only a few trees in a the huge forest of the Islamist movement that is based on basic Islamic principles. Islamism is a movement that is not tied to the direction of just a few individuals. In fact, the Koran mandates that all Muslims are obligated to do Jihad.
"Terror" is only one facet of Jihad. While we are fascinated and focused on bombs and violence, the other jihadists, the diplomats, economists, rich petrobillonaires, educators, and so on are also waging jihad. They are "hiding out in the open," creating conditions for the eventual take over and implementation of Islam, Sha'ria and dhimmitude in the West. These people are more effective and more dangerous to the continuation of freedom and Western civilization.
What the "scholars" have overlooked - perhaps because anything that predates their birthday does not exist - is the only wars we have won have been wars that we have waged ruthlessly, persistently and with the clear objective of destroying our enemy.
We would still be fighting in Germany if lawyers had been attached to our combat units, public opinion polls allowed to shape strategy and if the order to verify nazi status before shooting had been given. Not to mention prosecuting our troops for conducting war....
What we are learning, and the Isrealis should clearly understand, is that piecemeal approaches to fighting an enemy only prolongs the effort and emboldens the opposition.
We need to identify radical islam, its supporters and its enablers and crush them. Crush them convincingly and without hope of repair. Clearly send the message that this is a path to self destruction.
Harbor Bin Laden and deny us access? You will face our wrath - not our foreign aid. We will take him out and as many of you as necessary. When bullets follow warnings - immediately and starting at the top - fewer and fewer warnings will be needed.
We spend untold billions on equipment, training and logistics on the finest fighting force the world has ever seen and then our so-called leaders are too timid to unleash them.
The result? Americans living with intolerable conditions here at home because of a few barbaric mutts. Our fine men and women dying abroad one by one. Lawyers making millions while they strangle our efforts.
Worst of all, we are filled with self righteous politicians making political hay over a situation that none of them have the courage to confront.
John Bolton had the right idea. Get rid of Kofi? Nahhh, get rid of the top ten floors. Rebuild in our favor - or get the hell out of our country.
well, i can only speak for France, and theres no sign of dhimmitude taking over there - they get 80 per cent of their electricity needs from nuclear power. Chirac then comes on with his "nuke threat". And Jean Marie Le Pen came 2nd in the last presidential elections. And you have to factor in the French "hijab ban" in schools. Yup - they dont really give a shit - you're either French or your not.
As for the UK - yeah, its well on the way - unless the Tories get back into power.
the war needs to be on multiple fronts.
I've gotta disagree. There war needs a front. And that would be on the edge --- whether intranational or international --- where Moslems meet non-Moslems.
That's the place to fight. We will be confronted with frontlessness when this passing fancy of seeding democracy into Dar al-Islam is done.
No one ever said that "killing the head" would end the terrorism", but slectively killing the leadership most certainly will make anyone claiming leadership spend a lot, if not most of their time looking out for their own wellfare, and less time planning attacks on us. Ben Laden has been reduced to one audio tape in a year, rather than several videos a month, and his ability to communicate now depends on couriers with notes, rather than satellite phones. It's not perfect, but it is progress. Eliminate his ability to "command and control" and I don't care if he's dead or not; in effect, he's "almost" dead because if he can't run the show, he's meaningless.
This same argument goes with those against the death penalty. They say taking the life of a convicted killer does not stop crime, but I beg to disagree. That dead sob will never harm someone else.
Keep eliminating those that preach hatred and death to the west and once you have eliminated enough, there will be peace in the world even if it takes nukes across the Middle East.
This insane notion that you can live or have to live in peace with the hatred and violence and murdering of Muslims is absolutely unbelievable.
If Islam is so great, why aren’t they attacking in American as they did in France, Europe and Israel?????
The war for our freedom is coming and it is near.
Be prepared.
Be ready.
The Texican
This same argument goes with those against the death penalty. They say taking the life of a convicted killer does not stop crime, but I beg to disagree. That dead sob will never harm someone else.
Keep eliminating those that preach hatred and death to the west and once you have eliminated enough, there will be peace in the world even if it takes nukes across the Middle East.
This insane notion that you can live or have to live in peace with the hatred and violence and murdering of Muslims is absolutely unbelievable.
If Islam is so great, why aren’t they attacking in American as they did in France, Europe and Israel?????
The war for our freedom is coming and it is near.
Be prepared.
Be ready.
The Texican
Message to bin Laden and Zawahiri from the men and women of the USAF 11th and 15th RECON SQ:
"Peek-a-boo, we see yoooooo!"
Previous post lost the link in the preview:
Message to bin Laden and Zawahiri from the men and women of the USAF 11th and 15th RECON SQ:
"Peek-a-boo, we see yoooooo!"
Fuggemall. If they want to harbor terrorists, then they can watch closely, carefully, and with wide eyes... while the USA. Blows. Their. Crap. To. Pieces. Yes. Pieces.
The "religion" of "pieces".
They brought it upon themselves. They've had enough time to separate themselves from the lunatic fringe. Enough time to declare their solidarity with the Western World. They have miserably failed to do so.
Our patience has run out.
So, FUGGEMALL. Specially that dude in the dinner jacket.. what's his name.. AhmadinaDinnahJacket?
Fuggemall.
ARCHDUKE ur exactly right, all these end of the world Christians take the scriptures out of context. Their horrible theology hurts America or any society for that matter. About this piece though...Osama will NEVER be dead until every one of his soldiers is destroyed. Satan's #1 man. Osama's personal task is completed. Whether his body exists on this earth or not, his ideology has spreaded like wildfire...like when you try and put out a fire by blowing on it. Some parts go out but the fire just gets bigger overall. Good news is that we have a little time (hopefully). I'm going to get in the baby stroller business and setup stores in the minority neighborhoods. Hey why not? There's tons of demand there.
Texican,
I hear ya! My readiness comes in the form of a Baretta 92FS with a Colt 'Commander' as backup. And a pistol gripped pump action tactical Remington for crowd control and a double barrelled coach gun in case it gets up close and personal. Lock and load..
This is hardly an astute or even new comment, as you could say the same about communist cells in the west or even Nazi cells likewise.
By its very defintion organised terror in the west is cellular and apart from targeting, almost totally autonomous.
Israel well knows this and its main reeason for dropping missiles into toilet windows is retribution and so it should be.
The major point in chopping off the head is for retribution and/or morale purposes. However, every so often you have a charismatic (and as I do not understand Arabic I have no idea if bin laden qualifies here) and taking them out does permanent damage to both direction and morale.
You MUST always chop the heads off the Hydra but this is not the end, just the beginning of the end(errr sorry Winston).
I also think that nonIslamic nations should build gaols specificially for Muslim terrorists so that they cannot contaminate prison populations as they are doing here.
"'Decapitation' May Not End Terror"
Hmmm...was looking for the proper thread to post this so as not to be too off-topic:
Islam Beheaded
Most regular readers here have probably already seen the article but I recommend it as an excellent article for people to simply email to even their more remote acquaintances (FPM has an easy email feature). No explanation required. Or, if one feels compelled to include a comment, FPM has an easy comment feature, which enables one to add a comment like this to a group email:
"Hey guys! Check this out! Wow! This Islam thing is in the news so darned much these days I thought y'all might find this article kind of interesting!"
Then you press the "send" button, and sort of grin to yourself like the proverbial Cheshire cat...:-)
The "scholar" and "analyst" mentioned in the article are either liars, fools, or ignoramuses. Take your pick. They claim that the tactic of wiping out the leadership is ineffectual or counterproductive. What drivel!!
In fact, Israel did not CONSISTENTLY pursue the strategy of "decapitation." If Israel had done so then it would have wiped out arafat long ago. In fact yasser a. was in Israeli sniper gunsights in 1982 in Beirut. But Israel was subject to diplomatic pressures from Western powers, the UN, and the usual assemblage of international freeloaders and hypocrites. That has been true all along, even BEFORE the Six Day War when the US voted against Israel at the UN, chastising Israeli anti-terrorism actions at that time. The "international community" has longed protected Arab anti-Israel terrorism from Israeli self-defense measures. If Israel had consistently and regularly applied the decapitation strategy, then it would have much reduced the anti-Israel terrorism.
In the specific case of arafat in Israeli gunsights in Beirut, Begin had promised the US administration that it would NOT shoot arafat. So the sniper was told not to shoot him.
Intelligent Americans should not take the so-called experts seriously, especially not those from the RAND Corp. which is a notorious factory for strategic delusion.
Good point about the Rand Corp. Why do we elect politicians who then use our money to pay others to think for them?
Archduke, I can't think of one thing the Tories will do that can or will stop dhimmitude in Britain. Even a few of their MPs backed up the Muslim view that we're too decadent here in Britain. People who warn about what Islam has in store for us are readily branded as bigots or fascists by the rest of the population. This is a corrosive PC mindset amongst the population at large that will take many years, and I fear a lot of 911-style atrocities to eradicate - years that sadly we don't have.
In effect, this means that the Imperialistic Islamic war is made up of ALL heads.
The jihadist movement from the Koran makes all of its followers interchangeable potential leaders.
The only answer: kill every head that pops up with this theocratic despotic terroristic message on its lips.
And keep killing them until they realize the fatal futility of this creed.
Or are all dead.
Cancer works on the same principle.
You don't stop fighting for your life because it is tedious or painful or bloody or maddening.
The alternative is the "peace" of the tomb. Mentally and spiritually. Bowing to 7th century headlock and moral primitivism of the Koran.
The hydra grew a new head whenever one was cut off.
Unless you cauterized the stump.
Getting Bin Laden will cauterize that 'stump'.
And demonstrate that we will defend our hard-won freedoms against all maniacs with yet another Holy Plan to imprison the species.
Send them to hell to see their plan in its pristine perfection.
Caroline,
Re: Islam Beheaded article. I think this article (link) is not OT.
The author in the original posting above was intellectually crippled by our university system. From that article:
'"Decapitation just fuels the movement itself," says Jenna Jordan, a University of Chicago scholar"'
That is, fighting back is the cause of the all the trouble. What is needed is therapy, of course, not violence
The Islam Beheaded article opines that the internet is the beginning of the end of Mohammedanism. I think that is true (witness JW/DW), because the truth about Islam and Mohammed is what will destroy this cult. And it must be destroyed, just as Nazism was destroyed.
The sad thing (revolting, if you ask me) is that American (Western) academia, who should have been the first to raise the alarm to protect civilization from the Mohammedan onslaught, instead are tirelessly defending this indefensible fascist ideology masquerading as a “religion.”
The other sad thing, is that the willful obfuscation of the truth by academia and their mentally crippled offspring—clueless politicians and media people--guarantees the that war to save civilization from Islam will be long, bloody, and result in millions of casualties across the globe.
Our corrupted academic institutions are bona fide traitors to civilization and to humanity. They have no integrity. They have no shame. They take no responsibility for their actions. Those are traits they share with the Muslim fanatics. Barf.
"Decapitation just fuels the movement itself," says Jenna Jordan, a University of Chicago scholar"'
Stendec - of course her statement implies that Osama et al are the "heads" that drive Islamic terrorism. She is obviously of the "tiny minority of extremists have hijacked a great religion" ilk.
You said - "the truth about Islam and Mohammed is what will destroy this cult."
I agree. Now you're talking Decapitation with a capital D!! For decapitation to work, you have to go after the actual HEAD, which the Wood article correctly identifies as the prophet Muhammad. Muslims know this, which is why as Wood implies, they are getting frantic as the truth about Muhammad is spreading.
Mr. Mahdi dajjal wrote
"Texican,
I hear ya! My readiness comes in the form of a Baretta 92FS with a Colt 'Commander' as backup. And a pistol gripped pump action tactical Remington for crowd control and a double barrelled coach gun in case it gets up close and personal. Lock and load..
"
So Mr.Macho Anti-Christ (your name translated), have you enlisted yet. You murderous thugs are getting their butts handed to them in Iraq. When are you going to go there and help them out with you "Colt 'Commander'"?
All of you who want to kill all the Muslims, you may have to end up killing your own children, as they are coming to Islam in large numbers. First it used to be mostly young black males, then there were young white females, and now we are beginning to see young white males.
MAY ALLAH BLESS AMERICA
"Murderous thugs" Batilshikan?
That's pretty ripe coming from someone who reveres a notorious "murderous thug" as the final prophet of God's word, as the "perfect" man.
Mahdi Al-Dajjal is just some anonymous poster on the internet, doing nothing but talking. He's nobody. But look how riled up by his mere words you are.
Meanwhile, you revere as the perfect man, someone who actually had 800 people beheaded! What a damn hypocrite you are. LOL!!
"All of you who want to kill all the Muslims, you may have to end up killing your own children, as they are coming to Islam in large numbers."
Noone here wants to kill Muslims, unless you come after us. We leave the gratuitous Muslim killing to you. It's what you do best, isn't it? Kill people? Just like your murderous prophet? And when you can't exercise your killing instinct on infidels, you busy yourselves massacring eachother. Saddam slaughtered his own people. Zarqawi is blowing up his fellow Muslims left and right. Palestinians are murdering their wives and daughters.
I actually used to care about all that. I actually cared about all the Muslims that Saddam killed - all the mass graves. Now I realize that bloodthirsty killing just runs in your Muslim veins and that you all ought to be cordoned off some place, preferably with padded walls, but far far away from the rest of us.
Who is providing the "insurgents" with food and arms? Even if they work for free, they need food to eat and explosives to continue their attacks.
While killing the generals won't stop the attacks
depriving them of supplies (killing the quartermaster) certainly will.
So who is supplying the terrorists???
Catherine,
I plead with you to get yourself a frontal lobotomy, as you obviously are criminally insane, and suffer from violent delusions. Your hatred for Muslims is just Satan working through you. I pray that Allah show you the right way, and put you on the path of Islam. May He guide you away from Satan (the rejected one)
to those who said Iraq had nothing to do with Bin laden.. why did Bin Laden "man in the cave" offer a truce if the US withdraws from Afganistan and Iraq? mmmmm.... there are many pieces to the puzzle... getting rid of the pieces takes time,, and it helps to squish the saudi brave man in the cave! Bin landen the coward who brainwashes losers to blow themselves up.. when he stays where its safe!!!
"I pray that Allah show you the right way, and put you on the path of Islam."
That would be the path that led Muhammad to order 800 men beheaded and his critics assassinated? Ummm...thanks for the invitation but I'll have to pass on that one.
Batilshikan,
Everybody sees that islam is a murderous deathcult which thrives on bloodlust. When you're not killing Jews, you're killing infidels. Otherwise, you're killing each other.
One of the posters here on another thread said it best: "The only thing muslims hate more than themselves is everybody else."
Two things:
1) People would leave islam if it didn't mean an automatic death sentence for them and their families.
2) If islam is the true path then why does islam make it a death sentence to preach any other religion in islamic lands?
To me, these two things prove that islam isn't anything but a cult working overtime to keep it's followers captive. It's beyond pathetic.
It's sad that you are forbidden from having a life outside of the religion of 'total submission'. And if you try to have a life outside of islam then you are murdered by your fellow followers of the religion of peace. What a sick twisted deathcult you've got yourself in. Too bad you can't get yourself out. Islam IS a lobotomy.
I've got weapons so that neither YOU nor anybody ELSE is going to drag me and my family into that deathcult. Death before dishonor.
Everybody sees that islam is a murderous deathcult which thrives on bloodlust.
How I wish that were true. But most people actually think that Islam is a religion. For example, it is referred to as a religion tens of thousands of times in these pages.
Most think that Islam is so messed up because many of its adherents are Arabs... and we all know about Arabs.
But, when one points out that non-Arab Moslems --- i.e., Fake Arabs --- are just as bloodthirsty, they stop and wonder about the ideology. You know, Fake Arabs like Abyssinians, Nigerians, Persians, Turks, Chechens, Pakis, Malays, Indonesians, Phillipinos.
Fake Arabs all, and damned good Moslems to boot.
I mean, I'm getting thirsty for some human blood just talking about all these Fake Arabs. I'm gonna go knock over a blood bank and grab me some bottles.
Remember the punk song Turning Japanese? It should be updated ot a much more realistic scenario and re-titled Turning Arab. We're all Arabs now. Or soon will be.