Anti-dhimmitude in Nigeria: Christian leader speaks out

Expect two things:

1) Most of the MSM will not even mention this man or his words.

2) They will be More than pleased to cough up anything a muslim speaker has to say.

Goes to show that the Christian community world wide is starting to get fed up with the Muslim violence. God Bless this Archbishop of Nigeria.

Jesus said to the other cheek, but, did he say do it twice or indefinately?

I think conflict is a difficult matter for Christian theology, and you won't find a single answer.

As regards the passage you refer to, I suppose one response might be that this is an injunction not to take revenge for an injury to oneself. However, there is, as far as I am aware, no Biblical injuction not to protect others from injury.

Many ethical writings from other traditions do, in fact, make specific note of a duty to protect the weak and those against whom violence is offered. C. S. Lewis listed several in his llustrations of the Natural Law - see Section 8 (a).

However, it must be said that none of these comes from a New Testament source. One is, however, from Hooker who was a major theologian of the Anglican church.

There is, of course, the concept from the Schoolmen of the Just War. Here is an question from The Summa Theologica where St Thomas considers the question Whether it is always sinful to wage war?.

The above is offered "as is". I am not a theologian, and while I had a Christian upbringing, it is many years since I have attended any Christian service.

Pardon the totally OT post. Don't see a good thread for this piece about ideological warfare(called "Gramscian Damage"):

http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=260#

Imagine, being upset and blowing up buildings, killing innocent people, staging violent protests and threatening the lives of others.

Why?

Because someone creates cartoons and suggests islam is a violent religion?

Where in the world would they get that idea?

If you don't submit to the religion of peace - off with your heads!

Wow.

I know, lets sell them ports in our country. That will appease them and they will immediately stop terrorism.

Worked with Hitler, didn't it.

What a polite, respectful manner this Archbishop has compared with his Muslim counterparts. Eloquent and articulate too, of course, but I fear his words will fall on stony ground.

Interesting article Caroline. My disagreement comes where the author predicts either a return to classical liberal values or an expurgation of Leftism through the triumph of a "Francoist" tryranny.

There is a third alternative, more likely than either of the other two. And that is the civilizational decay and eventual death that Stalin had in mind when he conceived his attack on Western culture.

There is a third alternative, more likely than either of the other two

Actually you can only have one alternative, though you may have two or more options.

/boring pedant mode off.

My ex said I was anally retentive, but he spelt it wrong, so I got the last laugh.

Some where in the gospels Jesus said "Be wary as serpents and gentle as doves." *cough* Anyone who has a bird feeder and doves just might have noticed how "gentle" those birds can be. They won't pick fights but they sure will defend what they see as their's.

While it's understandable to want to play nice with the other children it's not possible to do so when the other children are killing you, burning down your houses, churches and businesses.

It's obvious that their government will do nothing to stop the muslims from slaughtering them so they will have to defend themselves.

I keep saying that it is Black Christians who will be the force to be reckoned with in this struggle.

I have posted this before on the subject of how turning the other cheek can be an assertive action.
This is from the book Son of Man by Angela Tilby (an Anglican priest) which accompanied the BBC series of the same name.

Jesus’ teaching on non-violence is so well known that it has become part of everyday language. “Turning the other cheek “or “going the extra mile” (Matthew 5:39-42) have often been seen as examples of extraordinary Christian forbearance in response to others assertive behaviour. This interpretation has been useful to bullies and control freaks. ….
Playwright Dennis Potter, in his play about Jesus “Son of Man” had a scene in which Jesus was struck across the face. Jesus “turned the other cheek” by thrusting the other side of his face towards his assailant, defiance in his eyes, but without the slightest attempt to retaliate. The gesture startled the aggressor, displaying back to him the consequence of violence and making him look rather foolish.

Is this what Jesus meant? One of the scholars who has researched this aspect of the teaching of Jesus is Tom Wright formerly of Oxford University and now a Canon of Westminster Abbey in London. Putting the words of Jesus into context, he shows how Jesus introduces these teachings on retaliation by comparing what he is saying with what had been taught in the past. The law of Moses said an injustice should be avenged, but in proportion “an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth” (Deuteronomy 19:21) In it’s time this was sensible and humane teaching…… But Jesus is facing a situation where violence is not between equals. Ultimately the Romans were in charge and expected compliance. This meant that a different strategy was called for. Tom Wright explains that in the first-century world of Jesus a blow given to the right side of the face was given with the back of the hand. It was meant to humiliate as well as hurt. Turning the face was a kind of defiance, since the aggressor would either have to use the left hand to repeat the blow or strike with an open hand. Either way, turning the other cheek was an assertion of equality, a refusal to accept the intended humiliation. The instincts of the dramatist come together with scholarship tosuggest a very different understanding of “turning the other cheek” from the traditional meek and mild one. It is not about those who are dominated accepting their punishment, but the exact opposite. It requires them to assert their dignity.

Senior moment there.
The book is really called Son of God. By Angela Tilby ISBN 0 340 78646 9
Hodder & Stoughton, London, 2001

I look into my crystal ball and see many future headlines of the form "Anti-Islamic Violence," as the Chrisitans fight back.

And, of course, the articles will not mention any of the "Anti-Christian Violence" that precipitated the response, nor the desperate, failed policy of appeasement that the Christians attempted first.

---

Does anyone else now, when catching a glimpse of CNN or Fox, or listening to NPR--anything, really--just get a pit in their stomach realizing that the USA and the rest of the world are just in complete denial about the threat we're facing?

NPR spends an hour talking about the ethics of having physicians present during executions. You've got to be kidding me. THIS is what is important to our world today!? HBO does "hard hitting, cutting-edge investigative journalism" about... what... dealing dogs to labs!

So depressing...

Granny Weatherwax says:"I keep saying that it is Black Christians who will be the force to be reckoned with in this struggle"
Yes indeed. though I am not a Black,I really admire the strong faith and guardian ship of Christianity in the hands of the Black community.Just drop in to any of the Black churches,and see the spirit with which they worship the Lord. When ever they win a trophy,first thing they do is - kneel down in front of all,and give a thanks to God.They openly thank Jesus in a crowd. The White Christians have to learn a lot in the up keep of faith from these coloured people. In Australia, two Pastors were taken to court for telling that the Koran teaches Muslims to kill non-believeres(which is a fact)But that white Judge punished these two Pastors to either three months jail term, or to under go a course in Islam. These Pastors prefered to go to Jail. These two Pastors were form INDIA.
Again,in Pakistan,when a sole State Christian criket player by name Yousuf Yohanan was coaxed to convert to Islam,for the bounty of becoming a captain ,his poor parents disowned him,inspite of this prodigal son promising them a luxurous life,if they too convert to Islam.They still live in the tatched hut like house in Pakistan-as Christians.
I can go on and on with the stuggle these unsung Christins of colour to up keep their faith alive,and the courage they have to protect their faith from the advercities particularly in the Muslim Countries..Every day they are killed for being a Christian. These people are the real heroes and martiers for Christianity,which the West will never recognise..
How I wish our Western Govenments immigrate all these persecuted Christians from Muslim countries Like Pakistan, Labanon,Palestine,Indonesia,Bangladesh etc,instead of importing unwanted,trouble creating people as REFUGEES who ,after fattening in our countries,burn our own flags,and kill our own people.

The declaration of independence of Biafra by the Christians living, and suffering, in Nigeria, was prompted by pogroms carried out against them in northern cities by Muslims. That war lasted from 1967-69. It was, as Colonel Ojukwu said in the Ahiara Declaration, a war of self-defense against "the Jihad." The war lasted from 1967-1969.

The Western world abandoned the Christians of Biafra, most (though not all) of whom, were identified with the Ibos. Only two countries in the entire world offered Biafra diplomatic recognition: Ghana, and Israel. For all of his marxisant faults, Kwame Nkrumah ("Osagyefo")always mistrusted Islam. And Israel, one of whose citizens, Ulli Bieir, had lived in Nigeria and with scholarship and sympathy, collected and studied the artifacts of Igbo-Ukwu civilization, naturally had sympathy, back then, for those facing what, back then, the Israelis comprehended had a clear connection to the relentless Jihad that they too had endured and would always endure (they saw things more clearly 35 years ago).

The Muslim world gave all kinds of aid to the Muslims of northern Nigeria. Egyptian pilots strafed, at will, Ibo villages, killing tens of thousands who, of course, had not even a rifle to use against those merrily murdering pilots. The argument was made that "Nigeria had to be kept intact." Why? "Because Nigeria is the largest black country." So? "And that is a matter of black pride." What black pride? The pride of the Ibo? Of the Ogoni? Of all the southern Christian Nigerians who had suffered and are still suffering, from the Muslims who run, and staff, the so-called army of Nigeria?

The oil, like the oil in the Sudan, is in the lands of the Christians. But the revenues are largely used by the Muslims. The Western world completely abandoned the Biafrans. The only good articles were those by Renata Adler that appeared in The New Yorker. Everyone else forgot about Biafra. Who cared?

Should the Western world have a chance to support the Christians enduring daily oppression and insecurity from Muslims, all over West Africa, it should welcome that chance. If the Christians of Nigeria try again for independence, do not ignore them, do not ignore Egyptian pilots strafing Christian villages or other kinds of Muslim military and diplomatic support. Side with the Christians. In the Ivory Coast, the French chose to ignore the fears of Islam that are clearly part of what agitates the followers of Laurent Gbagbo, who has been trying to prevent his country being demographically islamized by those entering, and settling in, the north of the country. Elswhere, Christian leadrs have been bribed to reamin indifferent to, or support, the mosque-and-madrasa building funded by Saudi money, and to ignore as well the replacement of local marabouts and other features of a gentler, syncretistic African verison of Islam, with the real, and therrefore dangerous, thing.

Support Black African Christians everywhere. And make sure that wide publicity is given to their cause, and their plight, and such statements as that above, all over the black churches, and in newspapers, radio stations, television channels, that are directed at black audiences, in America and the United States and France.

It is obvious that the Hizb ut-Tahrir boys, the missionaries recruiting for the Army of Islam all over the Western world, have targetted the black populations in the West, hoping to capitalize on resentment of, or perceived alienation from, the circumambient society -- and Islam now presents itself as the vehicle of choice to express one's hatred of The System.

A counter-attack should be based on the history of slavery in Islam, on the failure of Muslims to abolish slavery except under outside, Western pressure, on the nature, and extent, and duration, of the Arab slave trade in Africa, especially the "hideous trade" in castrated young boys, only 10% of whom survived the operation in the bush, to arrive at the Muslim slave markets of Cairo, Damascus, Jeddah, Baghdad, Algiers, Constantinople, even Smyrna.

And do not fail to note the treatment of black Africans, enslaved still by Arabs in Mali and Mauritania and the southern Sudan. Nor fail, even, to note the mass murder of black Africans, even those nominally fellow Muslims, in Darfur.

All of this is the truth. None of it is made up. But it needs to be distributed far and wide.

If the American government cannot figure out why it should be supporting the distribution of such information, or supporting black churches that wish to get this informatin out, then it needs to have its collective head examined.

Examine it.

If goverments don't support this man (we know they won't) then Christian churches should issue statements of support. By doing this our politicians are put on the hotseat to address the war that is here.

The African-American churches should have this letter circulated: one for support, and two to slap down the crap that the Nation of Islam and the Black Panthers are putting out there.

This Nigerian pastor should also have a website and bank account number for raising funds from western nations to support and protect these Christians.

All of us complain of the censorship of the muhommad cartoons by the American media. But I would assume that a majority of the people here may go to church occasionally. Has everyone noticed the censorship by the Christian churches to not talk about what is going on. Even if the Christian churches will not address who the enemy is, then why won't they try and help fellow Christians and churches?

Grass roots!

American atheists came out with a response that was just as gaudy some time before, but of course that would never get printed on Jihad Watch

--------------------------------------------

As Riots Continue, Islamic World Must Put its Own House in Order Before Blasting “Insulting” Cartoons Says Atheist Group

An Atheist public policy group charged today that the continued riots and demonstrations by Islamic activists over a series of “blasphemous” Danish cartoons clearly shows the need for Muslims to put their own house in order before threatening the west.

Ellen Johnson, President of American Atheists, said that nations must not be swayed by extremist religious interests, especially when freedom of the press and other liberties are at stake. “First Amendment rights, and the right of individuals to express their opinions in democratic societies, must never be squelched in the name of religious doctrines,” said Johnson.

“Muslims need to realize that Islamo-Fascism institutionalizes the oppression of women, promotes intolerance, wages violence against working class people and intellectuals, and does not serve as a role model for promoting enlightened, free and progressive societies.”

Johnson added that while some may find critical cartoons or writings “offensive,” anti-Semitic and anti-American cartoons are often printed in the Islamic press. “We have a blatant case of selective indignation here,” said Johnson. “And as for the freedom of expression in the West, where’s the concern for instance when the Italian government tries to punish writers like Orianna Fallaci for their opinions?”

“Open societies require discussion and debate, not firebombs, blasphemy laws and threats of assassination.”
Dave Silverman, Communications Director for American Atheists, said that all governments should condemn violent Islamists for exploiting “blasphemous” portrayals of Muhammad to inflame, riot, kill and terrorize. “We should also demand an apology from Islamic leaders who have supported this kind of outrageous behavior,” said Mr. Silverman. “And we need to expose the deafening silence of so-called moderate Muslims for not aggressively speaking out when extremists insult other ethnic, religious or political groups.”

American Atheists is a nationwide movement which defends the civil rights of nonbelievers, works for the separation of church and state, and addresses issues of First Amendment public policy.

Julian: contrary to your statements, anyone who has been on JW for more than a few minutes is aware that your ideological accomplices are all too frequent on it. You are a troll, and I think it quite right - though it shows your complete lack of self-knowledge or humour - that you should name yourself for a bookish, humourless, persecution-minded failure who fawned on the mediocre Salustios and who lasted only two years on the throne before dying in a lunatically misconceived and utterly doomed campaign against Persia, simply because he had read on his books about Alexander of Macedon doing it.

To the rest: Peter Akinola is the leader of the part of the Anglican Communion that is demanding that the money-rich, faith-poor North American Anglicans should go back to being Christian or else leave the Church. And one of his reasons is that he has to deal with Muslims daily, who make all sorts of hay out of such things as "gay marriage" and homosexual bishops.

Paolo, your comments, gave me a good giggle.

First, as to him being humorless, have you ever heard of the Misopogon? I wonder, what did other good Christian rulers of the time, like, oh say Valens take to crticisms or perceived threats to their reign? Tell me, how do his exploits stacks up against those of Valens, or say, Honorius? Your remarks on Julian only show your ignorance of Roman history, because many scholars today regard Julian as the last emperor who had a chance to turn things around. Had not Julian been assassinated by a Christian traitor, and his campaign against the Sassanids been successful, the empire probable would not have split permanently and partially fallen under the reign of that illustrious Christian emperor Romulus Augustulus.

I find it laughable that you take the time to ridicule my screen name (ouch! that hurts!) when your own, whether out of gross ignorance of sheer stupidity, is based upon the name of a silver coin issued in the 16th century by an incompetent and impotent pope, Paul III. The irony of the fact that you name yourself after currency used by Christian ecclesiasts may or may not escape you.

Furthermore that your name (wherever from) is a throwback to an insane ranting lunatic who claimed to have ecstatic visions and who laid down draconian and misogynistic rules for his insane cult group merely shows the character of your putrid life. That anyone would follow such a cult, based on the life of shameful charlatan who deceived poor, oppressed, and uneducated persons by way of cheap tricks and contrite, stolen Cynic wisdom, who died a shameful, scandalous death as a result of a needless, reckless, and malevolent act of violence at a turbulent and inopportune time, tells us something very sad about the human condition.

As for Cardinol Kanoli, although I support his declaration against the mad Saracens and their ignoble cult, I cannot hold the man as anything other than the homophobic hate-mongering bigot he is. When the gay members of his own church assembled in Nigeria to have their rights and dignity as simple human beings recognized, this man attacked them, and largely thanks to him the "loving Christians" of the (southern) Nigerian police force, very likely at his bidding, broke into their meeting, beat them all, and dragged them off to (wonderful Nigerian) prison, much as Socrates and Nelson Mandella in our own day. The man is a hate-monger and a bigot, and if the only voices speaking out against the Jihad are such as his, then the kaafir are in a bad way indeed.

Oh, and if anyone doesn't believe me...

http://www.nigeriavillagesquare.com/content/view/2121/62/

Nigeria's gay men and lesbians regularly face harassment and arrest, gay activists here say. The criminal code bans acts "against the order of nature," and imposes sentences of up to 14 years for those convicted. In practice, gay men are often arrested and jailed until they can bribe their jailers to let them go...
...Indeed, in October, Mr. Mac-Iyalla and several other members of Changing Attitudes Nigeria (a group working for acceptance of gay Nigerians) were arrested after their first meeting, which drew several dozen people, after police officers found literature for the meeting in their car. Mr. Mac-Iyalla said he was kicked in the head by one of the officers, and he spent several days in jail without being charged or taken before a judge, although that is not unusual for people arrested in Nigeria. "There was no reason to arrest us other than that we were openly gay," he said.

Interested: That's the best laugh I've had all day. Thanks.

Let us also not forget the Jihad being conducted against Christians in Indonesia - in particular on the island of Sulawesi, a Christian majority island but now being inundated with immigrants muslims.

Right on, Peter Akinola!

It's great that the African Churches aren't infected
with this weird maliase that has gripped Western
Churches.

Julian: your suggestion that the millions, maybe tens of millions, of Italians named Paolo, of whom I am proud to be one, are all named for a sixteenth-century coin, gives the level of your intellectual ability and learning. And Akinola, whose name you misspell, is not and cannot be a Cardinal, being an Anglican. That shows your level of learning about Church affairs. That he is hated and slandered by propagandists for sodomy like yourself is to be expected, since he is the most formidable enemy of their entryist tactics and their attempted takeover of churches where they do not belong; therefore keep your propaganda to yourself, those of us who know something about church affairs have seen it already. Finally, your unquestioning acceptance that Julian the Murderer was "stabbed by a Christian traitor" rather than killed by the disease that ravaged his army, whom he had taken to complete disaster, shows the level of your critical intellect. And don't try to teach history to me, twit; with the exception of Hugh, there is nobody on this site whom you are less likely to impress.

"turning the the other cheek" simply means that we should not take ourselves too seriously. As anyone who has ever woken up from a barroom fight knows, it would have been better to have just walked away. Jesus in this case is telling us not to be distracted by petty quarrels and creating bad blood. In any case we have only two cheeks, He left the subsequent responses open. Nowhere did He say however that if they burn down one church we should offer two more to be burned. Neither did He say that if they rape your wife offer them your daughter also. Those so called 'pacifists' who distort His teaching to cover their cowardice or more likely their hatred of their own societies have a lot to answer for.

Goes to show that the Christian community world wide is starting to get fed up with the Muslim violence. God Bless this Archbishop of Nigeria.

Posted by: bigcatgirl13106

At least I can go to bed now with the knowledge that at least SOMEONE out there has the balls to state the truth and say enough is enough. Bush should send them the best of arms, munitions and training immediately!

Akinola, whose name you misspell

-----------------------------------

I deliberatly misspellED Akinola's name, genius. I thought "Cardinal Kanola(i)" sounded funny.

Finally, your unquestioning acceptance that Julian the Murderer was "stabbed by a Christian traitor" rather than killed by the disease that ravaged his army, whom he had taken to complete disaster, shows the level of your critical intellect. And don't try to teach history to me, twit; with the exception of Hugh, there is nobody on this site whom you are less likely to impress.

------------------------------

Dude, you really do need a history lesson.

According to the accepted story, Julian went into battle without his armor (it was a minor skirmish) and was hit by a javelin. He wnt back to his tent, gave instructions to his generals and confidants, and died. And the idea that a Christian traitor killed him was propagated with relish by several Christian writers who took pleasure from the fact that (at least in their own minds) one of their own had struck the fatal blow.

Also, as for him being "Julian the Murderer (that's a new one)", who exactly are you refering to? Who did he murder? Surely, you're not complaining about the Germanic barbarians he killed in his campaigns in Gaul? Or perphaps you are a Zoroastrian Sassanid? Unlike later Christian emperors, Julian reigned with religious tolerance. The only churchs he ever broke down were those that had been built over illegally destroyed pagan temples. What "martyrs" are you refering to?

You are a fanatical pseud, but I grant you that you managed to hijack this thread and distract me. So this is my last answer to you. On most of the points where I caught you being ignorant and stupid (e.g. my name) you have not even tried to answer, which shows that you know that you have nothing to answer. To find "funny" the infantile distortion of the name of a man who is standing up and consciously risking his life in a country where Christians are murdered daily, is an indication of the level of your mind. As for Julian the Book-creep; I had noticed the bizarre tendency among certain historians to overrate this overgrown schoolboy who lived and died of ill-digested archaism. It is of course nonsense; except for the insane attempt to turn back time, his reign is only notable for the extinction of the Constantinian dynasty. How anyone can be moron enough to imagine that Julian could have done anything to alter the fate of the Western Empire is beyond me, since the disaster began with the battle of Adrianople (376) when Julian had been dead thirteen years. It is like saying that General Patton could have won the Vietnam war.

The only thing that is evident about Julian's two-year reign is that he was preparing for a Diocletian persecution. When you consider how long it took Diocletian, from a much stronger position, to organize his attempt to exterminate the Church, you must realize that the fact that, in two years, Julian the Murderer had not started one, proves less than nothing. He had spent his time getting his ducks in a row. He systematically expelled Christians from all leading offices, and especially from the significant post of city orator (your hero Libanios was one of his nominees, and incidentally was allowed to remain in place by Julian's successors). The Pagans smelled the wind - if they were not encouraged to do so by concealed imperial action - and outbreaks of ground-level violence broke out in various places in the East (and, if I read St.Patrick and the archaeological evidence correctly, something happened in Britain as well). Several martyrdoms are on record. This is the classic way in which governments prepare the road for the massacre of political or religious opponents, as those who read JihadWatch know all too well. His death in a misguided campaign averted the disaster, and if a legend spread among the Christians (who, in fact, had behaved very meekly) that he had been killed, it was because they must have realized what they had just escaped.

This is my last word on the subject and to you. Any further sqwawks will be met with silence. So convince yourself that you have silenced me - "fighting the base with base weapons", as Mary Renault so wonderfully put it, disgusts me, and I want nothing more to do with you.

Julian- you are going out of track in this blog. Please write something connected either to Nigerian illtreatment to Christians,or about the bold stand of ArchBishop Peter Akinola has taken against it..Nobody is interested in American atheist movement here.