Of course, that is exactly what Western governments want so very much to do. "Captive reporter: 'There is very short time,'" from CNN, with thanks to Jeffrey Imm:
(CNN) -- Abducted American journalist Jill Carroll appeared in a video broadcast on Kuwaiti television Thursday, urging the U.S. government to meet her kidnappers' demands.On the video, Carroll says she is OK.
"I'm here. I'm fine. Please, just do whatever they want. Give them whatever they want as quickly as possible. There is very short time. Please do it fast," she says. "That's all."...
In the video, Carroll says the date is February 6, then she shakes her head and corrects herself: "February 2, 2006."
In the video, Carroll wears a hijab, or Muslim headdress, and appears more composed than she did during a video broadcast January 30, in which she was weeping.
"I sent you a letter written by my hand that you wanted more evidence, so we're sending you this new letter now just to prove that I am with the mujahedeen," Carroll says in English on the tape, broadcast on AlRai television....
Nothing better demonstrates the cowardly nature of these "people." Justice is giving to every person that which they deserve. Does Jill deserve this? This crime done to Jill is something I believe the Almighty will avenge in time and eternity.
I shudder to think what I would do in this situation.
I am unmoved by Jill's plight. If you dance with the devil, be prepared to pay the fiddler.
We can argue about her cluelessness but that's still redounds to her. She went to the ME, she believed she knew the true measure of Islam. Maybe she did, maybe she didn't. Maybe she's being honest and wants to be released, maybe she just wants the $ to help them. It's really impossible to say.
In this very strange war we are all soldiers. The enemy has made it thus. She's become a tool in the war.
It's all about just giving them what they want. That's what the whole war is about. Why should we give them what they want? Because they say so? Because they take a pretty little thing hostage? Because she's an American? How many Americans should die so Jill can come home? How many is she worth? Does she have intrinsic value and is worth any number of soldiers or if we give the money or release prisoners, the deaths of more soldiers/Iraqi civilians who will be killed because the Revenge Brigade is emboldened and enriched/possibly Americans here killed by further terrorist attacks? What is her intrinsic value if she has encouraged or will encourage by her writing our enemy? Is it morally incumbent upon us to save our enemies? Would I ask these questions if it was Oriana Fallaci who was captured? Would Oriana Fallaci have been taped tearfully begging for her life? Does that make a difference?
I wonder what her final fate will be. I can only hope for the best.
But the US mustn't aquiesce to their demands - the west has shown far too much weakness to the umma already. Only hard stances will speak to these people in a meaningfful way. Anything soft will only lead to more brutality on their part in the future.
I don't quite understand...this is her third video, in each video she states that if the kidnappers demands are not met there will be some sort of consequence. So far the only consequence I've seen is another video. Why didn't Nick Berg get a chance to make 3 or 4 videos, why do they keep pushing her deadline back and back and others were killed instantly when their deadline passed. I realize that it is different groups that are holding these people, but something about this kidnapping just seems fishy. "Meet our demands or we will be forced to give you more time and make more videos" just doesn't make sense, I do not beleive for a second that who ever is holding her cares that she "respects" their beliefs and customs.
This is the reward for respecting Islamic beliefs and customs.... I do pray for her release, however.
What other "religion" besides Islam creates such a plethora of monsters that deem beheadings and the kidnappings of women as valid means to an end?
Can anyone cite other cultural examples of this kind of supremely monstrous behavior from history, either past or present? I am curious.
I believe it says a lot about Islam that this vile business even goes on. How can we continue to tolerate such evil in our world and make excuses for the more moderate elements: the ones that don't actually do the kidnapping, murdering, bombing, raping but fuel it none-the-less? It's like saying the frontmen for a mob money-laundering operation are without blame.
I can only pray that Jill Carroll is released. No person should have to suffer like this.
To Jill Carrol:
Not to worry Jill. Help is on the way. On February 11th 100,000 Muslims are expected to come to London to protest on your behalf. They will call for your immediate and unconditional safe release. 100,000 practioners of the one true religion are expected to civilly direct their collective rage against the kidnappers who have, once again, shamed and tarnished the name of Islam. Keep in mind, Jill, that Islam is the epitome of justice, equality and tolerance. Your kidnappers only need to be reminded of this by their moderate brethern who, on your behalf, will take to the streets in London to save the life of an innocent infidel female.
Then again I might be wrong.
I can only imagine what did they do to her....She is an observant christian and a woman at the same time. They would kill the man, but the infidel woman is the another story. Man for many reasons deserved "better" death.
I think of the stories about iranian jailed virgins: some of them were executed during the long process (stoning), but before that they experienced the hell by gang rapes and tortures...And they weren't infidels.
Don't be so sure she is "with the enemy". I'm pretty sure that she became a sex slave of those savages. Every thing she wants - to go free. I can only to hope for this poor woman to be free - this way or another, no matter what she says.
l feel sorry for Jill, l think when l was her age, l was so blind, and thought all religions were to be equally respected. much has changed since then, and my eyes are wide open to this filth culture of death that keeps repeating the words a religion of peace. Islam has blinded over a billion people and allowed those with murder on their hands to go unrepentent. sorry to the above muslim who is still blinded by his cult of death known as islam.. l truly feel sorry for this ignorance. after l feel sorry for them, l feel rage for the all the killings done in the name of islam. Jill l only hope you come out of this alive and are more aware there is evil in this cult you wanted to learn so much from. may your soul rest in peace.
I think that she is in with her captors from the beginning. She is just too calm.
Give them what they want--immediate "martyrdom".
I won't blame Jill Carroll for being desperate. Most of us would be if we were in the hands of goons who want to behead us. Any word on the Quaker peace activists who got nabbed?
Big brave Muslim warriors for Allah terrorize a little girl.
Oh, wait, that was Mohammad with his 6 year old bride, Aiyesha.
But the general thrust of the story still rings true.
We are the jihadi lions! We can gang up on a lone woman and scare the sh*t out of her!
Ah, the perfume of Muslim courage!
Are we not men?
(Wait, didn't I hear that line growled in "The Island Of Dr. Moreau?"... spoken by a half-animal mutant? Maybe Islam is a genetic experiment from the 7th century gone really awry?)
Cowardly scum, with a "God".
The worst kind.
Jill Carroll's situation is heartbreaking. It's my understanding that under Shariah, she is a woman captured in war, and thus becomes a "possession of the right hand" of at least one of these thugs. I've read on one of those ask-the-imam, all-fatwas-all-the-time sites that such captives may be freely raped. In fact, the discussion I read was almost lubricious in its detail, including a remark that sex with a slave was one of the ways a Muslim master shows he "loves her."
http://www.islam.tc/ask-imam/view.php?q=5482
Heaven save us from jihadist "love."
USAgirl asks:
"Why didn't Nick Berg get a chance to make 3 or 4 videos, why do they keep pushing her deadline back and back and others were killed instantly when their deadline passed?"
Because the grand Poobahs of Islam most likely feel that a beheading, at this time, would siphon off some of the media coverage of this world-wide spontaneous "Cartoon Outrage". They play our Dhimmified MSM like a fine Wurlitzer.
It is clear that they will do to her. As far as I remember from my Koran, if she is a virgin, they will take her as their 9th wife. If she is not a virgin, which she probably is not, they will kill her. The Koran demands it.
I know it is wrong, but I hope they put her beheading on a video and show it in the US and Europe. When we can go to the same Imans who went around lying about the cartoons and get them to go to all religious scholars as they did before, asking them if that was Islamic and get them to condemn it. I do not mean the fake Western Imans, but the real ones who are actually influential. Get a televised conference with them and ask them to do it. Let's see that they say.
Western governments and media must start a PR campaign against extremists. Muslim countries have the biggest propaganda agaisnt us, why should we not do it against them, in our more advanced and diplomatic way.
mosmike
We already have the very graphic beheading of Nick Berg. Why can't we use this and do what you say now?
Her Dad, in a TV plea, said that she was on their side so they should let her live.
Perhaps daddy should trade places with his daughter? I would for either of my daughters - any real man would - but then I didn't raise daughters foolish enough to go into the belly of the beast.
My beloveds (Malik and Musa)
May the Creator of the heavens and the earth reward your valiant strivings in the den of inequity of the shaytin.
One ponders the question: Of all the professed religions of the world... WHY has Islam become the chief and sole obsession of so many Americans? Is it purely because of the events of September 11, or are there other reasons? What motivates so many people that are not Muslim to spend countless hours researching Islam if they want nothing to do with it?
Be sure, this is a dedicated, well-orchestrated, totally planned campaign being waged to disuade as many people as possible from their chosen religion (funny, they are not interested in converting the atheists, wiccans or satanists), and turn back as many Muslims as they can from their religion. If this were not so, you would be able to engage in intelligent dialogue with these people and discuss and compare religion respectfully without trading insults.
The tendency to apply today's standards to acts that occurred more than 1,400 years ago is also suspect, given the fact that Muslims are accused of living in the past and following a religion that is archaic and obsolete. The bible, revered by millions as irrefutable truth from God, is never put under similar scrutiny.
For example, Prophet Lot is reported to have slept with his two daughters after the destruction of Sodom and Gomorah at their urging, fearing that the world needed to be repopulated and they were the only survivors as seen in these direct quotes from the bible, NIV:
"Lot and His Daughters" NIV, Genesis 19:30-36
30 Lot and his two daughters left Zoar and settled in the mountains, for he was afraid to stay in Zoar. He and his two daughters lived in a cave. 31 One day the older daughter said to the younger, "Our father is old, and there is no man around here to lie with us, as is the custom all over the earth. 32 Let's get our father to drink wine and then lie with him and preserve our family line through our father."
33 That night they got their father to drink wine, and the older daughter went in and lay with him. He was not aware of it when she lay down or when she got up.
34 The next day the older daughter said to the younger, "Last night I lay with my father. Let's get him to drink wine again tonight, and you go in and lie with him so we can preserve our family line through our father." 35 So they got their father to drink wine that night also, and the younger daughter went and lay with him. Again he was not aware of it when she lay down or when she got up.
36 So both of Lot's daughters became pregnant by their father. 37 The older daughter had a son, and she named him Moab [g]; he is the father of the Moabites of today. 38 The younger daughter also had a son, and she named him Ben-Ammi [h] ; he is the father of the Ammonites of today.
Should we question the morals of Prophet Lot and his daughters for engaging in this obvious act of incest?
Still more distressing passages of immorality can be found in Genesis 38:13-18. I challenge anyone anywhere to find a single passage that says Muhammad slept with his daughters, committed adultery, or fornicated even once outside of marriage:
13 When Tamar was told, "Your father-in-law is on his way to Timnah to shear his sheep," 14 she took off her widow's clothes, covered herself with a veil to disguise herself, and then sat down at the entrance to Enaim, which is on the road to Timnah. For she saw that, though Shelah had now grown up, she had not been given to him as his wife.
15 When Judah saw her, he thought she was a prostitute, for she had covered her face. 16 Not realizing that she was his daughter-in-law, he went over to her by the roadside and said, "Come now, let me sleep with you." "And what will you give me to sleep with you?" she asked.
17 "I'll send you a young goat from my flock," he said. "Will you give me something as a pledge until you send it?" she asked.
18 He said, "What pledge should I give you?"
"Your seal and its cord, and the staff in your hand," she answered. So he gave them to her and slept with her, and she became pregnant by him. 19 After she left, she took off her veil and put on her widow's clothes again.
And in the following passages, David lies with Bathshebah, a black hittite woman, the wife of Uriah, plots for him to be killed in battle, and earns the wrath of God. Notice that the prophets of the bible did not shy away from killing and warfare. Also notice that in 2 Samuel 11:4, Bathshebah lay with David after ritually "purifying" herself from "uncleanness". Why was she considered "unclean"?:
2 Samuel 11:1-26 (NIV)
David and Bathsheba
1 In the spring, at the time when kings go off to war, David sent Joab out with the king's men and the whole Israelite army. They destroyed the Ammonites and besieged Rabbah. But David remained in Jerusalem.
2 One evening David got up from his bed and walked around on the roof of the palace. From the roof he saw a woman bathing. The woman was very beautiful, 3 and David sent someone to find out about her. The man said, "Isn't this Bathsheba, the daughter of Eliam and the wife of Uriah the Hittite?" 4 Then David sent messengers to get her. She came to him, and he slept with her. (She had purified herself from her uncleanness.) Then [a] she went back home. 5 The woman conceived and sent word to David, saying, "I am pregnant."
6 So David sent this word to Joab: "Send me Uriah the Hittite." And Joab sent him to David. 7 When Uriah came to him, David asked him how Joab was, how the soldiers were and how the war was going. 8 Then David said to Uriah, "Go down to your house and wash your feet." So Uriah left the palace, and a gift from the king was sent after him. 9 But Uriah slept at the entrance to the palace with all his master's servants and did not go down to his house.
10 When David was told, "Uriah did not go home," he asked him, "Haven't you just come from a distance? Why didn't you go home?"
11 Uriah said to David, "The ark and Israel and Judah are staying in tents, and my master Joab and my lord's men are camped in the open fields. How could I go to my house to eat and drink and lie with my wife? As surely as you live, I will not do such a thing!"
12 Then David said to him, "Stay here one more day, and tomorrow I will send you back." So Uriah remained in Jerusalem that day and the next. 13 At David's invitation, he ate and drank with him, and David made him drunk. But in the evening Uriah went out to sleep on his mat among his master's servants; he did not go home.
14 In the morning David wrote a letter to Joab and sent it with Uriah. 15 In it he wrote, "Put Uriah in the front line where the fighting is fiercest. Then withdraw from him so he will be struck down and die."
16 So while Joab had the city under siege, he put Uriah at a place where he knew the strongest defenders were. 17 When the men of the city came out and fought against Joab, some of the men in David's army fell; moreover, Uriah the Hittite died.
18 Joab sent David a full account of the battle. 19 He instructed the messenger: "When you have finished giving the king this account of the battle, 20 the king's anger may flare up, and he may ask you, 'Why did you get so close to the city to fight? Didn't you know they would shoot arrows from the wall? 21 Who killed Abimelech son of Jerub-Besheth [b] ? Didn't a woman throw an upper millstone on him from the wall, so that he died in Thebez? Why did you get so close to the wall?' If he asks you this, then say to him, 'Also, your servant Uriah the Hittite is dead.' "
22 The messenger set out, and when he arrived he told David everything Joab had sent him to say. 23 The messenger said to David, "The men overpowered us and came out against us in the open, but we drove them back to the entrance to the city gate. 24 Then the archers shot arrows at your servants from the wall, and some of the king's men died. Moreover, your servant Uriah the Hittite is dead."
25 David told the messenger, "Say this to Joab: 'Don't let this upset you; the sword devours one as well as another. Press the attack against the city and destroy it.' Say this to encourage Joab."
26 When Uriah's wife heard that her husband was dead, she mourned for him. 27 After the time of mourning was over, David had her brought to his house, and she became his wife and bore him a son. But the thing David had done displeased the LORD.
Should the bible as a result be viewed as a manual of incest and debauchery because of these passages? What do these passages tell us about the lowly status of women during these times?
And what sense shall we make of the following biblical passages about the sons of Prophet Noah? It has been a long-standing dispute that these passages infer that the black-skinned peoples of Africa are the descendents of Ham, the Canaanites, cursed by Noah to be the eternal "slaves" of their brothers (see Genesis 9:24-27). If this is not true, why haven't these passages been stricken from the bible, as they would have Muslims strike offensive passages from the qur'an? Note also that Noah is reported to have lived 950 YEARS, when the average life expectancy of a human today is about 75 years. I don't hear anyone challenging the validity of this claim.
The Sons of Noah (NIV) Genesis 9:18-28
18 The sons of Noah who came out of the ark were Shem, Ham and Japheth. (Ham was the father of Canaan.) 19 These were the three sons of Noah, and from them came the people who were scattered over the earth.
20 Noah, a man of the soil, proceeded [a] to plant a vineyard. 21 When he drank some of its wine, he became drunk and lay uncovered inside his tent. 22 Ham, the father of Canaan, saw his father's nakedness and told his two brothers outside. 23 But Shem and Japheth took a garment and laid it across their shoulders; then they walked in backward and covered their father's nakedness. Their faces were turned the other way so that they would not see their father's nakedness.
24 When Noah awoke from his wine and found out what his youngest son had done to him, 25 he said,
"Cursed be Canaan!
The lowest of slaves
will he be to his brothers."
26 He also said,
"Blessed be the LORD, the God of Shem!
May Canaan be the slave of Shem. [b]
27 May God extend the territory of Japheth [c] ;
may Japheth live in the tents of Shem,
and may Canaan be his [d] slave."
28 After the flood Noah lived 350 years. 29 Altogether, Noah lived 950 years, and then he died.
My beloveds, I give these few passages to you as an example of the deception, dishonesty, and twisted purpose of those who attack you here, who spend all of their energies and exhaust their knowledge and resources attacking Muslims and what we believe, without looking at what they claim to believe themselves.
May God the Creator grant you peace and mercy and forgiveness of your sins. Salutations of peace to Muhammad and all the prophets and companions of heaven.
Not trying to be macabre, but isn't she supposed to be dead? And why is she always dressed up as a Muslim woman in these videoes?
hatshepsut you speak of the story of Lot and you say
"Should we question the morals of Prophet Lot and his daughters for engaging in this obvious act of incest? "
well the answer to your question is yes and the bible does condemn it. The story of Lot is not a story praising incest but condemning it. While the story of Mohamed sleeping with children condones pedaphelia.
So there is a big difference. And second of all that story is in the Old testament. Islam is closer to the religion of the old testament then Christianity is so I dont know what your point is.
>>I challenge anyone anywhere to find a single passage that says Muhammad slept with his daughters, committed adultery, or fornicated even once outside of marriage:>>
Doesn't the Koran discuss Mohammed's rape of a slave on the bed of one of his wives? That's outside of marriage. He even had a convenient "revelation" about it when his wives complained ("The Forbidding").
Didn't Mohammed demand that a woman forbidden ("haram") to him -- a relative's wife -- be delivered unto him for sex? Wouldn't that be a lot like adultery? Wait -- he had a convenient "revelation" about that, too.
Did Mohammed even have any daughters? He must not have, otherwise we'd have a "revelation" about them as well.
Yes, poor Caroll. And bad, bad people those terrorists who dare to kidnap an innocent woman. And bad Islam that allows its followers to do such things to an innocent woman.
Of course spencer and the rest of the people conveniently forget to mention WHAT the terrorists want.
Since the beginning of the war, Iraqi women as well as men have been arrested, tortured and raped. It is a well known fact in Iraq that US soldiers kidnap the women and children of the insurgents to force them to surrender. Surely the ones who captured Carol are among those. But I guess people will say that after all, the women who have been arrested are terrorists. It feels so much better to pretend that when you learn about Iraqi women being raped by your troops.
Dozens of Iraqi women were and are in the same situation or worse than Caroll, but all you care about is one American woman.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/01/27/iraq/main1248784.shtml
In one case, a secretive task force locked up the young mother of a nursing baby, a U.S. intelligence officer reported. In the case of a second detainee, one American colonel suggested to another that they catch her husband by tacking a note to the family's door telling him "to come get his wife."
http://www.guardian.co.uk/women/story/0,3604,1220673,00.html
“In November last year, Swadi visited a woman detainee at a US military base at al-Kharkh, a former police compound in Baghdad. "She was the only woman who would talk about her case. She was crying. She told us she had been raped," Swadi says. "Several American soldiers had raped her. She had tried to fight them off and they had hurt her arm. She showed us the stitches. She told us, 'We have daughters and husbands. For God's sake don't tell anyone about this.'"
Astonishingly, the secret inquiry launched by the US military in January, headed by Major General Antonio Taguba, has confirmed that the letter smuggled out of Abu Ghraib by a woman known only as "Noor" was entirely and devastatingly accurate. While most of the focus since the scandal broke three weeks ago has been on the abuse of men, and on their sexual humilation in front of US women soldiers, there is now incontrovertible proof that women detainees - who form a small but unknown proportion of the 40,000 people in US custody since last year's invasion - have also been abused. Nobody appears to know how many. But among the 1,800 digital photographs taken by US guards inside Abu Ghraib there are, according to Taguba's report, images of a US military policeman "having sex" with an Iraqi woman.
Taguba discovered that guards have also videotaped and photographed naked female detainees. The Bush administration has refused to release other photographs of Iraqi women forced at gunpoint to bare their breasts (although it has shown them to Congress) - ostensibly to prevent attacks on US soldiers in Iraq, but in reality, one suspects, to prevent further domestic embarrassment. ”
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1432691,00.html
“Ramadi madness”
http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1001218842
"A report by Maj. Gen. Antonio Taguba on the abuse at the prison outside Baghdad says videotapes and photographs show naked detainees, and that groups of men were forced to masturbate while being photographed and videotaped. Taguba also found evidence of a 'male MP guard having sex with a female detainee.'
"Rumsfeld told Congress the unrevealed photos and videos contain acts 'that can only be described as blatantly sadistic, cruel and inhuman.'"
The military later screened some of the images for lawmakers, who said they showed, among other things, attack dogs snarling at cowed prisoners, Iraqi women forced to expose their breasts, and naked prisoners forced to have sex with each other”
http://www.vialls.com/myahudi/rape.html
hatshepsut
When I read your posts, I conjure up an image of a little girl happily playing with puppies and kittens in a meadow of daisies.
However, I wonder why you chose to post this sweetness-and-light image of Islam in thread that is about a young girl facing beheading unless we bow to Islam's demands?
Why aren't you using your gift for prose to convince these limp swords of allah (or whatever the hell they call themselves) to show the true belovedness of Islam?
Can anyone including our dear muslim friend here please explain to me what exactly is the difference between islam's ideas of death, sex, and megalomania and say.... Jim Jones and David Koresh?
Is there one? And if not, if those two demons were allowed to live and propagate their lies on weak-minded fools like those living in the deserts of arabia 1400 years ago listening to mo's BS, would our future generations be subjected to the Branch Davidian's cries for respect and understanding?
Someone has to save her!
Where is the ACLU!? Her rights are being violated! What did you say? They are in Washington trying to limit the intelligence we can gather on the Jihadists and working to extend civil rights to enemies in time of war? Well at least I will feel more comfort when I get togather with my Move On friends and talk on our cell phones and use library computers.
Where are the Moderate Muslims!? Mussolini and other posters say there are only about 10 in the whole world out some hundreds of millions, but I dont think so, there must be more! Maybe they can rally to the aid of this poor woman that is being abused and may die on Arab TV for the amusement of the arab masses. Certainly they can come to her aid!!!At least maybe they can say something that will sway her captors? What did you say?? What cartoons???!!You say they are too busy protesting, burning flags, comitting arson, and killing people over that to be bothered??
Where are the Irani's!!?? They certainly need some good press these days, and the captors will definitely listen to them. She is as good as free right now!!! What did you say? They are too busy building nuclear bombs..err.. sorry...developing nuclear technology and hosting a conference on why there was no holicaust??? Damn...The Syrians?? Oh yeah, sorry I guess I wasnt thinking...
What about the UN or the EU. Certainly they could help. What did you say?? They are too busy condemning the cartoons, or are hiding under their desks in Palestine while the moderates are protesting and burning outside!! Damn..
What about CAIR!! Certainly they can do something!!What did you say they are too busy sending money to islamic organizations to fund err...humane programs??? Maybe they could pay the blood money to get her out. Damn..same cartoons??!!
Maybe we can let some Iraqui women prisoners.. Maybe they will trade? What did you say? We already did that? Damn...Well, I guess her only hope is the US military, or maybe she can sneak out while the Jihadists are asleep. This is really screwed up.
>>She had tried to fight them off and they had hurt her arm. She showed us the stitches. She told us, 'We have daughters and husbands. For God's sake don't tell anyone about this.'">>
Not to mention that unless she was prescient enough to get 4 Muslim male onlookers to the reported crime, under Shariah she'd be stoned or hanged for adultery, like so many of her Muslimah sisters.
Marwan, you could easily have found this information yourself, but I will oblige you here. Please try to do your own research rather than relying about tainted sources for your information.
Khadijah (ra) and Muhammad (s) were the parents of six children - four daughters and two sons. His first son Qasim died at the age of two. He was nicknamed Abul Qasim, meaning the father of Qasim. His second son Abdullah died in infancy. Abdullah was also called affectionately as ‘Tayyab’ and ‘Tahir’ because he was born after Muhammad’s prophethood. The four daughters were: Zainab, Ruqayyah, Umm Kulthum, and Fatimah (ra).
Prophet Muhammad had 11 wives. He was also permitted according to the custom of the time to have 'amama, or captive women as his consorts (possessions of his right hand). A captive woman in the times of Muhammad had legal rights, but less rights than a free wife, unlike the American slave women raped by their masters.
You will not find any reference to him fornicating (sleeping with unlawful women) or imposing himself unlawfully on other men's wives.
Hatshepsut, the only reason Zeinab wasn't unlawful to Mohammed -- under his own rules, as the wife of his adopted son -- was that Mohammed had a special "revelation" allowing him sexual access to her.
Second, you were very specific about marriage. The rape of the slave described in "The Forbidding" was just one of his many rapes outside marriage. Safiyeh, a story that breaks my heart, is one of them -- a young woman dragged past the dead bodies of her husband and family to be deposited forthwith in Mohammed's bed.
Insofar as the "rights" of Islamic sex slaves are concerned, may I direct you to the Imam's discussion I cited in my first post; you might be surprised.
Finally, I'm not sure whether to be disgusted or amused by the Mohammedan insistence on calling raped women "consorts."
Ipsanan, you will note that all of the information you have posted about the serious breach of morality committed against innocent women in captivity in direct violation of all standards of decency were conveniently ignored. The lurid stories we hear of prostitutes (surely bringing AIDS) in the Green Zone, and decent women being raped by bruts is indeed a travesty. It is also widely reported that during this period of lawlessness and social anarchy, children are being kidnapped and sold into child slavery in Iraq. But posters at this site seem only interested in a 7th century prophet who lived 1,400 years ago, his bedroom etiquette, and his military campaigns. Who is living in the past?
This confirms the assumption that the objective of those who come here it at this site is to attack and discredit Islam. They are not here to discuss commentaries or engage in polite debate about news articles and events. That's the ruse. They are here to set a "honey trap" and many are probably paid to do what they do.
We can and should continue to exercise our rights to post facts and a counterbalance to the slanted, tainted distortions they offer to unsuspecting readers, as they try to brainwash the misinformed into some kind of group think vulcan mind meld against Islam and Muslims.
God will keep his promise and good will never triumph over evil any more than truth will be defeated by falsehood.
Thanks for the excellent references.
Marwan, you must apply the same criteria you obsessively insist upon using against Muhammad against all the prophets of scripture, and even to your own government, who for 300 years legalized the rape of enslaved women by their captures and did not even consider them human.
If you, Marwan, agree that for 300 years slave women were RAPED by their slave captures who had no right to them because the law did not give slave women any rights (actually more considering that no white man could get convicted of raping a black women in most southern courts due to Jim Crow laws), then I will agree that a captive women by virture of her not being free could be raped. This means the Thomas Jefferson and George Washington were rapists, by your definition, as they both had slave captives that were their consorts.
Ispanan! You came back!
You Missed these!
Amputation according to Sharia law, Nigeria, 2005:
http://www.mg.co.za/articlepage.aspx?area=/breaking_news/breaking_news__africa/&articleid=251387
Top Ten Reasons sharia law is bad for Anyone (with numerous recent examples, some bloody pictures):
http://www.americanthinker.com/articles.php?article_id=4726
Death by Stoning under Sharia law, 2002:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/theissues/article/0,6512,777972,00.html
And one can Easily go on.....
Please do explain how implementing sharia law in other countries will Not end up in the same fashion!
Oh, I forgot~ Ispanan never answers, Only accuses. Just like hateshutsup.
My dear Hatshepsut, slave owners, George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, and anyone else you wish to add to the list did not, to my knowledge, claim to be the last prophet of God.
Further, they are not, to my knowledge, regarded by anyone in the West as al-insan al-kamil -- the perfect man to be modeled by all men, as Mohammed is by your coreligionists.
I really hate to see Jill get her head lopped off. However, I can't seem to whip up a tremendous amount of sympathy for her.
She walzed off willingly with the beast, & the beast turned on her. She had to know this was a possibility.
I wonder if the video was 'time stamped'? The reason I ask is that she was confused on the date. Perhaps they made more than one video in the same day. It is possible that she has already been killed.
Finally, in answer to the listing of reported offenses against Iraqi women -- if you want to be rigorous about it, why the desperate indignation over Muslimahs supposedly raped by the enemy during a state of war? Under Shariah rules, doesn't that make them "consorts," with all the respectful rights (ibid. Hatshepsut) that the status implies?
What? The Shariah rules about "possessions of the right hand" don't apply when Muslims are the victims? Or is there some other technicality I missed? Do you see how horrifically offensive this double standard is?
Rape is an violent crime against humanity. Period. Unfortunately, it is codified as lawful in Muslim theology and Islamic law -- but apparently only for some victims, and not others.
Jill is an airheaded activist and in on this with the Muslims. I watched her appeal on Abu Dhabi TV (which any of you could watch if you had Dishnetwork or Direct TV, it is a program called Mosaic on LinkTV, channel 9410, you can also watch Iranian News, Cairo News and other programs from the mid east)
Anyway she shows up coiffed and calm garbed in a neatly arranged and tucked Iranian Style Hijab, backdropped by a very nice Persian Rug.
And I doubt that she is a Christian, at least not anymore.
I say ignore her and if she is shot (they shoot women, they don't behead them) then I was wrong.
For now she is an attention "ho", at least IMO.
What about those other "peace" people who were kidnapped in Iraq? Have they been killed yet?
The biggest cowards on this planet are those who take hostages, they don't have the balls to confront life without holding a serious threat over an innocent person.
hate shepsut-
I condemn George Washington, the hypocrite, when he was a slave holder.
But, in his last will and testament he freed all of his slaves.
Mohammad never did.
So I utterly condemn Mohammad eternally
Follow him at your peril.
Islamspam sez:
"...The military later screened some of the images for lawmakers, who said they showed, among other things, attack dogs snarling at cowed prisoners, Iraqi women forced to expose their breasts, and naked prisoners forced to have sex with each other...”
Good heavens, what else is new?
Why don't you call 'Abu Laban' and get him to come along with you to the ME to stir up another case of 'rage', like 'Koran rage, cartoon rage', Gitmo rage, Abu Graib rage? What else can you come up with?
And US soldiers 'raping' those wretched, burkha-clad ghosts? That'll be the day! Just waiting for somebody to write a book like 'sex and the burkha', any fethisists out there apart from you goat-humping sons of Allah?
You can stab and spew and spit, but you'll never get it. Just do us a favor and export yourself to where the Sharia reigns, will you?
Rape is an violent crime against humanity. Period. Unfortunately, it is codified as lawful in Muslim theology and Islamic law -- but apparently only for some victims, and not others.
To further point out how different religions view rape during war. Under the Mosaic law Jewish soldiers were not allowed to have sexual relations during war time. This prohibition was to prevent the rape of enemy women during war. King David's affair with Bath-sheba was exposed because of this prohibition. After David began the affair with Bath-sheba she became pregnant. In order to cover up the affair David had Bath-Sheba's husband Uriah brought back from the battlefield to Jerusalem in the hope that Uriah would sleep with his wife.The planned backfired when Uriah even though drunk refused to sleep with Bath-Sheba in violation of the law.
the spin Hatesput likes to put up with George Washington, was a time when slavery was legal, and has been made illegal what since 1865 for the US? and the British earlier.. now slavery still thrives in the islam world such as Sudan, Saudi Arabia, etc.. how can any civilized person still remain a muislim...!!
Back on topic:
"If you don't know what to do, don't do anything..." Miles Davis.
Jill Caroll:
We don't know what to do about you...