Malaysian official: wrong to equate terrorists with Muslim fundamentalists

The Malaysian Minister of International Trade and Industry says that real Qur'an-believing Muslims abhor violence and suicide bombers, and instead live in peaceful co-existence, mingling freely with peoples of other religions and races.

Well, that's a relief. But I do wish that Datuk Seri Rafidah Aziz would go farther. Here again the flat assertion is made. No attempt is made to refute the jihadist exegesis of the Qur'an and Sunnah. We are told again and again that the true Islam is peaceful. But the jihadists are the ones quoting chapter and verse of the Qur'an: 2:190-193; 3:139; 5:51; 9:5; 9:29; 22:39; 47:4; 61:9; 98:6; so many others. On the other side? 2:256 (with no indication of any awareness of the exegesis of Qutb and others) and 5:32 (without 5:33). What are we to think? Must we just ignore this because Rafidah is saying what we want to hear? Can we not ask for more -- some sign that she can actually convince Muslims to lay down their arms and stop waging jihad? Without that ability, her fine words are essentially meaningless.

"Wrong To Equate Terrorists With Fundamental Muslims," from Bernama, with thanks to Nicolei:

MILAN, Feb 28 (Bernama) -- The West, which is seen as being on a collision course with the Muslim world, is completely wrong in equating Muslim trouble-makers with fundamental Muslims, Malaysian Minister of International Trade and Industry Datuk Seri Rafidah Aziz, said.

Clarifying what is surely a common misconception among westerners, no thanks to terrorists and trouble-makers resorting to violence and killings in the name of the religion, Rafidah said "fundamental Muslims are those who follow closely the teachings of the Holy Quran."

Muslims who follow the fundamental teachings of the Quran abhor violence, suicide bombers, and instead live in peaceful co-existence, mingling freely with peoples of other religions and races, she said when touching on religious tolerance during a seminar on "Business Opportunities in Malaysia" here Monday....

Rafidah told the 300 participants at the seminar from Italy that "you are completely wrong in regarding Muslim trouble-makers as fundamental Muslims."

"Next time, you hear of a fundamental Muslim, think of me. I am a fundamental Muslim. I play golf, I dress this way (in a baju kurung), and go all over the world doing my work. Please do not equate fundamental Muslims and terrorists, there's a big difference," the minister said.

"I do not look like (Al-Qaeda leader) Osama bin Laden," she said to the obvious amusement of the audience.

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"The West, which is seen as being on a collision course with the Muslim world..."

Yes, no matter which way the West turns, it seems that it is on a collision course with the Moslem world.

The West, which is seen as being on a collision course with the Muslim world, is completely wrong in equating Muslim trouble-makers with fundamental Muslims, Malaysian Minister of International Trade and Industry Datuk Seri Rafidah Aziz, said.

Well, there you are. She doesn't want the 'international trade' to dry up right now. What's a lie or two when one's comfortable lifestyle is at stake?

I wonder what real Islam if and when it takes power in Malaysia will do with females who have the nerve to engage in politics.

...the obvious amusement of the audience.

Oh, and why not giggle about a movement that is responsible, among other things, for the toasting alive of 3,000 ordinary people going about their daily affairs. What's a little mass murder among friends?

Amazing that this crap can be printed straight faced by the mainstreammedia.

(the same cowards who trembled to print the mohammed cartoons)

It truly now is an Orwellian universe out there.

Clarifying what is surely a common misconception among westerners, no thanks to terrorists and trouble-makers resorting to violence and killings in the name of the religion, Rafidah said "fundamental Muslims are those who follow closely the teachings of the Holy Quran."

So what are the terrorists following for inspiration, the Yellow Pages? Nope-- specific quotations from the Quran, hadiths, and Sira.

The hadiths are the most damning to her position. One could foresee someone like Rafidah trying to rationalize the quoting of the Quran for terror by noting "the devil can quote scripture to his own purpose." But the hadiths make clear who the "devil" is-- uswa hasana, insam al-kamil.

So, what to do about that, Rafidah? Repudiate the hadiths? Or how about armed jihad?

(And are her friends "Rafidite dogs?" Or just a bunch of fundaments?)

Who put the West on a collision course with the Muslim world?

Obviously, the West has been having a civilized, modern society and given to the rest of the world its many technological inventions, breakthroughs in medicine and various other atrocities, so it’s naturally the West’s fault for all of this, right?

It couldn’t possibly have anything to do with 911, could it? Nah, our atrocities go back even further than that, of course. The first Gulf War and Sudam invading Kuwait was our fault. How about way back to the Iran hostage crisis? Perhaps the many, many wars and skirmishes in the Middle East the West is to blame for too, right?

Yes, I agree that there is a clash of civilizations coming, but it wouldn’t be that way if the nutjob inhabitants of the Middle East could all play in the same sandbox together without trying to kill one another over supposed land agreements or differences of opinion over who’s bloodline contains what …or whatever else you want to blame the disagreements on today. The Muslims, with their constant badgering and bickering and fighting has brought us closer and closer to a head-on clash and it’s getting downright tiresome.

It’s true that we shouldn’t equate terrorists with fundamentalists. To be honest, we should strike the word ‘terrorist’ from our language altogether and concentrate on this war that Islam as a whole has enacted upon the entire non-Islamic world. Once we do that, we may someday see some progress.

Sounds like a failed fundamentalist to me or maybe he has read too many Sufi textbooks. It's pretty clear in the Quran and even more in the Hadith about what is required from Muslims. And until the Jihadists start ignoring a large part of both nothing is going to change.

"The minister said Muslims in Malaysia practice peace, tolerance and live in harmony, with peoples of other religious beliefs".

I hope the Italian businessmen don't get fooled by this taqiyya spewing brainwashed mobot. For her words are flagrant lies in the face of hard evidence to the contrary.

List of racial discriminations (Malaysia):

http://www.faithfreedom.org/oped/Ramza60224.htm

Why do muslims get the "title" for relgion of peace? I'm not a christian but I know christian charites out number muslins a thousand to one. So while the muslims are enjoying there oil money christians give billions to the poor around the world only to have a few of those poor killed by muslims for converting to christians. Hey muslims, the Chirstins, Buddhist, Taoist, and Jews called, they want their "title" back.

She plays golf?!

That changes everything!

The author of the "Tarzan" novels called golf "a mental disorder".

(He once owned a golf course, so I consider him an expert.)

That must be the reason this "Minister" is an invertebrate liar.

(Or is that inveterate?)

In short, what a crock of Islamo-salami-salami-baloney.

Shouldn't journalists just laugh this kind of pious fraud right off the page?

Does anybody believe it?

Sorry for type o's, english is my third language

Why should we expect a muslim to see anything wrong with themselves? It's the other guys, not us.

She forgot to tell her audience about the Bumiputra system in Malaysia -- a disguised Jizyah tax on Hindus and Chinese. And the members of that audience, of course, forgot to ask.

Get it while you can:

Aladdin and The Wonderful Lamp (1934)

This cartoon is one of the best made by Ub Iwerks in the few years he spent helming his own studio. It's a jazzy take on the ALADDIN fairy tale, with a gorgeous score and great animation, one of the most distinctive cartoons ever produced.

I'm sure it takes a quite improper (if wholly innocent) attitude to the Caliph and consequnetly will never be seen on mainstream Tv again. (19Mb for a high-quality MP4 or 4Mb for a smaller file.)

http://www.archive.org/details/ALADDIN

Think I'm joking? Uh, uh. A spokesmen of the "RoP" has it in for Tom and Jerry and that hasn't even got a caliph in it. Apparently, the mouse is suspected of being a Jew.

http://memri.org/bin/latestnews.cgi?ID=SD110106

You couldn't make it up. ...

fun·da·men·tal·ism

A usually religious movement or point of view characterized by a return to fundamental principles, by rigid adherence to those principles, and often by intolerance of other views and opposition to secularism.

fun·da·men·tal

Of or relating to the foundation or base; elementary

Forming or serving as an essential component of a system or structure

009.030 The Jews call 'Uzair a son of Allah, and the Christians call Christ the son of Allah. That is a saying from their mouth; in this they but imitate what '''the unbelievers''' of old used to say. Allah's curse be on them: how they are deluded away from the Truth! {{{With that being said - everyone can see who '''the unbelievers''' are - according to the Koran

047.004 Therefore, when ye meet '''the Unbelievers''' in fight, smite at their necks. {Behead them! and the Muslims are commanded to initiate the fight} 002.216 009.039

005.051 O ye who believe! take not the Jews and the Christians for your friends and protectors {authorities]: They are but friends and protectors to each other. And he amongst you that turns to them for friendship is of them. Verily Allah guideth not a people unjust.

033.061 They shall have a curse on them: whenever they are found, they shall be seized and slain without mercy.

Two Questions for Datuk Seri Rafidah Aziz:

Does she understand the meaning of the word "fundamental"?

And - is she a true Muslim?

002.216 Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing [war] which is good for you and that ye love a thing [peace] which is bad for you?

009.039 Unless ye go forth, He will punish you with a grievous penalty, and put others in your place.

If she doesn't take the word of the god she says she believes in seriously - then she's not a 'fundamentalist' no matter how much she claims to be.

And her self-denial is getting people slaughtered

She forgot to tell her audience about the Bumiputra system in Malaysia -- a disguised Jizyah tax on Hindus and Chinese. And the members of that audience, of course, forgot to ask

Not hard to find out these things either - even Wikipedia has such information:

As defined by the constitution of Malaysia, Malays must be Muslim, regardless of their ethnic heritage; otherwise, legally, they are not Malay. Consequently, apostate Malays will have to forfeit all their constitutional privileges, including their Bumiputra status, which entitles them to affirmative action policies in university admissions, discounts on purchases of vehicles or real estate, etc.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_Malaysia

If I had been a part of that audience years ago, I would have believed her and felt relieved. Now I would just laugh until I cried.

I wonder how long will people in the West continue to believe these Islamist apologist liars? The farce continues...

Hey Beerguyster, those muslims give to plenty of charities .. like Hamas, Hezbollah, the local suicide bomber club, al queda, etc.

Before I sign up for the fiction that a Moslem fundamentalist can exist, show me my Unicorns.

Otherwise, I'm looking for activists who are dutifully obeying God's sacred commandments, as was this case on September 11.

I think I shall write a book and title it "Why I am Not A Golfer".

"The West, which is seen as being on a collision course with the Muslim world..."
-- from the article above

The West is not on a "collision course" with anyone. It is clearly with the greatest reluctance that it, or parts of it are coming to certain melancholy conclusions, despite its own great efforts to avoid coming to those conclusions, about the tenets of Islam and the consequently natural behavior of many Muslims, and the attitudes, not acted upon, of the rest.

The Muslim propagandist from Malaysia has it backwards. Muslims are on a "collision course" with all Infidels. The many non-Muslim victims of Jihad and Muslim mistreatment of Infidels within Muslim-ruled states, include all sorts of places outside "the West" as she so carefully put it. Think of Hindus (and Sikhs, and Christians) discriminated against in Afghanistan, in Pakistan, in Bangladesh, even in India itself where Muslim terror attacks are routine, and routinely ignored outside of the most local press coverage, think of the mass murder (sometimes through deliberate starvation) of Christians during the Biafra War, of Christians and animists in the southern Sudan, of the non-Arab (black African) Muslims, deemed insufficiently "Muslim" because not Arab (and for Arabs, who regard themselves as the "best of peoples" because they brought Islam to the world, there has always been the view that Islam belongs to them), in Darfur, in Mali and Mauritania (where black Africans are still enslaved), and now in Chad, where the Arabs are pursuing the refugees who fled from Darfur.

No, it is not "the West that is on a collision course with Islam." It is Islam that has always been on a "collision course" with the entire non-Muslim world, but that for centuries was largely limited to slaving raids in black Africa, in the Caucasus (especially Georgia and Circassia) and the southern Slavic lands, and up and down the coasts of Western Europe. With the OPEC money and the movement of Muslims behind enemy lines, the Jihads limited to tiny Israel or to largely defenseless blacks in the Sudan and Hindus in Bangladesh and Pakistan, has now expanded. It is everywhere. A thousand local manifestations of a single source of prompting: the source is Islam. The texts are Qur'an and Hadith. The model is Muhammad. Read. Study. Figure it out. Forget about the "democracy" project of ignorant and timid members of the Administration. Forget about the terminally stupid, like Tom Friedman. Forget about the timid editors of The New Duranty Times, who cannot be bothered to have their reporters, much less themselves, immerse themselves in the texts of Islam, and the history of Islamic conquest.

Fai da te. Do it yourself. Don't go to Home Depot for the necessary materials. Go to the bookstore. Go to the library. Go on-line. It's all there. An Infidel mind is a terrible thing to waste. Go to.

This little tidbit also flays the notion that "moderation" would be a good thing for us... Islam will always harbor the threat that Jihad will rear its ugly head, that the rape and murder of humanity will begin afresh, as we see in the latter half of the 20th Century with the staggering inflows of cash for oil to Muslim regions have caused...

Persons such as Daniel Pipes (and even sometimes Robert Spencer) who call for or hold out hope for "moderation" in Islam are selling a fanciful fairytale... I think that all calls for such are a troubling postponement of the final realization we must arrive at:

Islam is incompatible with our way of life. If we wish to survive the 1300 year old and continuing onslaught, Islam must be named for the enemy it is, utterly repudiated, definitively pushed back on its heels, and if at all possible, destroyed. If these steps can't be accomplished, the primitive eating machine will continue to bore, cleave, and rage against us until we are merely dust under Islam's cloven hoof.

I can actually sympathize a little with the Malaysian here. I knew someone from that country who wondered aloud, after being a long-time advocate of Malaysian anti-Communist "neutrality" in the Cold War, if he had become America's enemy because he kept halal, prayed five times, and hoped to make the hajj--after all, American had declared itself against "fundamentalism", and he understood that the "fundamentalist" Christians he met in America and Canada were just "serious Christians", not Klansmen.

The use of the term "fundamentalist" for Muslim crazies does not predate the Iranian revolution, and was probably coined to make the Evangelicals (who were abandoning the New Deal coalition in Jimmy Carter's hour of need) look un-American. I hope the editorial staffs of the NYSlimes and Washington Compost are proud of themselves.

"Persons such as Daniel Pipes (and even sometimes Robert Spencer) who call for or hold out hope for "moderation" in Islam are selling a fanciful fairytale..."
-- from a posting above

Robert Spencer has never held out hope for "moderate" Islam. He simply poses a series of questions, or challenges, to those who claim they are "moderate." He asks, repeatedly (a whole lot of repetition is going on at this website, consciously, because pedagogic demands require it), on what texts in Qur'an and Hadith do you propose to base your "moderation" so that it does not merely reflect individual whim, but can be imparted to others? And on what basis could you persuade hundreds of millions of other, "immoderate" Muslims, that all these Jihad-passages, all these stories in the Hadith, all these unpleasant episodes in the life of the Model Man, Muhammad, can somehow be ignoredthem, or interpreted them away?

That line is quite different from Pipes, who has repeatedly uttered this mantra of "moderate Muslims are the solution."

Fair enough.

Hugh: Fai da te. Do it yourself. Don't go to Home Depot for the necessary materials. Go to the bookstore. Go to the library. Go on-line. It's all there. An Infidel mind is a terrible thing to waste.

Anyone who actually does what Hugh suggests will know shortly that this female semi-muslim golf player, is full of petrified matter.

OK. From now on, I will just equate terrorists with muslims ... dropping the radical/fundamentalist nonsense, entirely.

When pressed further, we all know that Islam, which they claim is a religion of peace is only that when one is living according to the rules set aside in the Qu'ran, otherwise, one is a rebel and thus there can be no peace. Who is she fooling? Could she site at least 4 or 5 examples of Islamic countries where this is the case. Huh? Wake me when she does...then again, just bury me 'cause you know what will freeze first.

PJ

"...dropping the radical/fundamentalist nonsense, entirely."

That's the ticket! Paper beats rock -- reality beats fantasy -- truth beats lies -- democracy beats barbarous Islamic tribalism -- first world enlightenment beats third world ignorance -- Western hopefulness beats Muslim nihilism -- American secularism beats Islamic theocracy -- our sanity beats their fanaticism -- our laws of man beats their laws of "Allah" -- Our unlimited brightness beats their endless wasteland of darkness....

We should never be embarrassed or ashamed of our incredible successes -- and we should never be embarrassed to point out the numberless failures of the Muslims and the utter and complete ugliness of Islam.

Of course, the MSM has been lying to us for years. This is from a book published in 1987:

I read the article with some interest, since that same edition of The Times, carried another and more up-to-date article by Fisk, concerning Iranian matters and sent from Tehran. In fact he had not been seen in Beirut for some weeks (at least, by those to whom I spoke during my visit). Nor did the article show any awareness of the actual situation in the Lebanon. It might have been written two years ago; and it seemed to have no other purpose than to black in for the hundredth time the contours of a caricature whose credibility derives from nothing more than Fisk's habit of repeating it. but then, I reflected, suppose Robert Fisk had written the truth about the Islamic militancy which is now at work in the Lebanon: would he have been able to reside comfortably in the Iranian capital? Suppose he had, over the years, written the truth about the Syrian occupation: would he have been able to claim that special expertise which attaches - he hastens to inform us - to those who can travel "North of Baalbek" (i.e. to the zone occupied for the past ten years by Syria)? Or suppose he had written the truth about the Palestinians, whose lawless cohorts roamed the countryside of Lebanon, tormenting Shi'ite and Christian alike, and driving thousands from their homes, long before the Israeli invasion: would he have been able to enjoy the comfort, along with so many other Western correspondents, of a West Beirut hotel owned by Palestinians? And would he have been able to travel freely in countries whose leaders depend for their legitimacy on a united opposition to the "Zionist enemy", and on a selfless championship of the Palestinian cause (a championship which has invariably stopped short of offering the Palestinians a home)?

A Land Held Hostage: Lebanon and the West

These islamic groups have a gift for speaking the liberal language. Such comments that it is not the fault of islam, that islam is the only victims in the world, Similiar comments such as israeli occupation breeds suicide bombings appease the liberal idea that one is not accountable for their own actions

Yojimbo--

What a find. Over the years I have heard all sorts of stories from English and other journalists who have covered some of the same areas as Fisk, and who assured me he could not have been, or gave no sign of being, in a paticular place at the time he claimed to have been there. But if it's in a Good Cause, as Fisk would see it -- then Who Cares? He has a few steady themes: always there is his father, and World War I (brought up on every occasion), the relative perfidy of the United States, the absolute perfidy of Israel. And never a word, from this churner out of a thousand-page horror, about what is in Qur'an and Hadith, and Sira. Not a word about the example of Muhammad, not a single quote from any of the Hadith.

A thousand pages devoted to the Middle East, and to Iran, and Afghanistan, and not an intelligent word or two about the real contents of Islam, or the connection between Muslim attitudes toward Israel, or the Christians in Lebanon or Egypt, and the historic -- some 1350 years of history -- attitude toward the non-Muslims in the lands conquered by Islam.

That is not the only reason everything Fisk writes or says is completely worthless, and make him a guide to nothing and to nowhere. But it is one of the reasons. When Edward Said died, he began to dissolve before our very eyes. He left not a monument, but a junk heap of false ideas hysterically expressed. And everyone is now taking him apart -- from Robert Irwin to Ibn Warraq -- and no one can put him back together again.

No one will even try with Robert Fisk. It isn't worth it. His books will be unread, he himself has entered the language, not quite synonymous with, but close in meaning to, "quisling" and "a benedict arnold."

Next, let's talk about the word Islamist. A dodge by our MSM --- and the clever Moslems who run them --- to further disassociate Islam from itself?

It's a word not in the dictionary. It's a new word, a word coming to populate our discourse even as the concept of Unicorns falls into increasing disrepute.

Islamist. More tiptoeing. I can hear the eggshells breaking already. Wring your hands and sputter apologies to joe new master. An innovative cool new word uncritically accepted by almost everybody, and a word that will help ease us on to the death of world freedom.

My daddy always warned me about using bad language. I never understood grave importance of his admonitions.

Seems all these peace loving individuals are taking mind altering drugs as needed.
Smith and Wesson will suffice for me.

Wasn't Mohammed a "fundamental Muslim"? How many Jihads did he lead? How many people did he kill or have killed? How many slaves did he own? How old was Aisha when he raped her? Nine years old? Hmmmm.... seems to me that it's the "fundamental Muslims" one should be extra wary of.....

Is the speaker not dealing with the fact that thre is a clash of civilizations going on?

I've got a solution. Issue a US gov't fatwa requiring that calls for all 9-yr old Moslem girls to be rounded up and herded into facilities where they can hook up with adult men Infidel pedophiles and devout Moslems.

The feds could call it the Camp Gitmo Sunnah. Git it? This would really shake things up.


Sorry for type o's, english is my third language
Posted by: Beerguyster

Yeaahh, eengliish is my theerrdd language affateerr Teexann and rrannchh.

It is just hell trying to type with a drawl.

seee yalll.


The Texican.

Who knows, a Cultural Demolition Derby might be a hoot! Western 'steamroller' (M1 Abrams type, one each) vs. Islamic go-kart. Pay-per-view of course. Oh yeah, and a run sniffer dog over the go-kart. Wouldn't want any unanticipated 'fireworks'.

...and run a sniffer dog over the go-kart.

Criticism of Malaysia is really undercut by the fact that we also have race-based affirmative action programs here in America. One more example of equality-minded Western inventions being twisted to support some facet of unsustainable Islamic lifestyles.

And what's a "fundamental Muslim" anyways? By the literal definition, it is a Muslim who is base.

Isn't that all of them?

What about the much-ballyhooed moderates? Are they debased?

Works for me, or am I off-base?

They get a way with it because they know that the west prefers to remain ignorant and stupid. They get away with it because they think nobody will ever take the time to study Koran, Sira and Hadith.

They get away with it because they scream 'racism' and discrimination', they scream loud enough and they find enough lefty looney suckers in the west who believe they can't be wrong because they are mostly stupid and poor.. And if they call for genocide and annihilation of infidels & Jews nobody wants to know...

What a recipe for success!

I am sick and tired of 'fundamentalist Islam, radical Islam, militant Islam, fanatical Islam, Islamo-fascism, Islamists, extremists, terrorists, insurgents, rebels' and the "WOT"- its all Islam, nothing else. The slaves of Allah gotta go:

Internment and deportations NOW, no dialogue, no concessions, no more compromise: Round 'em up and ship 'em out, no other way...

right on,sheik

i just got "sword of the prohpet"from my local library,just barely got done with the first chapter,and i allready hate that child molesting
S.O.B

great man my ass,their nothin but perverts,in islam.The first muslim was a child molester,and the rest of them are talked into killen themselves and other's,just cause they are promisted virgin's.sounds like they should all be locked up to me,i know i am gunna keep my kids from em,as much as i can.What would people think,if jesus didnt die on the cross for our sins.What if he said i died so you can get all the booty you want in heaven?How can muslim's be so stupid?but,i am more ashamed of my fellow american's (politicians)for not stickin up for us,is Goerge Bush a pervert to?Everybody who signed the decloration of independance has got to by mad as hell.I think when they looked down at us,and we just let Bush steal the presidency,and didnt stand up and fight,to right the wrong.We let em down,they were probley saying"why did we fight,and die,to bring this great country into exsistance,if it was all for nothing".How many have we lost fighting to keep it,why?So a spineless governmaent can give it away?I'm ashamed of our government,i love america.just not who is runnin it.it is no longer a government of the people,of the people.

patriot-

You shouldn't be talkin' so bad about the "noble" religion.

Or, as Condi Rice said, of the "holy" Koran.

Or a work beloved by those "majority of moderate Muslism" as Rumsfeld keeps reiterating.

I always put on rubber gloves when I read that book.

And wonder how anyone, after the 7th century, ever bought this pack of psychotic sh*t.

Or why our leaders keep spraying it with perfume, lying about its contents, and other snake-oil salesmen tricks.

What the hell is in it for them?

Condos in Dubai?

How about once, just once, letting actions seak louder than words, Mr. Aziz. I wonder if it ever occured to her that maybe, if Mayalsia stopped accusing the jews of ruling by proxy, stopped their sharia based laws for Indians and Chinese and actively hunted out terrorists instead of ignoring them, then maybe we would listen when you say how unfairly you're being stereotyped. At the moment, I'd just be lucky most of the world doesn't take human rights seriously enough to actually pressure you guys to improve treatment of indians and chinese before doing business.

If you Malaysians can drag yourselves out of the 7th century, learn to treat chinese and indian minorities as equals, and in general put your domestic and foreign policies where your mouths are, then you can go on about how wonderful the religion of islam is all day for all anyone cares.

This Malaysian Minister Aziz is giving us non-Muslims a masterful lesson in Taqqiyya. As we have all seen by now, such Muslim apologists avoid telling us that the Kuran possesses numerous passages that command Muslims to attack non-Muslims. And such warfare against non-Muslims is financed by countries like Malaysia behind the thin veil of pro-Islamic propaganda like this here.

I have noticed that the door to Islamic terrorism is never really closed in any Islamic country--despite all rhetoric to the contrary. And certainly not in Malaysia where the 19 9-11-2001 hijackers convened in the year 2000 in the capital city Kuala Lumpur (and almost certainly with the Malaysian government's knowledge), or where at an Islamic convention ex-Malaysian PM Mahathir professed the need for Islam to wipe out the western world through warfare and then gave his subliminal blessings to Muslims for continued attacks on the Jews...for being jews and having allegedly commited a host of unsubstantiated (and vague) offenses.

If these people want us to believe them, they could and should STOP FINANCING ISLAMIC TERROR!! One suspects that they would be loathe to adapt any such suggestion. In short Islamicized countries will probably never stop financing Islamic terror despite what they tell the rest of the world.

According to Douglas Farah in BLOOD FROM STONES, several years ago Malaysian ship belonging to the Malaysian company the Oriental Timber Company was seen docking in a port in a conflicted west African country docking and delivering armaments to warring Islamic rebels. As I have said, for this and other reasons I do NOT believe this Malaysian!!!!

Folks, Robert mentions Qutb and the interpretation of verse 2:256...here are some extracts from a student's thesis on Qutb...

The Thought of Sayyid Qutb: Radical Islam's Philosophical Foundations

by Luke Loboda

Excerpts

"...Professor Muhammad Qutb, Sayyid’s brother, was a teacher and mentor to the young Osama Bin Laden, who has grown to lead the radical Islamic terrorist movement. Today’s radical Islamic groups, such as al-Qaeda and Islamic Jihad, have borrowed much from the thought of Qutb in justifying their vision for the world and the violence they promote..."

On "no compulsion in religion" (2:256)

"...By stating the objective of jihad as a removal of the institutions that act as obstacles to the establishment of a fully Islamic society, Qutb raises a number of issues. The first issue is the issue of compulsion. Qur’an 2:256 explicitly states that "There shall be no compulsion in religion;" therefore, people should not be forced into conversion. Qutb argues that the establishment of an Islamic society does not violate this commandment. Qutb does not believe that the destruction of jahili society causes anyone to convert to Islam by force. From his perspective, Qutb believes that the abolition of jahili institutions will "free those people who wish to be freed from enslavement to men."71 It does not force others to change their hearts. Furthermore, Qutb proclaims freedom of belief to be "man’s most precious right in this world…any infringement of this right, direct or indirect, must be fought even if one has to kill for it."72 Because this freedom is of such value, Muslims must fight jahiliyyah to obtain it. Although the abolition of jahiliyyah causes Islam to be the dominant faith, Islamic society does not use physical force to compel non-believers to convert. Qutb views the compulsion rule as applying to conversion through violent or coercive threat, but not to social pressure. He does not believe that jihad compels men coercively; rather, it destroys jahili institutions by force, not people who commit jahiliyyah."

http://www.ashbrook.org/publicat/thesis/loboda/home.html

We should give no more weight to the "no compulsion" statement than we give to the numerous statements in the Koran that Allah is "Forgiving, merciful"--juxtaposed with over 250 statements condemning people to the punishment of an eternity of torturous hell-fire for mere disbelief in Allah. Whatever the apparently self-contradictory "Allah" meant, it has nothing to do with modern western concepts of forgiveness, compulsion, etc.

Archimedes-

Just as finding a decapitated horse's head in your bed doesn't compel you to obey the Mob.

It's merely a kind of "social pressure".

After all, the horse is a "temptation" -to gambling, -or to wasting you time on something other than prayer. So it is really a boon that we destroy it. It "frees" you from the sin of "mis-directed affection".

Your dog is next.

Want to convert now?