Afghanistan: Many Convert to Christianity In Secret, Says Author

Christianity is likely to be of greatest appeal to non-Arabs, who make up 80% of the world's Muslims. If a goal of Infidels should be to shrink the army of Islam, and it should, then appeals to those non-Arab Muslims, by emphasizing the Arab supremacist ideology for which Islam is merely a vehicle, should be at the center of policy.

It isn't -- yet.

Hugh, having recently read Irshad Manji's book, "The Trouble with Islam", I see that she identifies and emphasizes Arab supremacy within Islam as a major problem. Since then, I've run across the same idea in a few other Muslim's writings on the internet.

You note that such an idea is not at the "center of policy" at this point, but would you say it's making inroads?

I would imagine such charges would work best coming from believers anyway, rather than from the "outside".

Is this not the way Christianity has always spread itself? How many years of corruption and rot did it take for Rome to fall into the arms of the ones they persecuted most? Hundreds. The rot and decay of Islam is finally exposed for all to see. Let the effendi boast about their fabled past. Rome, too, had her glories, but it was Telemachus stumbling into the bloody arena crying, "In the name of Christ, forbear", which finally sent the idle to their knees. Christ conquered Rome, and the Christian Heretics afterward conquered the corrupted papacy, and finally, leaving Europe to crumble under its own inquisitions and sectarianism and stupid principalities and fiefdoms, America rises out of the sea. Christ has indeed been alive and well on Planet Earth...and I am sure, he is somewhere, driving a busfull of Hajjis in Mecca, too.

another point to the Arabism of islam l only learned recently was that all of their prayers at their mosques are done in arabic. since most of the muslims are non-arabic and do not speak or read and write arabic, this should be really exposed. how can any westerner such as this idoit hooper, cat stevens ever become muslim, it must be due to their being illerate in arabic. or just plain lazy and did not read the whole koran? we need to push for Christians to bring their bibles and croses over to Afganishtan even more so now, to give people courage to stand up to these monsters, and show them the light of freedoms. when you come down to it, its all about control by the immans over their people. when given the chance to leave islam over another more sincere religion people will leave it in doves. with Israel bringing in European style Democracy and freedoms, the immans are greatly upset at their loss of control over their people.. so the immans brain wash further their own people. they will do anything to keep control, yes even put bomb belts on their children. The West has to press on this issue, people are waking up, first this year with the riots over the very mild cartoons, and now with this possible killing of a Christian, yeah give enough rope to these monster muslims, they will help hang their culture even sooner!

Hello, Jauhara Al-Kafirah,

As always, God brings good out of everything. But "Christian heretics afterward corrupted the conquered papacy"? With the result that the followers of Jesus are divided into thousands of denominations. Not exactly something desirable when the task is to evangelize Islamdom. Divide et impera said the Romans.

I personally know a convert, now living in Pakistan, who cannot speak out as to her conversion to Christianity. And she has told me that her own father would kill her if he knew that she is now an apostate.

At this site is a writer known as Avenging Apostate. Read what he has to say--PLEASE.

And this is a link to all the articles Avenging Apostate has posted so far.

Jauhara al-Karfirah: who conquered what? Count the number of Catholics in the world. Then count the number of Protestants - I will even allow you to reckon those who are no longer Christian, such Mormons, Unitarians, Episcopalians, and Jehova's Witnesses. Then go back and throw away your stack of Jack T. Chick books.

A couple of snippets from Bruce Bower's 'While Europe Slept'...

On multiculturalism:

"To discourage the children and grandchildren of immigrants from identifying with the country of their birth and from bearing allegiance to its values is to encourage them to look elsewhere for something to identify with. Such multicultural conduct isn't an act of generosity - it's an act of cultural self-hatred and cultural suicide."

On the condesencion towards immigrants:

"Across Europe, the attitude is millions in aid, not a penny for salary."

On the attitudes of Muslim youth in the West:

"They see Western society as the enemy, European men as wimps, European women as sluts. Their supreme shared value is a primitive cult of honor, according to which if your daughter dates a European boy, she damages the family honor and merits death, but if your son rapes a European girl, it's the girl's fault."

It has always been my observation, in conversation with new immigrants, as well as all that I have read about the image of the United States in the third world (how coincidencedentally so heavily Muslim) that America represents hope. With the degradation of America's image in the world as of late, cause aside, is Christianity replacing it? There was an article linked to in this forum recently about the growing "problem" of Algerians leaving Islam for Christianity. One of the themes that Algerians have been expressing is "Islam means death and Christianity means life".

Islam in its present form is a doomed belief system. The writing is on the wall. Even Al-Jazeera can't keep the civilized from the gates of Mecca it seems - they gave Wafa Sultan a soapbox - twice.

It is becoming clear that far from being the fastest growing religion, Islam is the religion from which more people are leaving than any other. This is our victory against the Jihad, and it is far more important even than the "war against terror". I realize this is an impossibility, but what if the United States had turned the other cheek after 9/11? To the mass of Muslims who live in fear of their most faithful co-religionists, what kind of appeal would that have been? I do not think I could have stood for it; my anger on 9/12 was too great. I am not sure it would have been the right path. But it might have exacerbated the hemorrhage of Muslims from the prison of Islam.

The west awaits a far more visionary leader, who can only be an American president, who understands the true nature of this conflict. Our enemy is weak. The can kill to intimidate but they still posess nothing else. They have riots, death threats, suicide bombs, and tyranny over the 1.2 billion people they have pressed into their cult, but underneath it all there is nothing. Now more than ever, we have nothing to fear but fear itself.

Quijybo

OT but makes some salient points relative to this discussion.

Prince Charles urges tolerance during Saudi visit

Britain's Prince Charles visited the academic heart of Saudi Islam on Saturday and urged a tolerant and flexible approach to religion, but although many students welcomed his visit, most rejected his views.

In a speech before Saudi scholars and officials at Al-Imam Muhammad Ibn Saud Islamic University, Charles argued against a rigid interpretation of religious texts..."What is so distinctive of the great ages of faith surely was that they understood, as well as sacred texts ... the meaning of God's word for all time and its meaning for this time," Charles said in his speech... "it was Islam's greatness to understand this in its full depth and challenge."

STUDENTS DISAGREE

The Saudi university students, most of them bearded and wearing white robes and sandals, were kept from the prince by a large security deployment.

Saudi Arabia's powerful religious establishment imposes the strict Wahhabi school of Islamic law which applies almost to the letter the text of the Koran.

Asked to comment on the prince's call for a flexible interpretation of Islamic texts, student Maher al-Sehili said: "Charles and the West don't understand the true Islam."

Another student shouted: "There's nothing to change. Haven't they read the Koran?"

Abu Dijana, 21, added: "He (Charles) should remember that Koran is sacred. I don't trust them (Westerners) and the Koran says it clearly -- Jews and Christians will not be satisfied until you follow their path."

Abu Dijana, 21, added: "He (Charles) should remember that Koran is sacred. I don't trust them (Westerners) and the Koran says it clearly -- Jews and Christians will not be satisfied until you follow their path."

Posted by: Lisa [TypeKey Profile Page] at March 25, 2006 01:50 PM
The path away from Islam will lead to their destruction, that is the real fear of islamic clerics. when given a choice most people chose freedom, that does not include islam.

Oh, Hugh, never mind. I've just gotten a moment to do a search on this site of Irshad Manji and I see what you think of her!

I have no quarrel with any of your points in your May 2005 posting on her (how can I? you're a walking encyclopedia...), but must ask; so what's wrong with dyed hair?

Vee,

Irshad Manji wrote this opinion piece regarding Bush's pre-emption doctrine appearing today in USA Today and on Yahoo News.

Pre-emption draws surprising consensus

I'm enough of a historian to know that George W. Bush isn't alone in his [pre-emption] approach. Other statesmen have shared his belief in pre-emption. Some of them are even lionized by Bush's harshest critics: Muslim-Americans.

Consider the prophet Mohammed himself. According to Muslim history, God's own messenger engaged in pre-emptive action against those whom he suspected of plotting against Islam. There's the well-known example of Jewish tribes who refused to take Mohammed as their prophet. After rumors intensified that these Jews were collaborating with Arab pagans to kill the prophet, Mohammed and his companions struck first. They exiled two of the tribes and later acted on a Muslim arbiter's opinion that a third tribe should be slaughtered.

Self-defense, my fellow Muslims will insist. Bush has said the same about invading
Iraq, but I don't see too many Muslims accepting that argument. Ah, but the president never had hard evidence for his claims. Fact is, neither did prophet Mohammed. He went on faith.

In drawing this comparison, I'm bound to be accused of besmirching the reputation of Islam's prophet and thereby joining the Danish cartoonists in infidel hell. But as many Americans believe that dissent is a patriotic duty, so I believe that self-criticism lives up to the best ideals of the Quran, Islam's holy book.

Honesty demands that Muslims in the USA judge the doctrine of pre-emption by a single standard. That requires making a choice. We can accept what the prophet did as necessary and guided by God, in which case we can't be shocked when the president makes a similar case for his policy. Or we can acknowledge that the prophet Mohammed's pre-emptive assaults on Jews were morally wrong, in which case we've got credibility when slamming the Bush doctrine.

Abdul Rahman, the man condemned to death for having abandoned Islam, is just one of many Afghanis who decide to convert to Christianity, but most are forced to do so secretly, argues Arab Christian author Camille Eid.

[.......snip......]

He was convinced that they were trying to send him a coded message" said Eid, a Lebanese Maronite who lives in Italy.

Maronites are not Arabs, from everything I know, even though they may use Arabic as their primary language. So which one is it?

Hugh, on your assumptions, although Afghans are not Arabs, they see it more important to maintain an identity distinct from Persians. Within Islam, it's easy, since they are (with the exception of Hazaras) Sunni, while the Iranians are Shia. In a post Islamic world too, they'd want to maintain a difference from the Persians. They therefore would prefer to be similar to Arabs, although persecution at the hands of al Qaeda might have changed some of that for Tajiks and Hazaras, but probably not the ruling Pashtun. I therefore don't think that Arab supremacy, which is a good argument elsewhere, would work here, since the Afghans, unlike the Persians, don't have a pre-Islamic heritage that is distinct from both Persia and India.

On the above story itself, Christianity makes sense, The other good choice would be the pre-Islamic Buddhism that existed in Gandhara - given that it is an agnostic philosophy more than a religion, I'd think that it would be easier for Afghans who want to renounce religion altogether to embrace Buddhism.

Many Muslims who leave Islam also enter into the wider world of agnosticism (sometimes narrowing their choice again, to atheism). We should also embrace this as a positive movement. I would infinitely prefer that a Muslim become a follower of Howard Stern rather than he remain a Muslim. In fact, the multiculturalist cafeteria out there provides the Muslim with thousands of choices if he wants to add some flavor to his agnosticism; anything from a believer in Tsohanoai, the Sun God of the Navajo Indians, to California zen Buddhism, to a Madonna-like dabbling in the Kabbala, and on and on and on. Let's not limit his last meal to Christianity.

Of course most here agree that the course out of Islam isn't exclusiviely into Christianity, that everyone should be able to find the faith or belief, religious, secularist or atheist, most confortable to them. To any apostate from Islam, although Islamic tenets are being rejected, there still may be certain aspects of community or ritualism that the apostate does not want to abandon. For those apostates from Islam that just can not give up ritualistic stoning, may I suggest Rastafarianism as a logical alternative.

Last year on GoV, I wrote this

The sentence of death on Apostates of Islam.

Freedom of choice is the hallmark of a liberal and just society. Yet we countenance the fact that people who leave Islam, have to go about in daily fear of their lives. Hour by hour that fear stalks them, even here in the West.

How could we have allowed such a situation come to pass in the citadel of liberalism? How did we ignore the cries for help from the weak, the vulnerable and the isolated?

Such social issues are not the fault of Muslims. Muslims are the first and most oppressed victims of Islam. They are just as kind and nice people as any other. It is the doctrine of Islam that gives rise to social values that are so cruel and unjust on individual Muslims. My heart goes out to the weak, the trammelled and the vulnerable Apostates of Islam. They are truly the most marginalized and victimised individuals in the world. Let it not be said, that even here in the West, we allowed such injustice to continue.

Vee

Anwar Sheikh identified that Islam was first and foremost, a vehichle for Arab imperialism.

http://islamreview.org/AnwarShaikh/index1.html

Also, Google Anwar Sheikh for more.

Thanks, Lisa. I'm not quite sure what's she's saying there; basically it's just "people in glass houses shouldn't throw stones". Hardly a strong defense of an opinion on the subject at hand.

Gee, I didn't realize she's at Yale now; I'm wondering if she's commented about the Sayyid Rahmatullah Hashemi flap yet.

What I can't figure out about her is why she's still a Muslim! I can't, for the life of me, understand why someone capable of intellectually picking apart her religion, whose tenets, if followed scrupulously, would see her dead for her lesbianism, continues to adhere to Islam. I leave that for the psychologists.

Vee

A good collection of books online on islam from various perspectives is here

http://www.faithfreedom.org/library.htm

Vee it is possible she is fighting fire with fire. She may not really consider herself a muslim she just distracts her opponents with the claim. She might just use it as a “I’m a lot of things but not an apostate” type of argument. If that is what she is doing it is a brilliant move. They can’t automatically dismiss her by issuing a fatwa and ordering her killed.

Thanks, DP111. I did Google Anwar Shaikh, and came up with the "Institute for the Secularisation of Islamic Society" website. (I'm still trying to wrap my mind around "secularisation" and "Islamic" in the same sentence; isn't that an oxymoron?)

Anyway, they look like an interesting group of thinkers (I see Ibn Warraq mentioned there), and am pleased to see they're operating in my back yard (New Jersey). There may be hope yet.

I'm not a praying woman, but I sure "pray" for their safety. The day an apostate is murdered in the US would be a dark day for Western culture, indeed.

Quijybo

Great post.

There is a spiritual void within islam, consequently it tries to replace that void with a system of laws that were set in stone some 1000 years ago. This void also leaves the ordinary muslim with nothing but the constant repetion of certain favourite Arabic phrases from the koran, and ritual.

As secular education spreads throughout the word it will broaden the horizon of muslims, just as it has in the West. This will lead to an increasing number of muslims who want more, and not finding it, will turn to other faiths or even non-faith. That has been the case with many, such Ali Sena and Anwar Sheikh.

The mullahs and imams are now very fearful. Theirs is a house of cards. Take one card out and the house collapses, and it is for this reason that Apostates are persued and prosecuted with great zeal. It is for this reason that they incite the faithful to acts of wanton violence. The game is up though. Even the MSM is beginning to see through the false outrage. These are all signs of inherent structural weakness and not strength.

Thanks again, DP111; I am aware of the faithfreedom website, and do visit it occasionally.

Ronin, why can't they issue a fatwa against Manji & order her death, based on her writings, a la Salman Rushdie?

A good article well worth reading

Jack is a man of straw when Muslims talk of killing converts - By Charles Moore

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/main.jhtml;jsessionid=ZXEPWLCB4CDKZQFIQMFCFFOAVCBQYIV0?xml=/opinion/2006/03/25/do2502.xml&sSheet=/portal/2006/03/25/ixportal.html

Vee by issuing a fatwa and ordering her killed they slander their own religion. They claim tolerance, so as long as she “questions” islam but doesn’t condemn it, she should remain fatwa free. The most they can say is she is misguided, mistaken or confused but as long as she remains a muslim she should in theory remain fatwa free. Still they would hurt her badly if they thought they could get away with it.

Above, I posted a link to a speech given by Prince Charles at the Al-Imam Muhammad Ibn Saud Islamic University in Saudi Arabia calling for ISlam to open itself up to interpretation in the modern world to reclaim its past. I just stumbled across the BBC account of the same speech.

It is interesting to note the BBC did not report any reactions of or statements made by his audience in its account. Not even a slightest mention that there was any disagreement with his message for Islam to open up more liberal interpretions for reconciliation.

I can not determine if the BBC is trying to protect the image of the Prince to hide the fact that his audience was not receptive to his message, or trying to protect the image of Islam in that its students and scholars stated in response to the Prince's speech that it can not be interpreted and modernized, with one essentially telling the Prince, and the West in general, to bugger off.

From the article posted by DP111, supra:

The reason, it seems, why Muslims want apostates killed is not just outrage at abandoning what they regard as the truth. It is because they see it as a kind of treason. Islam thinks it wrong to separate the government of a nation from the rule of faith. Indeed, the only nation whose ultimate validity it recognises is what it calls "the Muslim nation". Changing your faith is considered as much a threat to order and society as secretly working for the KGB was for us in the Cold War.

What this means is that there can be no equality, or even safety, for other religions, let alone for atheists, in a sharia-based Muslim society. The best that can be hoped for is the second-class, protected status for Christians and Jews, rather like the rights of black tribes under apartheid in South Africa, which is called "dhimmi". Dhimmis have inferior rights, and have to pay a special tax. What is out of the question is conversion.

There are, nowadays, many Muslims who do not agree with this ferocious intolerance. The Council for American-Islamic Relations has issued a statement saying that the Koran does not demand such punishments. Some in our own Muslim Council of Britain agree. A clutch of moderate Muslims who had a private meeting with the Prince of Wales about this last year told him that they regretted the penalty. They also said, however, that they were not going to speak out against it in public.

So it seems that, if we are to wait for most Muslim leaders to move away from a view that has prevailed for most of their religion's history, we shall have to wait a long time.

Lisa posted: I can not determine if the BBC is trying to protect the image of the Prince to hide the fact that his audience was not receptive to his message, or trying to protect the image of Islam.

OoooH. That is tough one Lisa.

Well let me see. For the last ten years at the least, the BBC has been the propaganda arm of islam in the West and the UK in particular, with numerous programs on Islam this and islam that. The Hajj gets special treatement as if the UK was already an islamic country.

The BBC has taken up every islamic cause, particularly the Jihad against Israel. It has demonised Israel and all its politicians, while paying reverant homage to terrorists such as Yasser Arafat, and Sheikh Yassin.

It was the front leader in accusing Israel of shooting Mohd Al Dura - the palestinian Arab boy. It has never re-examined that case, even when evidence shows that he was shot by palestinian gunmen. It was also the front runner in the Jenin "massacre". A massacre that never was.

The BBC demonised the Serbs, never examining or bringing forth that the Serbs also had a just case. It never showed the barbarity of the KLA, whose activities were responsible for the retaliation by Serbs.

Still, it could be that they were trying to protect the Prince.

There is no difference what the Telegraph article says (DP111's post) or what Muslims themselves say in the U.S. The Muslim Student Association at the University of Southern California has a wonderful web page, Ten Misconceptions About Islam. It is very enlightening to see what the MSA writes to counter misconceptions about Islam:

In this article, we will try to clear up many of the misconceptions that are prevalent about Islam. Before jumping into the list of misconceptions directly, it is important to give a little interesting background about the source of Islam.

We avoid the word religion because in many non-Islamic societies, there is a separation of "religion and state." This separation is not recognized at all in Islam: the Creator is very much concerned with all that we do, including the political, social, economic, and other aspects of our society. Hence, Islam is a complete way of life.

The opening two paragraphs of the MSA thesis already puts Islam in contraposition to the 1st Amendment to the U.S. Constitution, which forms the basis for our seperation of Church and State.

Is it a misconception that Islam is incompatible with democracy? Let's again see what the MSA has to say about liberal, pluralistic, securalist democracy.

Islam is a complete way of life. Given this, it is not surprising that the Creator is concerned with the method which we choose to govern ourselves.

[I]t is clear that the state's obligation of obedience to the Creator is as important as the obedience of the individual. Hence, the Islamic state must derive its law from the Qur'an and Sunnah. This principle excludes certain choices from the Islamic state's options for political and economic systems, such as a pure democracy...For example, a pure democracy places the people above the Qur'an and Sunnah, and this is disobedience to the Creator. However, the best alternative to a pure democracy is a democracy that implements and enforces the Shari'ah (Islamic Law).

In the U.S. Declaration of Independence it states inalienable rights are granted to men by the Creator, that to secure these rights governments derive their powers from the consent of the governed. Again, we see Islam as brought to us by the MSA as being the polar opposite of this proposition. We believe inalienable rights come from the Creator, rights that can not be abridged by government. Muslims believe the Creator to be the source of law itself, and governments can not obey the will of the people to grant them any rights. Also, the self evident truth of equality of men does not hold true in the Shari'ah, which states that Islam is to dominate and force the non-Muslim into willful submission (Koran 9:29).

Is Islam peace? Even the MSA says this is the number one misconception.

It might seem strange to think of this as a misconception, but in fact it is. The root word of Islam is "al-silm" which means "submission" or "surrender." It is understood to mean "submission to Allah." In spite of whatever noble intention has caused many a Muslim to claim that Islam is derived primarily from peace, this is not true.

There you have it, from Muslims themselves, educated Muslims at one of the finest universities in the U.S. Do we expect Muslims in Afghanistan to believe any differently?

Lisa

One good thing that is happening, is that atleast one MSM, the DT, is seriously and candidly examining the tenets of islam. The truth will out, especially as the Jihadis themselves are so candid about their goals.

It is just that the Liberal media in general, is unable to stomach the proposition that a "religion" can have immutable laws that demand the execution of a person for exercising his right to freedom of conscience.

But as you point out, muslims themselves openly state that islam is a "way of life" and not just a religion. Indeed - religion is a very small part of islam. V.S.Naipaul, a refreshingly honest writer, also noted this.

Ever Heard The One

""
There is the story, told frequently these days, of the scorpion and the turtle. The scorpion knocks on the turtle's shell and says he needs a ride across the river. The turtle replies that opening up would let the scorpion sting him. The scorpion says, "No, I'll let you get into the water, I'll jump on top, and then if I stung you, we'd both drown! I wouldn't be so foolish as to do that!" The turtle cogitates, and sees no logical problem.

Halfway across, the scorpion stings the turtle. As the paralysis creeps into his limbs, the turtle croaks, "But now we'll both drown!"

The scorpion replies, "I'll go to heaven, infidel scum!"
""
[blog response to article]

Afghanistan's Democratic Deficiency

By Claus Christian Malzahn

http://service.spiegel.de/cache/international/spiegel/0,1518,407493,00.html

And now, ladies and gentlemen, something to really make your blood curdle. Just saw posted at LGF the letter Mohammed Taheri-Azar wrote and told police was in his apartment just before he decided to use an SUV as a weapon.

In the name of Allah, the merciful, the compassionate.

To whom it may concern:

I am writing this letter to inform you of my reasons for premeditating and attempting to murder citizens and residents of the United States of America on Friday, March 3, 2006 in the city of Chapel Hill, North Carolina by running them over with my automobile and stabbing them with a knife if the opportunities are presented to me by Allah.

I did intend to use a handgun to murder the citizens and residents of Chapel Hill, North Carolina but the process of receiving a permit for a handgun in this city is highly restricted and out of my reach at the present, most likely due to my foreign nationality.

I am a servant of Allah. I am 22 years of age and I was born in Tehran, Iran. My father, mother and older sister immigrated to the United States in 1985 when I was two years of age and I’ve lived in the United States ever since.

I attended elementary, middle and high school in North Carolina and I was accepted into the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill. I began my college career in August 2001 and graduated in December 2005 with a bachelor’s degree in psychology and philosophy with Allah’s help.

I do not wish to pursue my career as a student any further because I have no desire to amass the impermanent and temporary fame and material wealth this world has to offer. However I made the decision to continue my studies and to graduate from the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill so that the world will know that Allah’s servants are very intelligent.

Due to the killing of believing men and women under the direction of the United States government, I have decided to take advantage of my presence on United States soil on Friday, March 3, 2006 to take the lives of as many Americans and American sympathizers as I can in order to punish the United States for their immoral actions around the world.

In the Qur’an, Allah states that the believing men and women have permission to murder anyone responsible for the killing of other believing men and women. I know that the Qur’an is a legitimate and authoritative holy scripture since it is completely validated by modern science and also mathematically encoded with the number 19 beyond human ability. After extensive contemplation and reflection, I have made the decision to exercise the right of violent retaliation that Allah has given me to the fullest extent to which I am capable at present.

I have chosen the particular location on the University campus as my target since I know there is a high likelihood that I will kill several people before being killed myself or jailed and sent to prison if Allah wills. Allah’s commandments are never to be questioned and all of Allah’s commandments must be obeyed. Those who violate Allah’s commandments and purposefully follow human fabrication and falsehood as their religion will burn in fire for eternity in accordance with Allah’s will.

Sincerely yours,
Mohammed Reza Taheri-Azar

Some defense lawyer will now argue that he was mentally incompetent since how could his allah, the most merciful, the most compassionate, order him to kill waontonly and premeditatedly. This incongruity to a lawyer reveals a typical nutcase who hears voices in his head, not an apostle of Allah. The District Attorney on this case better take a crash course in Islamic Doctrine, and not from John Esposito, or that insanity defense will prevail.

This example of Mohammedan madness coming hot on the heels of "Cartoonrage" is doing much to alert those previously unaware of the menace of Islam.
Last night I was pleasantly surprised, shocked even, to see a very accurate and hard hitting report on this man's fate in Afghanistan on the very left -leaning, multicultural TV channel SBS World News.
The segment was not brief and hurried as on the MSM stations. They actually had a lot of footage actually from Afghanistan beginning by showing a mad- mullah ranting with the usual ugly malevolance ( no surprises there .) However the more shocking evidence came next. They interviewed Afghani university students on campus who appeared quite westernized and by virtue of being where they were, presumably educated.
'aah' I thought "Here comes the voice of reason."
But no, they one by one, were adamant in their opinion that he should be hanged or otherwise executed in the most violent ways. Unanimous.
Even I , a dedicated DW and JW reader was shocked. The average viewer must have been shaken.
By comparison the ABC News ( Australian version of the BBC) reported NOTHING last night on the whole affair because it does not fit with their agenda.
As has been stated n previous posts and forums if this man is executed he would become a true " martyr" . Parallels with the crucifixion of Christ could be made.

Lisa posted: Some defense lawyer will now argue that he was mentally incompetent since how could his allah, the most merciful, the most compassionate, order him to kill waontonly and premeditatedly.

I believe that grounds of insanity are also the mechanism that will be used to release Abdul Rahman.

Insanity seems to be a recurring theme either way, whether one is a Jihadi or to explain the actions of one has left islam.

The doctrine of islam is what perverts what would be decent citizens of this planet.

I get the sense, in this Afghan apostate dilemma, of a potential very serious turning point.

A world-historical moment, if faced, that could allow Islam to free its first prisoner of faith. Ever.

And, like the cracks in Sovietized-Eastern Europe, once one area allowed freedom of movement (Hungary letting East Germans flee West through it), the whole charade crumbled.

If Islam can get one crack in its terroristic hide, and one apostate is allowed to leave, then millions could leave in a week. Hundreds of millions in a month.

I do not get a feeling that a lot of Muslims are happy with or within their creed.

And may only be 'in the faith' for this one benefit: keeping your head on your undisturbed neck.

If the 1300 year wall of fear is breached, Islam's members may flow back into the original faiths that were pressed into Islam.

This case of Rahman needs to be taken as a signal to all Muslims by Muslims:

-Are we afraid of freedom?

Can we not still love those who lovingly disagree?

This is this aeschatological moment for Islam.

Our future is tied in.

Let's hope Rahman escapes the dead 7th century.

If he does, it could free Islam.

The whole religion- emptying out like children into their first vacation.

Hope built out of terror.

Erratum:

"This is the aeschatological..."

In two words: Big Time.

I am troubled by the fact that the "War on Terror" has not produced the results that I had expected. I am truly not happy that what we call democracy in Afghanistan is nothing more than "Taliban Lite."

yohannbiimu

Thank you.

Profit's Beard,

Should Abdul Rahman be released, it will be no harbinger of a sea-change in Muslim attitudes or jurisprudence. It will be a single, exceptional case brought about by a confluence of factors, principally that the Afghan government is uniquely dependent upon the Western world for its very survival.

Should this case be resolved satisfactorily, you better believe Rahman will leave the country, that conditions inside Afghanistan will remain bleak in terms of religious freedom, and that future cases might have an entirely different outcome.

People, don't be the least surprised if:

a) Rahman finally relents and reverts back to Islam

(A Kuwaiti convert to Christianity was under similar threat about a decade ago and after holding out for several weeks as international pressure mounted on Kuwait, he issued a public statement confirming his reversion back to Islam).

b) Rahman is released and then murdered by a private citizen

(the fate - again about a decade ago - of a Pakistani Air Force mechanic who converted to Christianity and was finally released after an international outcry, only to be shot to death outside the courthouse).

My hopes are modest...that Rahman gets out of Afghanistan in one piece.

We'll see.

Cornelius

Your prognosis is right. I have felt the same as well for all those apostate muslims. In the West it is somewhat better but only just. The police in the UK refuse to recognise that islamic law requires the execution of an apostate. That was the position a year ago, mainly because the police had been undergoing "sensitivity" training by instructors from the MCB and the like. The result was that the ordinary PC was under the impression that islam was really wonderful. Things may have changed but as recently as 7/7, the Police commissioner of London, Ian Blair, was loudly claiming that islam was a RoP. This was genuine and not just politically correct garbage.

The Barnabus Fund has details of the harrassment and violence that ex-muslims face in the cities of the UK.

"but the process of receiving a permit for a handgun in this city is highly restricted and out of my reach at the present, most likely due to my foreign nationality."

Oh the racist meanies!! CAIR really needs to get involved in this.

"People, don't be the least surprised if:

a) Rahman finally relents and reverts back to Islam"

Well, I will be surprised if that happens.
Judging by the footage I've seen of Ahman, he has incredible faith.
The way he talks about Christianity and the Bible, and his devotion give me the impression he would not mind one bit becoming a martyr for Christ.
His childlike devotion and love for Christ remind me of all those stories of the early martyrs.
He might even die with a smile on his face.

Often when Muslims become apostate and convert to Christianity they put us soft western Christians to shame.

This story also illustrates to me why secular western societies are so horrified at the prospect of death(finis) and yet for a Christian with strong faith, death is no biggie.

Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one,
he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blind-folded fear
-Thomas Jefferson

DP111,

I've read about the harrassment of Muslim apostates in Britain...the death threats, the vandalization of property. You'd think that just as Western governments profess zero-tolerance for racism, there would be a similar public-education campaign and similarly harsh penalties for threats to freedom of conscience.

One can only surmise that the issue of race and racism continues to be the paramount weapon in the Western Left's nomenklature as it continues its dominance of the cultural landscape...and judging by the blind-eye turned towards the plight of Muslim apostates, Muslim women and other victims of Islamic intolerance, we must understand the cry of racism has little or nothing to do with a genuine concern for human rights.

Mike,

Very good points. Though the optimum outcome would be Rahman's freedom, I think the recantation of his Christianity would be a greater tragedy than his murder. I know this might sound insensitive to some, but it's how I feel.

I am afraid that a lot of 'converts' did it not because they realized that Christ is the real God but because they see that the Christian world is richer.

"Though the optimum outcome would be Rahman's freedom, I think the recantation of his Christianity would be a greater tragedy than his murder. I know this might sound insensitive to some, but it's how I feel."

I just wanted to extrapolate a little further. I didn't write the above as a believing Christian, only as a sociological observer.

The ramifications of Rahman's recantation would be to reinforce Islamic traditions of supremacy and intolerance. His murder would do the same, but would at least help awaken a somnambulent world that something is rotten in Mecca...that Abdul Rahman's murder was not committed by terrorists who "hijacked the faith," but by Afghan allies with the full weight of Islamic jurisprudence and public opinion on their side.

Of course in the end, Abdul Rahman's fate is his own. If he is killed, I would hope Christians around the world would honor him as a martyr.

"I know that the Quran is a legitimate and authoritative holy scripture since it is completely validated by modern science and also mathematically encoded with the number 19 beyond human ability"

Not the number 19 - that's astonishing!!! And who can argue with modern science (whatever that means). I get it now - you're nuts!!

"I know that the Quran is a legitimate and authoritative holy scripture since it is completely validated by modern science and also mathematically encoded with the number 19 beyond human ability"

i never could get what mihideen meant by that.so ya can count to 19,big whoop

See also the cartoon that accompanied Charles Moore's piece:

Oops:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/main.jhtml?xml=/opinion/2006/03/25/ixtop.xml

Patriot2:
"Does God exist? For the following reasons, it would seem that he does not..."
(Opening question of the SUMMA THEOLOGICA by St. Thomas Aquinas, the greatest Christian philosopher. Who lived five centuries before President Jefferson. He was in the habit of stating the three strongest possible arguments against any point he wished to prove, first, so that his conclusions should be the stronger.)

Hope the Afghan fanatics will not make Mr.Abdul Rahman really unsound of mind,as they are publicly broadcasting,just to save their faces.
Mr.Abdual Rahman is ready to sacrifice his life for the cause of his new faith. Yes, really,it is a shame for us, the Western Chjristians,who take our faith so lightly,joking,comenting against,and neglegting without going to church,and not passing it on to our children.That is the reason for so much trouble with our younger generations-Drugs,sex,killings,etc.
Let us import Rahman to show us the "real Christianity

In secret?? NO!!!

chimp posted: Not the number 19 - that's astonishing!!! And who can argue with modern science (whatever that means). I get it now - you're nuts!!

19 IS NOT THE ANSWER. EVERYONE KNOWS THAT THE ANSWER IS 41.( See Hitchhikers Guide to the galaxy)

Champ

SORRY FOR GETTING YOUR NAME WRONG. Deeply apolegetic.