More from tolerant, enlightened Malaysia from AP, with thanks to Jeffrey Imm:
KUALA LUMPUR, Malaysia - Malaysia’s highest court has agreed to decide whether the country’s Islamic court has the exclusive right to deal with Muslims who renounce their faith, a lawyer said on Friday.The Federal Court ruling, expected in months, will be a rare step into the highly sensitive area of conversions - and will likely have profound implications on cases about apostasy and religious freedom in this Muslim-majority country.
The Federal Court’s announcement on Thursday stems from the case of Lina Joy, who converted from Islam to Christianity in 1998. She applied to the National Registration Department to change her Muslim name, Azlina Jailani, on her government identity card the same year.
The NRD changed her name but refused to delete “Islam” from the card’s religion entry, saying it needed permission from a Shariah court, which handles Islamic issues.
“This case should be viewed in the larger context of Islamization and the erosion of constitutional rights,” said Joy’s lawyer, Benjamin Dawson.
INSERT ARTICLE FROM JIHAD-WATCH HERE ABOUT MALAYSIAN PM........COMPUTING...........ERROR....ERROR....ILLOGICAL FORMAT....SHUTTING DOWN....IT IS NOW SAFE TO TURN OFF THE DHIMMITUDE, THANK YOU FOR CHOOSING JIHADWATCH XP.
Scam alert, a big show to prove apostasy is illegal and they all apostates will face allahs wrath with the blessings of the country’s islamic court which apparently is more powerful than the criminal courts.
Wake up world!! If there needs to be a community meeting on an individual's decision, there is a problem!!!! And if that individual faces death based on his religion, it is a cult!
Stop and think!! islam is a Religion of Death!
Here I am trying to get into Islam as Ahmadis...and other short sighted poeoples want to get out ....I mean how stupid is tha
In a society where law is enforced, once the law declaring the illegality of apostasy is ratified, how far away is the enforcement of virtue as defined by Islamic precept?
Just like Saudi Arabia then, one could be arrested for missing three Jumuah (Friday) prayers, since that automatically makes one an apostate in the eyes of the takfir-branding brigade. For that matter, being infrequent in one's mosque visits would bring on similar treatment.
However these Muslims can CERTAINLY LEAVE MALAYSIA WITHOUT SHARIA'T APPROVAL! I suggest they pack up and do that.
Islam cannot and will not change. The world needs to get over it. And get away from it. And so must Malaysian apostates--if they value their lives.
While I certainly wouldnt blame anyone for leaving a country where religion is forced on them like that, I would prefer if they stayed and fought for their rights. Would be even better if our governments did something to support that fight, but thats unlikely.
Everytime non-muslims deal with muslim oppression by leaving the country, they are just helping the zealots get an even tighter grip and another base they can use to spread islam further. And one day there wont be anywhere left to run.
However these Muslims can CERTAINLY LEAVE MALAYSIA WITHOUT SHARIA'T APPROVAL! I suggest they pack up and do that.
That is not necessarily true nor possible today. You do have sovereign nations, so they may have to illegally leave Malaysia. Their passports do expire after ten years, you know, so they become illegals too. Their ICs (ID cards) are stamped with their religion.
Leaving isn't the solution.
Muslims and their apologists often use Malaysia as an example of tolerance and enlightened governance in the Muslim world. Let us see how the high court rules.
Cornelius posted: Muslims and their apologists often use Malaysia as an example of tolerance and enlightened governance in the Muslim world.
I wonder how they can justify that Malaysia is a tolerant state, given that the issue of Apostasy is being considered at this time.
Malaysia is moderate in comparsion with other rabid muslim nations, and thats not saying much.
Dear DP111,
It isn't saying anything. You should see what they do to gay people there or even people that they just allege are gay. It's stomach churning.
Malaysia's just another c--p moslem state that thinks that it can abuse whoever it wants. The plight of Christians there has to be seen to be believed. They bulldoze the churches and torture the priests and rape Christian women and sodomise the men. I know that I am gay but that last one still gets to me. What you do for your partner should be with love not as an act of rape but I don't mean to say that raping women is nothing either. Malaysia is barely or even civilised and although it is a very beautiful country we musn't be blinded to the rabidly moslem government that exists there.
We spent six months there in the Cameron Highlands when I was about fourteen and my dad was working in Singapore and we all hated it by the end. They are not civilised people.
Dominic.
"Malaysia's just another c--p moslem state that thinks that it can abuse whoever it wants. The plight of Christians there has to be seen to be believed. They bulldoze the churches and torture the priests and rape Christian women and sodomise the men"
What a joke..
Hate Hate Hate... No jews to persecute, now turns to muslim..
Dominic
I really did not know about the plight of Christians in Malaysia. I knew they were discriminated but that discrimination was light compared to what is happening in Sudan, Indonesia and the likes.
If you know of this, then how come it has not been publicised. Could you provide links to these. It is necessary.
Hate is a disease posted : Hate Hate Hate... No jews to persecute, now turns to muslim..
I agree. However hating those who hate is not a disease but a cure -so long as it is done with compassion and with the wellbeing of the patient in mind.
As a Malaysian, I would not say that Christians in Malaysia are being discriminated against, i.e. they are not given opportunities in jobs etc. However, issues such as religious conversions is still a hot potato. However, just yesterday during Good Friday services, some churches reenacted the crucifixion and Jesus' last hours. They were not stopped at all; they even received headline press coverage!
There are some Malaysian Muslims who are finally beginning to notice, and to resent, the Arab supremacist ideology for which Islam is a vehicle. There have been a few -- not many, but a few -- articles by those described as "Malaysian intellectuals" decrying the need for Muslims in Malaysia to take on Arab names, to learn Arabic, to assume false Arab lineages, to model themselves on some seventh-century denizens of the Hijaz, to take Muhammad's customs and manners as the example of what the Perfect Man does -- and therefore 21st century Malaysians, should do.
If enough attention is given to this theme, it may help at least some Malaysian Muslims unlock the mind-forged manacles of the belief-system taht was brought to them by Hadrami traders, and imposed, little by little, until many in Malaya and in the East Indies, found their minds captured by this curious blend of pagan Arab lore, and misremembered or misunderstood or distorted bits and pieces of Judaism and Christianity, together with the story of military campaigns and victories, designed to both justify, and promote, Arab victories over local Jews and Christians, in Mesopotamia and Syria, Judea and Egypt, who were far more advanced, wealthy, and settled than the Arabs who began to conquer them, and for whom this strange cultish faith, itself treating converts not as individuals but rather as recruits for the Army of Islam who were not allowed to leave that army, took them very far -- not morally, not intellectually, not in any of the ways that should count, but only as conquerors of others who possessed a superior civilization, but a less aggressive and militaristic way of life.
Native Malays are also resentful when they are targeted by police raids when enjoying a drink in a bar or club. Ethnic Hindu and Chinese Malays are free to enjoy such a lifestyle, as are visiting Westerners of course. But native Malays have to endure these indignities because of their Muslim heritage.
There is a similar phenomenon among women in schools and businesses. Hindu and Chinese women mix freely with men. Not so for Muslim women, who are compelled to segregate themselves from men and to wear headscarves.
This kind of discrimination creates resentment among Malays...and this resentment against the prerogatives of infidels is one of the factors unraveling the fragile societal consensus that has governed Malaysia since the end of the Civil War in the mid-60s, when the native Malay ascendency began.
Look for the inevitable growing schism between Muslim and non-Muslim in Malaysia, the eventual emigration of ethnic Chinese and Hindus (in many respects the most productive strata of society), and the faltering of Malaysia's 'economic miracle.'
Now, reading this latest fine breaking news posting from JW/DW, this poor hog farmer is left to wonder:
1) Will the esteemed Tim Russert jiggle his jowls on tomorrow morning's show that maybe this Islam thing could be a threat to freedom?
2) Will the sub-worthless fake Dr. Bill Fritz mist up and admit to George Stephanopolous that he doesn't have a clue?
3) And, can an alarmed George Stephanopolous signal the crew in time to cut to commercial to stop the tiresome Frist's refreshing burst of honesty from being aired on national TV?
4) Will Michael Savage crawl out from under the safety of his San Francisco bed and launch an expedition, a caravan into Araby, as it were, to run down the descendants of those 16th century tiny minority great reigion highjackers?
MO PRINCETON MO HARVARD MO YALE MO BERKELEY MO ENTROPY MO ISLAM MO
No, they can't.
George Will will accost George Steph after the show about stupidly letting the refreshing honesty burst thing happen.
The two Georges will in turn accost Senator Frist and demand that he issue an abject retraction forthwith.
Tim will burst into the studio and jiggle like a tired stripper, with nobody noticing as he undulates in the corner.
After video of that lurid scene is put on the Internet, Tim will tearfully retract his Islam doubt and resign NBC News.
The next day, on drive time Monday, Michael Savage will proclaim personal victory from San Francisco, and announce a profitable new book.
And Islam will have moved the pigskin another 10 yards downfield.
In his Barcalounger back at home, Hoop will click off his 50" Pioneer plasma, and smile to himself. "Another hard day's Dawa very well done, Ibrahim. You are so awesome."
Somebody's gotta win.
Something is not right with Malaysia. Or better : Malaisia, as in male, as in sick.... Sick as the former prime-minister Mahatir Mohammed and his racist rants against Jews, white people, anything outside of the realm of the Bhumiputra...
I felt that, the first time after the so-called 'riots' (Jihad) in 1968, when 20.000 Indians and Chinese were killed in Kuala Lumpur alone. Hate and fear was thick in the air and you could cut it with a knife.
The only place in the far East where I had that constant feeling of insecurity, of hatred and resentment. You could also feel it in Indonesia, but only in a few areas.
Generally, nobody wore hijab in Java in the seventies, people were friendly and open, everywhere we went. The hatred came with the oil, with the money from the Saudis, the young Indo's who went to 'study' Islam and came back to build mosques and to preach hatred.
Malaysia's court will decide against leaving Islam. They will rule according to the sharia. The writing has been on the wall for a long time...
All non-Muslims would be well-advised that Malaysia is no longer a nation-state. It is an islamic timebomb. They should unceremoniously vacate the place ASAP. They do NOT need shariat approvial for that. And we'll see if shariat can stop them from leaving(unlikely).