John VI Cantacuzenes Alert from ANTARA News, with thanks to DFS:
Moscow (ANTARA News) - Russia, formerly part of the dissolved superpower Soviet Union, has drawn international attention by hosting a dialog on "Strategic Vision, Russia - The Islamic World" here on March 27-28, 2006.Present in the dialog were 17 Islamic leaders from Muslims populated countries and a representative of Rabithah Al Islami. The meeting was organized by a Russian NGO, but in fact the organizer was a former government official in this state.
The meeting presided over by Evgeny Maksimovich Primakov, former Russian Prime Minister during Boris Yeltsin leadership. At the opening of the meeting, Primakov read out a written message of Russian President Vladimir Putin.
The Russian Head of Government revealed in his message that the Russian foreign policy gives priority to the dialog with the Islamic world. He explained that Russia has a long history of the Islamic world, relating to the aspects of economy, security, science/technology and culture.
Can someone please explain to me just why russia sees this need to pander to islam? Are their oil reserves so low? Is it a function of Russia's loss of superpower self esteem? Or does Putin have some Kafkaesque deep plot in mind?(turns 'em into cockroaches and sprays them)
Two of the dynamics:
Russia has a population of only 140 million and it's in decline
Russia is taking on the role of an energy superpower and wants to align itself with Muslim oil/gas exporting countries. Keep your eyes on the Russia/Iran/Venezuela/China axis of evil energy alliance
Well, not China. China is a net consumer of energy and, whatever its political relationship with Russia, its commercial interests are as much against Russia's as the buyer's are eternally against the seller's. In fact, I do wonder whether this move towards an Islamic/Oil alliance is not aimed, not only at the West, but at the rising power of China, too.
Russians fear China. A joke going around the Soviet Union in the seventies went something like this:
"After years of effort, the Soviet electronic specialists finally build a computer that can see in the future. They program it to give an account of the political situation in 2010. The answer comes:
'Everything quiet on the border between Finland and China'."
Ah yes... the "COLD WAR" is over and Russia has been defeated(????), but wait what is this alliance they propose?
Me thinks they might be bitter of the fact they were defeated and that they await patiently for an opportunity to exact some sort of revenge.
Did they not occupy Afghanistan for a time? Now they wish to form an alliance with Islam so as to wreak HAVOC on America.
Yes the "Cold War" is over now it is on to bigger and better things.
Of course China is a net consumer of oil/gas. It is very very friendly with Iran and Venezuela and gets long just fine with Vlad Putin. China signed a 100 million dollar oil exploration contact with Iran two weeks ago. China has Iranian oil under long term low price contacts. Now what would Iran want to buy from China?
Russia (some say Spetznaz) and China are training the Venezuela military. China buys Venezuelan oil and will buy lots more once it has refining capacity for heavy crude.
The COLD WAR was never over and the Russians
are using Islam as a tool in their quest for
world domination.
Arafat was a pawn of Russia and Russians helped
Saddam move WMD to Syria.
Yes, Russia needs to be placed in the "axis of evil" group.
If Russia has really moved to democratic reform,
why would their leader be KGB and where are
the mass arrests for corruption, etc.
Russia can't beat us the tradtitional way and are
now trying a different approach.
A coalition between Russia and Islamic nations will happen because it was foretold by the prophet Ezekiel (Ezek 38-39). They will all join together against Israel, and it will be the beginning of the first atomic world war:
http://www.tip.org/tip10.htm
http://www.tip.org/tip11.htm
Two major entities who have hated The Jews enough to try and destroy them as a race of people meeting together to do...what?
The USSR may be dead but that spirit will yet rebirth itself.
Scary!
PJ
This is a tool that will turn in their hand and cause damage to the carpenter. Have they forgotten their own history? Time was no Russian was safe from slave-raiders.
What would the Russian people think of this unhol;y allegiance between their former communist leaders and the islamic nations?
Doesn't Russia have a long history of attacks by the Turks and do they not suffer from terrorism by the islam through Chechnia and other former islamic soviet states?
Oldnick
Russia's fear of China have them countering the balance with allieance with the arab states who border their country. l read/heard some where of the last great war will be Russia along with the Arabs and China to the east will try to destroy Israel. Both Russia and China want to use up Arab oil, so even we dont buy into it, it will be taken by these countries, as well as India.
Russia is a paper tiger, and needs to bolster their image and seem important. its all smoke and mirrors much like the French and Germans.
Primakov has for decades been the Arab world's man in Moscow, and Russia's man in the Middle East, especially in Iraq and Iran. His connections with, not the KGB, but Voennaya Razvedka, Military Intelligence (a higher calling than the KGB) are piquant. Is he an agent for the Russian govenmentin the Middle East? Or an agent promoting Muslim interests in successive Russian (Soviet) governments? Or some of both? For a number of reasons, alienists would have a field day.
Hmmm, makes me wonder just how much help the iranians got from certain "business partners" for their new multi-warhead missle.... This Russian-islam alliance is disquieting, but we can all rest assured that our fearless leaders saw this coming a long time ago - I have to believe that Bush2 clearly saw this when he looked so deelpy into Putins eyes.....
Boris, the genius spy who had the wisdom to fill the north of his Motherland with Moslems, is now working that same magical brain to cut a deal with Islam? This is the EAD redux, apparently Boris has been shooting hoops and hanging out with Jacques.
I can only quote that august think tank consulted so many times by this alarmed pig farmer:
SUICIDAL HOMICIDAL GENOCIDAL HERBICIDAL PESTICIDAL MO SUICIDAL THAN
Tommy played piano
Like a kid out in the rain
Then he lost his leg in Dallas
He was dancing with a train
They were all in love with dyin'
They were drinking from a fountain
That was pouring like an avalanche
Coming down the mountain
--- taken from the song Pepper by the Butthole Surfers
"Russia is a paper tiger, and needs to bolster their image and seem important."
I'm not so sure about that.
They have some awesome new weaponry...try googling "Sunburn missile"...and apparently they have supplied some awesome weaponry like the Sunburn to China, who have equipped destroyers with them.
So, if they are afraid of China, then why do they supply China with their most modern weapons and why did they sign a defense alliance in 2001.
I personally believe the whole "We lost the Cold War" thing was a scam designed to disarm the west and that they have been modernising and building their armed forces non-stop ever since.
Gorbachev's speech to the Politburo in 1987, just prior to "the collapse":
"Gentlemen, comrades, do not be concerned about all you hear about glasnost and perestroika and democracy in the coming years. These are primarily for outward consumption. There will be no significant internal change within the Soviet Union, other than for cosmetic purposes. Our purpose is to disarm the Americans and let them fall asleep."
Russia might even cover one vast underground parking lot filled with tanks and APC's for all we know...and every now and again the Russian leadership puts in a humble appearance on the world's media, making it clear to everyone just how backward and "defeated" they are, and the Americans puff up their chests and think "Damn Straight!".
Somehow though, Putin's statements lately don't sound so humble or 'defeated'.
Perhaps Russia never did drop their plans for conquering Europe and later the world.
Now wouldn't Islam make a wnderful fifth column.
Thet's why they are courting Islam IMO.
Perhaps we in the West were being set up for a long time now...perhaps since the 60's.
All those lefties holding important positions in education, media etc., pushing all those anti-western agendas...pushing multiculturalism and open borders, instilling a culture of self-loathing on a generation or two.
Gee, how 'bout that, something venomous called Islam snuck in with all those nice folks from overseas...who'd a thunk it.
Maybe McCarthy was right and there really was a red under every bed..or at least every second one.
Here is an interesting link about Muslims in Russia:
http://www.nytimes.com/packages/khtml/2005/11/26/weekinreview/20051127_ISLAM_AUDIOSS.html
Vladimir Putin has been very clever in positioning Russia to be a tremendous exporter of oil and natural gag
RUSSIA want to be an energy SUPERPOWER
Same as the Muslim energy SUPERPOWERS
Thus they have common goals, Russia is allying itself with Saddam's Iraq (that chapter is over and done) and now Iran
Forget about the natural enmity that exists between Russia and Dar al Islam. This is about the new world we are in of 65$ barrel oil. Those who have the oil (and natural gas) are in the driver's seat today. Russia has been bullying former East Bloc nations over how much they will pay for Russian natural gas. Germany wants a natural gas pipeline from Russia to be built.
We have cursed the Arab/Muslim OPEC nations for years. They are THE energy superpowers. But Russia is positioning itself to be an energy superpower and so is Venezuela. It might be a faulty report but new estimates show Venezuelan oil reserves to be much larger than previously estimated.
CHINA's strategy is to get oil supplies under long term contracts from Iran, Venezuela and other nations by forming strategic alliances with them against the United States of America. China will pay for this discount price oil with cheap consumer goods and weaponry and perhaps nuclear technology. China often has it's stooge North Korea make the shipments of missiles so it has plausible or implausible deniability. Iran's newest missile (evades radar?) might be from North Korea. Everyone knows how cash hungry the N Koreans are.
RE: I personally believe the whole "We lost the Cold War" thing was a scam designed to disarm the west and that they have been modernising and building their armed forces non-stop ever since.
BINGO !!!!!!!!!! You hit the nail on the head!!
McCarthy was right about communism, his methods made enemies of the hollwood elite left and we had this boring movie made last year.
Russia are using what technology left over to appear sronger than what they are. look when they had trapped men in a submarine, who came to save their men,,the US and Brits. even being fearful of China, they can still make treaties and alliances with both china and arabs. The Russian people need to keep pushing for reforms. The Ukrainians have started, and l not giving up on knowledge people get from the interent! It would not so bad if within our own countries politicians like Carter, Clinton, Cdn liberals/socialist would just melt away!
McCarthy was right about communism...
Indeed he was. In spades. He was right about Hollywood and the State Department and so much more. It had gotten so bad that, when Truman initially chose a running mate for his 2nd run for the White House, Hoover of the FBI had to take Harry aside and show him the documentation that his chosen running mate was a Communist and that the FBI and military would not brook an agent of Joe Stalin one heartbeat away from the Oval Office.
MO PROBLEMS MO EXCUSES MO WHINING MO MOOCHING MO DISSEMBLING MO MO
I was so disappointed to see Rep. Sensenbrenner denouce Joe this week on TV. I mean, I can understand how an ahistorical puff-ball like George Clooney could produce a paean to one of the great buffoons in postwar history, Edward R. Murrow, but "save our borders" Sensenbrenner? Puleeze.
"...the Russians are using Islam as a tool in their quest for
world domination..."
Come off it, guys. They have other problems...
Yes, Russia has long experience with Islam. Russia emerged in the 12th and 13th centuries after a series of wars with the Mongols (Muslim) when Russia refused to pay any more tribute. Russia conquered central Asian Muslim countries in the 18th and 19th centuries. The USSR occupied the northern half of Iran during WW2 as Shah Reza was considered a Nazi sympathizer.
Presently, what is emerging is an axis of evil from Moscow to Tehran to Peking. North Korea is but a pawn which Peking moves against other East Asian countries and the US. Pawns to be acquired are Venezuela and Cuba. Who knows if France and Europe will soon be in play.
chsw
Magog Invasion......
Looks like Ezekiel 38 and 39 is just one step closer............................
Please read:
Russians Sense the Heat of Cold War
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/04/02/AR2006040200749.html
Ukraine and the Second Cold War
http://en.for-ua.com/analytics/2006/03/30/175653.html
I do understand Russias need to build an alliance since the west and the US have kept the Cold war going by supporting Chechnya. But come on Putin this is starting to get sickening.
I have read some good news about Russia's demographic problem today on the BBC (not really a good source) Apparently Russi is in a middle of a baby boom. So if they get that problem fixed hopefully they can keep the muslim influence in their country to a minimum.
I came across an interesting article the other day. Since we are on the topic of oil. Everyone knows that the biggest oil reserve in teh world now is in Canada since they decided to count oil sands. It will still take years for them to get up to Saudi production levels. But what is interesting is that the biggest oil reserve in the world is in the US. the problem is it isnt economical yet. The colorodo oil shales have enough oil to supply America at current levels for something like 120 years. If oil ever goes above $100 and it stays there. It will be good news for America. America will become a net oil exporter. Right now as oil prices go up the net flow of cash out of America increases. But once we permanently hit the $100+ levles oil companies will go back to Colorado. Exxon I believe pulled out in 1982. I believe this muslim threat to our economy is short lived but I pray they dont take over before the tide turns.
Russia was the force which destroyed the Turkish Empire, it made a deal, which the British took issue with and in an agreement(San Stefano March 3 1878), Bosnia and Herzogovena where given to Austria, and Russia got Bulgaria, and Montenegro, this was reversed in July 1878 when, in Berlin, the Congress of Berlin, with Britain under Disraili vigourously demanded that Bulgaria should not be in Russia's hands.
The Ottoman Empire was divided again, Russia got the Caucasus, Austria got Bosnia and herzegovina, and Britain's right to occupy Cyprus was confirmed.
Bulgaria became an autonomous principality that included Roumelia, made up of Macedonia and Albania which were nominally Ottoman, but it's governor was a Christian
Turkey then (later) became friends with Germany, which was it's ally against Russia.
http://www.hyeetch.nareg.com.au/genocide/story10_p1.html
"Looks like Ezekiel 38 and 39 is just one step closer............................"
Nope, well yes you are right in that it will be one step closer but it is nowhere near imminent...
Ezekiel 38, 39 is still at least a thousand years distant IMO.
Ezekiel 38, 39 pretty clearly refers to the same thing as mentioned in Revelations 20:8
And that happens after the thousand years of peace following the next kerfuffle.
I hope they're making some goddamned LONG spoons in Russia.
Such short-term gains often mean long-term pain.
Why the Russians aren't working closer with the U.S. (and vice versa) will be to the ultimate disadvantage of both.
Muslim powerbrokers seem to be fomenting the schism between these two essentially Christian countries for Islam's ultimate interest in destroying both.
The Russian mafia and cowed oligarchy see only money/whores/cars/guns/drugs, not the future, and they are a force within the former Soviet Union as powerful as the Cosa Nostra once was in Sicily.
I'm for speeding up the effort to terraform Mars, since the leadership (political/business/religious) on this planet apppear to be doing their best to (sur)render it into a theocratic Islamic hellhole, if not turn it into a literal, lifeless second moon by allowing the spread of all forms of WMD's beneath the [politically noticed] surface.
It's always good to have an escape clause.
Plus, the length of the Martian day is nearly identical to Earth's so we wouldn't have to recalibrate our internal diurnal rhythms... although the "year" is a bit longer... 668 to 669 days... so few of us would live beyond about 50 Martian years.
For some foresight, check out:
http://www.12x30.net/martian.html
Thinking outside the Muslim box is always restorative.
I don't condone Russia's sucking up to the Arabs/Islam, and whenever I read the name Yevgeni Primakov, I don't get a good feeling about it either. However, those who credit that to Communists are mistaken: while the Communists won a working majority while Yeltsin was in power, they were totally a rubber stamp once Putin came in, as they dreaded him. End result - the subsequet Duma elections that happened has resulted in their numbers being heavily reduced. What is at work now is Russian imperialism, and nowhere does one see a greater evidence of that than the tacit alliance between Putin and Zhirnovsky.
Having said all that, there is one aspect of it where I see the Russian point of view. The West (EU and US) have not been supportive of Russia in the Chechen war. In the case of Western Europe, while they opposed any military action against Iraq, they heartily embraced it in the case of Serbia. In Ukraine last year, and Belarus now, the EU is showing its diplomatic muscles in a way it hasn't in Iran, Iraq, Syria and Lebanon.
Given the above, coupled with the fact that the EU itself has been grovelling before Muslims, it is possible that Russia doesn't count on either EU or the US to wage a serious war on Islam. If that is the case, and Russia knows that it risks being isolated against both the West and Islam, it might as well pick an ally. While one can agree that such a move is inane from Russia's stanpoint, since it jeopardizes Russian minorities in the Turanian republics, as long as the West panders to Islam on its own, it has no business expecting better behavior from Russia, China, Israel, India, Thailand or any other country.
Mike_W : Some people put it before the trib, others after trib; and others again after the millennium rule.
But it is interesting (but scary) watching it all fall into place!
It is a strange modern theological/historical error that wrogly identifies Gog and Magog as Russia. Their identity were ancient peoples living around the Caucasus and north of Persia as well as other ancient enemies of the Jews such as the Hittites. Their closest modern descendents would be the Tokharian/Turanian peoples i.e. the Turks.
The first appearance of Magog is in Genesis where Magog is listed as a son a Japheth and an uncle of Togarmah (from where the Tohkarian name comes from). His nephew was Ashkenaz.
Genesis 10:2. "The sons of Japheth were Gomer, Magog, Madai, Javan, Tubal, Meshech, and Tiras
3. The sons of Gomer were Ashkenaz, Riphath, and Togarmah."
Today many Muslim writers commenting on the Hadiths about Gog and Magog (Juj and Majuj) invading from the north try to make them the Ashkenazi Jews invading Israel in 1948 and falsely claim that all these Jews are non-Semitic Khazars. Just as this prophetic fantasy among Muslims is absurd, we Christians would do well to avoid similar eschatological speculation.
Russia has long been an active handmaiden to Islamic terrorism.
Time to dust off and read Claire Holt's 'NETWORK OF TERROR' which documents Russia's links to Islamic terrorism against the western world. A very important work.
Erratum: That should have read "The Terror Network: the Secret War of International Terrorism" by Claire Sterling which was copyrighted in 1981. A valuable documentation of the history of Russia's relationship with Islamic terrorism and its implications for the western democracies. There was never a reason to trust the Russians and there is even LESS reason to do so now that THIS has transpired.
No less than Ousamah bin Laden remarked publicly that "the interests of the Islamists and the socialists meet in the war against the crusaders." Very telling.
Russia is now and always has been a thug nation. Now it is a thug nation led by a man raised in the KGB culture and supported by the Russian mafia. We can never trust them or wish them well.
Mike_W : Some people put it before the trib, others after trib; and others again after the millennium rule.
But it is interesting (but scary) watching it all fall into place!
If we were to date the Bible to the tribulation times, one real good verse identifies the times for us.
Un Forces 1992 and its MISSILES
Jeremiah 50:8-10
8. "Flee from the midst of Babylon, anf go out fromthr land of the Chaldeans, and be as he-goats before the flock.
9. For behold, I am stirring up and bringing against Babylon a company of great nations, from the north country; and they shall array themselves against her; from there she shall be taken. Their arrows are like a skilled warrior who does not return empty - handed .
Chaldea shall be plundered ; all who plunder her shall be sated.
I am searching diligently for any references to a man of straw and an African Princess who take news to the leaders of the factions who survive this onslaught, that they have to gather up the people and unify them, or risk having their neighbours come into their territory and make the situation worse, when the great nations, from the north country leave.
Mike_W : Some people put it before the trib, others after trib; and others again after the millennium rule.
But it is interesting (but scary) watching it all fall into place!
If we were to date the Bible to the tribulation times, one real good verse identifies the times for us.
Un Forces 1992 and its MISSILES
Jeremiah 50:8-10
8. "Flee from the midst of Babylon, and go out from the land of the Chaldeans, and be as he-goats before the flock.
9. For behold, I am stirring up and bringing against Babylon a company of great nations, from the north country; and they shall array themselves against her; from there she shall be taken. Their arrows are like a skilled warrior who does not return empty - handed .
Chaldea shall be plundered ; all who plunder her shall be sated.
I am searching diligently for any references to a man of straw and an African Princess who take news to the leaders of the factions who survive this onslaught, that they have to gather up the people and unify them, or risk having their neighbours come into their territory and make the situation worse, when the great nations, from the north country leave.