"Imam: Canada Suspects Didn't Seek Violence," from AP, with thanks to the Constantinopolitan Irredentist:
Several members of a suspected terrorist ring prayed daily at a storefront mosque in a middle-class city west of Toronto but never spoke of hurting others, one of their prayer leaders said."I will say that they were steadfast, religious people. There's no doubt about it. But here we always preach peace and moderation," Qamrul Khanson, an imam at the one-room Al-Rahman Islamic Center for Islamic Education, said Sunday.
Here comes a Claude Rains Shocked! Shocked! Alert:
The 40-50 Muslim families who worship at the mosque were astonished, he said, to learn that police had arrested 12 adults, ages 19 to 43, and five suspects younger than 18 on Friday and Saturday, charging them with plotting an attack in southern Ontario. Two Americans who met with the suspects also are in custody.The group had acquired three tons of ammonium nitrate _ three times the amount used in the 1995 Oklahoma City bombing, said assistant Royal Canadian Mounted Police commissioner Mike McDonell. The bombing of the Murrah Federal Building on April 19, 1995, killed 168 people and injured more than 800.
The fertilizer can be mixed with fuel oil or other ingredients to make a bomb....
The 17 suspects represent a spectrum of Canadian society, from the unemployed to a school bus driver to the college-educated. The 12 adults live in Toronto, Mississauga and Kingston, Ontario....
A spectrum this time, not broad strata. But still no mention of the salient point -- that they were all Muslims. Why does that matter? Because it is likely that they were inspired by the jihad ideology.
"For various reasons, they appeared to have become adherents of a violent ideology inspired by al-Qaida," Luc Portelance, the assistant director of operations with CSIS _ Canada's spy agency, said Saturday.The oldest suspect, Qayyum Abdul Jamal, often led prayers at the storefront mosque.
Khanson said Jamal's Friday night prayers were "more aggressive" than those of other prayer leaders, but there was no talk of hostility or terrorism....
Aggressive prayers? The prayers don't vary, so apparently Jamal also gave the Friday sermon.
FBI Special Agent Richard Kolko said in Washington there may have been a connection between the Canadian suspects and a Georgia Tech student and another American who had traveled to Canada to meet with Islamic extremists to discuss locations for a terrorist strike.Syed Haris Ahmed and Ehsanul Islam Sadequee, U.S. citizens who grew up in the Atlanta area, were arrested in March....
Khanson said at least three suspects regularly prayed at the Al-Rahman Islamic Center for Islamic Education.
"I have faith that they have done a thorough investigation," Khanson said of authorities. "But just the possession of ammonium nitrate doesn't prove that they have done anything wrong.
Yes, maybe they just needed it to spread more soothing Islam-Is-A-Religion-Of-Peace talk.
"We value our Canadian culture and we would never allow any links with the so-called Taliban or al-Qaida."...
That's not the same thing as saying we would never allow agitation for jihad and Sharia supremacism.
Muslim leaders were concerned that the highly publicized arrests would cause a backlash against their community. A mosque in northwest Toronto was vandalized overnight, with 25 windows and three doors smashed, police said.Mohamed Elmasry, president of the Canadian Islamic Congress, told the AP that he and other Muslim leaders were getting threatening e-mails.
"We hope Canadians will be more rational and consider the facts," Elmasry said.
I hope so too. Vigilante violence and threats arise, of course, out of frustration -- a sense that authorities aren't doing what they should be doing, and cannot be counted on to meet a threat. Elmasry and all Canadian Muslims could help dispel these frustrations by renouncing Sharia and all jihad violence, and working with Canadian authorities to root jihadist sentiments out of the Canadian Muslim community.
"But just the possession of ammonium nitrate doesn't prove that they have done anything wrong."
Of course not! How silly of us to think such horrid things of people who practice "the religion of peace" I bet after all is said and done, we'll discover that they intended on growing a bumper crop of hilal vegetables with THREE TONS of fertilizer.
Their intent was clear. As for them being peace loving individuals it's always the first response when their caught. As an American if I threatened them or their religion my fanny would be arrested immediately. And I'd bet I couldn't get the aclu to defend me.
Ammonium nitrate is a Fertilizer of Peace. Let's just get that straight.
Mixed with the Fuel Oil of Moderation, there may be a Tiny Minority of Explosions.
Islam is the Koran.....We can talk all day...but...how can a Muslim worship without the Koran?....Learn....Read.....Watch....Pound.
TORONTO (AP) - Police said Monday more arrests are likely in an alleged plot to bomb buildings in Canada, while intelligence officers sought ties between the 17 suspects and Islamic terror cells in the United States and five other nations.
A court said authorities had charged all 12 adults arrested over the weekend with participating in a terrorist group. Other charges included importing weapons and planning a bombing. The charges against five minors were not made public.
The Parliament of Canada, in Ottawa, is believed to be among targets the group discussed. Toronto Mayor David Miller said CN Tower, a downtown landmark, and the city's subway were not targets as had been the speculated in local media, but declined to identify sites that were.
A Muslim prayer leader who knew the oldest suspect, 43-year-old Qayyum Abdul Jamal, told The Associated Press on Monday that Jamal's sermons at a storefront mosque were
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20060605/D8I2B1TO0.html
Not to condone vigilante violence (although I'm no longer completely sure why not), but one good thing to come out of it would be to give Muslims in their home countries the impressions that Westerners really are bigoted against Muslims, despite protestations to the contrary. If this serves to dissuade many of them from coming over, then this violence, justified or not, would have served a greater purpose.
We keep hearing about the "al-Qaeda" ideology, or the "jihad" ideology, "terrorist" ideology, or the "extremist" ideology. Let's clear this up right now, shall we:
Islam is the ideology.
Jihad is a doctrine of that ideology. Al-Qaeda is a network of people, Muslims, who practice the doctrine of jihad. "Extremists" and "terrorists" we would be led to believe by Islamic propagandists, are folks like the al-Qaeda. That may be true, but the real question, the one that matters most, is whether the doctrine of jihad is "extreme" or is it orthodox, mainstream, defined unambiguously by immutable Islamic canon as obligatory to all true Muslims? Can the doctrine of jihad be renounced and separated from the ideology of Islam? Who has the authority to do that?
The ideology of Islam and most of its doctrines, such as the twin doctrines of jihad conquest and dhimmitude subjugation, is incompatible with all other ideologies on the planet. There is more than a thousand years of proof of this assertion.
Infidel Pride our weapon is Truth....Just keep speaking Truth....Asleep sheep...are dead sheep...wake people up...shake them...pound the truth....show them the lie of Islam.
Can a Muslim renounce Sharia and all jihad violence and remain a Muslim? If so how? What is the historical precedent for Islam shorn of Sharia and all jihad violence?
Hulegu Khan address these questions above. Are there any Muslims who are even trying to answer these questions?
I'm shocked, SHOCKED, to learn that peace loving, Muslims would even think about planning violent attacks in Canada!
Didn't Canada's condemnation and refusal to participate in the war in Iraq garner any favor amongst the Muslim population?
Didn't Canada's acceptance of the Muslim culture with defacto Sharia courts in Ontario, and the allowance of constructing hundreds of mosques (when it's forbidden to build churches in the Islamic world) gain any Muslim favor?
The next time Canada has the option to participate or not, in an attack on a Muslim country (read Iran), they might as well join in, as it's futile for infidels to earn good graces from the Muslim world.
Infidel Pride posted:
That thought has crossed my mind as well.
I have to say though that the atmosphere is getting decidedly ugly. If a bomb actually goes off, then all the police chief Blairs in the world (one in Toronto and one in London), will not be able to put Humpty Dumpty together again.
from Shinoliite: "Ammonium nitrate is the Fertilizer of Peace."
LOL!
Question: How shall we respond to a disbeliever if he greets us?
Answer: It is confirmed that the Messenger of Allah (peace be upon him) said. ."Do not be the first to greet a Jew or Christian with peace. And if you come across them in the walkway, force them to the edges." Muslim recorded this in his Sahih. He (peace be upon him) also said, .'If the People of the Book greet you with peace.
say, 'Wa alaikum (and unto you).'" This was recorded by al-Bukhari and Muslim. The People of the Book are the Jews and Christians. The ruling concerning the other disbelievers is the same as the ruling of the Jews and Christians in this matter since there is no evidence to show otherwise. In general, one does not first greet a disbeliever. However, if he starts the greeting, then one must respond by our statement, "And upon you", in accord with the order from the Messenger (peace be upon him). There is no prohibition to say after that, something like, "How are you? How are your children?" Some of the scholars, including ibn Taimiya, has said that this is permissible. This is especially acceptable if there is some Islamically sanctioned reason for that, such as hoping the person will become Muslim or making him susceptible to your calling him to Islam. Allah has stated, "Invite to the way of your Lord with wisdom (of the Quran) and fair preaching, and argue with them in a way that is better" (al-Nahl 16: 125). Allah has also said, ."And argue not with the People of the Scriptures (Jews and Christians) unless it be in a way that is better, except with such of them as do wrong" (al-Ankabut 29:46).'
http://www.faithfreedom.org/Announcement/MuslimGuidelines.htm
Heluga Khan:
Right on the money. Here is a more recent assesment of the situation from Comcast News:
Canadian police say there is no evidence the suspect group had ties to al-Qaida, but describe its members as being sympathetic to jihadist ideology. Officials are concerned that many of the 17 suspects were roughly 20 years old and had been radicalized in a short amount of time.
The article also goes on the show the Nazi like brainwashing techniques of these muslim so called leaders:
Some people who know the suspects said they were astonished by the arrests.
But Faheem Bukhari, a director of the Mississauga Muslim Community Center, said Jamal, the oldest suspect, had taken to giving hateful sermons and preaching intolerance to young Muslims at a small storefront mosque in Mississauga, a city near Toronto where six of the suspects lived.
"These youth were very fun-loving guys, soccer-loving guys, and then all of sudden they were not associating with guys they used to," Bukhari told AP, referring to some of the younger suspects.
Where is this ideology coming from? Khan hits it on the head.
Answer: It is confirmed that the Messenger of Allah (peace be upon him) said. ."Do not be the first to greet a Jew or Christian with peace. And if you come across them in the walkway, force them to the edges."......( this is pride..don't speak first...force them out of the way...why can't people understand...human pride is not from GOD.....thats not what the other book....the one ignored today....teachs.
Robert...you gotta see this!!!!!!http://www.littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/
It's too bad that the authorities always foil these plots. Because as long as they do that, the public will never understand the gravity of the situation. They will never understand what is out there.
Outrageous acts of violence and murder are the only thing capable of bringing around the slumbering masses to realize the threat of islam. As long as those acts are continually foiled, the public will remain passified. And as long as that public remains passified, the slow jihad, the long term jihad, the jihad to slowly turn our society into an islamic society, will continue like well-oiled clockwork.
The police might as well be working for the ummah for all the good they are doing for our society.
The front page story of both Toronto papers was of an imam looking, wistfully, out of his vandalized mosque window. In other words, appealing for sympathy for the very group of people that were caught red handed trying to murder thousands of Canadians.
Why do people use (peace be upon him). after mo's name?I know other mo's do that,but why do we?
Islam is peace. The kind of peace that comes from everything in 100 yard radius being dead.
Of course. Islam is the religion of fertilizer. They already believe so much male bovine fecal matter, what's another three tons?
Hulegu-Khan:
"We keep hearing about the "al-Qaeda" ideology"
Isn't it interesting that al-Queda has become the beating horse/scapegoat for those invested in disassociating Islam from murderous violence?
The would-be murderers were radicalized through association with a person who led prayers at the Al Rahman Islamic Centre.
"Al Rahman" is the name of a number of important figures in Islamic history. It is also, of course, part of the "bism'allah", meaning "the merciful [one?]".
With mercy like that, who needs vengeance?
As I think I have seen here before,
"War is peace"
Alas.
I will say that they were steadfast, religious people. There's no doubt about it.
I have NO doubt whatsoever that this is true.
But here we always preach peace and moderation...
Yes. Exactly.
The 40-50 Muslim families who worship at the mosque were astonished, he said, to learn that police had arrested 12 s, ages 19 to 43, and five suspects younger than 18 on Friday and Saturday, charging them with plotting an attack in southern Ontario.
I'm sure; they thought that none would dare arrest them!
How dare they! How dare they! In any case -- not to worry; all 17 will be released soon enough once the Saudi funded attorneys spring into action.
" peace be upon him." We don't, Storagemanager does. I will not be coarse and repeat what I wish upon him.
" peace be upon him." We don't, Storagemanager does. I will not be coarse and repeat what I wish upon him.
Posted by: pismopal
o.k thanx,guess he is one of the "others" then...
I think that storagemanager was simply quoting from a Muslim source, and of course that source would use the "pbuh". Of course, infidels are free to shorten the long "e" in "peace" to a short "i".
I doubt that Andres Serrano has the guts to turn that into a work of "art".
Now THAT would lead to some interesting demonstrations.
patriot
I don't know what one of the "others" would be. I simply answered a question with a fact,nothing more. Storagemanager, if he feels the need, will explain himself in one of his posts..and soon enough I'm confident.
Just meant a muslim,or somethin.Like Dhimmisoftheworldunite said.He just might have quoting from a Muslim source,and just didnt edit out the "pbuh" part.Was just wonderin why that would be in there.
If I understand patriot14's question, he is asking why Muslims use the 'pbuh'. I think that it is simply a mark of respect. If you listen to Muslims speak to each other, they commonly use a greeting which I will attempt to transliterate 'A salaam a leikum', which means "peace be unto you." So 'pbuh' is simply this benediction applied in the 3rd person to someone who is mentioned rather than addressed. This is standard practice when mentioning Mohammed, or others who are reckoned by Muslims to have been prophets.
An side note which is partly amusing because so gratuitous but also sobering because of the ill will it reflects is that when greeting an infidel, a Muslim is likely to not say "peace be to you" but "peace be to the rightly guided" (ie, "to me, not to you.") Qur'anically faithful Muslims have only war and subjugation (or death) for non-Muslims.
I will let Patriots question stand on it's own unless he wants to expand. The question had a point that I don't think I missed.
Finally the mos are starting their first agrarian economy in their history. They sure went about it enthusiastically enough. THREE TONNES. It must be a big field the mos are beginning their farming.
All the mos fault is that they forgot to buy the seeds first. And the field, too.
"I have faith that they have done a thorough investigation," Khanson said of authorities. "But just the possession of ammonium nitrate doesn't prove that they have done anything wrong.
The possession of a small amount, say to fertilize a lawn (assuming you own one), is one thing. Three tons of the stuff is something rather different, isn't it?
If our governments don't make these verminous scum leave, then sadly it will up to the citizenry -- no matter what kind of nasty label they want to attach to it. I personally don't care a bit what I'm labelled if I'm forced to act to protect hearth and home. Even in the near complete absence of "backlash", the Muslims and their craven protectors in the Media and Government lie and call our increasing unease "vigilantism", "racism", "intolerance", and "Islamophobia". Where I'm from it's called "common sense" and "self defense" and "patriotism" and "justice". They were welcomed into our domain, given every gift we could confer, yet Muslims continuously spit on us and threaten us and lie to us and plot our destruction. We're endangered in our homes, in our cities and on our planes. Our beloved homelands are not enriched by these villainous Muslim communities. They are threatened and endangered by them.
Perhaps it's high time for these Muslims to be encouraged to LEAVE our shores.