Blasphemy Suspect Flees Pakistan

If he doesn't get into Holland, he should hijack an plane, come to Britain, say he was acting under duress and he'll live the life of riley at taxpayers expense.

Actualy, I take that back. Genuine Apostates are welcome :-)

"(Muslim teachers) accused him of publishing a pamphlet showing Muhammad, the prophet of Islam, in indecent positions."

Honestly what positions would not be indecent to these animals? Muslims want to kill others over some person that lived 1500 years ago, I'll never understand it. O no! the school children didn’t say “peace be with him”; well lets go burn them alive in their own school bus.

I fear he won't find asylum in London:

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3270937,00.html

Panel: Zionists use anti-Semitism card to suppress debate

Britain’s largest Muslim TV channel, Islam channel, hosts debate titled ‘Zionism: The cancer at the heart of international affairs,’ hosted by former BBC correspondent Alan Hart

Britain’s largest Muslim TV channel, the Islam channel, last week hosted a debate on anti-Semitism and Zionism, with discussion centering on the idea that informed and honest debate on the Middle East is rendered impossible because critics are immediately accused of anti-Semitism.

The debate, “Zionism: The cancer at the heart of international affairs,” was filmed by the London-based Islamic TV station.

Alan Hart, a former ITN and BBC correspondent, chaired the debate. He said that “the anti-Semitism card is something the Zionists have exploited to suppress debate.”

Hart, author of the recently published “Zionism: The real enemy of the Jews,” blamed the mainstream media for complicity in the suppression
of truth of history, out of fear of offending Jews and thanked Mohammed Ali, the CEO of Islam Channel for his “courage” in widening the debate.

Expanding the debate, Hart added that the assumption is that “Zionism and Judaism are the same thing, therefore criticism of Zionism is anti-Semitism but Zionism is the nationalism for some Jews, a tiny minority.”

“The propaganda they use, the Melanie Phillips version (a Jewish journalist for the British newspaper The Daily Mail), is that Israel faces annihilation and fears being pushed into the sea,” Hart said, which he added was an unfounded myth.

Zionism vs. Judaism

On the panel were three Jewish anti-Zionists and Palestinian scholar Dr Ghada Karmi.

Dr. Ilan Pappe, the Haifa University historian at the forefront of a campaign calling for sanctions and an academic boycott of Israel, said that in order to divorce Zionism from Judaism we must not adopt their discourse.

Rabbi Ahron Cohen, who represented the anti-Zionist Neturei Karta Hasidic sect, said, “Zionists imposed a secular faith state on the Palestinians, this is immoral and the underlying cause of the strife. Zionism and Judaism are incompatible concepts. Many Jews do not approve of Zionism but they cannot say this publicly.”

European problem

Dr. Karmi, a research fellow at the Institute of Arab and Islamic Studies at Exeter University, said the tragedy of the Holocaust had been acted out in Europe and that it was therefore a European affair that had nothing to do with the Palestinians.

The former consultant to the Palestinian Authority offered her own interpretation: “The Europeans did it to atone for their sins and guilt, but the Jews who arrived in Palestine were not the Jews we knew, they were complicated and miserable and the problem is that they’re still there.”

“Israel has been a total disaster for the entire Arab world, nothing positive or beneficial has come from it,” she added.

Dr. Hajo Meyer, a German born scientist and Holocaust survivor, was another panel member. Now living in Holland, he is a board member of Another Jewish Voice, part of the European Jewish Alliance for a Just Peace. In his latest book, “The End of Judaism”, he has criticised Israel for “treating the Palestinian people in the same way the Nazis treated Jews during the Second World War”.

Dr. Meyer said that anti-Semitism is a form of xenophobia, but accusations are met with much swifter condemnation and reprimands.

Islam Channel plans to release a DVD of the debate later in the year.

(07.04.06, 16:57)

And yet we still allow Muslims into the West to prosper under our laws, rights and protections?

The world has gone mad.

Without a doubt I applaud this man for his conversion, but I have two questions:

Hameed’s wife and two children remain in Pakistan where they face dual insecurity for converting to Christianity and for Hameed being sought as a blasphemy suspect.

1. Did he leave his wife and children in Pakistan to their own fate???

...applied for asylum in late March, meeting Dutch immigration officials

2. Will he raise children/grandchildren to reject the ideology of the muslims he is running away from in Pakistan? Or will they grow up only to become like them, except in Holland???

foehammer-

The First Amendment is The Mouth.

The Second Amendment, The Teeth.

(Europe needs dentures, quick.)

I cannot understand how anyone could criticise such a saintly man as Mohammed. According to this message (sent to Timesonline, by a clearly devout, moderate Muslim) if all Muslims followed his example there would be no 9/11's or 7/7's.:

"There can be no justification for crimes of the nature of 9/11 and 7/7 no matter how desperate the situation becomes. The excuse given by those who condone these atrocities is that it is justifiable due to the inhumane actions of Western powers on innocent Muslims. The supporters of these so called "martyrs" will do well to study the holy character of their founder, Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) who led an exemplary life, almost all of it in a part of the world that was steeped in barbarism where seeking vengeance by any means was deemed acceptable. But the Prophet never ever sanctioned the taking of life of innocent bystanders; in fact he emphasised following the route of dialogue and diplomacy. Though he did not achieve this overnight, but achieve it he did, and in the most magnanamous way imagineable. Oh that followers of Prophet Muhammad could go back to the pristine teachings of Islam, we would not have this atmosphere of hatred and aggression anymore, Amen.
Arshad Ahmedi, Stevenage"

So there you have it - a watertight, totally convincing argument with which mainstream Muslims can dissuade their young men from following the path of jihad, using the example of the most perfect of men.

"So there you have it - a watertight, totally convincing argument with which mainstream Muslims can dissuade their young men from following the path of jihad, using the example of the most perfect of men."

This is sarcasm, correct?

Me? Be sarcastic about the prophet Mohammed (piss be upon him)? How could you think such a thing?

Please excuse my French.

Is such a country likely to be against or for terror? Dubya? Condi? Anyone ????

Ben Hur says "Britain’s largest Muslim TV channel, Islam channel, hosts debate titled ‘Zionism: The cancer at the heart of international affairs,’ hosted by former BBC correspondent Alan Hart"

Being a former BBC correspondent, he'd have the right credentials to host a debate with this sort of title.

No wonder I fume every time the BBC News comes on. Anti Blair, anti-Bush, anti-US, anti-Israeli, virulently antisemitic, obsequiously politically-correct, describes mass murderers like the Devils disciple Zarqawi, Bin Laden and his Islamofascists as militants (a term which conjures up the image of striking miners under leaden Yorkshire skies), activists, fighters, people - anything but the cruel, evil, barbaric, misogynistic, civilization-hating, sadistic mass-murdering Islamic savages they are - and made savage by inhaling the texts of the most evil books ever written in the history of mankind.

wallyUK,

Just as in Arabic, some things can only be said in French ;)

Wouldn't you know Alan Hart is a former BBC employee-usually half of 'em leave to go to Al Jazeera or Al Jazeera Jihadis are working for
Auntie Beeb. No doubt Emir of Qatar offers handsome monetary incentives if they spin lies about Islam being a religion of Peace and Tolerance.
As for foolish Israeli 'Hate ourselves bleeding Heart Liberals- a little brush up on History re:Al Hussaini, the infamous Mufti might bring them back to the real world. THE REAL WORLD WHERE
MUSLIMS TORTURED AND KILLED JEWS AND STILL DO...

Showing Mohammed in "indecent positions"? What positions could be much more "indecent" than how they *pray*? One look at the face-planted, sway-backed buttock-hoisting and pumping of Muslims at mosque immediately brings to mind a catamites' aerobics class.

I'm usually for publicizing these things, but not in this case. A news article on his not-yet-final asylum application gives the wrong parties time and notice to fight it, plus now they know where he is should they want to make an example of hiim. They should have waited until *after* he succeeded in obtaining asylum before publishing this. Furthermore, by mentioning the fact that his wife converted to Christianity, they put her in grave danger. She had plausible deniability for accusations of conversion, but printing it in a news article makes that impossible.

Don't worry!! THe UK is not unique in its obsequious need to suck at the islamic nipple or to kiss the Muslim buttock. Here in Australia both the ABC and the SBS, both dominated by PC loving multicultural leftists have their tongues firmly in the islamic camp.

So much so that I never watch the news at all on TV since their early 90s swing into the Islamic lap. Where every homicide bombing was seen as the mark of desperation of an oppressed people and every Israeli return of service as an atrocity.

This is the same culture of depraved leftist lunacy that blamed nonmuslims here for defending themeselves against Muslim predators. Fortunately because of the unofficial response from the non depraved and therefore non-gutless local nonmuslims, Joe Muslim will now think twice about starting anymore Cronulla style episodes. That is, until his numbers swell by over 100% which at present birthrates(7.1 to 1.93 I am told although not verified by me) will not take long.The welfare state caters well for Muslim overbreeding. Like most totally useless and unproductive weeds they thrive in the rich cultural soil of the west and it takes no small amount of trouble to eradicate them.

ayndrandgirl,

The media no longer reports news, they attempt to create it or manipulate it to further their own ends. The latest actions of the New Yorks Times epitomises this. They only care about the results of what they report if it follows along their ideological lines. In their minds, dead Christians are good Christians (replace Christians with any group that the MSM disagrees with). The duplicity is stupendous. Do not expect your newspapers to actually report the truth, or refrain from reporting until the story is complete, especially if there are lives in danger that they do not care about. They would rather grab a headline, or a triumph in their own cause. Sad, but true.

There is no chance at this point that this man is feigning apostasy. No one goes to prison and is tortured, and comes out of it defiant, and can still be a fraud. This man should be given asylum in the United States with his family. It should be done in the full glare of the media. He should be treated like Nelson Mandela.

Muslims are not any different that anyone else. They are vulnerable to criticism. Shame is the most effective weapon we have against Islam. It is legitimately something to be ashamed of.

An additional benefit of this policy will be to accelerate the brain drain from the Muslim world in a more selective manner. Of course, this entails a lot of risk, one not necessary to take. A few apostates here and there and the message will get out there.

It seems to me that Pakistan produces an inordinate amount of apostates. Maybe this is their secret strength that holds the country together: a lot of people pretending to be Muslim.

americaningermany

While I do sympathize with Mr Hameed and his family, I agree with you. Any number of people can do this, and even if genuine, what if 10 million Pakistanis want to come to Europe because they are unsafe in Pakistan? Why is it the duty of the West to take them in?

Instead, the West should push for religious pluralism in dar-ul-islam, after reading all elements of whatever constitute the Shariah. After all, didn't Profit Mohammed (piss be upon him) advocated tolerance (Quran 2:256, 109:6)

P.S. Sheikh er'Bouti, just in case you are wondering, the last sentence is sarcasm.

americaningermany

While I do sympathize with Mr Hameed and his family, I agree with you. Any number of people can do this, and even if genuine, what if 10 million Pakistanis want to come to Europe because they are unsafe in Pakistan? Why is it the duty of the West to take them in?

Instead, the West should push for religious pluralism in dar-ul-islam, after reading all elements of whatever constitute the Shariah. After all, didn't Profit Mohammed (piss be upon him) advocated tolerance (Quran 2:256, 109:6)

P.S. Sheikh er'Bouti, just in case you are wondering, the last sentence is sarcasm.

AmericaninGermany,

Yes, many Muslims from Third World countries ostensibly seeking asylum are in fact economic refugees. However, most claim asylum from political, not religious oppression.

Very few Muslims would convert to another faith simply in order to migrate. In any deeply religious Muslim society, which is what most Muslim societies are, conversion to another faith is considered a certain passport to hell, a sin and a crime worse than murder.

I am myself a Muslim apostate; I know my apostasy is genuine and I would have gone to Siberia to get out of the Muslim country of my birth, if that's what it would have taken.

Don't lump all asylum seekers together. Some, like apostates, are likely to be genuine.

Americaningermany,

Judging from your comments, anyone might think that there was a flood of Muslims seeking asylum in the West for apostasy. There is indeed a flood of Muslim asylum seekers in the West but not for apostasy. The ones who claim asylum on the basis of apostasy tend to be the ones who make the headlines, like Abdul Rahman of Afghanistan. Like him, most of those (very) few former Muslims who seek asylum for apostasy have already suffered in their native countries.

How else do you tell if someone seeking asylum for apostasy is genuine or not?

To renounce Islam within the Islamic world carries the very real possibility of death, sometimes imminent death at the hands of one's fellow citizenry even before the law gets to you.

To invite a death sentence in the hope that it might be a passport out of the country seems illogical to me (once you're dead you can't migrate anywhere, except perhaps to an after-life!)

On a separate but related issue, your comments seem to stem from a concern that extends beyond solely Muslim immigration to the issue of race and culture more generally. Whatever the merits of your position, if that's true, let's not pretend this is just about Muslim immigration.

Quijybo(sp?),

Thank you for your generous comments. You are right, shame is an effective weapon against Islamic oppression. Make sure though that your facts are always right, cross check them and check them also against what Muslims are saying. A measured denunciation is usually better than an intemperate one. Get the smallest fact wrong and Muslims everywhere will cry "demonization"! Ironically, that is itself a testament to the power of shaming people.

Americaningermany,

I don’t think your views necessarily make you a bigot or a racist. I don’t know enough about you to make that judgement and I do not throw epithets around lightly, particularly as most whites are remarkably tolerant compared with the openly, unabashedly racist Muslim society in which I grew up.

I would be lying, however, if I said that I did not find the increasing tendency in the West towards conservatism and nationalism worrying. I know that at the end of the day multiculturalism is only a construct, for the idea of “nation” has always, in every society, been founded on the idea of a common race, religion and language, long before the advent of the nation-state. Yet multiculturalism is a construct that might well have been very worthwhile if the left had not pushed it so far. It was initially about tolerating minority cultures (present in all societies), not about minority cultures ruling the roost, which is what it has now become in the West.

I worry that the backlash against Muslims is gradually becoming a backlash against all non-whites, even as I understand your desire for homogeneity.

I also fear that as the conflict between Islam and the West expands, it will encourage Muslims to speak for the entire non-white world (which is most of the world).

That is not something that either you or I would want.

As someone who will always be a member of a minority group, no matter where I might go, I understand your desire for homogeneity. Be gentle in its expression, though and be clear (distinguish between Islam and the rest of the non-white world). It will serve you well.