Muslim Youth Distributes Pamphlets Insulting Muslims

Off topic but seeing as how the movie, "Islam: What the West Needs to Know" is apparently premiering today, it might be a good idea to have a post about it to draw attention to it.

Ohhhh...what webs we (meaning muslims of course) weave!!!!

Sri Lanka is a place which is ripe for Muslims to exploit - I'm surprised they haven't so far. There's that 20 year long civil war between the Sinhalas and the Tamils, and to date, Muslims have remained neutral. In fact, compared to the beligerent actions of the LTTE (Tamil Tigers) and the Sinhalese dominated Sri Lankan government, the Muslims here look like pussycats by comparison.

I've always wondered which side they'd pick. Given the Leftist nature of the LTTE, I'd have bet on the Tamils, but if the above story is anything to go by, looks like I was wrong.

The most recent religious affiliation / ethnicity breakdown of the population i could find quickly is:

Religions: Buddhist 70%, Islam 8%, Hindu 7%, Christian 6% (2001)

Ethnicity/race: Sinhalese 73.8%, Sri Lankan Moors 7.2%, Indian Tamil 4.6%, Sri Lankan Tamil 3.9%, other 0.5%, unspecified 10% (2001)

You have to hand it to the Tamils: for 8% of the population they've certainly managed to kick up merry hell! The Muslims must be quite jealous.

Americaningermany

I've been getting this sort of mail in a yahoo address of mine daily, ever since I opened it. I had posted that address on Jihadwatch a few weeks ago, and looks like some of these clowns seem to have mined that from here. I've marked these as spam, but it drops into my inbox. Too bad I can't access yahoo mail from Outlook Express, or else I would have set my Norton spamfilter to flush out such stuff the moment they arrived (Anybody know how to do this, assuming it's possible?)

What I consider interesting is how the senders of one of the internet's oldest scams assume that people here are Islamic fanatics willing to donate to them. Why don't they scam people in the Gulf with that stupid template of theirs? If any Sheikhs are equally stupid enough to fall for those, let them - the less cash there is to build mosques in bilad ul kafir.

Is there a way to find out addresses of Islamic tycoons in the Gulf, and send these senders those addresses? Anybody?

WallyUK

That doesn't look right - the Tamils are by far the 2nd largest group in Sri Lanka, and a majority in northern and eastern provinces of Sri Lanka. The Muslims don't come close.

Also, all Tamils in Sri Lanka are Sri Lankan Tamils, by definition. Indian Tamils live across the Palk Strait.

No doubt they will say he is a Jew.

Caroline-"Islam: What the West Needs to Know"

Whats that?
Or am I being a bit blond?......its late

These are ethnicity figures given in encarta:

Sinhalese 74 percent
Tamil 18 percent
Moor (Arab) 7 percent
Burgher (Dutch), Malay, Vedda 1 percent

I suppose it's not unlikely that some sources deliberately understate the proportion of Tamils.

Americaningermany

to get rid of these messages you have to copy them (attention: including the mailheader) and then paste them into a new outgoing email adressed to the server were the message came from with "abuse" (i.e abuse@netscape.net, abuse@aol.com, abuse@yahoo.com, etc.) under RE: "Fraud" and off they go...
It has to be done for a while (several days) with all these types of messages, but being identified as a fraud prank this way, the operators behind it loose their adresses in the net...

You see what the trolls are doing here? I also used to receive such messages on our fax machine at work! - americaningermany

Yeah, and now when I actually need someone to help me get $2M out of the Central Bank of Bujumbura by supplying a modest fee up front in exchange for a cut of the loot, once retrieved, no one will listen!

Jerks! ;)

Shinoliite

Notice how in the original letter above

From The Desk of Hassan Bello
Bill and Exchange Officer
Foreigner Remittance Dept
African Development Bank
Burkina Faso

Bank of America
United States

"Caroline-"Islam: What the West Needs to Know"

Whats that?
Or am I being a bit blond?......its late
Posted by: dhimmiwit [TypeKey Profile Page] at July 7, 2006 07:04 PM"

dhimmiwit - go to the main JW page and you will see on the left the advertisement for the film (just below the Cox and Forkum cartoon) - a banner which has been there for many weeks now. It's a film which features Mr Spencer among others. But today is the premier (apparently restricted to DC, Chicago and LA).

I guess I don't see much point in advertising the film for weeks at the site via a banner absent an actual, bona fide post about the film on the very day of the premier (realizing of course how very busy Mr Spencer is, so that's certainly not meant as a criticism - I would just like to see Mr Spencer promote the film a wee bit on the day of its premiere after weeks of advertising it on his home page).

Reviews from the website for "Islam: What the West Needs to Know" (premiering today):

Chicago Sun-Times:
http://www.suntimes.com/output/movies/wkp-news-arthouse07.html

"George Bush, Tony Blair, Bill Clinton, Condoleeza Rice, and Sen. Harry Reid (D-Nev.) appear in TV clips insisting Islam is a "peaceful" faith "perverted" by terrorists. Davis and Daly counter with a line-up of authors who see treason and civilizational suicide in that message of tolerance. Islam is a violent, imperialist ideology with zero tolerance for infidels, argue the film' experts, whose works include The Politically Incorrect Guide to Islam, Apologize for the Crusades? Never! and The Stupidity of Dialogue With Islam. Serge Trifkovic, for one, fears secular America lacks ideals: "Multiculturalism and postmodern liberals are not worth dying for."

Also interviewed is Walid Shoebat -- a one-time member of the Fatah Brigade, PLO fund-raiser at Loop College, and author of Why I Left Jihad. "Islamic fundamentalism is a sleeper cell in America," claims Shoebat, who recanted his militancy and converted to Christianity.

From the Chicago Tribune:

http://metromix.chicagotribune.com/movies/mmx-060707-movies-review-islam,0,7464425.story?coll=mmx-movies_top_heds

"Another war-related documentary out this week is eminently censure-worthy, but I believe in a free country, where even deadly dull anti-Islam propaganda pieces can book a theater and try to attract an audience. "Islam: What the West Needs to Know" has one point to make: Islam is a bad, baaaaaaaaad religion, and it's a miracle you're even alive and reading this, so intent most Muslims are on your destruction.

The film comes from Quixotic Media, which "seeks to take on issues of social significance that major media will not." None of that treasonous New York Times bunk here. No, this is a different sort of bunk entirely. "What the West Needs to Know" relies on the same five talking heads parroting each other for 95 tedious minutes. One is Robert Spencer, who runs the Web site jihadwatch.org. Islam, Spencer asserts at one point, stands as the only big-league religion that "mandates violence against non-believers." Considering what has been done to whom in the name of other religions, that may well end up being the funniest line of 2006."

(CAROLINE: Yes, well, WHO WILL HAVE THE LAST LAUGH?")

From

http://www.washingtoncitypaper.com/film/2006/shorts0707.html?navCenterBot
"
It was practically the one patch of rhetorical common ground we had after 9/11: Right, left, or center, we could all agree—at least publicly—that the guys who took down the World Trade Center had nothing to do with true Islam. And that any war on al-Qaeda was in no way an attack on the Muslim people, who are innately peace-loving and law-abiding. And—oh, you know the rest. Those platitudes now come under a kind of jihadist assault from filmmakers Gregory M. Davis and Bryan Daly, whose monomaniacal polemic, Islam: What the West Needs to Know, argues that the world’s second-largest faith is nothing less than a warrior creed, right down to its Mohammedan roots. Forget whatever lip service the Prophet initially paid to tolerance; once he was in power, the film maintains, he wished only forcible conversion or death for infidels. As a result, declares talking head Robert Spencer, director of JihadWatch.org, “Islam is not simply a religion. It is a religion or belief system that mandates warfare against unbelievers.” This warfare will never end, we’re told, until all Earthlings are bowing toward Mecca—a proposition Davis and Daly periodically dramatize with insidious camera crawls across a terrain map of Europe, which lies as prostrate and defenseless as a virgin in a pasha’s chamber. No Westerner, of course, could deny the threat posed by Islamic militants, but this film wants us to believe that every Muslim is at heart a militant—even the most Westernized, who’s merely a fifth columnist biding his time until the great invasion of his fellows. Why? Because that’s what the Koran commands, Davis and Daly suggest. Let’s buy into their East vs. West presumptions for a minute—and note that the Bible variously sanctions slavery, genocide, rape, stoning, and, yes, forced conversion. Even that well-known pacifist Jesus was supposed to have said, “I came to cast fire upon the earth; and would it were already kindled!” Hold any of us to the letter of our founding texts, and we’re all in trouble. If Davis and Daly had a little imagination, they might see that the devil they’re chasing isn’t Islam but fundamentalism, which assumes many forms. Even documentaries."

From Knight at the Movies:

http://www.knightatthemovies.com/KATMkt.html

"I have been troubled since viewing the documentary Islam: What the West Needs to Know which opens today in just three
cities in America – Chicago, Atlanta, and Washington, D.C. The source of the trouble is my ignorance about the religion under attack
in the film – I don’t pretend to have more than a modicum of knowledge about it and as such don't wish to tread in such a current
events hot zone. I’ve read for years in the gay media about Islam's persecution of homosexuals and abuse toward women and
trust the sources of these reports. But a lot of religions, in one way or another, follow these same practices. So taking that out of
the equation (not the easiest thing to do, of course), is Islam a religion of peace as proclaimed by millions of its followers and many
world leaders? Or is it instead, a horribly divisive faith bent on the destruction of those who refuse to follow its tenets? Without at
least a working knowledge of Islam and its Muslim followers, how is it possible to review this movie with any kind of even-
handedness? Is this a documentary? Propaganda? A combination of the two?

This movie, which has been dubbed “controversial” before it’s been screened, easily falls into that category but on what side of
controversy does it fall? It’s obvious from that warning of a title and the film’s content where the moviemakers stand but where did
this polarized position originate? The extreme right and the extreme left, as has been noted elsewhere, are seemingly so rigid in
their positions and so quick to resort to aggression that it’s often hard to tell the two apart.

It hasn’t helped that aside from an ignorance of the subject matter at issue, there hasn’t been much background information on the
two filmmakers, Bryan Daly and Gregory Davis, who are making their debut with the movie. The film’s publicist provided the
information that the two started Quixotic Media, a small production/distribution company three years ago with the goal to “pursue
subjects the traditional media would not.” The inspiration for Islam: What the West Needs to Know, their first production, according to
their publicist was this: “After noticing the ubiquitous assertion that ‘Islam is a religion of peace’ they thought it would be publicly
useful and socially relevant to examine the issue from Islam’s own canonical sources” and that's what the movie does.

As the film begins clips of Western world leaders – Bush, Blair, Rice, et al – are shown one after the other decrying terrorists and
making the distinction between their barbarous acts and the Islam faith. Islam is a religion of peace they are quick to assert and is
sullied by the horrific acts of these fanatics but a trio of self-described experts on Islam and a former terrorist quietly debunk this
idea throughout the rest of the movie. As the film sees it, the opposite is true and followers of Islam won’t be happy until every non-
believer joins their ranks or failing that, is wiped off the face of the earth – and if that has to be achieved through extremely violent
means, so be it. The movie methodically lays out this thesis in six chapters – via the talking heads, graphics, Islamic artwork, and
voice over readings from the Koran and other Islamic texts.

The film is quietly persuasive in its arguments and if half of what these experts assert is true, the world is in for decades of bloody
strife – whether through ignorance or manipulative design (one of the experts points out that terrorist acts have become the scare
tactic replacement for Fascism and Communism of days gone by). This is a vision of the world that’s as terrifying as that envisioned
by Christian Fundamentalists after the Rapture, their Day of Reckoning occurs. Calm and assured (though never smug), Islam: What
the West Needs to Know is a poison pill of a movie with a dreadful warning. But are the filmmakers Cassandra’s, damned to predict
an accurate future that no one believes or the opposite?

My unease about all of this comes not just from the fact that the first scenario is a possibility but also from the potential
consequences of writing about this controversial movie that exposes that possibility in the first place. Then again, maybe that’s the
best reason for the movie to be seen in the first place. Anything that can stimulate an audience into an intellectual, open and
emotional discussion and get them to wrestle with such disturbing questions no matter the viewer’s belief – as this movie sure can –
is worth seeing. Isn’t it?"

americaningermany,
This seems to be the type of fraud that was very popular in Nigeria around 5 years back. Some people actually fell for it, sent some money and went over there. They were held captive until ransom was given. One American was actually killed. The FBI sought info on any email coming from Nigeria carrying this stuff. You can forward your mail to FBI, and rest assured, you won't be receiving any more messages.

From Muslims mulling jihad to Muslim Sri Lankans flee Mannar.

amercaningermany,
apparently the internet cafes in Nigeria make their money from people who spend all day sending out these things - but the Nigerian government has just announced it's going to crack down hard on the whole racket -things have reached the point where nobody will do any e-business with Nigeria any more.

Disinformation, thy name is Islam.

Caroline-

What those here (who feel that they know Islam's motivations all-too-well, but would still like to support a film that may be redundant for them when they go out for some relief and entertainment) can do is: buy a ticket at the box office for this film "ISLAM; WHAT THE WEST NEEDS TO KNOW"- at whatever multiplex runs it, and then go see a different film in the complex. One that will be something they don't already feel filled-to-the-gills-with. (I did this for "United 93", and no ticket takers noticed or cared.)

This way your money goes to support the film-makers, who need all the help they can get to inform the dozing majority of the populace still wading in the shallows of "religious relativism" ("What about the Christians during the Crusades, huh!?"), and you can take a break from the monochrome jihad. The psychic batteries DO need re-charging with aesthetic delights unrelated to psyhcopathic followers of a pedophile, from time to time.

Although I'm a fan of Phillip K. Dick's witty and paradoxical sci-fi [adapted fairly well with "Blade Runner", and then degenerating into the humorless mutilations of "Total Recal", "Minority Report", etc.], I can't imagine anything good coming of his insular little druggie-paranoia satire "A Scanner Darkly" which debuts out in the theaters shortly. It is a story that can only work as words, since it is about interior confusion not exterior uncertainty, so good luck with it onscreen. Thus, I don't have any recommendations. The pickin's, cinematically, seems slim, at the moment.

"The Road to Guantanamo", however, is one I want money back from, without even having seen it. "Three innocent boys from Tipton, England", who "went to a wedding in Pakistan" and then "crossed into Afghanistan for some sight-seeing"... shortly after 9/11... yeah, right... and ended up "tortured in Gitmo", "victims of American injustice".

That we let them go was the real crime.

(Although film-reviewer Roger Ebert is certain that Gitmo is "illegal" and "should be closed", so I guess that settles it. The man who penned "Beyond the Valley of the Dolls" knows best.)

Caroline -- Thanks for the transcripts! It's informative to know that many are still blind, but some are opening their eyes.

Cheers!

Templar 13, take your homophobia and shove it where the sun don't shine.

That was not caroline saying that. That was a movie reviewer saying that. Caroline was quoting his movie review.

Templar:

I value all attempts to remove Islam from the list of the world's problems. This will be a daunting task, surely, and one that should not be tended lightly. I appreciate your sincere efforts to do so.

That being said, I will add this - This forum is JihadWatch, not GayBash. No, I am not gay. Not that this would matter. The efforts put forth here should be directed toward a truthful and thorough understanding of Islam and Muslims, how they interfere with the world's freedoms directly and indirectly, and what we can do to stop them.

There should be no efforts to attack gays that, as far as anyone knows, may be the key to winning our battle.

- recalled

I think its possible that Templar was being sarcastic. I hope so at least.

Profitsbeard - interesting idea about buying a ticket, especially for those of us who don't live near DC, LA or Chicago. But if lots of people did that they might buy out all the tickets and then the theaters themselves would be empty, which might not look too good for a movie premier!

I guess I'm a bit surprised that Mr Spencer hasn't hyped it up a bit with a post, especially as he apparently figures rather prominently in the film (as one of the main talking heads).

Templar13, thought you might like to see this: muslim gays in the UK coming out of the closet. Alternate titles, "Boys in Burkas" or "The Queer Quran".
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13712248/
Also do not buy Subarus. They are openly pro gay/lebian.
Subaru bought a four-page, four-color pullout section in the December 21, 2004, The Advocate magazine, surrounding a celebration of 11 “People of the Year” selected by the magazine since 1990. Honorees include V. Gene Robinson (December 23, 2003), the homosexual Episcopal bishop; Rosie O’Donnell (January 21, 2003); George Michael (January 19, 1999), following Michael’s arrest for lewdness in a Beverly Hills restroom, and former Gay and Lesbian Task Force leader Urvashi Vaid and the late artist Robert Mapplethorpe (both December 18, 1990). Note: Vaid’s book was endorsed by presidential and vice-presidential advisor Mary Matalin, and Mapplethorpe is known for his homoerotic, X-rated images that engulfed the National Endowment for the Arts in controversy.

As for Subaru, the fourth page includes this summary:

“Subaru of America celebrates ten years of support for the gay and lesbian community.

• First national automaker to sponsor the Human Rights Campaign

• First automaker to extend domestic partner benefits to all employees

• Featured on The L Word [Showtime’s lesbian drama]

• Recipient of the Los Angeles Gay and Lesbian Center’s Corporate Leadership Award

• First automaker to insert custom creative in gay media

• Founding sponsor of the Rainbow Endowment, whose Visa Rainbow Card has raised more than $1.5 million for health, civil rights and cultural causes

• Sponsor of numerous gay and lesbian cultural and athletic events

• Presenting sponsor of the 2004 AIDS LifeCycle.”

Sample ads from past campaigns are pictured, including one with a photo of a Subaru wagon with the slogan above it: “It’s Not a Choice. It’s the Way We’re Built.”

Templar: "You all should take more care separating your words from those of another source, as I should take more care when speed reading."

Templar - I happen to be straight and married and actually opposed to gay marriage (because of the slippery slope to polygamy/Islam) and those weren't my words but if they had been - if I had stated that I actually read alot of gay publications, would that have actually warranted your post? Are you friggin serious? And to think I imagined that you must have been sarcastic when you wrote, "This arena has no room for Faggots, Gays Lasbians, fudge packers, queers, homos..."

Instead of taking more care when speed reading, I suggest you take more care when POSTING. As to the kind of folks this "arena" has "room for", I strongly suspect that if a vote were taken now it would be you who would find himself booted out into the cold.

Templar - are you as rabidly anti-homosexual as you come across or do you merely desire a certain amount of what one might call "discreetness" among practitioners of homosexuality?

Your reply to 'recalled' would suggest the latter, but your original post to my quote of a movie review, as well as your over the top sarcastic reply to my last post, would suggest otherwise.

Because if it is the case that you actually admire "discreetness", then might I suggest that you personally practice what you appear to preach?

americaningermany, we have had that sort of thing happening in Australia now for a few years, I would get at least 10 a week, all from people who had their husband or father or what ever killed in tragic circumstances and they need to get the money out of the country and out of the hands of the oppressors or what ever lies they came up with...
Our raidos announcers warned people about it also..
they must have given up on Australia as I have had only one in the last year... so perhaps it is your countries turn...for them to see if there are any suckers there..

Caroline I am reading you correctly, you say....My unease about all of this comes not just from the fact that the first scenario is a possibility but also from the potential
consequences of writing about this controversial movie that exposes that possibility in the first place.
I gather from what you say that you think most Muslims are friendly even though the Quran says that they are not allowed to be our friends unless it is to convert us.. Caroline, what you say in regards to Christianity happened before Moses, and God gave moses laws by which we should follow and that was to love our enemy etc, we put ourselves in danger if we dont listen to what is at our door today...
I have over 1050 vidoes most show clerics and muslim leaders calling for the death to the infidel to thousands of their people and you say that most are friendly, is that why tens of thousands of infidels are slaughtered every year by Muslims...More people are killed by Islamists each year than in all 350 years of the Spanish Inquisition combined (source)
Caroline, what do all these countries and places have in common......
India, Sudan, Algeria, Afghanistan, New York, Pakistan, Israel, Russia, Chechnya, Philippines, Indonesia, Nigeria, Thailand, Spain, Egypt, Bangladesh, Saudi Arabia, Ingushetia, Dagestan, Britain, Turkey, Kabardino-Balkaria, Morocco, Yemen, Lebanon, France, Uzbekistan, Gaza, Tunisia, Kosovo, Bosnia, Mauritania, Kenya, Eritrea, Syria, Somalia, California, Kuwait, Virginia, Ethiopia, Iran, Jordan, Tanzania, Sri Lanka, Belgium, Denmark, East Timor, Qatar, Tajikistan, Netherlands, Scotland, Australia, and the Malaccan islands and and...what do they all have in common, a struggle and or slaughter by Muslims

...and pretty much wherever Muslims believe their religion tells them to:

"Fight and slay the Unbelievers wherever ye find them. Seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem of war."
Qur'an, Sura 9:5

It is not Hindus or Catholics, or Buddhists, or charismatic, or or or ...it is simply Muslims the world over...and since Moses the bible does NOT tell its people to go and slaughter..it says to love, understand and be tolerant of others.

Caroline, I would have to agree with Templar13. Any government or person who pushes something which has the potential to destroy so many lives and people should be held acountable, whether it be Islam or homosexuality...
below is a small part of an article which people might like to read...
Infectious Diseases are a plight of homosexuals, at an incredibly far, far greater rate to heterosexuals.

Even after washing, the smell, faeces, germs, viruses stay in the pores and folds of the penis hrs after the act, collecting and passing it on as they go.

Homosexuality and Infectious Diseases: Bedfellows

In the mid-20th century, male homosexuals constituted about 8% of men afflicted with anal cancer; by the mid-1980s, this figure had risen to 72%. (1) The transmission of certain types of human papilloma viruses explains the association of anal intercourse with anal cancer. (2) In an examination of 3,391 Danish men in registered homosexual partnerships, followed for an average of 4.6 years, the incidence of anal cancer was 31-fold higher and the incidence of Kaposi’s sarcoma was 136-fold higher compared to Danish men in general. (3) Anal carcinomas among male homosexuals can approach 4-7 inches in diameter. (4)
During 1982-1989, MSM constituted less than 10% of individuals with hepatitis-A. (5) During the first 6 months of 1991, 29% of the hepatitis-A cases in Denver, 66% in New York City, 50% in San Francisco, 56% in Toronto, 42% in Montreal, and 26% in Melbourne consisted of homosexuals. (5) Between Nov 1998 and May 1999, among the reported cases of hepatitis-A in Columbus, Ohio, 66% of the men were MSM. (6) Parasitic intestinal infections are common among homosexuals; they result from the consumption of faecal material via rimming and other sexual practices (see here). A sexual transmission of typhoid, and a first of its kind in the U.S., occurred among a group of male homosexuals in 2000 (see here). Amebic liver abscess, a disease usually found in developing tropical countries is found elsewhere among individuals who have visited these countries and also among MSM. (20)
During the period 1994-1999, in Denmark, the incidence of gonorrhoea among MSM was 30 times that among heterosexual men. (18)
A 2004 U.S. report mentioned increasing drug-resistant gonorrhoea among MSM; the incidence of this drug-resistant form of gonorrhoea was 12-fold higher in MSM compared to the general population. (19)
This is not a anti homosexual site but as it was brought up I felt to contribute this and of course I expect a hash rebuff for it, but read the facts for yourselves... our leaders under the guise of discrimination push something which is dangerious to society, perhaps this is why all religious books are against homosexuality, as time has proven its deadliness...

Is it possible though to tackle islam and homosexuality at the same time?

Which one is more threatening to our societies?
At least we don't yet see Homos waging war on the heterosexual community by sending in suicide bombers to do us all in.
AIDS is definitely a threat to all of us and spread to heterosexuals through bi-sexuals, or through blood transfusions, but I don't feel as threatened by AIDS as I do by islam.

I am no advocate for homosexuality, (homosexuals shouldn't marry or adopt children) but I wouldn't turn away anyone who is willing to campaign against islam because of his/her sexual preference.

If we can find and destroy the culprit behind this political correctness "disease" we all now suffer under, maybe we could clean up our societies all the way round.

So, where do we start?

Gaye: "Caroline I am reading you correctly, you say...."

Gaye - no. You misread. Those were movie reviews about Islam: What the West Needs to Know" that I was quoting. I put the quote marks at the beginning and end of each review and am now grateful, given the apparent confusion this has caused, that Yojimbo has provided me with proper instructions on how to quote (the quote marks go at the beginning of each new paragraph and go at the very end of the last paragraph). It's a lesson I will take to heart in the future!

As to this homosexuality issue that got brought up, good lord! I never even noticed in the first place that the last reviewer mentioned reading gay publications. And even if I had noticed it, I would hardly have given it a second thought! I was a bit stunned by Templar's reaction and frankly, even more stunned by his suggestion that I "should take more care separating [your] words from those of another source" - not for the reason that I agree that yes, it is an excellent idea to take the utmost care to attribute ideas to the proper source (I most certainly DO NOT want to take credit for other people's ideas and words) but beacause there is a bit of an inquisition-type quality to the way he phrased that suggestion. My gut reaction is "Excuse me?". So if I did happen to read gay literature (all that the reviewer ever said), then that fact alone would have warranted the over-the-top reaction in his subsequent post?

Frankly, I have about zero interest in the topic of homosexuality. No, it doesn't disgust me personally and I don't think God (if there is one) would care one way or the other, unless God has some peculiar fascination with sex, which I seriously doubt. Yes, I am turned off by the blatant public display of homosexuality but I am also turned off by blatant heterosexual displays of sexuality in the public sphere. It's just crass and vulgar either way. I strongly oppose gay marriage at the present time because of the slippery slope to polygamy (and I have in the past and will in the future, should the topic recur, argue vociferously for that anti-gay-marriage position) but if Islam had literally vanished from this earth, frankly, I wouldn't even give much thought to the issue of gay marriage at all.

As to the diseases Gaye cites with regard to anal sex - plenty of heterosexual people have anal sex as well. If the figure for heterosexual anal sex were just 10% of the heterosexual population, it would still amount to about the same numbers of homosexuals engaging in the practice. Plus, if it hurts the practitioners themselves, then what business is it of mine? I smoke, so I should be the last one to complain about something like that. Likewise, anyone who is overweight, let alone obese (neither applicable to myself), in my opinion has no grounds to complain about either smokers like me nor about diseases associated with the practice of anal sex. The health costs related to obesity and the treatment for its various outcomes – including high cholesterol, hypertension, heart disease, diabetes, stroke, vascular depression, vascular dementia (and possibly even Alzheimer’s disease, which some research links to the same high fat diet associated with the prior conditions) – puts obesity and a high fat diet at the forefront of risk factors which deserve the public’s attention because this is where the clear bulk of the public's money goes in the health arena. Yet what we get instead is self-esteem building in the public press for obese people. “Fat is beautiful” and all that. Yeah – well, so by the same token, brown lungs are presumably beautiful too. As are presumably, homosexual penises carrying hidden diseases in their hidden regions.

I do find it somewhat amusing that I have admonished Kuffir Nonbeliever in the past for assuming that I was a right wing Christian fundamentalist and that he needed to back off from seeking the enemy around every corner and under every bed, where there was none. Now it was assumed, on the basis of ONE LINE in a movie review (among several reviews that I posted) that I was gay, which occasioned all of this. So I would give the same advice to Templar et al – please don’t be looking for homosexuals in every corner and under every bed. It just makes you look a bit irrational, you know?

And God forbid, should Templar and Kuffir N. ever get into it on the same thread, I seriously might just have to close my eyes.

Something I will add, is that I would have ZERO tolerance for any homosexual pushing an agenda of carte-blanche western "tolerance" above and beyond all other considerations (to include the Muslim threat) - come hell or high water, just because that would benefit their personal interests, even to the detriment of the western civilization to which they belong. No, I would not accept that at all.

But folks like Bruce Bawer and Kuffir Nonbeliever are not doing that. And I think that debating the issue of gay marriage in that context is a far cry from disparaging gays themselves as dangerous, subversive, subhumans.

Caroline, I am glad of that,, but I think the quotation marks wont make a difference, perhaps you need to say it is from something else...

Caroline, there is always a scietific reason why certian things are in the Bible, and science is only now just finding that out, eg the Jews were told to circumcise their babies, (which I am sure you will say is barbaric), and circumcised men are less likely to get cancer of the penis and their women are less likely to get cancer of the cervic, interesting eh..the foods they were told to not eat, science has found out that these things were scavangers thus carried diseases... and as you can see from my post above, the disease in homosexuals is horrifying, so this would be one of the reasons for God not allowing homosexuality, we dont allow our children to do things that is dangerious to them either... I will include a portion from one of the homosexual conventions to show that they have a concerted push on the hetrosexual just as Muslims have...
By Ed Vitagliano

"All churches who condemn us will be closed." That was what Michael Swift, a "gay revolutionary," declared in a February 1987 issue of the Gay Community News. Most of this has now happened..
"All laws banning homosexual activity will be revoked .... [W]e shall make films about the love between heroic men .... The family unit -- spawning ground of lies, betrayals, mediocrity, hypocrisy and violence -- will be abolished .... All churches who condemn us will be closed."

Not many people, however, saw the humor in Swift's sentiments, such as the following: "We shall sodomize your sons .... We shall seduce them in your schools, in your dormitories, in your gymnasiums, in your locker rooms, in your sports arenas, in your seminaries, in your youth groups, in your movie theater bathrooms, in your army bunkhouses, in your truck stops, in your all-male clubs, in your houses of Congress, wherever men are with men together."
While they claim to want only equal protection under law, the real agenda of homosexual activists is simple: the complete alteration of American society to fit the homosexual view of human sexuality, marriage and family.

This is not an overexaggeration. Paula Ettelbrick is former legal director of the Lambda Legal Defense and Education Fund and now executive director of the International Gay and Lesbian Human Rights Commission. Ettelbrick stated, "Being queer is more than setting up house, sleeping with a person of the same gender, and seeking state approval for doing so .... Being queer means pushing the parameters of sex, sexuality, and family, and in the process, transforming the very fabric of society .... We must keep our eyes on the goal ... of radically reordering society's views of reality."

End Game
But beyond these tactics, Kirk and Madsen said plans must also be drawn up to deal with "the entrenched enemy," which might persist in resisting even in the face of the preliminary schemes. They said: "At a later stage of the media campaign for gay rights -- long after other gay ads have become commonplace -- it will be time to get tough with remaining opponents. To be blunt, they must be vilified."

Again, astute people who are paying attention to what is happening in our culture can already see this occurring. On high school and college campuses, for example, people who dare to speak up against the homosexual agenda are being ridiculed and smeared. In corporations where they work, some people who refuse to acquiesce to the reigning pro-gay environment are reprimanded or fired.