EU Commission President disappointed at lack of EU support for Pope

"We should also encourage the moderate leaders in the Muslim world -- and they're the majority -- to distance themselves from this extremism..."
-- from Jose Maneul Barroso's comment

Four Questions In Search Of An Answer:

1. Define "moderate leaders."
2. Tell us how you know they are in "the majority."
3. Tell us why the attacks on the Pope can be described, without more, as "extremism."
4. Tell us why you think that "the moderate leaders in the Muslim world -- and they're the majority" have not once been capable of denouncing those who riot and agitate and utter death threats, not only now, against the Pope, but in other displays of mayhem and threatened (and sometimes real) murder, such as those world-wide protests, presumably from those Muslims not in "the majority," including the various governments of Muslim states that recalled their ambassadors or engaged in a boycott of Danish goods, over Danes daring to exercise in Denmark their right of free speech.

Astonishing anti-dhimmitude from a man who just in February said:

"Islam is part of Europe. We have a very important Islamic heritage".

Let's see... if we take that period of 7 months to represent the mean amount of time for one to go from dimwitted dhimmitude to semi-conscious skepticism, the revolution should begin in earnest by April of 2007.

That's my forecast.

Well said.
God bless the Pope.

Hugh asks: Tell us why you think that "the moderate leaders in the Muslim world -- and they're the majority" have not once been capable of denouncing those who riot and agitate and utter death threats, not only now, against the Pope, but in other displays of mayhem and threatened (and sometimes real) murder, such as those world-wide protests, presumably from those Muslims not in "the majority," including the various governments of Muslim states that recalled their ambassadors or engaged in a boycott of Danish goods, over Danes daring to exercise in Denmark their right of free speech.

And why is the President of Russia embracing the Berserkers?

"Russia is the most reliable partner of the Islamic world and most faithful defender of its interests, Russian President Vladimir Putin said in Chechnya’s capital Grozny."
Read it all. Checyya's terrorists to be granted amnesty.
http://www.mosnews.com/news/2005/12/12/muslimfriend.shtml

AND why are the EU deputies not condemning the Berserkers?

Centre-right MEPs suggest Pope clause in Turkey report
22-09-2006
By Lucia Kubosova
Brussels, EUObserver: Angry Muslim reaction to the Pope's recent remarks on Islam has seen some centre-right MEPs make a last-minute attempt to insert a paragraph condemning the Muslim outcry into a major report on Turkey's EU accession progress. The Pope affair also saw the conservative deputies campaigning to toughen the general wording of the report – to be voted on in Strasbourg on Wednesday (27 September) - during this week's meeting of the EPP-ED group. But with draft version of the report already ruffling feathers in Ankara, EPP-ED deputies opted to prevent further controversy by refraining from a reference to the protests in the Muslim world on the Pope's speech. Instead, they only filed a comment that welcomes the Pope's planned November visit to Turkey. . . .read it all here:
http://www.muslimnews.co.uk/news/news.php?article=11752

Perhaps the silence from Western leadership is related to shock. It may be sinking in that the Pope’s actions may force them to address an issue that they were planning to leave to their successors.

I think many of Europe's elite remember a peaceful, warm, romantic Islamic culture—a culture where the handsome Muslim men live in tents filled with beautiful wives and ride camels while the British, French, Italians and Germans travel about in autos, military tanks and airplanes (refer to movies about North Africa during the years 1880 to 1944). Raiders of the Lost Ark and Disney's Aladin remain the elite's prime sources for information about Islam.

When I have a machine gun and an armoured vehicle, the nice camel driver or coffee vendor or restraunteer is a very moderate Muslim.

However, I would agree—most present day Muslims are moderates. If they are illiterate, know how to pronounce the Quran in a foreign language they don't understand (Arabic), know little else about Islam, and have no television to pump government sponsered propaganda into their heads, they remain moderates. These moderates may, for food and money, jump up and down looking angry holding signs they can't read for foreign television news.

But "Moderate Leaders" would fall into these categories:

1) Those who have realized that Islam is a farce, but are too afraid to leave it (lose head) or have too much to gain by staying (oil revenues).

2) Dilemma of leaders who believe Islam is true: I can try to live according to the principles Mohammed taught and be sanctioned or bombed, OR I can be a moderate and use OPEC to squeeze money out of the West to fill my pockets while crying to the UN, EU, US that I need aid money to strengthen my jihadi military, er, I mean, to build schools and hospitals.

The Islamic world has had many chances and tons of money thrown at them to allow themselves "to distance themselves from this extremism". There seems little response. "Moderate Leaders" seem more interested in getting their people angry at Israel and the West rather than to calm their people down. No doubt this is to keep the people from becoming angry at their benevolent moderate leaders: Israeli Apes and American Swine are to blame for you being impoverished and me being filthy rich...

When the most extreme comments western world leaders make is to condemn the actions of a small minority who are transgressing the "real values" of islam ( and thereby praising it thru the back door), can one really expect support for the Pope in europe?
The sickness of europe is perhaps the inevitable sickness of the bon viveur who has it too good for too long. He cannot bear to even ponder that those years of plenty may soon be coming to an end.
Is that perhaps, it is only countries like Poland, who suffered until only recently refuse to align itself with the amoral nihilst thinking that pervades western europe.

Barroso said the caution on the part of European leaders was probably due to "worries about a possible confrontation" as well as a "certain form of political correctness."

It's this toxic mix of fear and guilt that the West is drowning in. Europe more than the U.S.

First, Europe is so ashamed of its colonialist past that its elites aren't even sure they have any right to defend European civilization and culture from any attack anymore. If you're drowning in depression and neurotic guilt, thinking you're worthless, you won't fight hard even to save your own neck.

Second, it has now become clear after the Mohammed cartoon incident and the Pope incident that the first time any European leader takes a firm stand, he will be met with Islamic violence. So far, no one in Europe is prepared to be "the first kid on his block" to start a wave of Islamic violence.

One of the many historical lessons that modern Europe has forgotten (along with the worthlessness of appeasement and the danger of cynicism and despair), is that things often seem to get worse before they get better.

Example: When Hitler marched into Poland, the French and British reluctantly declared war. One year later, Hitler had conquered Denmark, Norway, Holland, Belgium, Luxembourg and France, and was embarking on a systematic strategic bombing campaign against Britain. Declaring war seemed to have "provoked" Hitler into slamming Western Europe even harder. But declaring war was preferable to further appeasement or surrender--and eventually the tide of battle turned.

It's now clear that Europe cannot begin to face the growing menace of Islamic radicalism without an upsurge in violence in the immediate future. The Muslims are going to use force. The Europeans have to bite that bullet with the hope and expectation of turning that around in the future.

"And why is the President of Russia embracing the Berserkers?"

Posted by: A. Major

In my opinion, because the communist strategy for the conquest of Europe through cultural warfare is approaching fruition.
Islam is Russia's fifth column in the West and was deliberately introduced through active political lobbying via multiculturalism.

I don't believe communist Russia really lost the Cold War.

Gorbachev's speech to the Politburo in 1987, just prior to "the collapse":

"Gentlemen, comrades, do not be concerned about all you hear about glasnost and perestroika and democracy in the coming years. These are primarily for outward consumption. There will be no significant internal change within the Soviet Union, other than for cosmetic purposes. Our purpose is to disarm the Americans and let them fall asleep."

Interesting reading in view of Gorbachev's comment are,

"Political Correctness - The Revenge of Marxism", by Fjorman :
http://gatesofvienna.blogspot.com/2006/06/political-correctness-revenge-of.html

"Russian Footprints" by Ion Mihai Pacepa :
http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=NjUzMGU4NTMyOTdkOTdmNTA1MWJlYjYyZDliODZkOGM=

and

"How the Soviets Gave the Mullahs the Bomb"
By Jamie Glazov :

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=24019

Fear the Kittens
http://www.rathergood.com/laibach/

In my view Europe has always had this ignore-it-and-it-will-go-away attitude. It was shown to all the world between 1933 and 1939. They thought that Hitler really could be placated with the Sudetenland. Wishful thinking is no substitute for a strong backbone.

Some of you have heard this, but there are many new JW/DW members who have not. I saw an interview of an elderly gentleman who was a young officer in the Wermacht when Hitler sent troops into the Rhine valley in the late 1930s. He was instructed to turn back if the French army made a move to prevent the re-militarization of the Rhineland. He stated that they had no ammunition for their weapons. The French did nothing and Hitler was emboldened by his self-perceived brilliance.

As long as Europe does nothing, Muslims will be emboldened by their self-perceived strength. They will chip away until there is nothing left.

More xhocking British Dhimitued- this time quite unbelievable!

Police to brief Muslims before terror raids

POLICE have agreed to consult a panel of Muslim leaders before mounting counter-terrorist raids or arrests. Members of the panel will offer their assessment of whether information police have on a suspect is too flimsy and will also consider the consequences on community relations of a raid.
Members will be security vetted and will have to promise not to reveal any intelligence they are shown. They will not have to sign the Official Secrets Act.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2087-2372471,00.html

Steven L
i agree with that excellent post.

Furthemore, i would add that the perceived outrages against islam (Cartoons, Pope's quote. etc) are guite irrelevant.
Our very presence as infidels in the land of dar al harb is simply enough to warrnat murder and mayhem.
The 'percieved grievances' are more political that religious in Nature in that they act as catalysts to enbolden Muslims to perform their religious duties (from which they may have lapsed temporarily).
they also serve to send the western neo liberals into a whirpool of self hate, imperialist guilt etc,thus facilitating further inroads into western society.
However here in Australia, the effectiveness of this "spontaneous islamic rage' is showing signs of abatement. A must read article (creed of the sword) in the Australian yesterday by Marc Durie. got to the CORE of western ignorance about Islam and this is the first time i have seen such revelations in a western mainstream publication.
Robert has of course been exposing this for years and we have all been castigated for so doing. Now more amd more are understanding the horrific problems we face from Islam and it is that understanding which will ultimately put paid to our own self abasement and orgies of self blame.
Several years ago, i posted copies of Bat ye'or's 'islam and Dhimitued' to prominent journalist here and i was overjoyed to hear the cardinal pell had read it and passed it on to his staff. it is interesting to see that the level of Dhimitued is far lower here than in europe.

Next week:

BERLIN (Reuters) - European Commission President Jose Manuel Barroso was arrested early this morning for possession of drugs, after he made his inflammatory, controversial and racially motivated comments on Islam.

"I was high as a kite and tripping out of my skull that day, I have no idea what I was saying," Barroso was quoted as saying to the Welt am Sonntag newspaper.

"I take it all back, please don't kill me," the paper quoted him as saying in a preview of an article to appear on Sunday.

Why is this guy disappointed? The EU is full of PC, so it's to be expected. The sooner The EU disbands the better for all its people. This entity makes it all too easy to inject the invaders into Europe.

In line with Mike_W's post about Russia and how this is a time of talk, talk...

I recommend the following book:

"New Lies for Old"
by Anatoliy Golitsyn

'An ex-KGB officer warns how communist deception threatens the survival of the West.

Copyright 1984
Paperback published by Dodd, Mead & Company
New York

limes,

I think you're on to a very large part of the problem. The European nations decided en masse to use soft power (pensions, education, health care, job training) to solve all the world's problems. When a problem came along - as was certain to happen, ask any historian - which wasn't easily bent using the velvet restraints, they simply couldn't give up on decades of not thinking clearly. Some people are so self-assured, and the EU "brain" trust is certainly that, no facts will be allowed which might impact on The Cunning Plan (not cunning or much of a plan).

Furthermore, the other side of the Med was supposed to provide compliant little subjects for their grand experiment and labor for the many jobs they're simply too brilliant (and their children, of course) even for a moment to consider doing. That's why I get a very nasty feeling every time I hear "jobs Americans won't do." That signifies the slow destruction of a civilization. The Spartans had many jobs they wouldn't do, so they had helots do the jobs. The Helots eventually decided they didn't need the Spartans around very much.

SCV,

I found a review of "New Lies for Old"
by Anatoliy Golitsyn at,
http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1282/is_v36/ai_3423788

National Review, Sept 7, 1984 by Arnold Beichman

An interesting excerpt, 1984 review remember :

"Most startling is Golitsyn's prediction that is part of the Communist bloc's strategy for victory the following events will soon occur: a public Soviet-Chinese reconciliation; a "spectacular and impressive" liberalization in the Communist bloc with amnesty for dissidents, who would be invited to return; the freeing of Sakharov, more trade-union independence, adoption of constitutional amendments guaranteeing fulfillment of the Helsinki agreements, reduction in the role of Communist parties; a revival of controlled "democratization" on the Czech pattern for Eastern Europe, and even the return of Dubcek to power; demolition of the Berlin Wall--all of them in reality "cosmetic steps," says Golitsyn, because they have been handed down from on high."

A quick assessment of European conditions.

I think left leaning socialist Europeans, ex-communist Putin included, somehow had the illusion they could balance the Arab-Islamic interests with those of European demographic needs to continue financing their socialist pyramid scheme called the welfare state. This led to a kind of consensual dhimmitude on the surface, but always understood at bottom that they were still in control. What this latest episode with the Pope, and Danish cartoons before, and Paris riots before that, has shown this self assured and unconcerned European ruling class is that they were wrong. Islam, and in particular fundamentalist Sharia Islam, has gotten away from them. They no longer have control over it. Matter of fact, it is beginning to frighten them, as something monstrous they cannot understand. They're not integrating into society, have high unemployment, and may actually pull the welfare state down into bankruptcy! Still more threatening is their voting constituency is fed up, and ready to boot them out of office. Now they' re showing fear and waking up to the fact that their power base is threatened if they continue supporting Muslims requests, and Islamic migrations to the West. Pope Benedict woke them up, with a few choice words that led to global riots, death threats, killings of old nuns, burning of churches, and now the European elite are suddenly uncomfortable. Maybe they did not assess the situation rightly, and even they are now at risk when the voters turn out against them. Islamic barbarians are inside the gates. So this is a sea change, a real shift in the European wind. Notice how even the press is becoming emboldened to call Islamic Jihad what it really is, a threat to western civilization. This all happened suddenly. Australia's "Creed of the Sword" on JW [ http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/013262.php#comments ] is an excellent example of that sea change. Any wonder then that EU president, a Spaniard who was so quick to condemn all American efforts in the Mid East, and who pulled out troops when bombed in Madrid [they ran away in the face of the enemy, Castillian cowards], should suddenly find religion? Or is it just good common sense? If they want to hold their seats of power, they better pay attention to what Islam is doing. And the idiotic responses from Islamic leaders to the Pope's essentially benign words, same as their idiotic response to silly benign cartoons, is serving a very good purpose. They are revealing what they really are, ignorant primitives incapable of intelligent dialogue. They are incapable of holding their own under any kind of restraint, and certainly unable to debate the issues intelligently, so they riot. This serves well for Europe, and the West, to wake up to the threat. Putin should too. There is no truce of any kind with Arab Jihad fundamentalist Islam, any more than there was possible truce with Hitler's Nazism. Dhimmitude is now no longer in, it's out, and overnite comes a more positive stance against Islamic demands, that is in. Fascinating developments, all since the Pope spoke. Almost makes me want to believe in the 'hand of God', but I'm not that rash. Rather, this is just a wake up of intelligent men and women who realize that their earlier strategy of Islamic migrations containment, for their welfare state economic purposes, are not containable as hoped. They cannot finance their bankrupt welfare states with Islamic imports. It's too dangerous. So what happens now? Probably welfarism gets dismantled, as already evidenced in Sweden's last election, throughout Western Europe. As well, Arab-Islamic demands get contained, oil be damned. Force the issue. They need us more than we need them! We might even see Europeans begin sounding like Bush. Funny times we're in. What if Bin Laden is dead? Press the advantage.

Pope Benedict pushed exactly the right lever to move the EU to its senses. Nice job.

Posted by: Charles Martel [TypeKey Profile Page] at September 23, 2006 08:22 PM

Politicians say things for effect - to get others to do something - not to state the obvious or the truth....................the sooner people get used to the idea that politicians like lawyers live in a land of make-believe the more sane will be the world at large.

You cannot put sociopaths and psychopaths in positions of influence and authority and expect rationality

"Islam is Russia's fifth column in the West "

don't think so, otherwise they wouldn't be murdering chechens.

Fedup,

We'll see.
Pretty hard to maintain complete control over something as wild as Islam.
Bound to be some collateral damage playing with fire.

At least he acknowledged that:

"The problem is not the statements of the Pope but the reaction of the extremists..."

I was sick of the journalists and politicians who cenceitedly playing referee were ascribing guilt right and left equally and condemned the Pope for "inflammatory remarks" before condeming the Muslims for their stupid behavior.

At least he acknowledged that:

"The problem is not the statements of the Pope but the reaction of the extremists..."

I was sick of the journalists and politicians who playing referee were ascribing guilt right and left.

In their know-all multicultural conceit most of them began by condemning the Pope for "inflammatory remarks" before condeming the Muslims for their stupid behavior.

A battle of Tours - I agree with your assesment of european condition. But I can tell all of you what shall happened next. The european goverments in specific and EU as a whole will start to use heavy hand in keepeing "all the dogs in the cages". They shall try to prevet indvidual acts of leathal terror - for instance prevet bombs to go of, prevent assasination plots by jihadis, etc...

But they shall be also very quick to denounce and prevent any acts of organized defence and (on my opinion)also expresions of free speech in order to prevent our "constantlly offended friends" to feel provocked.

Trust me friends, we shall see the real rise of authoritarian state and mass media propaganda in Europe from now on.

The authoritarian state shall not be used to revert the effect of islamisation, but it shall be used to supress any attempt to resolve the situation in any possible way. They shall squeeze us both - the natives and the muslims.

THEY SHALL KEEP THE PROBLEM UNDER THE RUG WITH IRON FIST, AWAY FROM PUBLIC.

Trust me, I now what I have just written about. I have seen it happened. In a country that was once upon the time called Yugoslavia...

The point is that Europe after so many years of easy living is littered with policians of the Jimmy Carter ilk, when what it will soon require are Winston Churchills.
And journalists of the Walter Duranty ilk, when it needs more Oriana Fallacis.
But as Battle of tour points out things are beginning to change, that is certainly now quite noticeable.
And it's coming from the grass root citizens who are learning the truth about islam - they will be demanding politicians who will protect them and not feed them to the wolves.
Islam has now lost the battle for their hearts and minds and the Pope is to thank for much of that.

Well, Durão Barroso belongs to the centre-right spectrum of European politics. They know - just like the Right knows - the reality about Islam and about the utter failure of the leftist multiculturalist aproach to immigration. The problem was that due to the post-colonialist guilt that plagued most of Europe until not long ago, these politicians were powerless to act. Now they are slowly realising that the public opinion is shifting towards the defense of Western values and culture.

This does not surprise me one bit. In fact, I have even heard Socialists defending similar views in my country. The only people that remain blind are Communists and other leftist radicals.

While rats flee sinking ships, they will fight if cornered...

I just hope enough of the West feels cornered.

I was on a bus from Sophia to Rila, Bulgaria some years ago with two members of the EU Parliament. They were there with their attractive teenage "tour guides". The common language between them was English, so I could hear most of what they said. (Occasionally they switched to German which I don't know.) Their inane comments, said in a dignified manner befitting their position, made me lose hope in the EU doing anything worthwhile.

I have been a believer in European unity since I was a child, and I have not changed my mind. But when one looks at the dreadful crew that administers European institutions, rules European states, and runs much of the European press, all I can say is that it is a compliment to the Pope that they should criticize or ignore him. Who wants the support of a spineless gang of profiteers and ignoramuses?

Hi Paolo,

I'm reading La Fallaci's 'The Force of Reason' at the moment. Have her books reappeared on the best seller lists ? Also, is the average Joe in support of il papa ?

Cheers, Pasquale.

This is good to know. I've linked to you here: http://consul-at-arms.blogspot.com/2006/09/re-eu-commission-president.html

"where is the support from the EU leaders for the Pope?"

Bigger question is "where are the Catholics?".

The calling for the Popes head did not even wake up the Catholics.