It was interesting to her Robert introduced as 'an expert on Islamic affairs' rather than as a critic of Islam or something similar. The two Muslim women clearly wanted to keep the discussion confined to dress choices and there was disappontingly little talk about dealing with 'a fundamentally intolerant creed' which Robert said should be the real topic of debate. It seemed to be unclear whether he was using this description to apply to the whole of Islam or just to self-conscious jihadi, political Islam.The women also ignored Ayan Hersi's argument about the veil being a minor manifestation of the more general oppression of Muslim women in Europe (with the connivance of wetern politicians). It was, however, far more frank than most BBC discussions of this type about Islam and Douglas Murray being allowed to have the last word with his "give 'em the smack of firm government" approach, was encouraging.
wallyUK l quite agree with you on all your points. Both Robert and Ali could see the "whole picture", where as the two educated women could only see a partial if not a total denial of Robert's and Ali's whole concept of repression of women in muslim life.
l would of loved to hear Robert and or Ali directly debated those two women, but then they would be so much over the heads of those muslim women. l did send in a comment and said much of the same. l did say also perhaps these pious muslim women should spend some time in countries such as Saudi Arabia and ask then later which country/culture would they rather reside in? These muslim seem to want their cake and eat it to!
And the Muslims continue to refuse to assimilate both in the United States and Europe...they won't remove veils, they won't allow dogs and liquor in cabs...it's only going to get worse.
If it wasn't for the likes of Robert Spencer, we'd all be on the river without oars.
Off-Topic FYI: There is an ESPN special tomorrow morning (Sunday morning at 9:30am EST) on Pat Tillman called "Outside the Lines" which deals with his journey from the NFL to Afghanistan and tragic death. The preview showed fellow Rangers being interviewed who were there at the scene on the day he was killed. Maybe this will settle the issue of how he died once and for all. I hope so, but I also hope that it will be mainly a tribute to one Man's bravery, dedication, and service to his country, to all of us. Pat Tillman, American Hero, RIP.
That BBC is even airing such a frank discussion is IMHO a welcome sign. I too (like WallyUK) was happy to see Robert introduced as an 'expert in Islamic affairs' rather than merely as an Islamic critic. Hopefully, BBC will invite Robert Spencer for more future interviews.
Robert
You were BRILLIANT-congratulations to Ayaan Hirsi
Ali also.Was impressed to hear you introduced as'an Expert on Islamic Affairs'-which you are but Biased BBC usually bestow this accolade upon the likes of Karen Armstrong-who fortunately
seems to have vanished without trace together with her 'Islamic History.'WONDERFUL STUFF-you're certainly making an impact globally & predict we will see you again even on that British arm of Al Jazeera known as BBC.
thanks very much for telling us about this. having given up on the BBC after Beslan, i found it surprising and interesting.
it might have been livelier if everyone had been on line together, but it was very welcome anyway.
while i was trying to find out more about the forthright Douglas Murray, i found the following, which you may find interesting http://www.socialaffairsunit.org.uk/blog/archives/001176.php
It was interesting to her Robert introduced as 'an expert on Islamic affairs' rather than as a critic of Islam or something similar. The two Muslim women clearly wanted to keep the discussion confined to dress choices and there was disappontingly little talk about dealing with 'a fundamentally intolerant creed' which Robert said should be the real topic of debate. It seemed to be unclear whether he was using this description to apply to the whole of Islam or just to self-conscious jihadi, political Islam.The women also ignored Ayan Hersi's argument about the veil being a minor manifestation of the more general oppression of Muslim women in Europe (with the connivance of wetern politicians). It was, however, far more frank than most BBC discussions of this type about Islam and Douglas Murray being allowed to have the last word with his "give 'em the smack of firm government" approach, was encouraging.
wallyUK l quite agree with you on all your points. Both Robert and Ali could see the "whole picture", where as the two educated women could only see a partial if not a total denial of Robert's and Ali's whole concept of repression of women in muslim life.
l would of loved to hear Robert and or Ali directly debated those two women, but then they would be so much over the heads of those muslim women. l did send in a comment and said much of the same. l did say also perhaps these pious muslim women should spend some time in countries such as Saudi Arabia and ask then later which country/culture would they rather reside in? These muslim seem to want their cake and eat it to!
And the Muslims continue to refuse to assimilate both in the United States and Europe...they won't remove veils, they won't allow dogs and liquor in cabs...it's only going to get worse.
If it wasn't for the likes of Robert Spencer, we'd all be on the river without oars.
Off-Topic FYI: There is an ESPN special tomorrow morning (Sunday morning at 9:30am EST) on Pat Tillman called "Outside the Lines" which deals with his journey from the NFL to Afghanistan and tragic death. The preview showed fellow Rangers being interviewed who were there at the scene on the day he was killed. Maybe this will settle the issue of how he died once and for all. I hope so, but I also hope that it will be mainly a tribute to one Man's bravery, dedication, and service to his country, to all of us. Pat Tillman, American Hero, RIP.
Introducting Robert as an expert on Islam is very good.
There are a couple of cuts in what I'm hearing but that was a very strong message to go out on the BBC.
Robert Spencer's interview for Shire Network News will be going out later today (Sunday).
Brian
That BBC is even airing such a frank discussion is IMHO a welcome sign. I too (like WallyUK) was happy to see Robert introduced as an 'expert in Islamic affairs' rather than merely as an Islamic critic. Hopefully, BBC will invite Robert Spencer for more future interviews.
Robert
You were BRILLIANT-congratulations to Ayaan Hirsi
Ali also.Was impressed to hear you introduced as'an Expert on Islamic Affairs'-which you are but Biased BBC usually bestow this accolade upon the likes of Karen Armstrong-who fortunately
seems to have vanished without trace together with her 'Islamic History.'WONDERFUL STUFF-you're certainly making an impact globally & predict we will see you again even on that British arm of Al Jazeera known as BBC.
thanks very much for telling us about this. having given up on the BBC after Beslan, i found it surprising and interesting.
it might have been livelier if everyone had been on line together, but it was very welcome anyway.
while i was trying to find out more about the forthright Douglas Murray, i found the following, which you may find interesting
http://www.socialaffairsunit.org.uk/blog/archives/001176.php
congrats on getting onto the bbc of all places perhaps there is hope after all.
God bless Robert for his very excellent work and this appearance on the BBC is very surprising.
I sense that the unveiling of Islam's intentions for the world and the west is making great strides as of late.
We are reaching a critical threshold! The truth is getting out.