A bleak prognosis from Paul Belien in The Brussels Journal, with thanks to Mackie:
The German author Henryk M. Broder recently told the Dutch newspaper De Volkskrant (12 October) that young Europeans who love freedom, better emigrate. Europe as we know it will no longer exist 20 years from now. Whilst sitting on a terrace in Berlin, Broder pointed to the other customers and the passers-by and said melancholically: “We are watching the world of yesterday.”Europe is turning Muslim. As Broder is sixty years old he is not going to emigrate himself. “I am too old,” he said. However, he urged young people to get out and “move to Australia or New Zealand. That is the only option they have if they want to avoid the plagues that will turn the old continent uninhabitable.”
Many Germans and Dutch, apparently, did not wait for Broder’s advice. The number of emigrants leaving the Netherlands and Germany has already surpassed the number of immigrants moving in. One does not have to be prophetic to predict, like Henryk Broder, that Europe is becoming Islamic. Just consider the demographics. The number of Muslims in contemporary Europe is estimated to be 50 million. It is expected to double in twenty years. By 2025, one third of all European children will be born to Muslim families. Today Mohammed is already the most popular name for new-born boys in Brussels, Amsterdam, Rotterdam, and other major European cities.
Broder is convinced that the Europeans are not willing to oppose islamization. “The dominant ethos,” he told De Volkskrant, “is perfectly voiced by the stupid blonde woman author with whom I recently debated. She said that it is sometimes better to let yourself be raped than to risk serious injuries while resisting. She said it is sometimes better to avoid fighting than run the risk of death.”
In a recent op-ed piece in the Brussels newspaper De Standaard (23 October) the Dutch (gay and self-declared “humanist”) author Oscar Van den Boogaard refers to Broder’s interview. Van den Boogaard says that to him coping with the islamization of Europe is like “a process of mourning.” He is overwhelmed by a “feeling of sadness.” “I am not a warrior,” he says, “but who is? I have never learned to fight for my freedom. I was only good at enjoying it.”
Aye, there's the rub.
Read it all, and don't miss the links.
Broder is as bad as the bloody Muslims, just one more quack predicting the future without a genuine crystal ball.
We should consider all possible explanations, and develop a way to counter them all.
(1) Political Correctness
(2) Self hate
(3) Domestic corporate entities giving legal money in a variety of ways, campaigns, post govt employment, employing family members, book deals, etc.
(4) Foreign interests giving legal money
(5) domestic entities giving illegal money in off shore bank accounts
(6) foreign entities the same
What else is there?
In the US, the NSA can't report information it gets on illegal activities by members of Congress.Nor has it reported on illegal activity of EU politicians, including bribe taking.
Should there be a change in this law? Does there need to be a flow of funds analysis on politicians personal spending?
Nostradamus predicted a dark future for Europe as well (with references of possible nuclear conflict over there). Was this man 'the man who saw tomorrow'? Or, was he just another "quack"??
Only time will tell.
Lets add some additional reasons
(7) Myopia, belief future is same as present.
(8) Inability to work with forecasts
(9) Lack of acceptance of mathematical projections of any kind.
(10) Inability to act in face of future scenarios, even when risk is shown
(11) Can only understand certainty. Anything uncertain is considered of zero importance.
(12) Media and Politicians create above by their actions.
(13) Academia does the same.
(14) Mass communications transmit emotional ideas at variance with fact or math.
(15) Those behind mass communications have one or more of the other problems.
(16) Self hate from WWII, Holocaust, lies, etc.
Its also not just Europe. The West gives money and aid to feed the population bubble in the third world without thought of the future consequences.
Many don't have children and either don't care or are even glad. This includes many people who are healthy and otherwise normal.
Unpleasant Immigration Arithmetic as an example of lack of numeracy in policy analysis.
Suppose US population is stable at 300 million. People live 75 years, so 4 million die per year. Assume immigration of 2 million per year. By stability, this implies 2 million births.
So births/deaths is 2/4 or 1/2. So the genetic survival ratio is 1/2 per generation. Taking a generation at 25 years, this means in 75 years, one has 1/8.
This applies to each year's cohort of immigrants, not just those there. UIA implies a genetic graveyard effect, genes come here to die. This is true for any level of immigration not balanced by an outflow. An outflow wouldn't work in today's situation because of the exterior population bubble and adverse conditions.
"unpleasant immigration arithmetic search"
FROM THE ABOVE STORY:
“The dominant ethos,” he told De Volkskrant, “is perfectly voiced by the stupid blonde woman author with whom I recently debated. She said that it is sometimes better to let yourself be raped than to risk serious injuries while resisting. She said it is sometimes better to avoid fighting than run the risk of death.”
“I am not a warrior,” he says, “but who is? I have never learned to fight for my freedom. I was only good at enjoying it."
------------------------------------------
THIS IS THE WORLD WE LIVE IN. THIS IS WHERE MOST PEOPLE ARE AT. We are not the first generation of cowards--we just need the right vision adjustment to realize we can arise too. You do realize that there are things to fear that are far worse that death (hmmm).
I thought this was well portrayed in Braveheart (hey I know Gibson has acted like an idiot, OK?)when any one with any property would sell out to the lords/tyrants rather than fight. After Wallace was tortured to death at the stake, a few "got the picture" and helped more people to get it too. They stood together and fought for their freedom
The "immigration/infestation" of Islam which stands to take over by pacifist attrition/capitulation the western countries has not been on most of our radar screens till recently. For most of the west, it is still a big super bowl party or world cup -- who has time to worry about such things as jihad?
One painful but true observation we can make from the daily atrocities of the islamists brought to light by this site--is that it gives us a wake up call to sound the alarm. Robert gets it. Do we?
Don't give up on the west yet--we don't always wake up quickly, but when aroused we can get serious.
That's 50 million out of 730 million (Russia has obviously been included as well as Albania, Bosnia and Kosova) which works out at 7%. Isn't it getting a bit defeatist to say: 'there went the neighbourhood' when 93% of the population is not Mohammedan?
These guys really have no balls. Don't give up, Europe, I want to take my children to see Donatello's "Gay" David, British castles, and go to Finland, where my family is originally from. This is garbage. Keep strong, men! You WILL defeat the jihadis, if you just hang in there, and never give up, boys.
On second thought, maybe the governments will see their people leaving, and think, "maybe we have a chance in this", and then start try to ship out the hardliners, the ones that refuse to integrate.
WallyUK,
You see any reason to think people in Europe and the UK are going to defend their culture? The majority has been cowed into submission by their governments and the EU. Submitting to Islam is just part of the overall multicult experience. Enjoy. We'll join you in a hundred years, if not sooner.
All wars are wars of attrition and will. Islam's numbers are growing exponentially in Europe and native Europeans, for the most part, have no will. And if they do, the government brings the full weight of the law down to beat it out of them.
...Whcih would cause civil war, but whatever. It would expose them as violent. Wouldn't it?
We see them here in Thailand all the time now. They look vaguely shell shocked, these Europeans. They come here with what wealth they have and open restaurants, try to start businesses or find something to do. Countries like ours that need foreign investment tolerate them. For now. At some point when we don’t need them any more they will be made to move on. But to where? They should settle in places like Australia or New Zealand where they can better fit in than in Asia. These people are the new Jews of the 21st century. The funny thing is when you ask them why they moved here they never mention they are displaced, they always talk about high taxes, too many rules, or something vague, they don’t even seem able to say why they don’t want to stay in their homes anymore. It is sad but we don’t want our blood polluted by their weak genes.
The jury’s out on Europe. But here’s a prediction:
1. Immigration will continue, a percentage of which will be Muslim. The overall financial impact of immigration will be negative. The Muslim immigrants will constitute a disproportional percentage of the costs associated with immigration.
2. Democratically elected governments will vote to increase government revenue to meet the new needs through higher taxes. As it is easy to hide assets, the new taxes will be disproportionately levied on business owners, who are mobile.
3. At some point (years, not decades after the new taxes are imposed) European state revenues will go down instead of up as different countries throughout the world welcome the jobs, wealth, and know-how that the tax-fleeing European emigrants offer. Most of the emigration will be to South, Central, and North America. Some will go to Australia and New Zealand. Others to Eastern Europe. Maybe even Thailand.
4. The welfare states will face failure. PC will be seen for what it is. A leader will be identified, not necessarily by popular vote. The marginally productive, guilt-ridden European elites will leave.
5. Europe will be re-borne in a less than PC manner. It will not be the friendly, giving place than it is today. The 2006 calculations of a majority Muslim Europe will be the basis of some sort of State holiday. People may become familiar with terms like Roentgen, RAD, and REM.
6. Feel-good food aid to societies which are not self-sufficient will dry up. The 3rd world will face a humanitarian crisis with no sustainable answers.
Or there could be a voter revolt. But the clock ticks, the centrifuges turn, and the humanitarian aid grows.
History has a way of fooling prognosticators (I can use Hugh sized words) I am not giving up on Europe yet.
Many of the above comments are underestimating the demographic problem of Europe. Europeans have a very low birth rate (below replacement); the Muslim immigrants have very high birth rates and have children at a younger age. Although France is only 10% Muslim, its population under age 25 it is 30% Muslim and in the cities perhaps 45%.
Mark Steyn has a very good new book on this topic. Read the reviews and perhaps the book.
http://www.amazon.com/America-Alone-End-World-Know/dp/0895260786/sr=1-1/qid=1162264892/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/103-6065151-3763811?ie=UTF8&s=books
Papa Bear, when the population can no longer support them the muslims will eat their own young. I would call it a “feeding frenzy” but that would be an insult to sharks. The only thing muslims have ever excelled at is killing other muslims. They will thin each other out.
Another amusing statistic is that global warming may eventually shrink the world's economy by 20%. Lovelock, the Gaia man, predicts that by the end of the century Brits may well end up growing food in parks and city squares, as at the height of the First World War. These Muslims crow about their swelling populations right now but a few disastrous droughts, dried up rivers, dust bowls, destructive coastal storms and floodings may wipe the smile from their faces. The main problem that more northerly countries will have is putting in some really serious immigration controls to keep them out as they learn a few lessons about the theories of the Reverent Malthus. Also, if resources start to become scarce, the Muslim population in Europe has hermetically sealed itself off from the rest of the population, and irritated most people, to such an extent, that few people would stand up for them if it came to a 'balloon debate.'(Such debates have been known to occur in situations of extreme economic dislocation e.g expulsion of the Ghanaians from Nigeria in 1982).
See:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4385768.stm
The contents of that web page cannot be completely trusted as they are at serious variance with national censuses and it may be better to trust:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslims_in_Western_Europe
but bear in mind that it's wikipedia with everything that that means.
The PDF at:
http://users.fmg.uva.nl/jrath/downloads/@RSF%20European%20Research%20on%20Islam%20and%20Muslims.pdf
may be more trustworthy and accurate but it was published in 2002 and so the research and figures are likely to be older than that.
It may also be useful to read:
http://euro-islam.info/
but I would take it with a pinch of salt because, although it seems balanced, something, and I know not what, tells me that this is a group that has sold out, that is totally dhimmi. I may be wrong but...!
I hope that these sites help the debate.
Dominic.
"EU has limits in respecting Muslim traditions," says Frattini on October 9, 2006
The vice-president of the European Commission Franco Frattini has said "Europe can only respect Muslim traditions if they do not contradict the bloc's own basic values, such as freedom of speech or equality between men and women."
"We are not governed by sharia, after all," he said in an interview with the Italian daily La Repubblica published on Monday
This from:
http://euro-islam.info/pages/news.html#TOP
Dominic.
Broder is convinced that the Europeans are not willing to oppose islamization. “The dominant ethos,” he told De Volkskrant, “is perfectly voiced by the stupid blonde woman author with whom I recently debated. She said that it is sometimes better to let yourself be raped than to risk serious injuries while resisting. She said it is sometimes better to avoid fighting than run the risk of death.”
She DOES sound stupid. She's asking for more rapists.. GIVE ME LIBERTY OR GIVE ME DEATH!!! i live in NYC and I've had my share of run-ins with various scum - scum that like to outnumber their victim.. they HATE one-on-one.. but because I showed readiness to fight [cursing them loudly in German is a real good one to get them to scurry off, by the way]. I've even faked possession of a handgun when I needed to. That was a day after the Bernie Goetz incident in 1984. They asked do i have a gun when i suck my hand in my pocket and i told them to make their move and they'll find out.. four punks were dragged off by two girls who wanted no trouble.. and i was alone. I was ready to die for sure, but I knew I'd at least kill one of them no matter what. My determination is what saved me unscathed.
Yeah Europe has been doomed for a long time now. This is actually old news. Just look at France. And things are only going to get worse in Europe.
wallyUK/
Hate to correct you but it was in WWII that we had to grow food in parks and city squares. In WWI we still had mastery of the high seas and imported all that we needed over and above that which we grew for ourselves. Even in WWII we only had a shortfall of about ten to fifteen percent in terms of growing at home over what was needed to feed us all plus the troops from the Commonwealth, the Empire, the Free French, the Poles, the Netherlands, Belgium and the USA, to name just a few.
Records show that if we hadn't had to feed all the others we would have managed to feed ourselves with ease. However, if we hadn't got all the others then we would never have won, would we?
Dominic.
Henryk Broder is a well-known author in Germany. He is german Jew and he is a prolific writer and commentator. I think what he is doing is sounding the alarm. Let's not knock him for that. This guy used to be a BIG LIBERAL who wrote in the "feulletons" of "die Zeit" and of course "Zeit Magazin".. both are famously "Liberale Postillen".
I am glad mr. Broder is sounding he alarm. If a BIG LIBERAL like he is speaking up then the rest of the pigheads caqn't simply ignore him. He is no fool and he is widely respected. Of course leave it to the German jews to bail us out :-) LOL.. Bail us out of political correctness..
Broder is as bad as the bloody Muslims, just one more quack predicting the future without a genuine crystal ball.
Posted by: Mert
I am not going to debate that one Mert. But if a dyed-in-the-wool Liberal like Mr. Broder sounds the alarm.. other libs will have to at least reconsider their own positions.
We already know about islam.. but the libs are afraid to speak out.. for fear of being ONE OF US!! Ugly yahoo conservatives or whatnot. In my eyes there is simply NO OThER CHOICE.
so be glad if Mr. Broder sounds the alarm. He is speaking to the liberals in a way that is designed to make them "get it". Your rhetoric and mine tends to turn liberals off.. :-) They need to be brought into the fold gently at first.. and Mr. Broder just made a HUGE step! He is an old man and he is wise. He knows what he is doing and I am glad he's joining our side. Better him than [ex SS-officer] Günther Grass]
Van den Boogaard says that to him coping with the islamization of Europe is like “a process of mourning.” He is overwhelmed by a “feeling of sadness.” “I am not a warrior,” he says, “but who is? I have never learned to fight for my freedom. I was only good at enjoying it.”
Maybe we SHOULD have gays in the Military after all. They should share the burden for one.. and I see no reason they can't fight. I have no proof but a gay man once told me that Hannibal was gay.. who knows.. but I am sure a good number of gays can fight if they have to. And they are beginning to see they have a REASON~~~~!!!!!
"Secularists, it seems to me, are also less keen on fighting. Since they do not believe in an afterlife, this life is the only thing they have to lose. Hence they will rather accept submission than fight.
People who are not prepared to resist and are eager to submit, hate others who do not want to submit and are prepared to fight. They hate them because they are afraid that the latter will endanger their lives as well. In their view everyone must submit.
This is why they have come to hate Israel and America so much..."
--excerpts from the above article in its entirety
A lightbulb went off in my head as I read this: I wonder if this is actually the reason we hear so much cognitive disconnect out of the leftist media and academic classes in the US regarding the Islamist problem?
We have been living in a long and drawn out version of the Weimar Republic since the Second World War. Yet there are still signs of life. When the crisis point is eventually breached there will be trouble in Europe, and there will be dangerous and violent uprisings before we face obliteration.
I think the tide is slowly turning against Islam. More voices, even in the press, are beginning to speak out and those voices are getting gradually louder. There has even been admission from the UK government that Multiculturalism is failing - someting I never thought I would hear being said.
I hope these voices begin to drown out the retarded and suicidal elements of the 'progressive' left who could largely do with a good dose of dhimmitude to wake them up to reality. Of course, such commentators usually live far from the reality of the ever expanding Islamic slums and the hate hives of their radical Mosques.
This story... saddens me. It is neccesary for those of us with an ounce of sanity left to fight political correctness any way we can. Maybe Australia will be the next British Isle during W.W.III.
____________________________________
People who are not prepared to resist and are eager to submit, hate others who do not want to submit and are prepared to fight. They hate them because they are afraid that the latter will endanger their lives as well. In their view everyone must submit.
This is why they have come to hate Israel and America so much..."
--excerpts from the above article in its entirety
A lightbulb went off in my head as I read this: I wonder if this is actually the reason we hear so much cognitive disconnect out of the leftist media and academic classes in the US regarding the Islamist problem?
____________________
I would agree with the above post as well. Better to live in slavery than to die in freedom heh? I think pinned it exactly.
I for one.. will die in freedom rather than live in slavery.
Peace.
I don't know where people are getting the figures of 50 million Muslims in Europe. The numbers are around 20 million, with the majority in France (around 5 million), Germany (2-3 million), the UK (2 million) and the Netherlands (1 million). These numbers add up to 11 million at the most. Spain and Italy each have Muslim populations of less than 1 million.
Assuming a population of 20 million Muslims, they would have to double their numbers and then double them again to even reach 80 million - can people really breed that fast? I don't think so.
Now, as for native Europeans - the present population of the EU is about 400 million. Assuming that about 90-92% of this population is of indigenous white European stock, their numbers would stand at around 360-375 million, with the remainder being immigrants of other backgrounds such as Chinese, Vietnamese and sub-Saharan African.
Now, onto the Baby Boomer phenomenon. The largest chunk of the indigenous European population consists of people born between 1948 and 1963 - the Baby Boomer years. The fact that many of these people are not being fully replaced by a younger population is contributing to Europe's ageing demographic profile. Muslims as a percentage of the population will grow by default when the Baby Boomers start to die out - starting from around 2023 if we assume an average lifespan of 75 years.
However even if the indigenous population, through a combination of emigration and negative growth rates, was to halve itself, and Muslims were to maintain their artificially high birthrates and double their population (both unlikely), the population would still stand at about 180 million native Europeans (within the EU, not counting Europeans outside it) and 40 million Muslims - a ratio of more than 4 to 1. And don't forget that the successors of the Baby Boomers will likely consist of a younger and more balanced population.
Naturally, a 4-to-1 ratio is likely to cause tensions and alter Europe's politics, but this all continues to assume that native European birth rates will remain low. Things change and history shows that trends don't carry on far into the future.
Let's not forget either that the UK has a more stable and younger population among its white majority than many European countries. It also has a relatively high birthrate. White French people are also increasing their birthrate.
Immigration is not a strong factor here, as most European states have zero immigration policies - the numbers appear high because the departure of so many emigrants allows more immigrants to enter. The solution then is to address the concerns of the people who want to leave.
The upshot of all this is that Muslims will not be a majority in Europe this century, if ever. Lazy extrapolation from current trends (drawing a straight line into the future without considering any external factors) doesn't provide a very accurate picture.
Also, Muslims are not a solid bloc - Turks, Tunisians, Moroccans, Iranians and Pakistanis all have their differences. They are hardly united, even under pressure. The Islamists in France are generally Algerian, with some Tunisians thrown in. In Holland, there is a deep schism between Turks and Moroccans, with Turks generally being more secular and better integrated.
Muslim Europe all sounds very alarming, but the facts don't really bear it out. Europe will survive... if it survives beyond this century, it will be because they grew a pair somewhere along the line.
All wars are wars of attrition and will. Islam's numbers are growing exponentially in Europe and native Europeans, for the most part, have no will. And if they do, the government brings the full weight of the law down to beat it out of them.
Posted by: Beagle
Beagle.. You've sounded the Bugle! Our Euro-governments put people like Oriana Falacci and Brigitte Bardot - who is a European ICON like Marilyn in the US - on trial for laws against "islamophobia".
Even in Pre-war England Mr. Winston Churchilll was at Liberty to speak out.
Hate to correct you but it was in WWII that we had to grow food in parks and city squares. In WWI we still had mastery of the high seas and imported all that we needed over and above that which we grew for ourselves.
Dominic..
My grandmother told me they grew their own food in Germany as well during WW2.. raised chickens in their back yards..
So when the war comes agains pislam at leats WE can feed ourselves.. they need US for food :-)
Holy Wart; Its late. But I’d argue that the Battle for Europe’s future is based on finances. Europe has wired its jaw open with social benefit programs for immigrants. Going from a population of 3% to 25% , or even 6% is financially unrealistic, given the current problems. The people who are supposed to foot the bill are the guys who make the Continent work. And they can leave.
My great, great grandparents left Europe for opportunity. Many of the incoming will have left to avoid paying an unsustainable social safety net. And why should they?
I wish Europe all the best.
We were down to about 6 weks food supply at the beginning of 1917 - unrestricted submarine warfare and the late adoption of the convoy sydtem got us into a rather parlous state.
My great, great grandparents left Europe for opportunity. Many of the incoming will have left to avoid paying an unsustainable social safety net. And why should they?
I wish Europe all the best.
Posted by: limes
I disagree.. We may have **LEFT** Europe.. but IT IS FUC*ING ****OURS****!!!
No FUC*ING WANY am I going to see the filtfhy flag of pislam fly over Berlin.. Or Paris [even if the French want to fight me on that - joke] .. or Lisbon NOR WARZAWA Polski!! We STAND UNITED NOW!!!!
WArZAWA is just as dear to me as BERLIN or PARIS!
Should one of us/ours fall so shall we all! London, Rome and Bukarest... and all of those I here left out, You know who you are.. we NEED YOU!! We need one another.. this is a war that wil unite ALL Europeans as FREE Men and Women - respectful of the rights and interests of our neighbors. The moosleems are merely serving to UNITE US!!!
They better leave before they have to WATCH OUT!
GermaninAmerica; I am too, at least in part. The good guys will win and the latest interloper is just taking up space. The process takes time. With Fatherland regards;
This was posted on another thread yesterday. This thread is related. If there are Euros left who are willing to follow the Ukrainian model...
" Here are two solutions:
(1) Europe needs a Robespierre again to decapitate the elites ...figuratively of course, providing they go peacefully; otherwise...get rid of them. And after he is done with that, he can go on and liberate the media from its leftist masters.
(2) The Islamists love sharia law. Give them a good dose of it to enjoy at the receiving end. Give all Muslims in Western countries dhimmi status and make them pay a very larger jizza tax, one that is progressively higher the bigger the family. Make them "feel subdued" in the language of the hadith. Impose all the dhimmi rules on them. Make them want out! But unlike the fate of the dhimmi in Muslim countries, give them a way out. A one-way slow boat back to the desert and never be allowed to return..."
Americans face a similar problem with respect to our leadership. As in Europe, we see that the leadership and our foreign ministries are in the hands of the enemy, either through ignorance, stupidity, or as outright traitors.
This points increasingly towards the need for revolutionary removal of existing governments and installation of governments responsive to the people. The Ukranians set a great recent example, and the Poles and Hungarians before that. It does not have to be bloody. Such revolutions would be far easier to implement in Europe, country by country, first dumping the elites, then the EU, and then implementing "reverse-dhimmi laws" on the Muzzys as described above. Doing this in America will be far more difficult. However, if the European peoples were to launch into it, it would help wake up America - right now America is 95% asleep on the Islamic crisis, and no one in authority is alerting the country to the danger. Au contraire, we have George, Condi, and Karen in some never-never land, and there is no hope of a change for 2 years, unless there were a bloody revolution, and that is not in the cards, unless the Muzzys do something really stupid "in the cause of Allah".
Re my previous post above. The idea of solution #2 is well understood by readers on this site. However, the average Euro and the average American have probably never never heard of the word "Dhimmi" and have no idea what it means.
This might be an appropriate action theme, i.e., to inform the average Euro and American that when the Muzzies come to full power, the Euros and the Americans will become dhimmis (those still alive). Inform them what that means to their way of life; it is a lot worse than any of them presently visualize...if they visualize it at all.
If they fully understand what dhimmification means, they might be motivated to get into a fighting mode. And they might like the idea of turning the tables on the Muzzies with "reverse dhimmification". It is an educational process that should be started ASAP.
Bat Yo'er has done yeoman service defining the dhimmi history, and she or maybe others could likely come up with a great little summary pamphlet that could get wide circulation through underground printing presses.
Pamphlets were a major foundation of the American Revolution. They could be again in a new Euro revolution, throwing off the elites, the EU and the Muzzys, step by step.
What I'm truly afraid of is that at some point the general European population might become aware of the Islamic transformatiom too late. When nationalistic groups and militias come into existence, wishing to "purge" the continent of muslims. Hence a prolonged leftist political landscape, in love with multicultural ethics, will eventually lead to events comparable to the Balkans. By changing immigration politics from Islamic countries we can prevent such a horrible scenario to take place.
And still europians are most eager to imprison Ratko Mladic and alike. In Sunday, I watch again best movie ever made in Serbia, Battle of Kosovo (from 1989). Although poorly conducted and with miserable budget, story was quite right. In it, it was a stricking dialog between Muslim emperor Murat and his son Bayazid in the eve of the battle.
Bayazid: I was something thinking, my father. There are christians (vasals i.e. dhimmis) in our army. We are engaging other christians. How can we trust this ones. On the other words, if they betrayed theirs, wouldnt they betray us.
Murat: Somethimes is easyest but not wise to kill the defeated king. Because the highiet thing king have is his crown. So for that crown, he will gave everything: cheek, honor, land, people. Even his head is less precious than a crown. So for that, in their lands (he meant on the christian lands already occupied by Turks), they defend rights of the muslims even better than we would do. If you like to divide the christians (in movie he said serbs but right now its much more common), rely only on christians. They will do yor work better than you. Dont forget what was Ali said to us.
Bayazid: Yes, he said: torture the kaffirs wherewer you can. He also said : Its better for you to persecute them with the swords in their homes, than with spoons in your arms wait for them in your homes.
I was little boy when I watsh this movie, back than in 1989, when we commemorate 600 years of battle. But now, I know who is Ali, and I know islam. Only things in this last almost 20 years got from bad to worst.
An update for previos story (cos in many other events in my life I remember true words with grate delay):
At the end of the battle Murat dyes cos he was sttabed by grattest hero Milosh Obilich who pretend that he surrender, but actualy just want to came close in Murat vicinity willingly sacrificing his own life (maybe he knows for muhammad saying: war is deception; so he use their weapon against muslims).Anyway, dying Murat as last legacy said this to his son Bayazid:
See my son this field. There is a monastery of Grachanica (listed now as unesco property), and after that is pech patriarhat. And after that are churches in Venice, Wiena and Rome. And after them churches of France and England. Wherewer you heard the church bell, to there you must shoot a muslim arrow.
And then this jihadist dyes.
"You see any reason to think people in Europe and the UK are going to defend their culture? The majority has been cowed into submission by their governments and the EU. Submitting to Islam is just part of the overall multicult experience"
I would vigorously deny that "the majority has been cowed into submission by their governments and the EU". It is not the impression I get as one living in Europe, at least in the UK. I think you are mistaking the sensation-seeking of the media, which deliberately pick on unusual incidents (e.g. the veils business), for what the majority think. You wouldn't get a story like, for example, "More Europeans reading Jihad Watch".
svemirko you are right the self righteous europeans want to put mladic, whom i consider a hero in jail. Why? I think most europeans especially germans and dutch like to think they are better than others but are cowards. So they want to be heros by talking tough by saying lets go after these evil serbs. This way their muslim neighbors who they are scared shitless of won't get mad and at the same time satisfy their cultural marxist elite. I guess I should be fair the average north american is no better but it seems this kind of behaviour is the norm for the northern europeans.
Over on Harry's Place there is an example of what is wrong with the UK and Europe.
Look at the http://hurryupharry.bloghouse.net/ and the flag burning story.
Look at who is proposing this law, Assistant Commissioner of the Metropolitan Police, Tarique Ghaffur, who happens to be a Muslim. This law is designed I am sure, to rein in the extremists who happen to be waking up the general population, it is when people like Tarique Ghaffur are setting policy that shows we have already lost. Those on the left might say that flag burning etc. is part of freedom of speech and I would agree with them, but they would refuse to question the motives of people such as Tarique Ghaffur and of course they will call me a racist for even doing so. If one mentions the Project they tell you it is the same as the blood libel created in Russia to attack the Jews. Yes, well it was found in the house of a Muslim Brotherhood leader and is a policy document, Tarique Ghaffur is of course in the exact position that the MB wanted.
Europe is lost because of the above, the only why for Europe to survive is for the people to rise up, but they won't, can't, they will fight when they get attacked, but it will be too damn late.
I think most europeans especially germans and dutch like to think they are better than others but are cowards.
By pissedoffcanadian
Just to add to Your good observation. I still remember that during the war Mladic said that he would like to see germans coming again to balkans to settle the old scores with them (so far i know his father was killed by croatian nazists in ww2), and I can bet that was one of major reasons germans dislike him (not to mention notorious german inclination toward muslims and vice versa cos common antijewish sentiments). By my personal opinion his doom was (unfortenatly) hollow belife that althogether with his companions he protect christian europe where there are no christian europe any more, but rather neomarxist islamloving europe. He didnt realise (as many other with him) that Europe long ago stop to be a vision or way of thinking, but rather became just a geographic term.
The posters at Brussels Journal give me a headache. They embody all the worst stereotypes about Americans. "Yee haw, let's stockpile guns and kill all the ragheads, in the name of Jesus Christ!"
A lot of those whackjobs are just eager to replace fundamental Islam with fundamental Christianity and then act out all their ethnic cleansing fantasies.
What is happening in the UK with regard to Mohametan immigration provided me with a very good reason for leaving England and moving to Spain. Though there are always immigrants coming in to rural Andalucía they are only ever regarded as temporary - where I live, anyway - and nothing is changed to suit.
... when the population can no longer support them the muslims will eat their own young.
Not so fast. When the Moslems awake to the fact that complete demographic obliteration of Eurabian dhimmis is at hand, and that Moslems are faced with the spectre of getting real jobs, they will strip from the caucasians their "rights" to the Pill and to abortion.
Also, if a fiscal crisis looms, look for the Moslems to even reduce the Jizyah tax they had been imposed years before. By years before, I project around 2025 - 2030. And I mean a real Jizyah, not the wealth transfers "normal" to Marxist governments.
By that time, the financial burden on white people in Europe will have resulted in a still lower caucasian birth rates, depressed levels of capital investment, and falling productivity.
So, by about 2035 - 2040 the crackdown on abortion and the Pill will ensue, and the onset of the imposition of full-on Sharia will have begun.
This is the takeover cycle. As with the economic sea change that started on Oct. 17 1917, this new massive shift of wealth and power will be complicated and will take decades to effectuate.
China will be on the sidelines, their narrow minds finally alert to the grave threat to their bombastic dreams of hegemonic domination.
Jimmy Bones comments give us a direction, but its too big a step. A first step is they have to obey the same laws, and we eliminate welfare and tax avoidance, etc.
Just stopping welfare, asylum, free ER's, immigration, family reunification, H1B and Skil Bill, unlimited H1B for universities, reduced tuition to illegals, etc.
Nancy Pelosi has vineyards in California that illegals work and she voted against requiring employers to pay their hospital costs. This was in frontpagemag.com yesterday.
“Pelosi’s Stake in Illegal Immigration “
By Joseph Klein
FrontPageMagazine.com | October 30, 2006
"I certainly hope young Europeans don't flee. These are the people who MUST fight the battle to save Europe
"
I am afraid we are - I made a move from UK to Spain and am in the process of moving across the pond - I would fight but how many more?
"I don't know where people are getting the figures of 50 million Muslims in Europe. The numbers are around 20 million, with the majority in France (around 5 million), Germany (2-3 million), the UK (2 million) and the Netherlands (1 million). These numbers add up to 11 million at the most. Spain and Italy each have Muslim populations of less than 1 million."
It depends on what you call Europe. Bosnia is over 40% Muslim, Bulgaria 15% Muslim, Albania 70% Muslim, Russia almost 20% Muslim (and probably 80% of its population lives West of the Urals), and there is a city in the South Eastern corner of Europe called Istanbul, alongside Ediirne in the Turkish enclave with around 10 million Muslims on the European side of the Bosphorous (plus 4 million on the other side) - and only as recently as 1914 Istanbul was 50% Muslim - now it is 99% Muslim. If that is your definition of Europe, then there will be 50 million Muslims in Europe. In Western Europe it is over 20 million.
YOUNG EUROPEANS!!
Don't even consider emmigrating to the ANZAC LANDS. We refuse to accept dross like you. Stand and fight for your own people and your own countries.
You won't like our Internment Camps nor our Work Camps! This is a bloody big country. There's loads of hard work to do. All of it in hot, dry, dusty badlands...
Uh... what the hell?
"A lot of those whackjobs are just eager to replace fundamental Islam with fundamental Christianity and then act out all their ethnic cleansing fantasies."
If anyone actually starts killing in the name of Jesus, they will do so with absolutely no authority from new testament sources. The Crusades and Inquisitions have been throroughly repudiated by every mainstream branch of Christianity.
A reactionary and unstudied siezure of Jesus' name, in order to unify an armed struggle against Islamization, would simply prove the massive void of identity and conviction left by aggressive secularism.
Posted by: Holy Wart at October 31, 2006 12:25 AM
---------
have you taken into account if turkey join the eu?in 2010
would be interested in your analysis.
I truly hope a couple of things hold true in our future.
1.) That the great Admiral Yamamoto's quote, "I fear all we have done is to awaken a sleeping giant and fill him with a terrible resolve," holds true and when there is finally a slap sufficient enough that America will respond with utter and total destruction of Islam.
2.) That today's youth, who will be entrusted upon to defend our freedom, who are benign and oblivious to all that happens around them. Who take everything they have for granted. Will use their lack of fear and familiarity with violence to deal the islam's destruction.
"It depends on what you call Europe. Bosnia is over 40% Muslim, Bulgaria 15% Muslim, Albania 70% Muslim, Russia almost 20% Muslim (and probably 80% of its population lives West of the Urals), and there is a city in the South Eastern corner of Europe called Istanbul, alongside Ediirne in the Turkish enclave with around 10 million Muslims on the European side of the Bosphorous (plus 4 million on the other side) - and only as recently as 1914 Istanbul was 50% Muslim - now it is 99% Muslim. If that is your definition of Europe, then there will be 50 million Muslims in Europe. In Western Europe it is over 20 million."
first turkey is not EUROPEAN, just today it came out a EU report that said turkey failed to meet the requirements.
One more push and turkey won't be considered european anymore.
Secondly bosnia mighe be 40% muslims but the muslims bosniacs not many compared to the maghrebin immigrants.
It's true that they are all muslims but believe me that all the people causing real troubles are maghrebins and arabs and pakis, not the WHITE muslims from albania or bosnia
lastly, russia is no way 20% islamic.
Russia knows how to treat the islam problem. See basayev. See the demonization of chechens. See how the totality of ethnic russians see chechens ( = like shit).
Assalamau Laikum all,
Why is this called the rape of Europe?
Why not the Birth of Eurabia, or the Western rose of Islam.
We don't want you to go, nobody is throwing you out of your homes! Instead, we invite you us Islam to join in the largest and most exciting integration of the 21st centuary.The reverse of the British empire, you spent 300 odd years everywhere...now it is the will of Allah T'alah for his flat earth to be Islamic.
Please don't be alarmed or fret, and please don't be so biased...you know your future....it is Islam...no need to fight us....what would be the point?
Instead join us for the myriad of possibilities for converting to a new faith, new business opportunities,new countries joining....for example Eurabia will definately want Turkey to join them...another 100million secular muslims...what a bonus that is.... but most importantly please please please convert to Islam as an Ahmadi.
Do not listen to Robert or Hugh so much....Islam is OK really....a few growing pains ...and then you settle down...listening to the Koran from an experienced Mufti is intoxicating....learn from the masters...Let us intrepret the Koran for you....the livlihood of your pristine grandaughters will depend on your training of them to the purest religion of them all...Islam.
The report says "Today Mohammed is already the most popular name for new-born boys in Brussels, Amsterdam, Rotterdam, and other major European cities".
This is an excellent start...what about the womens name...perhaps Aiesha....no no ...I know, I know ....what about Naseem!
Naseem, your so funny, you can't be real?
"Instead join us for the myriad of possibilities for converting to a new faith, new business opportunities,new countries joining....for example Eurabia will definately want Turkey to join them...another 100million secular muslims...what a bonus that is.... but most importantly please please please convert to Islam as an Ahmadi. "
sorry ahmadi is the stupidest sect of muslims, while the rest of muslims have an iq of 60, the hamadi is 30. Basically the level of a mongoloid.
This is well exposed by a brain dead idiotic former sperm container called nasheem on a blog.
nasheem you don't go anymore to danielpipes.org to have your ass properly kicked everytime.
your half brain must love being kicked all the time by us only...
I don't know why people rise to Naseem's bait. He (she?) is obviously a troll extraordinaire. I suspect he's a non-Muslim westerner. But amusing with it -- even Comical Ali could take lessons from him.
Islam and its followers think too much of themselves. They will be the last to realize what is happening to them. Islam and muslims are being played by the West and the East in a grand pincer movement.
But because islam and the muslims that spread it exist mostly in a pre-conscious, near-bicameral state, they lack the ability to properly utilize the analogs and metaphors upon which civilization has been built. Islam, as with every other inferior culture that has come up against the West, will be destroyed.
Our only disadvantage is that the enemy (islam and the muslims that spread it) have discovered us instead of the other way around. In the end, this will only make the coming muslim humiliation more bloody. Many muslims will be put to death for failing to bear witness to the living universe that unfolds before their uncomprehending eyes. Islam is hateful. Muslims are hateful.
From Clive:
"If anyone actually starts killing in the name of Jesus, they will do so with absolutely no authority from new testament sources. The Crusades and Inquisitions have been throroughly repudiated by every mainstream branch of Christianity."
The Crusades were repudiated by every mainstream branch of Christianity??? Only by those who have become politically correct and no longer reflect true Christian doctrines, i.e. heretics.
If it were not for the Crusades, Europe would have been Islamicized centuries ago. There would not have been a Renaissance. There would be no European art, culture and music.
The Inquisition - the Spanish Inquisition - was carried out by King Ferdinand who appointed Torquemada, against the wishes of Pope Sixtus. There is a heated exchange of letters between the Pontiff and the Sovereign for which the Pope criticized the methods employed by the Spanish, who aren't the most squeamish people:
In Aragon, Valencia, Mallorca, and Catalonia the Inquisition has for some time been moved not by zeal for the faith and the salvation of souls but by lust for wealth. Many true and faithful Christians, on the testimony of enemies, rivals, slaves, and other lower and even less proper persons, have without any legitimate proof been thrust into secular prisons, tortured and condemned as relapsed heretics, deprived of their goods and property and handed over to the secular arm to be executed, to the peril of souls, setting a pernicious example, and causing disgust to many.
Get over your old prejudices, Clive.
Old Atlantic,
Of all the factors you listed, #1 -- PC -- is the most powerful and influential explanation. All the other factors you listed would lose most of their effect, were PC not as broadly and deeply dominant in Western societies.
A young Turkish woman was reported as saying:
"WE are not going anywhere. We have EVERYTHING we need right HERE. THe only thing we don't need is YOU" (speaking about the Germans of course)
So nice to have a beautiful multi-culti society in Europe, where everyone just loves one another. (sarc.)
Posted by: americaningermany
This is OUTRAGEOUS! I wish we had thugs who'd look her and her family up and beat them out of the country. I will go to Europe and fight when the day comes. I hope we'll have the Serbs on our sides. They're tough as nails and they hate muftis more than anyone. They know how to deal with them. the NATO attacks on Serbia was a WORSE mistake than getting involved in Iraq and that's saying a lot. The Serbs were merely doing what the moslems were getting ready to do to them and have been doing to countless ohters over the centuries. They will do to us if we don't beat them to it.
Nuke Mecca NOW!
atheling:
I need to clarify a couple of things.
1) My post was in response to an entry stating the writers concern that a certain group would "replace fundamental Islam with fundamental Christianity and then act out all their ethnic cleansing fantasies."
2) This site and BW are in the business of understanding the source materials of Islam and showing how jihad and global conquest can be their only logical outworking.
3) It is a matter of historical record that forced conversions and other atrocities did occur during the crusades, and contemporary Christianity considers these to be a blight on its history.
4) The repudiation I speak of is not the same thing as saying "its too bad the crusades took place," or "those people were really bad for having done that." Clearly they had to take place--it's just that Jesus' teaching in the new testament cannot be said to logically result in forced conversions, "ethnic cleansing," or many of the other heinous things the Islamist and elite leftists are accusing Christianity of.
In other words, the current conflict needs to be joined by Christians and secularists alike (and anyone else with a conscience) to halt the spread of Islamism, but NT sources do not logically result in tyranny the way that the Islamic sources do.
I think this is important to point out because, with the raised awareness of religious worldviews right now, you can already hear the "all religion is bad; let's get the Christians too!" bandwagon cranking up. Sorry for the confusion.
Laosuwan, Sawasdi Khrap. I spent two years in Thailand back in the 1990's. It's a beautiful country, especially the Pak Nua. They knock the Pak Isaan for its poverty, but the people I met were friendly and pleasant, and the old Khmer remains at Phimai were superb. I hope Thailand prospers and enjoys peace.
I don't think Europe is finished. The fact that people like Broder and Falliaci were originally from the Left tells me that the PeeCee shell will probably crack sooner than we think. Also, some of the Lefties here in America have become far more outspokenly anti-Muslim than I am. Then again, people for whom "fag" was the worst insult you could deliver back in the 1970's who then become supporters of gay rights are probably people with a very weak hold on their convictions and panic easily.
JesusChristSuperCop, don't fall for the moral equivalence game re Christian fundamentalism. It's one of the ways by which the West is being undermined. For one thing, the ONLY reason we talk about "Muslim fundamentalism" is because the New York Slimes and Washington Compost sensed in the Khomeini-ites a golden opportunity to make Evangelical Christians look bad back when they were abandoning the Democratic Party in Jimmy Carter's hour of need.
Nobody is more easily tempted to pacifism than a Christian fundamentalist. That is, a genuine, principled opposition to war in all forms rather than mere cowardice over being called to sacrifice one's life. Also, nobody's conscience is more easily pricked by appeals based on the poverty of others. How do I know? I happen to be one (although I'm on the "Just War" theory side of the argument myself). We weren't enthusiastic at all about getting into World War One, when the Social Gospel Liberals were screaming for the Kaiser's guts. And, even those of us who believe that there is such a thing as a just war don't see it as a surefire road to heaven. Only the shed blood of Jesus Christ on the cross and his resurrection suffices to save sinners (and that is all of us). It is the power of Christ and the certainty that God is true even when every man is a liar that makes us certain of salvation--not things we do. This is also why for us, the best case scenario isn't a return to a Lily White Atlantic realm, but a more thoroughly re-Christianized one, even if it's complexion becomes a bit swarthy.
We will fight if we must; but do you blame us for asking for a little sober reflection when we have seen some of the walls of Islam begin to crack?
I am just as pessimistic as Broders. Not because I necessarily think that all Europeans have become cowards -- history has shown how much violence Europe can produce.
But simple fact is that demographics is working its certain and unstoppable way. The Western European have simply stopped making children, preferring material pleasures to the effort of child-raising. The muslim immigrants are making children like rabbits, as a matter of course. Why, more manpower for islam is obviously a good thing.
So, regardless of individual courage, it does not matter. We have allowed islam in, we allow it uncontrolled expansion, so we have sentenced our continent to death. It is a simple fact.
(Look a Kosovo, Egypt, or Lebanon to see how quickly demographics work.)
JimmyBones; Although you are absolutely correct about US leadership being asleep at the switch, you are almost certainly wrong to claim that 95% of the country is asleep.
In polls taken recently, less than 19% of the US population has a positive view of Islam.
I personally know of no one in the United States who has forgiven the Muslims for 9-11.
But most significantly, the US population is ARMED. Most Americans either have firearms, know how to use them or can obtain these if necessary. Most Americans that I know are fully cognizant of Islam's inherent malignance and genocidal tendencies. Many Americans I know suspect that in their lifetimes they may be forced into an armed conflict with Islam on US soil. This is what I think and I have yet to get into an argument over it with a single American.
Americans do not wear their true feelings about Islam on their sleeve or rearrange their lives to avoid contanct with Muslims and terror, because they understand that to live in fear of Islam is to give Islam a de facto victory and no Americans I know wish to give the Muslims that kind of satisfaction.
Kepha,
I don't know if fundamentalist Christians are more apt towards pacifism than any other. The town where I live (USA) is very liberal, anti Christian and very pacifist.
The Left are more pacifist than any Christian I know, whether fundamentalist or not. I'd be willing to bet that a poll on pacifists would reflect that they mainly consist of non religious left. After all, their religion is one of "peace", not war. 60's remnants.
Pythagoras:
You have a point. We Americans are armed. I just armed myself and plan on owning more firearms in the future.
I don't plan on allowing Islam to encroach upon America as it has in Europe. I know many other Americans who feel the same. If a civil war breaks out, my only comfort is that the Left, who obstruct any means to keep America free from terrorism and Muslim invasion, will be killed first, since most of them don't carry guns or know the first thing about self defense.
to naseem
your mufti may be intoxicating(this is also another word for POISON) but i would prefer intoxicating liquor.at least i can enjoy that.
SO YOU ADMIT YOUR MUFTI SPREADS POISON?
GermanAmerica you are so right, we need the solidarity of all non-muslims to win this. Islam is at war with mankind and an Islamic flag flying over any infidel city, be it Manila, Bangkok or New York is a risk to us all.
United we stand divided we fall.
I have family roots in Europe, French, Spanish and German, so my focus is with the news from these places, but I realize we must care about every other indigenous culture that will also be annihilated by sharia and dawa.
I spend much of my time convincing my fellow americans that we must care about Europe and the non-muslim world. Even if many don't care about us.
GermanAmerican as a middle aged man I helped rid my part of New York from thugs and gangs, even had a flaming car driven into the lobby of my building. Yet, we won, and it was a much easier victory than anyone thought.
Cowards die a thousand deaths and thugs can never defeat a determined people.
To my European brothers wake up! fight to save your beautiful cities!
IF WE FIGHT WE WILL WIN!
God bless Robert for all his work, Godspeed to our cause!
Atheling: The Silly 'Sixties Leftovers are not pacifist at all. Sure, they hate international war with uniformed armies, but they love class and other forms of internecine warfare. Listen to them crow if someone "strikes a blow for liberation"--meaning an action in which members of some unfashionable group get stealthily maimed or killed. That's why they've adopted the Jihadi irregulars as a cause.