No pursuit into mosques without Iraqi troops. Loudspeakers in mosques permitted to broadcast prayers for the defeat of America. And the US is spending $200 million on reconstruction projects in Fallujah. And for what? None of this dents the jihad ideology. Clearly, they still hate us -- no surprise there. And when chaos fully erupts again in Fallujah, the US-funded reconstruction projects will probably be the first to be looted and set ablaze.
"Under fire, US marines hand off battered Fallujah," by Scott Peterson for the Christian Science Monitor:
FALLUJAH, IRAQ - From Observation Post Blazer, marines view Fallujah through a thick sheet of bullet-proof glass - already tested with numerous impacts. Or they stare through night-vision goggles or a thermal imaging scope that can pick up the heat of a dog hundreds of yards away.
The marines still patrol key roads. The US military, which still travels boldly through town despite a surge in deadly sniper attacks and roadside bombs, is spending $200 million on 60-plus projects to rebuild the city, heavily damaged in fighting two years ago.
But with just 300 marines, the US military footprint is smaller in this Sunni stronghold of more than 300,000 than it has been in two years. As the marine presence shrinks and Iraqis take more control, Fallujah - once a template for counterinsurgency efforts in Iraq, where US forces have controlled all the variables - is likely again to set a standard for the rest of the country.
"A lot of us feel like we have our hands tied behind our back," says Cpl. Peter Mattice, of Bravo Company, 1st Battalion, 24th Marine Regiment. "In Fallujah, [insurgents] know our [rules of engagement] - they know when to stop, just before we engage."
[...]
"They say we are here to win the hearts and minds of the Iraqi people, but I just don't see that happening," says Corporal Mattice, of Gladwin, Mich. OP Blazer is perched on the northern edge of the city, looking due south down a main street known to the marines as Ethan, site of numerous roadside bombs.
[...]
Each precinct in Chicago or Detroit, makes 100 to 150 arrests per night per 300,000 people," says Major Kolomjec, a lawyer who notes that Fallujah's population is similar. "Here you take 12 to 40 people per day, and people are up in arms. You can't expect stability, when you are not even doing the same level of policing as Detroit."
Another source of frustration: Pursuit in mosques is forbidden without the presence of Iraqi Army units. Marines say some of Fallujah's 76 mosques are used to hide weaponry. Some broadcast messages such as, "God help us defeat the Americans."
"Many would ask: What other war would we allow the enemy to broadcast calls for our defeat, for the sake of cultural sensitivity?" says O'Neill.
"A lot of us feel like we have our hands tied behind our back,"
Truer words have never been spoken...
http://doctorbulldog.wordpress.com
Yes, let's keep trying to fight this war in a warm and fuzzy manner. This is all so daunting.
I sometimes wonder if the current military and political leaders have ever read about what it actually took to win World War II. From the way these leaders are conducting the war in Iraq I am going to hazard to guess they haven't. This is most likely thanks to current history education in our U.S. public schools which blames America for everything and fails to point out any positive contribution by America or to even discuss the military tactics that won W.W.II.
THIS IS WHAT YOU GET WHEN YOU ABANDON THE TRUTH AND PERSUIT A MYTH AND CHASE IT WITH LIES
No pursuit into mosques without Iraqi troops. Loudspeakers in mosques permitted to broadcast prayers for the defeat of America. And the US is spending $200 million on reconstruction projects in Fallujah. And for what? None of this dents the jihad ideology. Clearly, they still hate us -- no surprise there. And when chaos fully erupts again in Fallujah, the US-funded reconstruction projects will probably be the first to be looted and set ablaze.
WOW!! Just like post-war Germany and Japan :-)
just kidding folks!
"A lot of us feel like we have our hands tied behind our back," says Cpl. Peter Mattice, of Bravo Company, 1st Battalion, 24th Marine Regiment. "In Fallujah, [insurgents] know our [rules of engagement] - they know when to stop, just before we engage."
Just like what an Israeli girl told me what the IDF calls a ceasefire: WE CEASE - THEY FIRE.
Strange days indeed that we live in!
What ever happened to LOGIC??!!!
"They say we are here to win the hearts and minds of the Iraqi people, but I just don't see that happening," says Corporal Mattice, of Gladwin, Mich. OP Blazer is perched on the northern edge of the city, looking due south down a main street known to the marines as Ethan, site of numerous roadside bombs.
We're spending OUR money there. Shouldn't THEY be winning OUR hearts and minds so we won't leave?
I am SO glad the dhims are giving us an excuse to GET THE FOOK OUT!!
Then let THEM KILL EACH OTHER!!!!!
Hip hip HOOO-RAYYY!!!
Another source of frustration: Pursuit in mosques is forbidden without the presence of Iraqi Army units. Marines say some of Fallujah's 76 mosques are used to hide weaponry. Some broadcast messages such as, "God help us defeat the Americans."
"Many would ask: What other war would we allow the enemy to broadcast calls for our defeat, for the sake of cultural sensitivity?" says O'Neill.
Posted by Marisol
Dang-dada-da Dang da-da-da.
Christms is near! Christmas is near!
Anything else from those mosk loudspeakers should be met with FIRE!
We're giving them money like a bunch of dhimwits!! Santa Is in Iraq and Americans go without at home!! Bull!!
Let's take our money OUT OF THE DEVIL's land!
THEY HATE SANTA!!! Let's get Santa home and let those devils kill each other NOW!!!
It's hopeless .
It's time to pull out, pull back ,refortify the Frontier and cut the Middle east OUT!.
Expel any and all Muslims guilty of sowing insurrection and have a zero tolerance policy for ANY Muslim , Immigrant or native born.
No Aid, No trade........ nothing.
Fast track an Alternative Energy Initiative
let them stand alone .
and let's stop pretending it's NOT a Clash of cultures!
It IS East VS West , and we need to wake up and smell the Jihad. The West and primarily N. America needs to realize hugs and kisses and wishful thinking won't undo 1400 years of Islamic Insanity, Cruelty , and Blodlust.
Yes, let's keep trying to fight this war in a warm and fuzzy manner. This is all so daunting.
Posted by: pigtails not veils
\
Sounds like Bruce Lee movie. Too bad this is Real Life and OUR soldiers are getting killed and maimed because of it.
Every time I read about things like this I just shake my head. One of the big problems with the American politicos is that none of them have actually "SERVED" in the military. In peace or in war. Soldiers are trained to win battles and fight wars. Not be policemen, peace keepers or such rot.
So the politicians tell the Generals to be nice and don't upset the poor people. The Generals turn to the soldier on the ground and tell them to turn the other cheek. Makes you wonder which cheek the troops are being forced to turn.
I know how bitter they are. I have heard the same voice in friends who served in the balkans.
My prayers go out to them, they need it.
Here is what I feel about 'winning hearts and minds': http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/014154.php#c306611
I don't know about others here but sometimes i just Despair for the Wests lack of Knowledge on just how severely threatened our Culture actually is.
I watch and Read Western Media and the truth is just NOT out there in the mainstream where it should be.
It is very disheartening and DEPRESSING at times.
Especially when people you know " Don't want to hear about it "
It makes me very sad at times.
this is great, all of the brave men and women who were duped into thinking these savages want any kind of democracy? bush you f'd up bad. i would agree with all of the anti war people but they are on the side of the enemy. not because the war is a bad idea, but they dont think we should offend the french. i did find a mountain top i could climb up to the other day and just watch the world crumble around me. its gettin time to go there.
i meant shouldn't offend the french. sorry.
Yes, let's keep trying to fight this war in a warm and fuzzy manner. This is all so daunting.
Posted by: pigtails not veils
\
Sounds like Bruce Lee movie. Too bad this is Real Life and OUR soldiers are getting killed and maimed because of it.
Posted by: germaninamerica
Well, if we are going to fight a war , let's fight it! Not worry about how to handle a koran, not worry about being insensitive, not worry about bombing a mosque, not worry about how WE ARE NOT POPULAR AND UNLIKED AROUND THE WORLD!!!! your soliders? Oh okay, I come from a long line of veterans on my father's side. We have lost soldiers! I voted for Bush twice and I want to see that cowboy stance from the beginning and not the way he has backed down. We look soft. Don't you think?
duggy i agree with you so much. many people in the west are not paying attention to this. just because some jihadist hasn't tried to waste them directly they chose to ignore it. it does seem as though another catastrophy needs to happen while the democrats are in power to wake folks up.
goddamn right pigtails!!! i was in a drug rehabilitation center back in september 2005. this jack off came in from jail as a convert to islam. he immediatly started to demand special treatment and trying to proselytise to the rest of us. well, he got thrown out because he said he was gonna make sure many people get sent home in a pine box! the reason he said this to us? maybe because we all thought he was full of shit. and that mohammed was nothing but some caravan raider and pervert. you muslims will not win us over by doctrine only by fear. muslimah pelosi can tell you more.
oh buy the way, fools that get thrown out of rehab just go back to prison. not back out into the street. t
The 'heart & minds'-thing is a lost cause, it always was. Yes, our troops are in a deja vu situation, it is scandalous!
No, politicians don't need to be military-types or experienced soldiers, but they should at least understand how the enemy ticks.
And since we know that even in the CIA they are clueless about islam and about Shiites & Sunni etc. don't expect any kind of 'intelligence' coming out of there either, especially not when they use Mohammedan translators... Unbelievable!
As for the purpose of mosques, her is the link:
http://pedestrianinfidel.blogspot.com/2006/02/inside-forbidden-fortress.html
oh id like to thank that f**k face with the hook on his hand to say we are nothing but cows. and if you can't trade me in a market, then kill me. hmmmm. how about if i trade your existence with a pile of rat shit. hook handed wanna be pirate bitch. is there no one in this country willing to put these shit stains in there place? i mean people who have the power to do so. average folks cant because many average folks are to dumb to realize what the f is happening.
When the USA, UK and Australia depart from Iraq sooner than we expected, why not leave behind a bit of what killed Alexander Litvienko? Mad muslim bombers and russian despots don't give a flying fuck. Why should we?
It started long time ago and has developed over the years. It started with Israel-Arab wars when Europe and US demanded a so called “clean” conduct of war.
Now we are getting fruits of those seeds we planted over many years. We had been given and demanded from Israel the recipe of disaster without thinking that one day we will have to take the same medicine.
We should have known better. In 1955, 1967, 1974 US saved arabs from humiliation. There was no gratitude for those actions and rightly so: “No good deed should go unpunished”.
We seems to praise American soldiers in Iraq, yet forgetting that first of all they are humans and only after that are soldiers. Knowing they are not doing the right thing and continue to do it destroys them as individuals. It is immoral to act against your consciousness.
An open question: in your view what is the best thing you've read on the 'occupation' of Iraq, and on how the US and its allies should take things from here. Some advocate staying but changing the course (Daniel Pipes), some staying and winning (Victor Davies-Hanson, Mark Steyn, if I'm right) and others to get out (Hugh Fitzgerald). I'm interested in how this debate is proceeding within the community of people that understand the nature of the jihadi threat.
The most important thing to remember is that the ideology of jihad and hatred will spread regardless.
If you look at Saudi Arabia, despite a high degree of prosperity and social order, the jihad ideology is taught in schools and mosques and this poison works on young minds unabated.
Same is hapening in Punjab, where hatred against christians, jews, Hindus in India is relentlessly drilled till the impressionable mind of the child is almost ready to explode.
The billions of dollars in american largesse has failed to change punjabi minds.
So the lesson is development projects in Fallujah, whether 200 million or 200 billion dollars, is not going to change the hatred.
If it did not change Saudis and Punjabis, is there any doubt its going to chane iraqi arabs??
Not the least.
Bush's geopolitical strategy at its finest! We shouldn't be there in the first place.
No pursuit into mosques without Iraqi troops. Loudspeakers in mosques permitted to broadcast prayers for the defeat of America.
when l read this l wanted to puke. with this type of warfare l will for once will agree get the FUCX out of iraq, when the military elites are too afraid to really want to win, and put their men in harms way, it time to get the Hell out of there. for all care there is no more leadership in the military or goverment. it will take ordinary people to rise up one day and do the work that is needed.
I'm too tired from all the turkey this weekend to repeat myself so here ya go:
http://www.foehammer.net/2006/05/how-to-deal-with-werewolves.html
Iraq is a good example of how islam tears down a group of people. I won't call them a civilization. We are seeing what islam actually produces and it's pathetic.
Sometimes when the foundation is completely rotted, you have to raize the entire building. When it's that rotted, you just don't rebuild.
These people are like mindless rabid bi-pedals. Nothing more , nothing less.
"No pursuit into mosques without Iraqi troops. Loudspeakers in mosques permitted to broadcast prayers for the defeat of America. And the US is spending $200 million on reconstruction projects in Fallujah. And for what? None of this dents the jihad ideology. Clearly, they still hate us -- no surprise there. And when chaos fully erupts again in Fallujah, the US-funded reconstruction projects will probably be the first to be looted and set ablaze".- Marisol
It is madness.
I'm always surprised at how people think that good will and good intentions will change hearts and minds. In historian John Toland's excellent biography of Hitler (published 1976) we read how Hitler, who was homeless in Vienna for several years prior to World War 1, often would find food and shelter at a hostel set up by the Jewish Epstein family of Vienna. Little did the Epsteins know that one of their clients was a deadly snake, full of venom, who should have been left on the streets of Vienna to freeze to death.
A lot of us feel like we have our hands tied behind our back...
Just like Viet Nam. Instead of walking on eggs shells for fear of offending the PRC Red Army, this time we've lowered ourselves to kowtowing to Arab Moslems. That's low, real low.
americaningermany-
Churchill was right.
They use our good will for their ill-will. We are no more than cattle to true muslims.
The Watcher’s Council has announced its picks for the most outstanding posts of the preceding week. The winning Council post was Marc Schulman's at American Future’s post, “Our Rules of Engagement in Iraq”.
http://shrinkwrapped.blogs.com/blog/2006/11/the_immorality_.html
Shrinkwrapped concludes in a post here: http://shrinkwrapped.blogs.com/blog/2006/11/the_immorality_.html
"The dilemma shared by Israel and America is just this: If by fighting morally, we cannot win a limited war, we create the conditions which will ensure the fighting of an unlimited war."
Gandhi once made the point that it is practically impossible to change the minds of people who hate you, that your good-will to them means nothing as long as they have hate for you. He made this observation in the context of his fasts. He pointed out that his hunger strikes were not directed at those who hated him, but at those who loved him.
It is clear that true Muslims believe that Kafirs are no more than cattle. There are no innocent Kafirs in this belief-system. This is mental illness. It reminds me of a Blake quote that Michael Savage is fond of quoting: "The mind that alters, alters all". Kafirs must be killed as per this mental illness.
Ultimately, the constant hate propaganda disseminated in the Mideast will result in the kind of response from the Kafirs that was required with Hitler. It's inevitable. No true Muslim minds will be changed re Kafirs by any good will. Their minds will see that as weakness. "The mind that alters, alters all".
Hitler, who was homeless in Vienna for several years prior to World War 1, often would find food and shelter at a hostel set up by the Jewish Epstein family of Vienna.
Sorta like when the Jews of Yathrib welcomed an impoverished Mohammed and his rag-tag band of Companions. Only a few years later the Jews were either robbed and exiled, beheaded, or enslaved.
I imagine that a thank you from a Nazi was much like a thank you from a Moslem always has been. Better ingrates like the Indonesians than receiving the kind of thank yous only these regrettable people can give.
I am convinced that George Bush is one of those college students who had a knack for test-taking. Like an engineering student, a memeber of Tau Beta Pi, who could not solve problems in the real world, I have known some.
George Bush also seems subborn. I imagine that trying to talk to Bush is like talking to a stump. If G. Bush were one of Patton's division commanders, he would have been relieved a long time ago and sent home.
duggy i agree with you so much. many people in the west are not paying attention to this. just because some jihadist hasn't tried to waste them directly they chose to ignore it. it does seem as though another catastrophy needs to happen while the democrats are in power to wake folks up.
Posted by: ffoegthehun at November 26, 2006 02:49 AM
Oh.. it is that and more. Like DUGGY said, Bush f*ed up bad. Bush, his party and his family should pay for the damage done to US of A. And to believe Bush made mistakes, is in itself a mistake. Bush is and has always been currupt. He has been raised on petro-dollars funded by Saudis and raised by illegal mexican nannies. Bush, instead of serving his country, went AWOL. Later, he and Bandar Bush (the wahabbi adopted by Barbara) smoked cigars while WTC crumbeled. Any surprise Bush let Bin-Ladens to safety, while all other flights were grounded? Later, Bush stalled the 9/11 commission and erased references to Saudi (yes.. Bandar's Saudi) from the interim report... the same Saudi that had attacked US on 9/11. Now, does this sound like what a patriotic citizen let alone, a president/commander-in-chief would do? Fact is, Bush, his party and family havd sold-out US at every opportunity leaving hard-working, tax-paying and honest Americans at the mercy of terrorists. No Bush, his party and his family have to pay.
Once upon a time, there was this place called "Vietnam."
Has anyone at the Pentegon heard of it?
Well, the whole saga is about how not to win wars and how to, spend lots of money, prop up corrupt dictators, win hearts and minds, engage in police actions under UN mandates, give out screwy orders to troops like "yell halt three times before shooting, when on jungle patrol" and "do not strafe the convoys on the Ho Chi Min trail if they pull to the side of the road and turn off their headlights" -- (imagaine an F4 crew lining up to a truck full of SAM's to blast the SOB's all the back to Hanoi in the hereafter and the NVA flipping them off as the flew by at 400 knots at tree-top level!) -- just to mention a few hilarities.
Then there was this other saga called WW2 ...
Declare "Victory" already, and buggy! Else, flatten the place and really destroy the enemy and buggy in about a week (hey, no point in hanging around a bunch of ghost towns).
I would opt for door number two!
Relax, no one in my government will opt for door number two -- just look at Olmert who is doing exactly what he is told by Condi and company!
No worries!
"Sorta like when the Jews of Yathrib welcomed an impoverished Mohammed and his rag-tag band of Companions. Only a few years later the Jews were either robbed and exiled, beheaded, or enslaved".
APF-
Excellent comparison re Hitler and the Epstein family of pre WW1 Vienna and Mohammed and the Jews of Yathrib. It fits. It means that both Hitler and Mohammed hated them all along and bided their time till they could kill them.
Gandhi pointed out that it is practically impossible to change any mind by good will until hate for you is removed from their hearts. He knew some would hate him no matter how much good will he had for them. He said that his hunger strikes (demanding an end to violence) were directed at those who loved him. He knew that those who hated him wished he would starve himself to death. Mr. Gandhi was a smart fellow about human nature, realistic.
First: Foehammer, there one great difference between the war in Iraq and the war in Viet Nam. It is ISLAM.
Second: We are still fighting the lowest form of the human animal with our so called civilized form of warfare. We must temporarily put aside our "high minded, civilized crap" and our get our hands dirty. When we capture an "insurgent" we must take him or her behind the nearest wall and simply shoot them. Throw away the Geneva convention-it will kill us. After the "Islam Problem" is solved, we can rebuild and restore our civilizations. We must put aside our squeamishness.
I believe that when we captured Zarqawi, our troops simply let him die, or else administered his wounds half-heartedly. To that I say, "Three cheers."
I'm an a bad mood today.
The bottom line on this whole Iraq mess is that we attempted to save and redeem a people not worth saving or redeeming. Instead of accepting the gifts of freedom and human diginity we brought them, the Iraqi people have instead opted to remain in the darkness of Islam. I voted for George Bush twice but I believe the time has come to face the fact that the Muslim savages of Iraq are not going to become civilized human beings simply because we would like them to do so. The president's intentions were noble ones but liberating Muslims is not like liberating the Dutch and Belgians in World War Two. Furthermore, his repeatedly calling Islam a "religion of peace" did not make it so and is not going to make it so. Finally, waging a politically correct war and needlessly sacrificing hundreds of our own men in pointless infantry attacks instead of relying on overwhelming airpower and artillery to save mosques and "holy sites" (i.e. in reality,the enemy's bases) also did not help and instead only made us look weak and spineless. Many of the enemy's leaders haven't even been targeted as they should have been right at the start. In fact, we would have probably gained a lot more respect (and inspired a healthy dose of fear) among Iraqis had we displayed Al Sadr's head on a spike with a pork chop in his mouth.
The time has come to follow the example of the early state of Israel. Draw a line in the sand between the Muslims and us and hit back mercilessly and in overwhelming force if we are ever attacked, even with thermonuclear weapons. As for the Muslims living in the West, it is time to recognize that they will never become Westerners (you have to be human first) and deport them forcibly and without apology. If the liberals are unhappy with this arrangement, they are free to go with them and live in their own barbaric lands. My guess is after a couple of weeks, they will be begging to be allowed back in......
First: Foehammer, there one great difference between the war in Iraq and the war in Viet Nam. It is ISLAM.
Islam and Communism however, are both ideologies that people are willing to die for -- I think we all agree that we should be willing to do everything possible to help them do that, as quickly as we can.
"Americans can always be counted on to do the right thing... [open door No.2*] after they have exhausted all other possibilities." -- Winston Churchill
*from witness above
From above...First: there one great difference between the war in Iraq and the war in Viet Nam. It is ISLAM.
Right on the money...It is not sufficient to fight and kill insurgents...It is Allah who must be killed. That may be a tough job because he lives through anyone foolish enough to believe he is the 'real' God. As long as muslims believe that Allah is 'God', that the Quran is his immutable words, and 'instructions'. And that it was Mohammad (the perfect man) who recieved, supported, advocated, and implimented by force, Allahs edicts, there can never be any respite. This has been one violent and hegemonic movement since Allah started talking to Mohammad 1400 years ago. It still is...
Again, as one who has family in Iraq trying to make something of this boneheaded mess, it makes me sick that this is ultimately what our troops are going to have fought and died for. All based on BS intelligence and dimwit notions of spreading "democracy" to a nation more interested in fighting a religious war.
Oh, and let us never forget the initial mission in Afghanistan and how wonderful that is turning out (with Pakistan's wonderful help)since we abandoned it and fed our resources into the lost cause in Iraq.
Just sickening.
George W. Bush is to blame. He has lost. Enough with blaming the state dept., condi, or anyone else. This is his show. This is his plan.
He thought he could make Muslims like us. It failed! All he had to do was study history and and few Islamic holy books and he would figured it out. Did he???
Nope! That Yale education at work.
The American people should put a ban on anyone who has graduated from Yale, Columbia and Harvard from public service for at least 10 years. That alone would do wonders.
Posted by Pelayo:
"When we capture an "insurgent" we must take him or her behind the nearest wall and simply shoot them. Throw away the Geneva convention-it will kill us. After the "Islam Problem" is solved, we can rebuild and restore our civilizations. We must put aside our squeamishness."
Yes take the Geneva Conventions and toss them write out the window for this conflict. The conventions I believe should only apply to armies who both follow them.
Fighting an enemy that uses the conventions against your forces should not expect you to follow them. If they get down in the dirt. Bury them the quickest way possible. There is no morale high ground when you are six feet under.
Posted by Pelayo:
"When we capture an "insurgent" we must take him or her behind the nearest wall and simply shoot them. Throw away the Geneva convention-it will kill us. After the "Islam Problem" is solved, we can rebuild and restore our civilizations. We must put aside our squeamishness."
Yes take the Geneva Conventions and toss them write out the window for this conflict. The conventions I believe should only apply to armies who both follow them.
Fighting an enemy that uses the conventions against your forces should not expect you to follow them. If they get down in the dirt. Bury them the quickest way possible. There is no morale high ground when you are six feet under.
Posted by Pelayo:
"When we capture an "insurgent" we must take him or her behind the nearest wall and simply shoot them. Throw away the Geneva convention-it will kill us. After the "Islam Problem" is solved, we can rebuild and restore our civilizations. We must put aside our squeamishness."
Yes take the Geneva Conventions and toss them write out the window for this conflict. The conventions I believe should only apply to armies who both follow them.
Fighting an enemy that uses the conventions against your forces should not expect you to follow them. If they get down in the dirt. Bury them the quickest way possible. There is no morale high ground when you are six feet under.
Throw away the Geneva convention-it will kill us. After the "Islam Problem" is solved, we can rebuild and restore our civilizations. We must put aside our squeamishness.
Well stated, Pelayo. When one finds yourself running with these people, one must tolerate coatings of Moslem dung unti the whole mess can be cleaned up.
There is a difficult passage to be gone through. A knothole. Gonna be rough, gonna be nuclear, don't wanna make light of how it's gonna be.
But, when the smoke clears, it'll be time for Article III Section 2 of the Consitution to be able to retain our honor bound system as we flush the crap away from our corpus politic.
Iraq=Theater of the Absurd.
More proof that we are wasting our money and blood in Iraq. Hard core evidence that talk of "victory" is bullshit, a smokescreen for saving the face of Bush/Cheney, Dhimmicrats, Repugnicans and all of the morons who supported the invasion and support the occupation.
The only way to victory in Iraq is genocide, total annhilation of the inhabitants.. and that is impossible.
On the other side of the coin all of that money spent for reconstruction is fattening the coffers and stockholders of Cheney's Haliburton, and other supporters of the Repugnican party like Blackwater..
Just like during the Viet Nam war, the supporters of the Democratic party made a fortune off contracts in that theater and event..firms like BMK RMJ, whose initials include Kellogg, Brown, Root (now subsidiaries of Haliburton -Cheney's company) and J for Johnson as in Lady Bird Johnson.
You guys won't read it, but Imperial Life in the Emerald City provides an overview of what is wrong, and perhaps AN ulterior motive behind the invasion ,to make money, and to privatize Iraq (that is sell or give off Iraqi assets to American companies, that supported the RNC and Bush)
Thie whole Afghanistan then Iraq war thing was a classic bait-and-switch. They get support for Afghanistan since 9/11 happened to fall in their lap. Then they have all the tropps and special forces they need for Iraq which is where Bush always wanted to go.
He never gave a rat's ass about catching bin Laden. That scumbag was let go several times. Most infamously at Tora Bora.
Then our forces had this sadr in their sights and they were prevented from shooting him.
Something smells foul in the Stet of Denmark!
Sorry for the triple posting I made. My finger and internet connection kinda stuttered.
I'll try not to let it happen, or at least show some patience
I keep hearing people say- 'If we are going to fight- then let's fight' and I am so tired of hearing that. People have a lot to say and no backbone to back it up. Until we start fighting fire with fire there will be no change. I am a Warfighter not a Policeman.
The American Armed Forces are doing all we can. It is time the American people stand up and yell- Enough is Enough....Let's kick some ass.
Until the people in Washington know who they are working for, winning the hearts and minds of these pricks will continue with no positive outcome.
A Disgruntled War Veteran of Afghanistan and Iraq.........
God Bless America!
IR
SSG, USA
Thanks for your reply.
I never said anyone was blaming us. My point is just what you said about leadership.
We need more than our current leadership. They are all about politics. They are about getting re-elected and/or getting promoted.
We need the American people to rally behind us and make this leadership take notice and to finally let us WIN this war.
We go to war to break the backs of our enemy. We do not go to war to win their hearts and minds.
Last I remember, I work for the American people.
What's the biggest Saudi export? Oil? Nope. It's their PIGSLAM. Their oil just finances the export all of over the world in the way of financing islamic schools, mosques and terror groups--including CAIR!
Posted by: americaningermany at November 26, 2006 04:15 PM
BINDO! I could not have put it better myself. Now only if we could get rid of the corrupt sell-outs in office and bring folks like Tom Tancredo to lead the 'free-world'.
They would kick ass if our leaders would allow them to, and we know that.
Posted by: americaningermany at November 26, 2006 04:12 PM
.... and who are our leaders? Corrupt sell-outs who compare American civil-rights movement to barbaric Palestinian fraud, who dance at Riyadh's tune, flying terorrists to safety while blaming patriotic Minutemen, breaking national borders to let Mexican sewage flow in.. all for a few votes and even fewer pesos. If one is looking for traitors start with the white house. Unfortunately, these corrupt sell-outs cramp our distinguisguished military, giving patriotic men and women of service, their black name. Good point, AIG!
"Something smells foul in the Stet of Denmark"
-- from a posting above at 1:11 p.m.
Call the copy editors, the rollers of big cigars, and tell them to make those changes after all.
I was one of those people that believes that the U.S. can't just walk away from Iraq. We have to stay long enough to stabalize the Iraqi government and give the Iraqi people a fighting chance to have a better and freerer life.
We'll, I've long since given up on the illusion that Iraqis want anything more than the twisted and dark world they've always lived in. If the people of Iraq were really interested in a better world than the one they've lived in for generations, the insurgents would have been defeated long ago. Instead these murderers move effortlessly through the Iraqi population receiving all the moral and material support they need to war against the American soldiers there to help them.
It's true that Sadam Hussein was a murdering sadist, but he seems to have been the only kind of leader they respect and obey. The alternative might be a theocracy where Iranian style Sharia law is applied to insure absolut submission to the rulers.
Whichever one they get, they deserve it. They've lived in spiritual darkness for so long, they love the darkness, and we're not going to change it.
And that goes for the whole Muslim world.
@Duggy
Yeah seems the battle cry of the Western public at large is " Jihad, what Jihad ? the malls are open". Until our way of life is completley threatened by a collasped economy or some major attacks at home or when the suicide bombings start at the malls the average comfortable American will remain asleep and when that happens it will be too late. Its still viewed as "problems over there, with "those" people"..they don't realize our enemies wantthe west as we know it destroyed. The average Joe has become soft and focused on chasing after possesions and comforts to the detriment of all else. "Stand up for what is right ? Gee will it cost me something ? Well then, maybe I won't, maybe we should keep our nose out of it" is the common view.
A Pastor I know who was visiting here form Africa tells they cannot understand in thier African villages why Americans with all our comforts and riches are the largest consumer of antidepressants in the world.
G. W. Bush is either more clueless than was thought or he, now with the fabulous "Baker Boys," is too closely tied to the Saudis. The Democrats are hopeless. It will be up to us (the "people") to do something or we wll be either dead, bowing to Mecca, or "cows" for the Moslems to milk.
TheRegulator wrote:
" The average Joe has become soft and focused on chasing after possesions and comforts to the detriment of all else. "Stand up for what is right ? Gee will it cost me something ? Well then, maybe I won't, maybe we should keep our nose out of it" is the common view "
You put into words my exact sentiments. i am trying in Vain to educate and alert people that i care about about Roberts Books and the true Agenda and teachings of TRUE Islam. nobody cares. I am Canadian , but after 911 my life and outlook changed,forever.It was on all of our doorsteps. it's not just an American problem like many people i know think.and the US did not start this war. Canada is fighting with the US in Afganistan and if Canadians think we are not targeteed , they are foolish. on 911 i saw EVIL on a scale i had only read about in History Books, and sadly worse is yet to come. i tell my friends that THIS IS HISTORY in the making. our decendants will look back on us and judge su and wonder how the hell we could have been so foolish.
200 Million dollars wasted on trying to curry favor with people who hate us because we're not Muslims. I'm for not spending another dime until we change the ground rules on these ingrates who want to blow up the American service people who resucued them from that psychopath Saddam.
First, turn off the electricity and water and restrict the food supply. Not another kilowatt, not another cup of water or food item until they earn it. Divide the city into 1 square mile units. Wherever there is peace and harmony, civil obedience, lack of murdering and mayhem, then these people get electricity, water and food.
No food for the naughty Iraqis. They can act out all they want, but eventually, they will become hungry, tired and dehydrated. When they do tire of going without necessities, then we will have their attention. Send in our boys then and interrogate until we find out who is making all the trouble, who has the weaponry and who is making bombs or sniping at our troops. These bad Iraqis go to prison. End of trying to figure out who is a good Iraqi and who is against our troops trying to rebuild Iraq and plant the seeds of democracy and civil peace.
As for rebuilding Iraq, we should dole the rebuilding out in increments conditioned on the obedience and peace Iraqis demonstrate within their own enclaves and also with our troops. Why rebuild their infrastructure if they are just going to keep killing their benefactors?
Saddam held this country in his grip for decades by restricting their freedoms and making life hard for those who opposed him in any way. Unfortunately, this is a way of life for these people. They cannot agree to disagree on religion; they must kill those who do not belong to their sects. We must recognize their barbarism with equal control. Control their television, radio, food, water, electricity, public transportation, access to roads.
Up to this point, the Iraqis have done a very poor job of "thanking" our troops with bullets and sabers and roadside bombs. We must reaquaint them with the harsh reality that but for America and a few Allies, they wouldn't have survived Saddam.
I am curious as to how our government can prosecute the Pendleton 8 without hesitancy, but is unable to find out who in the Iraqi police is going around executing Iraqi citizens. Surely, there must be some technology, some intel, some way of tracing the movements of these police...microchip implants and a lot of satellite monitoring and mega-computing. Or, more bugs.
And, I almost forgot the roadside bombs. Since we cannot rely on the Iraqi people to inform our troops where the bombs are we should change tactics. When our troops need to patrol on foot or in vehicles, they should routinely march Iraqis in front of them down the highways and streets. I guarantee you that if enough civilians 'found' these roadside bombs for our troops, a lot of the bombing would stop.
Yes, its harsh and smacks of win at all costs...but what is the alternative. These people are playing both ends against the middle and our troops and American taxpayers are footing the bill in blood and treasure. We should be able to dictate the rules for a change.
As regards the mosques, for every American or Allied service personnel killed in Iraq on any given day, we will henceforth SHUT DOWN an equal number of mosques.
Our troops will go in dismantle the mosque, capture the weapons and level the mosque to the ground on the way out.
For every serviceman killed in Iraq, we take one media outlet: radio station, newspaper or television station. Replace these media outlets with militarily-administered radio and press operations.
We don't allow hate speech inciting murder and crime in the U.S.; Iraq should conform to this standard.
BurkasforHitlery-
Let me be the first to donate to your 08 Presidential run.
You've got my vote.
TheRegulator wrote:
" The average Joe has become soft and focused on chasing after possesions and comforts to the detriment of all else. "Stand up for what is right ? Gee will it cost me something ? Well then, maybe I won't, maybe we should keep our nose out of it" is the common view "
... but in our system of government we, common citizens work to make a living, pay tazes and depend on the elected officials to do their job. INS, now ICE, to closely monitor immigration. military, headed by commander-in-chief, to protect us and so on.... The fault lies with the elected officials who have taken an oath of office and yet, are corrupt. James Zigler, have orders to border petrol to NOT detain alien criminals. Just the opposite of what he took an oath to do. Commander-in-chief encourages criminals from acorss the bordew, erases the nayional borders (like it was his father's ranch), helps terrorists to safety, thretens patriotic Americans (Minutemen) and prosecutes border-petrol for doing their job well, granting immunity to foreigh criminals, dances to the tune of his wahabbi financers in Riyadh.... you get the picture....
Man, I am loving this thread 2-day! I have been thinking of these things for a long time, but y'all have really expressed it well. Win the war. Period. Stop pussyfooting around.
IF there are decent men and women among the Muslims, let them stand up and help us be rid of the muck and mire. If there are democratically minded people in Iraq, let them stand up and fight for what they believe in.
If a mosque is even suspected of harboring arms or terrorists, let our guys enter without restriction and if they find the suspicion to be true, blow the hell-hole off the map.
I think Pope Benedict's insistence on reciprocity is also very important.
In the US and elsewhere in the west, all mosques and islamic centers should be banned from receiving any text books or literature from S. Arabia or any country that does not have freedom of religion. And the mosques in the west should be under surveillance: if any preachers are advocating hatred for the Jews, the Christians or anyone else, the mosque should be closed.
As for quoting Winston Churchill, it only serves to lamentably remind one that there appear to be none equal to him in this day and age. If there are such warriors, such zealots for freedom among us, they are being hushed by the PC's, the pussy-footers and the business interests.
But I also agree that the PEOPLE will win out. Our leaders are as weak as water. I, too voted for Bush twice and now I can't decide whether he's a ball-less wonder, a dishonest business broker or a hapless dupe.
Recently I enjoyed some episodes of Glen Beck, et al., who were good at exposing some of what we are really up against. However, there is always the mention of the "majority" of peaceful Muslims, the "religion of peace," and so forth.
The Pope is right, but Michael Palaeologus was even MORE right, as his city and empire were soon to prove.
Sansantiago- wish they would do just as you say- this crap has got to stop- terrorists are playing us for the fools and we're catering to them by buckling under to the MSM and their anti-American apologist crap they feel obligated to print in hopes of discreditting our government. Every other nation practically has laws against their media running terror propoganda, and they ENFORCE those laws- We on the other hand buckle at the knees at the lsightest hint of being seen as doing something politically incorrect because the press is absolutely sure to jump on the mistakes like flies to a gut wagon & show America in the worst possible light- thus encouraging the enemy to push forward in their hatred against us.
I really wish there were some laws preventing biased propoganda during wartime- We'd get a lot more accomplished much quicker if our soldiers didn't have to pussyfoot around the terror loving press. http://sacredscoop.com
True, the leadership of Bush is not what it could be, and that is sometimes discouraging. On the other hand, there is the inspiring example of tens of thousands of Americans such as Iceratt that have volunteered to serve this country, and that have done so valiantly. And they are our bulwark against those animals...
It appears that not only Muslims are fighting us but our own politicians the pc...
If Bush hasn't read the quran yet he is a bigger fool than he is looking right now...
yep, the stupid Americans rebuild for them with Americans hard earned money, that means that these people don't have to use their money on rebuilding for themselves so they can now use their money on weapons to kill the dumb Americans... it is no wonder they laugh at us and think they can win the war and I just have to agree. Once Muslims have established themselves in different spots in the world, and they have got all they can out of the Americans and the western countries, they will act and because of our blindness and stupidity, 'when the time is right and they are called' they will easily win the war.. American politicians (the left has proven to be even worse in the past) and the media are helping them with their lies and lack of knowledge of Islam. America why don't you march on your politicians and say enough is enough before it is toooo late..
duggy you said, "I don't know about others here but sometimes I just Despair for the West's lack of Knowledge on just how severely threatened our Culture actually is". duggy I feel the same way, there are just so many stupid people who take no notice of the warnings of a tsunami, they stand at the waters edge and stick their heads in the sand. This alone makes me so scared, it means we are in effect being attacked front and back... while there is non-stop world wide muslim voilence, they tell us we are racist.
I am one person who felt sorry for the Iraqi people, my heart went out to the hell they had lived under with Saddam. however I now feel that we should just let Saddam go back to Iraq to take up his leadership again, to kill the thousands a week that he killed, to keep the power away from those who would not conform, to not allow the water to flow if they disobeyed, etc, this seems to be what the people of Iraq want so we are being cruel by not allowing him to go back to his adoring people..
from above:
The only way to victory in Iraq is genocide, total annhilation of the inhabitants.. and that is impossible
---it is not impossible.
A good analysis of this type of warfare "Asymmetric" or "4th Generation Warfare" can be found at
http://www.lewrockwell.com/lind/lind-arch.html
and
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth_generation_warfare
Hope this helps gain a better understanding of the 4th Generation of warfare the world is facing.
Well,
like all wars there is a political component. War is diplomacy by other means. But you people with your killer hearts can't comprehend that. What are your ultimate plans: exterminate all Muslims?