The Bahai faith was founded in mid-nineteenth century Persia. Its central figure, the Baha'ullah ("Glory of God"), is designated a successor to Muhammad in a series of divine messengers. (More background information at the Encyclopaedia of the Orient.) Clearly, this poses problems for mainstream Muslim clerics, and the predictable persecutions often follow.
Islamic Tolerance Alert. "Egypt Bahais Lose Battle for Recognition," by Jano Charbel for Arab News:
CAIRO, 17 December 2006 — An Egyptian court denied Bahais yesterday the right to state their religion on official documents and described them as pro-Israeli apostates. The Supreme Administrative Court ruled against the right of Hossam Ezzat Mussa and his wife, Rania Enayat, to state their religion on official documents.
Judge Sayed Nofal, speaking after reading out the verdict, said “the constitution promotes freedom of belief for the three recognized heavenly religions and they are Islam, Christianity and Judaism.
“As for the Bahais, Islamic jurists have all agreed that the Bahai faith is not one of the three recognized religions,” he said. “Those who belong to this religion are apostates of Islam, because the faith’s principles contradict the Islamic religion and all other religions.” The couple had filed the case in 2004. In April this year a lower court ruled in their favor.
How are the Bahais pro-Israel? Looks like the authorities wanted to make extra certain these people didn't get what they wanted by branding them pro-Israel.
By the way, Egypt's got a nice sounding, enlightened constitution. Sounds like it was written by that famed writer of constitutions Leonid Brezhnev.
ISLAMSFORLOSERS
It was probably translated into Arabic by Nasser
Among other things, the religion's headquarters and the Baha'ullah's tomb are near Haifa.
But there must be more than the matter of geographical location, since the Egyptians could just as easily call the Haifa headquarters a part of "Palestine." In addition, the Baha'ullah's activity in the area far predates the establishment of the State of Israel (he died in 1892).
For one thing, Bahai beliefs demote Muhammad from the position of "Seal of the Prophets," and Islam's claim of a divine, supreme right to the Holy Land and other places goes with that.
In addition, the official Bahai website, bahai.org, stresses "world citizenship." I'm not clear on the particulars of that, but apparently it doesn't incorporate or address the Palestinian agenda to the satisfaction of this Egyptian court and other Muslims.
Juan Cole could not be reached for comment.
The genocide is not far behind for these people. Unbelievable that the world is blinded by the false language of victimhood.
Assalamau Laikum all,
You all know that I am not a Bahai...I am Ahmadi.
In someways however the stance of this faith is similar to mine.
Peaceful tenents of Islam are adhered to and someone after Muhd. was considered a spiritual leader.
It is interesting to ask the question though "Why should Muhd SAW be the last prophet?"
It has been 1600 years since Muhd...why wouldn't God send somebody else to build upon (most of the) the good work of Mudh.
Even with Christianity Jesus was the "son of God", he was the only son , he was crucified...and that's it now. As the only son ...there can be no more...and therefore no more prophets.
Muhd said in similar fashion...."I'm it...the top of the tree and there shall be no more".
The question is why?...Dr. Ronan Williams is a clever man, the current pope is a clever man,
lots of Holy men in India, Pak, the Saud, but where are all the new prophets?
Are we saying that there can be no being who will be a prophet?
How about the womens? What about a prophetess, would God not send one of them?
Don't you folks kinda smell something fishy here?
Naseem: For the last time, wither be a REAL MUSLIM or discard your hatefilled faith and become a Christian or Hindu or whatever you want.
A CENTRAL TENET OF THE REAL ISLAM IS THIS: MUHAMMAD(SAW) IS THE LAST AND GREATEST OF ALLAH'S PROPHETS.
Stop trying to analyse how Ol' Alla's mind works -(he doesn't exist) - and understand that your sick religion DOESN'T ALLOW YOU TO THINK ABOUT WHY
1)ol' Mo' was the last prophet(which is what the Bahai and Ahmadis have been killed and persecuted in Iran and Pakistan for)
2)Why ol' Alla' didn't send a "Prophetess"(which is why Muslim women are kept repressed)
Your desire to worship a female version of divinity is understandable - become a Hindu and try Goddess Saraswati, the Goddess of knowledge - after all, THEY WERE THE GODDESSES OF YOUR LAHORI ANCESTORS BEFORE THE CULT OF DEATH ARRIVED WITH MAHMUD OF GHAZNI.
As to your specific question of why all "Prophets" said: "I am God's messenger and no one comes after me", it's surprising you have the courage to ask such a question, but after all you are only an Ahmadi and not a real Muslim.
The answer is simple: Ol' Mo' wanted money, power, sex and influence. No doubt he was a smart and charming leader. So he decided to fool the uneducated desert tribes of Arabia into subservience by calling himself Ol' Alla's "Prophet". He obviously didn't want any challengers - therefore he tells people he is Ol' Alla's "last prophet". He loots caravans and calls it the wealth bestowed by Alla' on his "willing slaves".
I could go to a very remote part of Africa or some other place where the people are ignorant, backward and have no connection to the outside world. I could train myself to be a charismatic speaker and learn some magic tricks. I could call these magic tricks miracles and my oratory the gift of the Great Goddess - who I would call Naseema - a name they are not likely to have heard of. I could take a bunch of drugs and vaccines with me and miraculously "heal the sick". It wouldn't be too hard.(BTW, MO' PERFORMED NO MIRACLES AT ALL!)
So why are there no prophets today? Maybe because we're smarter, more aware and better informed and unwilling to trust some "Prophet" with his hocus-pocus.
Open your eyes and understand that Ol'Mo' was no different.
The Bahai' have faced terrible persecution in Iran. I grew up in the Sultanate of Oman and lived there until the age of 14 - my best friend was an Iranian Baha'i - and I trace my distaste for political Islam from then itself.
His mother was arrested merely because she was a Bahai and a "threat to the Islamic Revolution" in 1988. She had engaged in no political activity whatsoever and was a housewife. She was dragged from her house to an infamous prison in Teheran - the name of which I can't recall right now - raped, tortured, had her fingernails pulled out and finally died under unknown circumstances in 1989 - which is when my friend escaped Iran as a three-year old to live in Oman with a distant relative.
Over time his other relatives who could not leave Iran suffered the same fate. His father has not been able to communicate with him since 1995 and he has no idea whether the rest of his family are alive or dead. And it did not stop in Iran - he studied in my school because he could not bear it at the Iranian school where not a day passed without taunts being issued about his being a "Bahai dog" - and the teachers, he tells me, were happy to partake in this. Fortunately he then shifted to our Indian school and he became our sports captain!
As his friend I was angry about this but could not as a kid really understand why his family were being persecuted - I imagined perhaps they had committed some crime he was too ashamed to disclose.
Imagine the living hell a blameless child and his loving parents go through at the hands of this cult, and see the nature of the evil that lives even today.
Naseem,
Interesting questions. Like most religious questions, I consider them and remark "Hmmmmm?"
If I were to have an actual opinion on such issues the only guaranteed result is to become a heretic, apostate, and offensive opinion-holder. But like you, I wonder if perhaps the fish lack refrigeration.
Shows that even a supposed moderate state like Egypt is still evil like the Islamic devils they are. Once a devil always a devil. ;)
The opression and numerous slaughters of the bahais in Iran and other parts of the region is one of the more disgusting bits of modern mohammedan history.
It goes nearly unrecognized and is never mentioned in the west.
From what I've heard the bahai religion is pretty benign stuff. Rather christian-like in its general outlook and emphasis on good works.
But there aren't many bahais left in the world, and the world, in general, doesn't care what happens to them.
Muhammad fundamentally misunderstood the Christian theology of the Son (as with just about anything in the Judeo-Christian tradition) and then he passed on that misunderstanding to other muslims such as Naseem. The Son is one of the terms, albeit a preferred term, for one entity (person) of the triune God. Other terms also used for this same divine entity/person of the triune God include Word (Logos), and Wisdom. The Son was identified with the Wisdom calling out in the Book of Wisdom, and with the word spoken by God in opening of Genesis to bring the world into being (see prologue of John). Muhammad confused the Incarnation of the Son with the beginning of the Son in time. The Son pre-existed, He had no beginning in time, and the entity denoted the Son includes much more then what can be described by the Son term (or any other human term). In the Incarnation, the divine entity of the Son took on a human body AND a human soul, which human soul was created at the time of the Christ’s bodily conception (like other human souls are). During death at the Crucifixion, that human soul separated from the human body, but the divine entity the Son itself remained nearby as it were, until the human body and human soul were all reunited and changed into an immortal glorified body and soul in the Resurrection. The general belief of early theologians was that any of the two other distinct persons of God could have been incarnated too accomplish the same thing (thought this may have changed the terminology as we would now probably call that entity the Son), God just happened to choose the entity/person we now denote the Son.
With respect to the necessity of the Incarnation, it was believed that when God created the forerunner of the human race, He endowed him with free will, because without free will there cannot be true love. The forerunner of humanity was given to partake in contemplating the vision of God, and could have chosen to move closer and be with God forever, but he choose to turn away instead. When he did this, he brought death, suffering, and sin into the universe, because since God is all-encompassing being, any turning away from Him has those results, as it is a turning way from being to non-being. This state of things was passed on to his offspring, but so was free will. The Incarnation was God healing the now-disordered universe by embracing it as it were, by the Incarnated Person of the Son passing through physical death in the crucifixion and thereby transforming physical death (for those who accept the Son the Father sent) into a process that instead ends in a glorified body and soul which is perfectly united with God through the Incarnated Son who now has a dual nature, a divine and human. Of course, one is still free to reject the Son the Father sent, and instead eternally unite himself with Lucifer and the other fallen angels, because God wants true love, which cannot be forced… So, when correctly understood, there is nothing disgraceful the Incarnation of the Son, on the contrary….
Judge Sayed Nofal, speaking after reading out the verdict, said [SNIP] ... “As for the Bahais, Islamic jurists have all agreed that the Bahai faith is not one of the three recognized religions,”
I have to admit to a certain amusement at the sheer brazen ignorant backwoods arrogance of this.
It's a little like listening to a 4 year old pontificate about the nature of life based on his knowledge of the local playground.
Most of the people in the world today have been raised in the Buddhist, Confusian and Hindu traditions (or strait-up natural paganisms) that have nothing whatever do with the Bible or the Koran.
... the three recognized religions as if the recognition of these neanderthals were something all the rest of us were interested in.
Jeepers creepers! They don't recognize Buddhism! Ever hear of the Chinese empire? Don't recognize Hinduism! Ever notice a little spot on the map called INDIA!?!?!
And they sit there with comical clothes and funny hats insisting that the rest of the world earn their worthless recognition!
But you have to admit, it does have a funny side.
So, in appreciation of all this fine humor, when do we schedule the aerial bombardment?
Oh man! Who is masterpiece of creation on this earth, whose body received the final shape in the dark regions of his mothers womb, behind thick overlapping curtains, remember that you are made out of dust, and for a fixed period (while your development was going on) you were kept concealed from human eyes. Your movements there were hidden, you could not hear anybody and nor could reply if addressed to. Then you were given birth to in a place which was quite new to you, where you were a stranger, where you did not know what was good for you and what was harmful. Who taught you to obtain your food from the breast of your mother and who taught you to suckle milk? Who taught you to express your pleasure and demands with your movements and cries? Verily when you cannot fully understand your ownself, how can you understand your creator? It is impossible for you to understand God from the attributes which are meant only for His creatures.
Imam Ali (as) Sermon #166
Nahjul Bhalaga- The Peak of Eloquence
http://www.aimislam.com/forums/index.php?s=e2aff76ddc7c2937a0679bc50ff9b5d0&showtopic=1824&pid=8848&st=0&#entry8848
IT SEEMS THAT IMAM ALI 'THINKS' HUMAN REASON IS A WASTE OF TIME. THIS EXPLAINS A LOT.
[....]
"Peaceful tenents of Islam are adhered to and someone after Muhd. was considered a spiritual leader."
Uh, gee, Naseem. Would that someone to whom you refer be the founder of your rather eclectic sect of Islam, or are you talking about one of the many assassinated claimants to Mohammed's mantel?
"It is interesting to ask the question though 'Why should Muhd SAW be the last prophet?'"
According to the vast majority of the world's 1.3 million Muslims, it's because Mo said so.
"It has been 1600 years since Muhd...why wouldn't God send somebody else to build upon (most of the) the good work of Mudh."
Aside from inflating the number of years since Mo's departure... ...possibly the answer is that Mo didn't build much of a foundation. Rather Mo and his followers have scorched our world with a virulent hatred that once again is becoming ascendant.
"Even with Christianity Jesus was the 'son of God', he was the only son , he was crucified...and that's it now. As the only son ...there can be no more...and therefore no more prophets."
Sorry, Naseem, but that's quite the conflating of ideas. "Son of God" =/= "Prophet".
"Muhd said in similar fashion....'I'm it...the top of the tree and there shall be no more'."
So, Naseem, you acknowledge that Mo claims to be the last Prophet, yet you go on below to say that you don't accept such a claim.
"The question is why?...Dr. Ronan Williams is a clever man, the current pope is a clever man,
lots of Holy men in India, Pak, the Saud, but where are all the new prophets?"
Although Benedict is indeed a brilliant man, RoWan Williams is a ponce. And, per above, just who are you asking for answers from. The non-Muslim 80% of the world who reject that idea, or the Muslim 20% who accept that Mo is the last prophet?
[...]
"Don't you folks kinda smell something fishy here?"
Posted by: Naseem at December 17, 2006 07:23 AM
Naseem: we smell something a lot worse than fish that's beyond its "best before" date.
imo the most divine of religions is advaita hinduism which teaches we are god
though i dont like the un i think the udhr gives blanket rights to religionists regardless of the religion & nations that dont want to be called hypocrites should abide by that. another right is the right to a job which the us doesnt abide by but it would freely acknowledge it doesnt. im sure egypt doesnt either. one wonders how many un rights egypt doesnt adhere to
god...
Only the USA and Israel must adhere to the many Geneva Conventions and UN Human Rights decrees. Oh, and even when they do, they may be pilloried before the UN Security Council for commiting war crimes that they didn't commit while the palestineans commit war crimes and get off scot free. Well at least in the UN. Those pesky, Geneva Convention approved, Israeli bombs tend to take out many of them.
To ISLAMSFORLOSERS:
In answer to your question about Baha'is being characterized by the jihadists as "pro-Israel," I might be able to shed light on this because my wife is an Iranian-born Baha'i. One of the Bahais' main shrines is in Haifa, Israel, close to the Lebanon border. The Israeli government generously permits Baha'is from all over the world to make pilgrimages to the shrine (of course with all the necessary security checks). Hizbullah would have loved to hit that shrine last summer, and I'm sure that it will be hit once they recommence their war after this hudna. In short, the Baha'is of the world have a very friendly relationship with the government of Israel.
One reason I can't be a Baha'i myself (nor a "real" Christian for that matter) is that Baha'is are totally pacifistic and are not supposed to fight back with physical force when persecuted. There have been many heroic Baha'i martyrs (in the true sense of the word, one who suffers for his/her faith WITHOUT causing harm to others) in Iran since the 1979 Islamist takeover, but their sufferings get little coverage in the Western media, which is too worried that focusing on such sufferings might be "Islamophobic."