British Muslim leader: Only Muslims are innocent

i have been saying this from the time i started reading the qu'ran and hadiths! on ly muslims are considered "innocent" by allah. which makes the killing of nonmuslims , men ,women and children legal in islam!
there is an ayah in the qu'ran stating there is no recompense for a muslim killing a nonmuslim!
i will find it and post it here shortly!

It's the same old, same old.

Some random Muslim lies to the media and get lauded as a reformist.

Another gets prodded, after MUCH lying, and tells the truth about Islam. They are reviled and labeled as "extremists".

We see this particular lie all the time. Islam does prohibit the killing of innocents. We just don't see the fine print on the bottom that non-Muslims are not innocent by default.

As to why no one in law enforcement challenges these people, especially those who state the truth about Islam on television? Well, thats the $64,000.00 question, now isn't it?

Re: "He is entirely ready to condemn attacks on innocent civilians, but he notes that because non-Muslims have rejected Islam, none of them are innocent. Therefore attacks like 9/11 and 7/7 are perfectly justified".

This is a mental illness that warps perception and rationalizes crimes and exploitation of Unbelievers. To treat a belief as if it is a fact is mental illness. This individual, and people like him, belong in mental hospitals. These are psychiatric cases in ecclestiacal costumes. Eventually, people in authority are going to realize that that's true. He should not be on tv and talking about his delusions-he should be in a mental hospital.

"As to why no one in law enforcement challenges these people, especially those who state the truth about Islam on television? Well, thats the $64,000.00 question, now isn't it?"

Forget "law enforcement". Where the hell is the MSM on this? They ought to be following imams down the street asking: "Do you agree with Anjum Chaudri?"

As for me, I'm posting the link to that video everywhere they'll let me. We've GOT to get the word out.

This individual, and people like him, belong in mental hospitals.
Posted by: Frank at December 17, 2006 08:16 AM

Agreed, But it would have to be a really big hospital to accomodate the entire population of the "club of Islam".

these ayats pretty much spell it out. allah is telling the muslims to be sure the person they kill is a non muslims before killing him for spoils!
>>>surah 4}_92-94,It is not befitting for a believer to kill a believer except by accident, and whoever
accidently kills a believer, he is commanded to free a believing slave and pay
bloodwit to the family of the victim, unless they forgo it as a charity. If the victim is
from a hostile nation, then the freeing of a believing slave is enough, but if he
belonged to a nation with whom you have a treaty, then bloodwit must be paid to his
family along with the freeing of a believing slave. Those who do not have the means
(bloodwit and / or a slave) must fast two consecutive months: a method of
repentance provided by Allah. Allah is the Knowledgeable, Wise.[92] Whoever kills a
believer intentionally, his punishment is hell to live therein forever. He shall incur the
wrath of Allah, Who will lay His curse on him and prepare for him a woeful
punishment.[93] O believers! When you struggle in the way of Allah, investigate carefully, and do not say to anyone who offers you a saLutation: "You are not a believer" in order to seek worldly gain by this. Allah has abundant spoils for you. Remember that you
yourselves were in the same condition before. Allah has conferred His favors on you.
Therefore, make a thorough investigation before considering someone an unbeliever.
Allah is well aware of all your actions.[94]

in the qu'ran we find allah sent his most faithful and trusted servant "khizr" to murder an innocent child whose only crime was allah "feared" the child would grow up to be a nonmuslim. Allah states he murdered the child as a "mercy" to its parents!

SURAH 18-74,So they journeyed on until they met a boy, and Khizr slew him. Moses said: "You have killed an innocent person though he had killed nobody. Surely you have done a horrible deed!
SURAH 18-80-81,As for the youth, his parents are true believers, and we feared lest he would grieve them with his rebellion and unbelief.[80] It was our wish that our Lord should grant them another in his place, a son more righteous and better in affection.[81]All this was done as a mercy from your Lord.
What I did was not done by my own will.
Tafsir al-Jalalayn: SURAH 18}-74
So they set off, after leaving the ship, making their way on foot, until, when they met a boy, who had not yet reached puberty, playing with [other] boys, among whom his face was the fairest - and he, al-Khidr, slew him, by slitting his throat with a knife while he lay down, or by tearing his head off with his hand, or by smashing his head against a wall, all of which are [different] opinions (the coordinating fā' [of fa-qatalahu, 'and he slew him'] is used here because [it indicates that] the slaying took place after the encounter; the response to idhā, 'when' is [the following statement, qāla …]) - he, Moses, said, to him: 'Have you slain an innocent soul, that is, a pure one that had not reached the age of [legal] responsibility (a variant reading [for zākiya] has zakiyya), [one slain] not in retaliation for another soul?, in other words, one that has not slain any soul. Verily you have committed an dreadful thing' (read nukran or nukuran), that is to say, an abomination.
Tafsir al-Jalalayn:SURAH 18}-80
And as for the boy, his parents were believers and We feared lest he should overwhelm them with insolence and disbelief - for he is as [described] by the hadīth of Muslim, 'He was [incorrigibly] disposed to disbelief, and had he lived [longer] this [disposition of his] would have oppressed them, because of their love for him, they would have followed him in such [a path of disbelief]'.
Tafsir al-Jalalayn :SURAH 18}-81
So We desired that their Lord should give them in exchange (read yubaddilahumā or yubdilahumā) one better than him in purity, that is, in righteousness and ALLAH-fearing, and closer, than him, to mercy (read ruhman or ruhuman, in other words [it is to be understood as] rahmatan, 'by way of mercy') namely, [closer to] dutifulness towards his parents. Thus ALLAH, exalted be He, gave them in exchange a girl, who [afterwards] married a prophet and gave birth to a prophet through whom ALLAH guided an entire community.
Tafsir al-Jalalayn :SURAH 18}-82
And I did not do it, namely, what has been mentioned of [his] slaying of the boy , of my own accord, that is, [out of] my own choosing; nay, it was because of a command in the form of an inspiration from ALLAH.


Can we not see why muslims are so damn evil and satanic, the diety they worship is satan!

Abu Hamza was just as good, perhaps even better:

He claimed that the infidel in an Islamic state is just like stray dogs, wild animals, like cattle; you can kill it, enslave it, do what you want with it...

Its somewhere on U-Tube, look it up or google 'Abu Hamza al Masri...'

there is no need to ask the so called moderate muslims or officials of C.A.I.R. if they agree with this imam. Ofcourse they agree, it is what allah commands!

awake-

You made me laugh. Thank you.

"Why isn't any law enforcement official asking Muslim leaders (in both the U.S. and Britain) to denounce in clear terms the statement by Anjum Chaudri, that no non-Muslim is innocent?"

Because 'moderate' Muslims have told them time and again that Islam is a peaceful religion which has been hijacked by 'extremists'.

This man is obviously one of the 'extremists'.

Therefore no specific condemnation of his views is needed from the 'moderate' Muslim community (so, please don't ask them for one).

The real problem, of course, is that Chaudri is not a Muslim in Name Only. He's a true believer.

Yep.

Everytime I hear CAIR talking about how the answer to 'Islamophobia' is EDUCATION, I agree with them. Because the more people educate themselves about Islam, TRUE ISLAM, the more they'll start to hear and read things like what this man is saying. THIS IS TRUE ISLAM, and ONLY education on our parts will get the word out to all those sleeping sheep we share the world with. We need to wake up, we need to wake EVERYONE up to this evil we face.

Isn't it peculiar. In the same way that people during the 30's were reluctant to face up to the inevitability of war with nazi germany, so people today are every bit as reluctant to face up to the inevitability of war with iSlam. It's as clear as the nose on my face yet the ones that matter will deny it til they're blue in the face...

we are reliving the 30's and it saddens me the our government officials along with the old media continue to keep their heads in the sand. hopefully with the upcoming younger generation who will not be fooled by the old media, and understand the truth about islam death cult.

"Why isn't any law enforcement official asking Muslim leaders (in both the U.S. and Britain) to denounce in clear terms the statement by Anjum Chaudri, that no non-Muslim is innocent? "

Culturally, I think this is an unworkable and cancerous formulation which, if followed, dooms us forever to be embroiled in the endless Islamic Jihad, the war which Muslims will always wage against us, if given sufficient breathing room, opportunity, and resources. Tolerance of millions of Muslims on our soil, along with the jobs and wealth they are able to extract provides them with the breathing room and the resources to wage their Jihad against us. Allowing them to come here and earn livings which they otherwise couldn't obtain, providing them with welfare benefits which they otherwise couldn't receive, and the immense transfer of wealth from our treasuries which oil and aid to Muslim countries enjoins -- all of these multiply the force and effectiveness with which Muslims are now waging their Jihad.

One of the earliest exhortations from the so-called 'moderate' Muslim community in the West after 9/11 was for America and the West to become embroiled in Islam by entering the fray to support those so-called 'moderates' against their immoderate fellow Muslims. From this insanity we have Governments like Saudi Arabia, Jordan, and Pakistan described as "our 'moderate' Muslim allies" and other such malarky.

This is an Islamic civil war. It is not our civil war, nor should we permit ourselves to be drawn into it.

Again, speaking culturally, if Muslims wish to salvage their religion from their more literal and therefore violent co-religionists, then they should foot the bill far waging that war, not we. And it should be them, NOT US, who suffer and pay the price.

I see scant evidence that Islam is salvageable by Muslims, and I assert that Islam is unsalvagable. There is mounting evidence for this assertion. Given their huge unearned resources, and the inevitable uses they put their wealth to in the US and in Europe (continuing to practice and promote Islam -- continuing to build more mosques, and have more babies) and their intent to stick with Islam, the trajectory of Muslims is going in one direction, and one direction only: Sharia. It is breaking out EVERYWHERE Muslims reside in the world.

Therefore, it's up to Muslims to prove to us that this concept of calling for the 'moderates' to denounce the actions and beliefs of the rest of Islam will have any effect.

I am no lawyer, but legally we have some exemplary guidelines to follow, handed to us by our brilliant Founding Fathers. There are two specific clauses in our Constitution succintly stated in one sentence, and the concepts they enshrine were thought to be so central and so important to our form of government, that they were stated in the very First Amendment. It is the first part of this shining sentence which concerns me, although the second part is also significant in our battles.

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof."

These are labeled "The Establishment Clause" & the "Free Exercise Clause".

"The Establishment Clause" wisely forbids that our Government engage in any poisonous and ultimately self defeating endeavor to establish a favorite or preferred State Religion. This is the majority concept which, to me, forbids us from engaging in the Islamic civil war which their 'radicals' have clearly won.

WE MUST NOT ENGAGE IN THEIR CIVIL WAR BY ATTEMPTING TO SORT OUT A 'GOOD' VERSION OF ISLAM!

Our wise Founding Fathers recognized the bog such follies lead to.

The second part of this shining sentence, the "Free Exercise Clause" ironically is the clause which now ties our hands and inhibits our most effective defense against the Muslim onslaught: The outlawing of the seditous anti-democratic political economic ideology known as the 'religion' of Islam.

Islam must be outlawed in our dominions if democracy is to survive. This "Free Exercise Clause" is the loophole which permits the obvious sedition of Islam to persist in our land. Muslims who are actively engaged in practicing the sedition of Islam or who are involved in any way in the spreading the inimical 'religion' of Islam must end.

THIS is the battleground WE must be concentrating on for our victories. We must not enter that hopeless and insane arena of attempting to sort out the unsortable -- of attempting to fix the unfixable -- of assuming the impossible burden of salvaging Islam from itself.

Ban their civil war from our dominions. Let the bloodshed happen outside our homeland. If the winners (the 'extremists') continue to threaten us -- they will have lost their most important force multiplier: the presence of Muslims in our midst. Without them here, very little could be accomplished through their barbaric Jihad. And this would also forestall dealing with the entirety of the Islamic world in apocalyptic terms. Allowing them to persist in our domain will result in the necessity of annihilating them utterly or allowing them to destroy us utterly.

I believe the Jihadis are already in the process of winning the civil war, and we are only beginning to fathom this fact.

We'd be wise to get on with the business of ejecting the Muslim cancer from our body politic which Islam represents, and set about placing the entirety of Islam on the defensive. Getting lost in the inevitable cul de sacs of hopelessness and inutility which assisting 'moderates' would represent is a folly from which we would never emerge. The slow motion Jihad such an idea enables will destroy everything we hold dear.

I agree with the poster who stated that Islam is a form of mental illness. Any person with even a passing familiarity with the history of Western philosophy can refute Islam's theological and philosophical claims, to the point where any neutral observer would declare Islam's ideas defeated, without breaking a sweat. As a practical matter, the West could eliminate every Muslim on the earth in a matter of a couple of years. These two facts, when contraposed against the Muslim declaration of their superiority, highlight the insanity of Islam. They have neither philosophical nor practical rationales for assuming themselves superior to the West, yet they insist on this superiority daily.

Islam is like a homeless guy proclaiming himself the King of the World.

I'm sorry "moderate Muslims" but the only way you'll get any sympathy from me is to give up Islam. The same way a Communist only got my sympathy by giving up Communism.

I guess I should clarify "slow motion Jihad".

That is their Dawa -- their spreading of Islam by any means -- bakesales at the local Mosque --the birthings of more Muslim babies in our lands -- their spokesman on Western TVs -- their Jihadi propaganda on Western and Muslim channels -- their arranged tribal marriages -- their social and cultural insularity -- their 'outreach' in the jails -- praying in their Mosques and five times a day anywhere -- their funding of 'community centers' dedicated to Muslim pursuits -- their political agitation for more privileges and perks -- Muslims earning Western capital -- ANYTHING which allows or encourages Islam to persist in our domains.

"Fast motion Jihad" or "high speed Jihad" is what their shock troops are engaged in: the bombings, the beheadings, etc.

These are just two sides of the same coin.

You don't have the bombings without the bakesales. You don't have the bombers without the birth of Muslim babies.

They tell us to our face....
we will not believe them.
When someone says they are going to kill you, believe them!

Here is a moderate muslim...
http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,20877022-5001021,00.html

But, is she really a muslim at all?
Will she become radicalized when she gets married, and has kids? As we all know there is no moderate islam. Moderate muslims have to ignore what the qur'an and hadith say to remain moderate.

They tell us to our face....
we will not believe them.
Carolyn2, they killed 3,000 people on 9-11, and still many do not see this as an attack, but like the Clintonoid and Warren Churchill-liberal proffesors blame the west, like we deserve this destruction. these liberals would be the first ones killed in a muslim land.

Anjum Chaudri of the Omar Bakri group of jihadists in Britain,

another thing why is this man even allowed to be breathing! hey do the Brits have exra radiation poison for the SOB?

These are the community leaders. They say non Muslims are NOT innocent.
They represent the average Muslim man on the street.

The average Muslim man man on the street is NOT moderate.

The average Muslim man man on the street s NOT ouraged at these comments.

The average Muslim man man on the street Is NOT protesting these comments.

The average Muslim man man on the street silently supports Jihad.

The average Muslim man man on the street Is NOT our friend!

The average Muslim on the street ........

Really needs to Prove otherwise!, Before it's too late and irrelevant for them.

Agreed AIG !

As with the jihadists call for us to accept Islam or Perish, knowing full well that we will NOT accept it, I like to do tha same in my posts . Calling on Moderates to ACT before it's too late ( for them too), Knowing full well THEY will NOT do anything.

We have to keep calling for them to step up so that when they are Counted among the Enemies of the West( which is innevitable) , we can say we gave them a fair chance to side with Civilisation.

It's up to THEM now , IMO

I noticed how the 'Moderates' claim that killing innocents is wrong, but that non-muslims are not innocent. Therefore, all the 'Moderates' have condemned is the killing of Muslims which is already listed as wrong in the koran.

They do not say that killing women and children is wrong!
They do not condemn the murder of Christians and Jews!
Do not look these people with trusting eyes.
They lie and lie and lie.

This Chaudry character is a real gem. What a spokesman for islam! He is probably a moderate one compared to some of the others out there and unfortunately Great Britain has alot of vipers amongst them.

The Brits need to wise up and deport guys like this. Guys like Chaudry want to undermine the UK and take it over.

Classic malignantly narcissistic personality disorder, common to folks of that entire sect.
Hence the 2-rule law...

1) islam is always right
2) if islam is wrong, rule 1 takes precedence

Thanks to yet another islamofascist for proving me and my colleagues here right once again.

;-)

He has one of those faeces , sorry faces you
wouldn`t stop slapping

of coarse only Muslims are innocent because infidels having rejected Allah and his pedophile prophet mole am mad have committed a crime against Allah and his perverta least in Muslim eyes that is, probably the only cure for fanatics like this is castration so they cannot pass on their genes and give him back to Saudi Arabia for that matter I think that is why most of our Western politicians to not stand up to the Saudi's because at some point the politicians will become lobbyists and the Saudi Arabians pay the best

"innocent" - Yet he has his own definition of it.
(I'm even amazed he shared it!!)

Haven't these double-speak word games been part of almost every major Heresy of Christianity?

For the Islamaniacs innocent victims are as plentiful as moderate Muslims are for us.

I would like to suggest the following exercise in truth about Islam:

I suggest that Jihad Watch, and any number of other anti-Jihadist organizations, band together and ask Harvard university to host a debate between Anjem Choudhury, and team members of his choice, and a team consisting of members of CAIR and the Figh Council of North America.
The question to be debated would be "Were those people killed on 9/11 and 7/7 innocent victims of criminals and murderers, whose actions were inconsistent with Islamic scripture, or were they guilty of crimes against Allah and, therefore deserving of their fate?"
Harvard would issue formal invitations to all debate team members.
The invitations and the subject of the debate should be as highly publicised as possible, and Perhaps C-SPAN can be induced to commit to televising the event.
I have no doubt that such a debate will never take place, but it would be interesting to watch CAIR and the Figh Council of North America, worm their way out of the invitations, knowing full well that Anjem Chouhury's team would wipe the floor up with them. At least then, CAIR and the Figh Council can no longer hide behind meaningless Fatawas and bogus arguments about Islamic scripture not justifying acts of terror.
This could be CAIRS great opportunity to prove to the world that ISLAM has been hyjacked by extremists who don't really understand the teachings of Allah and his Prophet.

Perhaps "discussion" is a more accurate term.

Some things simply are not debatable...we've overkilled that term anyway (especially the politically correct crowd who thinks everything is relative, and up for a debate).

That would only end up another big ad hominem shouting contest, and that, even IF the islamofacists agree to it (don't hold your breath on a neutral, unbiased setting though...they never show up).

Can you imagine the world outcry if Americans said "Because radical islamics Christianity- attacks on ALL muslims is entirely justified"? There would be an immediate war against us with no questions asked. Yet, incredibly, imams spout their crap day after day telling the world that it is perfectly to attack ALL infidels because they don't accept Islam? http://sacredscoop.com

ISALMOPHOBIA REDEFINED:

ISLAMOPHOBIA "irrational fear of Islam" exists!

In fact it is real and it is all over, and deeply infests our MSM, our news-tickers, our wimpish 'reporters' who have become spin-docors and accomplices of the cult...

It is not US who are afflicted by it because we fight it, we resent and confront and embarrass the Mohammedan infil-traitors head-on, but those who are supposed to inform us, ' unbiased without fear or favor' are failing in their duties because of an irrational fear: Islamophobia!

These people are infected by PC and Islamophobia just like full blown AIDS!

...or in this case, perhaps "infested" may be as accurate. lol

British Muslim leader: Only Muslims are innocent

A double standard here. If I spoke such vile about my neighbour in public, I would be arrested.

If a western nation declared only Christians/Jews are innocent, it would plunge the muslim world into a murderous frenzy.

Don't worry! The DoD has a plan. It's the "generational war" strategy. Included is a perceived need to "show the errors in Islamist extremist thinking” The DoD should get going right away and write a nice letter to Choudhury explaining why he's wrong.

See:
http://www.washtimes.com/national/20061213-010657-5560r.htm
General foresees 'generational war' against terrorism
By Bill Gertz
THE WASHINGTON TIMES
December 13, 2006

I'm glad the "generational war" strategy has had some attention focused on it. I think it'll get a bunch of us killed! We need a "defeat now" strategy on the table in the Pentagon--soon. And, we need some "kill the bastards" type generals. The premises of the "generational war" strategy need to be discovered and challenged.