Umran Javed Update. His strategy here is different from that of Mohammed Bouyeri, who spoke proudly about what he had done. Javed, he just got carried away, you see. And why should anyone take him seriously? After all, it isn't as if there have been jihadist bombings on British and American soil. What's that? 9/11 and 7/7? What are you, some kind of evil Islamophobe?
From Gulf News, with thanks to Jeffrey Imm:
LONDON: A British Muslim said yesterday he regretted calling for the United States and Denmark to be bombed during a protest in London last year against publication of cartoons depicting the Prophet Mohammad.Umran Javed, who is on trial accused of soliciting murder and inciting racial hatred, told London's Old Bailey criminal court he got carried away during last February's demonstration outside the Danish Embassy in the British capital.
He said he had not intended to say anything at the protest, prompted by the publication of cartoons in a Danish newspaper that many Muslims considered insulting to Islam, until a megaphone was thrust into his hands.
"I regret saying these things, they were just soundbites, slogans," said Javed, 27, who had travelled from his home in Birmingham, central England, to take part in the demonstration.
"I do not want to see Denmark being bombed or the USA. I was disappointed I said these things. I made the statements in an emotionally charged atmosphere. These things were the only thing that came into my mind."
And what kind of thinking did you grow up with, that brought such statements to mind in your anger?
"I do not want to see Denmark being bombed or the USA. I was disappointed I said these things. I made the statements in an emotionally charged atmosphere. These things were the only thing that came into my mind."
I think this is a good example of what Hugh calls "the atmospherics" of Islam. If your first thought when someone insults you is that you want to kill them, something quite destructive of "the good life" has been bred into you.
Of course, a nice empirical study showing the homocidal aggression levels in Islam relative to other religions or cultures could be constructed around something like this. A cultural Rohrschach Test in response to pictures of one's religious symbolism being desecrated, if you will. I'm pretty sure the results would show that Muslims first response is much more violent, on average, than anyone else's. Reason enough not to allow them to immigrate to the West, where criticism of religion and blasphemy are simply seen as free speech.
"LONDON: A British Muslim said yesterday he regretted calling for the United States and Denmark to be bombed during a protest in London last year against publication of cartoons depicting the Prophet Mohammad."
What else is he going to say when faced with a damp jail cell?
Javed is a liar.
He meant what he said when he said it.
He merely regrets getting caught and brought up on charges.
I wager he feels picked on - "victimized" - and resents the prosecution.
What else is he going to say when faced with a damp jail cell?
I'm guessing it will contain the words "death" "America" and "Denmark", with probably "Israel" thrown in there too. These people are the archetypal "one-track minds". Hopefully, the whole stupid mindset they have is on a track to complete extinction.
Could this be by any chance the same Umran Javed who when interviewed by the BBC in October 2001 said the following as a spokesperson for Al Muhariroun:
UMRAN JAVED
Al Muhajiroun
'For us Muslims living here in Britain, the military institutions within this country are legitimate targets.
Nevertheless, having said that, our role here as Muslims is one of support for those Muslims who are on the
receiving end in Afghanistan'.
Could this be any chance be the same Unram Javed whose group Al Muhariroun but up posters in Birmingham in 2003 calling the 9/11 terrorists 'The Magnificent Nineteen'?
"I made the statements in an emotionally charged atmosphere. These things were the only thing that came into my mind."
Sounds like another case of successful anti-Western Islamic programming to me.
"I regret saying these things"
Hopefully a judge will regret locking this clown up and tossing away the key.
venividivici
These people are the archetypal "one-track minds".
What do you mean by "mind" in connection with that Umran Javed ?
;-)
If this victim of society goes to jail, what are the odds that he'll come out of prison reformed? With the high incarceration rate of Muslims in the UK, I'm betting he'd come out with a whole new appreciation of living in infidel terra firma.
Oh dear me, I do need some coffee.
Appeared in court DECKED OUT IN FLOWING MUSLIM ROBES AND BEARDS---->>>>
Bearded Abdul Muhid, 18, appeared by via link from Winchester Prison wearing a white skull cap and robes. He denied two count of soliciting murder to those who insulted Islam.
Appearing in the dock, Umran Javed, 26, who had a back beard and wore dark flowing robes, denied one charge of soliciting to murder American or Danish nationals and one charge of using threatening words or behaviour likely to stir up racial hatred.
Bearded and skull capped Mizanur Rahman, 22, who wore brown robes in the dock, denied one count of soliciting the murder of those who insulted Islam, American and British servicemen, and Danish, Spanish and French nationals.
He also denied using words likely to stir up racial hatred.
Bearded Abdul Rahman Saleem, 31, who wore a white skull cap and robes denied one count of using words likely to stir up racial hatred.
Anyone know if this Umran Javed is a welfare bum or whether he actually works?
Well, be careful about the TAQIYA technique. I am sure Javed said this only to mislead the jury, get a light sentence, and , once released, do some greater damage.
After all, this was the pattern of action of the Profiteer of Islam. He would gain confidence, make friends, and then kill two birds with one stone.
Of course there is no honour in Islam, well not by what we in the West call civilised standards.
So this shining wit of Islam will lie his back teeth out and grovel as much as he can claiming victim-hood and misunderstanding, even though caught "bang-to-rights" on film.
Don't hold yer breath regarding sentence though. He will get a slap on the wrist and 6 months less time served and reduction for good behaviour, so he's likely to be released after the case is concluded. All in the course of community relations erhem...you know....to prevent more of the same of why this racist bigot was actually arrested and now finds himself before the court.
Well, be careful about the TAQIYA technique. I am sure Javed said this only to mislead the jury, get a light sentence, and , once released, do some greater damage.
After all, this was the pattern of action of the Profiteer of Islam. He would gain confidence, make friends, and then kill two birds with one stone.
Posted by: proud-hindu at January 4, 2007 08:43 AM
I second that, you're absolutley right.
http://civoc.com/society/?p=111
Umran Javed made the following statement on behalf of al-Muhajiroun who put up posters in Birmingham that glorified the 9/11 terrorists:
"For us to air our views with regard to this issue, should in fact fall into the category freedom of speech.
"I don't see how people should have a problem with it.
"We believe what these individuals carried out on September 11 was an extraordinary event."
A non-citizen? Expel him.
A citizen? Strip him of his citizenship, or at least use the case to craft or draft legislation that will make such behavior treasonous, and grounds for the stripping of citizenship.
And then expel him.
Back to a place where, it is clear, in every respect, he will fit right in. He will not miss the legal and political institutions of the Infidels. He will not miss the emphasis on the individual. He will not miss a state in which Islam does not, as it should, yet "dominate" because it "is not to be dominated." He will miss nothing at all about Great Britain, of which he may be an accidental and disloyal citizen, save possibly for fish and chips.
He can find those, if he looks, in Pakistan.
"These things were the only thing that came into my mind."
.........This is the true Muslim mindset....death , death, death....
obviously , peace, compassion, co-existance did not come into his mind.
He will now say anything to get off the hook, but he will be back shouting just as loudly at the next protest.
"He said he had not intended to say anything at the protest, prompted by the publication of cartoons in a Danish newspaper that many Muslims considered insulting to Islam, until a megaphone was thrust into his hands."
And being a Muslim , he knew what to say. Had he said anything not following the traditional Muslim hate dialogue, he probably would have been beaten or killed.
Imagine what would have transpired had he shouted into the microphone, "Give peace a chance" or "I support Britain effort on the war on terror," or "Praise Bush!"
"I regret saying these things, they were just soundbites, slogans," said Javed,
here's a slogan for you 'Dont Tread On Me'
or this one "Death to Islam"
Shut up and get out of Britian you ungrateful bastard.
As far as I can remember, treason is still punnishable by death in the UK (although wishy-washy liberal leftists would never allow it)and besides, we'd only be sinking to the same level as an islamist (no capital i).
As for Umran Javed, I hope he has a really unsympathetic indigenous British jury who'll find him (and his mates) guilty of all charges brought and ship him back to his native land, British citizen or not.
Even MORE tax payers money being spent needlessly.
"These things were the only thing that came into my mind."
And these are the only things that come to my mind
Life in prison
OT
One of Thailands leading newspaper urges to stay alert and tuned on a possible counter coup. Just rumours?
I hope so, though there are movements of convois reported from which is said they are for the south.
http://civoc.com/society/?p=112
The charming Mr. Javed can be heard in action here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8E4rMJVHyeg
He's at 3 minutes in, I think. The full video can be seen at:
http://www.nefafoundation.org/
Re: "Javed, he just got carried away, you see".-Robert
The differences between Islam and the teachings of Christ boil down to deception. Jesus clearly (all through the gospels) condemns all deception as coming "from the evil one". Mohammad permitted deception.
Jesus' conflict with the Pharisees was based on his condemnation of their hypocrisy-deception. And again and again the Pharisees sought to deceive him. They ask him whether we should give to God or to the state and he asks them for a coin. He asks them who the coin belongs to. They tell him the state. He tells them to give to the state what belongs to the state and to God what belongs to God. He saw right through the Pharisees and they hated him for that.
The mandate to absolute truthfulness, the mandate against deception-hypocrisy, is probably the hardest teaching of Jesus. He said anyone who deceived others and who claimed to be his followers were from "the evil one". If Jesus is right re deception-where does Mohammad come from?
Amen, amen to that Frank
Everyone must know that all Muslims are errorists and quite a few are terrible errorists(t errorists) trying to lead the world into doomsday.
"These things were the only thing that came into my mind."
nuff said.
I don't believe him. I've seen that Video and that guy was in a Frenzy. there is no way that his words got away from him. Boot him out!
Arnie-
Thanks for the validation, Arnie. Once in a very long while I have even got a pat on the head from Hugh. Maybe I'm not so dumb after all.
I was taught that "out of the heart, the mouth speaks" so i'm guessing he said what he meant. Stiff penalties need to be applied to those inciting violence and the penalties ought to include deportation for non-citizens.
hmm. As i type, the jury is out.
For anyone with eyes, a brain and the freedom to use them, this man is guilty as charged.
On top of that, you can hear large numbers of the crowd responding to his every word.
Which will come first?
1) Our governments will accept and admit the menace of iSlum and will refrain from force feeding us this evil.
or
2) Public disorder, brought on entirely by our governments failure in their duty to protect their citizens.
I will ask this question again the next time some iSlumic 'hero' kills women and children in our country, encouraged by Umran Javed, his teachers, his friends and his cult.
DEPORT DEPORT DEPORT
UMRAN JAVED, the Jihadi mussalman, regrets that kafur infidel firangi became a money with a wrench in his mini Jihad. But worry not.. al taquiyya is handy to fool the kafur infidels. All he has to say he regrets.. not elaborating he regrets getting caught!
Of course, a nice empirical study showing the homocidal aggression levels in Islam relative to other religions or cultures could be constructed around something like this. A cultural Rohrschach Test in response to pictures of one's religious symbolism being desecrated, if you will. I'm pretty sure the results would show that Muslims first response is much more violent, on average, than anyone else's.
Posted by: venividivici
Great idea! One could hook them up to one of these brain-scanning devices while showing the images, and add other images such as one of the planes hitting the twin towers, and some of the Mo cartoons, and some of the protest marchers with their "Islam will rule the world signs". Then do the same with Jewish and Christian subjects (and others, time and money permitting). It sounds like a worthwhile dissertation project. Surely one of our foundations would generously fund such a study. Or maybe not, they might be too afraid of the results.
I made the statements in an emotionally charged atmosphere. These things were the only thing that came into my mind."
Isnt there a psychology test, an 'ink blot test' or something, in which one has to say what comes into one's mind immediately, and gives a representation of the mental makeup of the individual.
In this case, bombing Denmark and the USA, or for that matter, any Kuffar nation, is a fair representation of this individual's mental makeup.
In this case, bombing Denmark and the USA, or for that matter, any Kuffar nation, is a fair representation of this individual's mental makeup.
Posted by: DP111 at January 4, 2007 11:55 AM
.. wherever UMRAN JAVED goes in Dar-al-Harb, he and his family will be beasts and pests. Dar-al-Islam is the place for Umma, not Dar-al-Harb! He and his family.. whoever naturalized him and whoever was naturalied by him, in addition to blood relations, have to be kicked out of Dar-al-Harb. Anything less is a mistake to pay for many times over, thanks to his parasitic family, at a later date.
UMRAN JAVED became unravelled when protesting... well he meant what he said, and he is too much of a coward to stand up in court and face the music. he needs to be found guilty and deported.
Obviously, this muslim psychopath feels no sorrow or regret whatsoever, except for himself now that he is on trial for his freedom. It must gall him to know that the "infidels" have the power to take his freedom away and inccarcerate him for his criminal threats. Gee, I wonder why "Allah" is not magically coming to his rescue about now. Probably because "Allah (aka. Lucifer, the Devil, Satan, and so forth) is instead laughing at him from hell for being stupid enough to follow the teachings of his false prophet Mohammed and getting himself into this mess......
By the way, it'll be really funny to see how arrogant he is when he is placed inside a cell with Bubba.............;)
Umran Javed: Another customer waiting for FTD or the British equivalent to offer a "Sorry I Got Caught" bouquet.
Please watch this clip about the cartoon protests but stop the film at the last second, because the balding, white man wearing what looks like a lady's red leotard helping to hold up a banner looks like George Galloway. Does anyone else think so? After all, he had to wear one in the programme 'Big Brother' shown here in the UK.
Here
A little (i.e. extremely off-topic), but has anyone been following this story? They don't give names since they were teens involved, but the author goes out of his way to mention that the police "did not believe the attack had been motivated by race or revenge." Also, there is a follow-up article in The Age indicating that revenge attacks are feared. Revenge attacks on who? What group? Anyone from AU know more about this?
Just curious to find out what's going on there...
SR
The muslim said: "These things were the only thing that came into my mind."...
which is EXACTLY why the dangerous and evil cult, islam, should be outlawed. For, if the 'religion of peace' does not offer moral strength, guidance or boundaries, but instead leaves its adherents with nothing left in their minds but violence, WHAT GOOD IS IT???
None.
I am certain Umram the turban head does regret it just like Saddam regrets being caught and just like every rapist, murderer and child molestor regrets things.
It is time though these "warriors" be delegated as such by Europe and hung just like Nazi's were for war crimes. Let them swing like Saddam and find out the euphoria of Islamnutism has a short drop and no glory.
"Could this be any chance be the same Unram Javed whose group Al Muhariroun but up posters in Birmingham in 2003 calling the 9/11 terrorists 'The Magnificent Nineteen'?"
If so, he's from the same group that around the time of the Iraq invasion had on its web page a picture of the US Capitol in flames, as something for Muslims to strive for.
But he never really meant for anyone to bomb the US? RUBBISH!!!
Evil loves forgetfulness.
I don't believe this sob either.
@SR
From the Article:
"There is no evidence the attack was racially motivated."
"'This is a community with a large number of multicultural groups, and I think we live quite well together down here," Insp Godden said.'"
Maybe not racially motivated. Maybe religiously motivated???
I’ve seen the police fighting running battles with teenagers who had congregated at a disused quarry for a party. They came in riot vans with batons and Alsatian dogs and laid waste to about fifty kids. I ended up neck deep in a river trying to avoid them has they walked round the quarry looking for stray teenagers.
Yet this filth can shout his hate in the centre of London and the police where there to protect his right to protest? No arrests were made. In fact I heard that a van driver who took offence to their sick protest was warned by the police.
No wonder we have no faith in Labour.
http://www.wdcmedia.com/newsArticle.php?ID=2566
"Islam is a political movement that uses religion as a front and god as a weapon."
Posted by: s_sgt7
AMEN!
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/story/0,,1982376,00.html
ISLAM The religion of apartheid.
How in the world can the Pentagon give muslims their own bathrooms.
MONEY.
ref Elephant's question, i wonder if this is ALSO the same guy ?:
http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/008951.php
anyway, the Jury will be meant to be ignorant of any previous activities until after they have decided whether or not he is guilty in this case.
if he is able to persuade them that he is in fact just an innocent fluffy bunny, he will walk, and THEN they will be told about his past.
"the world has never faced such a threat from such a vile and facist ideology." -finger
You are so right! If nothing is done to check blatant and unapologetic Saudi-purchased(opps, I mean funded) economic,militaristic and Wahabbi infiltration, the US, and subsequently the world as we know it, will revert back to something resembling the dark ages. * These would be ideal circumstances only for those who require such conditions to establish(or reestablish) their rule.*
Thank you very much for spelling it out so cleary for us all, BTW,prior to direct Western involvement and assitance with petro extraction and refinement, how many people in the Middle East were physically ill or died due to impurities in their drinking water? The round figure escapes me.
I regret saying these things, they were just soundbites, slogans," said Javed, 27
Yes, he's speaking the truth because the word slogan means 'war cry' in Scots Gaelic, coming from the words sluagh (army) and gairm (shout).
I believe that, as a part of obtaining a building permit for a Mosque, a developer should be required to pay for a ‘Surah 9:29’ impact assessment to be conducted by the hosting community by a consultant of their choice. Increases in policing costs, social welfare costs should be quantified in similar situations. Decreases in housing values should be determined, if applicable.
The developer should be required to mitigate these community impacts through impact fees.
President Bush nominates Muslim for UN ambassador
WHY MUSLIMS NEED THEIR OWN BATHROOM (5 Reasons)
(1) Narrated Abu Huraira: I followed the Prophet while he was going out to answer the call of nature. He used not to look this way or that. So, when I approached near him he said to me, "Fetch for me some stones for ' cleaning the privates parts (or said something similar), and do not bring a bone or a piece of dung." So I brought the stones in the corner of my garment and placed them by his side and I then went away from him. When he finished (from answering the call of nature) he used, them . (Book #4, Hadith #157)
(2) Narrated 'Abdullah: The Prophet went out to answer the call of nature and asked me to bring three stones. I found two stones and searched for the third but could not find it. So took a dried piece of dung and brought it to him. He took the two stones and threw away the dung and said, "This is a filthy thing." (Book #4, Hadith #158)
(3) Narrated Abu Huraira: Allah's Apostle said, "Five practices are characteristics of the Fitra: circumcision, shaving the pubic region, clipping the nails and cutting the moustaches short." (Book #72, Hadith #777)
(4) Narrated Ibn 'Umar: Allah's Apostle said, "To shave the pubic hair. to clip the nails and to cut the moustaches short, are characteristics of the Fitra." (Book #72, Hadith #778)
(5) Narrated Abu Huraira : I heard the Prophet saying. "Five practices are characteristics of the Fitra: circumcision, shaving the pubic hair, cutting the moustaches short, clipping the nails, and depilating the hair of the armpits." (Book #72, Hadith #779)
Here is news from the UK which makes me think that the political leaders there have completely lost their minds:
Minister snubs desperate plea from twins
Ummah News Links
This must be one of those rare moderate Muslims we keep hearing about. Unlike those fanatical jihadists who proudly proclaim their wretched words and deeds in court this guy regrets his words.
Doesn't mean I believe him, however.
How is it that Britain managed to successfully govern a vast Empire for so many centries, but can't govern the Muslims within its own border?
The answer is that it goverened with the carrot and stick. If you behaved yourself and obeyed the laws layed down by British authorities, you were protected and treated quite well, as loyal subjects of the crown. The carrot.
If you failed to obey the laws, or revolted against the crown, they brought the sky down on your head. The stick.
I think that Britain, and all Western Countries, should adopt this same policy towards Muslims living within their countries.
Muslims that prove themselves loyal citizens, who adopt themselves to the values and culture of thseir new countries, shouldn't be treated differently than any other loyal citizen. The carrot.
Those who use the Mosque as recruiting stations for terrorists, or preach against the values and government of their host country, should be expelled immediately, and the Mosque they attended should be closed down. The stick.
Muslims must be made to understand that much more is required of them than just having a piece of paper that says "Citizen". It requires loyality to the their country and its values, and any religious dogmas and doctrines they brought with them can have no claim to their loyality if they conflict with the loyality they owe to their new country.
I think he's lying. Lying and deception is a part of Islam when interests are at stake.
Sen. Boxer Rescinds Award to CAIR Leader
Ummah News Links
Britain should integrate into Muslim values
http://www.littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20070104/D8MEJEU00.html
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MINNEAPOLIS (AP) - Officials at Minneapolis-St. Paul International airport are proposing stiffer penalties - including suspension of an airport taxi license - to Muslim cab drivers who refuse service to passengers toting alcohol or service dogs.
Officials on Wednesday asked the Metropolitan Airport Commission for permission to hold public hearings on a proposal that would suspend the airport licenses of cab drivers who refuse service for reasons other than safety concerns. The penalties would also apply to drivers who refuse a fare because a trip is too short.
Drivers would have their airport licenses suspended 30 days for the first offense and revoked for two years after the second offense, according to the proposal.
"Our expectation is that if you're going to be driving a taxi at the airport, you need to provide service to anybody who wants it," commission spokesman Patrick Hogan said.
The commission is expected to vote Jan. 16 on the request for public hearings.
Airports Commissioner Bert McKasy said the issue raised by Muslim cab drivers who say that carrying alcohol or dogs, including those that help people with disabilities, violates religious beliefs is "unfortunate."
"I think it's pretty much the consensus of the commissioners and the staff that we have to provide good service to the public, and that's pretty much the bottom line," McKasy said.
Each month, about 100 people are denied cab service at the airport. Airport officials say that in recent months, the problem of service refusals for religious reasons has grown. About three-quarters of the 900 taxi drivers at the airport are Somali, many of them Muslim.
Hogan said the goal is to have a new policy in place by May 11, when airport taxi licenses come up for annual renewal.
"We want the drivers to know about the policy in advance, so that if they don't think they can work under these conditions, they have the option of not renewing their license," Hogan said.
Last year, the airports commission received a fatwa, or religious edict, from the Minnesota chapter of the Muslim American Society. The fatwa said "Islamic jurisprudence" prohibits taxi drivers from carrying passengers with alcohol, "because it involves cooperating in sin according to Islam."
Eva Buzek, a flight attendant and Minneapolis resident, said she was recently refused service by five taxi drivers when she was carrying wine as she returned from a trip to France.
"In my book, when you choose to come to a different country, you make some choices," said Buzek, a native of Poland. "I never expected everything to be the same way as in my homeland, and I adjusted. I never dreamed of imposing my beliefs on somebody else."
But Hassan Mohamud, imam at Al-Taqwa Mosque of St. Paul and director of the Islamic Law Institute at the Muslim American Society of Minnesota, one of the largest Islamic organizations in the state, said asking Muslims to transport alcohol "is a violation of their faith. Muslims do not consume, carry, sell or buy alcohol, and Islam also considers the saliva of dogs to be unclean, he said.
Mohamud said he would ask airport officials to reconsider.
But many Somali taxi drivers don't have a problem transporting passengers with alcohol and are worried about a backlash, said Omar Jamal, executive director of the Somali Justice Advocacy Center. Jamal said he supports the tougher penalties.
"We tell the taxi drivers, if you don't want to do this, change your job," he said. "You are living in a country where alcohol is not viewed the way it is in your country."
[-]
Yeah.
The Guardian article
[-]
Britain should integrate into Muslim values
The moral code my parents instilled in me could help counter this country's culture of rampant disrespect
Sarfraz Manzoor
Thursday January 4, 2007
The Guardian
In 2006 the gloves came off in the fight to define what it means to be British. Whereas the dominant response to the London bombings was confusion over how anyone raised in this country could commit such atrocities, the veil debate detonated by Jack Straw and the teaching assistant Aisha Azmi was notable for its muscularity. Sentiments that might once have been considered too insensitive were openly expressed. "The right to be in a multicultural society," argued the prime minister in a speech last month, "was always implicitly balanced by a duty to integrate, to be part of Britain." Behind these remarks was an assumption that integration is a one-way street. However, there are many things that the rest of the country could learn from Muslims.
In the present climate, integration is the only show in town and multiculturalism has joined political correctness as a favoured target of those who feel that their Britain is disappearing before their eyes. Hence the calls, growing ever louder, for Muslims to integrate: no more forced marriages; no more honour killings; accept the rule of law.
Think of the words "Muslim community" and what do you see? A succession of veiled women walking silently behind their husbands? Bearded men gesticulating outside mosques? But there is another version of the Muslim community.
It is easy to dismiss Muslim parents as old-fashioned and traditional, but when the rest of the country is busy wondering how to respond to a culture of rampant disrespect, it is worth considering whether they could learn from Muslim values. Muslim children are more likely to be brought up in two-parent families rather than the single-parent households that are increasingly common in Britain.
Muslim parents also tend to be less interested in child-centred parenting and more into parent-centred parenting. For example, when I was growing up there was no possibility of answering back to my parents, and this was accompanied by an all-pervasive fear of letting them down. This was a model of parenting that put great faith in deference and, while at the time it felt regressive, it was also what kept my generation in check.
My father often used the threat of "what might the community say?" as a weapon to control my rebellious teenage desires. I resented the power that this community had over me, but it is only now that I can appreciate its value. The knowledge of the hardship our parents had endured, alongside their old-fashioned attitudes towards parenting, meant most second-generation Muslims simply did not have the opportunity or desire to cause trouble. Instead we were conditioned not to get mad at whites but to get even, by making something of our lives.
Many members of my parents' generation may have been uneducated, employed in manual labour and unable even to speak English, but they raised their children to value values. They instilled in them a strong moral code, in which children's greatest fear was of bringing shame on their family. Their children learned that responsibility to their parents does not end at the age of 18. That is why so many British Muslims live in extended families today; why my brother lives next door to my mother so that his children can see their grandmother every day; and why our mother does not feel abandoned and useless in her old age. If the greatest weakness of the Muslim community has been its insularity, then that has also been the source of its greatest strengths.
As the clamour for British Muslims to integrate grows louder, it is worth remembering that, amid all the negatives arising from living inside a tightly knit community, there are also positives worth retaining - the greater the integration, the weaker the sense of community. It is the third generation - those in their teens and 20s who have been raised by parents often more liberal than my parents' generation - who are the young men and women now tarnishing the reputation of British Muslims.
Whether the danger is religious extremism, drugs or crime, those involved are largely third-generation Muslims who are so integrated into white society that they are emulating its worst characteristics. Integration did not save them, it created them.
www.sarfrazmanzoor.co.uk
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(5) Narrated Abu Huraira : I heard the Prophet saying. "Five practices are characteristics of the Fitra: circumcision, shaving the pubic hair, cutting the moustaches short, clipping the nails, and depilating the hair of the armpits." (Book #72, Hadith #779)
Posted by: Ynkedoodl2 [TypeKey Profile Page] at January 4, 2007 04:38 PM
l had to laugh at this, it must take a month or so with some of those hairy islamists. like monkey man from iran!
from the www.wdcmedia.com article
Pentagon Advisor Doubts Wisdom of US Militarys Recruiting Muslims
2007-01-04 -- WDC Media News --
(AgapePress) - Retired Lieutenant Colonel Bob Maginnis, a Pentagon advisor and national defense expert, believes U.S. military officials are making a radical mistake by trying to make America's armed services more attractive to Muslims.
The Pentagon has lately gone out of its way to attract Muslims into the U.S. military, citing the need for officers and troops who can speak Arabic and understand Islamic culture. And recently, Deputy Defense Secretary Gordon England said that Muslims and the Islamic religion are totally compatible with Western values.
However, Maginnis disagrees with that assessment. In fact, he contends, "Someone who's an adherent to the teaching of the Koran and then abides by what it says, that person -- as far as I can understand -- is incompatible with Western culture."
The retired Army officer says U.S. military leaders may well agree with his concerns, but they will not go against the policy of the Bush administration or even their commander-in-chief himself. "The President says Islam is a respectable faith, that it's a great faith," Maginnis notes. "If President Bush says there is not a problem, then you can't expect that his subordinates are going to come out with a contrary view."
Obviously, the lieutenant colonel observes, people in the military who live in Muslim-dominated cultures and "who deal with these issues day to day can, in the privacy of their conversations, say the types of things that I've expressed." But even if these military personnel believe, based on their experience of Islam, that its true adherents are inherently anti-Western, he asserts, "they can't publicly state that."
Maginnis feels the Pentagon's policy toward Islam is naïve, at best. And judging by what has happened in Western Europe and other parts of the world where Muslim ideology has taken hold, he believes the U.S. military's ongoing effort to recruit Muslims will prove to be a radical mistake.
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He was probably sworn in on the Koran - it's allowed in UK courts.
Thats what they all say, when they get caught!
At the Old Bailey huh.
Wonder what Rumpole had to say about this.
Anyone?
"I regret saying these things, they were just soundbites, slogans," said Javed, 27
It just that, "soundbites and slogans" that stir the hearts of the masses and sets them in motion.
See "Propaganda," today featured at
http://islamic-danger.blogspot.com/
We must forgive him for he knew NOT what he said . Like Muhammad ,
The Devil spoke " Through him " , he was merely the messenger, perhaps a Prophet of sorts, Cause in Islam that sort of talk can make you famous.
The Devil made him do it .
"Thats the only thing that came into my mind"
Well, Yeah!! Thats what ALWAYS happens when your demon possessed or opressed.
s_sgt7 wrote:
The Pentagon even has 'toleration classes' for Islam - and separate bathrooms - and setting up special places for them to throw down their prayer rugs, etc. That is so totally prejudiced that a muslim can't use the same bathroom as everyone else ....................
Ynkedoodl2 explained:
WHY MUSLIMS NEED THEIR OWN BATHROOM (5 Reasons)
(1) Narrated Abu Huraira: I followed the Prophet while he was going out to answer the call of nature.... he said to me, "Fetch for me some stones for ' cleaning the privates parts....and do not bring a bone or a piece of dung." So I brought the stones in the corner of my garment and placed them by his side and I then went away from him. When he finished (from answering the call of nature) he used, them . (Book #4, Hadith #157)
(2) Narrated 'Abdullah: The Prophet went out to answer the call of nature and asked me to bring three stones. I found two stones and searched for the third but could not find it. So took a dried piece of dung and brought it to him. He took the two stones and threw away the dung and said, "This is a filthy thing." (Book #4, Hadith #158)
.............
It's all perfectly logical, and whimsical, and thus has the potential to become quite a good cartoon.
Followers of 'Mo the Pro' must imitate his example in all things; so no decadent Western toilet-paper for them.
Therefore a much sturdier, separate, plumbing system is required - to flush down all those used stones.
"I regret saying these things, they were just soundbites, slogans," said Javed, 27
The wrong soundbite can get you killed in a Muslim country.
"Last year, the airports commission received a fatwa, or religious edict, from the Minnesota chapter of the Muslim American Society. The fatwa said "Islamic jurisprudence" prohibits taxi drivers from carrying passengers with alcohol, "because it involves cooperating in sin according to Islam."
If the airport commission looses this one, it should issue its own Fatwa:
No cab driver is required to carry passengers judged by the driver to be a potential danger to his country or its values.
No driver is required to carry passengers whose religious faith and practices he considers sinful and immoral.
No woman weaing symbols of bondage, which covers their heads and other body parts, need be transported by drivers who feel they are cooperating in oppresive behavior.
Having just viewed the video made of this rabid dog foaming and ranting if any jury or judge has the slightes doubt about his guilt it would be a tradgedy. I am of course presuming that the video will be allowed as evidence. But the mealy mouthed pathetic excuses he is making are vomit inducing.
well said rational...=;)
Hugh said
Agreed. No society needs to embrace persons who are openly calling for its destruction.
And no society needs to allow emigration in the first place of persons who are working to destroy that society (or in their mind, working to transform it into a perfect model of totalitarian sharia law).
No-one has a right to come here. We can set the standards for those who can join us. Those whose first thought is "Death! Death! Death!" need not apply.
If there is not a codified standard that would exclude Muslim jihadists and Aum Shin Rikyo (the murderous Japanese cult) from entering the U.S./U.K., there should be. Creating that codified standard would be an excellent priority for the new U.S. Congress. It should be their FIRST priority. How could it not be? Surely keeping fanatical mass murderers out of the country is something the political parties could agree on?
What Mr Javed really regrets is getting caught on police CCTV; having no chance of denying what he said or blaming someone else.
His lawyer thinks that an apology will lighten the sentence. Hence, he then regrets what he said.
I'm sure he doesn't regret what he said earlier about the UK and US being legitimate terrorist targets. When he said these things he had no reason to lie.
-Stefcho
I'm a little late in the comments, but I guess everything has been said. He regrets saying this, on the verge of his conviction. What a pansy. At least stand by what you said, because we all know how you truly feel. Integrity is something not known to be amongst his group.
"Whether the danger is religious extremism, drugs or crime, those involved are largely third-generation Muslims who are so integrated into white society that they are emulating its worst characteristics. Integration did not save them, it created them."
www.sarfrazmanzoor.co.uk
-------------------------
So now it's Britain's fault that Muslims can't interpret their own religion. He says he was raised with "Muslim values". Talk about arrogance! Most infidels were raised with the very same values: respect for authority, respect for others. In the era of happy talk and the self-esteem movement and being very careful not to offend others, how exactly did the current white society create people who think they are entitled to push their values onto everyone else?
"Hence the calls, growing ever louder, for Muslims to integrate: no more forced marriages; no more honour killings; accept the rule of law."
No more honour killings? Now it's offensive for Britons to ask Muslims to respect laws that forbid murder? Accepting the rule of law is a burden? Then find a society that is NOT governed by the rule of law. Mohammad, the mountain won't come to you. You have to go to it.
"there are also positives worth retaining - the greater the integration, the weaker the sense of community."
So why did Muslims go to Britain? Did they go to establish New Pakistan or to join the BRITISH community?
"Many members of my parents' generation..instilled in [their children] a strong moral code, in which children's greatest fear was of bringing shame on their family. Their children learned that responsibility to their parents does not end at the age of 18. That is why so many British Muslims live in extended families today; why my brother lives next door to my mother so that his children can see their grandmother every day; and why our mother does not feel abandoned and useless in her old age. If the greatest weakness of the Muslim community has been its insularity, then that has also been the source of its greatest strengths."
That's wonderful to have a close extended family. Family is one of the foundations of society. The breakdown of the family has led to many tragedies in Europe and America, but that doesn't give Muslims carte blance. Families are also a part of a larger community and they have a duty toward others who are not of their tribe or faith.
Even insular communities have a duty to others. The Amish live differently from many Americans, but they obey the traffic laws and pay their taxes, just like everyone else. Muslims cannot escape their own responsibilities toward others in the community.
I see no give on the part of this author. If he can't tell the difference between a headscarf and a burkha then he doesn't understand modern living. If he sees honour killings as a religious right, then integration is clearly not what he is looking for. Muslims want to live under separate rules from eveyone else. That means they need apartheid, not peace (sorry, Jimmy Carter). They need to live in a different nation-state from everyone else and refrain from traveling elsewhere, just as they ban non-Muslims from certain cities, since the nation-state is the current political realm of the world. Empire is dead. Muslims who aspire to a new universal Muslim empire are dreaming. They are also asking for trouble. Muslims who don't stop them in their tracks will bear the burdens of their folly.
Murderers who get caught, regret the murder. A thief that gets caught with the goods regrets stealing. BUT, they really regret that they face the penalty for their deeds. They have a conscience (with knowledge) so they know what they are doing is wrong AND they are expected, as a member of society, to control their behavior.
This guy only regrets the potential for PENALTY...not for what he said. He should pay the penalty for his threatening comments. Maybe THEN, jihadists will learn to shut their mouths and act in a self-controlled behavior.....rather than like animals.
Whether the danger is religious extremism, drugs or crime, those involved are largely third-generation Muslims who are so integrated into white society that they are emulating its worst characteristics. Integration did not save them, it created them."
www.sarfrazmanzoor.co.uk
A VERY STUPID QUOTE
One that implies that the behaviour of the criminal is the fault of the society. Pathetic.
Fact is, there are criminals in muslim countries - and they get their hands cut off or other severe penalties. They exist, but they are CONTROLLED.
So, if Britain is to blame at all, it is that they have not squashed these idiots when they reared their ugly heads.
What disturbs me much more than the idiotic remarks is:
1. the decision to prosecute the agitator under the hate-crime nonsense, because whatever sentence the guy gets will be both short lived and counterproductive in that the trial is only being undertaken so that VERY HEAVY PENALTIES CAN IN FUTURE BE IMPOSED ON THE LIKES OF US WHO CAMPAIGN AGAINST ISLAMOSPREADIA. Javed is the sacrificial pig who will be feted and recompensed by the musslime for his services to the cause.
2. the failure of the Metropolitan Police to intervene under the lame excuse of the greater good. Public Order offences were ignored merely to placate the islamofascists.