Has anybody seen our nukes?
Nothing to be concerned about. It isn't as if there are any jihadists in Pakistan who could get hold of this material. Go back to sleep.
"Pakistan downplays radioactive ad," from the BBC, with thanks to Jeffrey Imm:
Pakistan's nuclear authority has said there is no cause for concern after it published press adverts for information on "lost" radioactive material.The adverts urged members of the public to inform officials if they found any "lost or stolen" radioactive material.
Mabel! Look at that thang in the backyard! It's a-glowin'!
They were published in major Urdu-language newspapers in Pakistan.A spokesman for the nuclear authority said that there was a "very remote chance" that nuclear materials imported 40-50 years ago were unaccounted for.
International concern over the safety of Pakistan's nuclear programme was expressed in 2004, when the country's top nuclear scientist, AQ Khan, confessed to leaking secrets to Iran, North Korea and Libya.
yoall grab a goat and let's commence to barb a quen, hell with charcoal briquetts.Just wear your Oakley's.
Well, a nuclear detonation in a Western city just came a step closer, it seems. What are our leaders prepared to do when it happens?
I keep wondering if I should push my somewhat elderly parents to move out of NYC. My brother out of Queens.
If a nuke goes off in D.C. or NYC, or London, what will happen next? What counterstrike would be meaningful or possible?
Washington would perhaps destroy Tehran and several other Iranian cities. Certain governments would perhaps be required to become utterly transparent or face obliteration. The American approach to Shinto might be applied to Islam internationally. The political side elements in the core of Islam would be mercilessly crushed.
The U.S. population might quickly abandon its biggest cities for smaller ones and become more of a telecommuter internet economy.
A true manhattan project for alternative energy would start.
U.S. Muslims would either be rounded up and put into internment camps or would be put under the most intense kind of surveillance. All the Saudi Arabian-influenced mosques would be closed -- in fact all mosques would probably be closed, and all jihad preachers thrown in the brig to rot for a long time, perhaps forever.
The hate-education in Muslim schools in the Middle East would be compelled to stop, on pain of total annihilation of the state harboring those schools.
If London were hit with a nuke, presumably similar things would happen there. Other European states would have mixed reactions, some perhaps following the patterns of highly invasive social control that would be set by London. The influx of Muslim immigrants to Europe would be stopped, Muslim illegal immigrants would be deported.
Non-European states with Muslim minorities might in some cases take even more extreme measures than the Western state actually hit by the nuke.
Some Muslim states might become highly unstable, as secular groups, or other outgroups, take desperate measures to get hold of the levers of the state in the hope of saving it from possible destruction.
Presumably there would be a worldwide economic depression, as U.S. borders shut down or tighten drastically, putting a huge dent in international trade.
Nuclear powers everywhere would have itchy nuclear trigger fingers pointed at every possible enemy.
Khan was technical adviser to bin Laden's atomic project and the person who rigged the Soviet bombs bin Laden purchased.
All this material is is just a missing pile added to the tons "missing". America pulled out of Iraq 1.77 TONS of French refined uranium weapons grade material out of Niger (remember Joe Wilson and Valerie Plame this is what he was sent to distract the world from but DOD found the stuff and took it to White Sands.)
The UK admitted that al Qaeda has been stopped from using several nuclear devices and they were not dirty bombs.
One can hope like in North Korea when the nukes go off they will be 1 kilo ton duds. Not that it will matter to those at ground zero as incinerated is incinerated. Now that America has been forced to leave Iraq, bin Laden will unleash this on the west.
Iraq should have been left a 30 mile kill zone around Baghdad to stop all of this, but the majority was too obsessed with themselves to understand it was keeping America safe.
meant to say "political elements" not "political side elements"
Lame Cherry said:
Where is the evidence of a connection between Khan and bin Laden? Where is the evidence that bin Laden managed to purchase Soviet nukes?
Lame Cherry said:
Yes? Show me where that admission is made.
Traeh, what happens if there's a strike in the bread basket of the U.S. City folks will still die but mostly of their own inability to fend for themselves. One strike anywhere in the U.S., and were all in aworld of kaos.
what happens if there's a strike in the bread basket of the U.S.
Well, I don't think they will because they want NYC and DC more than anything. If they can't get those, they'll go for San Francisco or some other major city. But even if they did hit somewhere in the "breadbasket" it wouldn't do nearly as much damage as in a city. The "breadbasket" is spread out over I don't know how many hundreds or thousands of square miles. A small nuke would totally obliterate an area less than a mile across, and create serious but perhaps temporary radiation damage to a radius out a few miles. There would be hardly any human casualties.
But you are probably right that there would be international chaos.
NOW can we stop treating the Pakis as friends and allies? And start supporting all the religous and ethnic minorites, the Hindus (including exiled Hindus), Christians, Balochis, Sindhis and Kashmiris from Northern Areas as they try to get freedom and pull the coutry apart? Now can we establish the Pakis' long standing support for the taliban and al qaeda, even in parts of Pakiworld where the local population has made it clear they want nothing to do with them? Now can we stop assistance, of any kind, to all muslim countries, (expect maybe the Central Asian stans, Albania provided they cooperate with Serbs over the Kosovo issue and some west African states)? And if that's not possible, at least make it conditional on not pulling s**t like this? Can we stop trying to win *hearts and minds* in Iraq and start trying to win *hearts and minds* of those within the islamic world whose *hearts and minds* we should have been trying to win in the first place? Can we make oil-less islamic despots appeal to Arab oil kingpins for humanitarian aid instead of the West and israel? Can we establish that "Palestine" is a made up entitity, nothing mor ethan an excuse for jihadists, like those who probably now have these nukes, to wage their islamic holy war against *people of the book*?
No, we can't, we can't do any of those things, can we? Jesus f**king christ we are done for, well, at least some of us are done for.
Well put maxwell46&2, most people here think New york, D.C.,Los Angeles, hell even Tampa are so ripe for targetting of a first strike. If and when America is struck, it would be kaos on the streets. Those whom were alive would fiest upon the destruction. And Marshall law would be established. And we would really see how much the French, Germans and Ruskies hurried to our sides.
Is this a late April Fool's day joke? Just because it's covered by BBC does not mean this ad was real. News organizations have fallen for pranks before. And why the hell would someone in the Pakistani govt do something stupid like that? Is there any way to follow up on this, because this is un-bloody-believable.
Since Muslims aren't exactly known for their sense of humor, I'd have to say these ads are not pranks.
I'd prefer to be wrong on this. Someone tell me I'm wrong.
Blowing up the infidels never is.
And the alarmists at JihadWatch go nutso...
Did you know that this is a very popular technique to trace stolen conventional weapons and capture political enemies? If someone "finds" possible nuclear material the government, in the name of national security, then has the right to burst in the doors of everybody in the neighborhood, sweeping up whatever (and whoever) they can find. This happens periodically in militarist states, including non-Muslim ones. Unfortunately, Spencer can't seem to see past the Islamic factor here (or anywhere else for that matter). The BBC is being its traditional sensationalist self, not putting much thinking into what's behind the sound bytes.
An American,
As ever, your idea of "thinking" is actually obfuscation and/or superficiality. Why would Pakistan, of all places, need some sort of smokescreen about nuclear materials going missing to hide behind to supress civil liberties? The fact that Pakistan is what, 99% Muslim, makes the "Islamic factor" a necessary adjunct to the story, not some ideologically motivated attempt to smear Muslims. You are also wrong that the BBC is being sensationalist. Not one quote in the story comes from anyone with the slightest bit of skepticism about the Pakistan government's story about the reason and scope of the ads.
Methinks your thinking methods need to be rethought, or you are just not really understanding what the word thinking actually means.
traeh- You seem to be full of optimism. Instead it will be the usual cluster f**k, as badly handled as Katrina or worse. Naturally it will only be blamed on a "tiny minority..." and all Islamic governments will express their concern and sympathy.
But I do like your ideas. Muslims should worry about us not because of how they are treated now (!) but for the way they will be treated once the next attack occurs. It will be more than a PR problem.
Whoever is President at the time, I would only exhort them to resist retaliation for as long as possible, even years. The tension would be crushing and increasingly effective over time in getting to the people we need to find and brokering arrangements with real clout.
We may be slow to perceive the real threat but these men, driven by their Islamic demons, will never comprehend our war mentality. They have never seen it. But Washington will remain unclear as to the real enemy and this will continue for some time, even after another major attack probably. Only after this phase will it become clear what needs doing and there will be no equivocation.
"no big deal"?...hmmm...
...well, coming from their perspective, cutting innocent victims heads off while rabidly invoking a diety is apparently no big deal either, so this comes as no surprise, either.
All this material is is just a missing pile added to the tons "missing". America pulled out of Iraq 1.77 TONS of French refined uranium weapons grade material out of Niger (remember Joe Wilson and Valerie Plame this is what he was sent to distract the world from but DOD found the stuff and took it to White Sands.)
The UK admitted that al Qaeda has been stopped from using several nuclear devices and they were not dirty bombs.-Posted by: Lame Cherry....where when did you hear/see anything about either of these statements.
This poster was the proud owner of a stateside civilian radioactive materials license for the better part of a decade. Without getting into specifics, there are multiple instances of significant amounts of nuclear materials going missing here in the US every year. Usually it's just thieves seeing something bright and shiny in the back of a truck and the device is eventually returned when the thief finds out that he can’t pawn it.
I can speak through the year 2006; Federal oversight is essentially zero (my license was in a Reciprocity state). State oversight consisted of about 70 minutes spread out over a decade. Nothing changed after September 11th , at least as far as I could tell.
Fiddle anyone? Georgie fiddles while Washington burns...no doubt in some bunker in Missouri in the mean time I will be glowing...
Great...Thanks..
This is all some kind of bad nightmare or I am stuck in a bad episode of Twilight Zone or Dr. Who.
I know the joke will be on me in the end but still I mean just check out the stories on Jihadwatch the last few days and sit back for a few seconds and think...
This is 21st century....right?
Maybe they could do what they're doing for their new cricket coach, and put an ad on their website for lost and found yellow cake. Or Pu-239. Or whatever. They might want to publish photos of the material in question. Of course, if it's Radium, it will become Radon (I'm forgetting the half life of Ra) and finding that inert gas will just be a piece of (yellow?) cake.
"Is this a late April Fool's day joke? Just because it's covered by BBC does not mean this ad was real. News organizations have fallen for pranks before. And why the hell would someone in the Pakistani govt do something stupid like that? Is there any way to follow up on this, because this is un-bloody-believable.
Posted by: wrathofasma"
It is not a joke. It simply means that they have given radioactive material enough for at least 10 devices to the qaeda and are now feeling somewhat shaky about it. This "un-bloody-believable" ad means that the paki establishment is desperately trying to distance itself from the qaeda. Believe me brother, this is not a joke.
" spokesman for the nuclear authority said that there was a "very remote chance" that nuclear materials imported 40-50 years ago were unaccounted for."
The pakis are also giving out statements that the nuclear material that is missing may predate pakistan, i.e., 1947. The British can surely verify if they had a nuclear program in place in the South Asian subcontinent and that this material was passed on to pakistan when it was born in 1947.
arjun.sevak
It's "sister".
An American,
arjun.sevak
It's "sister".
Pakistan, being the sole Islamic nation nuclear weapons, is currently greatest threat to the United States and Western Civilization (not to mention India). The Salafists there are about a bullet away from acquiring these weapons and I think this is the reason why the US has not captured Bin Laden yet- they don't want to. I've supported the US in Afghanistan and Iraq but I've really come to believe that the Bush administration is delibrately not going after Bin Laden because they know the price of Bin Laden will almost certainly be Musharraf (Sadat was killed for far less) and his nukes and that's probably not worth the price at present.
What are others thoughts on this?
Sister.
And the alarmists at JihadWatch go nutso...
Posted by: An American
As usual, what you have to say here reveals more about your motives and character than any other poster. Your ego is part of the dream, not it's source.
not too long ago, Al-Qaeda reportedly cancelled some planned attacks saying "we have something better planned."
I hate unfounded claims.
Come on Lame Cherry what are your sources?
Lost my ass. SOLD to Iran.
from jcom "well, coming from their perspective, cutting innocent victims heads off while rabidly invoking a diety is apparently no big deal either, so this comes as no surprise, either"
very true
Well, Irish, I think that if they could have assassinated Musharraf, they would have done it in a flash. I don't think they give him slack for bin Laden.
I think the Paks are simply protecting him because he is their leader.
Foehammer,
Given how the Pakis couldn't even tolerate satire in their theaters, it's hard to believe that they even know the definition of "prank".
Discounting what they were capable of led us to 9/11.
Some how I don't think it was lost but given to iran??
Just a thought.
Mabel! Look at that thang in the backyard! It's a-glowin'!
ROTFL!! ROTFL.
Part of the American Tribe
Squirrel Hunter
Spider Killer
GOD BLESS THE USA AND HER FIGHTING FORCES AND ALL WHO FIGHT WITH HER GIVE THEM STRENGTH, WISDOM, SIGHT, AND COURAGE TO DESTROY ALL ISLAMIC TERRORIST AND ALL WHO SUPPORT THEM AMEN
D-oh!!!!
Looks like a poster for a Mad magazine parody.
Love that backward question mark.
(Islam is a backward question mark.)
lycaste:
You say I am optimistic. But if a nuke goes off in NYC or DC, or for that matter in any other U.S. city, and the nuke has a yield, say, even a tenth that of Hiroshima, the U.S. response could easily turn out to be much tougher than the one I outlined above. More than half the country would be vociferously insisting on measures that, right now, are completely unthinkable.
A friend recently argued to me that if the U.S. doesn't destroy the Iranian nuke project soon, and it happens that a U.S. city -- any U.S. city -- gets hit by a terror nuke, we then might feel forced to wipe out not just Iran's nuclear program, but the entire country, as perhaps the only way to secure U.S. cities. And that could happen even if we have no clear evidence of what country is responsible for the nuke attack on the U.S. city. In fact a number of our worst and most vulnerable enemies might find themselves rained on by our nukes, I guess. It seems a fairly possible outcome, anyway. I suppose another unthinkable that might become thinkable under the circumstances would be neo-colonialism: the U.S. would invade and take over the oil-rich states, and do to Islam what the U.S. did to Shinto. Namely, tear out, root and branch, all trace of the political part of Islam's core, and ruthlessly destroy anyone and anything promoting the political aspect of Islam.
Would whoever is the U.S. president be able to find it within him/her to "push the button" of nuclear retaliation and consign hundreds of thousands or millions to their deaths? What a heavy responsibility for one person.
Most presidents would probably want to feel entirely sure that, under the specific circumstances, a large part of the U.S. population was demanding nuclear retaliation against the enemy. That way it would be as if a large part of the U.S. population -- not just one man -- was bearing the responsibility of having killed millions.
Sold to Iran??? Nahhh. They already have tons of centrifuges making enriched uranium. If the material has been stolen, more likely it was passed to some terror group, like Al Queda.
As Strangelove had it, "We'll meet again, don't know where, don't know when..."
I wonder if "An American" adopted that nickname because he thought it would be oh-so-clever to have most commenters at this site reviling "An American"! How unpatriotic that would show us to be, if we reviled "An American"!! So he insults and slanders and tries to provoke us into hate-filled responses. Let's not give him the satisfaction.
An American,
Last thread I saw you on, several people, including Robert Spencer, raised logical and factual objections to some things you said. You offered no answer to many of those objections, some of which revealed holes in what you were saying.
That you neither tried to refute the objections to which I refer, nor admitted you were wrong, suggests dishonesty on your part, or at least that seems suggested by the fact that you now reappear, completely unrepentent, offering more free-floating slander: You say Robert can't seem to do such and such, but then you offer no shred of evidence for that vague allegation.
I suggest to all that "An American" should be ignored, as he has no interest in real dialogue, has paid scant attention, if that, to Robert Spencer's writings or the writings of others relevant to this website, and is here in dishonesty and bad faith.
IRAN'S NUCLEAR BOMB:Pakistan & China!
IRAN secured valuable nuclear assistance from two major partners--China and Pakistan.
Both of these countries signed agreements with Iran to train personnel and provide nuclear hardware, although for several years both denied having made such agreements.
When, in October 1985, Sen. Alan Cranston accused China of helping Iran with a nuclear weapons program, China said there was "no relationship of cooperation between China and Iran." [2]
China began training 15 Iranian engineers from the AEOI in nuclear reactor design and research in 1987, and from 1988 to 1991, many more AEOI engineers traveled to China to learn about nuclear technologies, which were then applied at the Esfahan Nuclear Technology Center, according to a 1991 Nucleonics Week report.
Pakistan disavowed signing a cooperation agreement Iran is a signatory to the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty, which Pakistan has not signed. Allegedly, a 1987 deal called for at
least six Iranians to be trained in Pakistan at the Institute of Nuclear Science and Technology in Islamabad and the Nuclear Studies Institute in Nowlore. [3]
Also, a number of Iranian students have trained and may have learned about uranium centrifuge technology at what was then called the Engineering Research Laboratories and is now the Khan Research Laboratories, founded by Abdul Qadeer Khan.
In February 1986, Khan may have visited Bushehr, the site of Iran's commercial nuclear reactor project and other nuclear-related facilities. [4] Revered as the father of Pakistan's nuclear bomb, Khan reportedly paid a return visit in January 1987.
These initial interactions between Khan and Iranian nuclear scientists may have led directly to Khan's assistance in procuring designs and equipment for Iran's uranium enrichment program. Recently, it has been revealed that Khan met with Iranian scientists in Karachi and Malaysia for just that reason. [5]
It is not known whether the training Iranians received in China and Pakistan has fed into a nuclear weapons program. But the recent revelations, as reported in February in the
Washington Post, that Libya had obtained a nuclear weapon design from Khan's network--a design that originated in China--have sparked concerns that Iran may have acquired bomb blueprints.
see http://www.thebulletin.org/article.php?art_ofn=mj04boureston
The only way to get U.S.A. politicians who will protect human rights,represent the average working and middle class citizen instead of the Middle East Oil & Communist Dictators
& their buddies in the White House and Congress is to pass 5 U.S. Constitutional Amendments:
#1. Balanced Trade: every country who sells in the U.S. should buy equal amount of products from the U.S.A.
#2. Public Financing of All Political Elections:(Federal,State, County,City or Township) with no personal or outside contributions, see www.just6.org
#3 National Referendum Vote: (for Federal, State, County, City, & Township)4 times a year where citizens can override The President, Congress, & The Supreme Court and any politician with a 2/3 majority!
#4 Environmental & Worker's Human Rights Amendment-Enforce all worker rights in a worldwide trading partner to unionize, have health and safety standards, human rights
standards including freedoms of religion, assembly, speech & all medias, representation, business & property, and enforce all world standards for environmental manufacturing and disposal of hazardous materials with loss of trade for non-compliance!
#5. No Child Or Adult shall be entitled to citizenship, or ownership of business, property, or financial assets until proven to be a legal resident alien or U.S. citizen or by being the
child of at least one legal U.S. citizen or legal Resident Alien.
Boycott all Muslim & Communist Dictatorships completely and spread the word to your family, friends, associates, and representatives!
By their fruits, ye shall know them...
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http://video.google.com/url?docid=4026073566596731782&esrc=sr1&ev=v&q=9-11+improbable+collapse&vidurl=http://video.google.com/videoplay%3Fdocid%3D4026073566596731782%26q%3D9-11%2Bimprobable%2Bcollapse%26hl%3Den&usg=AL29H20aAIf7Mphmm2nu4VrEe7SmGTr3hQ
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http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4026073566596731782&q=9-11+improbable+collapse
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5236492071990669218&q=9-11+coincidence+theory