"It seems strange that a pro-Western government, supported by the U.S. Army and other NATO countries on its own territory, would seek Russian or Chinese weapons through questionable channels." Indeed it does.
"Italy Probe Unearths Huge Iraq Arms Deal," by Charles J. Hanley and Ariel David for AP (thanks to John):
PERUGIA, Italy (AP) - In a hidden corner of Rome's busy Fiumicino Airport, police dug quietly through a traveler's checked baggage, looking for smuggled drugs. What they found instead was a catalog of weapons, a clue to something bigger.Their discovery led anti-Mafia investigators down a monthslong trail of telephone and e-mail intercepts, into the midst of a huge black-market transaction, as Iraqi and Italian partners haggled over shipping more than 100,000 Russian-made automatic weapons into the bloodbath of Iraq.
As the secretive, $40 million deal neared completion, Italian authorities moved in, making arrests and breaking it up. But key questions remain unanswered.
For one thing, The Associated Press has learned that Iraqi government officials were involved in the deal, apparently without the knowledge of the U.S. Baghdad command - a departure from the usual pattern of U.S.-overseen arms purchases.
Why these officials resorted to "black" channels and where the weapons were headed is unclear.
The purchase would merely have been the most spectacular example of how Iraq has become a magnet for arms traffickers and a place of vanishing weapons stockpiles and uncontrolled gun markets since the 2003 U.S. invasion and the onset of civil war.
Some guns the U.S. bought for Iraq's police and army are unaccounted for, possibly fallen into the hands of insurgents or sectarian militias. Meanwhile, the planned replacement of the army's AK-47s with U.S.-made M-16s may throw more assault rifles onto the black market. And the weapons free-for-all apparently is spilling over borders: Turkey and Iran complain U.S.-supplied guns are flowing from Iraq to anti-government militants on their soil.
Iraqi middlemen in the Italian deal, in intercepted e-mails, claimed the arrangement had official American approval. A U.S. spokesman in Baghdad denied that.
[...]
"It seems strange that a pro-Western government, supported by the U.S. Army and other NATO countries on its own territory, would seek Russian or Chinese weapons through questionable channels," the anti-Mafia prosecutor wrote in seeking the arrest warrant that short-circuited the complex deal.
"It seems strange that a pro-Western government, supported by the U.S. Army and other NATO countries on its own territory, would seek Russian or Chinese weapons through questionable channels,"
The answer to that is simple. There are quantifiable parts of the the government that are not pro western.
This is what happens when you do not crush all the cockroaches.
They end up in the kitchen.
infidel!
Not only "in the kitchen", but posing as the cooks.
And the witchesbrew of the Koran is their recipe.
Anti-mafia, indeed.
Well I aint no genius, if Russia,China,Yugoslovia and any other country that can stamp out AK47 part's and God knows what else to help defeat America. Doesn't have production in arms at this time would therefor be an allie. And how much is comming from pakiland and iranastan?
infidel,
We also have quantifiable parts of our own government,
who aren't pro-western,
that aid and abet these double-agents,
especially after they get busted for telling outrageous lies ("warcrimes" et al) about their own, only to be exposed, fired from their rackets,
especially of running an active coup against a sitting President,
and in turn end up writing books with the same lies, fraud, deceit they just got busted being exposed for, only to get rave reviews by their equally scumbag quantifiable elements in media who actively support them as well...
better known as 5th column elements, who also actively aid and abet said officals-in-question mentioned in topic.
It's no surprise it took place when we have 5th columnists helping them.
The Iraqi government are a bunch of lowlife scumbuckets. They are merely frontmen for the Islamic militias. The only thing worth anything in Iraq is the oil. We need to control that and keep the Iraqis away from it. Without that revenue they can't make significant arms purchases and hurt themselves.
From the AP article:
"In Baghdad, the Interior Ministry wouldn't discuss the AK-47 transaction on the record. But a senior ministry official, speaking on condition of anonymity because of the matter's sensitivity, acknowledged it had sought the weapons through al-Handal.
Asked about the irregular channels used, he said the ministry "doesn't ask the supplier how these weapons are obtained."
Although this official refused to discuss details, he said "most" of the 105,000 weapons were meant for police in Iraq's western province of Anbar. That statement raised questions, however, since Pentagon reports list only 161,000 trained police across all 18 of Iraq's provinces, and say the ministry has been issued 169,280 AK-47s, 167,789 pistols and 16,398 machine guns for them and 28,000 border police.
A July 26 Pentagon report said 20,847 other AK-47s purchased for the Interior Ministry have not yet been delivered. Iraqi officials complain that the U.S. supply of equipment, from bullets to uniforms, has been slow.
A Pentagon report in June may have touched on another possible destination for weapons obtained via secretive channels, noting that "militia infiltration of local police remains a significant problem." Shiite Muslim militias in Iraq's civil war have long been known to find cover and weapons within the Interior Ministry.
In fact, in a further sign of poor controls on the flow of arms into Iraq, a July 31 audit report by the U.S. Government Accountability Office said the U.S. command's books don't contain records on 190,000 AK-47s and other weapons, more than half those issued in 2004-2005 to Iraqi forces. This makes it difficult to trace weapons that may be passed on to militias or insurgents.
The Pentagon, meanwhile, has described the Interior Ministry's accounting of police equipment as unreliable."
- - - - -
So we're talking about Iraqi officials who back the Shi'ites (presumably followers of al-Sadr?) attempting to buy a hundred-thousand-plus weapons in preparation for the civil war? Where did this $40 million come from? My taxes? (= the millions of dollars unaccounted for at the beginning of the war when we were passing stacks of cash out like candy?) Hmph!
Glad the Italian anti-Mafia forces were on the ball!
"It seems strange that a pro-Western government, supported by the U.S. Army and other NATO countries on its own territory, would seek Russian or Chinese weapons through questionable channels"
Why strange? The US does plenty of business with China, despite its questionable practices. Why shouldn't Iraq?
Pro-western? That's an odd way to describe a government that supports militias that are conducting their own war against the NATO countries trying to help their nation and its people on the road to freedom.
Questionable channels? Who provided the weapons? The multinational arms manufacturers that are peddling their wares? The same companies whose wares are bought by the US military?
Aaah, globalism.
"The same companies whose wares are bought by the US military?"
We don't use AK-47s
But china has been actively involved with terrorists in the same manner as the saudis...from...day...one.
They wrote the book on it...
http://www.newsmaxstore.com/nms/showdetl.cfm?DID=6&Product_ID=889&CATID=13&GroupID=58&CFID=8096815&CFTOKEN=bfbdc011c54a8810-5C841FBD-1372-63AB-A5740A64DC18E517
...and then bragged about it, too.
http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2002/9/24/143618.shtml
THAT will be THE main event (as we've known it for decades, as per decoded, cracked chinese military codes...but that will come later.
Very shocking, jcom. Yet we continue to strengthen China through trade. Russia too. They are both enemy states.
Sad to say, yep...but better to take the enemy out piece by piece (read that as by country) rather than having to take the whole thing on at once (see Shanghai Cooperation Organization).
This way, it will force THEIR hand and give themselves (read that as their treachery) away to the entire world, and face the music (and inevitable downfall)...or they will continue to sweat it out, pretend to be allies hoping nobody will take them to task, and hope the west will be too exhausted to take them on when they are ready (see their alarming rate of military buildup, while their lackeys in the islamist jihad keep us busy-that's NO coincidence, but it is, entirely another forum).
Besides, they're sweating out a LOT more than just about US...
Russia:
-it's plummeting population,
broke,
-selling arms to keep afloat until oil money rolls in,
-lack of enough clean drinking water,
-lack of arable lands from irrigating with salt water (morons) like the Aral Sea situation
-horrifically polluted areas they'll pay for in spades for their militarism (Chernobyl/Pripyat 1986, Kyshtym/Chelyabinsk 1957, Murmansk/Polyyarny naval base et al),
-and that's just the tip of the iceberg
China, it's
-not enough (private) banks,
-not enough women (because their 1-child policy has also coincided with their "birth control" eliminating alarming numbers of female babies & a dispurportionate number of male/female ratio,
-not enough clean water,
-let alone enough water for irrigating crops to feed their own,
-spending exorbitant amounts on their propaganda jewel known as the Olympics, and
-knowing they can only attack Taiwan or feed their own-but not both,
-can attack us, or feed their own-but not both, -and their unemployment is higher than most industrialized nations (10%+) triggering riots for various and obvious reasons.
Like the CIA long-range threat matrix told Bush in 2001 upon his sitting down in the oval office chair...this century's power wars won't end up being fought over oil...it will be over water.
Wake up Americans, no one with a "C" average in University should be President. Yes, that was GW Bush's marks in university.
Amongst your 300 million people, democrat or republican, surely you have some smarter people.
As for Iraq, the people there chose sectarian vengeance over democracy, death over life. Make a plan to get the non-Muslim Iraqi's out of the country and then cut & run.
Don't throw good money after bad, and squander more lives trying to make Iraq work. Get out before you screw your economy and take the rest of the Western world with you.
What do you expect from parties with names that sound like: World Subjugation Party, Slaves of Allah Alliance and Sharia Now League?
jcom - good points.
Other 'wild card' is the exponential growth of full-on hard-headed persecution-resistant Christianity at the grassroots in China. It's heading toward 10 % of the population, and affecting not only the peasants and the merchants, but the intelligentsia. Officially, there's persecution. BUT - at local level, Christians tend to be such stable, hardworking, peaceful, productive people that the local party chiefs turn a discreet blind eye, since large numbers of Christians make their job easier (less crime, less alcohol abuse, etc). And - Christian Chinese couples, if their 'one permitted child' is a daughter, welcome her and bring her up. This will create some interesting demographics in future...if a high percentage of available brides are devout Christians, there will be a huge incentive to lonely young men to convert.
Something similar happened in Greco-Roman pagan society 1st-4th century - the Christians, having inherited Jewish ideas about marriage and the raising of daughters, had a. more children than the surrounding society and, even more importantly, b. MORE DAUGHTERS, since the pagans practised female infanticide wholesale. Combine that with the Christian girls and their parents insisting on Christian husbands, and the Empire turned Christian as much by marriage as by anything else.
The Christian 'wild card' is also there, in Russia. About 50 % of Russia is estimated to be Christian; most of those would be fairly committed, having survived the Soviet persecutions. There is, at present, no significant persecution of Christians in Russia - not like under the Soviets. Go to the United Bible Society website and follow the links to find out what is happening in the Russian Federation: nothing less than an effort toward reconversion of all the Russias. An enormous effort of translation (into the non-Russian languages), publication, distribution, evangelising, and works of mercy and charity. They're handing out BIBLES to members of the Russian army; they go into the prisons, into the schools (yes: the Bible is being given to kids in Russian schools, with the government's knowledge and approval!), even the Duma. The Tartars are converting. And Russians who become Christian tend to drop the grog, work, form families, live positive lives. Even secularists should hope that that shift toward a literate, intelligent Christian faith in Russia may become a flood - it could save Russia, and the world.
I urge American Christians who fear Russia, and China, to do the following: pray; donate to the work of the Bible Society spreading the word in both countries; find out what other reputable agencies are at work, partnering the Russian and the Chinese churches, and support them. And, of course, make sure the Russian and the Chinese Christians get access to good, informative books about Islam (above all, Mr Spencer's invaluable works).
(Perhaps the Russian and Chinese ambassadors in the USA and elsewhere need to be presented with complimentary copies of the 'Politically Incorrect Guide to Islam and the Crusades", or a copy of 'The Legacy of Jihad' with all the bits relevant to their own histories, carefully highlighted).
If Russian or Chinese leaders think they can manipulate the jihadists against others, whilst escaping the jihad themselves, they're idiots. In 1400 years no nation has been able to pull that one off, not in the long term. Unity with all other jihad-resisters is the only recipe for survival.
Hmmm, according to official records released (after that hot topic was obsessed over by leftists) to park that notion, he proved to have better scores than John Kerry, so does that make JK worse than even W?
http://www.boston.com/news/nation/washington/articles/2005/06/07/yale_grades_portray_kerry_as_a_lackluster_student/
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,158776,00.html
Sounds like a political commercial that didn't work.
Best to avoid that here & concentrate on more relevant substance than echoed political talking points from past disproved claims.
dumbledoresarmy,
Yes, though I think your supplement is much more than just wild card.
China's exploiting the islamists "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" bit to the max.
I'll leave the rest open from here...
The AK 47 and the slightly newer AK 74 are everywhere and parts and ammunition are also everywhere and cheap. If I were going to supply arms to a bunch of illiterate Arab bumpkins, I would pick the AK-47 or-74. These rifles are virtually indestructable. In some respects, the AK series is a better rifle than the M-16; the AK is more suited for use by someone who will never, ever clean it, oil it, or will most likely leave it laying in the rain or mud.
There are two sides to every story.
Buy Russian weapons and steal American weapons.
Makes sense to me ... only pay when you have to.
‘STOP THE ISLAMIFICATION OF EUROPE’ DEMONSTRATION (11th SEPT)
Freddy Thielmans, Mayor of Brussels, has banned a demonstration which was scheduled to take place on Tuesday 11th September at 1pm outside the building of the European Parliament to protest against the relentless ‘Islamification of Europe’. The organisers are now mounting a formal legal challenge to the Mayor’s right to take this action.
Until this matter is properly resolved they cannot endorse or accept any responsibility for any protest made by any individual or group of individuals.
However the Mayor of Brussels has no power to prevent tourists from visiting his city. Visitors to this website might like to consult ‘sioe.wordpress.com’ to gain helpful information about visitor amenities and tourist attractions in Brussels
Guess they have to replace the 190,000 we lost.
I would suspect the weapons are intended to be delivered to the Muslim militant militias...you know...the ones who are killing the civilians and attacking coalition forces...
....in recent months, the US forces have uncovered hugh weapons caches. The Muslims supply of of weapons is dwindling....Give credit to the US forces for getting better at intercepting weapons deliveries as they cross into Iraq from Syria and Iran.....
......The Muslims would rather have guns than food or electricity or running water....
...or even common sense for that matter, lol
I don't understand.
Surely all those "Iraqi Freedom" supporters should be a-whoopin' and a-hollerin' at how democratic and free Iraq now is. They do business with who they want.
Surely that's what the invasion was all about?
Yanks soldiers die and the ever gullible Yank taxpayer goes broke so that Iraq has the freedom to stick it's middle finger up at America.
Recently they held very friendly talks with Iran and now they're buying bang bang stuff from China.
Boy, those boys who thought up "Iraqi Freedom" were bright things that's for sure.
Guess they have to replace the 190,000 we lost.Jonas Salk
I know. Surely THE Keystones Kop moment of 2007.
And it's up against some pretty stiff competition from the "Freedom Forces of Farce" over in Iraq
China's Communist government is waging an undeclared war on the United States and is in bed with the jihadists worldwide.
Chinese government officials are hoping to steal America's culture and exterminate white Americans in a few EZ strokes (including nukes).
Covertly assisting jihadists lurking within the Iraq govermnment is one step in their plans.
"Beware the yellow race"--the Judeo-Christian Bible.