I would guess that the Finnish establishment is beside itself with glee over this development, for they take it as evidence that Muslims are assimilating, joining the political process, becoming responsible Finnish citizens. But look at the party program: "The Finnish Islamic Party platform supports a ban on alcohol sales, the option for Muslim children to be excused from school music classes and outings to swimming pools, legal status for ritual animal killing and male circumcision, and the eventual introduction of shari'a law in Finland."
Most Finns, like most Westerners, have no idea what Sharia has in store for them. It involves a lot more than "preventing crime" -- it involves the institutionalized subjugation of non-Muslims and women. The Finns would no doubt now consign such an idea to "racism" and "Islamophobia." But they will find out soon enough what Sharia really involves.
"Islamic party forms in Finland," from Catholic World News (thanks to Josephine):
Helsinki, Sep. 12, 2007 (CWNews.com) - Europe's first Islamic political party has formed in Finland.The Finnish Islamic Party plans to collect 5,000 signatures in order to qualify for official registration by the end of the year. Counting on support from the 55,000 Muslims living in Finland, the party anticipates some success in next year's municipal elections as well as in the 2011 parliamentary elections. Party spokesman Abdullah Tammi acknowledged to reporters that to date the party has enrolled only a few dozen members.
The Finnish Islamic Party platform supports a ban on alcohol sales, the option for Muslim children to be excused from school music classes and outings to swimming pools, legal status for ritual animal killing and male circumcision, and the eventual introduction of shari'a law in Finland. Tammi added that the purpose of Sharia law was to prevent crime.
"The Finnish Islamic Party plans to collect 5,000 signatures in order to qualify for official registration by the end of the year."
...how many times can one Muslim sign the petition?....
...at least the Italians appear to be learning:
"According to an annual survey carried out in five top Italian cities - Milan, Rome, Bologna, Palermo and Naples - fear of Muslim immigrants is on the rise.
The survey showed that 28% approved of building new mosques, compared to 49% in 2006 and 61% in 2005.
Almost 30% of respondents said they were against the centres because they viewed Islam as a dangerous religion while 24% said they fomented terrorism.
Only 28% said they favoured giving the vote to legally resident immigrants against 51% in 2006 and 63% in 2005.
A quarter of respondents admitted that they were more afraid of Muslim immigrants now than they were a year ago.
I wonder if the law in Finland has the ability to block that "party" from forming.
"ignorance has killed many more than guns".
I wonder if the law in Finland has the ability to block that "party" from forming.
"ignorance has killed many more than guns".
...how many times can one Muslim sign the petition?....
Posted by: exsgtbrown
Given these cats always have about 10 aliases, I'd say ya need probably about 500.
exsgtbrown, there is a lot of activity in Italy that doesn't make press outside of Italy, and there is a definite growing resistance to the building of more mosques. But in the battle of numbers, it may be too little, too late. Italians aren't producing children, but the politicians keep pandering. The old may not like what they see coming, but they have no choice, they are too deeply invested in the welfare state to leave or change. The young, not so deeply invested, will leave, and in the UK, Netherlands and Sweden, we are seeing such a mass exodus already occuring.
Of course they're afraid, but are there enough of them left to change the course?
Rapes have gone up in Sweeden since muslims have come in. Sweeden should adopt Shaira too to cut down on crime.
Robert,
Here is a picture of these "muslims": http://www.halla-aho.com/scripta/images/muslimipuolue.jpg
Hardly immigrants, I do not think.
Pegg, your comment reminded me of a thread at "Gates of Vienna" posted yesterday. The thread and it's related comments expose a bit more about Finland . . .
http://gatesofvienna.blogspot.com/2007/09/hooray-americans-got-spanked.html
From one of the comments:
Rape is not a crime if it is Muslim man on Finnish woman. Sharia winks at Muslim men raping non-Muslim natives because, after all, they are merely infidels and this seems to be the Muslim's international pastime, sort of like baseball is to America.
Wake up people. The Hun is at the gate.
The party mostly consists of Finnish converts, and the spokesman is a convert too. I read that they plan to head to Saudi Arabia for religious training.
Pro-Sharia = anti-democratic
This party should therefore be outlawed from day one.
It's Islam exploiting our freedoms and democracy to establish an Islamic theocratic government... I am sure they are going to sugarcoat their platforms before Finnish voters go to the polls. I also predict here in Canada there will be a fringe political party probably called "The Islamic Party of Canada" forming also with similar goals in Canada.
loler's photo indeed appears to be of homegrowns, the most repugnant variety. It's like finding out in 1940 that your Irish neighbor has joined the local Bund.
With each new visit to JW and LGF etc I feel like I'd imagine I would watching gangreen's hourly advance up my leg.
Islamic FINLAND. It's the punchline but what was the joke?
Muslim walks into a bar... says, "Ouch!"
one word: FINLANDIZATION
this article is acutually incorrect.
"Europe's first Islamic political party has formed in Finland."
george galloway's "respect" party was partly islamic. http://www.respectcoalition.org/
and check out the supporters and members....
http://www.respectcoalition.org/index.php?sec=22
the muslim council of great britain is a heavily political party.
http://www.mcb.org.uk/
and they have an interesting story abotu a muslim convert in the 19th century in liverpool.
"An American explodes a bomb in the crowded streets of Constantinople and slays innocent women and children and , because he calls himself a Christian he is extolled in England as a hero and as a patriot! An Afghan fights for his fatherland in the Khyber Pass, and because he is a Muslim he is denounced as a traitor and a rebel, and his land is to be raided and his wives and children slain. Such is the British Christian logic at the end of the 19th Century in the diamond jubilee year of the reign of the Queen Empress."
anti-americanism in the 19th century from dhimmi brits, nothings changed!)
http://www.mcb.org.uk/features/features.php?ann_id=139
and then you have the islamic party of great britain http://www.islamicparty.com/ their leader is a an catholic "David Musa Pidcock"
Finnish papers should spell out, using every one of the 13 -or is it 16? -- cases for which Finnish is famous, exactly what, under Shari'a, the status of non-Muslims necessarily will be. Set it out now, clearly. It can be found in a thousand texts on-line, or in great detail, in Antoine Fattal's study (still not translated, as it should be, into English), or in Bat Ye'or's "The Dhimmi" and "Islam and Dhimmitude."
Hmmmm i wonder, would i be allowed to start an Anti Sharia/Anti Islam political party in the UK??
I think not.
They should be stopped in their tracks before they even get started.
Italians aren't producing children, but the politicians keep pandering.
Posted by: longtime lurker
***
Like this one, who made his politically correct and oh-so-multicultural speech on September 11?
http://www.thenewanatolian.com/tna-28703.html
"Today we remember a tragic date of a civilisation clash. I believe that the best answer to the prophets of the religion war is to have in the European Union a big, democratic, Islamic country such as Turkey," Italian Deputy Prime Minister and Foreign Minister Massimo D'Alema said in Bari during a meeting on the Balkans.
Turkey's joining the EU "will be the non-theoretical answer to the possibility of sharing different cultures and religions in the picture of a common acception of democratic values and of a common project for development and affirmation of peoplés rights," D'Alema said. "The EU expansion is a big flag of Europe, the challenge of the Balkans is the priority," he added.
I hope the Finns still know what "Sisu" means. They'll need it soon.
Massimo D'Alema, the man whom time forgot (there are so many) is also the man who thinks negotiating with Hamas is a good idea. Not to be confused with Walter Veltroni, or with any others who might seem to be in D'Alema's camp, but are not.
They wont be finished , they'll be done
Yes, FINLANDIZATION is a good term for the dhimmitude we are witnessing daily in the heart of Europe.
Often when we hear of acts of crime by muslims against innocent infidels, European governments and police talk about spontaneous, surprising, unexpected occurrences, so to speak acts of deranged individuals.
Such was the stabbing of a Rabbi in Frankfurt a week ago on Sabbath, who was accosted on the street by an Arab speaking man, who stabbed the Rabbi in the abdomen.
Today we read in the International Herald Tribune that the attacker was arrested. It is an Afghan. Less than one percent of Afghans are non-muslim. We wonder which denomination this man is of.
http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/09/14/europe/EU-GEN-Germany-Rabbi-Attack.php
"FRANKFURT, Germany: Police arrested a German man of Afghan parentage in the stabbing of a rabbi in Frankfurt last week, prosecutors said Friday.
The 22-year-old was arrested in Frankfurt Thursday night and admitted to stabbing the rabbi, Zalman Gurevitch, prosecutors in the city said in a statement. The man is being investigated on suspicion of attempted manslaughter and dangerous bodily harm.
The attack prompted concern and condemnation from local politicians and Jewish groups.
According to the rabbi, the assailant said "I'll kill you, you (expletive) Jew," prosecutors say.
However, prosecutors said the suspect — whose name they did not release — denies having either any intention of killing the rabbi and any anti-Semitic motive.
The Frankfurt-born German citizen, whose parents come from Afghanistan, maintains that he greeted the rabbi with the words "salem aleikum," or "peace upon you." In their statement, they said that there was then "an exchange of words which ended in a physical confrontation."
The suspect said that he "felt physically inferior to the rabbi and so reached for his knife," they added. The weapon had a 7.6-centimeter (3-inch) blade.
Prosecutors said they tracked down the suspect after being tipped off to an Internet forum that contained details of the incident.
Spokeswoman Doris Moeller-Scheu said prosecutors and police had no information to suggest that he had a radical Islamic background. She said the attack appeared to have been spontaneous rather than planned."
Well, in fact last week it was reported that the Rabbi had asked the man if he needed assistance....
How can any Western society allow the formation of its declared destruction?
Islam is anti-the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.
Anti-Constitutional.
Anti-secular state.
It needs to be invited to leave the West.
Lots of empty space in Saudi Arabia.
No Bibles or Jews or Christians.
Sounds like Paradise, eh Abu?
>>"Tammi added that the purpose of Sharia law was to prevent crime.">>
How odd, trying to "prevent" crime by committing a greater one.
This is frightening. This is what the experts have been warning us about and it is happening. In Finland, of all places.
"the purpose of Sharia law was to prevent crime" -- from the article
I think they cut the guy off. I think what he meant to say was:
The purpose of Sharia law is to prevent crimes against Islam (such as the sale or use of alcohol, music, the mixing of unrelated males and females, non-halal meat and uncircumcised males).
The new Islamic party that is being formed wants a ban on alcohol sales. Might harm their chances to get votes in Finland. After all, the Finns are famous among their neighbours for their vodka drinking habits.
OT but still related to the FINLANDIZATION of Europe.
Over at the UN, one of these dhimmi hatefests has been going on today.
Mr. Doudou Diène, 'Special Rapporteur on contemporary forms of racism, racial discrimination, xenophobia and related intolerance' (yes you heard it right, that is his title)has stated at the official in Geneva today, stated that the current Islamophobia is the most serious form of religious deffamation.
Diene cited a caricature of the Muslim Prophet Muhammad in a Swedish newspaper, a protest by far-right groups in Belgium Tuesday against the "Islamization of Europe," and campaigns against the construction of mosques in Germany and Switzerland as evidence of an "ever increasing trend" toward anti-Islamic actions in Europe.
"We see the initiatives and activities of many groups and organizations which are working hard to bring about a war of civilizations," he said, adding that right-wing groups were trying to equate Islam with violence and terrorism.
Racism and xenophobia are coming out of the closet, in a sense, and gradually creeping into the policies of mainstream political actors, Mr. Diène said. That fact is manifest not only in the backing away from cultural diversity manifested by many States, but also in restrictive policies regarding immigrants and asylum-seekers.
Speeches against immigrants, foreigners and asylum-seekers are becoming popular and intellectual legitimization is being granted to those currents, he added.
Diene, a Senegalese lawyer, said in his 21-page report to the Council that Islamaphobia had grown since the Sept 11 2001 attacks on the United States.
Worldwide, an increasing number of traditional democratic parties were "resorting to the language of fear and exclusion, scapegoating and targeting ethnic or religious minorities in general, and immigrants and refugees in particular", he said.
In Europe, Muslims faced growing difficulties to establish places of worship and carry out their religious practices such as dietary regimens and burials, according to the U.N. envoy.
"Political parties with open anti-Islamic platforms have joined governmental coalitions in several countries and started to put in place their political agendas. In sum, Islamophobia is in the process of permeating all facets of social life."
"Special Rapporteurs, who are unpaid and serve in a personal capacity, receive their mandates from the UN Commission on Human Rights." (UN News Centre)
...Well, one really wonders how those unpaid servants of Human Rights manage financially.
Doudou Dienealso accused Switzerland's most popular party, the right-wing Swiss People's Party (SVP/UDC), of inciting hatred.
He urged the withdrawal of the party's controversial campaign poster calling for expulsion of foreigners who commit serous crimes, depicting three white sheep booting out a black sheep under the headline "For the Security of All".
Anything wrong with that?
The Swiss SVP/UDC has launched a referendum to ban construction of minarets in the Alpine country, home to 350,000 Muslims. A similar move is underway in Cologne, Germany.
"Diene, a Senegalese lawyer, said in his 21-page report to the Council that Islamaphobia had grown since the Sept 11 2001 attacks on the United States. "
...of course, Islamaphobia, if it exists, may be caused by the constant Muslim attacks (military type attacks and the slow jihad attacks Muslims make by demanding everything be Muslim).....
....Muslims thrive on fear, therefore, they may just be promoting "Islamaphobia"....
Ban Muslim Immigration...
Tammi added that the purpose of Sharia law was to prevent crime.
...........................
Again, we assume that Islamists are using language in the same way that we do. We hear that the killing of innocents is forbidden in Islam, without realizing that for many Mohammedans, *no non-Muslim* is innocent, not even little children. When told that Islam forbids suicide, we assume that this is a condemnation of what we call "suicide bombings"--in many cases, it means no such thing. What we consider suicide bombers, they consider shaheeds, or martyrs--as long as their intent is to kill infidels. The ban on suicide is meant only for the innocently despondant.
When we think of crime, we think of things like theft and drug use. Sure, Shari'ah law forbids these things--although the average Westerner, no matter how much in favor of law and order, would be appalled at the common penalties under a Shari'ah state--amputation and maiming.
As awful as this is, though, it doesn't begin to address the *other* things that strict Islam considers criminal--"insulting" Islam and the prophet, apostasy, and adultery. Nor do many Westerners realize that this last can also include consensual pre-marital sex and even being on the receiving end of sexual assault.
Sometimes "crime" means allowing a religious critic, homosexual or rape victim to live. Imagine the spectacle of stonings in the public squares of Helsinki.
Hugo Schmidt-Fischer,
Interesting stuff.
The UN is a place where a few legitimate politicians meet with many at-large, unindicted criminals.
http://www.defenddemocracy.org/research_topics/research_topics_list.htm?topic=9059
We could use a little morale-boosting around here.
Hi, I'm Mahmoud.
Vote for me and you'll never have to vote again! Two legs bad, four legs good.
Peace Be Upon Him;
Mahmoud
Anybody seen the Anti-Jihad Federation website?
http://www.federationmovement.com/
(PLEASE POST THIS ANNOUNCEMENT AT OTHER WEBSITES)
The U.S. Senate Project (an initiative to increase congressional awareness of the nature and goals of jihad) currently has 85 volunteers in 39 states.
WE ARE STILL SEEKING ADDITIONAL CITIZEN VOLUNTEERS FROM ALL 50 STATES, ESPECIALLY THE FOLLOWING 12:
Connecticut
Delaware
Hawaii
Kansas
Mississippi
Montana
North Dakota
Oklahoma
South Dakota
Vermont
West Virginia
Wyoming
THE PROJECT: We're looking for people in every state of the Union who would be willing to purchase, from Amazon or any other source, a copy of Robert Spencer's new book Religion of Peace? Why Christianity Is And Islam Isn't and mail it, on an agreed upon date, to one of the senators in your state. We want to get the book simultaneously to all 100 senators, in order to send a strong message. If we get more than two people per state, books can also be sent to the U.S. House of Representatives.
If you'd like to participate (or you just have questions), please write to me at traehnam@yahoo.com under the subject heading "Senate," and tell me the state your senator represents, and a nickname. No need for your real name. And I will never share your email address with anyone, not even with other volunteers for this project.
And visit jihadawareness.blogspot.com to get more info on this project and to leave comments other volunteers can read. You can also see there the growing list of participants in this project, and the states their senators represent. I've also designed a graphic that might amuse. Scroll down when you get to the site.
Once we have at least two people from every state, we can agree on a mailing date and then each of us can mail a copy of the book on that date.
Right before each of us mails the book, we can issue a press release to various media outlets in every state, and in that way announce and explain the mailing. And perhaps we can come up with some other ways of maximizing the effectiveness of this project and gaining as much positive attention as possible.
One of the project's volunteers suggested contacting Rep. Sue Myrick, who started the Anti-Jihad Caucus in Congress. I'll try to coordinate this project with Rep. Myrick to maximize its effectiveness. I've also been calling various congressional offices to get advice on how best to go about the project.
Pegg, your comment reminded me of a thread at "Gates of Vienna" posted yesterday. The thread and it's related comments expose a bit more about Finland . . .
http://gatesofvienna.blogspot.com/2007/09/hooray-americans-got-spanked.html
One of the comments was a question. Would we welcome 100k German troops on our soil? The short answer is yes. We have trained more than that on our soil. Yeah they are welcome, as long as they are not jihadists. I love Germans; my father is one, although second generation American.
"We could use a little morale-boosting around here."
Posted by: traeh
How about a laugh:
http://www.thecanadianmuslim.ca/hijabs_blog.html
"And I always carry the hope that modest dress will become more and more the norm in westernized societies as they come more and more in contact with the ideas of people like us, the muslims, the amish, the quakers, the mennonites, the jews, and so on, who believe strongly in modest dress and present a good example to their peers."
(It's interesting that some of these women refer to wearing the hijab as their jihad against the unbelievers.)
Check out the "How to Hijab" videos. I never knew how important it was for the ears not to show through the fabric. The woman doing the demo (on a mannequin head) is wearing black gloves. So you know she's the holiest.
Josephine
That muslima clothing website is great. I urge all to click on the swimwear tab. Now that's something you could wear if you're ever dumped in the Bhosporos River.
The clearance rack has some rock bottom bargains, and Halloween is just around the corner.
All the posts are old and seem to be posted by mainly one gal, otherwise we ccould have some real fun.
"the option for Muslim children to be excused from school music classes" - the thin end of the wedge isn't it. How long do we have to wait until music shops are actually being firebombed and store owners threatened with death if they don't stop selling music? Where Pakistan is today, so we can be tomorrow.
I find it extremely puzzling that music should be condemned in this way. Surely music, at its best, is one of the most spiritual art forms? But then, I guess, muslims are not actually interested in 'spirituality'. They are interested in mind-numbing obedience and the demonization and domination of non-muslims, which is the opposite of spiritual.
I don't know the exact basis of the legal rights of the Finns, but I construe Islamic sharia law as sedition against our Constitutional laws in the U.S. I consider Muslims who espouse the implementation of sharia law in ANY manifestation on U.S. soil to be nothing short of traitors, worthy of the harshest punishment under our laws for such.
To Hugh - Antoine Fattal's book on dhimmitude came out in 1958. What are the French, or Lebanese, laws about copyright?
If it were out of copyright it could be put online via Project Gutenberg, like Samuel Zwemer's "Law of Apostasy in Islam" has been.
It might be worthwhile finding out which of the classic works on Islam that you keep on recommend to us, are in fact out of copyright and may legitimately be made available electronically via Project Gutenberg. There would surely be folks here - retirees, say - who would have the spare time to scan, check and deposit.
And even if Fattal's book is not being officially translated, and if it cannot legally be reproduced online in its entirety, then surely the most important passages, say a dozen selected paragraphs, embedded in a suitable commentary, might be translated and posted here (linked to Islam 101?).
PS, again to Hugh Fitzgerald, offtopic - I've been browsing through the Jihadwatch archives and have been struck, yet again, by the brilliance and clarity of your writing.
I also just came across your rave review of C S Forester's book - 'for children 10-13' - "The Barbary Pirates", 1958. I and my spouse are fans of Forester's Hornblower books but I'd never heard about that one. I will be tracking it down forthwith. Much thanks. Aside to any homeschooler parent reading this, specially if your kid is a teenage boy - judging from Hugh's review C S Forester's "The Barbary Pirates" would make a terrific textbook: historically accurate, well written, and most UN-PC about Islam and Mohammedans.
"...historically accurate, well written, most UN-PC about Islam and Mohammedans."
The same can be said about nearly ALL 18th, 19th and early 20th century novels which mention Islam and Muslims.
Read nearly any great Russian author from Tolstoi on which touches on the subject of Islam and learn about the barbarity of the Turk.
Read Voltaire's Candide, or novels by Thackeray and you'll hear about that old degenerate "epileptic Mohamet".
Often these things were mentioned in the offing -- it was understood between the author and the reader that they both possessed a shared knowledge and opprobrium for Islam and Muslims, and their understanding was NOT based on ignorance or bigotry but on the informed historic fact of Islamic horrors and the nature of that backward religion.
We have forgotten so much about Islam today that it's truly frightening and shocking in equal measures -- nearly any earlier schoolboy with the most rudimentary education knew to fear the Turk and loathe the filthy Seracen. Rules to live by -- rules to survive by in these portentious latter days...
Hey, we are 5/6 of the Earth's population. Why are we not kicking these barbarians arses all the way back to Desertville?
to malta 1565 - So Muslims in Finland want to keep the poor little Muslim kids out of school music classes. Presumably lest they be corrupted by the dread infection of joy.
I share your puzzlement at the hardline Muslim position on music.
I don't think there's any other belief system that has ever existed that has been so relentlessly negative about music, as Islam is:
e.g. "Allah mighty and majestic...commanded me [Muhammad] to do away with musical instruments, flutes, strings..and the affair of the pre-Islamic period of ignorance. On the Day of Resurrection Allah will pour molten lead into the ears of whoever sits listening to a songstress. Song makes hypocrisy grow as water does herbage" (and he predicts that disaster will fall upon Muslims "when songstresses and musical instruments appear and wine is held to be lawful"...i.e. that any future Muslims who 'hold fornication, silk, wine, AND MUSICAL INSTRUMENTS to be lawful" are sinners). [from an authoritative handbook of Islamic law, the Umdat al-Salik r40.1].
So when Ayatollah Khomeini ranted - "Music corrupts the minds of our youth. There is no difference between music and opium. Both create lethargy...If you want your country to be independent, THEN BAN MUSIC. Music is treason to our nation and to our youth", he was just reviving that oldtime religion.
Have all those black African converts yet been informed that zealous Muslims aim to silence every song on earth?
Has anyone pointed out to these idiotic Finnish converts to Islam that 'Finlandia' is haram? That if the Mohammedans take Finland it will be the garbage dump for Sibelius and the Kalevala?
Watch Kieslowski's 'Blue' - for the final montage, accompanied by Preisner's ravishing setting of portions of 1 Corinthians 13 in the original koine Greek. Or find, and listen to, Hildegard of Bingen; Monteverdi's Vespers of 1610; Mundy's Vox Patris Caelestis; anything from Taize; Bach's Mass in B Minor, or his Art of Fugue; and Thomas Tallis's 40-part motet, Spem in Alium. And that's only from the Western tradition; others here could tell us about the Greek and Russian and Bulgarian Orthodox religious music and the 'secular' music that exists alongside it.
Think of Judaism: there are the psalms and the hymns used in the synagogue and in family worship - think of the Sabbath hymn. I read a piece in the Jerusalem Post, once, by a non-Jewish expat in Jerusalem, and she said the thing she hadn't expected, but which struck her most forcibly about Israeli culture, was the music - people not just listening to recordings, but making music themselves, at home. Music all day long from people practising and performing; and the Sabbath hymn being sung on Friday evenings, quite clearly to be heard from homes all around.
And know that all THIS - not just a few silly poptarts - is what Islam implacably rejects and blasphemes, and dreams of silencing forever (even while, in its infinite hypocrisy and duplicity, it currently employs music and song for propaganda purposes).
Not just the music of Christendom, or of the synagogue. Everything else. Hindu liturgical chants and dances. Buddhist chanting. Thai and Cambodian ritual dance. Native American, Melanesian, Polynesian, the endlessly ramifying Native Australian song cycles, secular and sacred. Chinese opera and dragon dancers. Japanese theatre. Ten thousand lullabies and love songs in the ten thousand languages of planet earth. All, all, all VERBOTEN, HARAM, to the deaf ears of the soul-withering life-denying gnostic war-cult of Islam, hell-bent on ultimately extinguishing all life, motion, song and beauty (except of course for the secret pleasuring of decadent despots behind the closed doors of their palaces, while everyone else suffers and perishes).
Even the Nazis and the Russian Communists, evil as they were, permitted music. Shostakovitch survived under Stalin; he would not have existed in a Muslim polity.
This is even worse than Islam's rejection of portraiture and sculpture. We non-Muslims, be we hidden hunter-gatherer tribes or techno Japanese, we swim in a sea of music from birth to death. "We are music moved to music" - English-speaking Orthodox theologian, David Bentley Hart, in his book "The Beauty of the Infinite: the Aesthetics of Christian Truth".
Does Islam have any idea, any at all, just how disgusting, how totally unattractive its rejection of music makes it look in the eyes of every non-Muslim human on the planet?
Time for Finns reading this to write to the Finnish national orchestra and the Sibelius society (I bet there's a Sibelius society) know about the horrible anti-music rules in Islam. Tell the head of the Lutheran church in Finland that if sharia law were imposed in Finland, hymn-singing would be suppressed. THIS IS SERIOUS.
Jesus Christ Superdcop wrote: "The party mostly consists of Finnish converts, and the spokesman is a convert too. I read that they plan to head to Saudi Arabia for religious training."
Pray God they love the place so much (wonderful religous freedom, great weather, high status of women, strong community spirit, etc...) they all decide to stay there. Or better yet, the Finnish authorities will wise up and bar them from re-entering.
People should not write parties like this off as a lunatic fringe movement. As we have seen time and time again, the Islamofascists have an influence far exceeding their numbers, for the simple reason that they scare the hell out of people and those same people are too indoctrinated by the multiculti ethos that they won't admit to their fear.
A country like Algeria, hell-hole though it is, at least has the courage and honesty to admit to its fear of pro-Islamic parties and the threat they pose, and to ban their asses. Would that Europe had such balls too. Someone needs to remind these people (although why must it be North Americans?) that the Nazis were also big on "crime prevention" too. Yes, the Nazis...remember them?
This is why I return frequently to JW/DW on a daily basis. It is rare not to find a wonderful tidbit as that provided above.
Dumbledoresarmy, do you have a link for the "Law of Apostasy in Islam" at Project Gutenberg? I searched their archives and the only book by Samuel Zwemer posted is this treasure of a children's book titled "Topsy Turvy Land", ARABIA PICTURED FOR CHILDREN.
a few excerpts to savor . . .
snip
A view without the PC glasses into Arabia circa 1902.
CapitalistGig -- Glad you enjoyed it.
Although I disagree with the Amish and Old Order Mennonites, I would never mock them because they don't push their lifestyle on anyone else. (And, besides, it isn't nice.)
However, I've come to the conclusion that the silly rules and downright evil beliefs found in Islam should be mocked at every opportunity.
Not for the sake of being mean but because it proves that we are free to speak our minds; free of Islamic repression; free to act as we choose. We are free, free, free and they seem to hate that more than anything else.
After our lives, what is the first thing they want to take away from us? Our freedom. Our freedom to choose whether or not we want to go to the liquor store and buy a bottle of wine for dinner Saturday night. Freedom for girls and boys to swim together without fear of rape and murder. Freedom to change the station on the radio and listen to whatever we want to hear. Freedom to choose our friends and our mates. Freedom to believe in God or Buddha or whoever or nothing at all. I could stand on the corner, spit on the sidewalk and curse God and no one would arrest me, no one would stone or flog me. My ultimate fate would be between me and God or me and nothingness: even that knowledge or that question is not enforced by law.
We're free and they're slaves. The smart ones are breaking free of their Islamic shackles; the hateful ones (made stupid by their beliefs and their hatred) are fighting to take our freedom away from us.
I too couldn't resist having a look at the "Canadian Muslima" clothing site.
This is a site that just begs to be parodied, if it hasn't been already.
And yes, the "swimwear" is a real head-scratcher. (As a liberal Euro-Canadian, I confess to the belief that the best outfit for swimming is the skin that God gave you, but, when decorum requires it, a sensible bathing suit that covers what we teach our children to call "the private areas.") But in the Muslima full-body-and-head-covering ensemble, what's the point in getting in the water at all? Is the fabric waterproof, and if so, why not just climb into an anti-gravity chamber and pretend to be swimming? Also, you'll have the benefit of not having your wet clothes adhering to your body and showing your shameful feminine contours (haven't these people ever heard of "wet-T-shirt" contests? I can see a market for "wet burqa" contests even as I write this.)
"Does Islam have any idea, any at all, just how disgusting, how totally unattractive its rejection of music makes it look in the eyes of every non-Muslim human on the planet?" Posted by: dumbledoresarmy
All these years later, I still love the choruses I learned in the Pentecostal church. Many of them are based on Bible verses and easy to remember. They are such joyful songs of praise. The songs and hand clapping are the parts of the Pentecostal services that I miss (and I can't carry a tune to save my life).
justamomof4,
re: "Law of Apostasy in Islam" by Zwemer. AnsweringIslam has it.
http://www.answering-islam.org.uk/Books/Zwemer/Apostasy/index.htm
If the page doesn't come up, go to
http://answering-islam.org.uk/Index/index.html
click on apostasy in the index, then scroll to the bottom of the apostasy page, where there are a list of online articles etc. and the link to Zwemer's book.
khaybar oasis - thanks for pointing justamomof4 to the right place for the Zwemer book. I must have got my wires crossed - apologies, folks.
"The Law of Apostasy in Islam" is a very sobering read. The Arabised/ Islamised world has, in fact, produced a goodly crop of Muslim-background Christian martyrs and Valiants-for-Truth down the centuries. We don't hear about them because they nearly all got killed as soon as the Ummah found out they'd apostasised.
Hugo Schmidt wrote:
"Yes, FINLANDIZATION is a good term for the dhimmitude we are witnessing daily in the heart of Europe. "
If you are looking for a close historical parallel to dhimmitude, it is Finlandization.
That's why it was hardly surprising that Finnish Prime minister apologized for publication of Motoons on a Finnish website during the cartoon crisis.
The Finnish islamist party is founded by a small group of muslim converts or 'reverts'. I suppose they want Saudi money real bad, unless they already have it, which I doubt very much, since they haven't been able to build a mosque for themselves.
With all respect to all the thoughtful comments presented here, I'd like to state: You guys do not know the situation in Finland.
Yes, it is true: some homegrown Islam converts want to establish a political party. Yes, it is true: when the interviewer asked their spokesman, "What about getting a sharia", the wannabe-taleban replied, "That would be wonderful."
The nationalistic or right-wing leaning people in Finland have received this piece of news with a sort of exhilaration. Why is that?
First of all, of the Western European countries, Finland has the smallest percentage of Muslims. Our government seems to be in a hurry to change that, but nevertheless the number of Muslims here is relatively low, about 20-40K out of population of 5.3M.
These Muslims have a long, hard road to parliament. Given that immigrant Muslims have been at best lukewarm to this party, most likely the party will not make it, but they may have some success in local elections, attracting the vote of local muslims and confused leftists. However, given the multicultural pathos in Finland, their candidates will be given a lots of publicity.
Since the Finnish media has mostly abandoned journalism for multiculturalism, most of the people do not really know what is happening in France, Germany, Holland etc. vis-a-vis Islam. The media does its best to portray Islam as 'a religion of peace and tolerance'. It will be very hard to keep up the facade of Islamic tolerance, when there is some Muslim hothead politician making outrageous demands, portraying Muslims as silly, stone-age ragheads.
Finns do not want to drop beer. Hell, we want more of it! We want to keep our pork, too. Most Finns abhor all kinds of radicalism, be it Nazi, Communist or Muslim. If the Muslims demand legalizing halal-slaughtering, all the better! That will drive a wedge between them and the strongest supporters of islamization, The Green Party. Many of the Greens are animal rights supporters. Need I mention the rights of homosexuals? I just hope the people at 'Islamic Party' will be bold enough...
Also, IMO it is much better that things are transparent. I'd rather have the Muslim vote in Finland concentrated into one Islamic party, than have all the other parties bowing to Muslim demands. The latter seems to be the case in Western Europe today, e.g. just look what the Socialist mayor of Brussels did!
If the Finnish Secret Service would be bold, mean agency, on top of things, I would suspect they are behind this. But since they aren't, let us just label this as a stroke of good luck! Many of you might call this attitude idiotic, but only time will tell. IMO, Finland has a fair chance to survive the islamic wave that will wipe out Western Europe. Our chances did not get worse because of establishment of the 'Islamic Party'.
The 'Islamic Party' has now had its 15 minutes of fame. When the local elections approach, these guys will be asked some tough questions. Hopefully they will make a fool out of themselves, so it will be easier for the common man in Finland to see the emperor has no clothes.
The Finnish society is uniquely vulnerable to the islamist ideology due to two things:
1) There is a small muslim minority in Finland, the Tatars, who have lived in Finland for hundreds of years and are fully assimilated into the mainstream society in all possible respects.
2) The most recent Finnish translation of the Quran seems to play down on the violent passages in the book, making the Quran sound more benevolent than it actually is.
As a result, islam and muslims are seen as entirely compatible with the Finnish society, just like the Tatars are. The idea of a Tatar getting insulted in the name of islam is just plain ridiculous, and thus any angry ourbursts of other muslims are seen as individual incidents without any real threatening ideology behind them. Any muslim terrorism that is based on the Quran is seen as an aberration of the "real, benevolent, peaceful" Quran.
However, due to the Finnish history of Finlandization, ordinary Finnish people and some politicians can smell a bullying, aggressive and totalitarian ideology from miles away. We as a free Western democracy lived under a constant psychological pressure from communist Soviet Union, and many politicians eventually succumbed (right-wingers, too, nobody was immune). But many clear-sighted individuals - the majority, I believe - find the hardcore islamic ideology repulsive. Some dissident voices are even heard in the media, that maybe islam is not a religion of peace after all, and maybe poverty isn't the root cause of terrorism. There is still hope, and there are no minarets yet anywhere in Finland. I hope it stays that way.
Just trying to figure how the finns will react when the vodka stops
Huh. This reminds me of Black Adder, for some reason.
"Hey, we are 5/6 of the Earth's population. Why are we not kicking these barbarians arses all the way back to Desertville?
Posted by: interestinconundrum"
....well, 4/6 of the Earths population are dhimmicrats and leftists who neither know the truth about Islam nor care to support those who do...