Alright, then. What were the negotiations to be about again? "Erekat: We won't accept Jewish Israel," from the Jerusalem Post:
Top Palestinian negotiator Saeb Erekat on Monday rejected Israel's demand that the Palestinians acknowledge Israel as a Jewish state.
You'll want to read this next part sitting down.
"There is no country in the world where religious and national identities are intertwined," Erekat told Radio Palestine.
Just ask all those secular republics in the Islamic world.
Additionally, Erekat said, when agreements are signed, the Palestinians would demand that Israel make a commitment in writing to releasing all Palestinian prisoners held in Israeli jails.
A senior official in the Prime Minister's Office said in response that Prime Minister Ehud Olmert insists that the Palestinians recognize Israel's Jewish identity, as a condition for Israeli recognition of a Palestinian state.
The negotiations are to be about Israels total and unconditional surrender.What else?
Have there ever been any other negotiations?
"'There is no country in the world where religious and national identities are intertwined,'" Erekat told Radio Palestine."
-- from the article above
Muslims in every one of the Muslim-majority countries that belong to the Organization of the Islamic Conference will beg to differ.
A phrase comes to mind from a play by Griboyedov: "Vri, da znaj meru." Which is to say: "Lie, but know when to stop."
Clearly, Saeb Erekat is used to lying. It's his modus operandi and his hobby and his passion. But he needs to know when to stop.
As for Griboyedov, the celebrated Russian playwright who wrote "Woe From Wit," which contains the phrase I borrowed above, while on a Russian diplomatic mission in Teheran, and attempting (I recall) to help rescue some Christian women who had sought the assistance of the Russian diplomats, he was beaten to death by a Muslim mob.
Those who were part of the excitable mob, one more "vostochnij narod" or "Eastern people" whom the Russians had always found unpredictable, excitable, frothing-at-the-mouthable, were, of course, Muslims, "Basurmany."
Possibly those who make Russian policy for Iran will realize that in the attitudes toward non-Muslims, and the hysteria of reactions, today's Iranian leaders do not differ significantly from those in that Persian mob who beat Griboyedov to death.
The Jihaad is real.
The trillionair sheiks pay the mullas to run the brainwashing Madrassahs to teach as many lower class and poorer middle class moslem males that to die for allah is the greatest accomplishment. They are trained from as young an age as possible...and sent out to suicide bomb for allah all over the world ...and to fight the jihaad which the trillionaire sheiks want to eliminate as many young moslem males as possible ...in order to create the greatest number of single moslem women to fill their huge harems and the huge harems of their many sons and grandsons.....a gigantic number.
The sheiks send out harem recruiters to scout for the most and best moslem females for their vast harems. These recruiters are paid well if they succeed. Also sometimes the women are drugged and brainwashed to believe they should be in harems.
That is the root cause of the jihaad.
The question is...how do we shut down all the hate-kill brainwashing Madrassahs?
Perhaps only a one world government would have such power to do that...eh?
New world order?
But one with a good and careing true democracy government which benefits everyone.
Can humanity accomplish that?
I like to think so.
Or else...maybe if this message goes all around this planet..somehow it could get real loud to the extent that it might possibly reach the ears and eyes of the unfortunate madrassah boys...maybe opening their eyes to what how and why they are being destroyed...so that the wealthy sheiks can put their potential brides into their huge harems.
Then perhaps they will opt out of jihaadism...just perhaps.
Well, they don't want much, do they...3 simple demands...
1) release all terrorists so they can kill you again
2) disarm so the entire islamist world can kill you
3) die at the blade of the islamist sword
gee...they don't want much, do they.
(/sarc)
I'm so furious with Bush for permitting his naive Sec State, that Rice idiot, for ramming this conference down Israel's throat, that I have stopped contributions to the NRC. Furthermore, I also read that she is supporting independence for Kosovo, despite the Muslims torching more that 150 churches there and terrorizing the remaining Christian population. For once I agree with the Russians, who support the Serbs, now headed by a liberal and democratic leader and goverment.
""There is no country in the world where religious and national identities are intertwined," Erekat told Radio Palestine."
....sounds like an open annoucement that Non Muslims must not exist and it is just one of the reasons why we must Ban Muslim Immigration...
Right, Brown - then there's Saudi Arabia - which is basically an Islamic theme park of a country.
This Erekat guy must figure that most people are really stupid, which is probably a good assumption.
Does Erekat think he is telling us something new? Something we do not know already? Something we could't come to a conclusion on, on our own?
Some People are just so predictable.
Chutzpah may be a "Jewish" word but nobody has more of that than the palestinians.
I don't view Ms. Rice as a friend of Israel. She seems to cave in to the groups that scream the loudest. (Oh, those poor, noble "freedom fighters".)
When push comes to shove, the "Palestinians" admit that, in fact, they do not want a two-state solution: they want a one-state solution.
Why is that so hard for the interested parties to hear and admit?
I wish Ms. Rice would stop pressuring Israel to sign its own death warrant.
Wouldn't it be cool if each released prisoner got one of those puppie tags injected? How much better to find you my dear. Just think how much better your aim is if the target has a tracker?
Im starting to wonder if Islam does something organic to the brain.
Flowerknife is right, every time a muslim speaks, you can pretty much predict what will come out of his mouth, especially if you have heard it before...many times. The Palestinian Charter has not changed, and probably will not change. Erekat is just confirming that the long term idea that Israel does not exist, and has no right to exist, will exist a while longer. A change of attitude about this will not come voluntarily. Palestinians will have to learn to eat those ideas if they want a country. I don't think they will ever abandon their hatred of Jews and Israel, they will eventually have to be pacified by force. Either that or Israel will have to pack up and move out. I don't think Israel is going to move anytime soon...
That the U.S. Secretary of State, as well as the rest of the civilized world, would actually sit down with "top Palestinian negotiator" Erekat, given what he has said here, is proof itself that the world has gone mad in accomodating these people.
Islamism is such a cartoon that we rub our eyes in disbelief, unable to accept the reality of a thing so blatantly prepostorous.
It is only a matter of time before humanity is engaged in a nip and tuck death struggle trying to throw off this disease.
They aren't from here. Where did they hide the spaceships?
Here is the part that will get everyone's goat - and the media, our politicians and too many of our citizens will believe the muslims. It is as if a curtain of stupidity is over so many people.
Suggested reading at IsraellyCool:
Erekat = Hypocrite.
The main point being one doesn't have to look as far as Saudi Arabia to point out Erekat's lie.
With blood, sweat and money for a number of nations, including the United States, we allowed, encouraged and gave our blessing to the newly formed government called, "The Islamic Republic of Afghanistan." That's just for starters. Will any US national news media outlets have Erekat on their stations so that he can repeat those lies? Or interview Sec.Rice on so that she can be questioned about his statements and watch how much she has to squirm to explain his outrageous lies?
I'm so furious with Bush for permitting his naive Sec State, that Rice idiot, for ramming this conference down Israel's throat, that I have stopped contributions to the NRC. Furthermore, I also read that she is supporting independence for Kosovo, despite the Muslims torching more that 150 churches there and terrorizing the remaining Christian population. For once I agree with the Russians, who support the Serbs, now headed by a liberal and democratic leader and goverment.
Posted by: jewdog
I agree! Condy can have all the degrees in the world, but she's got no common sense. I gave up on the RNC when they appointed a Cuban immigrant to be it's president. He gave his first speech to the Senate in Spanish, so no more donations to them. Time to give up on a peace agreement with the Palestinians as they never come thru on their part of the deal and not serious negotiating partners. It's always one sided and nothing has worked. Everyone in this administration is dumber than a bag of rocks, except maybe Sec. Gates.
"There is no country in the world where religious and national identities are intertwined," Erekat told Radio Palestine." -
OFFICIAL NAMES:
The Islamic Republic of Mauretania
The Islamic Republic of Pakistan
The Islamic Republic of Iran
The Islamic Republic of Afghanistan
Then you have the Maldives with a a crescent moon flag on a field of green surrounded by blood red. etc etc.
Saeb Erakat is a long experienced propagandist. CNN has him on alot.
If you guys can remember one of the last videos of Yasser Arafat, when he was sick and in his pj's on camera with the gang of Fatah around.....Arafat attempted to bite the hand of Erakat, who was holding his hand on the tape. At the last second before the hand reached Yassers mouth, Erakat grabbed it back dramatically. It was quite amusing.
What is it with this country's obsession with creating a so-called "Palestinian" state? Was there some deal made with the Devil back when Israel was created?
Same for Kosovo. An artificially created Muslim majority province in the heart of Eastern Europe.
As for Condi - she's just following in her predecessors' foosteps - drinking from the same glass of Kool-Aid.
"What is it with this country's obsession with creating a so-called "Palestinian" state? Was there some deal made with the Devil back when Israel was created?"
-- from a posting above
Not at all. No one - least of all the Arabs -- had heard of the "Palestinians" or "Palestinian people" before the Six-Day War. It was only after that war that the local Arabs were carefully renamed the "Palestinian people" (and even today, all kinds of comic situations can arise, as when one tries to differentiate Jordanians who are called "Jordanians" -- that is, Eastern Palestinian Eastern Palestinians -- from those who are described as "Palestinians," which is to say those who claim their origins to be on the west side of the River Jordan, so that they are "Western Palestinian Eastern Palestinians."
The Americans did not start out being "obsessed" as you put it -- certainly that word would apply to the antisemite Carter, who was eager to put pressure on Israel, or the foolish Clinton, who to this day has not understood what was wrong, what was pointless, what was fruitless, what was even dangerous, about all those visits of Arafat to the White House (the most frequent foreign guest to Clinton), and all that frenetic, frantic, hectic shuttle diplomacy, with the ignorant and infuriating likes of (Choose One: Dennis Ross, Martin Indyk, Aaron Miller, Richard Haas, and all the others in the past, from William Rogers and Kissinger on up, down, and sideways, who made the goddam "Peace Process" -- what a phrase! what an idea! -- their focus, because they lacked the intelligence to sit down and find out about Islam, to find out how Muslims regard Israel, and what prompts their permanent opposition to its existence, and furthermore, lacked the will, lacked the intelligence -- and so apparently did everyone in the State Department charged with Arab-Israeli responsibilities -- to find out how, in Islam, treaties with Infidels are regarded.
It's maddening. But then, so much of American life, where the "authorities" are not authorities at all, but merely those in brief, or not-so-brief in the case of those members of the professoriate who have managed to slither into tenured posts, the better to misinform the young, and dis-enchant them from the pleasures of literature, of art, of history, of so many good things.
I must calm down, or otherwise, I shall be forced to self-medicate. Yes, bring on the Lisinopril. [Please note, o relevant drug company, the sly bit of product placement. Your grateful checks, or a lifetime's supply of lisinopril, may be sent to me, care of Robert Spencer].
Isn't it in the quran that there will be no other religion except islam on the Arabian Peninsula?
http://www.shalomjerusalem.com/mohammedism/mohammedism11.html
"There is no country in the world where religious and national identities are intertwined," Erekat told Radio Palestine.
This guy is funny. Someone at Comedy Central needs to sign him up.
Here is another article about islam and it's "government"
"There is no country in the world where religious and national identities are intertwined," Erekat told Radio Palestine.
http://www.liberator.net/articles/TremblayFrancois/Islam.html
“There is no such thing as separation of the church and state, or between the state and morality, in Islam. The church IS the state IS morality.”
So, in other words, the "Palestinians" have made a good-faith proposal, that Israel become a Muslim state with the Jews perhaps allowed to stay on in dhimmi status, and the Israelis are refusing to agree? It is time for the UN to step in and chastise Israel for her intransigence. The EU and US must also increase the political pressure on Israel to submit to the Religion of Peace's violent attacks. Until infidels everywhere submit to Islam, there can be no peace in the Middle East or anywhere else. And after Islam rules the world, it will be time to force all the not-Islamic-enough sects to submit to the True Islam. Ahmadiyas, Shi'ites, Sufis? Your turn is coming next.
The Muslim Brotherhood was founded in 1928 in Egypt by Hassan al-Banna as an organization seeking to combat the secularization of the emerging Egyptian state. But it evolved into an organization that saw itself struggling against Western civilization, as a whole, in order to advance what it defined as Muslim civilization.10 It quickly spread and established branches in dozens of countries within the Middle East and even beyond. (my bold) –from JC article
Negotiating with the enemy is bad strategy, which by the enemy’s own agenda will merely embolden them. Better to call them enemies of our freedoms and constitutional government, regardless of whether or not they want to use the democratic process to conquer the West. This is a confrontational issue, and non-negotiable.
Their agenda is Sharia, what they think (erroneously) is the law of their god ‘Allah’, and is diametrically opposed to our agreed upon laws safeguarding our individual human rights and our universal rule of law. Their sharia law is a barbaric regressive totalitarian system recalling medieval theocratic slavery of humanity to their primitive ideology, more akin to Nazism or Stalinism than to any modern democratic form of government. Their only goal, in claiming to use the democratic process, is to conquer us from within with our own laws of democratic vote, tolerance and religious freedom. Don’t let them, because Sharia is not a religion, but a political-cult system of total submission. And if Islam is to ever climb out of the hole of being a primitive 7th century-non-religious cult system, it must be updated to modern form, and its sharia law banned as intolerant and subversive of our human values as a free people. Personal-beliefs and religious-cult political-power are mutually exclusive ideas, as per our US Constitution’s First Amendment, the ‘separation of church and state’, as written by the Founding Fathers of our nation.
Sharia ambitions of world conquest (to make us all submissive to their god Allah) must be understood as a real threat to those freedoms our Constitution enshrined, and which made out nation great. Our history proves us a land of freedom and equal opportunity for all humanity, but it does not condone criminal behavior. The Muslim Brotherhood, with its Hamas, Hezbolla, Al Qaeda and their wanabe sympathizers, have proven themselves violent criminals, by our laws, and thus must be uncategorically condemned. We are successful because we are free, which is something the Shariaists fail to understand. The Muslim Brotherhood, and all its sympathizers, is the enemy. There must be NO negotiations with the enemy. We are at war with them, and only their unconditional surrender can be acceptable. This is non-negotiable, there is no discussion on the principles of our freedoms, and we will never submit to their doctrines of totalitarianism and slavery. Rather than talk, let them know our stand.
Israeli Palestine peace has nothing to do with this.
My theory is that if they have their own state, then they can be tried for war crimes.
I say that independence be forced upon them.
Arab quotes about mythical Palestine
The interesting things will start happening when these kind of people will admit that Islam is not religion.
They are dangerously close to that.
I have lots of patience, waiting.
Peter_Wiggin said
I have heard this theory, or something similar, and don't understand it. Who will try "them" for war crimes? Whomever that is, why can't they try "them" for war crimes now? How does giving them another state (after Trans-Jordan) make them any more morally culpable for their actions than they already are?
Why is it that none of the Israelis, and none of the U.S. diplomats, and none of the pundits, suggest that the generosity should go the other way, that Jordan and Egypt and Syria should each donate part of their land for a "Palestinian" homeland? Or better yet, for the Jews of Israel, many of whom were forced to flee Muslim-majority countries in the Middle East with nothing but the clothes on their backs? Why are the Jews of Israel expected to give up their land for Egyptians (like Yassir Arafat, may his name be erased) and Jordanians and Syrians? The Jordanians got the majority of the British Mandate, which was set aside for the creation of Israel. How about them giving some of it back?
I believe when people become more aware of the existence of jihad and the reason for its existence, and as we then (post-epiphany) continue looking at the Israeli-Arab conflict, alot of new proposals are going to come out. I can't wait.
Phobia is just fine with Muslims as long as it isn't Islam that is at the receiving end of phobias.
What a fantasy world is Islam where the laws of the universe conveniently don't apply and the innumerable and unspeakable horrors created by Muhammad's demented ideologies never stop and are always, somehow, someone ELSE'S fault...
From DebkaFile: In an address to the United Jewish Communities meeting in Nashville, Tennessee, Tuesday, Nov. 13, the U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice said Israelis must sacrifice some of their “longest held aspirations” in talks with Palestinian leaders. A strong Palestinian state was more urgent than ever, she insisted, as a bulwark against threats from violent extremists.
Yes on that, the lunatics are to be give the keys to the asylum.
There you have it, Palestinians didn't, have not, won't, ever make, peace, so let us turn on Israel, the crocodile is hungry.
It's just like radical Islam, it's all our fault, so let them advance their cause while we allow ours to be destroyed. Here it is on a silver platter.
Fits like a glove.
Oh, by the way, did Bush have a brain transplant sometime immediately after 2004?
And Oh, Rice's village just called, they've lost their idiot.
Hugh;
The list of players you name above should make anyone think, and question. Can they all be stupid, refuse to learn, " intelligence to sit down and find out about Islam, to find out how Muslims regard Israel, and what prompts their permanent opposition to its existence, and furthermore, lacked the will, lacked the intelligence -- and so apparently did everyone in the State Department charged with Arab-Israeli responsibilities" , etc, really?
Those people, some with ties to the Nixon era, close to forty years, and none can see the light, find out the truth?
Hard to believe for me, I would hope for you as well.
If they are all walking like a duck, more or less, then they have a agenda, and they know what they are doing. Its just we don't.
Find out the connections between them, look for actions between them, and agenda that matches the actions they walk to. You may find the fog clearing with little effort.
And stick to grass, it's organic.
Ever hear of:
stratagem
artifice
wile
?
(another BIG CLUE tossed out there)
Think about it.
Sometimes (like this case) it makes a big difference to appear conciliatory to get some barbarian to let down their guard & to admit what he/she really thinks (thus committing credibility suicide like erkat just did)instead of what he/she thinks we want to hear (like the terrorist arafat did)...he took the bait.
Couple that with this (November 13 blog from Captain's Quarters)
http://www.captainsquartersblog.com/mt/
(you'll likely see a LOT more on this in the news the next few days...if not the next few hours)
Again, think about it.
(they're nowhere near as stupid as the far left would like to wish after all).
;-)
wow...like I said..."next few hours".
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071113/ap_on_re_eu/nuclear_iran
Not at all. No one - least of all the Arabs -- had heard of the "Palestinians" or "Palestinian people" before the Six-Day War.
Hmm. I guess somebody forgot to tell the Palestinian National Congress, founded by Arab Palestinians in 1919 (see http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/History/brits.html), that the Arabs weren't supposed to have heard of "Palestinians" until 1967.
I guess, too, that the Palestinan National Charter, which refers to "Palestinians" and to the "Palestinian Arab people," was actually issued after the Six-Day War, but back-dated to 1964.