Words to ponder. "As goest Israel ... If the Jewish state can't survive the onslaught of militant Islam, neither can the rest of the civilized world," by Lorne Gunter in the National Post, May 5 (thanks to Doug):
Israel is Western civilization's canary in the coal mine. If Israel cannot survive, perhaps Western civilization -- pluralistic, democratic, individualistic, secular, free-trading and devoted to the rule of law -- will be unable to last, either.On the eve of Israel's 60th anniversary, those of us who cherish our own fundamental freedoms had better hope the Jewish state makes it through its second 60 years; or else our own right to think, say or worship as we please (unless, of course, we come under the scrutiny of a so-called human rights commission) is in jeopardy.
To many Canadians, that may seem a farfetched warning.
What has Israel's survival got to do with us? Israel is far away. It has different enemies than we do. Even among Islamic extremists, they are battling Hamas, Hezbollah, the PLO and Islamic Jihad, while the West is confronting the Taliban and al-Qaeda.
Besides, if we're nice and accommodating of diversity, the terrorists will respect our attempts to honour their culture and faith and leave us alone.
Nice theory. Too bad jihadis of every label view Israel and the West as conjoined and inseparable. Even though we may not see our destiny as inextricably linked with Israel's, they do. If we give up on Israel, they will simply take that as a sign they might be able to pressure us next to give up on Quebec, Mississauga, Michigan, Birmingham and the Paris suburbs.
Yes, and your city, too. Read it all.
The onslaught has been going on since 1400 the dictates of MoHAMtheMED and the inculcation of the teachings of the Koran to continue the looting and massacre of Non Muslims is well known. The wealth that was generated in the UMMAH and the "Islamic Golden age" was from the plundering of rich civilizations and it continues till this day but in another form--Western aid, dole, oil money, and open immigration to take advantage of rich nations.
The subjugation and ultimate destruction of Banu Israel is the final validation of Islam, and we can infer this from Islamic tradition. So LONG LIVE ZION!
The National Post is one of few newspapers left today that will report on what the reality is. Bravo to them. Note they used that blasphemous word "jihadis" when no one else will.
" Israel is far away. It has different enemies than we do"
not any more.
While the survival of Israel as a Jewish state is extremely important, its destruction would not herald the total defeat of western civilization. A Jihadist victory would remove Israeli as a putative casus belli between the Islamic world and the West. Such a conquest would be accompanied by a horrific loss of life on both sides including the probable wholesale slaughter of those Jews unfortunate enough to be able to put sufficient distance between themselves and victorious Muslim forces. Jihadist casualties would be extremly heavy as well, as it is likely Israel's nuclear capability would come into play. In the surviving West, it is just as likely that anti-Islamic rioting would take place - a conflict that Islam is not yet in a good positon to win.
This piece is pure propaganda. I've often felt that the message of Jihad Watch is entirely undermined by how it aligns itself with the Zionist movement. The truth is, there are two sides to that issue, and most Americans realize this. I say "propaganda" because it's entirely beneficial to the Zionist movement to make Westerns believe that poor innocent Israel is unfairly under siege by Muslims--because it's a Western country--when the truth is that the foundation of that country was to bound to guarantee this sort of feud in the first place. The truth is, The West and Israel do not both have terrorism issues--rather, The West has terrorism issues BECAUSE of Israel. The Zionist voices in America are entirely hell bent on making sure Americans don't make this realization. Furthermore, no Palestinian should have to recognize Israel's so called "right" to exist--because doing so would be endorsing the Palestinian displacement. We are quick to condemn Palestinian terrorism but never the Israeli activities--such as its maintenance in the West Bank of 200,000 Israeli 'settlers'--that incites that sort of terrorism in the first place.
If the Jewish state can't survive the onslaught of militant Islam, neither can the rest of the civilized world
Yes that true. Now what?
One way to defeat the Jihad for good is to stop all Muslim immigration. This should be the first step. It may seem a big step, but when the stakes are so high, then it is not just permmisable but imperative. If we do this, then the Jihad from within is defeated. Jihad from without can be dealt with, as it has been in history.
If one does this, then it is quite possible that a genuine reform of Islam may take place, thus freeing billions of Muslims. But this will be a bonus.
"The truth is, The West and Israel do not both have terrorism issues--rather, The West has terrorism issues BECAUSE of Israel."
How enlightening Mr.ibrahimX! But that's not what your fellow jihadists tell us. They tell us jihad against the Jews is their #1 mission and then #2, jihad will be turned solely against the west. Israel is only an excuse for your war, for now.
ibrahimX...
"We are quick to condemn Palestinian terrorism but never the Israeli activities--such as its maintenance in the West Bank of 200,000 Israeli 'settlers'"... and what was the excuse for the terrorism between 1948 and 1967 when there were no settlements on the West Bank? And why did over 90% of the Palestinians VOLUNTARILY leave Israel proper instead of staying and becoming a citizen of that country? And why didn't the Palestinians demand that the West Bank be a Palestinian state before 1967? And why did the Palestinians reject UN resolution 181 which would have established a Palestinian state in 1948?
ibrahimX,
If we have terrorism problems because of Israel, then how can you explain the Pasha of Tripoli? Israel was more than 100 years from being reformed, and the Muslim world had more than retaken the land "lost" to the infidel crusaders.
"The truth is, The West and Israel do not both have terrorism issues--rather, The West has terrorism issues BECAUSE of Israel."
Hate to break it to you ibrahim, but the West has terrorism issues because it has allowed Muslims within its borders.
Israel had a handicap there. On the day of its founding it had a sizable Muslim population, something the West brought upon itself by its own misguided policies and politics.
You've obviously forgotten, but al Qaeda's primary concern during the 1990s was getting US forces out of Saudi Arabia, your vaunted homeland. Usama seized on Israel as a cause only after the 9/11 attacks, not before.
Neither Spain nor Britain was attacked because of Israel. Israel wasn't the cause of ANY of these attacks on the West. ISLAM was.
Try again. You'll get it right eventually.
" say "propaganda" because it's entirely beneficial to the Zionist movement to make Westerns believe that poor innocent Israel is unfairly under siege by Muslims-"
Posted by: ibrahimX
let's see, dozens of rockets fired into Israel daily, suicide bombers at check points, kidnapped soldiers and civilians, sniper attacks, armed assaults, constant threats of a terrible invasions, promises of delivery of a nuclear attack to wipe out Israel, plots to poison Israel food and water supplies, disruption of many things delivered to help the Palestinian people which causes Palistinian people to suffer (Never mind the fact that these disruptions of fuel, electricty, water, food, medicine and other items of comfort were caused by the Muslim), the constant threat of suicide bombers boarding buses, trains , ships, and planes.
.
Sounds somewhat like a siege to me. It is amazing that Israel does not retaliate more than they do.
There is much death in the Palestinian future and they themselves will be cause of it.
"Peace" as in real peace is not in their Vocabulary, But "hate" sure is.
If the Jewish state can't survive the onslaught of militant Islam, neither can the rest of the civilized world.
This is arguable. Maybe it's phrased wrongly.
The Western world survived the Crusades. The holy land had been retaken from the Muslims and was in Christian hands for about a century. Eventually it was lost again. The Catholic Church survived and so did the Jews and so did Western civilization, even though the Islamic world was dominant at the time and continued to threaten the West for centuries afterward.
Israel has it harder than other countries. It might yet be lost to the barbarians but that doesn't mean Western civilization has to cave.
A better question to ask people: if you think it's okay for Israel to fall to militant Islam then what about your own country? If you want your people and heritage to survive the Muslim onslaught then why wouldn't you want the same for Israel? If Israel doesn't deserve to survive then why should you?
when the smoke clears, Israel will still be standing.
MP -
In wartime, the enemy's casualties, however massive, are either a matter of complete indifference or cause for celebration - one, or the other.
If we intend to win, we certainly cannot be concerned about the enemy's suffering. The prospect of massive casualities among the jihadis and their supportes bothers me not at all.
HotSpur- I'm 1/2 Scottish. The Scots are like Sicilians, but with poor food. I am tribal. I rejoice in my enemy's casualties. I was merely pointing out what to me is obvious, that any military defeat of Israel will only be accomplished at huge cost to the aggressor.
Ibrahim x u idiot.. we europeans have a terrirost problem NOT because of our friend Israel but because of our eternal enemy islam.
We have a terrism issue because some among us have carelessly opened the gates and allowed this flood of hateful and uneducated barbarians amongst us.
The european Left have hamstrung our defenses and they continue to allow the lowest of the world in our midst.
They are allowing those who mean us all harm into our formerly blessed lands which are now being despoiled by the presence of the mohamedan Satan-worshippers.
Guess who goes to jail in Europe when there's a fight between Europeans on the one hand and moslems on the other. Even when the aggressor is invariably the moslem side.
Don't blame this situation on Israel ok?
We have heard of kitman and taqiyya too.
So we know that all moslems lie. They'd be disloyal moslems if they didn't.
Yes, that's what it sas in their 'holy' book the KKKorag.
Cya, mohamedan troll..
ibrahimX exhibits the usual Muslim emotionalism when it comes to Israel and the "Palestinians."
Long live Israel! May she live long and prosper.
Israel isn't the problem. Islam is the problem. The thinking of Islam is the problem. Islam is still mired in the 6th century. It is outdated.
Israel will survive. When the shelling and bombing stop, she will be standing victorious as before. Regardless of what the Muslims or the Tower of Babel (UN) says or thinks. Israel will survive, she will endure and she will prevail!
Yom Yisrael Chai!
We are quick to condemn Palestinian terrorism but never the Israeli activities--such as its maintenance in the West Bank of 200,000 Israeli 'settlers'--that incites that sort of terrorism in the first place.
Posted by: ibrahimX
"WE" are quick to condemn.. .. .. "WE" are.. .. .. ?? Please DO tell, ibrahim.. when was the last time YOU condemned thos moslem barbarians who murder not only ISRAELIS but anyone who is not part of their savage throwback cult?
Pray tell.. and please Do condemn!
alla snackbar!! KILL! KILL! KILL!
PMK made a shrewd observation the other day that's worth pondering. He asked about the viability of a disjointed state of Palestine comprising Gaza and the West Bank when there is nothing connecting the two - except Israel.
Is anyone aware of whether there might be plans, perhaps secret, to create a corridor of some kind between Gaza and the West Bank, say something akin to the Polish Corridor? I could see something like this being cooked up by Dhimmi Khadr. Of course, this would have to come from land presently controlled by Israel, unless Jordan wanted to donate the land from its territory (doubful).
The prospect of massive casualities among the jihadis and their supportes bothers me not at all.
Posted by: HotSpur
----
It's even sweeter when they do it all on their own like during the Iran-Iraq war.
Oh, what a fool this Bush is. He who prattles about bringing peacee to this cauldron of hate called the Middle East..
"Furthermore, no Palestinian should have to recognize Israel's so called "right" to exist--because doing so would be endorsing the Palestinian displacement."
Uh.....sorry. This is hogwash of biblical proportions. First, Palistine and the "Palistine people' do not exsist except as a political entity created to destroy Israel. Second, who was it that "displaced" these so called Palistinians? It was the Arab League, and it started in 1948 when they told the "Palistinians" to leave, that when they destroyed Israel they would be invited back. That never happened so.....who is to blame for the so called palistinian problem" Yep, the Arabs and their Muslim handlers. Got it now? Good!
"Kuffirs of the world, Unite!"
"Islam, abusing women and children since 622AD"
"...the West has terrorism issues BECAUSE of Israel." -ibrahimX
And what about the East's "terrorism issues?" What about Kashmir, Mumbai, the massacres of Hindus in Bangladesh? What about Mindanao and other epicenters of Muslim-based bloodshed and terror in the southern Philippines? What of the massacres in Bali? What about Xinjiang Province in China? And in Islamdom itself, what about Sunnis blowing up Shi'ite mosques, and the thousands of Algerians killed in the name of Islam over the past two decades? What about the millions (65-80,000,000) Hindus murdered in India for their refusal to submit to Islam, their temples destroyed and their history effaced? What do any of these atrocities committed by Muslims have to do with Israel, pray tell?
"What do any of these atrocities committed by Muslims have to do with Israel, pray tell?
Posted by: commonsense "
HA! you are just trying to confuse poor Ibby even more than he is!
MP -
Chill, RobRoy, I was just concerned about the quality of your rest. It sounds as though you are going to be OK.
If Israel were to become the victim of the nuclear Jihad and then Iran, Syria, etc. vanished due to their righteous retaliation, it would not change the imperialistic assault by Islam against the infidels in the rest of the West.
If Israel had never existed, the Islamofascist, expansionist dogma of the Koran would still be in force and the West would still be under threat.
Israel is a strong ally, but this equation is mis-stated.
Israel is more a forward outpost than a pivotal point.
The truth is that Islam cannot tolerate free men and women anywhere.
That is the meaning of this war.
Human liberty versus sycophantic submission to the rantings of a pedophile "prophet".
ibrahimX ...Ok Ibrahim, whats with the X? Nation of Islam maybe? A Black Muslim Farrakhan style? From Oakland Ca Chapter? I have to confess Ibrahim, your brothers at the Black Muslim Bakery on San Pablo Ave, if it's still there, produced the best bread you can get anywhere. If only muslims would stick to what they do best, bread making, the world would be a safer place...
Remeber "The Samson Option". Zion has more then 200 plus nukes. The Jew-Hating muslem world will burn in nuclear fire, it will be righteous vengence, for gods chosen people. Their will only peace when every muslem family has felt the pain and horror of war. Jihad must be burned from their souls. This is a war of survival, all is allowed. LONG LIVE ISREAL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Islamic murders (terror) has surpassed 11,000 since 9/11. Israel is based on hope and love and has prospered in a most despicable place among a band of enemies. The Pali's and their brothers in hate will consume themselves as they are doing in Iraq, as Hamas and Fatah are doing to themselves. My bet is that hope and love will always win out over despair and hatred and that's all the Jihadists have. they have turned their god, Allah, into the personification of the devil and all that is evil.
The troll must be a regular at this hateful and untruthful site:
http://peoplesgeography.com/
There seem to be a couple of posters who definitely do not fit the Multi-Cultural Template. God only knows why the first is always special.
PRIME EXAMPLE OF "BACKWARDS" THINKING:
This piece is pure propaganda. I've often felt that the message of Jihad Watch is entirely undermined by how it aligns itself with the Zionist movement. The truth is, there are two sides to that issue, and most Americans realize this. I say "propaganda" because it's entirely beneficial to the Zionist movement to make Westerns believe that poor innocent Israel is unfairly under siege by Muslims--because it's a Western country--when the truth is that the foundation of that country was to bound to guarantee this sort of feud in the first place. The truth is, The West and Israel do not both have terrorism issues--rather, The West has terrorism issues BECAUSE of Israel. The Zionist voices in America are entirely hell bent on making sure Americans don't make this realization. Furthermore, no Palestinian should have to recognize Israel's so called "right" to exist--because doing so would be endorsing the Palestinian displacement. We are quick to condemn Palestinian terrorism but never the Israeli activities--such as its maintenance in the West Bank of 200,000 Israeli 'settlers'--that incites that sort of terrorism in the first place.
Posted by: ibrahimX
"X" stands for x-tra ignorant.
IbrahimX is the only one that speaks sense here, the rest of you are just senseless bigots and shills for extremist Likud zionism. Gramfan, just what exactly does this site post that is either hateful or untruthful? I challenge you to name a single one. Rather your charges are a projection for this hateful site, which is Islamaphobic in the extreme. I've yet to meet a Muslim who is against Jews, and do not conflate legitimate criticism of the apartheid state of Israel with a hate for Jews. This is the lowest form of rhetoric, and fortunately most people can see through it. It wasn't a Muslim Lobby that called for the invasion of Iraq, it was the Israel-first neocons. It wasn't a Muslim nation that occupies the West Bank and Gaza, it is Israel. It wasn't a Muslim nation that keeps invading its neiggbor Lebanon, it is belligerent, racist Israel that keeps stealing Palestinian land, refuses to abide by international law and refuses to act like a normal state and define its borders. Islam is not the problem./ Judaism is the problem. Racist extremists on both sides are, as well as the misguided "Christian Zionists".
IbrahimX is the only one that speaks sense here, the rest of you are just senseless bigots and shills for extremist Likud zionism. Gramfan, just what exactly does this site post that is either hateful or untruthful? I challenge you to name a single one. Rather your charges are a projection for this hateful site, which is Islamaphobic in the extreme.
I've yet to meet a Muslim who is against Jews, and do not conflate legitimate criticism of the apartheid state of Israel with a hate for Jews. This is the lowest form of rhetoric, and fortunately most people can see through it.
It wasn't a Muslim Lobby that called for the invasion of Iraq, it was the Israel-first neocons. It wasn't a Muslim nation that occupies the West Bank and Gaza, it is Israel.
It wasn't a Muslim nation that keeps invading its neighbor Lebanon, it is belligerent, racist Israel that keeps stealing Palestinian land, refuses to abide by international law and refuses to act like a normal state and define its borders.
Islam is not the problem./ Judaism is the problem. Racist extremists on both sides are, as well as the misguided "Christian Zionists".
Correction: Judaism is *not* the problem.
THeHammer, you are a nutcase:
"Remeber "The Samson Option". Zion has more then 200 plus nukes. The Jew-Hating muslem world will burn in nuclear fire, it will be righteous vengence, for gods chosen people. Their will only peace when every muslem family has felt the pain and horror of war. Jihad must be burned from their souls. This is a war of survival, all is allowed. LONG LIVE ISREAL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"
No, the Muslim world is not Jew-hating. No, the Jews are not God's chosen People. How dare you incite hate and war against a whole religious faith? This is a disgusting site. You are a disgusting person.
Gramfan,
I visited the site you mentioned. Thanks for turning me on to such an excellent site.
Agreed, Briars, "hope and love will always win out over despair and hatred" but no, Israel is NOT based on hope and love, it is its antithesis and has been from its inception. It routinely invades its neighbors, steals their fertile topsoil and water, refuses to accept peace overtures and thus undermines its own security, runs the longest running military occupation in modern history, keeps building illegal settlements, bites the hand that feeds it (spy cases, USS Liberty) and is a menace to the international community. Hope and love come by way of the non-violent resistance and survival of the resilient Palestinian people.
Ethnic cleansing and low-level genocide .... if that's your idea of hope and love I feel sorry fore you.
http://bangornews.com/news/t/viewpoints.aspx?articleid=162956&zoneid=35
http://www.charlotte.com/409/story/576063.html
Islam is disgusting.
No Islam - No need for Jihad Watch.
Islam, the religion of peace. There will be no peace until the whole world is for Allah.
The truth is, there will be no peace until the "religion of peace" is totally eradicated - before it totally eradicates us.
Islam is at war with all free nations and "until the whole world is for Allah" is exactly what their objective is.
Israel should be supported in every way possible until the West wakes up and does what it has to do to stop the jihadist onslaught, I hope.
PeaceTruthJustice ...Israels the big bad boogy man huh. Mean, nasty, baby killing Israel. The main thing in the life of Israel is to abuse 'Palestinians'. Those poor 'Palestinians', who are short on food and supplies but long on rockets for Israeli towns. And Israel really rubs it in when they leave the power on to Gaza, and treat wounded 'Palestinians', in Israeli hospitals. How brutal of them. The worse thing the Israeli's did to the 'Palestinians' was to give them Gaza. Now that was a brilliant piece of dirty Zionist strategy. Israel gave them Gaza and look what a beautiful sea side resort they turned it into. Not quite as good as Dubai but getting close. The rotten Zionist left Gaza in good hands, Hamas is turning it into a paradise for muslims. If only Israel would just pack up and move out, muslims could turn the land into a paradise just like Gaza. Look how the Pali's got those organic greenhouses up and running. Everything Hamas and Fatah touch turn to gold, it's only Israel that stands in the way of a world Caliphate, and a new golden age of Islam....
PeaceTruthJustice,
You're a new poster here, so I think people are trying to get a sense of you before responding. I followed the links you suggested, and after noting your usage of jargon it seems to me you might be more comfortable interacting with your fellow Palestinian partisans rather than picking fights with supporters of Israel you find here.
Eastview, Yes I would be more comfortable with people who believe in sanity and justice, but fighting for justice is not about living in one's comfort zone and having your prejudices confirmed by an echo-chamber around you. I do not think my comments were at all full of jargon, but I take your comment as an indication that this forum would prefer an echo chamber of comfort itself rather than have its views challenged based on fact. I would also dispute your implied comment that I am against Israel. If you think Islamaphobia (funded, no doubt, by Likud zionists) is the best way to protect Israel's security and safeguard Israel's future, you are mistaken. Only a just resolution to this conflict would do that. If you wish to continue living in your bubble, I will not prick your illusions. Goodbye and I will pray for both Israelis and Palestinians; Muslims, Christians and Jews.
"...Islamaphobia (funded, no doubt, by Likud zionists)..."
This is the kind of partisan jargon I was referring to.
"I will pray for both Israelis and Palestinians; Muslims, Christians and Jews."
On this we all can agree.
PTJ states: "I would also dispute your implied comment that I am against Israel."
Oh really. I can certainly see why Eastview concluded that you are against Israel due to one of several comments you made, this being most notable:
"...but no, Israel is NOT based on hope and love, it is its antithesis and has been from its inception."
You are making contradictory statements, so it's easy to see why one might consider you anti-Israel. Which is it?
To answer "Champ: ...
Are you capable of comprehending this, Champ? I am not against the Israeli people. I am against the policies of the Israeli government, of successive Israeli governments since its inception in 1948. Are you anti-American if you oppose a certain Democratic administration? Are you anti-South African if you opposed apartheid throughout its existence?
Eastview: Islamophobia is routinely expressed in these comments. Likud Zionism (as opposed to its more progressive strains) also find reflection here. Calling it partisan "jargon" is itself a partisan value judgment to which you are entitled. As for praying for Muslims, I very much doubt that of some of your commenters here, who have expressly desired that "every Muslim family ... feel the pain and horror of war" and used ridiculous names such as "mohamedan Satan-worshippers", impugning a whole faith tradition, the vast majority of whom are innocent, law-abiding and peaceful people, not "Jew-haters" as you claim.
PTJ
the usual type, and what an imaginitive user name!
"I don't hate Israel - I just hate Zionists" - makes everything ok.
No genocide of Palestinians is going on in Israel - their numbers have increased - or didn't you notice?
Do you think any "Palestinian" doctors would minister to an Israeli like those shown here?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CeVvMJdvEX8
Posters here know a taqqyia master when they see one.
Happy to have helped you find a site that is more to your taste.
Goodbye then.
'peacetruthjustice' (what a marvellously Orwellian nic!) proclaims to us that "I have yet to meet a Muslim who is against Jews".
Gee. I have read my way through the archives of this site, three years' worth. Many posting here have been shocked by encountering, from Muslim 'friends', neighbours, workmates, etc., open and virulent anti-semitism. Not just 'hatred of Israel'. Plain old nasty hatred of Jews, all Jews, any Jews, anywhere and everywhere.
Talk about head in the sand. Hear no evil, see no evil, speak no evil, like the Three Wise Monkeys.
Well: IF 'ptj' is not a Muslim, if s/he is, rather, a janissary, or Useful Idiot, s/he needs to be reminded about taqiyya.
Here are four pieces of evidence as to the prevalence of Muslim hatred of Jews, that spring to my mind, just while I sit here hammering out this posting before I rush off to cook dinner.
First, from Nonie Darwish:
"I’d like to start with my background. I was born and raised as a Muslim in Cairo, Egypt and the Gaza Strip; a time when President Nasser was committed to unify the Arab world and destroy Israel. In the 50’s, my father headed the Egyptian military intelligence in Gaza and started the Fedayeen, which means ‘armed resistance and self sacrifice’. They made cross-border attacks into Israel and caused death, damage and destruction. There were assassination attempts on my father in response to the terror.
"One night Israel sent commandos to our heavily guarded home, but my father was not home. All the Israeli soldiers found were us, women and children. The Israeli soldiers left us unharmed.
"I attended Gaza elementary schools. It is there that we learned hatred vengeance and retaliation; peace was never an option; but a sign of defeat and weakness.
"Jews were portrayed as less than human; I was told ‘don’t take candy or fruit from a stranger, it could be a Jew trying to poison you’.
"They filled our hearts with fear of Jews; that made hatred come easy and terrorism acceptable, even honorable."
Example no. 2, from Geraldine Brooks, 'Nine Parts of Desire': first, a general remark -
'If I were to marry a Jew, it seemed important to throw in my lot with his often threatened people. I didn't know then that I would spend the best part of the enxt decade in the Middle East, where being on my husband's side MADE ME AN AUTOMATIC ENEMY TO MANY OF THOSE WE LIVED AMONG."
And here is what Geraldine heard from the mouth of an elegant, sophisticated and charming Persian intellectual Muslim woman:
'Israel has to be obliterated', she would say, reaching for her teacup and taking a delicate sip, 'I'm looking forward to taking part in the war for its destruction'.
Example no 3: the Arab Muslim lynch mob rallying cry - Itbah al-Yahood! KILL THE JEWS! It's a LOT older than the re-establishment of Israel. Where do you think it comes from, ptj, pray tell? Hint: it WASN'T learned from the Nazis.
Example no. 4: from a Muslim sufi 'saint', Sirhindi, who died in 1621, on the subject of Jews:
"whenever a Jew is killed, it is for the benefit of Islam".
PS - Ayaan Hirsi Ali, in 'Infidel', mentions the open hatred of Jews that she encountered within every Muslim community in which she lived prior to coming to the West. In Saudi Arabia the Jews were blamed for EVERYTHING that went wrong.
When all is said and done, Isreal will still stand because the God of Abraham, Issac, and Jacob is with it.
God Bless Isreal on its 60th Aniversary of its independence.
After taking a look at this thread, there has been an invasion of two trolls here. They are PeaceTruthJustice and ibrahimX.
Robert, Hugh, and Marisol, please come and take a look at this thread. Thanks.
Eastview, Yes I would be more comfortable with people who believe in sanity and justice, but fighting for justice is not about living in one's comfort zone and having your prejudices confirmed by an echo-chamber around you.
posted by ptj
Eastview, Yes I would be more comfortable with people who believe in sanity and justice, but fighting for jihad is about living in one's comfort zone and having your prejudices confirmed by an echo-chamber around you.
There; I fixed your jargon.
No thanks needed.
peacetruthjustice
One question. I am a card carrying ________phobe.
Where do I apply for those Zionist funds?
I need to gas up my prehistoric beast-car. All 360 horses are hungry.
" Only a just resolution to this conflict would do that."
Posted by: PeaceTruthJustice
What is your definition of a "just Resolution"?
To everyone who is saying "Israel will survive", "Israel cannot fall", "The God of Abraham will protect Israel", etc.
I am a firm supporter of Israel, but the kind of thinking expressed above is counter-productive.
The survival of Israel is not a foregone conclusion. And the longer we (the West) continue to ignore the problem, the more doubtful Israel's survival becomes. And indeed, as Israel goes, so will go the rest of us.
Some of you are thinking to yourselves that I am wrong, because it says so in the Bible.
No it doesn't.
IF you accept Biblical prophecy (and not everyone does), then God promised that the Jewish PEOPLE would survive. He said nothing about the survival of the State of Israel as a government.
Israel as a country was wiped out in the 1st Century A.D. Who's to say it won't happen again?
"Islam is not the problem." ~PeaceTruthJustice
Agreed. The problem has always been its believers.
Has anyone heard or read about Ezekiel 37-39?
It talks a LOT about the restoration of Isreal and epic battles.
I am a devout Atheist. I was however raised a Scottish Free Presbyterian. For me which flavour of Sky Fairy a person claims as his protector or instructor or justification for their actions is irrelevant to me. I do not favour one invisible friend over another.
I lie awake at nights worried about Islam.
If a Jewish family move into my street I will racistly assume they are solicitors, doctors or professionals in someway. It may be that they are joiners. They will keep themselves to themselves. They will be good neighbours. They will be good citizens of the community. I could be 90% sure based on thousands of years of history that they were not going to cause me any danger nor intend to harm me.
Who can say the same about Muslims. In the UK many just come here and claim unemployment benefits from our government. DEmand special rights. Demand special schools. Claim they are offended by everything from School uniform to cartoons.
Now I base my judgement on 10,000's of incidents in Western Europe over recent history.
Dear God, so much tripe...
If by "Israel-first neocons" you're referring to our current administration, it's only appropriate to point out that if they are truly "Israel-first", they would not now be pushing so hard for a suicidal propitiation from Israel - give up another 50% of the land they've purchased and/or won to those who have vowed to destroy them.
Israel hasn't stolen any Palestian land. The land was GIVEN to them after WWI, through the same legal processes that created the modern states of Syria, Iraq, Jordan, etc.
Israel is not in contravention of any international laws. UN GA resolutions are not international law.
No matter where Israel defined her borders, the Arabs would disagree. Remember that the "green line" is only an armistice line, not a border, and the fraction of "Palestine" that Israel agreed to (in celebration) in 1948 was rejected then by all of the Arabs. We're all supposed to believe that those "borders" are going to be OK now?
The Muslim world is not Jew-hating? Perhaps...only those Muslims who are true to their faith are Jew-hating. I recommend you begin your education here.
Israel is not an occupier. Gaza and Judea/Samaria were illegally stolen from the Mandate territory (Israel) by Egypt and Jordan. There is no such thing as illegal settlements, unless you include all of the large housing units that have been raised in East Jerusalem by Arabs. All of this land belongs to Israel, legally.
"low level genocide"...right. Which is why the population of Gaza has quintupled since 1948...or maybe that all happened prior to Israel retaking it in 67? BTW..did you know that after Israel reclaimed Gaza - at least until the disengagement in 05 - life expectancy (and literacy rates) in Gaza nearly doubled? That would have to be the most spectacular failure of attempted genocide in history.
You want a "just resolution"? How about 78% of Palestine goes to Arabs, and Jews get 22% - after paying exorbitant prices to the absentee owners. Oh, wait...we already tried that, and got the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan.
Apartheid states don't allow the "other" in the ruling body, or give full rights of citizenship to them.
That's all we have time for today, boys and girls.
"It wasn't a Muslim Lobby that called for the invasion of Iraq,"
Posted by: PeaceTruthJustice
but it was a Muslim lobby that called for the massive multi-Muslim country combined invasion on Israel in 1967.
an it was a Muslim Lobby that called for the Invasion of Spain and Europe many years ago.
Muslim lobbies have called for Muslim invasions of Darfur, Eithopia, India, Indonesia, and other places..many times.
currently there are Muslim lobbies calling for a Muslim invasion of the UK, Europe, and America.
lobbies for invasions are popular with Muslims.
The biggest mistake Israel made is that they stopped at the Golan Heights. They should have contionued all the way to Mecca, Saudi Arabia. Saudi Arabia was a Jewish state before the Islam came from no where (badoins) and massacred them all and them started spreading like a plague or cancer. The Earth became Hell after being infected by Islam.
I can defend every word I am saying here!
er, uh...stupid attack. "propitiation" should be "capitulation".
People who just drop in and start dropping bombs, are not here to solve any problems. They are here to do damage. Either as jihadi's or useful idiots.
I bet the 'truth' guy and the X guy, have not spent much time on this site at all, yet they blow in here dropping insults and telling anyone who will listen, 'what is what'. Most of the people who post here regularly are experts in their own right about Islam in theory and practice, and how that effects the ME and the world in general. And one of the things they know is that Islam will never let an infidel state, Israeli or not, exist right in the middle of muslim lands, especially the ME, no matter how small. This is like a toothache to the Islamic identity and needs to be yanked out.
No one, or nation can live indefinitely with a toothache. No one can give a toothache the right to exist. Israel then is under attack by a coven of Islamic Dental Jihadist, seeking to end the toothache by extracting the rotten tooth.
A rotten tooth has no right to exist. Hamas, Fatah, Hezbollah, with the help of their friends,
are the dental team assigned by Allah to remove the rot of Israel from the ME. This is why dental attacks will continue against Israel, no matter what, it's not possible to make peace with a rotten tooth. Allah wants it removed as soon as possible. The problem is, of course, that Israels roots go deep into the land, both in history and religion, it's not easy to uproot her. That's why it takes multiple dental jihadist's, one alone can't do it. I am not so sure that the many can do it either...
PTJ -
I'm not hearing much in the way of 'peace, truth or justice' in anything you've written, only a lot of name calling, insults & platitudes.
duh_swami is right, in that some posters like to let off stink bombs and then act like - WHAT?! What have I said or done that might be misconstrued as hateful?
I don't need to work on my comprehension, because I'm a pretty good judge of when someone supports Israel or they don't, and you clearly DON'T support Israel. Attempting to redirect the problem onto me is not going to work, because I'm afraid it's too late, as it's very obvious that you DO NOT support Israel.
Come on - surprise us all by being honest, Mr. Truth.
Trolls are nothing but hit and run. They deposit a turd on your doorstep and run.
Funny also that one troll comes seldom alone. They always need backup.
None of the trolls arguments were truthful.
'Law abiding' Muslims? Which law would that be? The sharia?
'Justice' means sharia, we know that already,
'Peace' in Islam means the peace of the grave.
Same old, same old.
Israel will survive. But not with Ol-merde at the helm.
Hang in there Isreal, Olmert's time in office is getting close to the end and I predict Bibi will be elected.
Angus og - We should get together for a pie and a pint. I'll leave the deep fried mars bars and the irn bru to my cousins in Glasgow.
/Do like haggis though.
Really, that National Post. The headline should read: "as GOETH Israel" not "as GOEST". "Goest" is a second person form, for address. If they want to make their warnings sound Biblical, they could at least get the language right.
"...I predict Bibi will be elected."
Posted by: bigcatgirl13106
Let's hope so.
"...deep fried mars bars.."
WTF??? Sounds intriguing.
Got a recipe?
make that irn bru Barr's
shortfattexan,
Slightly OT, or rather NT.
A similar thought occurred to me with regard to Christianity. Consider Matthew 16:18. "And I say also to you, that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it."
Whether you are Catholic or Protestant, keying on the MAN or on what he CONFESSED, the point is that Jesus builds his church and hell will not defeat it. This says nothing about whether or not the church will endure on earth till the end. Indeed, Scripture appears to indicate that the church will have essentially disappeared as a faith based proposition by the time Jesus returns, "...when the Son of Man comes, will he find faith on the earth?" Luke 18:8
As for Israel, it may well be destroyed before the end by its many merciless haters, but Islam, that religion of hatred, will also be exposed as the work of darkness that it has always been. Muslims, at long last, will see that Mohammad was always a false prophet, deceived and deceiving. That, in any case, is what I believe will happen.
Eastview - Check out wikipedia which has a recipe, culinary history and a yummy looking pic. My Glasgow cousins talked me into trying one, and it was pretty good. Had to have a few pints and a curry first though.
Speaking of haggis -please don't tell me how it is made!- ponder if you will Robert Burns' Address to a Haggis (An English translation is provided!)
"As goest Israel ... If the Jewish state can't survive the onslaught of militant Islam, neither can the rest of the civilized world,"
I'd like to expand on this by suggesting that if Israel did not secure and defend its borders it would certainly not "survive the onslaught of militant Islam." The United States, as well as the rest of the civilized world, MUST be willing to secure and defend its borders in a likewise manner in order to survive.
Novalis--keep in mind that Israel is typically personified in the Bible: "Jacob[Israel]I have loved ..."
Why do champions of "Palestinian refugees" fail to see that, if, say, 750,000 Arabs fled that part of Mandatory Palestine that became Israel, then this is counterweighed by the 800,000 Jews expelled and dispossessed from Arab Muslim lands--though they had lived there for many centuries? Unlike many Palestinian Arabs, dependent and clinging to illusions, these Near Eastern Jews were absorbed into Israeli society and learned a new national language--Modern Israeli Hebrew.
Found an interesting flash movie on the Isreal's 60th aniversary. Enjoy.
http://www.aish.com/movies/60Years.asp
After becoming exhausted by reading the steady stream of outrageous items appearing on these pages, I decided to try a new pick-me-up, following MP's comment above.
DEEP FRIED MARS BARS RECIPE
Ingredients
milk
1 mars bar
1 cup plain flour
oil for deep frying
1/2 cup corn flour
pinch of bicarbonate of soda
Method
Chill the chocolate bar by keeping it in the fridge, but don't freeze it. Mix the flours and bicarbonate of soda together then add milk until you get a batter with the consistency of thin cream. Heat the oil until a small piece of bread will brown in a few seconds, but don't allow to smoke. Remove wrapper from chilled chocolate bar and coat completely in batter. Carefully lower into hot oil and fry until golden brown. Serve with ice cream.
I tried both Snickers and Milky Way, and washed them down with Jolt Cola.
Thanks, MP!
This article states the truth hyperbolically, but it is still the truth.