Avenger of bad Muslim girls
An attempt to add to the rapidly increasing number of Islamic honor killings in the U.S. Is this the kind of society we want to have in America? Are the assumptions that underlie this practice really compatible with Western principles of the rights and dignity of the human being? If our public officials at this point truly had the best interests of American society at heart, they would begin to examine this phenomenon as part of an examination of Muslim immigration into the U.S., with an eye toward ending that immigration. They would be calling upon Islamic groups in America to confront and fight against the assumptions that lead to honor killing.
Instead, we get the boilerplate "this has nothing to do with Islam" statement in this article, and the blaming of "South Asians" again. Yet Amina and Sarah Said were murdered by their father just months ago -- and they were Egyptians, not South Asians. If this practice has nothing to do with Islam, why did Jordan's Parliament quash an attempt a few years back to stiffen penalties for honor killings -- with Islamic politicians leading the way and making their arguments on Islamic grounds? When will American officials call on Muslim leaders in the U.S. to stop the blame-shifting and finger-pointing and take some real action against this practice?
"Henrietta Muslim knifing called 'honor attack,'" by Michael Zeigler for the Rochester Democrat & Chronicle, July 17 (thanks to all who sent this in):
Infuriated because his younger sister was going to clubs, wearing immodest clothing and planning to leave her family for a new life in New York City, Waheed Allah Mohammad stabbed her outside their Henrietta home, prosecutors allege.Afterward, he told Monroe County sheriff's investigators that he attacked his sister because she had disgraced their family and was a "bad Muslim girl," according to court documents.
Mohammad, 22, is scheduled to appear Friday in Monroe County Court on charges of attempted second-degree murder and first-degree assault in the May 8 attack on Fauzia A. Mohammad, 19.
The case is the second in four years in Monroe County in which an immigrant from South Asia is alleged to have killed or tried to kill a family member over the perceived loss of family honor — an occurrence that is not uncommon in South Asia but is rare in the United States.
Although the defendants in both cases are Muslims, resorting to homicide to restore family honor in mostly Muslim South Asia is a custom that predates Islam, said Aly Nahas, a retired professor of pharmacology at the University of Rochester who is a student of Islamic tradition.
"In my belief, it has nothing to do with Islam," said Nahas, a practicing Muslim. "I know Islam well, and I do not believe it is Islamic. There is nothing in Islam that talks about honor killing."
Nahas said, however, that many Westerners don't accept his assertion.
"And they will not because it occurs in countries that have been Muslim for 1,000 years," he said. "People will ask, 'Why isn't it stopped?' I can't answer that."
According to the United Nations Population Fund, up to 5,000 women are killed each year in South Asia for allegedly disgracing their families. Some of the women are killed after becoming rape victims or rejecting arranged marriages.
Assistant District Attorney Joseph Waldorf, who is prosecuting Mohammad, declined to characterize the case as an "honor attack" or otherwise.
Fauzia Mohammad is recovering from her wounds, Waldorf said....
Yes it is those "South Asians" again they are always at it. In the UK it is those "Asians" again. Such generalizations and marked obfuscation of facts leads to more misinformation and branding others who have hardly any such inclination towards these kinds of behavior. From reading JW most of these cases so far have involved Muslims. We have seen cases like this in the UK and now here in the US. This is now part of the fabric of western societies. Sharia and Islamic doctrines are being applied to non Muslims even though we do not believe in it and live in free societies, because Islam and its doctrines has included us as the mortal enemy for Muslims to destroy and kill.
Until there are cases of murder and attempted murder of girls and young women because of what they wear, etc from members of other religious traditions (other than islam), the professor's assertions, and others like it, are just taquiya.
I'd be interested to see any evidence that this "custom" dates back to pre-Islamic times. My understanding is that Muslims have tended to destroy any writings or other evidences of the times before Islam came along in countries now Muslim. (Not that this is unlike the Christians of some eras with regard to writings of pre-Christian times. But the Muslims seem to have been more thorough in this practice.)
"People will ask, 'Why isn't it stopped?' I can't answer that."
We can.
It won't stop because they don't want to stop. But, more properly, it's not "it" that needs to be stopped, it's them.
Them.
Them as a tribe of savages and them, more particularly, as the more powerful gender within that merry band.
Muslim men get a power surge for their narcissism when they think and hear about it, when they preach about it... when they do it; when they murder their mothers, sisters, aunts, and cousins in the name of their "god.".
They do this by stabbing and beating and shooting and strangling and stomping on the throats of the women they "love."
Hell won't be hot enough for these "men."
It's important that all of us who know that this custom (as well as FGM) AND specific Sharia and Hadith-related practices (Child marriages, for example) are Islamic in culture if not actually doctrinally-based, write letters to the editor of publications and TV outlets that self-censor and do not specifically identify these practices as Muslim. We must insist that they are related to Islamic culture, then let the apologists apologize and defenders defend, the "offended" whine of Islamophobia. Each story of this kind either fails to identify the practice in question as Islamic, or contains an uncontested ritualistic denial (by a Muslim) that it is so. Only by drilling the message in will an understanding of what Islam actually means ON THE GROUND AS PRACTICED be fostered.
ALI NAHAS: "...it occurs in countries that have been Muslim for 1,000 years. People will ask, 'Why isn't it stopped?' I can't answer that."
RESPONSE: Like so many Muslims, Ali is bereft of honest answers or real solutions.
The reason honor killings haven't been stopped is because of the profoundly anti-woman ethos found in so much of Islamic scripture, including Quranic verses 2.228, 2.282, 4.11 & 4.34...and also in numerable Hadith declaring women to be "deficient in religion and intelligence", "the majority of the residents in hell", a bad "oman", etc.
Having thus been sufficiently de-humanized, the culture of oppression (and murder) afflicting Muslim women is - Ali Nahaz's protestations notwithstanding - clearly an extension of the Islamic faith.
"In my belief, it has nothing to do with Islam," said Nahas, a practicing Muslim. "I know Islam well, and I do not believe it is Islamic. There is nothing in Islam that talks about honor killing."
-- from the article above
The Qur'an, the Hadith, the Sira are full of passages, including instructions from He Who Must Be Obeyed, Allah, and from He Who Must Be Taken As The Perfect Guide And Perfect Model In All Things, Muhammad, that clearly put women in a permanently subordinate position, and that, taken as a whole, depict a creature who not only is inferior to men in every important respect, but dangerously alluring to poor, seducible men who can't control their beastly urges, and these women, furthermore, are dangerously sexual beings who must be watched, tamed, even have their pleasure-centers surgically removed to make sure they calm down. Everything from the burqah, or hijab, to clitoridectomies, that are not specifically named or spelled out, in the Qur'an or Hadith, can nonetheless be easily teased out by implication, and have been, by Islamic scholars, and long ago.
It is absurd for any Muslim, in full command of his senses, as this professor apparently is, to deny the connection between Islam and honor killings. Absurd, and also gives us the right to view him, as long as he spouts this increasingly unplausible stuff, with suspicion. Come clean, come clean about Islam, because if you don't, the worst will rightly be assumed.
Any Muslim -- or for that matter non-Muslim -- deliberately engaged in prolonging the confusion and ignorance of Infidels about Islam, is himself contributing to the Jihad and should be regarded, and dealt with, as such.
When you read hadiths that say that Mohammed said: " I was shown the Hell-Fire and the majority of its dwellers were woman (Hadith 1:28) then you clearly begin to see the disrespect, and disregard of women by Islam
And Surah 4:34 Woman are seen as a major cause of evil and are to be kept under control. Men are in charge of women ...as for those whom ye fear rebellion scourge them.
The construct of this hadith and Surah 4:34 alone could easily lead to this kind of action,but there are many more that denigrate women to a status of almost less than human in the backward thinking Muslim mind.
"...an occurrence that is not uncommon in South Asia but is rare in the United States."
Moslems make up ca. 30% of the population in South Asia -- i.e. India, Pakistan, and Bangladesh, but only 1% in the U.S. That explains the difference in frequency. But give us time and more Moslem immigration; we'll catch up.
"...homicide to restore family honor in mostly Muslim South Asia is a custom that predates Islam,..."
No, South Asia is mostly Hindu. But the honor-killings occur mostly among the Moslems.
If the USA were a muslim country she would not have need stabbing, I guess thats the point.
Assistant District Attorney Joseph Waldorf, who is prosecuting Mohammad, declined to characterize the case as an "honor attack" or otherwise.
You can bet your sweet bippy that if it had been a white Christian who stabbed this woman it would have been logged, and would be prosecuted, as a hate crime. Instead it's just a familial spat which got out of hand. It happens all the time. I'm surprised no one has dragged out crime statistics of women stabbed by family members in the heat of an argument to show this isn't "Islamic".
His lawyer says even more important than the motive "is whether Mohammad, who emigrated to the United States with his family from war-ravaged Afghanistan, is suffering from a stress-inflicted mental disorder that could explain or mitigate the alleged attack on his sister."
More on the "argument":
During a family argument that spilled outside, Waheed Mohammad is accused of retrieving a knife from his car and chasing his sister. He allegedly lunged at her with the knife and stabbed her multiple times.
"He described her as a 'bad Muslim girl' and (said) that he did not approve of her clothing," a sheriff's investigator said in court documents. "They argued and he got angry."
After the stabbing, Mohammad allegedly threw the knife into a pond behind the apartment and fled in his car. Deputies stopped Mohammad minutes later at East River and Jefferson roads. Divers recovered the knife later.
Islam ordains stoning for adulterers and a 100 lashes for unmarried fornicators. However, Islam also prescribes death for those who sow discord in the land which is open to interpretation. Is a girl who scandalize her entire family, making them outcasts, an object of mockery and humiliation by the community deserve to die because she is considered to have sown discord? Many Muslims believe that to be so.
Of all these reports, I still do not get all the born Muslim women living in the West staunchly defending the status and treatment of Muslim women, instead of being grateful to the culture that emancipated them and gave them the right of self-determination. More buzzing still are the droves of well educated, formally liberal women who are embracing Islam in droves. I seen videos dozens of group conversion of beautiful young women from the U.S.A and other Western countries who are well educated and otherwise intelligent. Some suspect it is a form of rebellion against the rampant materialism and decadence of the culture and disillusion with modern feminism.
Since when is Turkey "south Asia"?
Mental illness became a defense in the first case involving an honor attack in Monroe County.
On April 15, 2004, Ismail Peltek, an immigrant from Turkey, stabbed and beat his wife to death and wounded two daughters at their home in Scottsville. He told investigators that he was attempting to restore family honor that had been lost when his wife and one daughter were sexually assaulted by a relative and the other daughter was "sullied" by a medical exam.
Peltek was allowed to plead not guilty by reason of mental disease or defect and is being held in a psychiatric center.
-from the article
He'll soon have company, since the defense in this case is prepared to argue "mental defect".
What is the point of quoting a professor of pharmacology about this?
RARE?
It's not rare enough here.
Just ask Amina, Sarah, Methel, and Sandeela.
And now Fauzia.
Of all these reports, I still do not get all the born Muslim women living in the West staunchly defending the status and treatment of Muslim women, instead of being grateful to the culture that emancipated them and gave them the right of self-determination.
have_mercy,
Just one theory springs to mind: they don't understand what they have here and they won't until it's taken from them. Too often, we don't appreciate the good things in life until they're gone.
They don't view it as emancipation. To them, we're trying to strip them of their heritage and they will cling to it with all their strength.
To them, the right of self-determination means they can wear the hijab and live as they please.
Isn't it horrifying that we are starting to get used to this happening in our country?
undoughtably when he is convicted and sentanaced we will saens of his mother weeping and wailing and crying her baby boy is inocent
From Hugh above
"Any Muslim -- or for that matter non-Muslim -- deliberately engaged in prolonging the confusion and ignorance of Infidels about Islam, is himself contributing to the Jihad and should be regarded, and dealt with, as such."
Then I guess that should include George Bush, Condi Rice, and perhaps, John McCain. God help us!
"deliberately engaged.."
When you mention "Bush, Rice, and perhaps McCain" -- why not Obama too, the one who said this week that Muslims all over America "are doing wonderful things" -- you ignore the adverb.
"Deliberately" in all of these cases, or merely ignorantly?
At a certain point ignorance is no excuse. That point has just about been reached.
These incidents will continue to occur in America and other Western countries, and with greater frequency. Two points about this: 1) Every time these despicable honor killings or attempted killings happen, the perpetrator should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law, including maximum jail time after conviction and even the death penalty where it exists and is appropriate. 2) Increasingly more and more non-Muslims will hear how this has nothing to with Islam and increasingly such folks will draw the exact opposite (and correct) conclusion, proving once again that nothing can discredit Islam the way Muslims discredit their own highly dysfunctional and screwed-up religion.
Let's say it doesn't -- which isn't true -- but bear with me. Islamic doctrine doesn't do a single thing to prevent it. And Muslims never address the problem either.
"Thou shalt not murder" is so much clearer than having an entire doctrine of Islamic killing for everything from apostasy and blasphemy to alleged morals violations, and seemingly everything in between. Only the murder of kuffar doesn't bring on a death penalty.
I seem to remember an article about the necessity of head coverings by women because of the rays shooting out from the women's hair causing men troubles
Wellington, I find myself in agreement with you again.
Perhaps there are things we can look for, things we can do to make a difference, as I wrote here some time back...
http://freemendo.typepad.com/undaunted/2008/01/honor-killers.html
If they won't stop, we need to do our part to stop them.
"In my belief, it has nothing to do with Islam," said Nahas, a practicing Muslim. "I know Islam well, and I do not believe it is Islamic. There is nothing in Islam that talks about honor killing."
Yea & we read all the time about brother Buba chasing after aiater Betty Sue because she was becoming a bit too"uppity"
OOpsy- aiater=Sister
JERRY: "What is the point of quoting a professor of pharmacology about this?"
This is the new journalism: If you can't find a Muslim scholar for comment, any Muslim will do.
undaunted: Thanks for the link to your article. You made several good very pro-active suggestions. Since the establishment elites, be they academics, media, polticians, etc. are still pretty much clueless about the overall threat of the Islamic mentality, it will be the common folk who will have to take the initiative from the grass roots level up in dealing with Islam in America (ugh!---the very phrase "Islam in America" resonates with ugliness).
Most disturbing was your narration about the woman who tried to explain the beating death of a Saudi woman as part of another culture. This reminded me of a college student I taught some four years ago. In class I mentioned how it wasn't fair in the least that Saudis could come here, preach their faith and build their mosques but Americans couldn't go to Saudi Arabia and preach Christianity (or some other religion) and build their churches there. The response by this student took me aback for a few seconds. He said that I didn't understand that that is part of Saudi and Arab culture to disallow such a thing. Yeah, I was the deficient one. I responded in class in an unusual way by obliquely insulting him (which ordinarily I don't like to do unless necessary----this time I thought it was deserved) by observing that sometimes a person can be so open-minded that their brains fall out.
Only modern multiculturalism and political correctness, entirely inventions of the Left as I've noted here before at JW, could produce such a young skull full of mush like the woman you mentioned or this student of mine. The enemy without is the Islamic world. The enemy within is the modern Left. We've got to prevail against both to keep America America. Take care, my friend.
"I can't answer that" Nooooooo Kidding! Study harder. This way when you use the word "can't" we will all know you really mean "won't". Until then, your just another useful Idiot.
I wonder how much Debt he took on for the brainwashing? A Multicultural Education does not come cheap these days.
South Asian? Why not just bite it, and mention the country. Were they Indian Muslims? Nepali? Sri Lankan? Were they from Pakistan? Bangladesh? Maldives? Where?
And like others have pointed out, it's fascinating to see Jordan, Turkey, Egypt and a whole host of other places come under 'South Asia'
In addition to the deaths of the women is the intimidating message:
"go ahead.....try to marry an infidel, and see what you get".
So, the result is that
Muslim men can marry your non-Muslim women
but
You cannot marry their Muslim sisters.
Another "in your face" victory for them.
I say keep the cursed religion out of the USA.
And if the Europeans (and Chinese, etc) had any sense, they would follow suit.
Confused in Louisiana.
It's that distant gaze of the fanatical ideologue again.
I suppose if this keeps up, the court system will have to have a shariah law section to deal with the growing abuse of women. What should be done?
Where are all those feminists?
Oddly quiet, but perhaps they favor the abuse and defilement of women after all?
Muslims do honor killing, not Asians.
Maybe there are some JW readers in New York who might be able to provide some assistance (financial or otherwise) to this young woman? I can't imagine being 19, having been stabbed by a brother, and without any kind of family support...
Good call, margheri.
Witness,
The feminist honchos are utter cowards and they are very immoral.
South Asian? Why not just bite it, and mention the country. Were they Indian Muslims? Nepali? Sri Lankan? Were they from Pakistan? Bangladesh? Maldives? Where?
IP,
It was mentioned further down in the article. THIS man and his family "emigrated from war-ravaged Afghanistan".
It should be understood that the definition of immoral dress to muslims is very wide.
About 5 years ago I worked in a 98% muslim area of the UK giving away money to our disadvantaged citizens. Most of them had managed to make an enormous contribution to our rich, vibrant and diverse multi cultural society without making any concessions in the matter of dress, lifestyle or even learning to speak English. Consequently an interpreter always accompanied me and to be honest we got on quite well. One day we called at a house and were admitted by a muslim girl of 18-19 smartly and quite respectably dressed in jeans and blouse. She passed us to her father and all the subsequent conversation was between the interpreter and him in Urdu.
As we got back into the street I remarked to Hanif that it was unusual to see an Asian girl in western dress in the area, at which he spat out in rage;
“She is a student they cannot do anything with her!”
Point - it was none of his damn business, he was only there to pass on information but he had made it his business to ask her father why she was not “properly" dressed. I thought she was a brave girl then and even more so now.
have_mercy
"The feminist honchos are utter cowards and they are very immoral"
I second that.
My wife was quietly sympathetic to the feminists for years but they eventually earned her contempt. As I remember she said “How can they claim to support women and ignore what the muslims do!”
There's nothing honorable about killing one's family members.
Nor is there anything honorable about killing those who happen to have other religions leanings.
It is however, honorable to kill in self-defense and in defense of others.
Just expressing my "ultra right-wing" views.
Because I still can.
At least until January.
"If our public officials at this point truly had the best interests of American society at heart, they would begin to examine this phenomenon as part of an examination of Muslim immigration into the U.S., with an eye toward ending that immigration."
On the contrary, our public officials will say that the problem is lack of multiculturalism and diversity. If anything, they'll increase Muslim immigration to out country.
And we keep electing the same public officials to office. Who's really to blame?
That's cute of them - use the term 'South Asian' to create the impression that they were from India, when in fact, they were not even from Pakistan or Bangladesh, but from Afghanistan.
So the next time a Turk does something in Germany, call him an European, or Eurasian?
His lawyer says even more important than the motive "is whether Mohammad, who emigrated to the United States with his family from war-ravaged Afghanistan, is suffering from a stress-inflicted mental disorder that could explain or mitigate the alleged attack on his sister."
Hm... didn't someone in some other thread warn about this trend...? Oh yeah, it was from that other recent honor killing in Georgia, and it was me!
Our justice system needs to develop "honor killing" as a category that would prevent or inhibit defense attorneys (and then juries) from diminishing a Muslim's guilt of first-degree murder due to mitigating emotional or psychological factors that would be given undue weight in legal sentencing because no other motive exists in the judge's or jury's mind, since if they don't even know what an "honor killing" is, they will look for other motives, and if no other normal first-degree motive seems apparent from the facts, it will be more likely for the defendant's crime to be mitigated by other factors.
http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/021682.php#c556739
...."His lawyer says even more important than the motive "is whether Mohammad, who emigrated to the United States with his family from war-ravaged Afghanistan, is suffering from a stress-inflicted mental disorder that could explain or mitigate the alleged attack on his sister."....
Oh yeah. He's a mental case alright. Just like all the other Muslims who have tried or accomplished honour killings. Problem is, there is no honour in killing innocent women. That is a coward's way.
Not all feminists are immoral cowards. Go check out Phyllis Chesler's blog and scroll down; see what you find.
http://pajamasmedia.com/phyllischesler/
She has some pretty fierce things to say about the rampant abuse of women and children in the Islamosphere (and anywhere else such abuse occurs).
dumbledoresarmy -- check out this essay by Christina Hoff Summers, one of the best overviews on the mentality of feminists unable to appropriately condemn Islam:
http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/archives/016412.php