If China was "cracking down" on a Christian minority group, would this even be making headlines? “US lawmakers condemn crackdown on China's minority Muslims,” from AFP, July 12:
WASHINGTON (AFP) — US lawmakers on Friday "strongly condemned" what they called Beijing's harsh pre-Olympic crackdown in China's Muslim-populated far northwest Xinjiang region.The bipartisan leadership of the Congressional Human Rights Caucus in a statement cited "credible" reports about a July 9 conviction in a closed trial of 15 minority Muslim Uighurs on terrorism charges that led to "the immediate execution of two" of them.
Three others were given suspended death sentences and the remaining 10 received life imprisonment, it said.
These are "abuses of due process and rule of law," said caucus co-chairmen Democrat Jim McGovern and Republican Frank Wolf.
On the same day, they said, police in Urumchi, the regional capital of Xinjiang, reportedly killed five Uighur men who authorities claimed were part of a 15-member criminal gang allegedly trained for "holy war."
"The Chinese government should not be permitted to use the 'war on terror' or Olympic security as a front to persecute the Uighurs," Wolf said.
"These trials' appear to be no more than a ploy to oppress religious freedom and ethnic minority groups," he said.
[…]
Chinese police have this year detained 82 suspected terrorists in Xinjiang who they said were planning to attack the Beijing Olympics, state media reported on Thursday.
The 82 belonged to five groups that "allegedly plotted sabotage against the Beijing Olympics," Xinhua news agency reported, citing police.
It was the first time that Chinese officials had given a total number of suspects detained in a series of raids this year.
Aplogies for going off topic, wonder if you could please post for debate about the perceived anti-Christian bias of a BBC TV fictional drama programme which portrays a 'Christian extremist' beheading a Moslem?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1034512/Bonekickers-drama-blasted-showing-gruesome-decapitation-scene.html
Honestly! It really is appalling. It pays to be a victim in this world. Well lets put it this way it pays to play the victim as in the Muslims. Who apparently are very good at it when it comes to say in countries they are a minority. But woe be it when you are minority in Islamic countries no human rights watch will take a glance at you. Hell it is quite alright for Islamic countries to kill infidels and kidnap them. It is really is a tragedy on an epic proportion. Ideas that are barbaric must be challenged not ignored. I want to kick the F%^&king asses of these politicians.
I wonder what the dhimmis in congress will do when Deerbornstan tries to succeed from the Union.
It's true what they say: the squeaky wheel gets the grease.
Maybe the Christians need to engage in violence? It seems that's what gets the attention of Congress and gets the "dissidents" labeled a victim group. Instead, Christians follow the teachings of their religion and are quietly forgotten.
Who's in who's pocket here?
I just took a look at Congressman Wolf's website, and watched a short video of his comments on China. In fairness to him, it should be noted that he criticized pretty much the whole record of Chinese abuses of human rights, not just against Moslems. He condemned the Chinese detention of Catholic bishops, and their persecution of Protestant "house-churches", and their actions in Tibet, as well as the Chinese supplying weapons to Islamic terror-states.
"It's true what they say: the squeaky wheel gets the grease."
Posted by: PMK
Yes this is true, however if the wheel keeps on squeaking it is replaced.
ebonystone, thanks for your comment. I was aware of Congresssman Wolf's activism on behalf of people suffering all kinds of human rights abuses and to imply he is only concerned with China's muslim majority if unfair to him.
Not sure if this is true or not but can you please highlight this
http://lionheartuk.blogspot.com/2008/07/glen-jenvey-threatened-with-arrest.html
Further to my earlier post, Glen's site is down?
http://www.glen-jenvey.com/
"...China's muslim majority ...."
Posted by: eve_anne_gelical
majority?
Peripherally I have to wonder what it will take for China and Russia to fully comprehend that their real antagonist is the Islamic world rather than America. Both China and Russia to date appear to look upon America as their true impediment to higher status in the global arena when, in fact, what is most injurious to their interests long term is an empowered Islam with an attitude.
We should bring all those oppressed Muslims here as refugees, just like we did with those wonderful Somalis. I'm sure the Chinese government would not mind at all.
That is so dishonest. Sorry, but Jihadwatch should check itself before posting trash like this which is blatantly false.
The Americans have spent two trillion dollars on Tarbaby Iraq, to prevent, rather than to encourage, ethnic and sectarian fissures from breaking apart Iraq, and possibly creating both a fault-line for Sunni-Shi'a hostilities, and a free Kurdistan that might have brought to the attention of the world's non-Arab Muslims (who are 80% of the world's Muslims) the ways in which Islam has and will always be a vehicle for Arab supremacism, as demonstrated not only by the Arab mass-murdering of Kurds in Iraq, but also by the mass-murdering of black African Muslims in Darfur, and the discrimination and persecution, the linguistic and cultural imperialism, from which Muslim Berbers in North Africa have suffered at Arab hands.
The Americans have lavished more than $65 billion on Egypt, and in so doing, have come to be regarded by those in Egypt as handmaids to the corrupt regime, of Mubarak and his Family-and-Friends Plan. For their pains, they have been subject to constant vilification in the Egyptian media and Egypt has become one of the most anti-American countries on earth. Meanwhile, Egypt continues to play a double-game to pretend to be a peacemaker as it pushes the "Palestinian" line in Gaza, and pretends to be working for an end to violence in Darfur, when it has really, all along, been running interference so that the Arabs in Khartoum can buy time, and complete their murderous task, before pretending to, finally, "make peace."
The Americans have, along with the Europeas, lavished billions on the "Palestinian" Arabs, and have ignored the many billions that were already supplied by the Infidel taxpayers and that simply disappeared, poof, when Arafat died. And they continue to allow the "Palestinian" Arabs to think they can live forever on the Infidel dole, and not to come to grips with several hard truths:
One, if you spend all your time spending what you have on arms, and preparing or actually using them, because making war on Israel is the alpha and omega of your collective and individual existence, chances are even the most modest of livings will be beyond you.
Two, if your population is self-schooled and self-primitivized in hate, that hate cannot be undone, and no Infidels on earth should be expected to take any of you in, for you represent a tremendous and clear threat, not only to Jews in those Infidel lands, but to all Infidels. You can continue to conduct your public life as one vast Nuremberg Rally, continue to have posters and placards that reek of Rosenberg's Der Stuermer, but don't expect anyone in his right mind to think that you are now salvageable, that you can be brought back to reason, and able to live with other humans. You become like wild dogs, and are suitable only for being caged up. Don't blame the Western world or Israel for that. You have done it, with a little help from other Arab Muslims, entirely to yourselves.
Three, you cannot continue to expect to be supported. This is the most farcical, longest-running, "refugee" crisis on earth. There have been hundreds of millions of refugees since World War II. The most coddled, the most supported, the most everythinged have been the so-called "Arab refugees" who promptly went on the UNRWA dole, and never got off (because no one ever dies), and meanwhile, local Arabs in the countires where some of these Arab refugees lived simply signed up themselves -- they were indistinguishable, after all, from the Arabs already on the dole -- in a massive case of welfare fraud, and the "internastional community" has plenty of cases of real refugees -- especially of the Christians murdered in the Sudan, or Iraq, or elsewhere in the Mulsim world, or the Hindus hounded out of Kashmir, or Bangladesh -- so that eventually there is going to be an enraged turning away by Infidels from this idiotic support for Muslms, not least because Arab and Muslim states, having received an entirely unmerited ten trillion dollars since 1973 alone, are now raking in more and more trillions, and buying up everything they can, but continuing to rely entirely on the U.N., and the Americans, and the Europeans, to pay for any and all poorer Arab Muslims who may not deserve, but nonetheless are getting, lots and lots of aid and attention.
Oh, did I forget to mention the $30 billion -- that's the real figure -- lavished by the American government on Pakistan, our "ally" in the "war on terror" -- for that's what we have repeatedly been told -- since 9/11/2001 alone? Have I a need to tell you about A. Q. Khan, and I.S.I. (in up to its neck in A. Q. Khan's machinations, as he himself said a week or two ago)? About the Taliban, given refuge in Pakistan? About Al Qaeda (ditto)? About how the Pakistanis continue to thwart our every intelligent effort, and who are not our allies, and never were our allies, and cannot conceivably be our allies, though here and there, an odd Pakistani government official or two may recognize the need, here and there, to play ball or at least seem to, with the ever-credulous and ever-hopeful Americans.
Did you know that last week the American and European governments got together to pledge some ten billion dollars or so for the Muslims of Kosovo? Not for Serbia, with its refugees fleeing Musliims in Kosovo and Bosnia. Not for any other country on earth, but for Kosovo.
Shall I go on? Do you want more?
Do you get the picture? You do? Very well, then, you tell me:
What's Wrong With This Picture?
Hugh, what is wrong is that it does not make any (apparent) sense. But then again it is not the sole suicidal policy pursued by the West, so perhaps we should not expect this to make sense.
And btw, the 2 trillion figure is the estimated long term cost of the Iraq war, not something we've spent.
"Peripherally I have to wonder what it will take for China and Russia to fully comprehend that their real antagonist is the Islamic world...."
Posted by: Wellington
Yes, the Russians are being particularly blind. At least China still has numbers on its side, and will have for many decades.
But the Russians are committing national suicide at an even faster rate than the Western Europeans. Over 1/2 of Russian pregnancies end in abortion, and Russia has a negative growth rate. By 2030, their population is projected to decline by 15%. Meanwhile, on the former U.S.S.R.'s southern border, the combined population of Turkey, Iran, and Afghanistan is already somewhat greater than Russia's, and is expected to grow by ca. 43% by 2030. Likewise, the populations of the former central Asian republics are also growing. All of these will be casting envious eyes on the emptying spaces of Russia. The "Tatar yoke" is returning, and Putin's mob is doing little to stop it.
My heart goes out to the long-suffering Russian people. First long years of Stalinist tyranny and genocide, then the Nazi invasion, then more Stalinism, and now the Islamic threat.
ebonystone: Central Asia is running out of water. No way they'll continue their population explosion. In fact, Westerners hold most of the world's fresh water. Islamic populations cannot continue to grow without water.
"That is so dishonest. Sorry, but Jihadwatch should check itself before posting trash like this which is blatantly false."
Posted by: MorrisMinor
MM, which posting are you referring to? Hope it wasn't one of mine.
I have to agree with you, Hugh. Would we even be having this conversation if oil had NOT been discovered in the Middle East. The massive transfer of wealth to the Islamic governments of this region has revitalized the jihad and propped up the corrupt Islamic regimes that used it to retreat back into the 7th century.
Money to Islamic countries is money down a rat hole. Worse, it breaths life into a dying culture that has no place in the 21st century.
Bosnia, Kosovo, Chechnya, Myanmar, Uzbekistan, now Xinxiang - and the Ummah States wonders why countries like Russia and China have no qualms about supporting Iran?
One good turn deserves another
ebonystone: Central Asia is running out of water. No way they'll continue their population explosion.
Posted by: george_rem
Maybe so. But that's all the more reason for them to grab Russia-Siberia, with all its great rivers: Volga, Ob, Yenisey, Don, etc.
And even if their population explosion doesn't continue, the Russians still need to reverse their own population implosion.
If China was "cracking down" on a Christian minority group, would this even be making headlines?
The crybabies (i.e. the muslims) get all the attention.
“US lawmakers condemn crackdown on China's minority Muslims,”
Just goes to show the fantasy world our government operates in. They see what they want to see, and ignore all evidence to the contrary.
They should know by now that Islam is the problem, not the Chinese government. True, the Chinese government doesn't tolerate desent, but, for the most part, will will leave religious groups alone so long as they are not perceived as a threat to the government's monopoly of power.
If the government's perception of Islam is that of a political movement, they are correct. They are a political movement in every country they exist in, and seek to overthrow every government that welcomes into their land.
A little Chinese wisdom in our government wouldn't hurt us one bit.
Both China and Russia to date appear to look upon America as their true impediment to higher status in the global arena when, in fact, what is most injurious to their interests long term is an empowered Islam with an attitude.
Posted by: Wellington
It's analagous to our situation vis a vis Hitler in WWII: the immediate danger vs the distant danger. Our common threat was Nazi Germany and so we joined forces to defeat it and battled one another only after the immediate danger was past. America today impedes both countries' efforts to dominate most of their neighbors. In true cold war fashion, both are working with and arming Iran, in an effort to weaken us further.
Since both China and Russia are members of the nuclear club and since neither is afraid to use brute force to put down rebellions, both probably figure they can deal with their Muslims once America is out of the way. First things first.
What's Wrong With This Picture?
Hugh
Absolutely nothing! You are right on!
The problem is there is no alliance of Christian nations controlling trillions of dollars of investments in the U.S. economy to get the ear of the Whitehouse & Congress. It would be fun to know how many times when the house of Saud says jump and the American Government have said how far. Just follow the oily money trail and no mystery why all the sudden we care so much about Chinese Muslims suddenly.
Islamic populations cannot continue to grow without water.
Posted by: george_rem
--
The problem is that our stupid governments keep insisting on helping these bastards to develop water resources. PLUS they allow them to settle among us!
We should trade water for oil!
They have OPEC. We need something like that to control water resources - MERCILESSLY so!
Payback is a ***CH!
PMK: Sound analysis of my comment. China and Russia had just better hope they haven't miscalculated.
ebonystone: Yes, Russians have suffered terribly through history. Their courage is admirable but to a large extent they have themselves to blame because they have remained stubbornly retarded about the neccesity to fight for, cherish, nurture and maintain freedom. It is their greatest failing as a people.
Wellington
"Peripherally I have to wonder what it will take for China and Russia to fully comprehend that their real antagonist is the Islamic world rather than America."
I disagree
Peripherally I have to wonder what it will take for the United States of America to fully comprehend that their real antagonist is the Islamic world rather than the Chinese and Russians.
Let me see...
Russia supports Iran (true), but the USA supports Pakistan, Kosovo/Albania and Saudi Arabia. If I was Russian, and I see report after report of Arabians in places like Chechnya and Kosovo, with loads of cash and weapons meant to kill your fellow Russian or Slavic brothers and sisters, I would be a little ticked off about the double standard as well. The Chinese and Russians have asked the Americans to turn over some Islamic Jihadist we have in custody, or are free loading in America as “refugees”, but we refuse because they might be abused or killed. How stupid is that?
It is so easy to bash Russia and China, and sometimes it is well deserved, but I will be dammed if I am going to shed one tear over the Chinese wasting some Muslim Jihadist in Western China.
Here is an example (it was on Jihadwatch sometime ago I think):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7oQeyyAoTrI
I wonder what the dhimmis in congress will do when Deerbornstan tries to succeed from the Union.
Posted by: senor doeboy
Send them lots of money and provide arms so they can defend their Caliphate. It's the American way...at least until the bums get thrown out of office.
China is not being tough enough, but they will soon see the necessity. Muslims have declared war, (holy), on the Chinese Han...I don't think the Chinese gov takes kindly to such talk and actions...
greatcometof1577: Thanks for your posts. I will try to respond. First, the US has loads of reasons to not embrace the Chinese or Russians. China continues to make thinly veiled threats about Taiwan and even Japan (hell, even Los Angeles). It seeks hegemony in the Pacific, if not top-dog superpower status throughout the world. Problem is it would be a miserable superpower precisely because it neither comprehends nor appreciates freedom. No superpower in history comes close (British Empire is second) to a willingness to shed the blood of its young men for the freedom of others. America is the most generous great power ever and if you are indifferent about this, then by all means support the Chinese as much as you wish.
As for Russia, it has revealed a continued absysmal ignorance where true democracy and freeddom are the issues. Putin has bullied through his proxies Estonia, the Czech Republic, Poland, those in the western Ukraine and elsewhere. He doesn't cozy up to Iran and Hezbollah, run interference for Noth Korea and make numerous overtures to the Chinese but for American foreign policy. That ain't it. He doesn't understand America, doesn't like America and is nationalistic and xenophobic in a very typical Russian way. He's basically a mafia boss on steroids. Ditto for his stand-in Medvedev. Russia right now is one huge con game where some freedom and prosperity exist for the little guy but only if the little guy doesn't ask too many questions. After all, most anything had to be better than the Soviet Union (which the Russians want back territorially and because the Americans have said "nyet" they're mad as hell----too damn bad in my opinion).
Actually, I agree with you to a certain extent about what has transpired in the Balkans in the past several years, most especially recognition of Kosovo as an independent state, which I personally have opposed from the beginning. But I think Clinton did the right thing (as opposed to numerous times when he didn't) in bombing Serbia in 1999. The modern Balkan tragedy can be divided into two perios: 1) 1991-1999 when slaughter and four wars made for an extremely destabilizing condition, not just in the immediate war zones but actually for all of Europe----and for NATO. 2) 1999-present which, while far from ideal, has not seen outright war and mass murders which, by the way, the feckless Europeans and UN and the cynical Russians were prepared to do exactly nothing about. The bombing by the US is the crucial factor here in a delineation of these two periods.
As for China taking a rough line with Muslim radicals, I agree with you. Yeah, so what? Also I am in accord with you respecting any jihadists America has kept from the Russians unless Russia is lying, which I think in most instances or perhaps even all, it is not.
Remember, we're the good guys. Russia and China are not. That doesn't mean that we are always right. Our recognition of Kosovo is a case in point. But we still stand for the promotion, protection and expansion of freedom. Russia and China don't give a damn about that. They should but they don't. Take care.
Why are Moslems catered to in the west? because their threat of violence if they don't get their way.
And as William Lind at Defense and National Interests points out. The elites in the west don't fear their deracinated Christians because they know they won't kill them for mocking their religion. They do however fear Muslims because of their propensity for violence.
And our elites do respect violence. Its about the only thing they really understand anymore.
If Westerners want to get attention from the elites they better start acting like Muslims and rain holy hell down on some Ivy league or Hollywood piece of shit that talks smack about their faith.
"That is so dishonest. Sorry, but Jihadwatch should check itself before posting trash like this which is blatantly false."
Posted by: MorrisMinor at July 12, 2008 12:31 PM
What are you talking about?? Mr. Ibrahim is just commenting on something he saw reported from the Associated Foreign Press. I have see the same story on other media outlets. What's your problem?
I think China has a handle on its moslem population.
When was the last suicide bombing in China? For some reason, I don't think that there have been any.
China... one of the safest places on Earth!
Wellington
Russia and China are not our friends, but they are not our enemies either. I have several major disagreements with our policy in relation to both countries that may not sit well with some (if not the majority) who comment on this site.
Let me start with China. We are not going to get into a war with China anytime soon. China needs our economy, but even worse the Chinese military needs our economy, because many of their “brass” are involved in international trade. Talk about loyalty issues (and you thought we had it bad)! If you are a general in the Chinese army, and you have stock or investments in Taiwan, Japan, or some Chinese company that supplies cheap clothing to Wal-Mart are you really going to screw that up with a war? China also has all sorts of internal problems (not the Islamic ones) that could be exploited by America if a war should happen. Do you think Shanghai, or Hong Kong, would stand by and let Beijing do something stupid that will mess up their money making machine. There is a reason why China has pretty much stayed within their own little celestial kingdom all these years, and that is the enemy within. By reaching out to China on this issue we can score a few points, and perhaps get them to at least remain neutral in places like Sudan.
As for Russia, it has been one miscalculation after another going back to Afghanistan. Looking back on it, our intervention into Afghanistan during the 1980s was a mistake. The Soviets were slaughtering the jihadist and ripping up their society from the ground up. Of course they were replacing Islam with communism, but even communism is a step up from an Islamic society. It would have been much easier to bring people away from communism, than it is to bring them away from Islam. Instead we charged in and funded the jihad against the Soviets. This has led us to where we are today. The Russians still have hard feelings over this, but more important the jihadist became organized in a way they had not been in hundreds of years. I would say that the real revivalism of the concept of global Jihad occurred not in the Iranian revolution in a Shia Iran, but in a Sunni dominated Afghanistan. The United States pumped billions of dollars into the effort. Many of jihadist fighting there gained experience taking on a superpower with modern weapons. They learned how to organized themselves, how to funnel money through networks, how to avoid detection, and most important of all how to win.
As for the relationship between China and Russia, it is only a surface relationship. They are suspicious of each other and for good reasons. Instead of doing everything in our power to annoy them, we should be working to promote friendly relations with both countries. Why you might ask? Without America as a rallying point of unity (based on their distrust of us) they will turn on each other. America is on the other side of the world, but Russia and China border each other, and both have scores to settle, and resources they both crave that the other has within reach. Like Russian oil fields….for example.
Last and most important of all…is Islam. No matter what I think of China or Russia, Islam is beneath them. Islam is a global danger, while Russia and China are not, despite what some fear mongers say. Russia will do what they always do….fight their neighbors to the south (mostly Muslim states). China will do what they always do….perhaps smack around a few of their neighbors, then retreat to deal with some internal matter…like a peasant revolt.
I hate to say this, but we Americans (and Europeans) are to blame. We are not to blame for the reasons left wing liberals blame us for, but instead it is because we are keeping the economic engine of jihad going with our protection of their oil trade, our friendships with two of the greatest Islamic jihadist states on earth: Saudi Arabia and Pakistan, and our general ignorance of what Islam is.
from above...Islamic populations cannot continue to grow without water.
They don't need water, they have camels...
greatcometof1577: Fine post. I find very little to disagree with. I do think the "freedom thing" is important and here Russia and China come up way short, but I have no quarrel with you whatsoever when you maintain that whatever is wrong with China or Russia it still is better than what Islam offers. Besides, sure the Chinese and Russians can be bastards at times, but at least they're not crazy bastards.
Intriguing, too, your contention that leaving the Soviet Union alone in Afghanistan would have been better for all. You may be right but, of course, we'll never know for sure. I would point out that Soviet occupation of Afghanistan was very ineptly done and Muslim resistance to it was not at a sophisticated level even with American help. Yet the Soviets took it on the chin nonetheless. Look, too, at how badly the Russians handled Chechnya. A nation like the Poles took heart over what occurred there because Russian troops were just not that good. I've seen where as high as 50% of the Russian Armed Forces are alcoholics and a significant number of recruits don't even know how to drive or fix hardly anything. Even back in Czarist days the rule of thumb was that the officer corps was pretty good but if you could kill that off the enlisted soldiers were brave and not much more. Contrast that with the American soldier who has demonstrated great ingenuity from the lowest ranks up for over two centuries now. I think this is rooted in freedom.
Cultures that repress freedom show far less capacity for innovation. In WWII, for instance, when Plan A for the Japanese wasn't going well, what did they do? They stuck to Plan A. Well, you get the idea.
Would be better for all if Russia, China and America buried their differences and animosities as much as possible and concentrate on Islamic radicalism. The jihadists are after us all after all. Really, is there anything lower among the human species than Muslims who want to implement all the tenets of their warped faith? I don't think so. My best to you and yours. Take care.
Wellington
The one good thing the about all this is the Jihadist might bring the world together...just not the way they planned.
good day...or night...
In regard to the water situation in Islamic countries, I don't think they're near the limit imposed by that constraint.
I looked up nine of the more arid Islamic countries: Afghanistan, Algeria, Iran, Iraq, Libya, Morocco, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, and Tajikistan. In 1950 their combined population was 93.9 million; in 2000 it was 351.3 million -- almost quadrupling in 50 years. And that's not counting the millions more that have emigrated to the West.
And if they want more water, there are all those lovely Russian rivers I mentioned above. In fact, the Soviets had a project to dam the Ob and build canals to divert its water south to the Aral and Caspian Seas. Environmentalists were concerned that diverting so much inflow into the Arctic might change ocean current patterns. Not much was done on the project, but talk of it has revived in recent years.
So the population of these countries will continue to grow; some of these additional millions will go to further colonize the West, and some will go to occupy an empty Russia. And if the remaining Russians decide to take some million of believers with them, so what? They will have died as martyrs for Allah, who has reserved many virgins for them.
Wellington:
I do not believe that the people of Russia and the people of china are represented by their governments. Both have an enormous cultural history that is not a characteristic of the cave men that control their governments. Those cultures are in direct contrast to the Islamic plague that seeks to extinguish them. The religious theocracy proposed by the Islamic ideology is in direct contrast to the non-religious character of both Russia and China's government. In this sense America needs Russia and China as the Crusaders needed them in stemming the Islamic plague of yesteryear. Our example of human liberty have not fallen on blind eyes of the people in Russia and China. Nor has the tyrannical actions of the Islamists. We need unity with both countries ion fighting this plague.
FOX news had on the ticker the story about the Chinese executing some Islamic Holy Warriors.Surely these executions will enrage the uhmma.I wonder when we will see other "Holy Warriors" flocking to China in defense of Islam and their Muslim brothers? Of course in China trouble makers are summarily executed, like the official who sent tainted toothpaste to the US.Could this be why we don't see Muslims trying to immigrate to China? Why isn't Al Qaeda active in China?
Briars: You're correct that the Chinese and the Russians are not properly represented by their governments, but that is principally the fault of these two folks at large. The old adage is that every people have the government they deserve. Few maxims I have ever come across are truer than this one. Look at the American people as an example. Traditionally they have been magnificently bold, independent and freedom loving. But beginning with the New Deal they are slowly being transformed from being citizens of the state into wards of the state. Obama and his ilk mean to complete this process. And if the American people allow this, then they deserve what they get.
As for a great cultural tradition, you are also correct. Each of these people, Chinese and Russians, have that impressively. But I would argue that however important cultural achievements are, even more important is the development, promotion and protection of freedom. When a people come up short on this latter phenomenon, they are deficient as a people, irrespective of artistic or intellectual accomplishments. And such accomplishments exist, in the final analysis, in a kind of vacuum. Freedom, by contrast, is pervasive through an entire society if cherished and nurtured properly---and so even more important than cultural excellence. The Chinese and Russians are dismal where freedom is concerned. I mean just wretched.
Respecting the West's need of Chinese and Russian cooperation in combatting Islamic supremacism, I agree totally. That's why I have long argued that America, Russia and China should bury their differences in order to take on the greatest totalitarian ideology of all time-------Islam. But the chief impediment to this cooperation, I aver, is the dearth of freedom in the lands of the great nations of Russia and China. What a shame.
It makes sense for America to make a stink over China's treatment of Muslims.
Firstly, China has been playing up to the Islamic world by helping spread anti-American propaganda about the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq and singing and dancing to the "Israel is evil" musical. Time to pay the piper.
Secondly, Chinese Communism and the Jihad movement need to be a little less chummy. If America can help these two powers realize that they are not friends just because the have a common enemy then it is a valuable educational experience.
The single most constructive thing any one of us can do to foster life and hope and, in the end, freedom, at grassroots level in Russia and China, is to support the work of the Bible Society in both countries; and to put pressure on China re. its persecution of Christians and other non-Muslim dissidents and its repression of Tibet - but NOT re. its perfectly sensible and justifiable battle against Muslim Jihad.
Unlike the Muslims, whose only real loyalty is to the 'blob', aka the Ummah, Chinese Christians are thoroughly Chinese. They are a threat to tyranny, as genuine Christianity always is; but they are peaceful, stable, law-abiding and productive, and their faith is thoroughly 'indigenised'. Were the persecutions to stop, one would ultimately see a flowering of secular and sacred art, music, poetry, etc., that would be recognisably Christian yet at the same time distinctively 'Chinese'.
Interesting demographic aside: devout Chinese Christian couples obey the one-child rule, which means that if their officially permitted one child is a girl, they give thanks to God for his gracious gift, and raise her. Thus, a significant proportion of the upcoming cohort of Chinese young girls (girls being at a considerable premium in a nation full of lonesome hound dawgs) are likely to be Christians...one wonders how many young men are going to trot off to church at the behest of a pair of big dark eyes. ( I know my *own* father, when courting, said to my mother: If you let down your hair [long, blonde, and normally worn all pinned up in a sedate bun], I'll come to church; so she did, and he did).
As for Russia...it is not impossible that, through dissemination of Christian scriptures both in Russian and in the non-Russian languages,
http://www.biblesociety.org/index2.htm
and a revitalisation of the Russian church, not to mention the conversion [currently under way] of groups such as the Tatars
http://www.biblesociety.org/index2.htm
http://www.biblesociety.org/index2.htm
and Kazakhs, the civilisational suicide might be arrested, and a healthier, freer society begin to grow, slowly, from the ground up.
Go and read the stories that the Bible Society, for example, reports from Russia. It's easy for people to sneer at such things - but there are people in modern Russia who are living positive lives of loving service to others, after their discovery or rediscovery of the Christian faith.
http://www.biblesociety.org/index2.htm
Furthermore, the Bible seems to be making its way into the hands of Russian soldiers (Stalin will be spinning in his grave and the ghost of Lenin will be gnashing its teeth) -
http://www.biblesociety.org/index2.htm
and
http://www.biblesociety.org/index2.htm
and
http://www.biblesociety.org/index2.htm
and here's one soldier's story...
http://www.biblesociety.org/index2.htm
I'm not going to write off Russia. I don't think they are fated to remain 'unfree' forever.
I'm not being Pollyanna-ish. I am acutely aware of the terrible history of despotism and violence, and the huge current problems, of both countries. But there is far more hope for both Russia and China, than there is for any part of the Islamosphere.
A little off topic yet related. Has anyone seen this article?
http://en.epochtimes.com/news/8-7-9/73205.html
Ms Pig from Australia