Rashid and Ahmed
Life TV’s "Daring Question," hosted by Muslim apostates, Rashid and Ahmed, recently ran a show dedicated to examining the connection between hadiths and fatwas—particularly the more outrageous ones which have caused Islam no small scandal, such as Rida’ al-Kabir, “breastfeeding the adult."
Rashid initiated the show by asking: “Are these otherwise absurd fatwas truly grounded in usul al fiqh [Islam’s roots of jurisprudence] or can we dismiss them as products of eccentric or deviant ulema and fuqaha [theologians and jurists]?”
The first fatwa they focused on was the so-called “Mickey Mouse fatwa”—wherein a sheikh declared that Mickey Mouse (a cartoon character) must die. Rashid indicated that this one particular fatwa received much exposure (and laughs) in the Western media; but he displayed several Arabic newspapers also questioning the legitimacy/sanity of such a fatwa.
The hosts then played a clip of Sheikh Muhammad Salih al-Munajjid, condemning the rodent, deploring the fact that some otherwise upright Muslims allow their children to find favor in despicable characters like Mickey Mouse or Jerry. As rodents, the sheikh confirmed, they are dirty and corrupt—“little satans”—who, according to sharia, should be killed indiscriminately. The sheikh was visibly agitated that Muslim children were being exposed to these animated rats, and finding them “lovable.”
After the clip (and after a moment of perplexed silence in the studio), Rashid asked Ahmed: “So, we’ve seen what the sheikh says: is that his own position or can he actually back it up from Islam itself?
Ahmed (the more scholarly of the two, who actually studied at Al Azhar in his former Muslim life) confirmed the latter. He quoted several Muhammadan ahadith from Sunan Abu Dawud portraying rodents as “soldiers” and “hosts” of Satan,” and enemies to believers. Sahih Muslim contains a hadith clearly stating that rodents should be killed indiscriminately.
Ahmed also revealed that, according to Sahih Bukhari—the most authoritative hadith collection—along with pigs and monkeys, rats too were once upon a time Jews.
Here Rashid asked if even rat-hatred is a product of Islamic anti-Semitism? Ahmed said that was plausible, but, then again, it seems that Muhammad commanded his followers to hate any number of animals, for any number of reasons. Here he quoted some hadiths where Muhammad categorically condemned various insects, for no apparent reason, and said black dogs are satanic and must also be killed with impunity (see here for a list of Muhammad and the animals).
Rashid addressing the viewers asked how, scientifically speaking, anyone can believe any of these hadiths: “Can we scientifically demonstrate that rats were Jews and black dogs satans? God gave us a brain to use, people.”
At any rate, the two hosts concluded that, as absurd as the sheikh’s “kill-rodents” (including Mickey Mouse and Jerry) fatwa seemed, it is not based on his own particular views, but rather Islam’s.
The second video clip dealt with the left hand in Islam. One Sheikh Wajadi Ghunim, from Al Azhar, dramatically explained the great importance of refraining from using one’s left hand: “How can you nonchalantly use your left hand, and then say you hate Satan?!” he demanded of his viewers.
He quoted Muhammad saying, “Satan eats and drinks with his left hand.” He then went on to mock the notion of “etiquette” during eating. He offered a personal anecdote: once when he was dining at some five-star restaurant with several dignitaries, the chef came up to him sheepishly advising him to use the fork with his left hand instead of right, to which the sheikh boomed “I AM MUSLIM!”
The sheikh further indicated that, from childhood, he was left-handed; but, in an effort to be a “true” Muslim, he forced himself out of that satanic habit. He did this by placing his left hand beneath his thigh when eating, in order to force himself to get used to eating with his right.
Finally, while going through these motions in front of the camera (left hand beneath thigh, pretending to eat with right hand), he concluded his imaginary meal by licking all his right fingers—for, as he sternly admonished, that too is sunna: Muhammad, in Sahih Bukhari, told his followers to always lick—or have someone else lick—their fingers clean after eating, “For you know not where [in the food] the blessing dwells.”
Here, Rashid, somewhat astonished, asked “So many great men—such as Michael Angelo, Einstein, Newton, Da Vinci, Picasso [he could’ve added yours truly]—were left-handed: so what gives? Simply because they wrote or ate with their left hand, we must conclude that they were followers of Satan?”
Ahmed said that everything the animated sheikh said is, in fact, sunna: he quoted from Sahih Muslim Muhammad saying, “Do not eat or drink with your left hand for Satan eats and drinks with his left hand.”
Rashid seemed still unable to get over the finger-licking aspect: “Look, no one is out to judge other cultures, but this is the problem: because Muhammad—a 7th century bedouin—did this or that, they try to impose it on all of us, against our will.”
Rashid, somewhat timidly, asked Ahmed: “Are there any more hadiths that associate human physiology with Satan?
“Many,” answered the latter (while appearing to be desperately trying to suppress a chuckle). “For instance, yawning. According to Sahih Muslim, Muhammad said that if you must yawn, you should fully cover your mouth—preferably with the back, not palm, of the hand—lest Satan scurry down your throat, where he will dwell and laugh." According to Sahih Bukhari, if you must yawn, do not give yourself to yawning fully; rather, hold it back as much as possible, and by so doing vex Satan.
The hosts played one last video of Sheikh Ishaq al-Hawani who was discussing the importance of waking up at night to perform the obligatory night prayers. The sheikh then read from a hadith where Muhammad said that Satan urinated in the ears of a man who failed to wake up for the night-time prayer.
A(nother) moment of perplexed silence followed, when finally Rashid asked the viewers: “Billions of people in this world do not wake up to pray. Are we to believe, then, that there are billions of satans urinating in humanity’s ears?! So many problematic questions—if Muslims were to only seriously reflect on them for a moment, surely they would forfeit Islam.”
They took a few calls. One caller could not stop laughing and did not seem to have much to contribute aside from mocking Islam, to which Ahmed said, “Yes, we understand; but you and everyone else must understand that this show is not about mocking Islam, but exposing it, in order to help other Muslims leave the darkness and come into the light."
That's really practical advice, Raymond--be sure to bind your left hand to your thigh when you dine, accursed Leftie! I always knew there was something Satanic about the Left. Down with Kos and Soros!!
Want to get in on a worthy argument?
It's for men and women of good will who have a different opinion about the terminology that should be used in today's world, whether using Islam or some qualified form of it. They say Islam, we say......
Also, if you like my work, I'd love for some you to confirm my Facebook Blog Network that links to my blog. Thanks in advance.
Sometime ago I blogged about some of the "silly hadith". Here it is, hoping it adds to the dialogue:
Explaining the Unexplainable
There is a trilogy of texts that define Muslim belief. First is the Quran, the words spoken by Muhammad that Muslims believe were inspired by Allah via the angel Gabriel. Second is the hadith, the sayings and actions of the Prophet written down by his followers mostly after his death. Third is the sira, or early biographies of Muhammad, the first of which was written about 200 years after his death.
Muslims believe that the actions and sayings of Muhammad serve as Allah’s desired standard for all Muslims for all time. With the exception of Prophetic allowances (Muhammad had eleven wives while today’s Muslim can only have four), Muslims are to accept everything in the Quran and the hadith as not only true but divine.
With the arrival of the internet and the translation of these ancient Arabic texts into English that are available online, Muslims faced an unprecedented challenge. The fact is that some of the hadith, even the most authoritative ones in the Sahih Al-Bukhari collection, are just plain silly.
When Jews are confronted with the fact that the law of Moses called for the stoning of adulterers and Christians are reminded that Paul taught that women should cover their heads and be silent in church, they have an easy answer. They simply say, “Yes, that is written there, but we don’t do that anymore.” It’s not so easy for Muslims. They have to try to explain. It’s true that the Christianized, Westernized Muslim living in America who is your friend or neighbor or coworker and probably the nicest person in the world doesn’t take this stuff seriously. In fact, they came to America to get away from the craziness. But over here in the heartland, where mockery or criticism can get you fired, imprisoned, or killed, it’s a different story.
And so religious shaykhs go to great lengths to explain the silly hadiths. Actually I haven’t yet come across an explanation for my all-time favorite. Muhammad said that if a woman becomes pregnant, the child will resemble whichever of the parents first reached orgasm. If the woman came first, the child will look like her. If it was the man, the child will resemble him. If this were actually true, I imagine that ninety percent of American kids would look like their dads. Maybe the reason I haven’t yet heard an Islamic response to this one is simply that it is too wild to even try.
But they do their best to explain other silly hadiths. When the media picked up that Muhammad ordered some sick people to drink a mixture of camel’s urine and milk as a remedy, shaykhs rushed to explain the medicinal advantages of that concoction. When someone pointed out that Muhammad had said that a man should only be in the presence of women who had nursed him, a shaykh issued a fatwa that (unlike in Saudi Arabia where men and women never work together) men and women could work together in the same office if the man was breastfed by all the women in that office.
I was listening the other day to a shaykh on television explaining some more of the silly hadiths to the millions of people watching. He was asked about the time when Muhammad told people not to worry about eating food that a fly had fallen into because even though one wing of the fly carried harmful bacteria the other wing carried the cure. The shaykh explained that “a British doctor” had actually done a study showing that this was true. As usual, he did not give the name of the doctor nor mention where this study was available.
The same shaykh was then asked about the hadith where Muhammad stated that the Children of Israel always took communal baths. Moses, however, chose to bathe alone. One day he laid his clothes on a rock which started to run away. Poor naked Moses had to run after the rock shouting, “My clothes, my clothes!” Without a second’s hesitation, the shaykh replied that this story was indeed true. Was not Allah powerful enough to cause a rock to run?
I have to concede the shaykh’s point. If Allah is all-powerful, he can make a rock do anything he wants it to. I just don’t believe it ever happened.
And for the record, I use Islam, unqualified Islam, but there are those who know the issue is Islam as such, but who add prefixes and suffixes in order to hit home the fact that Islam is totalitarian and fascist, etc., and are doing so only during this time where confusion runs high. I think the qualifiers add to the confusion, but again, an argument worth having even if I think A is A and Islam is Islam.
Call me satanic. I'm left-handed.
I knew women who had their arms physically tied down to prevent them from WRITING with the left hand. Barack Obama is left-handed. How did he survive in Indonesia?
Most of the time Islam creates a state of mind wherein the listener is too old to cry, but they hurt too much to laugh.
PMK,
OBAMA a LEFTIE?--I KNEW IT!!!!
There's a follow-up television appearance by the paticular cleric in question, denying that he ever issued a formal fatwa about Mickey Mouse. Call it the Mickey Mouse Clarification:
http://www.memritv.org/clip/en/1912.htm
Memri has hours of such stuff for your listening pleasure. Hold, in your dorm, a MEMRI party, with a computer hooked up to a large screen, and play such things so that everyone can have a good time learning about the Wacky World of Islam.
Nice to see you here Bosch! And Raymond, I appreciate the constant updates from Life TV! I wish we could see these subtitled here in the Greatest Satan on Earth. It would be one religious program that might get a huge following.
For a catagorized list of "satanic" people, go here: http://www.anythingleft-handed.co.uk/famous.html
Up with Lefties (including me)!
You too, Jewel, thanks.
give me doughnuts, l think lefties should unite agains islam, since being lefthanded like myself l was always told by my mother that it was my unique gift from God.
Barack Obama is left-handed. How did he survive in Indonesia?
Posted by: PMK
By being an observant Muslim.
If, under islam, someone who is caught as a thief has a hand cut off, is it always the right, or left hand? The answer would bring a few more questions, would it not?
The worlds largest minority, left handed people.
I lived in Saudi Arabia for three years and being left handed, I was advised on more than one occasion that the Left Hand was considered the "Toilet Hand".... hence the reference to removal of the right hand as a punishment for stealing.... thereby forcing the individual to eat with his left hand.......
Let's see if we can turn the negative animals against them:
Apes - King Kong
Pigs - snarling wild boar
Lizards - Godzilla (the real one)
Mice and Rats - Mighty Mouse, and Splinter, the mentor of the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles
Snakes - The Don't Tred on Me Snake (early U.S. flag)
Rooster - Foghorn Leghorn "That there mullah is nutty, I SAY NUTTY, as a fruitcake.
Dog - Cerberus
Haha, so we're talking about funny hadith... here's one ya'll will get a kick out of:
"The strong man is not one who is good at wrestling, but the strong man is one who controls himself in a fit of rage". (#45 in Riadh is-saliheen).
How funny is that???
Richard ;
Interesting, I did not know it was the right hand that was targeted. So, is it the same for a non-follower of islam, (or just death)? Can the status of the criminal alter the cutting to the left hand?
A poster above mentions the Islamic "scholar" of science who, naturally, finds all of modern science, and for that matter all of modern quackery, in the Qur'an or Hadith.
Here's that fly-falling-in-the-food Hadith, where one wing cures what the other wing causes, a nice case of homeopathy avant la lettre:
http://www.memritv.org/clip/en/1889.htm
I'll add my name to the ranks of the evil left-handers, and in so doing, I'll get the telltale ink smear on the side of my left hand.
But I'll wear it proudly.
"I'll add my name to the ranks of the evil left-handers, and in so doing, I'll get the telltale ink smear on the side of my left hand.
But I'll wear it proudly."
posted by: MarisolJW
Is that the Islamic version of the Mark of Cain?
Here are some more helpful tips from the Reliance of the Traveller, certified of course by Al-Azhar in 1991: it "conforms to the practice and faith of the orthodox Sunni Community."
Got it! Thanks!
I can do most things equally well with either hand...Don't applaud, throw money...
"He quoted several Muhammadan ahadith from Sunan Abu Dawud portraying rodents as “soldiers” and “hosts” of Satan,” and enemies to believers."
File away for future reference (after 2016 when a sane Administration comes into office) re: improvements to waterboarding.
fascinating show!
Ever since hearing that 'Satan steers mice" I've been trying to steer mine... not much luck so far
From the "mo & the animals" link:
"Muslim, Book 026, Number 5562:
'Amir b. Sa'd reported on the authority of his father that Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) commanded the killing of geckos, and he called them little noxious creatures."
Puts the caveman-sues-Geico running gag into a new light. Of course, insurance is satanic in the first place.
jewcat:
You might like the movie "Willard", or the book "Ratman's Notebook", upon which it's based.
My allah! I am left handed and have a black lab!
Jimmy Bones (alias Lefty Satan)
I have lived in Indonesia for a good many years, and I now prefer to use water than toilet paper.
In fact the whole concept of toilet paper is downright filthy, disgusting and unhygienic.
For anybody that has travelled around in asia, most toilets have water available. There is ample proof that using water is not restricted to muslims.
Further thinking about it, for those who make such ado about how to clean up, what would you do if paper was not available.
Then what would you do if no water was available, but only rock and sand.
InfidelK9
Thanks for sharing. Do you use a bidet?
"Ever since hearing that 'Satan steers mice" I've been trying to steer mine... not much luck so far"
I hear ya, jewcat. It takes a mighty small, mighty sharp knife to steer a mouse. And those teeny little brandin' irons...
Hey, you guys should read the stuff about Satan having a female sex organ on one leg and the male sex organ on the other leg - and well, you know what Satan is doing all the time! Or that Satan lays eggs.
It is all combined in this video:
Satan lays eggs and has sex with himself! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=21VlTPEmUsw&feature=related
here is one that shows us that allah wasn't too bright. It says that humans cannot go out of the zone of the earth. Well, it seems that allah is sort of... stupid. (some of us - including me - just thinks allah is nothing but mohammed elevating himself up to be a god. He took his moon god and elaborated on it.)
allah says we cannot go out of the zone of the earth: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7IGvwwgepLg
there are more things in the realm of science that shows that allah wasn't too bright of a god. it didn't know too much about the mountains and the rotation of the earth either!
allah says the mountains stand firm and stop the earth from moving: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=true7x0Z7_A&feature=related
Oh, there is a wealth of information from islam's own texts to show us that it is very hard not to mock islam. Very hard. that first website just tells me that mohammed had a very, hard time getting his head out of his underwear! I mean... everything is about sex to that guy.
InfidelK9, well just make sure to not use leaves! One could get these things called 'chiggers'! Sometimes they are also called 'no see ems'. One could just scratch the hades out of oneself if you get chiggers.
Oh, and it wasn't me who found this out - a guy I knew went running and had to 'do his duty'. So, he went off into the side of the path and hid in the trees to 'do his thing', and then used a couple of leaves and found himself in sickbay with a 'slight' problem a little time later! :-))
Posted by: Infidel Pride
Thanks for sharing. Do you use a bidet?
NO, There are no such things as bidets, in Indonesia, not even in 5 star hotels.
Most toilets are of the squat model. and there is a tap or a tank of water, and a small bucket.Also many toilets have a hand shower.
You only find sit down toilets in hotels/restaurants that cater for westerners, and here they always have problems due to being jammed up with paper or sanitary napkins.
When you go into the villages, toilets do not exist, the villagers squat in the streams, rivers or in the rice paddies.
It took me several weeks to adjust, and I can truthfully say that I feel much cleaner and refreshed by using water, especially being in the tropics, where one tends to get rather sweaty and sticky.
I guess if I was living in the desert, where there is no paper, and very little water, the using of three stones makes a lot of sense.
I would go as far to say, that anybody who sensible enough to try using water instead of paper for a couple of weeks, will find that they will also feel dirty if they go back to using paper.
And just think of how many forests have been destroyed, and how much damage to the environment has been caused because of using paper.
Hey you guys - diseases that we have wiped out due to toilet cleanliness, or lack thereof, are still in those countries that use rocks.
Posted by: R_not
Hey you guys - diseases that we have wiped out due to toilet cleanliness, or lack thereof, are still in those countries that use rocks.
In the desert water is scarce, so it is logical to use stones.
What has stopped a lot of diseases is awareness of personally hygiene, not the use of toilet paper
I will argue any time that water is far more hygienic than using rocks, Hayballs, Scraper/gompf stick kept in container by the privy in the Middle Ages, Discarded sheep's wool in the Viking Age, Frayed end of an old anchor cable was used by sailing crews from Spain and Portugal, Straw, hay, grass, gompf stick Medieval Europe, Corn cobs, Sears Roebuck catalog, mussel shell, newspaper, leaves, sand- United States, Pages from a book, British Lords, Coconut shells in early Hawaii, Lace was used by French Royalty
Public Restrooms in Ancient Rome- A sponge soaked in salt water, on the end of a stick, The Wealthy in Ancient Rome-Wool and Rosewater, French Royalty-lace, hemp, Hemp & wool were used by the elite citizens of the world, Defecating in the river was very common internationally
Snow and Tundra Moss were used by early Eskimos, or any other thing that was used before we became so dependent upon using toilet paper, by successful marketing campaigns.
What are the hidden costs of this luxurious habit?
Most toilet paper is bleached causing the byproduct dioxin, one of the most toxic human-made chemicals known. Once released into the environment, it is persistent because natural bacteria cannot effectively break it down. When we buy toilet paper bleached with chlorine, we support pulp and paper mills that pollute our environment with dioxin and other toxic organochlorines.
Trees are harvested each year to supply the global demand for toilet paper.
Toilet paper is hardly every composted and is usually flushed into sewage systems which then has to be cleaned or removed with chemical treatments.
We have to buy the toilet paper, versus using locally available and free alternatives.
Paper and other materials that could be *recycled* are now going directly into landfills.
The average roll of toilet paper weighs 227 grams, including the cardboard tube, which is just over half a pound.
With one cord of wood one could make 1,000 pounds (.5 metric tons) of toilet paper. O ne cord of wood = the heating value of 200 gallons (800 liters) of fuel oil.
In 2004 estimated annual global sales on toilet tissue will exceed $19.8 billion.The processing of 1 metric ton of paper uses: 17 trees, 6,953 gallons of water, 463 gallons of oil -- causing 587 pounds of air pollution, taking 3.06 cubic yards of landfill space and 4,077 kilowatt hours of energy. The 2004 estimate for toilet paper production is 24.635 million metric tons. The resources required to produce these 108.5 billion rolls of toilet paper will use the equivalent of:
418,795,000 trees
71,287,155,000 gallons (685,148,620,000 liters) of water
11,406,005,000 gallons ( 45,624,020,000 liters) of fuel oil
14,460,745,000 pounds (6,573,065,909 kilos) of air pollution
75,383,100 cubic yards of landfill space
equal to 100,436,895,000 kw hours of energy
Where as it states somewhere within Sharia law that where ever possible, running water should be used to clean one self
Somehow, I have no interest in pursuing the "science" behind a man squatting like a woman to urinate, or doing a little hokey-pokey dance entering and exiting a toilet area, or wiping himself with rocks, sand, or wombats.
Well, I find this thread's contents becoming, as they used to say of "Pravda" and "Izvestia" in the old days -- goditsya tol'ko na podtirku -- most absorbent.
Hugh:
I know that you're an atheist but would you concour that the the Catholic church's magisterium protects its believers from such absurdities? And that magisterium is something to be appreciative?
Raymond: How can apologists explain the Catholic church's magisterium in a manner that would be attractive to the Moslems? Surely, they must be bewildered by the contradictory fatwas and causes them a lot of hassles to conform?
xavier
oh?!!! You are a "canhoto" (left-handed in portuguese) ?!! I knew you were eeeeeeeeeeeevil, Ray!!!
Are you telling me, Raymond, that I could have saved myself the trouble of adopting, spaying, and microchipping my black dog, and just let my home security rest on my hairless rats?
How am I going to explain that to Lucy and Vivian?
I was a leftie, until I was "cured".
Isn't "sinister" also used as an old term for left-handedness?
Circumambulating to the left is banning, to the right invoking. Circling the Cube seven times to the right is attempting to 'invoke' the qualities of the god. (Absorb those qualities into yourself)
In this case Allah, and we know what those qualities are.
I wonder what would happen if Mohammadans started circumambulations to the left?
"Muhammad, in Sahih Bukhari, told his followers to always lick—or have someone else lick—their fingers clean after eating,..."
So that's what KFC stands for! Koranic Fried Chicken -- it's finger-lickin' good!
Swami,
I think the majority of Wiccans hold that circumnambulating to the left (clockwise) is "invoking", while moving "widdershins" is banning.
This might work the other way around if you're a southpaw, though. In right handed people, the left hand is the receiving, or receptive hand. The right, the projecting hand.
But, that's Wiccans (and probably not all of them). :)
InfidelK9, I don't know about the practice of going to the bathroom in the rivers and streams - the same water that is used to drink. There is this thing called e-coli. There is a small number of people who do that - boaters and fishermen and probably some swimmers - but most do not.
If we used all the items you suggested instead of toilet paper - people would be complaining that we are using those things, and they are running out, or it is filling up landfills, and there is a problem with this or that.
I used one of those b'days (spelling?) and I really don't like them.
I am a woman and I find that many woman's bathroom habits are just disgusting. If they had to fix the toilets they jammed maybe they would stop that sort of thing. They also have bad manners as far as baby diapers go too.
Anyway, this is a thread about islam. I posted some really odd things that have been found in their texts - Satan laying eggs and having sex with himself, or that their allah was a rather dumb god who didn't even know about the rotation of the earth, and that eventually man would leave the earth. There are other things in islam that have shown allah to be less than stupid! Is it really islam that is dumb or the ones who follow such a 'religion'? I mean there will always be some fool that will do, or start, something - does that mean that the others should be foolish enough to follow such men? Then I think that there will always be such ignoramouses - look at all who followed Hitler, Stalin, Mao, and the ones who like to call themselves progressives and/or elitists who idolize Che or Marx!
xavier,
I'm Catholic, and respect my creed for its embrace of rationalism (yes, guys--a respect for reason) and the inherent consistency of authoritative Catholic Tradition. But most people don't know what the "magisterium" is or means--that is, the teaching authority vested in the Pope and bishops in union with him, who guard and interpret the deposit of faith revealed through Scripture and Apostolic Tradition. Magister means teacher in Latin.
I see that all revealed truth, genuine or alleged, is human-mediated; but Islam denies or ignores this, and Islam never succeded in establishing a central authority to arbitrate and apply its precepts. Catholic Christianity, in our view, is built on Rock, not sand.
jasonfruit,
The hadith you quote rings true; but, in the view of its detractors, what is true in Islam is not new or unique to it; and what is new or unique to Islam is not true.
jfruit, why not bring your deen out of the closet--admit it. You don't want to be a hypocrite or apostate like, say, Obama now, do you?
John C:
So am I. I used the technical term as Hugh is well informed and I felt I'd be patronizing him if I defined it for him
xavier
Hugh excepted. But we wouldn't want to spark a Know-Nothing revival or anti-Papist riots with all of our Romish conspiratorial mutterings and mumbo-jumbo, now, would we? Gotta beware nativist backlash. [Ppssht -- don't let on about the weapons stashes and plans for a coup, either. --jcb]
dag,
I certainly believe that it is possible for a non-Muslim not to be a bigot. I dislike and distrust Islam, and I think it is inherently flawed and sinister; and yet, I do not think that I am bigoted toward Muslims.
Yes, it's hard to accept the very idea that a rival religious ideology can be an existential threat. Once that unsettling idea is grasped and accepted, then we can engage in the day-to-day contest between competing worldviews. "You shall know the truth, and the truth shall set you free."
"Well, I find this thread's contents becoming, as they used to say of "Pravda" and "Izvestia" in the old days -- goditsya tol'ko na podtirku -- most absorbent."
Please don't squeeze the Sharia!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwfbbuV_XtY&feature=related
Observe dagny, typical Muslim supremacist, talking big, trying to trash-talk the church.
Anyone who wants to declare that the church is dying should remember that this has been said, in tones of gloating exaltation, many times before, and always the reports of death have been found to be greatly exaggerated.
Here is G K Chesterton's "The Everlasting Man", part two, chapter six: "The Five Deaths of the Faith":
http://www.worldinvisible.com/library/chesterton/everlasting/part2c6.htm
(While reading this, persons should bear in mind that although Chesterton himself did not realize it nor remark upon it, *exactly* the same pattern is manifest in the history of the House of Israel, the people of Israel, now commonly called the Jews, even unto this very day; Church and Israel, side by side, have had a habit of springing up alive at the very point when all have pronounced them dead; they are the Burning Bush, that burns with the fire of G-d, but is not consumed; they live under the sign of the Phoenix).
I commend the following website to anyone who thinks the church is dead, or dying, in Europe or anywhere else.
http://www.taize.fr/en
Anyone who thinks the church is dying or dead should also consult Jackie Pullinger, 'Chasing the Dragon' and find out what happens when diminutive female Christian missionary meets Triad bosses and drug addicts...
Or they might watch the classic old black and white film with Ingrid Bergman, 'Inn of the Sixth Happiness'. It is highly fictionalised (Gladys Aylward's actual memoirs are much more interesting) but nevertheless conveys some of the truth of what Gladys was and did, and goes a long way toward explaining why people are simply avalanching into the Christian church, in both its Catholic and Protestant manifestations, in China today; the seeds were sown decades ago.
Islam is *not* a noble religion. Rather the opposite (as shown, perhaps, by the sheer petty bizarrerie of some of the odder hadiths explored by 'Life TV', but also by its obstinate clinging, in many places, to horrid and barbaric customs such as the marriage of grown men to prepubescent girl-children; or its approval and recommendation of wife-beating).
Here is the considered judgement of Sir William Muir, shared with us here at jihadwatch by Hugh Fitzgerald. Everything I have learned in every news report from the Islamosphere, and every history book I have read, supports Muir's judgement.
"Here is how Sir William Muir, that tireless scholar, well-versed in the languages of the East, summed up the evils of Islam
(see pp. 534-535 of the abridged version of his "Life of Mahomet" -- which can be ordered on-line):
"Setting aside considerations of minor import, three radical evils flow from the faith [i.e., Islam] in all ages and in every country, and must continue to flow so long as the Coran is the standard of belief.
‘FIRST: Polygamy, {casual} Divorce, and Slavery are maintained and perpetuated; striking at the root of public morals, poisoning domestic life, and disorganizing society.
‘SECOND: freedom of thought and private judgment in religion are crushed and annihilated. The sword still is and must remain the inevitable penalty for the renunciation of Islam. Toleration is unknown.
‘THIRD: a barrier has been interposed against the reception of Christianity. They labour under a miserable delusion who suppose that Mahometanism paves the way for a purer faith.
'No system could have been devised with more consummate skill for shutting out the nations over which it has sway from the light of truth."
His conclusion was that "the sword of Mahomet, and the Coran, are the most stubborn enemies of Civilisation, Liberty, and Truth, which the world has yet known."
see Posted by: Hugh at March 30, 2005 3:30 PM
And now for John Quincy Adams, a very intelligent and well-read person, campaigner against slavery, who had had up-close-and-personal diplomatic dealings with Mohammedans, and had undoubtedly consulted the best available texts, including translations of the Quran.
First this:
“In the seventh century of the Christian era, a wandering Arab of the lineage of Hagar [i.e., Muhammad], the Egyptian, combining the powers of transcendent genius, with the preternatural energy of a fanatic, and the fraudulent spirit of an impostor, proclaimed himself as a messenger from Heaven,
'and spread desolation and delusion over an extensive portion of the earth.
'Adopting from the sublime conception of the Mosaic law, the doctrine of one omnipotent God;
'he connected indissolubly with it, the audacious falsehood, that he was himself his prophet and apostle.
'Adopting from the new Revelation of Jesus, the faith and hope of immortal life, and of future retribution,
'he humbled it to the dust by adapting all the rewards and sanctions of his religion to the gratification of the sexual passion.
'He poisoned the sources of human felicity at the fountain,
'by degrading the condition of the female sex,
'and the allowance of polygamy;
' and he declared undistinguishing and exterminating war, as a part of his religion, against all the rest of mankind.
' THE ESSENCE OF HIS DOCTRINE WAS VIOLENCE AND LUST: TO EXALT THE BRUTAL OVER THE SPIRITUAL PART OF HUMAN NATURE (Adam's capital letters)…"
and then this:
"The precept of the Koran is, perpetual war against all who deny, that Mahomet is the prophet of God.
The vanquished may purchase their lives, by the payment of tribute;
the victorious may be appeased by a false and delusive promise of peace;
and the faithful follower of the prophet, may submit to the imperious necessities of defeat:
but the command to propagate the Moslem creed by the sword is always obligatory, when it can be made effective.
The commands of the prophet may be performed alike, by fraud, or by force". END QUOTE.
There is, too, the awkward little fact that Islam does not teach the Golden Rule. See Surah 48: 29 and the doctrine of 'loyalty and enmity', that is, the idea that the pious Muslim ONLY owes what we might call decent treatment, to their fellow Muslim, whereas towards the non-Muslim, anything and everything that all major codes of ethics name as EVIL is perfectly permissible so long as it advances the power of Islam over those non-Muslims.
The absence of the Golden Rule places a bottomless gulf between Islam and pretty well all other current major religions.
Another one bites the dust.
Long live Robert Spencer and JihadWatch!
Up with the Counterjihad!!