Yet another case of alleged Qur'an desecration. And what are the human rights agencies saying? What is the UN saying? "‘Blasphemy’ claims three more victims," from the Daily Times, August 5 (thanks to Block Ness):
LAHORE: A factory owner and two others were killed along Muridke-Sheikhupura Road when factory workers attacked them for allegedly desecrating the holy Quran, reported a private TV channel on Tuesday.One private TV channel said the owner and the other two were killed over the factory administration’s failure to pay workers, but another private channel reported the attack was prompted by an allegation that the factory owner – identified only as Najeebullah – had desecrated the holy Quran.
A worker entered Najeebullah’s factory at around 2pm and saw that the owner had taken down an outdated calendar – which had verses from the holy Quran written on it – and put it on a table. The worker then misbehaved with the owner over – what he thought – was “desecration” of the holy Quran. When a guard tried to stop him, he ran out into the working area and started gathering his colleagues, claiming the owner had committed ‘blasphemy’.
When an enraged mob subsequently surrounded Najeebullah, his guard tried to protect him by firing in the air, but the crowd started firing shots at the owner and his guard....
Here is what I preserved of the comments to this article, made while we were over at IntenseDebate.
First part.
JEWLOVER said - If an Infidel merely touches a 'ran, it's blasphemy, worthy of death.
How is it possible for an Infidel to NOT desecrate a 'ran?
Please don't send 'rans via mail that have been defaced in any form or fashion anonymously to moslems.
Even the name Pakistan is offensive to many people in India, as it means pure or clean, implying that India is dirty.
-BEAUTY OF REASON said - I guess they have trouble recruiting non-Muslims to Islam if they won't even allow a Quran to touch "infidel" hands without morphing into murderers. In any case, the violent behaviors promoted by Islamic purists speak volumes.
TANSTAAFL said - A "reason" for murder only matters to a sociopath.
-SORROW said - Just keep saying that it is only a tiny and insignificant minority while the enraged mob surrounds you.
BEAUTY OF REASON said - Why do some Westerners continue to believe that Islam is tolerant of other religions? All evidence points the contrary.
PULSAR said - It is becoming much more clear....Islam is conducting a religious war...one that is escalating .....rapidly..
JOCKAIRA said - This is how devout Muslims settle an argument...kill...kill...kill...
Muslims desecrate life!
SAXONLANDS said - I think one thing to consider is for Pakistani Christians to adopt a warrior ethos, in the same way that the Sikhs became a martial faith in response to persecution by Muslim emperors.
This will probably escalate violence against them, but as things stand, they are being slaughtered on the basis of imagined offenses anyway.
DUMBLEDORESARMY said - Jewlover, Saxonlands - in this particular case, I think the three people who were killed on what appears to be an entirely spurious charge of 'blasphemy' (the killers were merely after an excuse - the real quarrel was about something else entirely, it appears) were not Christians but Muslims.
Whenever a Muslim wants to destroy another Muslim, it appears that all they have to do is to claim that the other person is an apostate or a blasphemer (or, if female, has committed zina, sexual immorality).
So even if all the Christians, Hindus and Sikhs of Pakistan buckled under the continuous barrage of slander, curses, threats, lies and pogroms, and converted to Islam, their lives would *still* not be worth spit, since anytime one of their everlovin' Muslim brothers conceived a grudge...insta-mob, insta-lynching.
See Nonie Darwish's great little book about sharia, 'Cruel and Usual Punishment', the subsection entitled 'allah's enforcers: vigilante justice'. Sharia creates an atmosphere in which every single Muslim can become judge, jury and executioner of every other Muslim. On p. 143, Nonie writes 'since vigilante killing is allowed under sharia under certain conditions, a Muslim not only is required to adhere to allah's law but is also entrusted to enforce them on others right here on earth'.
She adds - 'when justice is left in the hands of people on the street, not only is it bound to be abused, but more importantly, the execution of justice {I would have written 'justice' - dda} is transferred to the streets and homes and not necessarily in courts. When I lived in the Middle east I rarely heard of people going to court, but I heard of a lot of fear from the public and what self-appointed vigilantes can do to you." (p. 147).
Nonie observes, furthermore, on p. 144, that under shafi'i law, if a mob runs riot but 'repents' they are 'spared from punishment' if they repent - and she notes that 'crowds of Muslim murderers have gotten away with murder, torture and plunder in genocidal rage that killed many Muslims and non-Muslims.
BEUKENDALL MASON said - Anyone else find it odd how Muslims are getting so violent over the desecration of a book, when idolotry is so banned in the religion?
You cant have pictures of the Prophet Muhamed, they denounce Christians due to the importance they put on the cross, yet they riot, destroy, burn, and kill over a book.
Not the denunciation of the beliefs there in but damage to a book (an idol) or in the case of this report, a calender(!?!). It sadly looks more and more of hypocrisy and use of false claims to kill others...
DREWBENSTEIN said - It's getting harder and harder to tolerate this CRAP from these so called "believers". Damn them to hell!
TOAST AND MARMALADE said - what a joke of a "religion" this is.........I am looking forward to when the civilised world becomes ENRAGED about the crap known as Islam
CJK said - I'll take this as the lesson for this week on how mohammedanism fosters industrialism.
-JETCAL said - cjk,
They were quite industrious, they killed the owner and if I read the article correctly, burned down the factory where they worked. All-in-all not a bad days work. I wonder if while any of this was going they stopped to pray to Mecca?
AGL said - Pakistani Muslims talk about how Jinnah wanted a secular Muslim state carved out of India, where minorities rights are protected.
I personally don't see how you can have a secular Islamic state. Sounds shady double talk to me. Like they blame later Pakistani Muslim leaders from straying from Jinnah's vision of a secular Muslim state.
DUMBLEDORESARMY said - Dar al Islam is an Empire of Fear. Muslims in sharia-soaked societies live in perpetual fear of each other, because if a neighbour or family member conceives a desire to kill them, and does so, all that person has to do, to get off scot free, is to say that the murdered person had apostasised, or blasphemed, or (if female) committed zina.
Ten times worse than living under the Stasi, or in North Korea under Kim Jong Il.
Everyone around you is a potential murderer - though of course you yourself also have those excuses ready to hand, if you fly into a rage with someone and 'off' them. Suspicion and aggression, and 'do first lest you be done by'.
Throw in, too, the fact that every married woman lives in fear of the day her husband brings home wife no 2 or 3 or 4; and also lives with the threat of 'talaq' hanging over her head.
-PIMP said to DUMBLEDORESARMY - for muslims the oppresion starts at childhood. it doesn't end until death. even after death there is no peace for muslims as they are tortured in the grave until judgment day.
JEWDOG said - It would help if the Europeans pressured Pakistan to respect minority rights, but I doubt they will. The Europeans only make a fuss about their pet project, the Palestinians, persecuted by those demon Zionists. Now that we have a Euro-think president in Washington, nothing will happen.
DUMBLEDORESARMY said - In the 'World Review' of the United Bible Societies, 1st February 2006, I read the story of the gentleman - Kurdish by ethnicity, citizen of Turkey - who helped translate the New Testament into the Kurdish language. As a result, he converted from being a nominal Muslim, to a Christian.
Here is part of his story; it concludes with his remarks on the difference between a society affected by Islam, and a society that has absorbed the Christian ethos.
"As he became immersed in reading and translating the New Testament, he found that he was being deeply affected by it.
"He discovered that Christianity’s culture was quite different from that of Islam.
" Certain Bible teachings highlighted the differences strikingly. “It totally changed me to deal with how you are taught to forgive people, to love people and live with them in peace. The Bible says ‘Love your enemies and your neighbours’ and ‘Treat your neighbour as you would like to be treated.’ This affected me.”
From then on, while still a Kurdish intellectual, “In my heart,” he says, “I believed in Jesus.”
“When I recognised the Bible, I learned to be flexible… to listen to people… to forgive them… and to be more patient. For example, if you are among Muslims, you would always fight. I don’t want to fight; I always wanted to convince people, to argue with them. … to understand them.”
The year after he became a translator he undertook a short course in Christian theology. Since giving his life to Jesus Christ, he has been a vocal advocate of the Christian faith.
“I have spoken with hundreds – maybe thousands – of people on the issue of being Christians and Muslims,” he says. “And I am always supporting the totally different Christian culture."
-GOZAN said to DUMBLEDORESARMY - "The logical outworking of the New Testament is completely different than that of the Koran. Those who try to claim their equivalency are knowledgeable of neither."
END of first part of my record of original comments to this article - dda.
And the remaining part of my copy of the comments originally made to this article:
HUGH (Hugh Fitzgerald) said - Have a score to settle with a boss, a fellow worker, an employee, your husband, your wife, a parent, your own child or another child you've been molesting? Perhaps you'd like to get rid of a competitor, for a job, for affections, for anything at all.
Simply "discover" that the object of your calculating and murderous hatred has somehow blasphemed. Tell everyone. Let the primitive mob gather. What good would denials be then? Think of living in such a world.
-PULSAR said - large areas of Muslim dominance are already there....
-SORROW said - Yes, it is even better than the twinkie justification.
RRWEST said - I have a hunch that the factory owner was selected by the local clerics or imams because he was wealthy, not just because he was Christian. Perhaps he pissed off one of them?
Runours and gossip are major currency in Muslim countries. The imams and other leaders fuel the rage of their people so that their anger is not directed where it should go; to their leaders.
This was one of the lessons that George Orwell wrote in his book 1984. I know that he had something very much like Islam [in mind] when he wrote the book. It was Nazi Germany. The parallels are much too close to ignore.
I hope that Muslims around the world lose their faith as they learn more about the rest of the world and that the hold the imams, clerics, ayatollahs, shieks and mullahs have on them lessen in time to virtually nothing.
May the west, truth, honesty, equality and democracy prevail.
Kafir and proud.
HARVARD said - If an animal or pack of animals would have done this, they would have been killed on the spot...shot as possibly rabid dogs or rodents, or whatever...
But they are Muslims...
Wake up people..you are seeing the rabid dogs biting and killing..and this will be the future of the world...
You can't even make up these types of scenes in horror movies....
Where are the leftists, the human rights watch, the feminists...it's not Israel, dummies..so they don't care... don't you see... if it isn't Israel and the Palestinians..it is irrelevant
This..is ...the future...look closely....this is your death....not in 3', but in millions to come..
CORNSYRUP said - The only way for Christians to survive in places like Pakistan is strongly bond together
mentally as well as physically . They must also meet violence with violence . The old testament allows an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth. This is a language that the Muslims will understand. They must also make better use of the internet to get their message and situation out to the west.
MAXPUB said - If I was a Muslim, especially from Pakistan, I would be one self-hating mofo. And for good reason. What a disgusting, evil, barbaric excuse for a human society.
Pakistan means "land of the pure", which is meant as a slur against "unpure" Indian Hindus.
Yeah, pure evil.
-DUMBLEDORESARMY said to MAXPUBLIUS - What is amazing is what happens when Pakistanis ditch Islam. Four I know about: Canon Dr Patrick Sookhdeo, in the UK, whose family originally migrated from Pakistan to S America (Suriname?) and then to the UK; while at University in the UK in the 1960s he converted to Christianity and became an enthusiastic inner-city evangelising priest...he has written three books that beautifully match, confirm and complement Mr Spencer's. Another is Michael Nazir-Ali: his parents made the change, converting from Islam to Christianity and raising their children as Christians; I have met him, he is the sweetest person. Then there is Ibn Warraq, author of 'Why I am Not a Muslim'.
And I first learned, years and years ago, about the rule by which Muslims kill any Muslim who leaves Islam - and about Muslim persecution of Christians in Pakistan - from two little paperback books, the testimony of educated Pakistani Muslim women who had converted to Christianity and were subsequently forced to flee their homeland - Bilquis Sheikh's "I Dared to Call Him {i.e. God, the Biblical God} Father' and Gulshan Esther's "The Torn Veil".
-MAXPUBLIUS answered DDA - Yep. Pakistani and/or Muslim is a state of mind, not a permanent condition.
No one should be condemned to such a fate, just as no one should be condemned for pointing out its loathsomeness.
Like Robert says, "Tell me again, what race is Muslim?"
-SORROW provided a link to a news story about Chinese in Algeria.
-JOCKAIRA remarked, to SORROW - (quoting linked article) "Around 25,000 Chinese currently live in Algeria, according to the Algerian media, working mainly in commerce, telecommunications, and the building trade."
...Doing all those jobs Muslims are too stupid to do.
Seriously! I notice that the Muslims have requested that the Chinese be shipped out because they don't fit in and dishonour Algerian and Islamic ways.
I say if they want to ship out the Chinese, why shouldn't we ship out the Muslims for the same reasons?
THELEGEND said - To tell you the truth people as i live in Egypt.
most Muslims in Egypt are retarded and they keep def-ding islam i tell you that let them have it let them suffer from sharia laws i wish they kill each other they are simply retardd from the host show to the scum people but what makes me sad the people who will get hurt are the christians and libreals like me.
but if egypt had 100 percent muslims i would encourage shariaw law wich they go and kill each other in there country because when a thinker in egypt tris to fix people they attack him and say no islam is peace and yopu must be killed even the moderate ones the sutation in Egypt is becoming worse.
they want sharia laws look at europe look at usa they want to change the laws they want to live in pain and misery they want to kill people let them have it let them have it but in there countrie's if they want it let them have it.
but don't ever let islam have it in the west with out the west aid and the pc that i am using i wouldn't survive one bit in my life plz people fight islam i beg you plz this is coming from a guy who is me who lives in the middle east plz wake up plz tell people show them clips let them travel.
-DUMBLEDORESARMY answered THE LEGEND - G-d {the YHWH of the Bible} bless you and keep you, mate. Here's a lovely Jewish prayer to use when you're really scared: "In the Name of the LORD, the G-d of Israel: may Michael be at my right hand, Gabriel at my left, before me Raphael, behind me Uriel, and above my head the divine Presence of G-d". And just call out the name of Jesus if you're totally desperate. He'll listen.
Something to think about - among your ancestors, long long ago, there are probably some Coptic Christian or even Jewish people whose daughters were snatched by Muslims, or whose sons just got worn down, and converted. Think how happy those ancestors must be, looking down on you and knowing that even *one* of their descendants has 'seen through' Islam and is struggling to climb out of the darkness into the light. They're cheering you on, mate.
-DOGWITHOUTSLIPEERS to DDA re THE LEGEND - Nothing dumb about you! Yes, this man's ancestors are looking down on this man and saying that their heritage will one day be reclaimed and sanctified.
LEEVY said - where are these Western converts of islam on this issue?. they have such lofty views of islam while living in the WEst, dont they see how islam perverts human rights? Islam when left onto themselves is self destruction. l say fence them in and let the fireworks begin!
MONTEDORO said -
"A hint of desecration Koranic
Results in disturbances chronic;
It provides much release
To the Religion of Peace
To murder blasphemers demonic."
END of my record of the original comments to this article - dda.