Scholars from a country that doesn't allow churches or synagogues slam Swiss minaret ban

Could we ask these students what they think about Christian churches being banned outright in their country--not just the cross on top, but the whole church. When these students slam Saudi Arabia's Christian Church ban, then someone may actually take them seriously and not see them as muslim hypocrites playing the poor victim card.

Someone really needs to just spit in their face.

"Shaikh Murshid Al Motairi, a noted Saudi preacher, underlined the need for launching a massive campaign to withdraw investments of Muslim countries from Swiss banks and halt going to Switzerland for holiday making."

The Swiss should confiscate all Saudi funds in Swiss accounts for this formal declaration of economic war by Saudi religious authorities.

Furthermore, he recommends that Muslims should not travel to Switzerland.

If Muslims actually view this as an impingement upon their freedom to practice their faith, aren't they supposed to emigrate to another country which will allow them to practice freely?

ThinkThrice: that's beautiful. I couldn't agree more.

remember?

"Saudis shred tourists’ Bibles found during customs checks at their airport. If anyone is found with more than one Bible, he is taken into custody."

I don't understand.. they're going to reward Switzerland by keeping Muslims out of it? Hell.. we should all start banning minarets immediately! I wouldn't have thought it would be so easy.

Let me see if I've got this right. The Saudis seem to be saying that if you don't allow us to come to your country and piss wherever we want; we will conquer your country so we can piss wherever we want.

In Sahih Bukhari, the most canonical of hadith collections, Muhammad said, "I have been ordered to fight the people till they say: 'None has the right to be worshipped but Allah.' And if they say so, pray like our prayers, face our Qibla and slaughter as we slaughter, then their blood and property will be sacred to us and we will not interfere with them except legally and their reckoning will be with Allah."

In other words, if you are not a Muslim, Muhammad says your blood and property will not be safe from Muslims.

And if you are a Muslim, boy, you better stay one. Also in Sahih Bukhari, Muhammad said, "Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him."

That and similar statements of Muhammad are the main reason why today all the schools of Islamic law call for the death penalty for apostasy.

Whenever I hear an OIC spokesman talk about "dialogue at the grass-roots level" I reach for my lawn mower.

Hmmm, just curious how powerful is the Saudi money weapon with the Swiss? I'd imagine they could twist some arms.

Speaking to Gulf News, they said that this is another evidence of the West's antagonism towards Islam...

I guess the west just needs to cough up more jizya...Underpayment is a sign of antagonism and disrespect.
Rasool Obama promised in Cairo to 'fix' that, but he's not quick enough...Islamic country's need American taxpayers money NOW.
America must cease this insulting antagonism...Obama bowed in homage to the King but didn't pass a check...'That's' antagonism...I bet the King was pzzed...Geo Bush never antagonized them like that.

actually when l hear OIC spokesman talk about dialogue l envision bombs dropping on Mecca and Medina.

Yet again we see what a hypocrite the Islamic world is. And to Saudi Arabia, which isn't even a country but a family, please, just fuck off.

Drip by drip the Islamic world makes its real intentions and inconsistencies known to all who have even half a brain. The Western elites of course, possessed of less than half a brain due to factors like college education, greed, PC/MC, snobbery and general stupidity, are still clueless, but the Western body politic is taking more and more notice of the monstrosity which is Islam with each passing year. I remain cautiously optimistic. No way a century from now Islam will still be a major world religion. In the unlikelihood that it is, then mankind will have descended into the darkest of dark ages, courtesy of the religion which a seventh-century pervert and psychopath invented while reinventing himself.

Ah, no way mankind can be this stupid, so as to let Mohmmedanism become the ruling ideology of the human race, though the Western Left will give it a good shot here in support, collective idiot which it is. The times are out of joint. Big time.

ThinkThrice:
Yes. My sentiments too. Enough has been said. I just want them to go away and leave us alone. They can even keep their oil; we can cope without it, when we have to. It's not worth the trouble.

Today I was called a racist and a bigot by several posters on Turkish newspaper sites where I posted comments on the Swiss minaret ban. Basically, what I said was that until Muslim countries such as Turkey protest the practice in Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Egypt, etc. of discrimination against Christianity that their protests about Switzerland were hollow. I guess I struck a raw nerve.

Robert is right here when he says that what we see as hypocrisy (from a Western viewpoint) is what they (many Muslims) see as the truth and the proper way the world should be.

This blindspot, in its dazzling arrogance, threatens world peace.

"What the Klingon says is unimportant, and we do not hear his words" - Dr Leornard McCoy

Apologies to non-trekkies.

Here's the brave and forthright Melanie Phillips (Londonistan) on the minaret ban:

"Switzerland Draws the Line"

http://www.melaniephillips.com/articles-new/?p=698

It must take considerable training for Al Shahri and Ihsanoglu to make these statements with a straight face. I can't get even half-way through without bursting out in laughter.

Now let's see. If all the rich Arabs with villas and apartments in Vevey, Lausanne, Montreux, Geneva were to decide to leave Switzerland in order to punish it, they would have to put their real estate on the market, and presumably wish to decamp quickly. And if they did so, the prices would have to be low enough do so as to sell quickly and that, in turn, would mean below-market prices, for the non-Arab non-Muslim buyer. Of course the Arabs and Muslims will never sell. They would go crazy if the European countries prevented them from visiting, and living in, Europe. In fact, every Arab or Muslim could easily be charged a head-tax, a Jizyah, to have the right to come to Europe, a charge that might possibly reimburse Infidel nations for the increased costs of security that the presence of these Arabs and Muslims entails, and perhaps a much larger head-tax for Saudis, Kuwaitis, Emiratis, who give the money that pays for mosques, madrasas, and campaigns of Da'wa in Dar al-Harb. Make them pay the entire cost of the increased security arrangements made necessary by the large-scale presence of Muslims, a presence made more visible, and easier, by that flow of foreign Arab money.

Brilliant article Robert.

These committed Islamists are hardcore cultists. Don’t expect the Islamists to change their minds anytime soon.

Although many Muslims are good people to be sure, Muslim’s themselves have very little real understanding of their own religion, and unfortunately, Islam perverts and retards the majority of minds and souls that it touches.

The Muslim “Ummah”will for a long time to come, blame The West exclusively for all of their problems.

Being unable to question or criticize Islam, “the Islamists” will fail to see that Islam itself is the root cause of their problems.

The entire foundation of Islam is a fraud.

~~~~~

Here is excerpt from a recent article that I wrote:

Muhammad was a deranged man. He was so deranged in fact, that he himself believed his own lies. He made his living and satisfied his “needs” by creating enemies and then raiding and looting their property. Muhammad and his gang of criminals butchered thousands of people during their raids. Often the women and children were spared death only to be enslaved and sold for profit or used as concubines and free labor. Many of the modern day followers of Muhammad’s cult of Islam want to re-live that savage age. They want to slaughter “infidels” and take their wives. They want to see stonings, amputations, and mute women in full length black garb on every street. The early Muslims became Muslims by being duped or threatened by that convincing mad man. Modern Muslims, even the most educated, are Muslims due to either fear or ignorance, period.

~~~~~

Here is a recent statement from a group of Bangladeshi apostates living in the UK explaining the reasons why they have abandoned Islam:

One who claims to be a messenger of God is expected to live a saintly life. He must not be given to lust, he must not be a sexual pervert, and he must not be a rapist, a highway robber, a war criminal, a mass murderer or an assassin. One who claims to be a messenger of God must have a superior character. He must stand above the vices of the people of his time. Yet Muhammad’s life is that of a gangster godfather. He raided merchant caravans, looted innocent people, massacred entire male populations and enslaved the women and children. He raped the women captured in war after killing their husbands and told his followers that it is okay to have sex with their captives (Koran 33:50). He assassinated those who criticized him and executed them when he came to power and became de facto despot of Arabia. Muhammad was bereft of human compassion. He was an obsessed man with his dreams of grandiosity and could not forgive those who stood in his way...

He described this as the latest example of growing anti-Islamic incitements in Europe by the extremist, anti-immigrant, xenophobic, racist, scare-mongering ultra-right politicians who reign over common sense, wisdom and universal values."

Which "extremist, anti-immigrant, xenophobic, racist, scare-mongering ultra-right politicians" does Ihsanoglu have in mind? The libertine Pim Fortuyn? The famously-to-the-left Oriana Fallaci? Possibly the former Muslim who arrived in Italy from Egypt, Magdi Allam? Could it be the Somali beauty, who was raised in Somalia, Kenya (among Muslims), and Saudi Arabia, before finding her haven and heaven in the Western world she had been raised to hate and despise, Ayaan Hirsi Ali?

Tell us. We're all ears.

Please, oh please, Saudis, take yourselves out of Switzerland and go back to the desert lands whence you came!

Would it not be great to turn back the clocks to before the world became addicted to oil and empowered such hideous cultures? Several individuals to blame in that regard, for spreading the noxious pollution both physical and spiritual.

Please see my article on this fracas:

Swiss minaret ban causes global uproar

This American kid has some good videos :-).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QwW5pvre7hs

"...extremist, anti-immigrant, xenophobic, racist, scare-mongering ultra-right politicians."

Music to my ears. When can I vote for one?

Here's a Muslim "explaining" why Moslem countries do not allow freedom of religion - because "Islam is the one true religion."

You will either puke or laugh outright at this pathetic excuse for a human being.

Oh, by the way, the phrase "religious scholar" concerning Muslims translates to: nutter

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=plyS8sIUjmQ

...he Western societies are being hostage to extremists who exploit Islam as a scapegoat and a springboard to develop their own political agenda ...

Would that agenda happen to be protecting the rights of women, children, gays, etc, and the principles of free speech, equality, etc?

Oh, my heart just bleeds purple panther piss for these poor wounded saudis.

PFFFT!

The more that the likes of Gaddafi or 'Shaikh Murshid Al Motairi' complain about the Swiss minaret ban, the more clear it is that the Swiss people made the right decision.

I'm going to LAX this week dressed as a Chassidic Jew and try boarding a flight to Saudi Arabia.

as a reader of baen scifi i find this debate over muslim bayonets(minarets ) in the land of the Swiss interesting because in the book Caliphate by t katzman the muslims have turned all of Europe along with the middle east into a Caliphate all but the Swiss and the funny thing is there have been a lot of country's that have tried to over run Switzerland and this Shaikh Abdul Mohsen Al Shahri can wine all he wants but in reality theirs not much the uma can do to the swiss for there minaret ban and its long past time the west banded new mosque construction untill churches are being built and given the same respect in muslim countys as mosques are

The link given by Darcy in a posting above should be carefully looked at. For it shows that Muslims are not being hypocritical. The word has no meaning for them. They understand themselves to be in possession of the complete and exclusive truth. No other faith has any claim to the truth, and it is therefore perfectly proper, even a duty, for Muslims to constrain, control, and ban outright when they wish, any and all churches and other structures connected to Christianity, and to ensure that there is no possible propagation of Christianity -- let's not even speak about other faiths -- in lands controlled by Muslims.

Dr. Naik, the famously "moderate" Indian Muslim, shows us exactly the Muslim mindset, and it is one that everyone in the Western world, whose rulers and media elites are deficient in their apprehension of danger, and remain most ignorant of Islam, needs to grasp.

Again, go here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=plyS8sIUjmQ

And when you have viewed Dr. Naik, and understood, completely, how Muslims see things, make sure that you, in turn, send that link through email to many others, to put it on ListServs, to urge others to send it on. An effort at life-saving pedagogy that has no end -- but it does have, at some places on the Internet, at least a beginning.

Oh so it's now 1.5 billion Muslims now is it? Up from 1.2 billion only recently.

The more the OIC exaggerates the less credible they become.

the Sowdies, that's all.

Arrogant impertinent bastards.

Again I say, no churches in Arabia, no mosques in Christendom.

No Bibles in Arabia, no korans in Christendom.

No open Christian prayer in Arabia, no open mohammedan prayer in Christendom.

And don't even get me started on the way Jews, Hindus and Buddhists are treated.

The ignorant incompetent bastards can't launch a single successful industry on their own, and they remain perfectly insane with their convictions of superiority.

I can't think of a single mohammedan country known to excel at any productive act. Yet they are seized with passion about their superiority.

They truly will kill over any questioning of their fanatic self-regard.

This murderous passionate vanity is the nadir of human spiritual weakness and corruption.

They really have to be told repeatedly and firmly that IF they behave they might be treated as equals, but not otherwise as they look distinctly inferior from our point of view.

You cannot have a successful community where the weakest least productive member is convinced that he is better than everybody else.

Before I get flamed by somebody who doesn't know what's going on here -- I am talking about the mohammedan political/religious establishment, not about random individual mohammedans who in the words of Churchill may show splendid qualities.

The need for favorable self regard is one of the key motivators of the human psyche. The only way a decent life for man can be assured is by tying people's self regard to such measures as effectiveness, productivity and benevolence toward the people around them, whether neighbors or strangers.

People tragically invent all sorts of pretenses, manipulations and tricks to fill themselves with favorable self regard without a thought about anything of real value.

It is a deep spiritual corruption.

And it is astoundingly difficult to beat out of the mohammedans. Every time they are excelled or defeated they come back even more insanely convinced of their superiority.

Puzzling. Disgusting.

"He described this as the latest example of growing anti-Islamic incitements in Europe by the extremist, anti-immigrant, xenophobic, racist, scare-mongering ultra-right politicians who reign over common sense, wisdom and universal values."

How is this "racist, ultra-right, xenophobic and extremist" how is it an incitement?

Why are these Muslims not demonstrating those "values" toward other beliefs? I want to see freedom of religion in SA along with churches, synagogues, and all believers to be treated equally.

"This is a clear evidence of the racial and religious segregation still prevails in the West, "

Seems to me that it is the Muslims who choose to set up parallel societies in Dar al Harb with the intention of eventual domination of the indigenous culture and people.

"The Chief of OIC, which represents about 1.5 billion Muslims worldwide, expressed his deep regret that at a time when the Muslim world and Muslim societies around the world have been engaged in a struggle to fight extremism, the Western societies are being hostage to extremists who exploit Islam as a scapegoat and a springboard to develop their own political agenda which in turn contributes to polarization and fragmentation in the societies."

Hahahahaha I had to read this a couple of times because I just couldn't believe the balls of this OIC chief.

So the Ummah is fighting extremism? How exactly are they doing that? By building schools that teach the fundamental hate of the Q'uran? Teaching Arab imperialism as a mandate to impressionable children?

Maybe they are fighting Muslim extremism by making cartoons of Jews as cannibal vampires, using animation extolling the virtues of murder by suicidal jihad for the consumption of children. Yes they are so effective, especially when they use women and children as human shields, then cry about the evil Israelis who are trying to defend themselves.

Now this arrogant fool actually has the nerve to say the very people who speak the TRUTH about Islam are extremists who are holding the West hostage! Scapegoating Islam no less!

Memo to OIC Idiot...Muslims and their Books of Hate are doing fine daily showing the skeptical West what Islam is all about.

Now it is time Dar al Islam sign and enforce the UN 1948 Universal Declaration of Human Rights and scrap 1990 Cairo Declaration of Human Rights.

It is also time that instead of Muslims telling us all how great Islam is and they start learning about Christianity,Judaism, Wicca, Hinduism and all other faiths. Once Muslims learn about other religions, then we can have dialogue.

OT, but here is a powerful interview with Hamid Tawfik. He blames religion, not poverty or lack of education, for the radicalization of his youth. He implores the Israelis not to grant concessions to radical Muslims, calls Israel a "great nation", and insists that America's weak response to the African embassy bombings in 1998 was the green light for 9-11.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2wvqDfitLY

Further to the comments above on the youtube interview with Zakir Naik;

His 2+2 analogy does indeed illustrate his certainty of his belief.
Are we to accept that Christians do not feel this same degree of certainty in their faith?
Surely there are many who do. I suggest that the difference between Muslims like Naik and his counterparts in Christendom is not that only Muslims have total belief, but that only non-Muslims have empathy enough to understand that believers in other faiths can experience the same devotion and therefore have a moral right to equal consideration.
It could also be that Naik is using his profession of the certain truth of Islam to mask what is actually his arrogance and intolerance.

Meanwhile, in Pakistan their co-religionists have this year bombed seven mosques -- yes, mosques, not merely minarets --killing 366 people in the process (from a ROP article). Any comments on that, Al Shahri and Ihsanoglu?

Do as we say, but not what we do! Why is America buddy buddy with Saudi Arabia?

Well, I was beginning to write off Europe as a lost cause to Islam. But...perhaps, just perhaps there is some hope yet. France is beginning to stiffen. The Dutch party of Geert Wilders is growing. The un-telligenzia people of Switzerland seem to have had enough. Italy is stirring and Austria. too.

The Europeans should take this energy and pour it into positive, Western Civilization freedoms which are the foundation of our society. Freedom of Speech, Women's rights, religious freedom... Let these be the line in the sand which we in the Western World will not compromise!

Il Toscano

Well, I was beginning to write off Europe as a lost cause to Islam. But...perhaps, just perhaps there is some hope yet. France is beginning to stiffen. The Dutch party of Geert Wilders is growing. The un-telligenzia people of Switzerland seem to have had enough. Italy is stirring and Austria. too.

The Europeans should take this energy and pour it into positive, Western Civilization freedoms which are the foundation of our society. Freedom of Speech, Women's rights, religious freedom... Let these be the line in the sand which we in the Western World will not compromise!

Il Toscano

Taken from last paragraph of blog:

"He stated that this move also highlighted the need for promoting genuine dialogue at the grass-roots level to alleviate all misunderstandings and misinformation that lead to intolerance and misconceptions."

One broken 2x4 hit em again we are starting to get their attention. By their very own koran we are told what to expect from muslims. When we stand up and say NO MORE they threaten us with worldwide unrest. Your genie is out of the bottle and the time for deception has past. You misunderstanders of islam have been found out and the world is awakening to just how savage you are.

Well, I was beginning to write off Europe as a lost cause to Islam. But...perhaps, just perhaps there is some hope yet. France is beginning to stiffen. The Dutch party of Geert Wilders is growing. The un-telligenzia people of Switzerland seem to have had enough. Italy is stirring and Austria. too.

The Europeans should take this energy and pour it into positive, Western Civilization freedoms which are the foundation of our society. Freedom of Speech, Women's rights, religious freedom... Let these be the line in the sand which we in the Western World will not compromise!

Il Toscano

Everything they say makes you hate them more and more! The world wakes up as islam bellows.

These scholars should promote those values that they admire
in Western countries;like democracy,freedom of religion,
human rights etc.Why don't they condemn the extremists in Islam for their opposition to these said values?A good start
would be to lobby for the leaders of Islamic countries to
respect the rights of non-Muslims to practice the religion of their choosings.This is like the proverbial people in glass houses throwing stones.Clean up your own back yards.
Put up or shut up.

WOW! My ex-wife nust have been a muslim. I didn' think
anybody could lie with such a straight face. Remind me never yo play poker with a muslim.

Under Islam, hypocracy is good, I presume. Everything evil or awful seems to be good or nice under Islam.

Under Islam, men rule and women are slaves. I would hope that most free men and ALL free women would cringe at the thought of Islamic rule.

He stated that this move also highlighted the need for promoting genuine dialogue at the grass-roots level to alleviate all misunderstandings and misinformation that lead to intolerance and misconceptions.

Boiler plate nonsense.

The deceased calling the hanged man dead...

It is repellent but one has to bear in mind that from the mohammedan point of view, since they regard themselves as our superiors and the carriers of THE ONE TRUE WAY, every other view of life is insignificant and wrong, and deserves no respect.

Therefore, for THEM to ban the study or practice of any way but their own seems completely natural and reasonable to them, even benevolent.

However for anybody to set a limit on their expressions of superiority is to them a gross injustice, because, of course, they are superior, and it's only natural that that be advertised as loudly as possible.

Mere equality, in the sense that WE understand it is neither interesting, nor really meaningful in their view. There cannot be "equality" between THE ONE TRUE WAY and the myriad of corruptions and errors out in the rest of the world. It doesn't make any sense from the mohammedan point of view.

=================

By the way, on has to be cautious in the handling of mohammedan utterances about such things as "extremist, anti-immigrant, xenophobic, racist, scare-mongering ultra-right, inequality, blah, blah, blah ...".

Those terms have no particular meaning or value in the mohammedan mind.

The lightest most casual perusal of their domestic mores and regulations reveals that what we call "extremist, anti-immigrant, xenophobic, racist, scare-mongering inequality" and a bunch of other things is their idea of normal when they do it at home.

In point of fact, they have simply learned our vocabulary and learned that we have a strong aversion to being called those names. So, well ... common sense says that you go with what works. If the kaffirs are scared off by being called a few meaningless nonsensical names, cool! Go for it.