Jihadist who tried to murder cartoonist for depicting Muhammad as violent faces terror charge

I think he means the TEACHINGS of islam is violent, and yes, I do agree that not ALL muslims are bad, however, there's a real danger (or should I say potential) that all muslims *could* become violent simply due to the nature of islamic theology. While some are genuinely peaceful, sticking to sugar-coated qurans/interpretations, there's always that potential risk of becoming more literal/fundamentalist in the teachings. Now, I've read whole surahs of the quran from a popular English translation of the quran, and even w/o commentators' notes, I can clearly see the violence prescribed in that book. Though some may argue that it uses a lot of analogies, one cannot deny the violent words that are printed on those pages.

To be frank, Paul, you must concede that there's a genuine concern in the international community about actions carried out by muslim terrorists. There's a real fear that our own countries will be taken over and transformed into islamic states - it's basically ingrained in islamic theology. It's their belief in Allah's commands to take over the world and have everyone submit to islam. Now, I will admit that Christianity DOES tell its followers to preach to all nations as well as baptise everyone, etc, but seriously, does the Bible tells its followers to use violence in order to achieve its goal? Sure, there's the threat of a painful afterlife, same as islam, but what does that have to do with public conduct in the earthly, or physical life that we live in now?

So do I think Spencer does raise a very important issue? I would say so.

Ok wisenheimer....YOU say : "Spencer always seems to painstaking try to convince us all that islam is a threat and not peaceful."

AHah!!! Robert does NOT have to painstakingly TRY to convince us that islam is a threat ...IT'S IN THEIR little GREEN BOOK, you silly wisenheimer!!!!!!!

Kill, slay, cut their necks, rape captives, on and on. The koran is bad poetry and vicious to boot.

I pity any poor slug who follows mohammed and his deranged CULT. The only angel who would advocate the violence in the koran is a fallen one called SATAN.

islam needs a REFORMATION. One to cut out all that penchant for violence against PEOPLE who do not suscribe to mohammed and his death cult.

Anybody who does not like dogs is a LOSER to me. That goes double for mohammmed.

You must be new here Paul. The thrust of this site is that this isn't an isolated incident, but rather one of a long string of attacks by Muslim believers on those who would insult their religion. Although one can certainly find religious strife in almost any historical period, the fact is that today, and during the recent past, this religious strife overwhelmingly involves Muslims as the initiators, and virtually all of it is justified on religious grounds. They are not even shy about announcing this, although quite a few people seem to tune out what they are so loudly trying to say. We are not impressed by the claim that Islam is a "Religion of Peace" when so much of the strife seems to involve followers of this religion, and when we see apparent apologists like yourself working so hard to deflect attention from what is so plainly evident.

Ok wisenheimer....YOU say : "Spencer always seems to painstaking try to convince us all that islam is a threat and not peaceful."

AHah!!! Robert does NOT have to painstakingly TRY to convince us that islam is a threat ...IT'S IN THEIR little GREEN BOOK, you silly wisenheimer!!!!!!!

Kill, slay, cut their necks, rape captives, on and on. The koran is bad poetry and vicious to boot.

I pity any poor slug who follows mohammed and his deranged CULT. The only angel who would advocate the violence in the koran is a fallen one called SATAN.

islam needs a REFORMATION. One to cut out all that penchant for violence against PEOPLE who do not suscribe to mohammed and his death cult.

Anybody who hates Jews, is of the devil and works openly for the demon himself. Nazis, fakestinians, moslems, KKK.. ALL you jerks, YOU work for the devil!!!

And one more thing....Anybody who does not like dogs is a LOSER to me. That goes double for mohammmed. May a dog slobber all over you mohammedens after licking the daylights out your beard!!
HA!

Paul, you poor, benighted soul.

No-one, including the esteemed Mr. Spencer, has to "painstaking try to convince us all that islam is a threat and not peaceful".

The followers of the "Religion of Peace" do that themselves, day after day, year after year, century after century.

"The fact that the police had to shoot him twice, once in the leg, and again in the hand so he would let go of the ax, makes it hard for me to believe it was just a pank."

To paraphrase agent K in "Men in Black": "I really liked that ax."

Common sense is foreign to Robert, eh? ...uh, gotta mirror, paul? Your comment suggests that you're the one in need of some common sense ...you need a LOT of common sense!

paul_benheimer, you said:

I would understand if he [the would-be cartoonist-killer] was joined by the 1.5 other billion of Muslims around the world in such actions, but common sense (something I think Spencer should use although probably foreign to him) would dictate that this isn't the case.

Spencer always seems to painstaking try to convince us all that islam is a threat and not peaceful.

There may be good reasons to criticize some of Spencer's arguments, though in general they seem pretty sound to me. But a few points:

1. Did you know, paul_benheimer, that Tina Magaard, a linguist who has a Ph.D. in Intercultural Communication from the Sorbonne, did a three-year study of the original holy texts of ten religions, and found that Islam's texts are by far the most aggressive toward other religions?

2. Did you know, paul_benheimer, that if you look at the statistics of human rights groups, that Islamic nations as a whole have the worst records on civil liberties and political rights? And that even the least oppressive Muslim nation, arguably Indonesia, has religious identity cards and prosecutes people for proselytizing religion, threatening 5-year prison sentences? Also prosecutes people for teaching unorthodox forms of religion? And Indonesia is about as good as it gets. Saudi Arabia and Iran are hell-holes for civil liberties and political rights.

3. Did you know that in Sahih Bukhari, the most canonical of hadith collections, Muhammad said, "Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him."

4. Did you know that all the schools of Islamic law agree on the death penalty for those who leave Islam, and they agree because according to the core texts of Islam, Muhammad ordered on a number of different occasions that apostasy be punished with death?

5. Did you know that in the years since 9/11/01, there have been almost 15,000 deadly jihadist attacks against civilians, attacks carried out in the name of Islam around the globe? See www.thereligionofpeace.com for the breakdown month to month, year to year, nation to nation. If an average of three people were killed in each of those attacks -- a conservative estimate, as one can confirm by reading the actual reports of the attacks -- that comes to over 45,000 civilians dead from jihad over the last decade, and God knows how many crippled and injured.

6. Here's the data that's most critical for you to question, paul_benheimer: According to polls of Muslims, it seems that between 40% and 60% of Muslims would prefer to live under Islamic law rather than under Western legal systems. If that or anything like it is true, then Robert Spencer's arguments are common sense, despite what you have said. Meanwhile, polls of Muslims also show that between 5% and 10% agree with violent jihad attacks, while 1% are interested in actually participating in such attacks. In the U.S., there are perhaps three million Muslims. That means some 30,000 are interested in participating in jihad attacks. Somewhere between 150,000 and 300,000 agree with such attacks and would be unlikely to report jihadists to authorities. But the real problem is that some 50% of Muslims apparently prefer Islamic law, which seeks to turn non-Muslims into second-class citizens subject to all sorts of discrimination in all areas of life. Have you ever considered why it is that so few Muslims ever protest against Islamic terror going on daily around the globe? Has it ever occurred to you to look carefully at the core Islamic texts, and see if they justify all that totalitarian violence? Could it be that the jihadists and bin Ladens understand and adhere to Islam more closely than the so-called moderates? Where are those moderates? Why don't millions of Muslims come out in protest against major terror attacks? The only time they do protest in large numbers is when Muslims do terror against other Muslims. Why is there no large, major mainstream international Muslim organization that utterly rejects Islamic law and militant jihad to spread Islam among non-Muslims?

7. Many mainstream analysts have been looking at the demographics of Europe and predicting that, due to immigration patterns and differential reproductive patterns, Europe will be majority-Muslim before the end of this century. Already, it seems that one-third of babies born in France are Muslim. The most common boy's name in France is one or another variant of Muhammad.

8. You say that other religions are equally violent, but no other religion contains within its core texts an open-ended command, true till the end of time, to subjugate all unbelievers under religious law and if necessary make war against them to bring them under the rule of religious law. Only Islam has that imperative in its core texts.

9. Whereas other religions are to varying degrees open to a separation of religion and state, Islam, in the person of its founder, never distinguished religion and state. Where JC, for example, said, "Give to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's," Muhammad became Caesar, or at any rate became the ruler of a theocratic dictatorship.

All of these points show that your objections to Robert Spencer are surely little more than prejudices based on not being adequately aware of the current situation. If you were more apprised of what Islam has been and what it's doing now, you would not accuse Robert Spencer of lacking common sense.

Until Muslim-majority nations show that they can grant full equality of rights to non-Muslims, it is suicide for non-Muslim nations to allow in more and more Muslims. Already freedom of speech is seriously wounded in Europe, as who knows how many journalists, artists, politicians, and others self-censor in order to avoid the fate of Kurt Westergaard and others like him, who must live under constant guard.

"Spencer always seems to painstaking try to convince us all that islam is a threat and not peaceful.

I can do the same thing with almost any religion, if I want to prove whatever is in my agenda."

1. I kinda got that idea myself on the morning of September 11, 2001, long before I had ever heard of Robert Spencer.

2. Oh, really? Well, why don't you give Christianity a shot, then - that it's a "threat and not peaceful."

Waiting.

Darcy...

Spencer's critics come and go...mostly go...

Your post reveals more about you than you realize. You've got to do much, much better if you're going to hold your own here at JW, where no quarter is asked for and no quarter given. Right now, you're not even making the junior varsity, let alone the big leagues. You're out of your depth and clueless. Do some homework, plenty of it, and then come back------if you dare and if you can. Lotsa' luck.

You may wish to think a bit before posting. Kurt Westergaard is under police protection due to threats from individuals and organizations. His cartoons have been condemened by the governments of many Islamic countries, including Iran, Egypt, and Saudi Arabia. Also, there have been riots, attacks on Danish embassies, boycotts of Danish goods and other attacks on Danish interests world wide due to the Danish cartoons. This is not an isolated matter concerning only one extremist. As for common sense, you had best search for it. Ignoring what is going on around you in favor your preconceived idea is not sensible, but delusional.

Yes, they made me go after him. Those evil rotten Danes. I had to hatchet my way through that, door you see? I really think that mosque warrants an investigation. They sound like enablers.

Awesome reply traeh, I copied it for future use.

I guess Common Sense should tell Mr Benheimer and many Political Correct people that of 1,57 billion Muslims OF COURSE many would prefer an Islamic theocratic world to a democratic world. That they would prefer a world in which they are supreme over a world in which they are only equal.

And how many of the 1,57 would have qualms of conscience, genuine objections, in the way to reach that to them desirable objective?

Are you blind or just blind to attacks made by islamic extremists/terrorists? Regardless, you have chosen to side with the enemy of freedom for islam is slavery...in all ways. Good luck with that.
Tell me...would you see the Constitution of the United States replaced by sharia law? THAT is what the good muslim seeks. They allow sharia law even now in banking in some states. islam creeps. Will you support and defend those that would end our way of life? Your Politically Correct ways are what allowed the Fort Hood shooter to kill 14 Americans. 13 soldiers and an unborn child.
As Wellington said, study up and come back, you're out of your depth.

islam is a lie and
Truth is killing it.

I disagree. A trial must be held, especially for an enemy combatant. The combatant has been apprehended in the act charged, caught red-handed.

But a trial is essential for establishing, publishing, and enforcing the sentence. Without a trial, an execution would be murder. That's called "Goin' Muslim!"

Sentence must be determined and rendered by legal authority.

You are either in denial about the truths of Islam or you are a total ignoramus!

Muslims, the followers of ISLAM send their CHILDERN to die for Allah.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QcYykH-V_R8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=we4_C2Hy64o&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ZT7Fe1HpoE&feature=related

God the Father sent his son the Lord Jesus Christ to die on the cross for sins of those He came to save.

Islam teaches intolerance and hatred for non-Muslims.

Christianity teaches forgiveness and love.

Islam teaches to wage war with the non-believer.

Christianity ,"Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself"

The last words of Mohammed: "May Allah curse the Christians and the Jews".

The last words of Jesus Christ: "Father forgive them for they no not what they do".

"The last words of Mohammed: "May Allah curse the Christians and the Jews."

Is there a citation for that?

I did find this in the Hadiths:

Mohammed's last words at his deathbed were: "Turn the pagans (non-Muslims) out of the Arabian Peninsula." Vol. 5:716

Note: Mo-ham-mad cursed Jews on his deathbed.
Volume 2, Book 23, Number 414:
Narrated 'Urwa:
Aisha said, "The Prophet in his fatal illness said, 'Allah cursed the Jews and the Christians because they took the graves of their Prophets as places for praying."' Aisha added, "Had it not been for that the grave of the Prophet (p.b.u.h) would have been made prominent but I am afraid it might be taken (as a) place for praying.
 
Note: Mo-ham-mad cursed Christians on his deathbed.
Volume 2, Book 23, Number 472:
Narrated 'Aisha:
Allah's Apostle in his fatal illness said, "Allah cursed the Jews and the Christians, for they built the places of worship at the graves of their prophets." And if that had not been the case, then the Prophet's grave would have been made prominent before the people. So (the Prophet) was afraid, or the people were afraid that his grave might be taken as a place for worship.

http://www.truthandgrace.com/mohammaddeathbed.htm

MUHAMMAD: "May Allah curse the Jews and Christians for they built the places of worship at the graves of the prophets." Bukhari, Vol. 1, #427
 
http://www.answering-islam.org/Silas/founders.htm

Thanks so much Christian Soldier.

Now, what exactly does "they built the places of worship at the graves of the prophets" mean?

Dear Alaskan, nice to hear from you again. I think Paul got what it takes to realise that he uttered a lot of rubbish (bs). This intruder went to Kurt Westergaard's house equipped like Freddy Kruger. I wish he'd get the appropriate treatment.

Darcy,

Sorry I cannot respond to your question. I am late for a meeting.

Will give you an explanation as soon as I can.

Keep an eye on Yom, he maybe strapping a bomb to himself as I type this.

Keep up the good Fight,

Christian Soldier

Kinana of Khaybar wrote:

gravenimage,

Nice work!
...................

Thank you!

"I disagree. A trial must be held, especially for an enemy combatant."

Is that what we did in WW2? Everytime an enemy soldier attacked us with weapons, we took care not to kill him, then apprehended him in order to accord him a trial with legal representation? Enemy combatants are not accorded a trial. They are fought and killed, and if captured alive, are incarcerated and treated according to various international conventions that the modern West, uniquely, has developed in order to try to treat them as humanely as possible (though even there, there should be -- and were, when we were sane, as in WW2 -- exceptions), under the circumstances, referring to basic physical and psychological treatment, not meaning they get a trial and legal representation.

Nice to be heard. I had to take some time to reassess my view of islam...Partly because I kept gettin' my ass kicked around by Hesperado...;)
I have come to the conclusion that there is no chance of islam dropping Blood and Death from their itinerary...no chance of reformation. Those of the ummah that even suggest such a thing must hire bodyguards and live in fear of having their heads separated from the rest of their body in a most unpleasant fashion.
Speaking my mind has cost me dearly. The majority of my family lives overseas in countries where islam is a constant threat. They live in fear...fear of what might happen to them if some of their neighbors make a connection between what I post here and other places and them. Their neighbors are, of course, muslim. According to my sis in law, some are quite radical and dangerous. They do no feel safe communicating with me...in any way.
How's that for a kick in the teeth? My sister in law identifies ME as a threat to her family...for speaking Truth. So...I shall miss them all.

If that's the price I pay for speaking the Truth about islam then so be it.
As we all know, evil flourishes when good men remain silent. I cannot be silent when my country and my fellow citizens are facing the evil that is islam.

islam is a lie and
Truth is killing it.

Thanks!

And don't worry - I will fight against the Mohammedan Barbarians to the bitter end.

Dear Alaskan, thanks for your warm reply. I can only locate your sis in law somewhere in the middle of Eurabia where the shadows lie. That's Europe today.

My cat and me are wishing you, your wife and all your dogs a good night's sleep

Laila tov from Europe. the sinking ship