Vani is a Pakistani tradition involving trading girls to settle disputes between families. It was outlawed in 2004, but persists in areas where Islam is held to most fervently -- perhaps because Islamic texts and teachings reinforce the idea that women are mere chattel. "Cleric among 10 held in vani case," from The News International, January 4 (thanks to Sr. Soph):
MANSEHRA: Police have arrested 10 people including a cleric for being part of a jirga that declared two girls vani in Siran valley, an official said on Sunday.Mohammad Ayub, father of the vani, Nazi Bibi, was arrested late Saturday and nine jirga members and a cleric Shamsur Rehman were arrested two days back. The jirga members were arrested for declaring two minor girls vani to resolve a marriage dispute. A jirga at Sathan Galli area had declared two girls, Nazi Bibi, 9 and Noreen Bibi, 3, vani last month.
Sources said uncle of the girls, Mohammad Mehboob, and a girl had married on their free will. Taking up the issue, the jirga had given the hand of Nazi Bibi in marriage to a married man Hassan Dar and Noreen Bibi to Mohammad Yasir in marriage. Besides the family paid an amount of Rs0.2 million as compensation to father of Rukhtaj, the girl who had contracted marriage without the consent of her family.
Prior to his arrest, Mohammad Ayub told this correspondent that he wasn't ready to hand over his daughter as vani but was forced to do so by the rival party. Sardar Ajmal, station house officer of Battal police, said declaring a minor girl as vani was repugnant to existing laws of the country and all the jirga members would be taken to task for the crime. He said that so far 10 people including the cleric and father of Nazi Bibi had been arrested and raids were being conducted to arrest the remaining ones.
2nd attempt to post comment:
What is the punishment for this crime?
So what is the punishment for this crime? I could not even begin to guess considering Islamic men seem to have no real problem with doing exactly as they please and all the laws are in place for their gratification and exoneration.
I doubt that this will become a trend. Islamist oriented states have a great deal of trouble imposing non-Sharia regulations that contradict established practices. I wonder where the feminists are in all this?
Feminists and Liberal Democrats who are in the majority are Sick, Racists, Xenophobes and Cowards for covering up this vile, sickening, inhumane Islamic custom which is tantamount to juvenile slavery. I mean one would have to be severely mentally ill to consider a 3 old year, hardly out of a diaper, to be a sexy bride for their wedding night!!!!
What the f**k is wrong with these sordid people!!!!
Child lovers are not mentally ill, they are pedophiles. Pedophilia is perfectly fine and acceptable, for muslim "men". The koran says so.
Ummmmmmmm........I've been what many would call a 'radical feminist' and most of my politics have always been what would be called "leftist"in fact very leftist...however I DO follow my own opinions and do my own research and will NOT follow any "party line" just because..........And I find this an incredibly,utterly repugnant custom.....even more so when I look at my 8 yr old daughter and imagine her in such a situation.....I believe that most feminists who endorse such things as hijab,burka and other IMHO antifemale (and thus anti-human)practices,make the mistake of thinking that this is a choice-(I mean when I was a pre teen/teenager and subject to wolf whistles,grabs and disgusting comments from men(and the occasional bulldyke-no offense to lesbians intended)there were definate times I would've KILLED to have a burka to throw over my head-even AFTER I realized the problem wasn't ME,having a large chest, or even how I looked or dressed ,but the rude,piggish and objectifying mindset of those that could only feel better by denigrating others(esp. women)and that no matter HOW I dressed,be it burka or bikini,it would still continue,until they,in themselves,changed.
I know I have digressed here,but to put it simply many feminists by agreeing with the concept of "choice" and "freewill" do not realize that cultural brainwashing can happen in any milieu,and that many many Muslim women,in and of themselves,have not yet had their own "feminist revolution" and are ,in fact, even more trapped than the "happy homemakers"-sarc on-of the 40's and 50's whom a fair amount either pity or revile(greatly simplified here).Some "feminists" have not yet gone far enough in their thinking to realize that many of the most fervent Muslim females who seem to so ardently embrace hijab,burka,disgusting customs like "vani" and the like do so from a deeply profound Stockholm syndrome,and an incredibly ingrained fear, from seeing what happens to those women who step outside the bounds of what is culturally and religiously acceptable.
One last thing however....I have not personally EVER met any self described feminist, who approves of,or who would want to live under these so-called "Islamic cultural customs".What they believe in ,as I have said,is the concept of choice and free will for ANY and EVERY woman.....but sometimes do so w/out thinking through the religio/cultural parameters that might prevent it.
"Child lovers are not mentally ill, they are pedophiles. Pedophilia is perfectly fine and acceptable, for muslim 'men'. The koran says so."
Darn tootin'! If a six-year-old was good enough to be a bride to Mohammed -- the Final Prophet, the Perfect Man -- she's good enough for me! Big Al in the Sky with Virgins said so hisself.
"Feminists and Liberal Democrats who are in the majority are Sick, Racists, Xenophobes...etc...."
This is a complicated issue and as a veteran of the 2nd wave of feminism in the late 60s and early 70s I believe that i am qualified to give an intelligent perspective on this.
First, the above assumption is precisely why the sterotype of all feminists also automatically BEING neo-liberal democrats is totally inaccurate. I try to tell people that just because the 1970s feminist movement was co-opted by all kinds of partisan politics agendas and civil rights movements, including socialist and communist organizations does not mean we subscribe to the principles of these groups. I've always come to my own conclusions about national and international situations, and personally, I wish more could be done for these women and girls (babies) who are trapped in this culture. However, feminists of my ilk are usually silenced by PC controlled dismissive attitudes as well as the fact that feminists in general are still seen as upsetting the apple-cart too much. (which is exactly what our intentions were/are to do).Conversly, I also have friends who were/are radical feminist and they would ironically be the first to support the cause of females who are victimized by islam and yet would simultaneously support the very neo-liberal/PC/collectivist ideas that allow such conditions to permeate even in Western cultures. An example of this would be such a feminist being for "open-borders" because that is part of the liberal-chic agenda. For me,though, boundaries on every level is what the feminist cause is about.
Mohammad was a pedophile. One of his wifes was just nine years old.
I am not surprised. They're just emulating what their Prophet did when he married(at the age of 55) this 6 yr old child named Aisha.
I am not surprised. They're just emulating what their Prophet did when he married(at the age of 55) this 6 yr old child named Aisha.
Thanks for your post kittybootz.
My post/reply is in ** ....**
" Ummmmmmmm........I've been what many would call a 'radical feminist' and most of my politics have always been what would be called "leftist"in fact very leftist...however I DO follow my own opinions and do my own research and will NOT follow any "party line" just because.......... "
**Well that is quite refreshing and welcome news to hear because contrary to your stand on matters, your flagship organization, the NOW, is and has been in lockstep with their "facilitators" and "benefactors" the Democratic party, and are also in lockstep with the major Islamist organizations in America. In fact, when it comes to any important issues affecting women other than abortion, that may adversely affect or upset the feelings of the other two organizations, such as pedophilia, rape or even the vile religious custom of honor killings and forced Female Genital Mutilation(you may want to look this up) the Feminists (and NOW) are deafeningly silent on the national scene. I guess these issues are not worth protesting or burning your bras over.
Why are Feminists conveniently quite on the Rifqa Barry issue? Is it because she is not white or black? Or a Muslim? Or a native born American? Why do Feminists, the Democratic Party and Islamists appear to be highly selective in their rationale? In fact they appear closer to being racists, supremacists, xenophobic and out of touch with the reality on the ground.**
" (I mean when I was a pre teen/teenager and subject to wolf whistles,grabs and disgusting comments from men(and the occasional bulldyke-no offense to lesbians intended)there were definate times I would've KILLED to have a burka to throw over my head-even AFTER I realized the problem wasn't ME,having a large chest, or even how I looked or dressed ,but the rude,piggish and objectifying mindset of those that could only feel better by denigrating others(esp. women)and that no matter HOW I dressed,be it burka or bikini,it would still continue,until they,in themselves,changed. "
**In fact, contrary to what popular media is paid to broadcast, women in burqas are no more "safer" than those in headscarves or without any head covering. Vile men will be vile men anywhere. With one huge difference. Here,you have recourse and legal address. In an Islamic state, women can be slapped around, severely beaten, raped, married off earlier, when they are a child, kidnapped, sexually tortured, circumcised against their will, bartered, auctioned, sold, and stoned to death for inadequate proof (law requires 4 males to testify in support of an alleged rape victim, good luck finding them!), hung by the neck, and IT IS ALL LEGAL TO DO SO. Yet, Feminists and the NOW appear silent on these global and possibly soon, if not already, to be domestic burning issues! WHY? **
"and that many many Muslim women,in and of themselves,have not yet had their own "feminist revolution" and are ,in fact, even more trapped than the "happy homemakers" "
** Please don't hold your breath, the deck is so stacked against women in Islamic states, that their "Feminist Revolution" perhaps will never happen, especially when their partners in the west (Feminists and the NOW)are so expedient and politically correct.**
" -sarc on-of the 40's and 50's whom a fair amount either pity or revile(greatly simplified here).Some "feminists" have not yet gone far enough in their thinking to realize that many of the most fervent Muslim females who seem to so ardently embrace hijab,burka,disgusting customs like "vani" and the like do so from a deeply profound Stockholm syndrome,and an incredibly ingrained fear, from seeing what happens to those women who step outside the bounds of what is culturally and religiously acceptable."
** Agree. And this is exactly why it is critically important to expose these vile practices and expose the practitioners for who they really are, instead of being in bed with their affiliated organizations and being expedient, and politically correct, so that the victims of this scourge can be helped with their EQUAL RIGHTS.**
" One last thing however....I have not personally EVER met any self described feminist, who approves of,or who would want to live under these so-called "Islamic cultural customs".What they believe in ,as I have said,is the concept of choice and free will for ANY and EVERY woman.....but sometimes do so w/out thinking through the religio/cultural parameters that might prevent it."
** And yet, alarmingly enough, Feminists and the NOW do not practice what they once effectively preached, even for their future daughters sake! As Edmund Burke once said: All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good [WO]men to do nothing. **
Peace be upon victims of Islamic Jihad.
Thank you for your post ElizaDoolittle
My post/Reply is in **....**
"First, the above assumption is precisely why the sterotype of all feminists also automatically BEING neo-liberal democrats is totally inaccurate. I try to tell people that just because the 1970s feminist movement was co-opted by all kinds of partisan politics agendas and civil rights movements, including socialist and communist organizations does not mean we subscribe to the principles of these groups."
** Perhaps you, are an anomaly. The vast Feminist movement and its flagship organization, which wields the power under the banner of Feminism, is in lock step with one party for decades now, their facilitator and benefactors, the Democratic Party, and their new pseudo allies, the Islamist organizations of America. Your individual Feminist efforts, if in any opposition to your mothership the NOW is insignificant. It sure sounds nice on TV though when a woman says "Oh I personally believe in XYZ", because, NOW does not, and votes and lobbies otherwise. So I believe its more of a verifiable, pure fact than a stereotype. **
" I wish more could be done for these women and girls (babies) who are trapped in this culture. However, feminists of my ilk are usually silenced by PC controlled dismissive attitudes as well as the fact that feminists in general are still seen as upsetting the apple-cart too much. (which is exactly what our intentions were/are to do).Conversly, I also have friends who were/are radical feminist and they would ironically be the first to support the cause of females who are victimized by islam and yet would simultaneously support the very neo-liberal/PC/collectivist ideas that allow such conditions to permeate even in Western cultures."
**I agree. NOW and Feminists do not want any apple carts upset with the Islamists or the Democratic Party, this is exactly why there is no representation of any sort from NOW in support of Rifka Barry and her plight or any action against numerous honor killngs, FGM, polygamy and abuse of women, here at home and abroad where many women look to Feminists in America to lead the way.**
" An example of this would be such a feminist being for "open-borders" because that is part of the liberal-chic agenda. For me,though, boundaries on every level is what the feminist cause is about."
** I surely hope more women, Feminists and the NOW can mobilize support to speak up at rallies against the Islamic traditions in keeping women repressed as subhumans, at least here in the United States. **