But their understanding of jihad led these men from Northern Virginia to travel to Pakistan to train to wage war against American troops in Afghanistan. Would any American "moderate" Muslim spokesman care to refute Ramy Zamzam's understanding of jihad? Honest Ibe Hooper? Brave Ahmed Rehab? The sinister and slimy Salam al-Marayati? The duplicitous and whiny Khaleel Mohammed? Anyone? Anyone? "US suspect in Pakistan defends 'jihad' plans," by Asif Shahzad for Associated Press, January 4 (thanks to all who sent this in):
SARGODHA, Pakistan - One of five Americans detained in Pakistan said their aim was to go to Afghanistan to wage jihad against Western forces, defending their intention as justified under Islam....Monday was the first time the young Muslims from the Washington, D.C., area have addressed a court after being arrested in early December in the eastern Pakistani city of Sargodha. The case has spurred fears that Westerners are traveling to Pakistan to join militant groups. Pakistani police have said they plan to seek life sentences for the men under the country's anti-terrorism law.
"We are not terrorists," one of the men, Ramy Zamzam, told The Associated Press as he entered a courtroom in Sargodha on Monday.
"We are jihadists, and jihad is not terrorism," he said....
"They told the court that they did not have any plan to carry out any terrorist act inside or outside Pakistan," said Rokri. "They said that they only intended to travel to Afghanistan to help their Muslim brothers who are in trouble, who are bleeding and who are being victimized by Western forces."...
Police have not said what the group's intended target was, but authorities say the men had a map of Chashma Barrage -- a complex located near nuclear power facilities that includes a water reservoir and other structures. It lies in the populous province of Punjab, about 125 miles (200 kilometers) southwest of the capital, Islamabad....
Pakistani police and government officials have made a series of escalating and, at times, seemingly contradictory allegations about the men's intentions, while U.S. officials have been far more cautious. The U.S. is also looking at charging the men -- Umar Farooq, Waqar Khan, Ahmed Minni, Aman Hassan Yemer and Ramy Zamzam....
Jihad is not terrorism, but terrorism is a prime tool in the well prepared jihadists tool bag...What would these young and dumb jihadi's do if they tied up with a group who told them to commit what they know would be a terrorist act? Would they refuse? Resign their commissions? Abandon ship? Would refusing put 'them' at risk? These guys are as stupid as a bag of hammers...I have no doubt that the Taliban would sacrifice them to the cause without a blink or a sigh...
"I have become victorious through terror" - straight from the mouth of the prophet (BBOH). Why is it that I understand Islam better than these wannabe jihadis? It's all right there in the Qur'an. Maybe they are too lazy to read it? Or comprehend the Qur'an's message?
Maybe they are in too much of a hurry to gain booty (money, infidel women) to read the fine details...........
"They said that they only intended to travel to Afghanistan to help their Muslim brothers who are in trouble, who are bleeding and who are being victimized by Western forces."
THEIR MUSLIM BROTHERS = TALIBAN
Even in Europe we have such a traitor! Worse, as the radicalized Muslims by birth, however, are the converts! Christian schismatics who have connected to Islam! They are more radical as this!
These people are not recognized as Muslims Visually. What makes the prevention and combat of preparations for attack!
The Counterjihat has begun in Europe SVP Switzerland, Austria FPÖ, Vlaams Belang Belgium, Germany ProNRW
Below is a recent debate-interview between Heinz Christian Strache, the leader of the FPÖ (Freedom Party of Austria),
and Carla Amina Baghajati of the Islamic Religious Society. ....
Minarets: Expressions of Dignity, or Symbols of Domination?
Gruß Wilhelmus
The U.S. is also looking at charging the men...WITH TREASON OR SEDITION I hope. When are we going to wake up and realise that moslems are the enemy of the human race and treat them accordingly.
"They told the court that they did not have any plan to carry out any terrorist act inside or outside Pakistan," said Rokri. "They said that they only intended to travel to Afghanistan to help their Muslim brothers who are in trouble, who are bleeding and who are being victimized by Western forces."...
..................
Why do these Jihadis expect a message like the one above to strike a sympathetic chord in Pakistan? Probably because it will.
The main concern the Pakistanis have seemed to had is that these Jihadis will carry out terrorist acts in Pakistan itself.
If they can convince them that they intended to act in Afghanistan only, and then only against the Western forces "victimizing" Muslims, they will likely find a lot of sympathy among Jihad-minded Pakistanis, despite the idea that the West likes to consider them "allies in the War on Terror", or whatever euphemism we are using today.
...'said their aim was to go to Afghanistan to wage jihad against Western forces, defending their intention as justified under Islam.... '
And there you have the whole problem in a nut shell!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ByAAEOqVDXM
Muslims of America Three weeks ago i have seen this video
Now im understand.
Gruß Wilhelmus
"What would these young and dumb jihadi's do if they tied up with a group who told them to commit what they know would be a terrorist act? Would they refuse? Resign their commissions? Abandon ship? Would refusing put 'them' at risk?"
The real question would be, then, "would it even matter?" All that needs doing is to convince them that it is all in the name of the 'non-terrorism' that is jihad, or, even more ridiculous, that if the targets and/or 'collateral damage' happen to be fellow Moslems, to illustrate how they are not really Moslems at all; apostates merit about as much clout as infidels, after all...why feel remorse when you have so much to look forward to in 'paradise?'
In a funny sort of way, it puts me in mind of that proverbial gaggle of masked anarchists that seem to materialize whenever there is a protest against anything from military engagement to capitalism to earning an honest living: if the end result is that stuff gets wrecked, then the 'cause' is all the better for it, because people are talking about it. Right?
"In a funny sort of way, it puts me in mind of that proverbial gaggle of masked anarchists that seem to materialize whenever there is a protest against anything from military engagement to capitalism to earning an honest living: if the end result is that stuff gets wrecked, then the 'cause' is all the better for it, because people are talking about it. Right?"
--posted by Wyldeirishman
Re: the proverbial (um...perennial?) gaggle:
I believe it's called "RUIN and REPLACE"
Get ready, because we're going to see a lot more of this in the future.
We allow, even encourage, people to openly preach sedition, requiring only that they disguise their treason with the trappings of a "religion".
As long as we allow the enemy to openly recruit in our society, they will always be able to find someone who is willing to buy what they're selling.
"We are not terrorists. We are jihadists, and jihad is not terrorism."
They are not Americans. They are Muslims--agents of Islam, a foreign international political cult at war with our nation. Islam is not American.
Bring them back here. Hang them for espionage.
They say they are "muslims living in ______ (fill in the blank)" They are not American. They are not British.
Traitors all, deserving a firing squad.
So a Jihadist is not a terrorist... Hmmm that actually fits perfect with the current administrations perception that terrorism is actually a man made disaster and not the imposition of Sharia law on non-Muslim populations.
So even though we are thwarting attacks every other week now it seems, in actuality we have no enemy.
"There is no smoking gun linking the Nigerian bomber to a greater plot". Are you freaking kidding me?
It is impossible to fight a war when you refuse to identify the enemy. It is high time we acknowledge that this is a problem with Islam itself and not just a few lone nutjobs.
911, Bali, Madrid,Beslan, London, Mumbai are some of the greatest hits. What about all the attacks that are stopped every year that no one talks about. Or the individual attacks on women, Hindus, Christians, Buddhist, Jews and ex-Muslims.
A two year old could connect the dots and link the root of the problem to the murders and attempted murders that are now occurring with frightening frequency.
If Islam will not reject the genocidal components within its religion then the world must stop treating it with kids gloves.
Explain how the eradication of non-Muslims in the name of Islam is any different than the eradication of non-Nazis?
Its absurd that this many people are dead and that there are still excuses being made for a religion that doesn't have a hint of tolerance.
After all that has happened so far, I shudder to think what it will take to stop this oppressive faith.
You ain't no jihadist son, you're just a misguided dhimmi; viz., tool and murderer.
OF course jihad isn't 'terrorism'. Jihad isn't even 'war'.
In Islamspeak 'war' and 'terrorism' (and 'oppression', etc.) are ANYTHING AT ALL that non-Muslims do to resist or impede or protest against the imposition of Islam upon the world.
I myself commit an act of war and terrorism against Muslims every time I walk down the street with my hair and face visible and my little cross hanging around my neck.
While in my nation's capital, last week, I encountered two hijabettes who each, poor dears, had to endure the sight of an uncovered kafir female (me) wearing a cross...
as also on a train trip, just before Christmas: a heavily-hijabbed Muslimah on the train had to sit there and watch not one [myself] but *two* Australian Infidel females visibly wearing crosses; for the lady in the seat behind me, a nice plump young Aussie matron with child in tow, was - like me - wearing a cross pendant, which beautifully adorned her more-than-ample and very-unislamic decolletage.
To the jihad-minded, sharia-minded Muslim, it would have been we two Christian matrons with our crosses who were the 'terrorists', for publicly displaying the symbol of our faith in the sight of a Muslim who was powerless to stop us from so doing.