Vanderbilt Muslim professor admits that Islam mandates death for homosexuals

"Gay rights advocates make a huge issue of Christian opposition to gay marriage etc, while remaining indifferent to the murderous Islamic jihad against gays"

Right, that's because protesting against Christians is low-risk/high reward. They can pat themselves on the back for being "brave" and standing up against those oppressive Christians. And of course, they know that they don't face any serious threats of violence from the Christians, and in fact, the Christians may actually listen to their arguments. When it comes to standing up against Islam, whose practitioners might well use actual violence---well, a lot of their "bravery" suddenly transforms into "respect for different cultures" and "peaceful coexistence of different ideologies".

The professor sure looked uncomfortable after admitting
the truth.He was obfuscating until he had no way out,thanks
to the persistence of the questioner.

As I am a practicing Unitarian-Universalist and a member of a "Welcoming" Congregation, let me extend the open hand of fellowship to you.

To all other spectators, may I say "Thank you, Buddha" that we (Americans) are governed by a secular government. Religions all seem to have a different idea of what sin is, but Islam views the right of conscience (that is the freedom to choose one's religion) as the ultimate sin. Comparing the treatment of gay folk in the modern age between ANY other religion and the ideology of Islam is illuminating. Illuminating because the death penalty seems to be default punishment for many, if not all, infractions in Islam.

The other major difference in all our different faiths is that while we can live together in a secular society, Islam insists that the only way it can be observed is if Islam is the government and all other religions submit to its rule.

There are apples and oranges; but in the case of Islam, it is bananas and machine guns.

I think darkpaw is trying to ignore the fact that as a homosexual in an Islamic state,his life is in peril as
opposed to being homosexual in the West.In so doing,he is taking the safe path of moral equivalence.

but no Muslim has any right to claim that a non-Muslim homosexual has committed an Islamic sin. That person is NOT a Muslim and is therefore NOT subject to the backwards, 7th century dogmas and rules of Islam. Why should anyone's religious ideas of a 'sin' have any bearing on a non-religious person?

One problem - According to islam ALL people are muslim at birth (whether you know it or not) and therefore subject to islamic doctrine. It matters not what YOU believe.

I think I'm just kind of fed up of all religious people forcing their conflicting ideas of 'sin' upon the world.

If islam has its way there will eventually be only one worldwide measure of sin. If that ever happens being "fed up" will be the least of your problems.

Indeed, Cornelius. That type or intellectually lazy, overly-emotional and outright false moral equivalence argument that darkpaw put forth was most disheartening.

"As a non-religious person I find the Halal slaughter of animals barbaric. Muslims think it's not barbaric. Who is right?"

We are.

The Nazis were barbaric, too, though they would say they weren't. Don't you understand right from wrong? Oh, you're "non-religious," so I guess you don't. Can you think, or what?

Muslims are wrong. Islam is wrong. End of story.

If you don't get it, I pity you.

Jesus is God

allah is Not

Get it?

You worship a non-existent pagan moon idol that commands mass-murder:

"Kill non-Muslims wherever you find them. Lie in wait and ambush them, seize and capture them using every stratagem of war." - Qur'an 9:5

Islam and "allah" (Warlord Con Man Mo) are evil.

ONLY Muslims are mass-murdering people. ONLY Muslims, thanks to the Jihad doctrine in Islam.

Your equations are correct! Congratulations!

I'm not concerned about the Old Testament. When's the last time a Jew killed or stoned on orders from Jehovah? Right. Judaism progressed. Jews are moral people. Bravo Israel! Keep defending yourselves from the Islamic Jihadist Barbarians.

Jesus is my God. Jesus preaches only peace and love and compassion and forgiveness. You know - the New Testament.

Things the Mohammedan god, "allah," (Warlord Mo) knows nothing about. "allah" is NOT "merciful," "allah" is NOT "compassionate." "allah" is a mass-murderer of "Infidels." "allah" sucks. That's your Warlord, mind you. There is no "allah," an Arabian pagan moon god that self-proclaimed "prophet" Mo used to obtain power.

"Fight then against them till strife be at an end, and the religion be all of it Allah's." - Qur'an 8:40

Right. Screw you "allah" (Warlord Mo). Fight back against evil Islam, people.

YOURS is the "sky-pixie" - oh, make that the "moon-pixie," "allah." The moon deity of pre-islamic Arabia. A pagan idol.

Or, slightly altering your comment:

"Gays are perverted not stupid. Confront a Christian and you get prayed for. Confront a muslim and you get preyed upon."

"...what sensible person thinks that a practicing homosexual, who openly admits to such sexual activity, faces any danger of being killed by Christians..."

I agree, Wellington.

Such a scenario is not recorded in the New Testament, but a similar situation arose when a woman caught in adultery (which was ALSO punishable by death) was brought before Jesus, as recorded in the book of John:

Chapter 8: 1-11

"But Jesus went to the Mount of Olives. At dawn he appeared again in the temple courts, where all the people gathered around him, and he sat down to teach them. The teachers of the law and the Pharisees brought in a woman caught in adultery. They made her stand before the group and said to Jesus, 'Teacher, this woman was caught in the act of adultery. In the Law Moses commanded us to stone such a women. Now what do you say?' They were using this question as a trap, in order to have a basis for accusing him."

"But Jesus bent down and started to write on the ground with his finger. When they kept on questioning him, he straightened up and said to them, 'If any one of you is without sin, let him be the first to throw a stone at her.' Again he stooped down and wrote on the ground."

"At this, those who heard began to go away one at a time, the older ones first, until only Jesus was left, with the woman still standing there. Jesus straightened up and asked her, 'Woman, where are they? Has no one condemned you?' 'No one, sir,' she said."

"Then neither do I condemn you, Jesus declared. Go now and leave your life of sin."

Juxtapose Jesus's forgiveness with muhammad's vengence:

Sahih Muslim 17.4206

There came to him (the Holy Prophet) a woman from Ghamid and said: Allah's Messenger, I have committed adultery, so purify me. He (the Holy Prophet) turned her away. On the following day she said: Allah's Messenger, Why do you turn me away? Perhaps, you turn me away as you turned away Ma'iz. By Allah, I have become pregnant. He said: Well, if you insist upon it, then go away until you give birth to (the child). When she was delivered she came with the child (wrapped) in a rag and said: Here is the child whom I have given birth to. He said: Go away and suckle him until you wean him. When she had weaned him, she came to him (the Holy Prophet) with the child who was holding a piece of bread in his hand. She said: Allah's Apostle, here is he as I have weaned him and he eats food. He (the Holy Prophet) entrusted the child to one of the Muslims and then pronounced punishment. And she was put in a ditch up to her chest and he commanded people and they stoned her.

While I agree with what you wrote I think there is a bit more to it than just Christians are an easier target.

I think the main reason is far more insidious. It goes back to the Progressive movement and their need to overthrow the US Constitution and crush the Judeo-Christian concepts of freedom of the individual to impose their agenda. One of the major obstacles to this ambition is religion. One only needs to look at the way Mao, Stalin et al viewed religion as an obstacle.

What you are witnessing is the result of decades of indoctrination in Western education which has lead to attacks on religion and a gradual erosion of liberties. As an oppressed minority, homosexuals were easily manipulated and their frustrations directed against the institutions of the church and right wing governments.

I don’t think it even occurs to most of them that there are more evil oppressors; they just see the current zeitgeist as the one to be challenged and if Islam challenges it to then it could be a useful ally.

"hands down the Islamic world of the Middle East is the gayest region I've ever been in."

Doesn't surprise me, as I've long held that Muslims are schizophrenic about sex, simultaneously cultivating the most obsessively fanatical puritanism on the one hand, and the most licentious sexuality on the other hand -- where the latter goes far beyond homosexuality to also include depraved aberrations (I'm leaving aside the question of whether homosexuality is good or bad) such as pedophilia, bestiality, and gang-rape.

Also, I don't think your theory holds for explaining the rampant gay behavior among Middle Eastern Muslims, for from what I've heard, "temporary" and "traveling" "marriages" -- i.e., functional prostitution with girls and women given blessing as perfectly Islamic -- are common and available for men. I think their rampant pursuit of homosexuality simply reflects their pathologically oversexed mentality in general, following in the footsteps of their Prophet, from whose "little Mo" even inanimate objects that weren't nailed down weren't safe. But as I said above, the pathology doesn't end there -- it's further twisted into a strange paradox of schizophrenia, where the sex mania is in constant tension with an obsessively fanatical puritanism.

While all societies have this tension in a much milder form and in varying degrees, Islam has elevated it to new heights (or abased it to new depths) of grotesque intensity unlike that seen in any other culture.

"The Nazis were barbaric, too, though they would say they weren't. Don't you understand right from wrong? Oh, you're "non-religious," so I guess you don't. Can you think, or what?

Muslims are wrong. Islam is wrong. End of story.

If you don't get it, I pity you."

Excuse me? I DO get it.

And what's with the little snipe there claiming that because I'm non-religious I don't understand right from wrong? How dare you!

Killing animals in such a barbaric way is wrong. Religious people think it's right. In your example, the Muslims are the Nazis. Yes, Muslims are wrong. Islam is wrong.

"or it's their implementation of Islam (segregation of the sexes from puberty onward) that forces them into rampant homosexual behavior"

I'm inclined to think that this is the reason for your observations. It would also be a reason for the amount of homosexual activity in prisons.

In an article I read much of the gay behavior in Saudi Arabia that was tolerated was the actions of the dominant partner, the submissive partner was rare in the Kingdom.

Anyway, the effect of Islam on human sexuality is not healthy.

"The Nazis were barbaric, too, though they would say they weren't. Don't you understand right from wrong? Oh, you're "non-religious," so I guess you don't. Can you think, or what?

Muslims are wrong. Islam is wrong. End of story.

If you don't get it, I pity you."

Excuse me? I DO get it.

And what's with the little snipe there claiming that because I'm non-religious I don't understand right from wrong? How dare you! I don't need a religion to tell me what's right and wrong - especially since most religions say homosexuals should be killed, and that slavery's perfectly acceptable.

Killing animals in such a barbaric way is wrong. Religious people think it's right. In your example, the Muslims are the Nazis. Yes, Muslims are wrong. Islam is wrong.

Both. To me, both Kosher and Halal slaughter are barbaric. We have laws that are supposed to prevent excessive suffering to animals, but we have exceptions for religious slaughter. What a ludicrous situation.

No, I'm saying that Islam mandating the death penalty for homosexuals is wrong, regardless of what Muslims think. I'm not claiming moral superiority here, but I am claiming that their morals are questionable at the very least.

We don't kill people because they're a different colour, or because they like the Xbox360 instead of the PS3; and killing someone because of their sexual orientation based upon what their religion says, is utterly wrong. (I assume you'll agree with that one?) You can choose your religion, you cannot choose your sexuality.

"Excuse me? I DO get it."

Great.

However, Muslim countries hang homosexuals on cranes.

We don't.

So, cease with your "moral equivalency" BS.

Darkpaw.My issue with you was due to the fact that you were
equating the treatment of homosexuals by Islam with that
of Christians. Christians may verbally condemn you to damnation or they may try to "save your soul."
Muslims on the other hand will be your judge and executioner.By mentioning other religions when the issue
was Islam's treatment of homosexuals gave one the idea that
you were being intellectually dishonest, or playing the
political correct game.

"...especially since most religions say homosexuals should be killed, and that slavery's perfectly acceptable."

Is that a fact?!

MOST religions, eh?

I challenge you to list these religions one by one, along with citations that support your accusations against "most religions". No, really ...please humor me by backing up this wild claim with SOME supporting evidence. Thank you.

Something tells me you can't deliver ....

Thank you for your answer.

"However, Muslim countries hang homosexuals on cranes. We don't. So, cease with your "moral equivalency" BS."

I'm well aware that Muslim countries following the religious laws of Islam hang homosexuals on cranes. I never claimed that they didn't. I never claimed that my life in the West is equivalent to someone in such a country. I merely stated that religions should not have any say in my life since I do not follow them.

If a homosexual in a Muslim country faces the death penalty just because of their nature, then there is something wrong with that country's laws, and thus, Islamic law. If they are unable to change those laws without being killed, then they may try to seek a way out of that country (and a lot of people do).

Given the chance of having your country as a totally Christian country (I assume you are a Christian?), would you want your religion's laws in place? Or would you be content to have a totally secular country where your religion has no standing above any other? I think you would want concessions for your own faith. Is anyone in your country currently pushing to have Creationism taught in science class at school?

Muslims have Islamic law in their countries - however much we disagree with the results. We see the results of religious law every day, and you highlighted that the religious laws of a Muslim country allow for the hanging of homosexuals.

In my opinion, this is utterly wrong.

The Abrahamic religions of Judaism, Christianity and Islam, have traditionally forbidden sodomy, believing and teaching that such behaviour is sinful.

The Torah states that: "[A man] shall not lie with another man as [he would] with a woman, it is a תועבה toeba ("abomination")" (Leviticus 18:22)

Orthodox Judaism views homosexuality as sinful.

In 1 Corinthians 6:9-10 (TNIV), Paul says:
"Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor practicing homosexuals nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God." So 'God' has created homosexual people and then refused to allow them entry into its kingdom because of the nature that they were born with? What a loving god...!

The Roman Catholic Church and later, Reformed and Protestant churches traditionally condemned same-sex sexual relations, based on scripture texts such as describing a man lying with another man (Leviticus 18:22) as sinful acts.

Passages from the Old Testament have been interpreted to argue that homosexuals should be punished with death.

Homosexual intercourse itself has been interpreted to be a form of lust and a violation of the Qur'an: "What! Of all creatures do ye come unto the males, and leave the wives your Lord created for you? Nay, but ye are froward folk." Quran , 26th sura, trans. Pickthal.

Zoroastrianism: The man that lies with mankind as man lies with womankind, or as woman lies with mankind, is a man that is a Daeva [demon]; this man is a worshipper of the Daevas, a male paramour of the Daevas.” Vendidad

Indian religions: Most contemporary religious authorities in the various dharmic traditions view homosexuality negatively, and when it is discussed, it is discouraged or actively forbidden. The Vedas often refer to people of a third gender, who are neither female nor male. Some see this third gender as an ancient parallel to modern western lesbian, gay, transgender and/or intersex identities. However, this third sex is usually negatively valued as a pariah class in ancient texts. Ancient Hindu law books, from the first century onward, categorize non-vaginal sex (ayoni) as impure.

Hinduism: Some of the law codes, such as that of Manu Smriti refer to both female and male homosexuality as a punishable crime. Punishments include ritual baths, fines, public humiliation and having fingers cut off.

Sikhism has no written view on the matter, but in 2005, the world's highest Sikh religious authority described homosexuality as "against the Sikh religion and the Sikh code of conduct and totally against the laws of nature," and called on Sikhs to support laws against gay marriage.

Even Jainism, whose main idea can be summed up as "do no harm", actively harms homosexuals by denying them their right to be who they are! Chastity is one of the five virtues in the fundamental ethical code of Jainism. For laypersons, the only appropriate avenue for sexuality is within marriage, and homosexuality is believed to lead to negative karma because the sexual act is outside marriage.

Among the Taoic religions of East Asia, such as Taoism, passionate homosexual expression is usually discouraged because it is believed to not lead to human fulfillment.

Taoism stresses the relationship between yin and yang: two opposing forces, which equate to male and female, and maintain harmony through balance. Taoist tradition is that the male energy in males needs to be balanced by the female energy of females, and vice versa, in order to bring about harmony, completion and transformation; this points to male-female relationships (heterosexuality) as the physical and emotional embodiment of the harmonious balance between yin and yang. Both male and female homosexuality are seen as representing a union of two yins or two yangs, and therefore unbalanced, rather than harmonious, which means that same-sex relationships, or engaging in same-sex sexual activity, will have a negative effect on the health of those individuals.

---
I think that about covers the majority of the world's religions.

It's only Paganism, Neopaganism and Confucianism that don't seem to care, and don't have any prohibitions or punishments. Face it, Christianity doesn't like homosexuality, just as much as Islam because they're both Abrahamic religions. The only difference is that Muslims will actively seek out to have you killed (legally!), and Christians won't have you killed yet because they've had their claws cut by progressive society and the changing moral zeitgeist.

---
Since you asked me to show you that the world's major religions do in fact loathe homosexuality and have passages in their texts that encourage the murder of homosexuals, let's turn this one around and ask you to show me the religious texts and laws of the world's major religions that DO NOT have anything bad to say about homosexuality.

You're a muslim, right? 'Splains it all ....

Darkpaw,
You can indeed choose your sexuality, and you can also change it.

There are hundreds of men and women who have decided to change to heterosexuality, and they are living happy and fulfilling lives as a result.

There is even a ministry called Exodus, or something like that, and they minister to those who want out of the misery of homosexuality.

Homosexuality is not a lifestyle, it's a deathstyle.