In Human Events this morning I discuss the mainstream media's favorite religious extremist group: the Hutaree:
A Christian militia group--called the "Hutaree"--preparing to battle the Antichrist and supposedly targeting Muslims, has been raided by the FBI and Joint Terrorism Task Force, and nine of its members have been arrested. These raids and the alleged Christian character of the militia, as well as its rumored targeting of Muslims, are a mainstream media dream come true--a few years back the BBC featured an improbable inversion-of-reality drama about Christians beheading Muslims, and now, lo and behold, it seems to have come to life.For years now we have heard, in the indelible formulation of Rosie O'Donnell, that "radical Christianity is just as dangerous as radical Islam," and yet proponents of this exercise in wishful thinking and ignorance have had precious little evidence to adduce in support of it. But now it is certain that for years to come this Hutaree group will be thrown in the face of anyone who takes note of jihad activity in the United States and around the world, as if this group in itself balances and equals the innumerable Islamic groups that are waging armed jihad all around the world today.
The point will be the same as the one Tim McVeigh has had to shoulder alone all these years (even though he wasn't really a Christian at all and did not justify the Oklahoma City bombing by referring to Christian teaching): that every religion has its "extremists," and that therefore it would be bad form to subject Islam to greater critical scrutiny, and Muslims to greater law-enforcement scrutiny. Everyone does it, don't you see? Al-Qaeda, Hamas, Hizballah, Jemaah Islamiyah, al-Shabaab, and on and on and on--yes, but the Hutaree!
Meanwhile, in the Detroit News story on the raids, which as tendentious, superficial, and slanted as all the mainstream media coverage of the Hutaree's downfall, the Hutaree is matter-of-factly identified as Christian. Yet there are no quotations in the story from Christian leaders explaining how they condemn this "Christian militia," and saying that Christianity doesn't condone such violence, and that these militiamen have twisted and hijacked their peaceful faith. Why didn't the News take care to gather such quotes? After all, they always include such quotes from Muslim leaders in every story about Islamic jihad terror activity. Why is the practice different in this case?
Yet instead of the mainstream moderate Christians (now there's a phrase we don't ever see even from the moral-equivalence types) that we would have every reason to expect the Detroit News to feature in this story, the Hamas-linked Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR) shows up toward the end of the article, playing the victim card with gusto. The arrests are announced during the tenth anniversary banquet of the group's Michigan chapter, to "audible gasps" from the assembled crowd. The claiming of victim status, complete with gasping prospective victims, is artful--and of course the Detroit News, true to mainstream media form, says nothing about CAIR's links to Hamas, the jihad-related arrests and convictions of several of its officials, and the rest of this group's unsavory record.
A responsible reporter might have asked Dawud Walid, executive director of CAIR-Michigan, if he thought this alleged Christian militia group was a "backlash" after the sharp increase in jihad terror activity in the U.S. in the last year, but why should the Detroit News have responsible reporters on staff when no other mainstream media outlet does?
And as for the FBI and the JTTF, are they investigating the Muslim camps around the country where firearms and paramilitary training are known to be going on? Are they doing so with the same energy and resources that they obviously have devoted to the investigation of this Christian militia? If not, why not? If the allegations against this group are true, they richly deserve to be raided and arrested and shut down. But there have been allegations made against Islamic compounds in the U.S. that are quite similar, and nothing has been done. Why is that?
The Islamic jihad is global, well-financed (courtesy our friend and ally Saudi Arabia) and relentless. One self-proclaimed Christian group should not divert us from the ongoing need to defend ourselves against that jihad. But for many, it will.
How many victims of Hutaree violence has there been? A single one?
Meanwhile, the victims of Islamic terrorism over the last 20 years number in the millions if one includes the Sudanese genocide. Even without it, there have been hundreds of thousands (mostly in Algeria, Nigeria, Iraq, & Indonesia).
So, our intellectual and moral response to this absurd attempt at equivalence should be to belittle the premise for its contemptuous neglect of scope and degree.
Here's one from Observer-Reporter who prefers to remain anonymous:
"this perplexing distortion of religious teachings"
"The latest attacks - twin subway bombings in Moscow believed to be by "black widows," extremist Muslims from the Caucasus area of Russia - bring to nearly 1,000 the number of dead in attacks in Moscow by these fanatics in the last 10 years. Meanwhile, the arrests Monday of militia members in Michigan illustrates that this perplexing distortion of religious teachings is not restricted to Islam."
Hmm, what does it take to convince this eager beaver that one of these religious teachings is not distorted at all?
http://www.observer-reporter.com/or/editorial/03-31-2010-Religious--Editorial
http://newstime.co.nz/2010/son-of-hamas-leader-mr-peace-love-muhs-sock-puppet-allah-suffers-from-split-personality.html
Islam Does Not Mean Peace
http://newstime.co.nz/2010/http___www.bible.ca_islam_islam-kills-not-peaceful.pdf
PDF File 70 KB Islam only means peace to Muslims who blindly submit.
To Christians Islam means war, persecution and death.
Fanatics vs fanatics again? Good job religion
Sorry ... this link is right :-)
http://newstime.co.nz/http___www.bible.ca_islam_islam-kills-not-peaceful.pdf
PDF File 70 KB Islam only means peace to Muslims who blindly submit
FBI response to Jamat el fuckra..
http://thelastcrusade.org/
As usual, you nailed it exactly, Robert.
The guy who ratted the Hutari out is a muslim convert.
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/01/us/01michigan.html?ref=us
Check this out... the guy who turned the Hutaree militia in to the FBI, is a MOSLEM!!! (I did not see that one coming.)
Militia draws distinctions between groups
Strict Christian dogma
The strict Christian dogma espoused by the Hutaree does not fly as well these days either, at least in Adrian militia circles. Mr. Savino said that he converted to Islam in the late 1990s after a soul-searching separation from the Lutheran faith he had grown up with, and that he believed that he was the only Muslim in the militia
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36129992/ns/us_news-the_new_york_times
*sigh*
The MSM knows about as much about ANY traditional religion as it knows about the dark side of the moon--maybe less. It and our government elites are staffed by people for whom the jettisoning of a traditional theology is almost a required rite of passage into elite status. Worse, they are proud of their utter ignorance of anyone's traditional theology. Hence, they can neither understand how the Hutaree people are offbeat Christians while Qaeda is mainstream Islam.
I don't throw the word great around without pause, but Ivy League Person Keith Olbermann has taken dubmass-hood to the level of greatness.
He tried to foment a Constitutional Crisis with proof that the presidential election was thrown via ballot fraud in the Florida panhandle when he discovered a statistically significant pattern of registered Democrats voting Republican. Poor Keith had not yet heard of Dixiecrats. Instead of being fired and laughed off the national stage, Keith never corrected his ridiculous error and was later actually given a promotion for the boner.
*** Tabari 1:299 ***
A few years later, after the Fort Dix bust, Keith was again outraged, this time sneering that it was obvious to anybody with a brain that everybody packs heat on U.S. military bases, and these Moslems were obviously falsely accused innocents because they were found with guns, get it ha ha ha. Poor Keith then found out that it's absolutely verboten for anybody to have guns on a U.S. military bases except the Military Police. Keith, genius Ivy League Man, again quietly dropped the matter and took another promotion.
*** Tabari 1:267 ***
Night before last I saw the Great Dumbass Keith at it again. This time he was sniffing and sneering sarcastically about how, "Oh, I've got to go and search for the answer why there are no leftist terrorist groups, let me go look for the reason for this, ha ha ha."
*** Tabari 2:78 ***
Here's a hint, Keith: why would leftists protest when they have everything their way? They've got the schools K - 16, they've got the government jobs, they've got the networks and all the papers, they've got the churches, they've got Affirmative Action racial discrimination from the barrel of a gun (whence all justice is issued), they've got the judiciary, they've got race-based confiscatory wealth transfer already, and we're doubling down on that game soon, they've got Hollywood, they've got Europe, they've got the borders left wide open to aboriginal illegal migration, they've even gotten the military on the bandwagon, and now they've got the White House, with an American-hating born Moslem Indonesian Prez to bow before King Abdallah and apologize about how American has lost her moral compass.
*** Bukhari Vol 4 Bk 54 Nbr 52 ***
So why would any self-respectiing leftist need to take up arms, Kieth? What would they have to fight against, Keith?
Go back to your Ivy League and axe joe professors that. You have greatness Keith, but even you don't know it all. Just look. Just axe.
Strict Christian dogma... Thou shalt not kill.
Strict Moslem dogma... Thout shall kill...(PBUH)
Good point--although it's better understood as "commit murder". I believe that the Bible does sanction capital punishment (albeit to be administered by civil authority) and that there is such a thing as a just war--again, to be declared by proper authority.
Now, would someone kindly tell me where in the Qu'ran and Hadith does it command us to pray for those who despitefully use us and love our enemies--as opposed to giving them da'wa before declaring a war to loot them? I'd really like to know.
Strict Moslem dogma... Thout shall kill...(PBUH)
*** Bukhari Vol 9 Bk 87 Nbr 115 ***
Shalt, Mobamad, shalt.
There is almost certainly an underlying motive to the FBI's actions in going after these guys in such a high profile operation. In browsing the stories and comments about this over at HuffingtonPost I see a few calls for restricting private ownership of guns. Maybe this is also on Obama's agenda?
Egos gone wild...
The Hutaree have little to do with Christianity...Anyone can say anything...Any Christian may suddenly, or slowly, come to realize that Islam, or government, is a threat, and something should be done, but only those with damaged mentalities would think that killing local policemen was a means to that end...
Christianity does not 'cause' violent behavior, but violent men can act in its name...'Love your enemies' is not a call to attack them...Sometimes legitimate self defense is called for, but if you have to hide behind religion to do it, your motivations might not be all that legitimate...
...would someone kindly tell me where in the Qu'ran and Hadith does it command us to pray for those who despitefully use us and love our enemies--as opposed to giving them da'wa before declaring a war to loot them?
*** 8:59 ***
That's easy:
The infidels should not think that they can get away from us. Prepare against them whatever arms and weaponry you can muster so that you may terrorize them.
Just have to read between the lines is all. It's all in the inner deep meaning. Look deep, real deep.
" there is such a thing as a just war--again, to be declared by proper authority."
I don't know if that is all together true, a Christian is not allowed to kill.
Jesus never spoke of "a just war," under any authority.
This is the closest verse that I can find to justify war.
1Ti 1:18 This charge I commit unto thee, son Timothy, according to the prophecies which went before on thee, that thou by them mightest war a good warfare;
I don't even think that this is referring to warfare in a military sense.
Oops... Sorry, let me get out of the new king James, and go back to the KJV.
:-D
"I see a few calls for restricting private ownership of guns. Maybe this is also on Obama's agenda?"
The democratic party has always gone after second amendment rights. Under the disguise of gun control.
One of Obamas advisers has stated that any American that owns a gun should be put on the "no fly list." As a potential terrorist.
I can't help but notice that all media outlets seem to describe this group of nutcases as a "Cjhristian militia" or "Christian extremists"--what happened to the "--ist" beloved of any description of Muslim fanatics? In those cases it's almost always "Islam**ist**" rather than "Islamic"
Perhaps you missed something?
"Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I came to set a man against his father," according to the Bible, Jesus said that.
@kegner:
As any muhammadan apostate to Christianity can tell you (and I know many) Jesus was 100% correct.
I know several former muhammadans who are under death watch from their own fathers (and goon brothers) because they apostasized from islam and went to Christ.
So, you see, Jesus was very truly a prophet (and much more!)
That particular verse is in the context of how by becoming a Christian one runs the risk of being rejected by one's family. That one may be disowned and have those who were once friends turn hostile. Basically to put it in historical perspective, it was said at a time when Christianity was a new thing, and it's human nature to think of the new and strange as being a bad thing.
Another way of looking at it, in a more modern sense, if you used to be a Muslim, but suddenly decide to embrace Christianity, you probably will have your father come at you with a sword or a knife or a gun.
It's a passage where context is important.
You are correct in the biblical distinction of "kill" vs. "murder". It's an important one, so thank you for making it.
As a Christian minister, let me be clear, I condemn the violence and hate espoused by the Hutaree. It has nothing to do with traditional Christian teachings.
Now, when will I hear an Imam make the same statement about Muslim terrorists? By the way I do not think the Hutaree are Christian.
I am amazed by the MSM response to this. The terms used such as "Christian Extremist" and "Domestic Terrorist" are used before all the facts are in. Didn't the "ONE" tell us to wait before making judgment after the massacre at Fort Hood? Where are the media kid gloves? Why the rush to judgment?
Good point--although it's better understood as "commit murder".
'Thou shall not kill'...'Thou shall not murder'...
have different meanings...My Bible say's 'Thou shalt not kill'...
I have discussed the 'kill'...'murder' issue with Christians many times...
Christians tell me that the Bible is the word of God...They further tell me that I can trust it, and every word in it...
Then other Christians tell me that the real meaning is not 'kill', but 'murder'...So the second group are telling me that My Bible does not mean what it says, it means something else...and you have to go back to original writings to get 'murder'...But how do I know that the original writer/translator had it right? What I get out of this is, that if God Almighty wanted my Bible to say 'Thou shalt not murder'...That's what it would say...
As expected, my local rag weighed in with an editorial equsting the Hutaree with Islamic terrorist groups. To make the equation, the writer had to ignore several considerations.
First, numbers. The number of Hutaree arrested amounted to nine. That's out of a population of at least 250 million American Christians (many of them only nominally so, I realize). Talk about a tiny minority! Meanwhile, Islamic terrorist gangs can recruit several times that number from just the few tens of thousands of Twin Cities Somalis. In other words, the chance of a Moslem becoming a terrorist is about 1 in 1,000; the chance of a Christian doing so is about 1 in 28,000,000.
Second, numbers again. How many victims did the Hutaree claim? None. How many victims have "Christian terrorists" claimed in the last 10 years? You can count the number on one hand, if you consider the killings of a few abortionists as the acts of Christian terrorists. How many victims of Islamic terrorists? Thousands, and even leaving out the 9/11 murders, hundreds. Here I'm considering only the U.S.
Third, terminology. "Hutaree" is a made-up word, without any Christian connotations at all. It appears nowhere in the New Testament, nor in the writings of the Church Fathers, nor the Church Councils, nor in the writings of any of the theologians. "Jihad" on the other hand, is a term which fills pages of the Koran and other Moslem writings.
RE: just war
a Christian when ordered by the state to kill, as in declared war, may. this is following the extended understanding of the command to honor one's father and mother, i.e. those in authority.
the Christian, however,is not to be so gleeful as to think "now I have license to go forth and kill." the Christian, in a state of repentance goes forth in war, and kills knowing that he/she may be delivering someone to Hell, should they not believe in the LORD of All the Living.
the Christian, otherwise, does not have permission to kill. but the state may grant that right as in "Make My Day."
the Christian is to attempt to live at peace with neighbor, even though neighbors may not have that understanding.
the Muslim is not guided so by Imams who demand, quoting various texts, that the adherent follow the despicable example of temperance found in Muhammad.
KB --
You are taking Jesus' words out of CONTEXT! Context is the key to Jesus' words.
You mentioned Matthew 10:34: "Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword."
Jesus is speaking about the divisions that will come, even among family members, over their belief or lack of belief about Him. In that respect, He has come to bring division. This context is also related in Luke 12:51: "Do you think I came to bring peace on earth? No, I tell you, but division."
Jesus is preparing the disciples for His departure. He is telling them that they will need to provide for themselves and even protect themselves. Up to that time, everything they had needed had been provided. But, after the crucifixion and ascension, they would again be "on their own." They would need to work, provide for their families, and, if need be, protect their own; hence, the mention of the sword. Of course, the Bible teaches that Christians are to be peaceful, loving, and forgiving; however, it also teaches that we are not required to sit idly by when persecuted unrighteously.
Jesus did not contradict Himself. When we look at His words in CONTEXT, then we can see what He was saying and that there is no contradiction at all.
"By the way I do not think the Hutaree are Christian."
I concur, Craniac! ...no way are they Christians. Jesus condemns this types of evil plots.
Do all who responded to the newest idiocy retched out by Kegner - the mohammedan zombie, really believe he hasn't heard your retort before in other places? Why of course he had and you know it! And do you really believe it will prevent him from flashing the "question" again and again in the future? So why in the world do you provide the pabulum to that IQ-less mohammedan troll? Don't you have better things to do?
You could watch the telly, feed the dog, have a drink or egg and bacon or throw darts at the image of mohammed...
As I wrote on the other thread (Belgium/Burqa) ..."ignore that mohammedan ninny who lacks even the most basic wits to meaningfully assemble the soundbits he has plagiarized.
Encapsulate the imbecile in a sound-proof burqa, so his simian howling won't be heard outside of it."
Happy Easter and Sweet Pesach everyone!
Something smells way off on this story since it broke. I haven't figured it out yet because they are keeping so much from us in terms of actual facts.
"You could watch the telly, feed the dog, have a drink or egg and bacon or throw darts at the image of mohammed..."
hahaha! ...yeah but I hate to watch television: B.O.R.I.N.G., and we no longer have a dog; but I do love bacon 'n eggs! ...yum!
Note to self: buy darts
Happy Easter, Thomas_h :)
You're right - television is (mostly) boring.
Still, having a choice of watching TV and hoping to establish true and sincere communication with a mohammedan liar one should always choose TV. However, if the choice is between watching the TV and having the fun of kicking the mohammedan butt then, of course, TV must wait.
I too share your fondness of eggs and bacon. I even affixed a slice of it to the image of mohammed, right on his forehead - he doesn't seem to mind.
If you should forget to buy darts you can always use shoes. Mohammed on my wall has a large imprint of the sole of my (left) hiking boot across his face. The sole and bacon slice really make him look smashing.
Happy Easter to you and yours, my friend!
....hahaha! :-D
Oh, Ebonystone, all those numbers. They're just so confusing, especially to today's generation of "journalists" whose schooling apparently didn't include logic and the quantitative arts. It's the concept that's important. A dollar in your pocket is exactly the same as one-million dollars in the bank, don't you see, because both involve "dollars." In exactly the same way, a Christian "Extremist" is no different from an Islamic "Extremist" because the focus is on the term Extremist, not on messy irrelevancies that involve metrics and other such confusing concepts.
I agree with you. I sensed that something wasn't quite right when I read the first article. Journalism has gone completely to the dogs and they don't even apologise or issue retractions anymore when they screw up, which is every day. The corrupt, biased mainstream media will go out of their way to make Christianity look bad and muslims look pitiful and persecuted, and they will sensationalize the story with their own biased opinions and factoids. They do not care about the truth; 90% of the journalists in America are propagandists for the Obama administration and the democrat party.
It has become so bad that I cannot bear to listen to any of them any more. I used to force myself to watch Katie Couric every evening so I could honestly say I got some of my "news" from a liberal source. No more. I get so upset I could scream and what irks me the most is the false sincerity with which she presents her version of current events. I sit there and fill in the blanks with the facts that are skillfully omitted to change the entire character of the stories. It is revolting! Fox News is far from perfect but you'll get more truth there than anywhere else. But even the most outspoken, candid people at Fox draw the line at telling the truth about islam, if they know the truth. I'm beginning to feel like a paranoid lunatic, afraid to believe anything I hear until I can verify that it's true.
Ibn Warraq, the author of "Defending the West" writes that self-criticism is one of the most endearing characteristics of the West, of both Christians and Atheists nowadays. It is in part the cause of Political Correctness and Multi Culturalism, which is now so outrageously overdone, and it has to do with the Golden Rule; Do not do to(so also do not talk about) others what you do not want them to do to you.
This, according to Ibn Warraq is totally absent in Islamic culture.
When I was very young and I heard 2 people talk I naturally assumed that the one who never admitted he was wrong was right and the one admitting his own mistakes and conceding numerous points to the other talker, was wrong. Now I much more appreciate the honest and openminded "mistake-admitters" + "point-conceders".
I like the West so much more than Islam in part or largely because of the "righteousness", rigidity, stupid stubbornness, closed-mindedness of so many of Islams followers.
Will these "unlawful combatants" be consigned en masse to Gitmo or "waterboarded"?
Terry
My one hope and prayer is that they will get better lawyers than Rifqa Bary. And if just one of the lawyers chronicles the scope of Jihad activity versus what this tiny group has done, then maybe a small light will be shined on the truth for just a moment. Wishful thinking huh?
duh_swami, but the rub that the differences are due to the translation.
I do not speak ancient Hebrew, nor Aramaic, nor ancient Greek. A bit of ecclesiastical Latin perhaps.
PIMF! Should read "the rub is"
Happy Easter Champ, Izzy, DDA, Robert, and to all Christian JWers!
And as always,
لن استسلم
ABS
From a poster above:
"One of Obamas (sic) advisers has stated that any American that owns a gun should be put on the "no fly list." As a potential terrorist."
Do you have a link perhaps?
Machiavelli 101.
I've always had a theory regarding what seems to be Westerners' compulsive,seemingly, politically radical-oriented, killing of innocent people. I think that groups (or individuals) like this Hutaree are people who already have a criminal background. They work in cahoots with special government surveillance forces like the FBI and the CIA. Even though the police officers were really killed, this ordeal was staged to make it appear as if this white Christian "radical" group is on a rampage. They inevitably target the group-- muslims ----which is in the center-stage area of religious, racial and cultural odds with the majority of Western-minded people. The motive for this particular incident is that this radical group of killers become the "spoilers" for those of us who truly want peace.As we can now see, they become the symbol of how bad white Christians are, so that our government officials can proliferate more chaoas and polarization. This furthers the New World Order plan, ultimately.
I think that historically, numerous murders and assassinations have been committed to throw citizens off the path of who the real enemies are, which is usually the government/governing powers. Then the government uses the civil warfare for its own advantage.
Eliza, whatever it is you're smoking, I want some, too!
Hi ...Happy Easter, Drew! :)
Happy Easter 2 All!
LOL! I really think this way naturally. I don't put anything past centralized institutions of power. Must be in my Mediterranean blood.
OK some Christian's who posted in this thread have got it all Wrong, (that's BUG and Kegner)
"Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I came to set a man against his father," according to the Bible, Jesus said that
You will have to re-read your Old Testament and the New Testament as well.
Our Lord is describing the effects of his Gospel, where some (even close) members of the community take his message, and of those members (say 10 persons) receive His Word, (and 5 of them do not) this is important! It is His Word which is accepted or rejected, those who accept His Word are saved from Judgement, John 5 - 24, those who do not accept it are liable to Judgement, by His Word, which is the "Glittering Two Edged Sword which is polished and sharpened for slaughter" Ezekiel 21:8-10 this same Sword is called "The Word of God" in Revelations 19:15 - 21, throughout history both in Judaism and Christianity, this is the "Holy Spirit" and "Word of God". This title is not the only one, "Holy Spirit" gives identity, "The Counsellor" gives his activity, but so as we know that when Christ speaks of a "sword" it is this "Third Person of the Blessed Trinity" whom he is so passionate to introduce into the World, because it is his portion to Judge everyone who refuses to believe in Christ, and in God who sent him, and his Gospel. The Criteria by which a man is judged is the Mosaic Law, even if he is a Muslim, or an Atheist, because unless a man is open to the promptings of the Holy Spirit, he can not come to an understanding of the Kingdom of God, or of the Majesty of Christ.
What Joy then we should have when we see with our own eyes the Judgement meted out to Muhammad in the world to come, and all those who have exalted themselves above God.
Now it is common to Catholic tradition that we believe that the Holy Spirit can Judge the living as well as the dead, and as one who though living has been Judged, I can assure you this Judgement is not like any human Judgement where you see the angry face, or the smiling face of some gentle dignitary, this Judge is impersonal to you, He is a Living Sword, terrible to behold, and his very words bring utter dread, His appearance is wonderful but stark, and He is Power, a bright nuclear light emanates from him, then he will address you "Who are you to stand before me and darken my counsel" and believe me, if you are standing before him it is because there must be a case against you. He is the "Wrath to come".
Now can you as a Christian, escape this Judgement, Yes you can.
Now can you as an atheist or a Muslim or a Jew escape this judgement, No you can't, but you can be lucky, would you chance it though!
Yes, McVeigh again! This is getting old.
There's more to it then simply the fact that McVeigh never acted in the name of christianity, and something JW (i.e.Spencer and Fitzgerald) never seems to mention. Jayna Davis six years ago in "The Third Terrorist" established a strong connection with Palestinian and Iraqi elements in the planning and execution of the Oklahoma City bombing in 1995. She clearly shows that the FBI suppressed and buried such evidence of a Middle Eastern connection.
So, we it seems we may have had an early example of "sudden Jihad syndrome". But why hasn't JW run with this information?
Craniac, we're probably on the same page, mostly, but being a Christian doesn't mean you don't do dumb--or even sinful--things. I was taught that the church of Christ is a hospital for sinners rather than a museum to show off finished saints.