"When we die as shaheeds we'll go to paradise"

Roger that...

"Hitler would be so proud of these young kids dreaming of a jew free palastine. So much like his own hitler youth. ..."

Words from the monsters own mouth:

"You see, it's been our misfortune to have the wrong religion. Why didn't we have the religion of the Japanese, who regard sacrifice for the Fatherland as the highest good? The Mohammedan religion too would have been much more compatible to us than Christianity. Why did it have to be Christianity with its meekness and flabbiness?"

(Albert Speer reports in his memoirs of a statement made by Hitler).

Perhaps speer may get his and Hitler's wish after all. Germany has a huge and growing muslim population. I wonder what the germans will do when these muslims eventually demand a seperate muslim german homeland, aka Kosovo?

Desi,

Just to clarify a point: Please don't allow anyone to put Albert Speer in the same category with Adolph Hitler. That he served his evil master well there's no doubt, but he was anything but a devout Nazi. In the quote referenced, he was quoting Hitler, not stating his own views. I'm not making this distinction to defend Speer any more than he defended himself. He confessed his guilt and served his 20-year sentence to the day.

Anyone with an historical interest in the hot-house that was Hitler's regime would do well to read his book, from which that quote was lifted...

G

Oh can your Muslim al-Taqiyya BS. No one here is buying it.

Honestly, Muhakh, I never wanted to "know well" about islam. But islam forced me to what knowledge I have. And what I "know well" about it turns my stomach. I've heard it all before from better liars than you, sir.

You may be a well-intentioned person--if so, consider leaving islam and joining the civlized world--then you won't have to apologize for that which no apology can suffice...

I imagine you sitting at your computer with a big creepy smile on your face as you LIE through your keystrokes.

Point taken, but still the same he served Hitler well, he believed in Hitler, and I am sure many of the things believed by Hitler were also what he believed.

Had the Hitler won the war, he would have kept serving him until death. He would still have been in his inner circle of friends. But unfortunately for him, Hitler lost. He spilled his guts at Nuremberg and served his time. To save face he wrote books. I am sure he whitewashed many of his own views so that history won't judge him too harshly. I am not sure to call that cowardice or a little bit of honesty on his part. Either way my original comment stands.

Desi,

Pretty dicey affair, predicting alternate history.
But you're entitled to your opinion and I to mine. Fair enough, & I won't contaminate the thread by arguing it further--we have this little jihad-thing to focus-on...

Regards,

G

You wrote, " you will know that Islam ordered us to be peaceful with peaceful people and don't start a war but when anyone attacks us we must defend for ourselves, our land or our kins ,and if you die defending for yourself,your land or your kins you are "shaheed" which means martyr"

What a joke. What did the Muslims, including Muhammad do with the peaceful Jews, Christians, North Africans, Persians, Assyrians, Afghans, and Indians among others? Their lands were invaded, their men killed, their riches stolen, and their women and children taken as slaves or concubines. All done by you’re so called peaceful Muslims.

Know Islam? We have lived with islam for over 1000 years in India. When I go back to visit I am reminded of the "peacefulness" of your filthy prophet and religion by the numerous Muslims I see. The old Muslims with red colored beards, the muslimahas walking around in tents, numerous poor filthy Muslim children, the dead goats hanging in outdoor stalls, curfews, strikes, eid, and so on. I am often disgusted by such sights. I often wonder how better India would have been had that old fool Gandhi let the Muslims all go to Porkiestan, instead of welcoming them to stay in India. To stay and breed like rats, to claim disappropiate share of the economic wealth, to get all the benefits of being in a secular democracy while supporting a foreign religion and culture that would strangle it.

Know Islam? Believe me we know it well. We had over 1000 of Islam and that’s 1000 years too many.

"Ask yourselves ,and think well before speaking .
God be with you and peace be upon you."

Oh, and what a nice "pious" ending to your string of lies ...

Muhakh2 avers that "Islam orders us to be peaceful with peaceful people." The Jews of Khaybar, whose menfolk were slaughtered and their leader, Kinana, burned alive because he refused to reveal where the Jews' treasure was hidden, were farmers, attacked by Muhammed and his band of Muslims without provocation. There was, of course, a pretext - thugs often have a pretext for their aggression. But the real reason for Muhammed's vicious attack was because the Khaybar Jews were easy prey; before the ruination of Khaybar, Muhammed and his cohorts had had plenty of practice honing their skills in pillage, enslavement, and murder, specializing in attacking the caravans of the Quraysh and others, whose only offense was that they were not Muslim.
But to truly give the lie to Muhakh's claim, we need only turn to one of my favorite hadiths, one which is quite well-known, oft-quoted by Muslims themselves, and which appears in Article 7 of the Hamas charter - to wit, that of Sahih Muslim, Book 41, No. 6985:
Judgment Day will come only when the Muslims fight the Jews and kill them, until the Jew hides behind the tree and the stone, and the tree and the stone say: O Muslim, O servant of Allah, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him -except for the gharqad tree, which is the tree of the Jews.

The message here should be clear - Islam mandates the annihilation of all Jews. How peaceful, indeed.

you said "'m not lying and these words which I told you are the words which I learnt from the mosque,the Islamic TV channels and my parents.So,If you don't want to believe me , you are free but I'm not lying because my religion which I'm so proud of orders me to tell the truth anyway"

Very nice you show your ignorance, it's very much like someone saying he learned all about Christianity from the church, television, and his parents. and now he is 100% sure it's correct.

How can you be sure that islam is correct? You have obviously never cracked open that filthy book, the Koran and read it's tripe filled boring pages. Well you moron, do what I and other people have done, read the Koran, this Koran has all you need to know about Islam. Don't take the sugar coated Islam from your parents, nor the white washed version from the mosque and TV. Read that damn book, with the full knowledge that this was supposed to be the true letter by letter book from a god. Read the mind numbing pages, soak in it's illogical assumptions about the world. it's violent and hate filled passages. the absurdities and the stupidities. This book isn't from god it's the second hand raving of a violent blood crazed thug called Muhammad. All those ravings were collected and mixed together and thrown together to make this Koran after the over timely death of Muhammad.

For further info see ali sina's site Faithfreedom int. Look over the archives of this site also. Come back when you are more educated.

I agree that not all muslims are terrorists, but why then are most terrorists muslims? Come on, I am not a muslim, and even I know the answer to that one: the koran. This unholy book is nothing more than a manual for murder, and you know it.

Have you ever bothered reading Robert Spencer's book, The Truth About Muhammad? If not, then I suggest that you do, ASAP. It's shocking how many muslims come on this forum and defend islam and muhammad, when they've never taken the time to research the evil life of muhammad (perdition is upon him). And your comment about Israel also reveals that you are a liar. Shut up, they are not terrorists. Grow a brain why dontcha.

desidude

I'd say he knows, he knows.

'Peaceful' non-Muslims, in Islamspeak, are Infidels who meekly convert to Islam as soon as they are 'invited' to do so, or who unresistingly and unquestioningly submit to the near-slave status of dhimmitude, stripped of all their human rights within a Muslim sharia despotism. That, you see, is 'freedom'; anyone who prefers their own non-Muslim faith and their own political and social arrangements, as against the state of spiritual, mental and political enslavement that obtains under sharia, is seen as being a 'slave' to 'man'; in Islam, to 'liberate' a person or a region is to force a person to submit to 'allah', which means, in practice, to be the subject of whichever morals-free Muslim dictator happens to be in charge in their neighbourhood, or indeed, of the local Muslim warlord, sharia-pushing gang boss, etc.

Anyone who criticises Islam, anyone who refuses to become a Muslim when he or she is told that he must become a Muslim, and anyone who refuses to become a dhimmi, and anyone who fights back to defend him or herself when Muslims attack, is an 'enemy' of Islam, a 'terrorist', and is blamed for the war that the poor, poor Muslims are thus **compelled** to wage in order to either drive him from his territory, exterminate him, or force him to become either a Muslim or a dhimmi.

http://www.jihadwatch.org/2006/07/islamic-dictionary-for-infidels.html
Islamic Dictionary for Infidels

The article quotes German-Syrian Muslim scholar, Bassam Tibi, on jihad, war, peace, etc:

According to Tibi,

"world peace, the final stage of the da'wa (call to embrace Islam), is reached only with the conversion or submission of all mankind to Islam…

"Muslims believe that expansion through war is not aggression but a fulfillment of the Qur'anic command to spread Islam as a way to peace.

"The resort to force to disseminate Islam is not war (harb), **a word that is used only to describe the use of force by non-Muslims** {my emphasis - dda}.

“Islamic wars are not hurub (the plural of harb) but rather futuhat, acts of "opening" the world to Islam and expressing Islamic jihad.

“Relations between dar al-Islam, the home of peace, and dar al-harb, the world of unbelievers, nevertheless take place in a state of war, according to the Qur'an and to the authoritative commentaries of Islamic jurists.

"**Unbelievers who stand in the way, creating obstacles for the da'wa, are blamed for this state of war**{my emphasis - dda}, for the da'wa can be pursued peacefully if others submit to it.

"In other words, those who resist Islam cause wars and are responsible for them."

A bit later on, the author of the article explains:

'Islamic apologists in the West keep repeating the mantra that "Jihad isn't a fight against non-Muslims, but a struggle against tyranny and injustice."

'Again, the problem is that seen with Islamic eyes, there isn't too much of a difference between these various terms.

;It's "oppression"
when Muslim immigrants in the West must live by the same, secular laws as the native infidels, not sharia,

'and "injustice" in the end refers to pretty much all societies not subjugated to obedience to the will of Allah.

"Injustice"
can thus be used to describe all non-Islamic systems, for instance Western democracy.

'The Saudi deputy minister of religious endowments, Abd Al-Rahman Al-Matroudi, stated in an interview on Saudi TV in July 2005 that "the definition of terrorism that concerns us is that it is **any act or statement that contradicts the Koran or Sunna, whether in thought or action** {my emphasis - dda}."

'He also said that Muslims should "impose their culture," and that
peaceful ways should be pursued only when they were not strong enough to do this:

"If you are strong enough to defend yourself, you must do so...Host: and impose your culture...Al-Matroudi: Yes, and impose your culture. Host: Great. '

...

"it is not seen as aggression or war when Muslims attack non-Muslims.

'On the contrary, it is seen as aggression when non-Muslims resist the Islamization of their lands and thus "place obstacles in the way" of the spread of Islam.

'They are defying the will of Allah.

'Since subjugation to Islam alone can bring peace, Muslims consider themselves to be "spreading peace" when they raid, maim and kill from Europe to Central Asia."...

'Peace: "Peace" in Islam equals submission to the will of Allah through his divine and eternal law, sharia, and the extension of the Dar al-Islam – or 'House of Islam' – to cover the entire world.

'The absence of sharia is the absence of peace.

'Since it is the will of Allah that Islam will rule the entire planet,
entering non-Muslim lands to subjugate the population and wipe out their corrupt, infidel culture is not seen by Muslims as "waging war," but as spreading peace.

'Freedom: Hurriyya, freedom, means freeing all people from being slaves of the laws of men

'and making them live in perfect slavery, in submission to the will of Allah and his laws. {which is, in practice, their subjection to cruel, capricious, hair-trigger-tempered and downright murderous Muslim overlords and the Mohammedan mob – dda}.

...

"Aggression: When non-Muslims do anything to preserve their culture and resist the Islamization of their country.

'Even when this "aggression" is non-violent, such as publishing a cartoon critical of Islam, this intolerable insult to Islamic supremacy on earth can be answered with violence by Muslims.

'Since a refusal to submit to sharia is a rebellion against Allah, the very existence of non-Muslim communities can be viewed as an act of aggression."

END QUOTE.

Now, go back up and re-read Muhakh's first posting...it will sound very, very different.

This is all true, but you must remember that many Muslims are every ignorant to the specifics of their own religion. Fist of all they can't read the Koran in their own languages so they rely on the mullahs and parents for what Islam is about. Second they can't question any aspect of Islam. The brainwashing begins from birth, they are taught Islam is the right religion, Islam gives women rights, and Islam is peace and so on. Many Muslims specially the women are taught the white washed Islam. The Muslims don't feel women need to know about the real Islam of jihad and dieing for Allah. They need them to produce babies. Why do so many Muslims become ex Muslims when they do find out the truth? Because they have been lied to for all their lives. They have been lied to by the mullahs, their parents, and their friends.
So if this mukah2 is an Islamic snake lying through his teeth we can tell, if not he needs to be educated to what his religion really say.

Why are the Arab residents of Gaza used as human shields by Hamas?

London Jim, I think you are absolutely right. The show host said that this man was a devout Catholic? Hardly. A devout Catholic doesn't suddenly embrace Islam and realize that Smite the necks of the unbelievers" and "Kill the Jews where you find them" is compatible with "Love your neighbor as yourself". There's something very fishy about the good father's exclamations. I wonder what it is that he did against his faith and against his soul that lead him on the path to Islam.

"...words which I told you are the words which I learnt (sic) from the mosque, the Islamic TV channels and my parents."

Right. Lies. Utter and complete lies. You brainwashed Muslim fool.

NO - YOU'RE wrong. Get it, Barbarian?

desidude adduces the "many (or most?) Muslims don't know Islam" defense.

Let's parse it out and analyze it:

many Muslims are every ignorant to the specifics of their own religion

a) How does desidude know this?

b) How many is "many Muslims"? Is that "many" numerous enough and widespread enough around the world to make a difference to our #1 priority, the safety of our own societies?

c) What are these "specifics"? Can Muslims be ignorant of certain "specifics" but still be dangerous to us? Yes: because outside of the Koran, through various sources in their Islamic societies, they have imbibed the more important worldview of Islam -- hatred and paranoia of the Other + intolerance of the Other's laws + a deranged eschatology = a deadly psychological and sociological cocktail.

Fist of all they can't read the Koran in their own languages so they rely on the mullahs and parents for what Islam is about.

a) And their mullahs and parents don't inculcate in them all that's necessary to breed dangerous fanatics?

b) Those aren't the only two sources of extra-Koranic deformation of Muslims. To mullahs and parents can be added multiple public sources of individuals and groups who engage in public harangues in the marketplace as well as in small groups in cafes, in public rooms of local mosques, in Islamic "cultural centers", etc. -- not to mention the Internet.

The brainwashing begins from birth

Brainwashing by whom? desidude is assuming that a tiny minority of Islamic "Elites" are responsible for all the mass demonstrations, mass riots, mass fanaticism we see on a regular basis around the world, in addition to all the violent fanaticism we see Muslims plunge into on a regular basis. Thus, desidude is straining credulity to try to relocate the blame for all this mass fanaticism on a tiny few, when the blame should be on the Muslim masses.