Now we know why his vaunted academic findings just happened to whitewash the role of Islamic texts and teachings in encouraging suicide bombings and other violence. "CAIR, Academic Scheme to Inflate Book Sales," from IPT News, October 6:
University of Chicago political scientist Robert Pape, whose research finds religious extremism has a limited role in suicide bombings, is working secretly with a suspected Hamas front to pump up sales of his new book, the Investigative Project on Terrorism has learned. That includes a secret agreement by CAIR to have its chapters around the country to buy them in bulk so they can manipulate the sales to move up the bestseller ranks. Pape is also scheduled to appear at this weekend's national banquet for the Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR)Cutting the Fuse: The Explosion of Global Suicide Terrorism and How to Stop It, is Pape's latest project touting his thesis that religion is not a prime factor in suicide bombings. Rather, it is a response to occupation, he argues.
That's appealing to CAIR, which court records show was part of a Hamas-support network in the United States. Prosecutors say CAIR, which touts itself as the nation's leading Muslim civil rights organization, never withdrew from the conspiracy to support Hamas politically and financially. And the FBI cut off communication with CAIR in 2008, saying it won't resume until "we can resolve whether there continues to be a connection between CAIR or its executives and HAMAS."
Emails reviewed by the Investigative Project on Terrorism show Pape reached out to CAIR this past summer, hoping to have the Hamas-front group buy 1,000 advanced copies of his new book. Pape asserted in his emails and other communications to CAIR that the book would advance and reinforce CAIR's ideological views that it is the occupation of Arab lands that causes suicide bombings. CAIR's officials responded with enthusiasm to Pape's thesis and to his proposal for bulk purchases to artificially boost his rankings into the best seller lists.
"Pre-orders are especially helpful," Pape wrote on his University of Chicago email account, "because they allow the press to increase the advertising for the book when it is published, and so help to build momentum for the message in the book -- that ending Western occupation of Muslim countries is the best path for reducing the spread of suicide terrorism."
Pape did not respond to an email seeking comment. CAIR's national banquet is scheduled for Saturday evening outside Washington, D.C. In a release, CAIR says Pape will be on hand promoting his book. The release says Pape will participate in a workshop on "Challenging Islamophobia" and quotes CAIR Executive Director Nihad Awad:
"This groundbreaking new book offers a powerful educational tool to be used in challenging Islamophobia that is based on the false linkage between Islam and suicide terrorism."...
The whole of academia is paralysed by self-loathing Political Correctness and Dhimmitude.
...and another thing, if suicide bombing is a response to kuffar occupation of Muslim lands, why did they try to bomb the Strasbourg Christmas market, which was shown in a video with one of the Muslims saying that the passers-by were the "enemies of God" and would burn in hell? http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4102023.stm
They kill because they are mindless robotic clones of a psychopath. No further explanation is necessary.
Booksellers do not take kindly to this type of stuff. They consider these types one step below self-publishers.
I'm surprised he's not hitting the higher-ed textbook marketers up.
Robert Pape is dispensing the usual academic BS.
"Rather, it is a response to occupation, he argues."
Isn't that what Pat Buchanan argues, too? How can they be so ignorant?
I wonder how far has the tentacles of the saudi jihad money has reached into our educational institutions?
Everything a pious Mahoundian does is Islamocentric...
When a Shia suicide bomber blows up Sunni's in a marketplace, or the other way around, what 'occupation' is causing it?
What US or Israeli policy is responsible for that?
The Mahoundians do not view these as suicides, they are acts of martyrdom for Allah...not suicides for 'occupation'...there is no god called 'occupation' to martyr over, that would be haram and blasphemy...
I just wrote Robert a lengthy piece on just where the money is coming from. Go to the Carnegie Corporation's grant page and you'll see where the money is coming from.
University of Chicago political scientist Robert Pape, whose research finds religious extremism has a limited role in suicide bombings, is working secretly with a suspected Hamas front to pump up sales of his new book...
...............
An alliance made in Hell. Unfortunately, Pape's absurd message is one a lot of people will want to hear, since they find the truth too disturbing to deal with...
Here's Pape's interview with The American Conservative, where he expounds on his ludicrous thesis:
"The Logic of Suicide Terrorism"
http://www.amconmag.com/article/2005/jul/18/00017/
His claim that we were actually "occupying" Saudi Arabia is especially ridiculous.
Pape's theory gains traction if you believe the myth that jihad began around the time America sent troops to Iraq, Afghanistan etc..
However, wars of jihad were being fought 850 years before America was discovered! So, why blame the USA for an ideology that's been killing and maiming its enemies for 1,350 years?
Therefore, what makes anyone think that withdrawing troops from these countries would mean an automatic end to the ideology of jihad?
This reminds me of the mendacious Paul de Man who wrote collaborationist tracts for the Nazis during the Second World War. De Man’s deconstructionist ideas looked very self-serving after his pro Nazi work was revealed. Surprise! Human nature remains the same.
Further, it is just pathetic that Pape did not disabuse his supporters of the notion that his work might reach the best-seller list when so few academic works ever get there. The best-seller list usually contains dreck anyway; and the list isn't improved when still worse dreck reaches it from the halls of academe.
You might as well ask whose money greased the way for the lazy, hostile, drug-addled, and academically inept Barack Hussein Obama to get his Ivy League "education."
So today we learn that two suicide bombers kills 7, wounds 65 at a Sufi shrine in Karachi.
This along with other suicide attacks on mosques and religious rallies....
Suicide blast at Pakistan mosque kills 1 - Sep 2010
Suicide attack kills 15 at mosque in Pakistan's Waziristan - Aug 2010
Suicide attack on Pakistan mosque - Jul 2010
Suicide attackers kill dozens at Ahmadi mosques - May 2010
Suicide bomber kills 57 in Pakistan at a Shiite Muslim rally - Apr 2010
Pakistan Rawalpindi mosque suicide attack kills many - Dec 2009
Suicide bomber kills 30 at Pakistan Sunni mosque - Jun 2009
Suicide bomber kills 24 at Shia mosque in Pakistan
Scores killed by Pakistan mosque bomb - Mar 2009
Teen suicide bomber kills 9 in crowded Pakistan Shiite mosque
50 killed by suicide bomber at Pakistan mosque in failed bid to murder minister - Dec 2007
....begs the question to Mr. Pape: if one is angry at foreign occupation, oppression, injustice, whatever (perceived or not), why on earth go blow yourself up in a mosque?
The Carnegie Foundation has been doling out money to Bright Young Musilm Reformers, those who will lead us out of that "clash of civilizations" by pretending that there is no such clash, that Qur'an and Hadith and Sira (in ascending order of violence and aggression) do not contain what they do contain, do not naturally inculcate the attitudes, and lead to the observable behavior, that they do inculcate, and that does lead to that behavior.
Vartan Gregorian, with his dreamy view of childhood Tabriz,and his confusion of Iran under the (relatively advanced, because secular Shah and the Shah's regime), got the ball rolling, and it's been continued under others. I wonder what Andrew Carnegie would think of this extraordinary use, and abuse, of his charity.
Here are some of those previous mentions of the Carnegie Foundation -- it has not gone unnoticed here:
July 9, 2007:
“I don't know if Gerges has gotten on the gravy train of government and foundation grants to study, or promote, the "reform of Islam" that he and others, eager for the same grant money, keep talking about. Perhaps his television retainer, and other fees, are enough. But in Fawaz Gerges' case, I doubt it. No, I'm sure some "reforming Islam” grant money (Vartan Gregorian's Carnegie Foundation? Or some other innocent, shelling out the dough?) has gone, is going, or will go his, Fawaz Gerges', way.”
May 20, 2006:
How could anyone today who knows anything about Islam and the umma believe those Muslims living in the West who are good at being given grants by the Carnegie Foundation and others for various "reforming Islam" projects, when they explain that that they are indeed working on "reform" but without ever explaining how they think the Muslim masses could ever accept a reworking of the Hadith, so that many of those classified as "authentic" by al-Bukhari and Muslim would now be demoted and classified as "inauthentic"? It can't be done.
July 9, 2007:
“I don't know if Gerges has gotten on the gravy train of government and foundation grants to study, or promote, the "reform of Islam" that he and others, eager for the same grant money, keep talking about. Perhaps his television retainer, and other fees, are enough. But in Fawaz Gerges' case, I doubt it. No, I'm sure some "reforming Islam” grant money (Vartan Gregorian's Carnegie Foundation? Or some other innocent, shelling out the dough?) has gone, is going, or will go his, Fawaz Gerges', way.”
July 10, 2010:
That Jihad, however, is based, let it be emphasized, not on an "interpretation" of Islam that can be changed, but on the immutable text of the Qur'an, and the Hadith that more than a millennium ago were studied, and winnowed. What remained was assigned different ranks of "authenticity" by those deemed to be the most authoritative muhaddithin, such as Al-Bukhari and Muslim. This can't be undone, not by Bright Young Muslim Reformers who keep getting grants from the American government and the Carnegie Foundation, or who keep getting hired and promoted on the basis of their entirely factitious achievements in this line.
-An excellent post. I can’t fathom the islamic mind – even though I’m on my third reading of the Qur’an.
For the each link you put up, the headline for the story could read:
"(fill in the number) lazy Muslims killed in Suicide Bombing for failing at Jihad:
Stunned survivors exclaim:”We’re Muslim, what kind of Jihad is this?”"
What is crazy about Pape is his insistence that almost all of the suicide bombers of Hezbollah are "leftists" because his Arab informants tell him so, and by "leftist" he means that some may be members of this or that group with "Marxist" in the title. But long ago J. B. Kelly noted how superficial was the word "Marxist" when applied, or used, in the Arab context. For underneath one could still detect the substratum, more powerful than any "Marxism" which amounted to a thin veneer of fashionable attitudes, of Islam. And then, again because his Arab informants tell him so -- does anyone in his right mind trust this "social scientist's" methodology, when the very people who are supposed to be his field workers are themselves eager to make sure that his book says what would be most convenient for all Muslims and Arabs to have said -- to wit, that "Islam has nothing to do with suicide bombers."
And then there is the matter of a handful of Christians he claims are among those suicide bombers. Interesting, is it not, that this claim appears to be based on two things. The first is simply the name of the bomber, as if that necessarily reveals a Christian. And the revers is also true: there are those with Muslim-sounding names in the Middle East who are or were Christians or Jews. The Iraqi Jew who founded the famous Sassoon dynasty (whose members made their fortune in Bombay and Shanghai and Hong Kong, like the Kadoories, was named Abdallah Sassoon -- but that would have fooled Robert Pape, who has no idea about naming-days in the Middle East.
Furthermore, Pape seems obvlivious to the phenomenon of the islamochristian, particularly among those "left-wing" people, especially "Palestinian" Arabs -- see George Habash, head of the PFLP -- ooops, the supposedly "Marxist" PFLP -- who was in his viciousness always trying to prove himself, despite being nominally a "Christian" Arab, plus royaliste que le roi, that is more Islamic, in his anti-Israel hatred, than the Muslims themselves. It's perfectly understandable. Maronites and Copts, more numerous and more sure of themselves, are far less likely to produce "islamochristians" (and in the physical security of the Wsst prompter to throw off those attitudes that they had to adopt for protective coloration, when they still lived in a threatening Muslim sea).
All of this stuff escapes Pape. He's not very clever. And the company of murderers whom he is willing to cultivate and to keep, all in order to promote himself, disgusts absolutely.
I hope his behind-the-scenes efforts to get the likes of CAIR to buy his book, and promote him, comes to the attention of professional associations, of his colleagues at the Unversity of Chicago, of the Syndics at the University of Chicago Press, and to the President and of course to the Development Office, of the University of Chicago.
Alumni and potential donors should be alerted to Robert Pape and what he is all about, and make their views known, and make sure that those who might otherwise be on the receiving end of largesse are, instead, on the receiving end of something quite different. Moral appeals have so little effect as do those based on logic and evidence. But money, the withholding off....ah, that's a different story.
Unfortunately sir, I think that we have to say: “fat chance of that.” The Ivy League and their public counterparts have had lowered standards for years now. They have also been compromising professional integrity. In the Humanities in particular, they having been failing the society they were founded to serve. What Allan Bloom wrote in 1987 in his famous book; The Closing of the American Mind, is still largely true. That so many of the graduates of our schools do not see the dangers of Islam, is the result, in part, of the maladies Bloom discussed.
When will colleges and universities in this country dare to develop the character and the spirit of their students as well as their intellects? I don't think it is possible with a professoriate that will tolerate, and largely agree with, the likes of Dr. Pape.
Hello. Pape is not the only author who indicated factors other than religion is the driving force behind terrorism. Several US authors have clearly showed the same. David E Long wrote "anatomy of terrorism." The author of Raod to 911 said the same. More recently another author wrote the same in his book "The Righteous the fundamentalists and the terrorists." In this book he boldly uncovered the falsehood of Robert Spencer. All of you who suspect Robert Pape to be deviant are PARANOID PSYCHOPATHS.
Well can Cho, if there are factors other religious ones that account for terrorism, they aren't much in evidence in what we have seen from the Muslim world.
Mr. Spencer has made his case by using the words of the terrorists themselves to show how their themes are the echoes of themes found in the Qur'an as well as in other important Islamic books.
Thank you for the diagnosis though, I was wondering what path I was on.
I'll stay with the comparison between the contemporary world to the ancient one to reflect on how much human nature seems to be the same. When I do that, social science explanations for human behavior are interesting, but are a bit thin when put next to what the ancients already knew.
If you doubt me, read Thucydides; Xenophon; Polybius; Livy; Tacitus; Suetonius; and others.
While Muhammad may seem unique, he was much like autocrats and tyrants before him.
@can Cho.
Yes, can Cho, the opening sentence should read:" ...if there are factors other than religious ones that account for terrorism, they aren't much in evidence in what we have seen from the Muslim world."
I hate that when that happens. You've got me.
CAIR is the soft voice of Al Qaeda, Al Qaeda supports Hamas, CAIR supports Hamas, by their friends CAIR shall be judged.
Classicus Well. Go and read more. Much of the muslim world is recovering from the clutches of colonialism. the former colonial powers have not yet loosened their grip over much of the muslim majority states. you know you are GUILTY for looting the muslim world and invading the muslim majority states and occupying them,murdering muslims in thousands and leaving behind orphans and widows. it is natural for the people under occupation to fight back. there is not a single religious decree that allows suicide bombing. if muslims act on thier own accord do not blame the religion of Islam. You believe in Vodoo scholarship of your false messiah Robert Spencer the cunning clown. you PARANOID PSYCHOPATH YOU DO NOT HAVE A SHREAD OF FAIRNESS.
Good Heavens can Cho! You forgot to throw in China, India, Japan, Sub-Saharan Africa, Latin- America and the North American land mass.
I can’t tell you what a thrill it was to roll over the lesser peoples of the earth leaving in my wake, railways, roads, improved farming methods, public schools, communication infrastructure, new science, new mathematics, and advanced medicine........ Or, should I apologize for penicillin, the elimination of small pox, the polio vaccine, advances in heart surgery, desalination technology, and space travel, photography, cinema, and all those other things left in the wake of Western conquest. Would that make you happy?
Since I’m an Anglo-Frankish American, I really am upset about how the Romans brutalized my ancestors both in Gaul and Britannia as I enjoy the benefits of divided government, a military controlled by civilian authority, democracy, freedom of conscience, free inquiry, narrative history, drama, epic poetry, philosophy, and the codified rules of inference,….. I mean: What have the Romans ever done for my people?
If the Qur’an is the highest contribution of the Arab mind to humanity, I rate the Arabic number system and algebra far higher. Islam could disappear from the face of the earth tomorrow and humanity would have lost nothing.
You're right about that fairness thing though, I keep it smidgens rather than shreds.
Now, can Cho you're not going to let me have the last word are you? Are you? I'm becoming quite paranoid about it.
Your move. How is that for a smidgen of fairness?
classicus. No No i did not leave out india china. I thought it was understood. As a matter of fact these countries have substantial number of muslims. May i wake you up from the sweat dream of innovations of western mind benefitting the world populations. Well you know well the discovery of radio film and Penicillin was mere a chance. We the muslims have left impressions on those lands that we ruled. travel to spain and india look for those impressions. Dear Classicus I do not think your western cronies can erect a building like TAJMAHAL. Tell me if you interested to pay a visit to India to witness the marvels of engineering of muslim mind i will be happy to be your guide. i will take good care of you. If you take away the Qur'anic verses ingrained on TAJMAHAL the building will lose its glamour. You living in western world will have not worthy opponent if Qur'an is taken out of this world. Long live Qur'an
Classicus. Bible takes you back, Qur'an takes you forward. Dear Classicus rememer those days when prominant thinker was put to death years ago when he claimed sun centered universe by the dear Pope. Your religion has nothing i repeat nothing to do with the advances in sciences and technology. I mean nothing. On the other hand Qur'an is a book that brings science and religion to one platform. If you do not believe me ask the prominant gynecologist Dr. Moore from CANADA. Dear Classicus i will leave you with one reminder WHERE THERE IS CRUSADE THERE SHALL ( i did not use "will" ) BE JIHAD.
Ladies and gentlemen
in 'can cho' we have the invincible ignorance and boastful arrogance of the Muslim mind, on full display: strutting, glaring and boasting. Its attempt to sneeringly 'talk down' to another poster who has identified himself as conversant in three languages, a student of the classics, is the stuff of farce.
And note the reversal of reality by the Mohammedan.
It is the Bible that has taken people forward - to understand what I mean by that, see Tom Cahill, 'The Gifts of the Jews'; whereas the Muslim screeds, and the amoral monstrousness that is sharia, drags humanity backwards, and downwards, into an ever-deepening darkness, into physical desolation and intellectual and spiritual delusion.
Many people have at different times attempted to describe the disastrous effects of Islam upon human beings, and to societies, and to the earth itself.
Here is one attempt to sum up the effects of Islam, as they appear to sane, rational, decent non-Muslim observers:
Serge Trifkovic, in his book on Islam, 'The Sword of the Prophet', writes, on page 207, in a chapter entitled, “The Fruits”:
“The fruits of [Islam's] attempted escape from the shackles of natural morality are as predictable as they are grim, for the Muslims no less than for their victims: both are enslaved, brutalized and dehumanized by Islam.
"The all-pervasive lack of freedom is the hallmark of the Muslim world.
Discrimination against non-coreligionists and women of all creeds,
racism,
slavery,
virulent antisemitism,
and cultural imperialism
can be found – individually or in various combinations – in different cultures and eras.
"Islam alone has them all at once, all the time, and divinely sanctioned at that.”
"There is no presumed equality of different people’s claim to life, liberty or any pursuit at all in Islam.”
And here is another, longer essay on the same subject: the observable fruits of 'Islam-on-the-ground", Islam as practised, and how they appear to rational non-Muslims possessed of common sense and moral sense:
Father J L Menezes, a Catholic priest, had ample opportunity to see what Islam and Muslims were like, over many years spent in India. He wrote, in his book 'The Life and Religion of Mohammed', p. 140:
"The Mahommedan religion on the whole with all its dogmatic and moral principles, and with all its positive and negative laws has been a curse to human society.
"Mahommed pretended to confer by his religion a boon, at least on his own countrymen, by giving them in place of gross idolatry a purer faith, and surer moral habits, but in this attempt he has miserably failed and has hopelessly fallen into the very sin he so vehemently assailed.
"Mahommedanism has penetrated into barbarous countries and has forced its inhabitants to accept it as their saving religion, but in doing so it has not succeeded in elevating man’s condition to a higher level – or at least to a level any higher than that of Arabia in Mohammed’s time.
"The Partial and specious reforms which it may have attempted to effect, are vitiated by the fact that they tend to exclude the higher and nobler virtues;
"and as their inner life of families, the whole, the whole tone of society and the intellectual and moral standard of a people depend on the principles of the ruling religion,
"it is hopeless to expect that Islam will ever cease to be what it hitherto proved, the most formidable obstacle to the dawn of a progressive and enlightened civilization.
"How can it be otherwise?
"No permanent house can be built on a foundation of sand; what permanent civilization and progress then can be expected from a people professing a religion founded on fatalism, polygamy and slavery?
"Their blind belief in inevitable fate, and their antagonism to liberty of thought and action have rendered reform next to impossible;
"and the professors of this religion seem never to realize their obligation and duty towards the people under their rule, of spreading true civilization, good government and the cultivation of the peaceful arts.
"The natural consequence of this ignorance and blindness has been despotism, mal-administration, bigoted persecution and oppression of their co-religionists.
"In the countries of the Mahommedan world
"anarchy, rapine, revenge, strife and murder are the order of the day,
"thieving, lying, usury and oppression are looked upon more as virtues than vices;
"unrestrained licentiousness is carried to unimaginable excess.
"Dirt and filth are things that never come seriously before the attention of Mahommedans;
they seem indeed to prefer living in the most dirty and filthy environment.
"They are generally illiterate and at the same time self-conceited
"and their vainglory in their religion and the nothingness of their own acquirements makes them scorn every other religion;
"the meager education which they generally receive when young, makes them believe that there is not much left for them to learn in the world.
"In short, Mahommedan countries are the chosen homes of
"ignorance, bigotry, tyranny and brutal vice,
"and rendezvous for a filthy, unprincipled people, as well as for brigands, felons and freebooters.
"While all other countries not influenced by Islam have made rapid progress in every direction and enjoy the blessings and peace of true civilization,
"Mahommedan countries have remained absolutely opposed to change and reform;
"nay, rapacity and extortion have reduced them to a most deplorable state.
"Such is the boon conferred on human society by the Mahommedan religion, and what a benefactor Mahommed has been to his country!
"Who was pleased to give to his country, nay, to the whole world, a religion which,
"claiming a divine origin as the final and irrevocable standard of morality,
"has kept its followers sunk in ignorance and barbarism,
"and has become an insuperable barrier to the regeneration, civilization and progress of the Eastern world.”
He wrote that in 1912. Every word of it rings just as horribly true, today.
Ladies and gentlemen
the sneering Mohammedan told 'classicus' "Dear Classicus I do not think your western cronies can erect a building like TAJMAHAL. Tell me if you interested to pay a visit to India to witness the marvels of engineering of muslim mind"...
'I do not think your western cronies can erect a building like [the] Taj Mahal'.
ROFLMAO. The Taj Mahal is pretty, to be sure, but...
1. Parthenon.
2. Persepolis.
3. Colosseum - built by the Romans, centuries before Mohammed was born.
4. The Roman Aqueducts and Roman roads, ditto; and let us remember, too, that after the Muslims took North Africa, the existing Roman roads and other infrastructure disintegrated into ruin.
5. The Hagia Sophia, built at least 200 years before Mohammedanism was invented, and which is still standing, 1600 years later, despite earthquake and war and deliberate Mohammedan neglect and inshallah fatalism; and which is still hauntingly beautiful, at least as beautiful as, or more beautiful than, the Taj Mahal (which was probably designed by Hindus, and which was built by Hindu slave labour anyway; the only thing 'Muslim' about it is the fact that a Muslim despot commanded it to be built).
6. Chartres, Notre Dame de Paris, Cologne/ Koeln Cathedral, and the Duomo of Milan. Oh, and assorted Russian cathedrals. I think any one of these can stand beside the Taj Mahal without feeling in the least ashamed of itself.
7. St Paul's, London.
And if one moves beyond the West, then one can think of any number of staggeringly impressive buildings created by Hindus and Buddhists - Angkor Wat, and Borobudur (which was built long, long before Muslims arrived in Indonesia) are just two examples.
Much of what Muslims built anywhere they went would not have been built at all had they not had slave or dhimmi non-Muslim architects, and non-Muslim slaves or near-slave dhimmis to do the building - one thinks of the Europeans who were seized and enslaved and worked to death building mosques and forts and palaces for the wicked Muslim despots who ruled North Africa in the late middle ages and early modern period. Just as hundreds of thousands of non-Arab Muslims and non-Muslim labourers are worked - under appalling conditions, for little or no pay, defrauded and abused - in the Muslim states of the Arabian peninsula, such as Dubai, today. Take away all those non-Muslims who keep the place going - who know how to design things, build things and fix things - and everything would collapse back into sand, camels and mud huts within a decade or two.
dumbledoresarmy, your long post is more apt than what I might have written.
I was going to write an answer to can Cho, but I thought better of it. Since I was slightly mocking in tone in my posts to him, I ought to have considered that perhaps he was not catching the irony of it. It is a bit unfair – even though the Internet is not the place for people who are easily bruised.
It is Islam that is bad, and not necessarily Muslims. After all, Muslims must live in the Islamic universe whether they would like to or not. It is best not to mock when the play is not understood. So I apologize to can Cho, but not to Islam.
By writing as I have, I’ve pulled this thread too far off topic. Nevertheless, my parting shot, when I think of how Dr. Pape has knowingly sullied his profession all for a little lucre in the tiny world of academic publishing is: ‘Pape stultus est. Nihil nequius est te.’ Islamismus est stercus.
( Pape you are a fool. There is nothing that is more usless than you. Islam is bullshit.) It sounds a bit meaner in Latin.
Actually, "Pape stultus est," means "Pape is a fool." To address Pape directly the noun would have to be in the vocative case and I didn't bother to Latinize Pape's name or put the verb into the proper form, which would be "es." It just proves that it is a bad idea to operate a keyboard well past one's bedtime.
dombledoarmy. Dear dimmi. I read your post that you prepaired in haste. I want you to go and read more. The basis of chritanity is not bible. the divinity of jesus the sonship of jesus theory of atonment and resurrection none are supported by bible. Dear dimmi when europe was sleeping in dungeon during the dark middle ages we the muslims were living in the most civilized world. Dear Dimmi you have to be treated as dimmi because of your crimes against fellow christians jews and muslims. Dear Dimmi you slaughtered the unitarian christians you routinle killed jews because your gospel tells the world that jews were the one who killed your human god jesus. Dear Dimmi your Adolf hitler was an admirer of lutheran theology. he almost wiped out the jews. Dear dimmi at least we did not come close to wiping out dimmis. Go and ask Pope how much money he paid to child molesters. Dear Dimmi i will talk to you later . Oh i accept claasicus's apology.
How dare you call me a dhimmi!
I am not your dhimmi slave, you ignorant and arrogant Mohammedan.
I am a free citizen of the Commonwealth of Australia, a loyal subject of Her Majesty Elizabeth II.
I am a practising Christian in a church that rings its bell *loudly* before the service every Sunday.
I walk with my hair uncovered and I wear a cross. And I do not buy my life by paying jizya to any thrice-accursed servant of the war-demon of the Arabs. And I intend to do everything in my power to stop my foolish government from giving 'aid' to malevolent, arrogant Muslim countries such as Indonesia, Malaysia and Afghanistan.
You are talking nonsense.
I have read the whole Bible - the Bible that pre-dates by hundreds of years the incoherent and violent screed of the Qur'an, not to mention the Horrible Hadiths and the life story of your meshuggana warlord Mohammed - more than once and know it very well indeed.
You are wrong, when you claim that Christian doctrines cannot be found in the Bible. The orthodox Christian belief that Yeshua of Nazareth is the Messiah, the Son of the Living God, is based firmly on the first-hand testimony of his own followers as recorded and taught in the four gospels and in the epistles; and the doctrines of sonship, of atonement, and of resurrection are logically related to what the TaNaKh teaches about the character and purposes of God, about humanity, about human sin, and God's love and faithfulness.
As for your claim about superior Muslim 'civilisation' in the early middle ages - it is grossly exaggerated. To be frank, most of what was achieved in the early Muslim empire was achieved not by Muslims but by the newly-conquered non-Muslims within that empire; once they were all wiped out, or completely crushed, or converted to brain-numbing Islam, achievement ceased. Islam is like a vampire; it survives only so long as it can suck the life-blood of others.
And you finish by throwing a shower of mud. One of the things that convinces me that Islam is inspired by the Evil One, the entity that both Christians and Jews call the Accuser, is that Muslims spend so much time accusing people.
I have heard every one of those accusations before, from every other Mohammedan who has ever visited this forum. You seem to have a set list of 'things to accuse the kafir of, in order to throw them off balance' (for I don't for one second believe that you really *care* two hoots about any of it).
But as regards Jews, Mohammedan, I will tell you this, just so you know: I, a Christian, love and honour the House of Israel, and I pray for the peace of Jerusalem and for divine protection and deliverance for the Jewish state of Israel; and I primarily feel toward the Jews an enormous debt of gratitude - for the one between whose hands I have placed my life and my death and my hope of everlasting life, is a JEW: Yeshua/ Jesus of Nazareth, son of Mary, Son of the Living God. The more I love Him, the more I love His people; and the more I come to know His people, real live Jews, the better I understand what kind of person *he* was and is.
You, a Mohammedan, a hater of Jews (and of Christians) claim that Christians ought to be punished for mistreating Jews? - well then, you must condemn Muslims, too, for Islam is full of antisemitism, hatred of Jews, from top to bottom, and there are many historic examples of Muslim cruelty toward Jews, and mass-murder of Jews. Mohammed - whom you are all taught to imitate and admire - himself *ordered* the killing of hundreds of Jews...and shall I remind you of the Khaybar Oasis, and the murder of Kinana, and the rape of Safiyya? Or of the rape of Rayhana?
Christians can be Christians *without* hating Jews, for nothing in our faith, nothing in the central teachings of our faith, either requires or commands it, and therefore many Christians today feel and have publicly expressed grief and shame over the sins that our predecessors committed against the Jews.
On the other hand, I see a whole hell of a lot of vicious Jew-hatred spewing from the mouths of Mohammedans today, including major Mohammedan religious leaders, and having seen the texts on which it is based, and the Jew-hating example of Mohammed, I'm not sure whether it's *possible* for a dyed-in-the-wool Mohammedan to renounce hatred of Jews, and to regret and denounce the many atrocities that Muslims have committed against Jews.
And as for Hitler: it is recorded that Hitler preferred Islam to Christianity; many of his Nazi followers, after the fall of the third Reich, ran away to the Middle East and *converted* to Islam. So I think it quite reasonable to argue that Hitler was inspired by Islam at least as much as by anything else (he was reading the work of a Muslim jihad theorist, in the 1920s) and perhaps more. More than one person, in the 1930s, saw striking similarities between Hitler's Mein Kampf, and the Koran, and between Nazism and Islam.
I am not going to bother answering any others of the incoherent list of accusations that you spewed out, by rote. You're only doing it in an attempt to confuse, anyway.
Hello dumbledoarmy.
Before you go i just wanted one answer from you. Can you please tell me the dollar amount Pope paid to the victims ( altar boys whom the christian priests raped). Those godly men (supposed to be Godly men) raped the innocent repeatedly. Not only the catholics but the protestatns also raped the innocents. There is nothing like reliogisity in chiristianity. all there is is LUST and full of SIN. Do you know that your are nasty. Definitly nasty if do not anser my question.