Note the exceptionally high level of competence of Western intelligence officials. An incident like this is on par with the keenness of their analysis of Islam and jihad.
War Is Deceit Update: "Taliban Leader in Secret Talks Was an Impostor," by Dexter Filkins and Carlotta Gall for the New York Times, November 22 (thanks to Bill):
KABUL, Afghanistan -- For months, the secret talks unfolding between Taliban and Afghan leaders to end the war appeared to be showing promise, if only because of the appearance of a certain insurgent leader at one end of the table: Mullah Akhtar Muhammad Mansour, one of the most senior commanders in the Taliban movement.But now, it turns out, Mr. Mansour was apparently not Mr. Mansour at all. In an episode that could have been lifted from a spy novel, United States and Afghan officials now say the Afghan man was an impostor, and high-level discussions conducted with the assistance of NATO appear to have achieved little.
"It's not him," said a Western diplomat in Kabul intimately involved in the discussions. "And we gave him a lot of money."
American officials confirmed Monday that they had given up hope that the Afghan was Mr. Mansour, or even a member of the Taliban leadership. [...]
Others suspect that the fake Taliban leader, whose identity is not known, may have been dispatched by the Pakistani intelligence service, known by its initials, the ISI. Elements within the ISI have long played a "double-game" in Afghanistan, reassuring United States officials that they are pursuing the Taliban while at the same time providing support for the insurgents....
"It's not him," said a Western diplomat in Kabul intimately involved in the discussions. "And we gave him a lot of money."
Ofcourse if you give a fraudster a lot of money - you can get him/her to pretend to be anyone.
To me this show the level of desperation of the Westerners now - anything to try and short circuit progress and get out.
Actually nobody asked you, or invited you there - why are you there? What do you hope to achieve?
Giving money to nobodies is not the answer - even giving money to the taliban is no answer.
Better to just say we made a mistake - apologise and then leave - give the responsibility to Pakistan and China.
The US needs to learn now that they are no longer King. I understand that at the last G8, Obhama was trying to find the Chinese leader to strighten him out about keeping the Chinese currency artifically low....he found him eventually locked in a room with the Indian, Brazilian and Russian leaders trying to straighten out the global econcomy - America was not even invited - expect even fewer invitations in the future.
Forget about your moral dilemmas - instead LEARN - learn from others how the world works, you don't "work" the world, the British learned very quickly after WW2 , now it's your turn.
You are going to be a middle ranking country in the world very soon - take your soldiers back and wag your finger from 5000 miles away - like a good moral middle ranking country oh! and save your money - you'll need it more than the Taliban.
Well, the old hokum-bunkum strikes again. Another con-man is unmasked, and the Afghan conflict is back to square one.
BTW, Roland, I agree with you that we should bring our soldiers home from Afghanistan. That country's never been pacified by anyone who hasn't been willing to sack its cities, make towers of the inhabitants' skulls, and ensure that succeeding generations looked like the conquerors. It needs someone like the Sikhs, who forced the feminine shalwar kamiz on the Afghan men; or the Mongols, who left swaths of the country desolate and the survivors in the Hazarajat looking Mongol.
You are right Roland in your analysis of the stupid people in the government of the USA. They seem to be clueless on many levels. Exposing this stupidity is the theme of this and other conservative sites on the internet. We need a change of leadership that knows who the enemy is (Islam and the left), and we need to do battle with that enemy here within the USA, and stop supporting their regimes abroad. How stupid to waste all that blood and money on Iraq and Afghanistan only to help them set up another Islamic regime. However, you are an Islamic advocate aren't you? So though we agree that the left is clueless or complicit in our destruction, we won't be agreeing on the nature of Islam. Islam is unkowingly worshipping an imposter god, known as Satan in the bible, and though it seems he has the upper hand now it is only a matter of time till the almighty God destroys him. The God of love and truth is almighty, and is only using your god for his own purposes for the time being.
Kepha - It needs someone like the Sikhs, who forced the feminine shalwar kamiz on the Afghan men;
The sikhs are people from that part of the world - I can understand that they were hard done by muslim ancestors.
They are a good and strong people which is why - I can't understand why they needed to get involved in trying to protect some next hindus - we were lookinig after them just fine, some hindus formed part of the mogul ministries, they had their say.
You though are not from that part of the world, you have no business there - you will always be classed as a ferangi, in reality the sikhs are our brothers - we just don't say it loudly.
Equally I am not totally enamoured by you phraseology of "forcing us to wear feminine shalwar kamiz on the men" - it is called the kutra pyajama which admittely looks similar but is different.
"And we gave him a lot of money."
Yes, a lot of money. And you keep giving a lot of money to all the people who want you dead, and gone, and want your country as the establishment territory of a caliphate.
Yeah - you just keep giving them that money, and the all the tech help, and don't forget NASA!
citizens.
Don't help the Israeli victims of jihad, or the Indidan victims of jihad, whose governent finances the Islamic Hajj of so many Muslims, or even the USA victims of jihad.
Don't spend money on protecting your own country either, or its citizens, many of whom need good solid help.
Keep paying that jizya, Uncle Samuel...shopping for peace is the only way you know.
(Oops, some rogue typing mistakes. Corrected version)
Yes, a lot of money. And you keep giving a lot of money to all the people who want you dead, and gone, and want your country as the establishment territory of a caliphate.
Yeah - you just keep giving them that money, and the all the tech help, and don't forget NASA!
Don't help the Israeli victims of jihad, or the Indian victims of jihad, whose governent finances the Islamic Hajj of so many Muslims, or even the USA victims of jihad.
Don't spend money on protecting your own country either, or its citizens, many of whom need good solid help.
Keep paying that jizya, Uncle Samuel...shopping for peace is the only way you know.
Oops, rogue errors. Corrected version.
"And we gave him a lot of money."
Yes, a lot of money. And you keep giving a lot of money to all the people who want you dead, and gone, and want your country as the establishment territory of a caliphate.
Yeah - you just keep giving them that money, and all the tech help, and don't forget NASA!
Don't help the Israeli victims of jihad, or the Indian victims of jihad, whose governent finances the Islamic Hajj of so many Muslims, or even the USA victims of jihad.
Don't spend money on protecting your own country either, or its citizens, many of whom need good solid help.
Keep paying that jizya, Uncle Samuel...shopping for peace is the only way you know.
It's not their own money, that's why they give it away.
roland, you forgetful mohametan you, we WERE invited to this play party! Sure our silly so called president and his silly predecessor have a silly pretend story that Afghanistan invited us. That is wrong and just downright rude. After all it was Pakistan who invited us. We certainly hope to play with them sometime very soon.
We would definitely trust India to play with Pakistan. India definitely is invited to the festivities and is playing even now. Thank you India!
China shows little interest and in any case they didn't receive a formal invitation like we did.
And thank you roland! The nabi appreciates your help in bringing the party to Pakistan where it belongs.
Your friend and true nabi...
nabi ZK (pbum)
From post above...The US needs to learn now that they are no longer King.
An uncalled for slur...from abroad no doubt...If not the US, who would you suggest, or prefer?
A prophesy...'You are going to be a middle ranking country in the world very soon'...
The leftists greatest wish...Not likely to be fulfilled...
Another prophesy...The US will survive Rasool Obama...
The Obama administration is incompetent beyond belief.
To be expected, though. BHO himself is an impostor.
It doesn't matter whom they negotiated with; they're all liars. And it wouldn't matter in any case if the object were to destroy the Talibanis rather than play footsie with them.
This nonsense only gives heart to Muslims everywhere that the West will soon fall and the caliphate will be established. At the very least, it will be worth a chuckle in mosques world wide.
Thank you, Imam Obama!
Afghanistan and Iraq are the wars of dumb and dumber...Geo Bush should have won the Iraq war when he won it...when Saddam was dug out of his spider hole...Instead the dumb decided to bring democracy and freedom to people who did not want it, not on western terms anyway, turning the wars into political swamps...The quagmire of Iraq was caused by ignorance, deliberate maybe, of the nature of Islam, it's texts and how it effects believers...The dumber has made Afghanistan
a war of 'The floggings will continue until morale improves'...But the Afghan people already have Allah and sharia to do that, and they naturally resent the American/kufr version, won't accept it, and so they fight...in these cases, their lands actually have been invaded and are being 'occupied'...The Mahoundians fight smart, the dumber fight dumber...This is because the dumber is dumb and thinks voting, money, a pat on the back, and a job can buy off jihad...The soldiers in the field know better than that, but no one listens to them...The sooner America finds it way out of these swamps the better...
Ha-Ha! You're joking right?
Also, as soon as we get rid of PC Islam-loving Hussein in 2012, America will have a backbone again - no more "apology tours" or bowing to Muslim potentates.
FOOLs AND THEIR MONIES ARE SOON PARTED.
I have to congratulate the deceutful liar muslims. they made fools of these gullible western idiots. These western idiots who live in their own fantasy world of kumbhya and peace at any price. Obama is the lead fool.
All sects, either religious or secular, will often point to sacred texts and the deeds of the founder for guidence in how to operate in culture, discipline members and supervise its relationships with the communities it has to cope and struggle with or against. Take the Amish as one example.
Then, there is Islam. Its founder was a nobody in an affluent city [Mecca] who's lust for temporal power has become the cornerstone for the carnality by which his cult is famous.
'War is deciet' [Bukhari 4.267; 4.268; 4.269] and hellfire awaits those who cannot BUY themselves from Allah's Punishment [Bukhari 4.16]. The best way to buy yourself out of the hellfire? Fight in the Cause of Allah!
From the article:""It's not him," said a Western diplomat in Kabul intimately involved in the discussions. "And we gave him a lot of money." American officials confirmed Monday that they had given up hope that the Afghan was Mr. Mansour, or even a member of the Taliban leadership"
I lauged so hard upon reading that. Oh my sides.
You honestly couldn't make it up.
The sheer incompetence.
How much do you want to bet that no heads roll for this particular fiasco.
Beats any sitcom on TV hands down.
From Above - "as soon as we get rid of PC Islam-loving Hussein in 2012, America will have a backbone again".
What happens if Obhama is re-elected in 2012?
What happens if a true muslims is elected in 2012?
What happens if a true leftie is elected in 2012?
My friend your thinking is pie-in-the-sky stuff. The time to act is now - but you won't or can't act.
Within 20 years, America will be a failed state like Japan.
@ Roland
The story of the imposter who swindled the West out of lots of money is a metaphor for the way the West deals with Islam.
'Peaceful Islam' appears in place of 'Violent Islam' and we have a constructive dialogue, thinking that we're making progress. Then Peaceful Islam disappears with the benefits of the deal and Violent Islam - the real Islam - says, 'Hey, you were dealing with the wrong version of Islam. You are no further forward.'
And, of course, just as there can not be two Mansours, there can not be two Islams. There is only one: a violent, poisonous, plagiarizing so-called religion, founded by a false prophet peddling second-hand revelations for gullible clowns like you!
What happens if Obhama (sic) is re-elected in 2012?
What happens if a true muslims (sic) is elected in 2012?
What happens if a true leftie is elected in 2012?
Well those are just totally redundant. But dude! Whatever hallucinogenic substance you are smoking, pass some over here to the nabi.
What happens if the Easter Bunny is elected?
What happens if Santa joins the jihadists?
What happens if leprechauns take over both houses of Congress?
What?!
nabi ZK (pbum)
" Ofcourse, if you give a fraudster a lot of money - you can get him / her to pretend to be anyone ".
Sounds like you're describing Imam Rauf.
" You are going to be a middle ranking country in the world very soon - take your soldiers back and wag your fingers from 5000 miles away - ... "
If we become a middle ranking country soon, it will be because of the leftist political elites who have allowed third world immigrants, a lot of whom are hostile to democracy, to come into the country.
By the way, why do so many people across the globe, wish to immigrate to the " Great Satan ", anyway, roland ?
By the way - I do agree with you that the US should stop ALL aid to hostile, foreign countries.
Next time there's a flood that causes a humanitarian crisis, call Saudi Arabia.
The next time there's a famine, call Iran.
Earthquake assistance ? Get on the hotline to Syria.
I could go on, but I think you know where I'm coming from.
You though are not from that part of the world, you have no business there - you will always be classed as a ferangi, in reality the sikhs are our brothers - we just don't say it loudly.
What "part of the world" is outside God's Earth to belong only to Islam? What planet is Islam from? Don't you get it, we are ALL from this world, and there is not special piece of 'ferangi' real estate that belongs to Islam alone. Don't get your pantaloons wet, Roland, get over it. Make sense, boyo.
Let's not stop at just citing this clown as a fraud.
I want to know the who's, when's, why's and how's of access that got him into the mix.
If, if, such as 'just in case', anyone is going to take these campaigns seriously, then a little more than just surface jingoism and policy graffity is going to have to be shown. This guy had a "lobby" who had to make intro's and move him along.
Maybe he came from a source in OIC that the "Fraud-in-Chief's delegate met.
(BTW - OIC (Org. Isl. Conf.) - Made up of and attended by heads of state of Islamic countries - delegates or foreign ministers attend only in off years - Obama has appointed a delegate.)
And we could save a lot of money and trouble by deporting parasitical hate-filled bigoted savages like yourself to a typically hate-filled Islamic tarpit of our choice.
Within 20 years, America will be a failed state like Japan.
And it is time you were deported to that typical failed Muslim state called Pakistan, savage. Of course, you have over 50 open sewers to choose from.
Taliban leader in secret talks was impostor: "It's not him, and we gave him a lot of money"
.......................
What could be worse than giving the *Taliban* itself a "lot of money"?
Either the fake Mullah Akhtar Muhammad Mansour is going to spend the money on Jihad against us just as the real one would have—in which case it is no worse—or he is just going to pocket it, in which case it is not quite as bad. Of course, then he'll likely spend it on hash and "dancing boys".
Of course, we can only hope that the US will look in earnest for the *real* Taliban leader, so they can give him "lots of money" as well...sarc/off
Suicidal madness.
Here is a picture of the impostor
http://antarcticiana.blogspot.com/2008_02_01_archive.html
We continue giving him money.
Obama "Smart Power" at work.
Perhaps they need a "reset button". Remember that? They failed to spell the word "reset" properly in Russian...instead it read, "overcharge".
Smart Power...what a joke.
Contrary to what you were told at school, history isn't made by leaders who shape destiny, it's made by morons. Imbeciles and morons. And NATO are mining the motherlode.
From the article:
a) The "high-level discussions conducted with the assistance of NATO"
DOH
b) "NATO and Afghan officials said they held three meetings with the man"
Double "DOH"
c) Many in the Taliban leadership, which is largely made up of barely literate clerics from the countryside, had not been seen in person by American, NATO or Afghan officials.
Make that a double scooby snack sized "DOH"
d) From the article: "these negotiations with a senior Taliban leader had been going on for months"
Make that a Scooby snack sized "DOH" with extra cheese
The only quibble I have with the article is when they compare this utter debacle with a spy novel.
"In an episode that could have been lifted from a spy novel"
Oh no siree, this isn't from the world of espionage, it's from the world of slapstick comedy. Laurel and Hardy, The Keystone Cops, Spongebob Square Pants, Scooby Doo.
Suggestion to NATO: Perhaps you should give up trying to give suitcaseses full of cash to Taliban leaders and instead go back to destroying WW2 Partisan monuments.
Stick to what you know.
Islam is unknowingly worshipping an imposter god, known as Satan in the bible, and though it seems he has the upper hand now it is only a matter of time till the almighty God destroys him. The God of love and truth is almighty, and is only using your god for his own purposes for the time being.
My God's better than your God
My God's better than yours
My God’s better cause he eats Kennel Ration
My God's better than your's
Is this really what we have come too? Please say it ain't so? I like what you were saying up till God came into the picture. Just like Beck. I will not fight a "Holy War" on either side. I will fight for The United States of America and when I die, I don't know where I will go, but I will go there with the truth that resides only in my heart (or in my brain more accurately. Everybody is entitled to believe whatever they want when it comes to religion, but If God wants me to know something, he will tell me. I have difficulty believing that God won't talk to me and yet talk to somebody else and tell them to tell me what he wants. We all have "gut" feelings and know right from wrong. Nobody on this planet is superior to anybody else simply based on religion, race or wealth. We are all God's creation. If one of his creations has "bad wiring" and deemed defective we must limit their ability to influence others or harm others. Yes Virginia there is a Santa Marine guarding our liberties and freedom. People who try to dominate others with force need to be killed. But we also do not hold a monopoly on morality. There are good and bad in all people. We need to encourage the good and destroy the bad. Let's leave our religious beliefs in our hearts and theirs in their hearts. If their religion motivates or instructs them to kill non-believers, this is a business of a predatory nature and needs to be wiped off the face of the earth. Fight for right and truth and equality, not for instructions from God. There should be a way to show the world that fighting for God is just as irrational as fighting against God.
Or maybe not……………………1
Excellent points you raised. I agree to your script except "We all have "gut" feelings and know right from wrong."---
Virtually all wars in the world are caused by having gut feelings about rights and wrongs... MoSlums believe Mo was right, we all know that he was way out of line about 90% of things he did. His followers are no different.