Spencer: A jihad in Tunisia

Popular will may be the way to new woes. This morning in Human Events:

When Tunisian President Zine El Abidine Ben Ali was toppled from power and fled to Saudi Arabia on Friday, The Washington Post's Jennifer Rubin hailed this "Jasmine Revolution" as a "remarkable event: a popular, secular revolt in a Muslim country" that "poses an opportunity and a risk for the U.S." Mona Eltahawy, also writing in the Post, explained that "a 29-day popular uprising against unemployment, police brutality and the regime's corruption" brought down Ben Ali. But there are numerous indications that there were other sources of dissatisfaction in Tunisia with Ben Ali -- including the relatively secular character of the government. Pro-Sharia Islamic supremacist forces are poised to take advantage.

The popular perception is that Ben Ali was brought down by the will of the people. The French government declared that Tunisians, by toppling Ben Ali, had "expressed their democratic will." German Chancellor Angela Merkel expressed her support for "real democracy" in the North African nation, adding in a message to officials of the new Tunisian government: "I appeal to you to use this deep break in Tunisia's history as a new departure."

A factory worker in Carthage had similar high hopes: "This is like the French Revolution," he said enthusiastically. "It's the end of an era. I'm hoping there is real change. We can't continue like this." Political analyst Ahmed Lashin declared: "The Arabs have been repressed for too long. They are eager for change and are on the verge of explosion."

But what kind of change? What kind of Reign of Terror might come in the wake of this new French Revolution? Rached Ghannouchi, the London-based leader of the banned Tunisian pro-Sharia party, the Tunisian Renaissance Party (Hizb al-Nahdah), was quick to dub the Tunisian uprising an "intifada" and to claim it as a victory for Islam. "The Tunisian intifada," he exulted, "has succeeded in collapsing the dictatorship."

Pro-Sharia MPs in Kuwait applauded "the courage of the Tunisian people," and Abdelmalek Deroukdal, a leader of al Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb, hailed the revolution as a jihad and expressed solidarity with the Tunisians. In Gaza, the jihadist groups Hamas and Islamic Jihad were both thrilled at events in Tunisia. Hamas spokesman Sami Abu Zuhri hailed the victory for democracy, and Gaza Foreign Minister Fathi Hammad emphasized that "we are with the Tunisians in choosing their leaders, no matter what sacrifices it takes."...

There is more.

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OT

Suicide blast kills 42 police recruits in Iraq

TIKRIT: A suicide bomber wearing a vest filled with explosives attacked Iraqi police recruits on Tuesday in former dictator Saddam Hussein’s hometown of Tikrit, killing at least 42 and wounding over 100, officials said.
http://www.dawn.com/2011/01/18/suicide-blast-kills-14-police-recruits-in-iraq.html


I checked the Voice of America web site and encountered numerous comments from the well-meaning but ignorant Americans and British people,about how they found it such a wonderful country when they went on their two weeks vocation there, of course knowing nothing about the history and the culture of the country. They were full of praises about the wonderful 'Jasmine Revolution' and how that was going to lead to a wonderful era of democracy and brotherhood. I sent in a comment about the dangers of Islamic fundamentalism and dangers for the West. But most people were trying to outdo each other in singing he praises of the wonderful Tunisian revolution. Talk about turkeys looking forward to customers.


Sorry the last sentence should of course be 'Talk about turkeys looking forward to Christmas'.

There has never been real democracy in any Dar al-Islam "nation" that I can tell. Some faux democracies such as Turkey, but the Moslem urge for authoritarianism has kept even the list of proud fake Islamic nations exceedingly short.

Two women of my family and friends were on a vacation to Tunisia together some years ago. And they agreed afterwards: never again.
That two middle-aged and elderly women cannot go out for a stroll without being greeted by lewd gestures is not the best recommendation for Tunisia. And this in a holiday resort that should not be unacquainted with strangers.

Islam will fill the void, but they won't get their money back...According to an article on Drudge, the royal family took 3000 lbs of gold with them when they left...

The unfolding scenario of dictatorships being replaced by Islamic dictatorships is interesting.

The Islamic dictatorships would face the same problems as any normal government - lack of staple foods, the price for basics too high, lack of jobs and opportunities etc...
Islam's insh'allah incompetence would mean that Islamic governments running iron-heel Sharia societies would face riots and social unrest, too.

Individual governments facing these problems might be able to put them down in brutal fashion -- but not if they erupt across the ME simultaneously! That's what's worrying petty dictators from Algeria to Tehran now. What if all the people rise up together?

Islam rushing in where secular angels would fear to tread would result in a few years of Boko Haram/Al Shabaab 7th century viciousness, then the game would be up for Islam.
A total breakdown in electricity and water supply, no food, no services of any kind, and so on, would result in a line of imams hanging from lamposts.

Islamic dictatorships....? Bring 'em on. They're doomed.

It seems the most workable form of government in Islamic countries always has a strong autocratic component. In Turkey, up to now, the elected government always knew that the army was ready to depose any government that was Islamic. Of course, that constraint is now loosened.

The biggest problem with that is that any autocratic government inevitably becomes greedy, more brutal, and more isolated. The shah of Iran made any possible alternative look good, until, of course, they actually got a committed Islamic government. Similarly, the wife of the former president of Tunisia ran what was basically a mafia, under the protection of the government. One can't blame the people for wanting a change. The tragedy would be if the change installed an Islamic government, which appears quite possible, although not inevitably. After all, the street demonstrators are in contact with young Iranians, who can tell them first hand the pleasures of living under Sharia law.

Perhaps the most stable form of government in that area is a monarchy. The monarch is not subject to democratic will, but the extended family provides a sort of network to reality. Most of the monarchies in that area, Saudi Arabia excepted, seem to provide some margin of separation from pure Islamic governance.

I think Tunisia may go the same way as Iran with Khoumeni!!! Secular governments can last only for so long. Just look at Turkey's leanings towards bringing Islam in the government!! Can Tunisia be far behind??

Not good. Ousting of dictators in Islamic lands is usually followed by anarchy and then a takeover by the Ulema orthodoxy. This "revolution" is like that of Iran in 1978, when the Shah fled and Khomeini returned in early 1979, with the western left liberals waxing enthusiastically about the 'people's victory' at the time. Tunisia does not have an Ayatullah-in-waiting to takeover. So it should be prepared for a long period of anarchy.

While the main stream media was gushing all over this story, I knew that it wouldn't end well. Political upheaval is always a ripe field for islamic takeover.....Where is Obama on this?

When Tunisian President Zine El Abidine Ben Ali was toppled from power and fled to Saudi Arabia on Friday, The Washington Post's Jennifer Rubin hailed this "Jasmine Revolution" as a "remarkable event: a popular, secular revolt in a Muslim country"
................................

What makes Ms. Rubin assume this is going to *stay* "secular"? Opposition to the Shah in Iran was widespread—including many secular and "moderate" (in the Islamic sense, at least) components. But it was Islam that carried the day.

More:

A factory worker in Carthage had similar high hopes: "This is like the French Revolution," he said enthusiastically. "It's the end of an era. I'm hoping there is real change. We can't continue like this." Political analyst Ahmed Lashin declared: "The Arabs have been repressed for too long. They are eager for change and are on the verge of explosion."

But what kind of change? What kind of Reign of Terror might come in the wake of this new French Revolution?
................................

Notice this Tunisian factory worker did not cite the *American Revolution*—a comparatively civilized affair, which did not explode into savage insanity and revenge once the British were ousted.

There was indeed a bloody "Reign of Terror" in the wake of the Iranian "Islamic" Revolution, and, as the events of the last two years show, it is not over yet.

I'm afraid I agree more with the opinions of Slamdunk and Jaladhi here, Buraq. After all, Iran has neither mellowed nor collapsed in over thirty years, and is now threatening the world with nukes.

And if there was a full collapse of governments across the Magreb, then there is always the baleful example of Somalia, which has festered without anything resembling a real government for over twenty years.

You wrote:

A total breakdown in electricity and water supply, no food, no services of any kind, and so on, would result in a line of imams hanging from lamposts.

Islamic dictatorships....? Bring 'em on. They're doomed.
................................

Unfortunately, Buraq, I believe—if you have a Somali-style Islamic hell-hole—the only reason you would have "Imams hanging from lampposts" would be if the rival Jihad factions had declared them "insufficiently Islamic" and killed them in the name of Islamic "purity".

"A jihad in Tunisia"

I don't think Dizzy wrote that one...

... of course knowing nothing about the history and the culture of the country.

Good point, Mazz.

Know why they call U.S. Marines Leathernecks? Back at the turn of the 19th century, the Jihadis built a fleet of attack boats called corvettes and proceeded to raid Infidel merchant ships at will, and with success. At one point, the cost of ransom payoffs made by America to Moslem Activist strongmen (Jizya) reached nearly 50% of the federal budget.

So, President Thomas Jeffeson bought a copY of the sacred Ko-Ran, and proceeded to send the nascent U.S. Navy to the Mediterranean to straighten the Moslems out.

Admiral Perry, the father of the U.S. Navy, soon found his Marines being decapitated. So he arranged for them to wear thick leather neck braces to help avoid his mean losing their heads. Trouble was, broken necks remained a common for his Marines.

So, Perry then arranged for more firearms and even artillery to solve the problem, which it eventually did. That's whey the line The Shores of Tripoli in the Marine Song. Yeah, I know, Tripoli is in Libya, but there were major battles in Tunisia too.

*** 33:21 ***

That copy of the Ko-Ran that Jefferson bought? It was used by the born Afro-American revert Representative Keith Ellison, D-MN, for his swearing in (he rejected using a Bible). Oh, the irony.

But that's what American Dhimmitude is all about: willful ignorance.

Islam rushing in where secular angels would fear to tread would result in a few years of Boko Haram/Al Shabaab 7th century viciousness, then the game would be up for Islam. 
A total breakdown in electricity and water supply, no food, no services of any kind, and so on, would result in a line of imams hanging from lamposts.
Islamic dictatorships....? Bring 'em on. They're doomed.

Like SOMALIA, the "pirates haven" of the Indian Ocean. This could be the new "industrial" revolution for Dar-al-Islam, a PIRACY Network from Mali to Indonesia, for glorious 'Allah' and the myth of its Moon-god 'prophet' of 7th century pagan Arabia.

This is the legacy of primitive Islam, that food, water, infrastructure, electricity and roads, medical and social services, all disappear... for inshallah "Allah provides". Indeed, all natural life is snuffed out, like in Taliban held areas, no music, no art, no education, no joys of life except the five-times-deep-groveling to the Moon-rock at Mecca. The game is up, with war and more war, mass civilian killings, machete wielding genocide, mass rape of women, mass murder... mass Islam. Jihad Tunisia? Like Somalia? "They're doomed".

As long as Islam is the predominant religion in a country, that country is doomed to being either an authoritarian secular state or an authoritarian Islamic state. The former can be possessed of some freedoms (e.g., Ataturk's Turkey which is quickly fading away) but no nation where Islam is the chief religion can ever be truly free. Never has happend. Never will happen. Islam, even when surpressed by a dictatorial type, insures that liberty will never prosper because either Islam will crush liberty or the secular dictator will have to in an effort to keep Islam restrained (and for other reasons common to all dictatorial regimes). Now, if only present Western politicians could grasp this, say Governor Christie of New Jersey, but they won't.

"Two women of my family and friends were on a vacation to Tunisia together some years ago. And they agreed afterwards: never again."

Why would anyone go to Tunisia?

"Tunisia does not have an Ayatullah-in-waiting to takeover."

Actually there's a guy called Rachid Ghannouchi, now in exile in... London LOL, who said he'll return home now. Don't know if he's the next Khomeini though.

Those Swiss bank accounts Wiki is exposing will have their names and Arafat's.

Did you not know, if you knew nothing about Tunisia, that this was going to be a push for Islamic society to take over the government and that the West would misunderstand the politics entirely?

Is it not just predictable? George Friedman? Can you help them with this one, please?

But Chaka Khan sang it:

A long time ago in the 600's
Mohammad gave us this wrong
He called it "A call to Islam"
And the jihad still lingers on

It was new and very strange
Blew the heads off Jews and Christians
Few could go along
But the jihad still lingers on

Rape and thievery to name just two
Together they grew
The idea was young and strong
And the jihad still lingers on

They paved the way for generations
From Mohammad to Imam Rauf
No one could stop the winds of change
Without them where'd jihad be?

Valette and Sulieman were there before
The past you can't ignore
The torch is lit, we'll keep the flame
And the jihad remains the same

In the 600's
A night in tunisia
In the 1000's
A night in tunisia
In the 1500's
A night in tunisia
In the 2000's
A night in tunisia

Here's the melody:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSP72EjOjFI

My apologies to Miss Chaka.

may be that was a code : Night = Darkness = Islam?

Interestingly, Dizzy had become a Baha'i in 1970, so probably knew what Islam was all about.

And The Malady Still Lingers On...

Thanks for the link. Ghannouchi is a canny politician and is a leader of the Islamic party Ennahda (Hizb Nahda), which is much like Turkey's AKP, but he is not a religious leader like Khomeini or al-Sadr in Iraq. He is holding a political Ace in his hands, but is not yet ready to jump into the fray till the dust settles down. As he says in his recent FT interview - "However I have no political aspirations myself, neither for standing as a minister, for parliament or president. Some are presenting me as a Khomeini who will return to Tunisia – I am no Khomeini".

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/24d710a6-22ee-11e0-ad0b-00144feab49a.html#axzz1BS42TlmW

According to this Hizb-ut-Tahrir Facebook site the Tunisian protests are indeed Islamic.

Any proof Robert as to the pro-Sharia leanings of the Tunisian Opposition. You have provided none whatsoever other than rehashing comments of other groups outside Tunisia. have any quotes from any of the opposition? It seems you haven't.

Just testing, Sorry guys Im new on this blog. Have a nice day you all.

Does anyone know anything about the nature of the non-Islamist political opposition in Tunisia? Is there one to speak of? If there is but it is not organized and prepared to step into the breach, say by taking control of the military and police forces, then this bodes ill. If chaos envelopes the country, what external power is prepared to step in to establish the peace? The UN? LOL. France? NATO (assuming that France would deign even to hold its nose and go along with such a proposal)? And then what? Democratic "elections" to choose among parties lacking democratic traditions? Whatever happens, it would appear Tunisia is in for a period of chaos, as mumbling Westerners are challenged by even more bumbling, but deadly, Islamists. Meanwhile, the country burns.

Things don't look good for Tunisia, which could well become the unexpected unstable domino in the Maghreb. Whatever happens, the U.S. should simply stay out of it - and accept no political refugees.

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