Will they burn themselves in effigy and demand that they be prosecuted? "Afghan mullahs push peaceful protest in wake of Quran-burning violence," by Tom A. Peter for the Christian Science Monitor, April 14 (thanks to Urban Infidel):
As the dust settles in Afghanistan after sustained protest over a Florida pastor's Quran burning, many residents in Kandahar are facing an unpleasant truth: More Qurans were burned in the course of their protests than by Terry Jones.The demonstrations, which started peacefully, quickly turned violent, killing at least nine people and injuring scores in Kandahar City alone. And as protesters vandalized a girls’ school and set fire to shops, Qurans also inadvertently went up in flames.
“If they burn a shop, there is a Quran in every shop, so this is a big problem,” says Azizullah Aziz, a perfume and soap salesman in Kandahar City. “People don’t know how to protest.”
On Wednesday, the province’s top spiritual leaders moved to address the irony – and promote restraint at a time when passions are running high over the US war effort. They called a shura, or meeting, and told the crowd of several hundred people that gathered in a tent at Kandahar University how to protest in an Islamic manner....
“One person burned the holy Quran in America. This was not good, so we came to speak out and protest, but unfortunately the police fired on us because they did not know what the protest was about,” said Maulavi Mohammed Omar, a prominent mullah in Kandahar. “Why did people burn the shops and markets, and the holy Quran? That is not good.”
Seek elders' advice
Islam does not discourage protests, said the mullahs. But, they said, when something happens that causes concern, citizens must seek the advice of their religious leaders before taking action. They added that any protest should also have clear goals.
“You have to respect what the mullahs say. If they say protest, you have to protest. If they say don’t protest, you can’t protest. They know the Islamic law for when to protest,” said Haji Rahmudeen, head of the Kandahar Business Association, in his address to the crowd....
In addition to imploring citizens to maintain order during protests, the mullahs called on the government to better prepare the police to deal with protesters, ensure that government and international forces respect Islamic and Afghan culture, and stop international forces from conducting night raids, among other demands.
There was much speculation that Wednesday’s event could end in yet another protest. Indeed, all the ingredients were there to stoke the ever-present well of anger over the ongoing foreign presence. During Mr. Omar’s speech, he reminded the crowd that America was still the enemy and its soldiers are “killing our 2-year-old children in our homes.”
At an Afghan demonstration, such remarks would normally be met with shouts from the crowd and calls for “Death to America.” But on Wednesday, the crowd just quietly listened. When the event ended, few people stayed even to socialize as the crowd shuffled out of the tent, returning to their cars or bicycles....
Ah, this idiocy never ends. Wherever there are Muslims, there are idiots aplenty. This is a sure bet.
During Mr. Omar’s speech, he reminded the crowd that America was still the enemy and its soldiers are “killing our 2-year-old children in our homes.”
Maybe it would have been better had Mullah Omar turned over Osama when Bush demanded it...How many dead 2 year olds are worth one Osama?
Afghanistan Qur'an-burning protesters burned more Qur'ans than Terry Jones ever did
Will they burn themselves in effigy and demand that they be prosecuted?
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If these "protests" hadn't been so horrifically murderous, I'd just say **Ha Ha!**.
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As the dust settles in Afghanistan after sustained protest over a Florida pastor's Quran burning, many residents in Kandahar are facing an unpleasant truth: More Qurans were burned in the course of their protests than by Terry Jones.
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Wadda buncha maroons!
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The demonstrations, which started peacefully, quickly turned violent, killing at least nine people and injuring scores in Kandahar City alone. And as protesters vandalized a girls’ school and set fire to shops, Qurans also inadvertently went up in flames.
“If they burn a shop, there is a Quran in every shop, so this is a big problem,” says Azizullah Aziz, a perfume and soap salesman in Kandahar City. “People don’t know how to protest.”
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Does Azizullah Aziz have a problem with "protesters" *beheading UN aid workers* and destroying a girls' school, or is his only concern for a few extra-crispy Qu'rans? Wait, don't answer that question...
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On Wednesday, the province’s top spiritual leaders moved to address the irony – and promote restraint at a time when passions are running high over the US war effort. They called a shura, or meeting, and told the crowd of several hundred people that gathered in a tent at Kandahar University how to protest in an Islamic manner....
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"Protest in an Islamic manner"—I can see the placards now: "Burn Infidels, not Qu'rans!"
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“One person burned the holy Quran in America. This was not good, so we came to speak out and protest, but unfortunately the police fired on us because they did not know what the protest was about”
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I guess all that carnage would have perfectly jake with the local police if only they had realized the perfidy of Pastor Terry Jones half-way 'round the world in southern Florida...
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“You have to respect what the mullahs say. If they say protest, you have to protest. If they say don’t protest, you can’t protest.”
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What a bunch of zombies. I can just hear dear ol' mom now, saying "if your mullah told you to jump off a cliff, would you do it?"—that would be right before admonishing you to listen to your mullah, of course.
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At an Afghan demonstration, such remarks would normally be met with shouts from the crowd and calls for “Death to America.” But on Wednesday, the crowd just quietly listened. When the event ended, few people stayed even to socialize as the crowd shuffled out of the tent, returning to their cars or bicycles....
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Aw—poor Jihadists are feeling pretty subdued after realizing they just went on an inadvertent orgy of Qu'ran burning.
Don't worry, though—they'll be back to yelling "Murder, murder America" any day now!
I thought this was a joke; since when did they ever pause tothink about the damage they inflict?
Maybe one day they'll realize the irony in killing "stinky, dirty, scumbag infidels" like Christians, Jews, Polytheists, Homosexuals & Athiests that Allah himself made. So much for their reflection.
Then again, pigs could fly, and that would be the day.
Afghanistan Qur'an-burning protesters burned more Qur'ans than Terry Jones ever did.
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DICKHEADS!
"“Why did people burn the shops and markets, and the holy Quran? That is not good.”"
They were pious Muslims who were filled with ISLAMIC rage intent to destroy anything in their path...They had the Imams blessing to protest....The Muslims were worried...they hadn't protested in two days...
"“You have to respect what the mullahs say. If they say protest, you have to protest. If they say don’t protest, you can’t protest. They know the Islamic law for when to protest,” said Haji Rahmudeen, head of the Kandahar Business Association, in his address to the crowd...."
Having intelligence and freedom to question authority are UN-Islamic..
We should have imposed separation of mosque and state in Iraq and Afghanistan. Then the war would have made sense.
Now we just imposed mini-caliphates...
...more qur'ans destroyed? ..yay!
It's okay to burn a Koran... if it FURTHERS Islam.
It's an old Sufi trick that falls under the "war is deceit" rubric.
You may lie to defend the faith, or destroy objects ordinarily esteemed by Muslisms, if it hastens the final dominance of Islam.
So these AKI's (Accidental Koran Incinerations) are actually good for the Ummah's goal.
And can be excused as tactical losses in the war's ultimate aim.
FLAME ON!!!
Terry Jones didn't actually burn a koran.
we are now talking about terry jones from monty python...
these people are comical in their insanity. they have no dignity and always come away looking like spoiled children having a tantrum.
i guess, when you are the lowest tier of a rotting, medieval community you'll grasp at anything and carry on about nothing every chance you get.
and as youre from that bottom rung, you'll do it in idiotic fashion.
the rampant inbreeding doesn't help of course.
"Protest in an Islamic manner"—I can see the placards now: "Burn Infidels, not Qu'rans!"
youre analyses are always factual and cutting. i love it.
Just read the definition of Mullah in Wikipedia. As usual for these things it means different things to different people in different countries. The position itself is veague and interchangable with others.
A mullah can be merely an educated man. They have levels of knowledge in hadith, law and have supposedly mermorized the koran. They perform marrianges, funerals, lead prayer and make pronouncements on sharia. They are interchangable with cleric, Imam and Shiek.
According to the definition muslims use it correctly but ignorant muslims or forigners use it incorrectly even though they use it to refer to the exact same person performing the exact same duties. No propoganda to see here folks, move along.
Thanks, wikipedia. Super helpfull as awlays.
"In addition to imploring citizens to maintain order during protests, the mullahs called on the government to better prepare the police to deal with protesters, ensure that government and international forces respect Islamic and Afghan culture, and stop international forces from conducting night raids, among other demands."
Roh Roh...looks like those international night raids are working....must be disrupting arms deliveries and terrorist group movements..
Now if only the police would deal with the Muslim protesters with the same zeal as they deal with Christians...
other demands??? hmmmmmm.
Never thought of that angle to the story. Good stuff.
"They know the Islamic law for when to protest."
Now that is something only sodomizing afgan mullah's will know about the islamic laws.
Funny, I thought it was Karzai who informed the mullahs about the Qu'ran burning in Florida and the subsequent Friday sermon that triggered the burning, looting and murdering.
A battle for the "hearts and minds" of the Afghani people? The problem is the hearts are black and the minds are closed.
Stop the night raids?!?
Evidently night raids are working... just because their "tough men" hide behind children and then the kids get killed... But then that's ok since they train their kids to be terrorists anyway...
How about ceasing the mindwashing of children to be martyr-terrorists for their religion of hate, Islam?!?
How about stopping suicide bombers?!?
The Islamoidiots cry "death to America"... America is not killing EVERY Afghan?!? The "war" is against the taliban, the radicals... they're all just a bunch of idiots...
The more I read these threads, the more 'sightless' and deluded these people appear. One would expect after years of personal religious devotion, prayer, study and faith their lives would have become imbued with the more 'positive' aspects of the Koran - compassion, respect for life, peace etc. I'm a little naive, but generally over time, isn't a practitioner's life supposed to be progressively enhanced 'from without' with the higher qualities / blessings (assuming for the moment that some do exist, even for the Koran / Allah etc)of the religion ..indicating Allah's impartial compassion for all of his devotees?
It would seem that from the erratic often violent antics of the strongly regimented Muslim at least,behaviour seems to be repeatedly nurtured from within under the influence of anger, delusion, suffering, envy hatred and stupidity rather than bestowed from without under the influence of some holy / heavenly intervention.
Does the average militant Muslim ever reflect on this? In the absence of any enhancement of his life through the intervention of Allah, does he not realize that he is in fact acting on the direction of his 'low state of life' that he himself has created when ingnorant, arrogant and angry and having gone against the natural inclinations of his own life, in order to be true to his relgion?
Similarly it seems a little odd that to gain access to allah and / or understand him more, you need the services of a Mullah, Iman or Cleric. Surely an understanding of Allah and his supposed 'purity' / 'virtue' / 'sanctity' etc would be realised by each and ever one believer with faith and strong devotion. Why is the interpretation / guidance of a middleman necessary. Surly this would cast a few doubts on the valitidy of the teachings and practice - (well in retrospect, maybe not!)
In any case it would seem that strong daily religious indoctrination in the absence of reason, and the outlawing of any social, sporting or intellectual activities that enhance one's social, personal and psychological well being
have combined to distort their conceptions of the events that take place in their environment and stain their lives with deep seated anger and frustration.(This must be true of any regimented, fundamental religion, to lesser or greater degrees)
This is largley why they can become quite volatile when Islam is perceived / conceived to be slandered.
[It is interesting to note that in the 'West' people who do less injury to themselves and others are treated with drugs and therapy for psychosis and other psychiatric illnesses]
And when Allah is not personally forthcoming with punishment for slanderers, they assign the role of Allah to themselves, and punish offenders, to maintain the validity of the religion, something they've devoted their entire lives to, through thick and thin, no matter what. Ultimately, it becomes impossible to substantiate the 'concrete reality' of any Allah, outside the lives and beliefs of devoted Muslims - they, and the Mullahs in particular, are Allah - it is pointless to look for Allah anywhere else.
The sad thing is, by violating their own lives and the lives of others, they will suffer the consequences of their actions in one way or another, at some point in time, for 'earth, and life, abide' ...'the slate' will not be wiped clean - life (and death) do not know of, nor abide by, personal beliefs.
They have, through taking life, basically forsaken its sanctity - a universal known - for an unknown, ...
from the point of nature and the natural sciences at least, they are a danger to themselves (eg (Mahayana). Buddhist theory suggests the cummulative effect of everything a person thinks, says and does (karma) transcends one's physical death to be the
determinant of the conditions (his physical / personality makeup, the family type, region, country etc) into which that person is reborn.
If one considers Buddhist philosophy for a moment, what karma must a person have to be born into wretched circumstances, such as poverty and warfare ....and why are some children blown up in bombs, whilst others are born into prosperous hapy families. Though this may seem a little off topic, I really feel that people who take 'life in vain'(ie on the basis of religious belief) will somehow suffer far more than just from the punishment (assuming they're charged) metered out in a
court.
All the thousands of people born into Middle Eastern familes and suffer an early death, disease, poverty and war etc. Where do they all come from....do their lives really begin at conception or is their another dimension we are unaware of .....
In view of the profundity of life, something beyond comprehension, it would seem wise, for the moment at least, to be wary of the fundamental religions, and strong Islam in particular.
I'm often reminded of a popular philosophical quote saying:
"Fear not wild animals, which can only end / take your physial existence in this lifetime alone....but fear indeed anyone who sways you towards teachings which do not accord with nature / reality .....for they take your life"
Though of course you could apply this saying to many religions, it seems somehow very applicable to Islam in view of the strong mindset many of them have and their resolve to die for Allah if necessary.
How many 2 year olds did the Taliban send to Allah with it's indiscriminate shellacking of whole cities and warfare in their battle against the Soviet backed regime? A holy warrior, Osama, is held in higher regard than all of the Afghan people. Innocent Martyr/Victim, a person outside the cult can draw no distinction between the two.
Oh forgot to mention ... and for what it's worth and for those who may be interested etc etc..
There is a concept in Buddhism referred to as one's 'goodness of mind'. This does not mean whether one is kind or generous etc. 'Goodness of mind' refers to one having the faculty to correctly perceive the true nature of an event, incident or set of circumstances. It is not learned but a general innate faculty operating independently of intelligence, education, social background etc.
Over time, in response to repeated religious indoctrination, this faculty is erroded away - the religious devotee perceiving some event from the basis of his religious devotion.
It is interesting to note that the most wretched beggar in the streets, though dirty, perhaps a drinker, believing in nothing in particular and wearing filthy clothes may be far superior / purer to a high ranking Muslim from an influentual, noble family....because he has not destroyed his 'goodness of mind', whilst the Muslim, though well to do, pious and devoted, has.
Over time, Muslims generally violate and errode this independently functioning faculty
through obsessional clinging to beliefs and texts that do not accord with nature.
Profitsbeard wrote:
It's okay to burn a Koran... if it FURTHERS Islam...
You may lie to defend the faith, or destroy objects ordinarily esteemed by Muslisms, if it hastens the final dominance of Islam.
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I think you are exactly right, Profitsbeard. These "protests" are all about getting Infidels—frightened about Jihad terrorism in the West and "instability" in the Muslim world—to "voluntarily" toe the Shari'ah line and squelch freedom of speech and the criticism of Islam among their own citizens.
I just think the Imams are hoping they can control some of that berserker Islamic rage just enough so it leads to fewer toasted Qu'rans. I notice they don't seem to care as much about the poor people who lost their shops, either...
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FLAME ON!!!
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Hah! I love it!
James wrote:
"Protest in an Islamic manner"—I can see the placards now: "Burn Infidels, not Qu'rans!"
youre analyses are always factual and cutting. i love it.
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Thanks, James.